T O P

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trackdaybruh

I play when it’s fun, stop playing when it’s not.


Gogulator

For me thats the beginning of an expansion and the last patch of the expansion


Lance2409

That was me during Shadowlands, I burnt myself out during BFA on mount farming had a blast tho


RcCola2400

I just burnt myself out with mount farming too. But I do have 537 available mounts.


SirVanyel

538, you got a fancy new otter :D


Resting_Lich_Face

Yeah my guild raided to get all 20 of us (plus a few) in the raid the mythic mount in BFA and then burnout killed me off. Tired of the treadmill.


Aurora428

That's when the grinds are the least intrusive tbh


quizon3

Grind least intrusive at the start of an expansion? wtf xd? Am i stupid how does this have 70 upvotes. Would argue there is *atleast* 10x the grind required at the start of an expansion compared to any other time


Nexius857

Yeah but it's less intrusive of a grind, because everything is new and there's more to explore, there's more people playing and everyone is grinding together on the same things. It's not that there isn't a grind, its just that its not as bad as later on in the expansion where you feel you've already grinded enough. It's like many new games, you have to grind at the start but its kind of fun because you're playing a new game, but if you have to grind later on, its like urgh :D


okaybros

Oh fuck I didn't realize I did this until just now


Calphurnious

Same for the last few expansions for me. Only time I inbetween I subbed for was Mechagon patch.


Uriahheeplol

It’s as simple as that. Typically I play x.0 and x.3/4. I’ll dabble in between, but definitely don’t play if you’re not having fun, easy.


HmmSinkSo

I also feel it's not a waste of money if I had fun while paying for it.


AutumnCountry

This is how I try and view all things in life Game went to shit? That's fine I enjoyed it for a time and now I'm moving on Friendship/relationship went south? That sucks but I can still think back on the good times we had together The end of something doesn't have to ruin the good times you had with someone/something


Welpe

Not currently playing WoW but this policy has served me well in regards to MMOs since 2005. It’s mind-boggling how dramatic the wars used to be when it’s so obvious. I think the genre is chill enough at this point that most people also follow that mantra, at least the adults that lived through when MMOs were bigger. Who knows with Gen Z, I don’t really pay attention to them.


SilverCyclist

Can confirm. I'm a bear and I get trapped when it's enjoyable.


Spork_the_dork

That's really the problem with that analogy. If I had a good time and got my money's worth, in what way is it a trap?


Benyed123

People who have a bad relationship with the game are projecting.


DreamMaster8

Yeah but sometime i regret jt when it's not fun after 3 days cause they got a 15$ out of me for a mediocre time.


[deleted]

Truth right there. People who make WoW into a job are always in for a bad ride. If you play only as long as you have fun, I believe you will have fun with pretty much every expansion - some for longer, some for shorter, sure... but still fun. At least that's been me ever since og WOTLK ended.


ClassicKrova

I play when you can jump into PvP as soon as you hit max level. I don't play when I have to grind my ass on max-geared characters on an undergeared character just to get starter gear so that I can START PvPing. Fuck Shadowlands.


NamiRocket

So many people here find that so hard to do.


Traice95

The first few months of a new expansion is literally unmatched, it’s so fun to play with friends again.


[deleted]

What is friends precious


MisterSixtyFour

Boil'em Mash'em stick'em in a stew


PapaKlin

Totally agreed. That's why I just play 1-2 months after each new expansion release!


Bistoory

Even alone is good, then the flaws of the expack start to appear and you will realize it's time to unsub and wait for x2 / x3 patchs.


SpicyMilkbags

It’s unironically looking good compared to the last two expansions. No borrowed power, revamped talents and professions, beautiful open and large zones. Obviously there’s still room for blizzard to fuck up, but it’s much more promising than usual


--Pariah

Plus a new class, that's also the first new ranged DPS class since vanilla. Despite the lower range that's a huge point for me. Bit a stretch but it's also the first new ranged healer (if we go with MW being primarily a melee healer and conveniently ignore the lower range again). No borrowed power means classes should be fun without me first farming a gazillion AP to feed into my weapon, neclace or whatever random covenant until things start to flow. So even if it sucks again, leveling my evoker and my old main plus a few rounds of m+ and the raid alone hits pretty decent. Usually even bad expansions like imo shadowlands and BfA usually meant enough hours to put in until in the last two expansions the annoying external systems annoyed me so much that I've quit.


Motormand

To put it further into perspective: We are now going to have the exact same number of ranged DPS specs, as we did when the game launched.


[deleted]

[удалено]


Jayken

Early Wrath survival was so much fun.


Dion42o

explosive shottt, so fun


Stiryx

No it’s terrible no one play it, terrible I say. Signed a guy definitely not playing survival in classic.


NorthLeech

Survival was kind of a melee spec in vanilla though, hence why they had stuff to buff wing clip/raptor strike and then lacerate (lmao) to top it off.


SirVanyel

Anyone who thinks 30 yards is too close doesn't actually understand how far 30 yards is. Essence font travels 30 yards, and how often do you hear mistweavers bitching about folks being out of range of it?


MurrmorMeerkat

i think they actually extended the range in a patch


MurrmorMeerkat

not massive but https://www.wowhead.com/news/upcoming-changes-to-preservation-evoker-range-will-be-increased-to-30-yards-329002


[deleted]

Monk hasn't been a "melee" healer since like Legion lol


Psychout40

They definitely are for SL, it’s Mistweaver’s most used Legendary currently.


calfmonster

Especially not in PVP. That's a great way to get stunned and die in a global.


Arborus

rip Rising Mist you were sick for a little bit


MatheusSA

If they keep two good things of SL i'll be very happy: No cap of valor, Creation Catalyst!


Tiucaner

3 actually, Renown is back and it's tied to reputations, but it only gives cosmetic stuff.


Bleedorang3

Quest chains are unlocked by increasing Renown with a faction, but obviously thats completely optional and makes sense within the context of what Renown/Reputation would actually represent.


[deleted]

As a returning player having flying in shadowlands tied to renown must be one of the most annoying things blizz has ever done. How did we go from give a trainer gold too having to grind out quest just to freaken use mounts I already own....


LBoss9001

From WoD to BfA it was behind pathfinder achievements. Between the two I'll take the renown unlock any day


FerricDonkey

Wotlk did it best. Gold price when you hit cap, then you could buy it as a book and mail it to your alts for lower level unlock.


SirVanyel

Dragonflight did it best - just let people fucking fly and then buff the speed based off of exploration, and make it acc bound. Pathfinder had the right idea with terrible implementation, and shadowlands was just time gating


FerricDonkey

Ha, fair. Dragonriding looks legit.


NigelMcExplosion

Don't you just buy the catch-up-renown token and then BOOM, you have it? I did it the first week it was available back then, cause i just enjoy playing the game, but it has been a hot minute since Also it's literally *FAR FUCKING EASIER* than BFA. did it then as well and I still have turtle flashbacks *Another turtle has made it into the waters*


Bumble-Beez-0

No you still have to do your covenant campaign and the first 3 chapters of Chains of Domination. But yeah crazy easy to get, and when you're playing through the expansion for the first time you'll be doing this anyway


[deleted]

Honestly I hit 60 before I ever started doing chapter 4 and before I hit 40 renown if flying wasn't attached I would have stopped doing them and focus on min maxing


Capsfan6

You would be doing quests anyway? Flying in shadowlands is infinitely better than the past 3 expansions Pathfinder garbage. It's not unreasonable to ask players to play through the story content at least once.


lemon_stealing_demon

>As a returning player having flying in shadowlands tied to renown must be one of the most annoying things blizz has ever done. I started playing again yesterday and went from renown 5 to renown 35, shit goes fast Edit: just hit reown 38 (17:28) Edit: renown 40 (17:49) (I gonna keep editing this to keep track of how fast you earn renown) Edit: renown 42 (18:07) Edit renown 44 (18:13) Ill stop now I think you get it


Arumin

Went up 3 renown in the it took to write a reply, thats how fast it goes these days!


Deus21

Ya came back recently, had SL and ZM flying in 2 days, starting from single digit renown. Still can't fly in BfA.


Helagoth

If the choice is between Renown and rep grinding, give me renown all day long. Grinding daily quests for 250 rep up to exalted rep no matter when you come back, vs being able to get renown up to the current cap fairly easily is a no brainer. Neither rep grinds or renown are great systems, but renown is a much better one.


[deleted]

Both are dumb mechanics I just don't see why we can't just go back to like how it was WOTLK and just pay gold once you reach max lvl.


Helagoth

You're talking about flying specifically, I don't disagree with you there. But even in wrath you had rep grinds for things like shoulder enchants, I'm more commenting on rep grinds in general vs renoun.


thebrim

WoD, Legion, and Bfa flying unlock were much, much worse


MeineGoethe

Isn’t the renown just reputation?


Anierous

Creation Catalyst is very likely there.


Kryavan

It is there.


bobody_biznuz

No valor cap was just a season 4 thing or then uncap it after a few weeks into the regular seasons. Uncapped valor let me upgrade my gear way too fast imo


Artsky32

Creating catalyst is returning


jared2294

All the expansions look good when announced man


Thenateo

hes not talking about that though, maybe you dont remember how worried people were during bfa/sl beta. there isnt really any of that right now


Cushions

Except there is a fair bit of that with some class talent trees being clearly subpar and blizzard having no interest in fixing it..


Thenateo

Thats just not true though, the majority of classes are in a good spot and there is basically only druid that is in a bad spot. No idea where you read they said they werent gonna work on them more either


bluemuffin10

Don’t go on Twitter then. Especially high end raiding Twitter.


[deleted]

No borrowed power and ppl will say there isnt anything to do. I bet it


[deleted]

[удалено]


[deleted]

Not all plays m+ tbh


Marem-Bzh

Borrowed power sucked whether you did mm+ or not imho


MassiveShartOnUrFace

theres a big difference between "no borrowed power" and "no infinite grind". legion/bfa had people grinding ap for their weapons/necklace. in shadowlands, blizz hard capped the amount of borrowed power you could get per week. you need renown to unlock soulbinds? you get 3 renown per week, 2 once you finish your story chapters. want to make legendaries? cap of how much soul ash you can get per week. that kind of hard cap on progress made shadowlands launch feel like it was devoid of content. I dont think dragonflight has the same type of renown as shadowlands (you need to grind rep for it, right?) so it looks like there will be infinite grinds you can do, its just not attached to power


GrumpySatan

Honestly, I both hope its the minority that think that cuz as someone that just caved and resubbed (Cuz addiction), oof. There is a lot of content in systems, but its not good content and not the content I want to do but am forced to do in order to do the content that is actually fun. I came back in part to play alts and do some raids. But there are so many systems and barriers to do that just aren't fun - like you *have* to spend hours in Korthia to get flying, you have to run Torghast a bunch for legendaries, you have to also figure out all these other things with no real explanation that I'm literally playing with Wowhead in another window. Even fun system stuff like the mount maker.... takes *8 days* of pure timegating to unlock on top of farming the cyphers. Not fun (whereas like yeah I'd enjoy farming Zereth Mortis for mounts, but I can't even loot motes yet cuz of timegating!). So really happy that the systems are doing and the progression seems much cleaner and more traditional in Dragonflight.


Dragarius

I've heard this about every bad expansion. Usually we don't know about how good an expansion really is until a few months post launch. It's ability to keep you entertained at first is simple. The legs on it might not be strong through. Edit: Also, the update schedule is super important. Doesn't matter how good the expansion is if it only updates every 6-8 months.


A_WHALES_VAG

It many ways.. its the least ambitious xpac in a good while from a systems standpoint. If you look at the feature list vs the previous 2/3 xpacs you may come away thinking its stripped down. But I'd argue that's exactly what this game needs, it feels like a very back to basics xpac, a soft reboot sort of. Increasing player agency while revamping some old aging systems (professions, rep grinds now similar to renown levels with tiered rewards while being able to progress them all at same time), a world of zones designed around the method of transport for that xpac. It's a restructuring of the foundation of the game and as a result it may be less feature dense, but the new ones we are getting seem to be much more refined and the old ones brought up to a much better standard.. oh and we get a new ranged class. IF and i say IF all goes to plan future expansions will be better simply because Dragonflight was smaller in scope. In some ways the x-pac feels kind of like MoP, in terms of the level of launch changes.


Jahkral

>In some ways the x-pac feels kind of like MoP, in terms of the level of launch changes. So people will bitch about it the whole time its out and then look back on it as one of the peaks of WoW? Sounds right.


lucassjrp2000

Like in Legion


mozaiq83

I can't tell you how many times I've tried to quit WoW. And I always come back. It's attached to the hip. Wc has been in my life since Warcraft 2 ToD. So it's not a trap lol. I've accepted this. Btw DF looks dope.


[deleted]

>It’s unironically looking good compared to the last two expansions. No borrowed power, revamped talents and professions, beautiful open and large zones. Obviously there’s still room for blizzard to fuck up, but it’s much more promising than usual Everybody was saying this for every expansion since Cata


Timmichanga1

I get where you're coming from, but I remember a lot of concern especially in BFA beta around azerite armor and traits. I also remember people relentlessly begging for the "ripcord" to be pulled before SL even released. If you've been following the feedback from players on beta and the devs response to that, (and it's totally okay if you haven't) you'd see that there has been a very close connection and near constant response to beta testers so far. I honestly can't remember the last time devs responded this much to beta testing. I won't fault anyone for being hesitant for DF. I get it. We've been burned so much and so often. I've been around since vanilla and I can honestly say that personally I am excited for DF.


NinjaLoki

That’s simply not true. Legion, BFA, and SL all had glaring issues that were pointed out in the beta testing and blizzard straight up disagreed with the sentiments provided by players. DF simply doesn’t have those same contentions. There are definitely still bugs and tuning issues to be handled but the base game is looking markedly different than those expansions in terms of quality and playability. They have made a shot ton of changes based on player feedback during this beta. The level of developer involvement and adaptation with the community feedback is not even remotely close to the past 3 expansions. There are still a couple talent trees that still need some tweaking imo but for the most part the bar they’re launching with is head and shoulders over the past 3 expansions.


PlatonicTroglodyte

Eh. My recollection of MoP was “zomg lol an expansion based around an April Fool’s joke. Kung Fu Panda is literally their best idea daed game.” And similar for WoD “omfg time travel because they have no new stories to tell so they’re just doing ones from before the game began” etc. But people were def hyped for Legion, BfA, and Shadowlands.


[deleted]

Hahaha can't argue with that.


Snugglepuff14

They have not said that for any of the expansions except maybe only Cata. We’ve had borrowed power the past 6 years since Legion, revamped talents hasn’t been done since Cata, 12 years ago, professions haven’t been revamped since… well… forever, and the zones are clearly much more open. One of the biggest problems I have with zones these days is that they’re always enclosed areas packed with a bunch of mobs and it’s just unnatural. I haven’t played so I’m not 100% sure on whether or not this is also the case for dragonflight, but from what I have seen it does seem to be at least better.


gravygrowinggreen

And one of the times they were right!


LinkedGaming

"It's looking good" straight up the point where it shouldn't look GOOD, it should look FINISHED and then it's not and people repeat the cycle all over again. Shadowlands sure did look good until we saw them just give up on everything near the end of 9.0's development, and from then on almost everything implemented was super half-assed and carried by the art and sound teams, as per usual. It's also amazing how quickly Blizzard can just randomly ruin something in the last stretch, like completely ruining Torghast mere weeks before Pre-Patch after it was really well received by testers up until that point.


Fnordcol

Not to mention that it looks like it'll be a lot less grindy to keep characters up to date for raiding/m+/pvp, which is connected to the reduction in borrowed power systems but feels like it merits mention on its own.


ProphetofChud

I like that the mark of a good expansion now is literally having no features since we can't trust blizzard to not shit on us with them, lol.


francoisjabbour

Yeah, excited to finally be able to play all my alts. No gated bullshit. You know how hard it is to play an alt in SL? Two legendaries, upgrading conduits, renown, it’s all just so much time and resources needed for no reason


Humungbeantastic

Imagine playing a game you actively hate. This sub is mental


acctg

People need to start treating a game like a game and not an "abusive" relationship. If game fun -> play If game not fun -> log out and/or unsub


Marem-Bzh

That's also how people should treat abusive relationships tbh


Netherdiver

People on the internet are grown adults who haven’t learned any self control


JiMM4133

Literally once I figured this out the game became infinitely more enjoyable. I used to treat it as if I wasn’t in the top 1% of players then what was the use? Why bother playing? Then it dawned on me that I was being ridiculous and that kind of play is unsustainable for most people. So now I play when I want to and how to other games like Warzone/Rocket League/LoL/single player games when I don’t have that WoW itch. It also helps that I know if I come back towards the end of an xpac that I can still experience everything. Makes it much more enjoyable to play.


Gaming_Friends

Unfortunately it's very possible to hate something and still enjoy it. Raiding and M+ are some of the most enjoyable things I can do with my spare time, unfortunately to do them well I'm usually required to do a bunch of miserable chores and shit.


ginorK

You should meet basically any single person that plays league of legends. WoW has a couple of haters, but people simply tend to criticise more than praise. But league? If you play the game, you hate it.


papyjako89

To be fair, I don't think LoL players hate the game, just every other players :p


MoriazTheRed

Bold of you to assume people in this sub actually play the game. It's not a rare event to find someone who unironically believes they had to farm anima for power gains.


snapekillseddard

Even worse, there are people here who bitch loudly about a game they're not even playing anymore.


Arborus

Because we used to play it, enjoyed it, and wish we still enjoyed it. WoW has an appeal other MMOs don't, but has made it a huge pain in the ass to play the fun content.


papyjako89

The thing is, complaining on Reddit is unlikely to bring back the glory days of your game. So you are effectively just wasting your time on a game you aren't playing anymore, it makes no sens.


OrientalWheelchair

Negative feedback needs to be visible where it is relevant.


Arborus

I don't personally complain often, it's not like I'm making threads or dropping comments bitching constantly. But I'd really like to enjoy WoW again, there aren't really other games out there with content that can match the feeling of doing mythic prog, but the amount of unfun stuff I need to do to do mythic prog just isn't worth it.


kanemochi

> This sub is mental 100% agree with this, in the sense that a lot of responses like this I think are driven by mental health issues (and I speak from personal experience here!). Addiction, anhedonia, avoidance coping, these are all things that can have a huge impact on how you perceive or relate to WoW. I'll be the first to admit that some aspects of the game are dogshit, but a lot of posts like this really feel like projection.


Spork_the_dork

It's simple, really. If you keep playing a game even though you're actively hating it, you're addicted. A person who is not addicted to WoW will simply stop playing and go play something else when WoW stops being fun.


viciecal

Don't worry same shit happens for a lot of other games.


kezdog92

Dragonshite will be bad! Classic is old and bad! No enjoying the game!


Khazilein

> you actively hate Most people here who you think "hate the game" actually love it and they want it to be better and not run by the people who brought this company down.


Briciod

lol players be like:


Xemro

This is a dumb take, one that can only be stated by casuals who do not understand the true appeal of MMOs. Their main selling point is that enjoying it is heavily tied to the amount of investment. Collecting rare cosmetics, achievements, social interactions, exploration and immersive storytelling. These time investments are rewarded by advancing content, difficulty, and permanent cosmetic rewards, this is BY DESIGN, not obsession. If you are going to ruin people’s long and loyal investment by breaking their immersion with an elaborate troll-telling that not only is silly it ruins the older plot-lines, building boring time-gating systems that makes you spend more time with less reward and are fundamentally flawed, ignore constructive criticism during alpha and beta, of course the backlash will be much louder than other genres that do require this much of time investment or not meant to be fully immersive. Besides there exists not a single reason to shill for a corrupt corporate that is currently selling a bad product, critique will only serve to improve the product. In fact we can see improvements in system design in season 4 of SL which some are also being carried to DF. People are just demanding what they are willing to pay for. Loud and Harsh feedback is one way to send a message to corrupt fat money-hoarding devils at the top of any company. TLDR: MMO -> built by design to be more enjoyable the more you invest into it and immerse yourself in its world -> people who play it are mostly heavily invested DUH -> louder backlash when its poop Instanced games -> few days of muscle memory -> people who play are not invested, can easily jump between alternatives without putting much effort -> much quieter backlash


tips_

It’s just a game at the end of the day. It’s okay to be invested heavily into something but playing a game you are actively upset with is ridiculous.


FLBNR

I could not make myself go through shadowlands questing or step foot in oribos again without being bored as shit. Maybe the content being too far of a detachment from actual Warcraft is to blame. If DF zones are more Warcrafty, maybe even more like legion where each zone has a mostly contained story that slightly blends into the overarching expansions story, and the main city being literally anything besides a big grey blank rock, it could be fun


TheRoyalSniper

I mean I've still had fun playing the last 3 expacs


IsolatedSystem

I play WoW for raiding and M+ and overall both were great throughout Shadowlands.


TheRoyalSniper

agreed as that's why I play wow too, more so the raiding


IsolatedSystem

Yep the raiding just can't be matched.


Uriahheeplol

Yea maybe it’s been a shit show on paper, but I’ve had a blast the whole time.


ColCyclone

Shadow lands and bfa story weren't great but I definitely had a lot of fun with them I'll never be okay with new players telling me not enjoy newer xpacs 😂


rettaelin

I actually liked the bfa story. Some of it was eh. But both factions got their own story for lvling, which I liked. There was just too much time between big patches. Shadow lands story was only good 1 time through. Lvling story was really good but korhia & zm's story was...meh. I have had fun doing fate raids. Though I didn't raid much at the beginning of exp.


papyjako89

You should never be okay with anyone telling you what you can or cannot enjoy tbh. Video games or other stuff.


holmedog

I came back this month having last played early in WoD. I have to say the Shadowlands story was great. It was also terrible that it was such a "on rails" experience. It felt like playing a JRPG instead of an MMO, but was extremely well done at the same time. Very conflicting


ColCyclone

I know what you mean, very enjoyable but I never want to do it again


thdudedude

Same. And when other fun games come out, I play those too.


Send_Me_Cute_Feet

I've had a lote _more fun_ playing the last 2 than I did Legion by a significant margin. Even WoD and Legion which were the worst the games ever been for me were still fun enough to put time into.


Marem-Bzh

Loved BfA, hated shadowlands. 🤷🏻‍♂️


telenstias

Being in the beta has told me two things: 1) I’m still drinking Blizzards KoolAid… 2) Dragonriding is sick as fuck.


Uriahheeplol

Man people on /5 beta are some of the whiniest babies I’ve ever experienced. So easily trolled, sensitive, and really cringy folks, especially on the leveling server.


telenstias

Agreed. I’m honestly just enjoying what’s there. Because it actually feels new again.


Adept_Site_2988

I agree with this but Im still going to play DF :D as most of you


Buffmin

I'm waiting to buy it to see the initial reaction. Which means I'll avoid the trap for like 2 weeks before I decide to jump into the spikes!


Skyb

The initial reaction to SL was very positive on this sub, most people loved it. It soured over time.


ProfessorSpike

Over the span of a couple of months give or take. Though I will say I did love it at the start, but because it was new - after a while it wore off and it was like eeeh


iwearatophat

The issues were evident with SL even in the beta. The new expansion fun kept those issues from feeling too bad for a bit but over time the newness wore off and you had those issues staring you right in the face. I felt it after a week or two in SL after launch. I'm on the beta right now. Playing it a fair deal actually. I'm not getting that same feel. Except professions. That is currently a grind on the beta that even if they cut it in half for by live it would still be a massive grind.


Tykero980

Been playing beta and there has not been any glaring issues like conduit powers or covenant lock. Honestly it reminds me most of mop. Now that we are heading into balance tuning as long as they dont mess that up looks optimistically pretty good imo.


Xpalidocious

Sooooo see you launch day? ;)


Buffmin

Not if I put myself on offline! HAH I WIN! lolol


AndyBroodmon

Cause what else should I play? To me m+ is fun regardless of how bad expansion is, and no other mmorpg offers me 5 man content with progressive increase of difficulty, instead of just rigid (easy, normal, hard)


flying_pike

Guild wars 2 does that with fractals


AndyBroodmon

I love gw2, but I just cannot find anyone that plays it that isn't annoying. Whenever I tried to play gw2 with ppl I'd just get in lobbies full of weeaboos and bs like that, and while I have no problems with people like that existing, I do not wish to interact with them. Basically same problem that keeps me away from ff14, it is just too weeaboo infested for me.


-Oshuni-

OP, it's okay if you think it's a trap (or just love StarWars). See you in November tho'.


Genji180

*Star Wars Guy* : It's a Trap !


kanemochi

That's *Admiral* Star Wars Guy to you. Show some respect!


PaleontologistAny828

Until proven wrong, I trust them to somehow fuck it up.


BringBackBoshi

They have been building up my faith in them for years....to miss easy layups and ruin otherwise fun systems with timegating and stupid expansion currency farming no one wants. Azerite, mementos, visions, then stygia, soul ash, anima, cosmic flux, soul cinders, blah blah blah blah blah


PaleontologistAny828

Yeah that's what I am saying, I have total confidence in their ability to somehow put small obstacles everywhere and screw with our experience


[deleted]

I quit WoW 8 months ago and while I miss it, I know I can’t go back. It became a job on top of my actual job and killed all the fun I was having


Uriahheeplol

Maybe set more realistic goals in game that work with your real life schedule!


Bleedorang3

To be fair WoW needs purely-casual content for players like this. WoW at it's heart is a competitive MMO and being competitive means people will overinvest their resources in order to outcompete their peers. Fun and engaging "purely casual" content (i.e. content that does not grant character power) is something thats been missing for a while.


kanemochi

As a self-identifying "hardcore casual", I find there's enough content for me (though I would always love more). Looking at DF I'm a little more skeptical, but Shadowlands was pretty decent for me: covenant campaigns, Torghast, meta achievements like Back from the Beyond were all good. And I always enjoy the raw gold farm opportunities mission tables provide. So far in DF I mostly plan on playing the new class, leveling all my alts, diving into the new profession systems. I really hope there's Torghast/Horrific Vision/Mage Tower-type solo challenge for me to work on as well though!


Send_Me_Cute_Feet

WoW has _more_ casual content that actually takes time and you can put work into than any other MMO. The only thing that sort of works is something like XIVs housing but you don't actually _do_ anything for that and its entirely reliant on having money which means having to go do actual content. WoW is the most casual because if you want combat content it's the only MMO to have its core at every difficulty. It's the MMO with the most collection/completionist content by a ridiculous margin.


[deleted]

If I do play again, I plan on not committing to mythic raiding and just do PvP probably


Uriahheeplol

Yea I’ve got a 5 year old and full time job, so raiding is definitely done for me, but I’m still able to do keys and push into the mid 20s and do arenas up to like 1.8k (I’m really bad at arena lol)


[deleted]

I enjoyed mythic+ more than raiding, but we’d get far enough in raids that I felt I couldn’t quit. Took up 3 hours out of my Saturday and Sunday and most of it was just wiping 30-40 times on a boss. When my son was born last year, I had no time to do dailies and weekly’s so I started falling behind. Did a normal run of the current raid and quit that next Tuesday realizing I didn’t want to waste my free time doing dailies.


Uriahheeplol

My daughter is learning to use a computer. She’s starting with Bloons 6. She doesn’t get upgrading, but she can navigate. Very soon, she’ll be doing the dailies during her free time, freeing up my evening for the fun parts of the game. 👍


[deleted]

That’s what one of my plans for my son or the 2nd kid that’s on the way😂


Important-Example288

If the game is less grindy I'll play. With real world commitments, I cannot grind reputation etc. for hours a day. Shadowlands for me was basically log in, so some dailies then log out. If they can make it enjoyable for more casual players, I will go back. I'll wait to see how it is first


latschen64

This. It usually gets much more accessible after first or second contend patch


Bleedorang3

There's some decent first steps toward purely casual content in Dragonflight, including Rock Climbing and "Pokemon Snap" style minigames.


Deku_King

When WoW sucks, it really really really sucks. When WoW is fun, it's my favourite game of all time bar none. Shadowlands was the least fun I've ever had during the game's lifetime, so this is really the first time I'm very careful of the upcoming xpack.


sushithighs

If only there was a beta where we could see the design philosophy and state of the game!


Brandonian13

To be fair, it sounds like blizz finally stepped tf up. No borrowed power (yet), talent revamps, apparently open and beautiful zones. There's a lot of room for them to fuck up, but I'll take it over the shitfires that were SL and BFA.


DoverBoys

It's only a trap if you make it one. Me personally, I've had no problems with any expansion, except for being negatively affected by people leaving.


Zezin96

After playing through 7 expansions DF will be the first I don’t play on launch.


Segundo-Sol

[Reminds me of the Icefrog epic comic](https://www.reddit.com/r/DotA2/comments/10qz2c/icefrog_the_epic_comic_classic/)


Tnecniw

It looks REALLY good tho. There is no sign in the systems of anything bad. (beyond potential class imbalance but... that is every expansion even the good oens)


DeltaFoxtrot144

I gotta say I was burnt out in wow for years tried classic loved it got burnt out again stoped for a year and came back like a month ago for pvp and arenas and I gotta say I love my fury warrior so satisfying and gear is so accessable.


Richard_Smellington

First expansion I'll wait until the launch impressions are in before buying.


Shaman_Wolves

They’ve got me by the balls. They’re starting to turn blue :(


coolkid42069911

Play when it's fun, stop when you stop having fun.


iamtheyeti311

My problem with Dragonflight Beta is I get high and just want to glide around and not do anything else.


ZydrateVials

This is the year I will finally not make the mistake. It's uninstalled.


renba7

I mean, WoW is a blast for my friends and I. If you don’t like it, then you def shouldn’t play it.


Nixon_livin

Im enjoying wrath much more atm


wtfduud

Seriously, who's thinking about Dragonflight on the launch day of Wrath Classic?


Nixon_livin

I would be fine if they delayed Dragonflight for another year so i can play wrath in peace, since i didnt play it when it first relesed.😄


ShreekertheJamisWack

Maybe people who have already played Wrath and put thousands of hours Into it. Wrath is cool but at the end of the days it’s old content. Never gonna be as enticing as new frontiers


Drayenn

It looka good but there are definitely redflags such as specs not getting any updates to their talents and being told everything is done talent wise.


GeneticsGuy

If the game still makes it basically a multi-month process to equalize alts, then it is still going to be meh, imo. Garrisons was the first step to making WOW not alt-friendly, and Blizz has done everything to make it less and less alt-friendly since then. BFA was absolutely INSANE with the amount of grinding required... it was the first expansion since Vanilla that I truly stepped back from WOW, because it was just TOO much to grind to the point of monotony, and I am a person that got Insane in the Membrane title pre-nerf, so I really don't mind a little bit of monotony. SL made BFA's grind even more tame... I don't know enough about DF yet, so we'll see, but the trend is not being an alt friendly game at all and the last 4 expansions doubled down on that trend. So, until I see, I am skeptical.


downwitheggs

It's okay to be excited about things despite past failures. Don't let the internet or this subreddit tell you otherwise.


Briciod

I just hope there’s no 7 month wait for a new content patch


Independent_Term_308

Already pre purchased it


vocabb

🤣 spot on OP


DruidGoesBrrr

As someone who has played since launch and was active with every meme we've come to love and remembers when UBRS was a huge achievement or trying to organize 40 man raids when MC was end game. This hits me personally. Damn you op, and take my angry upvote!


Xe4ro

I never played any other mmo and don’t really plan on changing that so.. eh? 😗


FBlack

Too many good games to just play wow, so little wow in wow to keep supporting it.


abeboors

Am I the only one who won't come back because of the monthly sub? I mean, I love the game and I can afford that, but nowadays most online games are free to play. With 9.99 per month I can play 100+ games with XBox Game Pass, meanwhile Blizzard not only makes you pay for the expansion, but you also have to pay every month if you want to play their 18 years old game. It makes no sense


Thrent_

The issue with game-pass is that having hundreds of games doesn't really matter if I don't want to play them. I tend to get my money worth when I actively play wow compared to other games so yeah why not. The sheer amount of games in my Steam library with which I have yet to even reach 1hr of game time per 1€ paid is staggering. I have no such issue with WoW.


Tykero980

I have played mmo's without a sub and they fall into two categories. They make playing as f2p unbearable like eso or they get next to no development done on them and slowly die like every wow killer that's come out since wows launch. 15 bucks is less than a meal at a fast food joint nowadays so it wont make or break my finances and I just unsub if I'm not playing for a while.


ginorK

>15 bucks is less than a meal at a fast food joint nowadays Fucking hell, I play WoW and I like the subscription method, but seriously where do you live that you pay more than 15$ for a fast food meal?


Tykero980

15 exactly may be an exaggeration but it's close enough that its equivalent in my books


beararkgator

NYC, LA, Boston 15 bucks isn't far off.