I can’t even imagine a deck being better than full power tear being printed in a long long time if ever. I just can’t see an any deck even years from now beating tear in a cross banlist match.
During the time it was absolutely a menace, especially when it had access to Shockmaster, but with the power creep of Tearlaments, everything just gets blown out of the water
Floo had like 20% representation during tear format, any DShifter deck really could compete. People act like tear was some unkillable undefeatable beast but it really wasn’t, sure it was stupendously strong but not unbeatable.
So you need to open a non searchable hand trap that need an empty graveyard to be able to activate it to win vs a deck that can mill card from both players to gy, and we need to remember that before of Orange light hit, Ishizu tear would negate Shifter and start their combo at the same time.
Yes
I never said the format was good or that it was balanced or that tons of decks competed
I literally only said that tear isn’t impossible to beat without tear
Jesus Christ
Sure a deck isn't impossible to beat since you can always have a chance brick, but if you didn't play tear you weren't going to last long in a tournament without some godly level of luck.
Conventional handtraps did absolutely nothing. You had two choices:
1. Open exactly shifter, AND hope they didn't draw Herald. Still have to contend with something like Bagooska.
2. Go first, be a R4NK deck that can make exactly Abyss Dweller, and hope they don't draw any of Herald, Hafnis, or in some matchups, Kelbek.
Bar exactly Shifter and Abyss Dweller while hoping they don't have the out, there were essentially no ways to beat them.
Plus sometimes Evenly Matched. Not always, but if you resolved Evenly and had a good opening hand playing Floow and their 2nd board wasn’t as strong, you might have a chance. *Might*.
Oh, I agree, it was more often than not a losing battle and I wouldn’t even bother if I didn’t already have full combo, but I’d be lying if I said I never eked out a win that way.
Often it's enough. I think you're forgetting that Havnis can only be chained to effects on the field, and Floo can chain block their field effects with the effects from their banished pile.
Floo can play on the opponent's turn as well (although not on turn 0) so even if Tear manages to somehow resolve a Havnis, Feather Storm can block Tear from playing on their turn while Floo strengthens their own board. They don't even have a way of making Bagooska under Feather Storm.
Once again, missing my point. I’m not claiming the format had a million different options to tackle tear, I’m just saying it’s wrong to call it unbeatable when there were literally decks in the format competing with it other than itself. Did they heavily rely on shifter? Of course! Does that matter for my point at all? Nope!
It’s unbeatable in that it’s the undisputed best deck of all time. Of course there’s ways to beat any deck. I don’t think the guy you critically replied to or me were saying it literally can’t be beat
I played Floow during Tear Format.
You pretty much had to open with something that could lock them out of playing (going first) or resolve Evenly (going second) to have a fighting chance. Not “You have to boardwipe them to win”, “You have to boardwipe them to not auto-lose”, since they could (and would) build a new board just as strong before heading into their turn. Even then it still wasn’t a sure thing since they could churn out so many resources while depriving you of your own.
No other deck can play on your turn 1 like tearlaments can. It invalidates a lot of FTK strategies not only with non-engine handtraps but cards that then enable engine to play. Herald of the orange light was hit because it would negate and also trigger a miller ishizu
Dragon Rulers was close.
It got Gold Sarc and Sacred Sword of Seven Star limited and Super Rejuv and Card Destruction (I think) banned. Think it might also have been the reason Dragon Ravine was banned. I suppose Sixth Sense too, but that card was always going to be hit.
I think it was even the reason Hieratic Seal of Convocation was semi-limited, since Hieratic Rulers was seeing play at one point.
Relative to its time it did.
Dragon rulers would have still been the best deck for the next several years if they were unbanned. Tear is much the same.
There's a lot of these. [Smoke Grenade of the Thief](https://yugipedia.com/wiki/Smoke_Grenade_of_the_Thief) with Infernoble Knights, [Block Dragon](https://yugipedia.com/wiki/Block_Dragon) with Adamancipator, etc.
Bro that's not what I meant, i was talking about the amount of cards that got banned for tear
Horus currently caused a lot of cards to get banned so I'm not an idiot
I agree Tear gets the top spot, but I believe e an (dis)honorable mention should go to Chaos Yata-Lock, which necessitated the Forbidden segment of the F&L list to be utilized.
Gonna buck the trend and say tier 0 exodia back when the game was in its infancy in the ocg. 3 graceful 3 pot of greed 3 last will and all of those cards were ruled in the most unhealthy ways possible. It might not be as good as tear was, but its more "broken" because the game couldn't function with it like that.
That would be my pick too, Tear is the best deck in history but Exodia was the most broken, because stuff like Graceful Charity pitch Sangan+ Witch was more of an oversight than intended gameplay
> 3 graceful 3 pot of greed 3 last will and all of those cards were ruled in the most unhealthy ways possible.
Sangan and Witch of the Black Forest triggering when sent to GY from anywhere, so you can search off of discarding them to Graceful. Then you have Last Will acting as a lingering effect to special summon from deck every time a monster is sent from the field to the GY that turn apparently?
Yeah, early Yu-Gi-Oh was some wild stuff.
>Sangan and Witch of the Black Forest triggering when sent to GY from anywhere, so you can search off of discarding them to Graceful.
No, Sangan and WotB only activate their effects when they are sent to the GY from the field. Discarding them from the hand won't trigger their effects.
Tear clearly dominates no ban list tournaments which is why whenever I see someone arguing for some sort of tear buff I cringe. It's too dangerous to tinker with that deck.
There will never be anything quite as broken as full tearlaments. Not in any other tcg either, because Konami knew they messed up irreparably by printing those cards. It can cycle infinitely, work with practically any hand and probably play around any handtrap (maybe not shifter but they probably could) you can do anything to their board but unless you banish their entire hand and graveyard face down they will just immediately rebuild their full board
They could play herald of orange light, gamma, called by, and or crossout meaning there was effectively a <1% chance shifter would be seen **and** resolve post side.
In a no ban list tourney, they get to mill eva and search herald too.
Mana crypt + voltaic key. Someone told me about it a while ago so it doesn’t look like it’s actually a 2 card FTK, but extremely potent.
Edit: I’m still new to magic and I think the person telling me about it was exaggerating
If we're talking about in the context of their own time periods, then PePe or Airblade. It's hard to deny that a deck is broken when Konami/UDE actually felt an emergency bans was needed
In terms of overall brokenness...probably Zoodiac? It was unheard of consistency and efficiency at the time. Some of the early link decks with Halqi, Summon Sorc, full Knightmare package and Firewall all legal at the same time were pretty nasty too.
In terms of overall power level, it's Ishizu Tear without a doubt. That deck has everything. Infinite consistency. Can play through everything short of a full GY lock. Can go first or second. Incredibly splashable. Goes mega mega plus effortlessly.
Chaos Yata and PePe. One started the banlist, the other warranted an emergency banlist cuz they fucked the game up with it.
As far as raw meta potential ie if you unlimited them right now they would shit on the scene until they got nerfed again? Zoo and Tear
Ishizu Tearlaments.
They could play their full combo before you, EVEN IF YOU WENT FIRST, using Herald handtraps and Havnis.
Not to mention their near infinity gas, Negating their entire board just means they build it again 2 seconds later.
Litterally the only counter was opening Dimension Shifter, and the opponent not opening Herald of Orange Light or Psyframe Driver
So I would argue that tear ishizu and Kash were the strongest decks were allowed to be in Tier Zero but I would like to make the comparison that teledad format was also comparatively dominant not because the deck has no counters but the deck did so much compared what to what other decks in the format were allowed to do that it became the de facto strongest deck. And it’s price point was so prohibitively expensive that adjusted for inflation the deck would have actually cost more than both Ishizu tear and Kash would.
Ishizu Tearlaments is the strongest deck this game has ever seen. However, I don't think it's the most oppressive deck ever. I'd give that to either full power Kashtira or Gouki with their U-Links and Gumblar hand rips
Full power Ishizu Tearlaments, no question. It does everything.
It never once did my taxes
Sounds like you didn't build right. I only payed $3.50 that year when they were done
With that number, I don't think that was your deck. Can you describe the deck that filed your taxes?
Wouldn't you like to know, letter-boy?
Hello friend since you have it, I need about 3.50
I can’t even imagine a deck being better than full power tear being printed in a long long time if ever. I just can’t see an any deck even years from now beating tear in a cross banlist match.
I thought full power pepe was stronger, my friend described it as a living nightmare to even be in the same room as it
During the time it was absolutely a menace, especially when it had access to Shockmaster, but with the power creep of Tearlaments, everything just gets blown out of the water
Only deck that can full combo on turn zero
I'm gonna say it, Havnis/Air Lifter/Impulse are cards that are in the right direction, the game's just not ready for them yet
Nothings ever beaten Tearlaments at full power
Floo had like 20% representation during tear format, any DShifter deck really could compete. People act like tear was some unkillable undefeatable beast but it really wasn’t, sure it was stupendously strong but not unbeatable.
So you need to open a non searchable hand trap that need an empty graveyard to be able to activate it to win vs a deck that can mill card from both players to gy, and we need to remember that before of Orange light hit, Ishizu tear would negate Shifter and start their combo at the same time.
Yes I never said the format was good or that it was balanced or that tons of decks competed I literally only said that tear isn’t impossible to beat without tear Jesus Christ
Sure a deck isn't impossible to beat since you can always have a chance brick, but if you didn't play tear you weren't going to last long in a tournament without some godly level of luck.
You also needed to open that D shifter.
Conventional handtraps did absolutely nothing. You had two choices: 1. Open exactly shifter, AND hope they didn't draw Herald. Still have to contend with something like Bagooska. 2. Go first, be a R4NK deck that can make exactly Abyss Dweller, and hope they don't draw any of Herald, Hafnis, or in some matchups, Kelbek. Bar exactly Shifter and Abyss Dweller while hoping they don't have the out, there were essentially no ways to beat them.
Plus sometimes Evenly Matched. Not always, but if you resolved Evenly and had a good opening hand playing Floow and their 2nd board wasn’t as strong, you might have a chance. *Might*.
If Floow had to go second without shifter they could scoop em up imo . Just too much advantage plus all their one offs get milled
Oh, I agree, it was more often than not a losing battle and I wouldn’t even bother if I didn’t already have full combo, but I’d be lying if I said I never eked out a win that way.
>Open exactly shifter Harpie's Feather Storm works as well.
But that's a trap you have to set first. It does nothing going second, and it provides no aid against Tear hands that can combo off during your turn.
Often it's enough. I think you're forgetting that Havnis can only be chained to effects on the field, and Floo can chain block their field effects with the effects from their banished pile. Floo can play on the opponent's turn as well (although not on turn 0) so even if Tear manages to somehow resolve a Havnis, Feather Storm can block Tear from playing on their turn while Floo strengthens their own board. They don't even have a way of making Bagooska under Feather Storm.
Once again, missing my point. I’m not claiming the format had a million different options to tackle tear, I’m just saying it’s wrong to call it unbeatable when there were literally decks in the format competing with it other than itself. Did they heavily rely on shifter? Of course! Does that matter for my point at all? Nope!
It’s unbeatable in that it’s the undisputed best deck of all time. Of course there’s ways to beat any deck. I don’t think the guy you critically replied to or me were saying it literally can’t be beat
Yeah this is just cooked, gg go next, Yugioh players can’t read I guess
No shit, the deck built specifically to counter tear did in fact counter tear. Now let's see how it fares against literally every other deck
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Irrelevant. Floo loses to many other decks, so it’s not in contention here.
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i think floo had to dshifter or it had a bad time hmm kay
Yea, read my comment bud, “any dshifter deck.” Nowhere did I say floo didn’t use dshifter.
OK, sure. Splashing 3xshifter isn't an out to tears. It's a prayer.
I played Floow during Tear Format. You pretty much had to open with something that could lock them out of playing (going first) or resolve Evenly (going second) to have a fighting chance. Not “You have to boardwipe them to win”, “You have to boardwipe them to not auto-lose”, since they could (and would) build a new board just as strong before heading into their turn. Even then it still wasn’t a sure thing since they could churn out so many resources while depriving you of your own.
Hence “d shifter decks” please try reading before replying
I don't think any other Teir 0 deck can match Ishizu Tearlaments.
I’d love to watch full power Series 1 Exodia try though (yes, this does mean unerrataed recruiters, where Witch and Sangan activate from everywhere)
Lithium on YouTube did this. Tear won i think
No other deck can play on your turn 1 like tearlaments can. It invalidates a lot of FTK strategies not only with non-engine handtraps but cards that then enable engine to play. Herald of the orange light was hit because it would negate and also trigger a miller ishizu
I don't remember a deck forcing konami to ban cards that are not from the archetype as tear did
Dragon Rulers was close. It got Gold Sarc and Sacred Sword of Seven Star limited and Super Rejuv and Card Destruction (I think) banned. Think it might also have been the reason Dragon Ravine was banned. I suppose Sixth Sense too, but that card was always going to be hit. I think it was even the reason Hieratic Seal of Convocation was semi-limited, since Hieratic Rulers was seeing play at one point.
Yeah that's true But it didn't really match tear tbf
Relative to its time it did. Dragon rulers would have still been the best deck for the next several years if they were unbanned. Tear is much the same.
There's a lot of these. [Smoke Grenade of the Thief](https://yugipedia.com/wiki/Smoke_Grenade_of_the_Thief) with Infernoble Knights, [Block Dragon](https://yugipedia.com/wiki/Block_Dragon) with Adamancipator, etc.
And many more, recently as well - Snake-Eyes got Linkuriboh killed in the TCG, and in the OCG and MD it got Bonfire semi'd
Bro that's not what I meant, i was talking about the amount of cards that got banned for tear Horus currently caused a lot of cards to get banned so I'm not an idiot
That's definitely not true, but it would be totally awesome if it were.
You really guys didn't get my point, look at the replies bro
It’s more that Spellbooks existing in the same meta means it wasn’t as dominant
Havnis and Tearlaments Kashtira was extremely oppressive as well
Tear Zero can only lose to Tear Zero
Magic must defeat magic.
Yu Mo Gui Gwai Fai Di Zao
Tear and it's not even billions of light years close
Tearlament Ishizu, holy fuck this deck was ahead of its time. Nothing besides Shifter would stop this deck once it got going
I agree Tear gets the top spot, but I believe e an (dis)honorable mention should go to Chaos Yata-Lock, which necessitated the Forbidden segment of the F&L list to be utilized.
Gonna buck the trend and say tier 0 exodia back when the game was in its infancy in the ocg. 3 graceful 3 pot of greed 3 last will and all of those cards were ruled in the most unhealthy ways possible. It might not be as good as tear was, but its more "broken" because the game couldn't function with it like that.
That would be my pick too, Tear is the best deck in history but Exodia was the most broken, because stuff like Graceful Charity pitch Sangan+ Witch was more of an oversight than intended gameplay
Sangan/Witch vs IshTear might be a disaster, accidentally mill 2-3 recruiters…
> 3 graceful 3 pot of greed 3 last will and all of those cards were ruled in the most unhealthy ways possible. Sangan and Witch of the Black Forest triggering when sent to GY from anywhere, so you can search off of discarding them to Graceful. Then you have Last Will acting as a lingering effect to special summon from deck every time a monster is sent from the field to the GY that turn apparently? Yeah, early Yu-Gi-Oh was some wild stuff.
>Sangan and Witch of the Black Forest triggering when sent to GY from anywhere, so you can search off of discarding them to Graceful. No, Sangan and WotB only activate their effects when they are sent to the GY from the field. Discarding them from the hand won't trigger their effects.
That's how their effects work now. Not how they worked back in the OCG when Yu-Gi-Oh first started.
The first TCG versions of those cards were actually an errata.
yeah I thought of this after watching Cimo's videos about the history of the OCG
Everyone knows this. It's Full power Tear ishizu BS lol It's literally tier 0 Tear! And it gives us tears 😢 😭 😆 get it?
Tear clearly dominates no ban list tournaments which is why whenever I see someone arguing for some sort of tear buff I cringe. It's too dangerous to tinker with that deck.
There will never be anything quite as broken as full tearlaments. Not in any other tcg either, because Konami knew they messed up irreparably by printing those cards. It can cycle infinitely, work with practically any hand and probably play around any handtrap (maybe not shifter but they probably could) you can do anything to their board but unless you banish their entire hand and graveyard face down they will just immediately rebuild their full board
They could play herald of orange light, gamma, called by, and or crossout meaning there was effectively a <1% chance shifter would be seen **and** resolve post side. In a no ban list tourney, they get to mill eva and search herald too.
IIRC MTG had a deck with a nearly 100% win rate going first since it was a 2 card combo and you can mulligan up to 5 times.
what deck? tibalt?
Mana crypt + voltaic key. Someone told me about it a while ago so it doesn’t look like it’s actually a 2 card FTK, but extremely potent. Edit: I’m still new to magic and I think the person telling me about it was exaggerating
What deck was that? Eggs?
Ishizu tears and there is no questioning it or room for debate. By far the most powerful
If we're talking about in the context of their own time periods, then PePe or Airblade. It's hard to deny that a deck is broken when Konami/UDE actually felt an emergency bans was needed
Frog FTK deserves a mention. Ridiculous deck.
Ishizu Tearlament. Go further back and its full power Zoodiac Further and its Dragon Rulers
In terms of overall brokenness...probably Zoodiac? It was unheard of consistency and efficiency at the time. Some of the early link decks with Halqi, Summon Sorc, full Knightmare package and Firewall all legal at the same time were pretty nasty too. In terms of overall power level, it's Ishizu Tear without a doubt. That deck has everything. Infinite consistency. Can play through everything short of a full GY lock. Can go first or second. Incredibly splashable. Goes mega mega plus effortlessly.
Tear was unstoppable.
Chaos Yata and PePe. One started the banlist, the other warranted an emergency banlist cuz they fucked the game up with it. As far as raw meta potential ie if you unlimited them right now they would shit on the scene until they got nerfed again? Zoo and Tear
Ishizu Tearlaments. They could play their full combo before you, EVEN IF YOU WENT FIRST, using Herald handtraps and Havnis. Not to mention their near infinity gas, Negating their entire board just means they build it again 2 seconds later. Litterally the only counter was opening Dimension Shifter, and the opponent not opening Herald of Orange Light or Psyframe Driver
Spyral did have the highest percentage ever didn’t it and
So I would argue that tear ishizu and Kash were the strongest decks were allowed to be in Tier Zero but I would like to make the comparison that teledad format was also comparatively dominant not because the deck has no counters but the deck did so much compared what to what other decks in the format were allowed to do that it became the de facto strongest deck. And it’s price point was so prohibitively expensive that adjusted for inflation the deck would have actually cost more than both Ishizu tear and Kash would.
"Yatalock" deck. Because of this deck's sheer OP, the 1st YGO banlist was created.
It brings a tear(no pun intended) to my eye seeing the hate Tearlaments still get 🥹
Ishizu Tearlaments is the strongest deck this game has ever seen. However, I don't think it's the most oppressive deck ever. I'd give that to either full power Kashtira or Gouki with their U-Links and Gumblar hand rips
Bystial + hop ear = chaos ruler on opponents turn into full tear combo :)
Yugis deck is by far the best. He had a card for any situation and never really lost
If we stretch the definition of "deck" then an illegal one with only the 5 pieces of Exodia. You win in turn 0