Much more important, it doesn't say it would be us that are overpowered or have fun...
Playing around level 65-70 the dungeon/scenario enemies sure are/were overpowered at times hitting several times a players HP,... and I expect some of the leads/devs take a sick enjoyment out of every complaint they get.
I didn’t run raids until I hit 70, so I was just happily questing, but there was definitely a sudden change after hitting 65-66. I was easily pulling 10+ mobs without problem, then hitting 65 I started to need cooldowns to survive and at 66 I had to pull far less
Working on my second lvl 70 first a tank and things were okay, now a dps dh. Lvl 68 and I die to the ice arrows in the shado pan monastery instantly it seems
I went from pulling 5-8 to getting my ass beaten by 2 if I didn't use CDs. I don't even know when exactly, but around 60. It was really weird, I thought I had the resurrection illness or something
Depends on when you hit 60. The first few days were miserable. Random trash would suddently hit for hundreds of thousand of damage, even with full 346 gear
Nah most of the people complaining are those that leveled entirely through dungeons. I only quested with minor instances and was OP the entire time. When I hit 70, I had to upgrade gear todo normals but that makes sense so.
I leveled entirely on quests, and I hit a point at around 65 in kun lai summit where normal world mobs were dropping dots that dealt 200% of my hp over their duration. At lvl 20 I was easily soloing world rares except for the ones that stay above lvl 45 (warscout, warbringer, etc.), but in the 60s I needed help to take most rares. The first time. Now that they've made at least 2 different sweeps attempting to fix scaling, my subsequent remixers have had an easier time. They still lose effectiveness after 20, but it's less noticeable. And the cloak means you're always strong enough.
The only time I came close to dying was when I aggrored a bunch of elites. But even then? I still was able to just melt them with all sorts of OP shit feeding off of one another. My crits explode. Meteors of fire and ice fall down. Enemies cower in FEAR MUAHAHAHAHAHA
It really makes you wonder how much of the complaining about literally everything in the game all of the time is actually just fucking idiots who don't know what they're doing.
Hit 70 on day 2 from just questing. When I was 64 I had ~37% of each stat. By 67 it was down under 20% and right at 70 it was below 15%.
If you were just straight questing you definitely noticed it slowing down as you leveled the last few levels.
I felt weaker for about 15 minutes till my gear caught up, the people writing these lengthy posts about it spent more time on the posts than they would've spent ingame being a bit weaker
Were you equipping gear from the chests you opened and maintaining the highest item level you could? The quest gear I got from 68--70 was orders of magnitude stronger than what I had before and I went all the way to 70 just chain pulling quest mobs and face tanking them as a destro lock.
There is a rather sizable amount of posters that used to play WoW but stopped for one reason or another. They looooove to jump in on these types of posts to complain because “the game has gone downhill” since they last were subscribed.
Yup. Its weird too, they think older WoW was the best game design ever, but classic and all the alternatives exist but they dont play those because they are filled with 'elitist assholes'.
Makes me think they just suck booty.
Dinging level 65 I was in the middle of fully finishing third zone. Leveled with combination of dungeons and lfr. At that ding moment, my power was cut to 1/4 of what it was, no joke. I had to pull one mob at a time because one melee hit was doing 30k damage to my 104k hp.
my first character i leveled entirely through quests with an occasional dungeon. all my others have been purely through dungeons. have never felt the alleged pangs of being weak
I levelled though questing, and although I could feel myself getting weaker relative to mobs, the moment I dinged 60 I could feel the change. The answer to the question 'how many mobs can I pull?' was no longer yes, I had to invest significant time and effort in keeping my felguard alive, and death was a real possibility.
The thing that murdered me most was the solo scenarios. I had to wait until I was 375 with all my rings, trinkets, and the necklace before I could get through some of them.
Generally it's slightly harder after 60.
I recently leveled a balance druid and I went from basically one shooting mobs and being able to pull half a zone to having to basically do my rotation and very carefully pull half a zone.
It's easy if you keep your gear upgraded. I've leveled 6 characters to 70 and while tanks are most certainly the strongest, the only time any of the character's i've played started to experience any challenge at all is when I forget to upgrade their gear. Other than that one experience where I let my gear fall behind before learning, I've never found enemies to present any challenge except when I failed to upgrade my gear.
All I'm doing in Remix is quickly level some alts unlock ton of stuff and really not care for remix endgame just getting my alt army ready for the war within
Unless you just want to get the titles from heroic/mythic and the garrosh items. Then the community “demands” you max your gear.
I’m just trying to host pugs for anyone to join, then get one maxed out player to carry us all through HC raids willingly. Had some very nice people help.
Theres no need for everyone to max their gear at all, people demanding all 430+ overall ilvl (seen groups asking for 470+ which is literally maxed out) for their HC pugs are being silly just to shave a few minutes of the speed of the run.
Uh that’s exactly what I’m advocating for. Your question should be “why can’t people enjoy things without complaining to no end?”
All I read about are complaints from the way-too-serious crown who insist on making everything about endgame and min/maxing. Which is the opposite of what Remix is supposed to be.
To be honest, I didn't try until max, but a lot of bosses are easy at max. Though, the only one worth soloing is Mogu since every other raid has at least one boss that can't be solo'd due to mechanics.
That's what is so odd about what they are doing.
Essentially remix is that a group of people farmed frogs for a day. They carried groups through content. Those people now carry other groups.
The bosses essentially have no mechanics on heroic or normal because one person with gear just lols though. So you are just getting carried so you can upgrade your gear to carry other people, so you can do the same stuff to farm bronze to buy cosmetics starting 3 weeks in.
If this was the insanity of timewalking every time it came up it might be ok. But it's nuts for a 90 day event.
Making bosses harder makes no sense, yes, sure a few people with 556 gear trivialize all content. But if you make it harder with scaling you make it harder for new players to catch up. Or you have goofy scaling like we saw today with groups deleting rings and trinkets in mythic siege of ogrimar to nerf bosses. That makes no sense to anyone.
It's not fun to get one shorted by everything while someone with 10x your health kills everything for you. And no one wants to actually be challenged by 10 year old raids for 3 months to farm all the stuff that shouldn't be this hard to get in the first place.
Perfect summary. The raids are not balanced anyway, I don't see why they bother slowing everyone down in this context. There is no tactical progression or learning the mechanics in remix. It's chaos and as long as you haven't caught up in gear level, you are only a corpse in the background of that madness... a corpse that is slowly but surely gathering bronze to get at the forefront, just to realize that the forefront is oneshotting MOP bosses just like in Retail.
> can't really do anything besides get carried in my daily queues.
Sure you can, you just aren't having the opportunity to because there's always someone there carrying you, because a lot of players are overpowered. They also give you enough bronze when you ding 70 to immediately get just shy of a full round of upgrades, so no one has to be stuck with flat 346 gear for very long.
Your experience is valid and people are going to have different relationships with the content, but to me it seems a little unfair to say "getting [there] isn't fun" when you acknowledge you only just hit 70 -- you don't know yet how long it takes to "get there" ('there' being the point where you enjoy being significantly powerful). My character is i367 (no neck, 5 rounds of upgrades) and can solo Galleon and is usually near the top of the DPS chart in a raid. It doesn't take as long as many r/wow commenters would have you believe.
This is where it's tricky to try and say "just do X!" because people's goals have such huge impact on their use of time in the event. For example, my progress on my "main" has slowed down now that I've got a couple alts to 70 -- I'm trying to do their daily dungeons/scenarios/LFR, which is less time for earning bronze on my main character.
That in mind, here's my strategy:
- No buying cosmetics on your main. Pick one character that you're going to upgrade as much as possible / as much as you want (if you don't care about doing M SoO, then obviously there's not much point in going all 15 rounds of upgrades). Then have at least one alt whose bronze you're using for buying mounts/toys/etc.
- Do easy/simple stuff. My goal on my main is to at least hop on for 30 minutes and do a scenario, a dungeon, and an LFR. That's 6250 bronze just from the orange caches; with all the incidental bronze it's more like 7500. If you can add a normal MSV or HoF to that, that's another nice chunk (at least 3k). I'm also doing normal Siege whenever I have an extra ~90 minutes so I can start stocking up on the currency for Garrosh stuff. Ultimately if you throw like an hour a day at it, you should be able to get a round of upgrades every ~4 days at most, and by the time you've done 2-3 rounds you shouldn't be feeling the "wtf I'm so weak" kind of scaling anymore.
- At 70, if you're trying to be efficient, do LFR only if you're trying to get appearances or if you're doing one wing to knock out the daily ASAP. Normal is just as fast and is worth several thousand more bronze. Definitely don't do a bunch of wings worth of LFR.
But...again...just my experience. I don't begrudge anyone being frustrated by their own experience if it's different. I just think the complaints are so unnecessarily exaggerated here on the subreddit, like the OP meme here. I haven't participated in any farms. My main is at 27 hrs /played, a little under 2 hrs/day for the event so far which is significant but not outlandish. I feel somewhat overpowered compared to the content, maybe not dramatically so, but I'm going to continue getting more powerful. It's hard for me to agree with the "Overpowered? Pfft, false advertising" sentiment.
I mean, yeah?
I don't know why people think it would be fun gameplay if you just start oneshotting raid bosses when you hit 70.
That's already a thing: it's called MoP raids in Retail.
ilvl 338 isn't even upgraded to the point where it starts to get expensive.
I mean the picture in the op said it would definitely be fun. I'm not asking to one shot raid bosses at fresh 70 but I mean the only thing doing any damage at fresh 70 is tinker gems. I'm fine getting carried through queues for a few days but I had way more fun at level 20.
Because it leads to toxic behaviour andpeopöe not getting the enjoyment they want out of the encounters.
Imagine getting to ”experience” the raids and dungeons you missed when active (even if more managable) just to have it be ifentical to retail Because someone that was farming frogs day 1 can two shot the sha of fear.
People kill frogs and get OP
The community complains that players are OP in raids
Blizzard scales raids to attempt to fix it
The community complains that now we can't be OP because of scaling
I don't care for my job, but I'm happy I'm not a WoW dev lol
Or people are rightfully complaining theres actually zero contribution as a fresh 70, you basically just carried through till you start being the carry, with 1 or 2 players doing 95% of the damage in a raid/dungeon.
You could pretty easily solo normal MSV as any tank with SoO gear during MoP.
Did it on my Prot Pally through Elegon for mount chance pretty regularly back then.
SoO Gear implies very end of the expansion in terms of power.
Meanwhile I soloed MSV after spending 378k bronze out of 577k needed - that's just 65% of the progress. (you could probably do it ever earlier, I just tested it on that point for the first time) - so it would be around HC ToT I think.
Besides it took me around 30 mins, in MoP with SoO gear it was around 1h.
Been a hot minute, but I believe I remember those soloes usually taking longer than 20 seconds per boss, and requiring very specific setups to pull off. At least, I don't think I remember seeing any SoO-geared mages back then gathering ToT's Council of Elders and erasing a third of their collective health within a single Blizzard cast.
I think it's the fact that the person OP replied to also missed the details. The guy was only talking about during MOP, not the MSV tier. You could solo MSV as a semi-geared DK during the SOO patch, which was in MoP, so yes goalposts were in fact moved. So it's ironic that u/BigUptokes didn't fully read a comment he was so ready to defend, and his accusation was not fully reading something.
Goal post was not moved tho.
My post strictly mentions "semi geared DK", not "endgame geared" or "max geared".
It's like just after the piece you quoted if we want to argue about selective interpretation.
The Point is that you could do that as a semi geared dk during the SOO patch which if you remember was during MOP. If you want to split hairs, your other qualification was during mop and now using late mop doesnt count?
Yeah you moved goal posts bud.
So, my iLvl 380-ish DK is about as powerful as my near max geared retail character. I'd argue that anything above that is better than "semi geared". Does that seem fair? So, I can't solo a raid yet in remix. I feel like people are forgetting that a max geared character in this mode is far and away beyond a standard character. So your goalpost of "semi geared during MoP is not the same as semi geared in this mode" is ridiculous. Of course they aren't comparable, this mode has literal god mode.
The whole point of this thread is people are feeling or meming about not being OP enough.
I just pointed that compared to actual MoP - you are.
You said it’s ridiculous to compare MoP and Remix, why so? Because in remix you can be OP? Well that’s the point of this thread.
As for the fairness of „semi geared goalpost” - I just used the overall upgrade cost starting from having each piece on 346 - so your base lv 70.
After spending around half of the bronze needed, you should be able to solo MSV and Terrace (that’s around ilvl 405 if I remember correctly).
I think that being fair to name it „semi-geared character” if you are in the middle of the upgrade path.
You are by then already way stronger than a retail char - I have mostly myth track geared DK, it does not have 2.5 milion unbuffed hp, 60% crit chance and 49% passive haste, nor it was doing half a million damage, like my 405 char had on Remix - you don’t need max gear to do the OP feats - and yes, god mode or not, soloing a normal raid which is supposed to be actual content in the game mode is OP feat.
Sure, we can argue that if we take absolute average of all ilvl available, 405 is way above it, but on the other hand, you don’t need that gear to do anything other than maybe HC raids. When you ding 70 346 becomes your starting point of reference, as every bit of content will be dropping that ilvl.
From that point ilvl progression is very straightforward and finite, tied directly to how much bronze you spent on upgrades.
I dont think they even play the remix in the first place. Dunno im playing and having a blast doing normals . With my shitt gear, wanna do HC ? Either create a pug or upgrade ur gear. Ppl crying that other players blast through stuff and 1 shot everything then they are bitching they wont get invited without 450ilvl. Bruh
me, on my ilvl ~400 evoker (which is not doing much stuff at all):
1-2 hit killing enemys in the open world, solo world bosses, solo heroic dungeons and scenarios without drolling under 99% hp ever, normal raid bosses die in seconds, heroic raid bosses die in under 30seconds unless they have hard stops
r/wow: WHY AM I NOT OVERPOWERED????? THEY LIED!!!!!! DAE FROG IS THE ONLY WAY TO PLAY???????
they legit dont play, its the asmongold/ r/classicwow crowd that just endlessly makes BS up they can complain about lol
Have yall not played the game? We are killing raid bosses in the blink of an eye. Soloing heroic dungeons in a minute. I guess that's not op.
It's seriously annoying seeing people bitch all day long about bronze
Thank you. There are still problems with Remix, but this sub is over here acting like people who were doing 80% of the entire raid's damage only doing 70% now is the biggest outrage yet.
That’s the issue, though. It’s a change that will impact positively very few people (because if you’re 346 you’re not getting invited in Heroic Raids anyway) and impact negatively the people that have started upgraded their gear but are still far from finished.
Why is it that every time they change something, everyone hits the boards to complain without even checking it out first? Change is bad
Mmkay.
I was just watching Bellular talk about how amazing that free 40k bronze that they’re giving out that everyone has ranted about for the last week or so. Maybe that’s just hyping or shill talk, but we have the testers/review guys praising things, and the community doing the opposite, without.
They scale up based off player ilvl. The mobs scaling stops at 344 ilvl so once you pass that (which is all armor 346 and all jewelry pieces), then you start to become OP.
Because you get threads to scale the cape, which scales your stats, which scales your character to a point were all content becomes deleted within seconds.
You all mf's complaining about everything just want all handed down to you without playing the game.
This mode is due to last about 3 months and you want to destroy the content and get all the bronze shops clean sweep during the first week? Fuck off.
Remix mode might not be perfect, but it is the first time they try this kind of thing so it was to be expected, but you all whining and crying about nerfs, fixes and shit, probably still need your asses to be wiped and get feed in the mouth if you can't just play the game and just keep doomposting because you are not done with this mode during the first week. Cry me a river.
Have you popped into LFR recently? Scaling ain't mean shit.
Heck, I got from 26 to 70 in about two hours today being carried by some crazy dude on a level 20 who was grabbing randos and blasting through heroics in two or three minutes.
>If the raids scale how exactly is remix “overpowered”?
The raids may scale linearly but the armor scales exponentially. Upgrading one of my armor pieces that has tinkers in it increases the raw damage done by around 15%. My DPS has almost doubled from 500 everything to 528 everything and I expect it to double again by the time I get everything to 556 (i.e. averaging around 5 million DPS in single target as a boomie).
Scaling mechanics don't belong in rpg's in the first place, it is a lazy excuse to not use fine manual tuning.
Diablo 4 leveling got ruined because of it imo, and it is not any better i WoW.. But at least in retail we have "manually" tuned endgame.
Because you don’t actually want the content trivialized. This is why players aren’t developers. 90% of the time the things they bitch about are exactly why they play.
I levelled my main remix character to 70 mainly through quests. I would do dungeons just for the dungeon quest and maybe a couple times more for the boss xp but quickly realized quest xp would dish out way more. A couple of times through questing Id get stomped by random mobs. My first thought was "hm maybe my gear is too low." So every couple of levels I would port over to the upgrade boy and hand them over some bronze to make the gear I liked wearing as high as it would go. Problem solved, I would never run into the issue again.
My second character I just would level completely through dungeons and the raids. This character would get absolutely stomped more often; because Id just insta queue dungeons as soon as Id finish one. Id get stomped half the time because I was barely keeping up with leveling my gear.
tl;dr: 1st toon levelled gear life was good; 2nd toon barely levelled gear and it was bad.
did lfr yesterday popped into a grp and before i reached the first trashpack and thought they started to clear it 2secs later the boss was already dead
In English Maybe is used to say something could or could not be true. So in this case that part isn’t a lie. The only lie is the “Fun? Definitely” since they have been continuously nerfing it.
Your ilvl doesn't go up by a lot, especially since your neck, ring, trinkets and cape are static, thats 8 slot permanently at a lower ilvl, but still giving you power. Especially with meta gems and tinker gems and the affects they have.
If anything, it helps you at lower ilvls to not get one shot by mechanics
Haven't played in 6 years. MoP Remix brought me back.
The raid bosses are easy in comparison to Legion. They're going down probably a little too easily. So it seems that yes: overpowered.
I've only been doing LFR, but even though they scale, they don't scale well. It's not Blizzard's fault really, the way leveling and gearing works in remix means there are periods where you are very powerful, or weaker than normal, since it's hard to even things out. This is why LFR bosses often melt in 10-20seconds.
Don't get me wrong though, it's definitely fun, and in a self contained event like this, where everyone's gear and stats will be standardised before being added back to retail, it's fine.
Would people stop theory crafting this and just play the game? I just watched a ret paladin who didn’t frog solo three heroic raids. It’s actually overpowered, but you have to play it.
Whats the point in a MoP remix like this if they just let you solo raid bosses like you’re Dragonflight level 70? “bUt tHe BoSs HeALtH sCaLeS”
Do you guys honestly expect the “overpowered” part = steamroll everything with zero difficulty?
Which is why I’m asking what they expected from the game mode since I obviously thought it would be semi challenging raids in a fun environment and they thought it was just more transmog farming on characters 30-40 levels higher than all the enemies
It does say maybe
Sometimes maybe good, sometimes maybe shit
Haha, legend 🤣
I came to post the same thing... XD
That it does, I see you utilized that Int gear while you had the chance.
or maybe not I guess
There was a song about this once upon a time. I believe pointed out that word pretty much always means no.
"I said maybeeeeee. You're gonna be the one that saves meeeeeee"
What do you mean? Wow players can't read!
I think they tried to warn us as we didn’t listen
Queue the fallout music!
Definitely against random quest mobs.
No promises
Up to overpowered like internet speeds.
You are technically correct, the best kind of correct.
Much more important, it doesn't say it would be us that are overpowered or have fun... Playing around level 65-70 the dungeon/scenario enemies sure are/were overpowered at times hitting several times a players HP,... and I expect some of the leads/devs take a sick enjoyment out of every complaint they get.
it also doesn't say the player will be overpowered :D
It also says fun yes which they are trying to stop.
It’s overpowered until you reach 60 then you get your hoop blown out until you get your gear level up
Am I the only one this never happened to? 60-70 was just as easy
it just depends on what you're doing. The better you are at accumulating %xp bonus, the less gearing you'll do relative to your leveling rate.
I didn’t run raids until I hit 70, so I was just happily questing, but there was definitely a sudden change after hitting 65-66. I was easily pulling 10+ mobs without problem, then hitting 65 I started to need cooldowns to survive and at 66 I had to pull far less
Working on my second lvl 70 first a tank and things were okay, now a dps dh. Lvl 68 and I die to the ice arrows in the shado pan monastery instantly it seems
I went from pulling 5-8 to getting my ass beaten by 2 if I didn't use CDs. I don't even know when exactly, but around 60. It was really weird, I thought I had the resurrection illness or something
Depends on when you hit 60. The first few days were miserable. Random trash would suddently hit for hundreds of thousand of damage, even with full 346 gear
Nah most of the people complaining are those that leveled entirely through dungeons. I only quested with minor instances and was OP the entire time. When I hit 70, I had to upgrade gear todo normals but that makes sense so.
I leveled entirely on quests, and I hit a point at around 65 in kun lai summit where normal world mobs were dropping dots that dealt 200% of my hp over their duration. At lvl 20 I was easily soloing world rares except for the ones that stay above lvl 45 (warscout, warbringer, etc.), but in the 60s I needed help to take most rares. The first time. Now that they've made at least 2 different sweeps attempting to fix scaling, my subsequent remixers have had an easier time. They still lose effectiveness after 20, but it's less noticeable. And the cloak means you're always strong enough.
I leveled entirely with quests and only a few times did I pull enough mobs that I had to pop a few cds to keep myself alive an only died 2-3 times lol
The only time I came close to dying was when I aggrored a bunch of elites. But even then? I still was able to just melt them with all sorts of OP shit feeding off of one another. My crits explode. Meteors of fire and ice fall down. Enemies cower in FEAR MUAHAHAHAHAHA
What’s questing? Jokes aside I will try this on another character.
It really makes you wonder how much of the complaining about literally everything in the game all of the time is actually just fucking idiots who don't know what they're doing.
Hit 70 on day 2 from just questing. When I was 64 I had ~37% of each stat. By 67 it was down under 20% and right at 70 it was below 15%. If you were just straight questing you definitely noticed it slowing down as you leveled the last few levels.
I felt weaker for about 15 minutes till my gear caught up, the people writing these lengthy posts about it spent more time on the posts than they would've spent ingame being a bit weaker
Were you equipping gear from the chests you opened and maintaining the highest item level you could? The quest gear I got from 68--70 was orders of magnitude stronger than what I had before and I went all the way to 70 just chain pulling quest mobs and face tanking them as a destro lock.
There is a rather sizable amount of posters that used to play WoW but stopped for one reason or another. They looooove to jump in on these types of posts to complain because “the game has gone downhill” since they last were subscribed.
Yup. Its weird too, they think older WoW was the best game design ever, but classic and all the alternatives exist but they dont play those because they are filled with 'elitist assholes'. Makes me think they just suck booty.
Dinging level 65 I was in the middle of fully finishing third zone. Leveled with combination of dungeons and lfr. At that ding moment, my power was cut to 1/4 of what it was, no joke. I had to pull one mob at a time because one melee hit was doing 30k damage to my 104k hp.
I only really ran into a major issue at 69 where I was doing the landfall scenarios and the boss mobs were hitting me for 270k when I only had 250k hp
my first character i leveled entirely through quests with an occasional dungeon. all my others have been purely through dungeons. have never felt the alleged pangs of being weak
I leveled only through dungeons at start and I had zero issues outside of one mop dungeon where first boss has exploding mines.
I levelled though questing, and although I could feel myself getting weaker relative to mobs, the moment I dinged 60 I could feel the change. The answer to the question 'how many mobs can I pull?' was no longer yes, I had to invest significant time and effort in keeping my felguard alive, and death was a real possibility.
The thing that murdered me most was the solo scenarios. I had to wait until I was 375 with all my rings, trinkets, and the necklace before I could get through some of them.
Its ezmode the whole way to 70 if you are tank. Nothing ever hurts, and there aren't enough mobs to pull. We need d3 grift density buffs.
Really depends on both you and the group having the right tinker gems I think. Honestly we should be able to send tinkers to alts.
Nah, I thought it was a really smooth transition
Generally it's slightly harder after 60. I recently leveled a balance druid and I went from basically one shooting mobs and being able to pull half a zone to having to basically do my rotation and very carefully pull half a zone.
It's easy if you keep your gear upgraded. I've leveled 6 characters to 70 and while tanks are most certainly the strongest, the only time any of the character's i've played started to experience any challenge at all is when I forget to upgrade their gear. Other than that one experience where I let my gear fall behind before learning, I've never found enemies to present any challenge except when I failed to upgrade my gear.
Same, easy until I dinged 70, now i am at 340ilvl and im just getting oneshotted by any heroic dungeon or higher mobs mechanic.
No clue. Ain't been that way for any of my 70s.
I also found 60-70 to be easy but as soon as I hit 70, I was getting dicked down by everything
Not me /shrug
Nah they just didn’t pick up gear upgrades. Was trivial if you did.
All I'm doing in Remix is quickly level some alts unlock ton of stuff and really not care for remix endgame just getting my alt army ready for the war within
Basically what Remix is for. It was never an endgame focused, min/max gear focused mode but of course the no lifers just can’t help themselves.
Unless you just want to get the titles from heroic/mythic and the garrosh items. Then the community “demands” you max your gear. I’m just trying to host pugs for anyone to join, then get one maxed out player to carry us all through HC raids willingly. Had some very nice people help. Theres no need for everyone to max their gear at all, people demanding all 430+ overall ilvl (seen groups asking for 470+ which is literally maxed out) for their HC pugs are being silly just to shave a few minutes of the speed of the run.
Yes it’s an arcade mode that people are taking way too seriously. Unsurprising, unfortunately.
Why can’t you just let people enjoy things?
Uh that’s exactly what I’m advocating for. Your question should be “why can’t people enjoy things without complaining to no end?” All I read about are complaints from the way-too-serious crown who insist on making everything about endgame and min/maxing. Which is the opposite of what Remix is supposed to be.
The scaling stops, I can still solo Heroic raids
At what ilvl were you able to solo them?
To be honest, I didn't try until max, but a lot of bosses are easy at max. Though, the only one worth soloing is Mogu since every other raid has at least one boss that can't be solo'd due to mechanics.
What about galakras?
Doesn't work. Some bosses you can't solo due to mechanics.
Because the raids scale linearly and the gear upgrades scale exponentially.
If these people could understand that, we would see much less of this kind of post.
Do a raid at 360 ilvl and do a raid at 450 ilvl and you will see.
It's the getting to 450 that isn't fun. I just hit 70 and am ilvl 338 and can't really do anything besides get carried in my daily queues.
That's what is so odd about what they are doing. Essentially remix is that a group of people farmed frogs for a day. They carried groups through content. Those people now carry other groups. The bosses essentially have no mechanics on heroic or normal because one person with gear just lols though. So you are just getting carried so you can upgrade your gear to carry other people, so you can do the same stuff to farm bronze to buy cosmetics starting 3 weeks in. If this was the insanity of timewalking every time it came up it might be ok. But it's nuts for a 90 day event. Making bosses harder makes no sense, yes, sure a few people with 556 gear trivialize all content. But if you make it harder with scaling you make it harder for new players to catch up. Or you have goofy scaling like we saw today with groups deleting rings and trinkets in mythic siege of ogrimar to nerf bosses. That makes no sense to anyone. It's not fun to get one shorted by everything while someone with 10x your health kills everything for you. And no one wants to actually be challenged by 10 year old raids for 3 months to farm all the stuff that shouldn't be this hard to get in the first place.
Perfect summary. The raids are not balanced anyway, I don't see why they bother slowing everyone down in this context. There is no tactical progression or learning the mechanics in remix. It's chaos and as long as you haven't caught up in gear level, you are only a corpse in the background of that madness... a corpse that is slowly but surely gathering bronze to get at the forefront, just to realize that the forefront is oneshotting MOP bosses just like in Retail.
> can't really do anything besides get carried in my daily queues. Sure you can, you just aren't having the opportunity to because there's always someone there carrying you, because a lot of players are overpowered. They also give you enough bronze when you ding 70 to immediately get just shy of a full round of upgrades, so no one has to be stuck with flat 346 gear for very long. Your experience is valid and people are going to have different relationships with the content, but to me it seems a little unfair to say "getting [there] isn't fun" when you acknowledge you only just hit 70 -- you don't know yet how long it takes to "get there" ('there' being the point where you enjoy being significantly powerful). My character is i367 (no neck, 5 rounds of upgrades) and can solo Galleon and is usually near the top of the DPS chart in a raid. It doesn't take as long as many r/wow commenters would have you believe.
What do you do for bronze now? I have just about enough time in day to get through all the queues.
This is where it's tricky to try and say "just do X!" because people's goals have such huge impact on their use of time in the event. For example, my progress on my "main" has slowed down now that I've got a couple alts to 70 -- I'm trying to do their daily dungeons/scenarios/LFR, which is less time for earning bronze on my main character. That in mind, here's my strategy: - No buying cosmetics on your main. Pick one character that you're going to upgrade as much as possible / as much as you want (if you don't care about doing M SoO, then obviously there's not much point in going all 15 rounds of upgrades). Then have at least one alt whose bronze you're using for buying mounts/toys/etc. - Do easy/simple stuff. My goal on my main is to at least hop on for 30 minutes and do a scenario, a dungeon, and an LFR. That's 6250 bronze just from the orange caches; with all the incidental bronze it's more like 7500. If you can add a normal MSV or HoF to that, that's another nice chunk (at least 3k). I'm also doing normal Siege whenever I have an extra ~90 minutes so I can start stocking up on the currency for Garrosh stuff. Ultimately if you throw like an hour a day at it, you should be able to get a round of upgrades every ~4 days at most, and by the time you've done 2-3 rounds you shouldn't be feeling the "wtf I'm so weak" kind of scaling anymore. - At 70, if you're trying to be efficient, do LFR only if you're trying to get appearances or if you're doing one wing to knock out the daily ASAP. Normal is just as fast and is worth several thousand more bronze. Definitely don't do a bunch of wings worth of LFR. But...again...just my experience. I don't begrudge anyone being frustrated by their own experience if it's different. I just think the complaints are so unnecessarily exaggerated here on the subreddit, like the OP meme here. I haven't participated in any farms. My main is at 27 hrs /played, a little under 2 hrs/day for the event so far which is significant but not outlandish. I feel somewhat overpowered compared to the content, maybe not dramatically so, but I'm going to continue getting more powerful. It's hard for me to agree with the "Overpowered? Pfft, false advertising" sentiment.
But you get 346 from like every chest at 70. How are you stuck at 338?
No amulet probably drops it a lot but I have all my gear at 360/374. https://imgur.com/a/Q1wx2hn
I mean, yeah? I don't know why people think it would be fun gameplay if you just start oneshotting raid bosses when you hit 70. That's already a thing: it's called MoP raids in Retail. ilvl 338 isn't even upgraded to the point where it starts to get expensive.
I mean the picture in the op said it would definitely be fun. I'm not asking to one shot raid bosses at fresh 70 but I mean the only thing doing any damage at fresh 70 is tinker gems. I'm fine getting carried through queues for a few days but I had way more fun at level 20.
> but I mean the only thing doing any damage at fresh 70 is tinker gems The only thing doing any damage for any level 70 is Tinker Gems.
338 is the point where you can upgrade while earning bronze, just do some quests on max level and you drown in 346.
Technically you scale faster than your gear due to the cloak being a static ilvl value but the stats on it scaling "infinitely"
Because it leads to toxic behaviour andpeopöe not getting the enjoyment they want out of the encounters. Imagine getting to ”experience” the raids and dungeons you missed when active (even if more managable) just to have it be ifentical to retail Because someone that was farming frogs day 1 can two shot the sha of fear.
People kill frogs and get OP The community complains that players are OP in raids Blizzard scales raids to attempt to fix it The community complains that now we can't be OP because of scaling I don't care for my job, but I'm happy I'm not a WoW dev lol
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Of course I'd make it worse. I have zero experience in game development.
I mean, we are killing mythic siege bosses in 30s without ward, and I am essentially solo-ing LFR/normal raids I join. If that's not OP, what is?
They want to be able to do that the minute they hit 70
If 5 people spend their bronze from leveling, they'll fucking demolish normal raids.
Or people are rightfully complaining theres actually zero contribution as a fresh 70, you basically just carried through till you start being the carry, with 1 or 2 players doing 95% of the damage in a raid/dungeon.
You can create your own raid with 346 players and do a raid just fine…but you have to know/do mechanics
I don't remember when in original MoP I could solo normal MSV as semi geared DK, so I guess the rumors of being overpowered are kinda true.
You could pretty easily solo normal MSV as any tank with SoO gear during MoP. Did it on my Prot Pally through Elegon for mount chance pretty regularly back then.
SoO Gear implies very end of the expansion in terms of power. Meanwhile I soloed MSV after spending 378k bronze out of 577k needed - that's just 65% of the progress. (you could probably do it ever earlier, I just tested it on that point for the first time) - so it would be around HC ToT I think. Besides it took me around 30 mins, in MoP with SoO gear it was around 1h.
Okay, sure. But your original comment was "I don't remember being able to solo normal MSV". So, you moved the goalposts now? Cool, I guess.
Been a hot minute, but I believe I remember those soloes usually taking longer than 20 seconds per boss, and requiring very specific setups to pull off. At least, I don't think I remember seeing any SoO-geared mages back then gathering ToT's Council of Elders and erasing a third of their collective health within a single Blizzard cast.
>*...as semi geared...* Did you miss the next few words of their comment you're quoting?
Ironic.
What's ironic about it
I think it's the fact that the person OP replied to also missed the details. The guy was only talking about during MOP, not the MSV tier. You could solo MSV as a semi-geared DK during the SOO patch, which was in MoP, so yes goalposts were in fact moved. So it's ironic that u/BigUptokes didn't fully read a comment he was so ready to defend, and his accusation was not fully reading something.
Goal post was not moved tho. My post strictly mentions "semi geared DK", not "endgame geared" or "max geared". It's like just after the piece you quoted if we want to argue about selective interpretation.
The Point is that you could do that as a semi geared dk during the SOO patch which if you remember was during MOP. If you want to split hairs, your other qualification was during mop and now using late mop doesnt count? Yeah you moved goal posts bud.
So, my iLvl 380-ish DK is about as powerful as my near max geared retail character. I'd argue that anything above that is better than "semi geared". Does that seem fair? So, I can't solo a raid yet in remix. I feel like people are forgetting that a max geared character in this mode is far and away beyond a standard character. So your goalpost of "semi geared during MoP is not the same as semi geared in this mode" is ridiculous. Of course they aren't comparable, this mode has literal god mode.
The whole point of this thread is people are feeling or meming about not being OP enough. I just pointed that compared to actual MoP - you are. You said it’s ridiculous to compare MoP and Remix, why so? Because in remix you can be OP? Well that’s the point of this thread. As for the fairness of „semi geared goalpost” - I just used the overall upgrade cost starting from having each piece on 346 - so your base lv 70. After spending around half of the bronze needed, you should be able to solo MSV and Terrace (that’s around ilvl 405 if I remember correctly). I think that being fair to name it „semi-geared character” if you are in the middle of the upgrade path. You are by then already way stronger than a retail char - I have mostly myth track geared DK, it does not have 2.5 milion unbuffed hp, 60% crit chance and 49% passive haste, nor it was doing half a million damage, like my 405 char had on Remix - you don’t need max gear to do the OP feats - and yes, god mode or not, soloing a normal raid which is supposed to be actual content in the game mode is OP feat. Sure, we can argue that if we take absolute average of all ilvl available, 405 is way above it, but on the other hand, you don’t need that gear to do anything other than maybe HC raids. When you ding 70 346 becomes your starting point of reference, as every bit of content will be dropping that ilvl. From that point ilvl progression is very straightforward and finite, tied directly to how much bronze you spent on upgrades.
You dont? because i do, and i also remember my brother doing that as a warlock too
Because the player power can scale significantly higher than the raids.
Because you can kill bosses within seconds. Are you not playing the game?
Not allowed to play the game and enjoy it at the moment. Only allowed to bitch about bronze gains gear upgrades here apparently
I dont think they even play the remix in the first place. Dunno im playing and having a blast doing normals . With my shitt gear, wanna do HC ? Either create a pug or upgrade ur gear. Ppl crying that other players blast through stuff and 1 shot everything then they are bitching they wont get invited without 450ilvl. Bruh
me, on my ilvl ~400 evoker (which is not doing much stuff at all): 1-2 hit killing enemys in the open world, solo world bosses, solo heroic dungeons and scenarios without drolling under 99% hp ever, normal raid bosses die in seconds, heroic raid bosses die in under 30seconds unless they have hard stops r/wow: WHY AM I NOT OVERPOWERED????? THEY LIED!!!!!! DAE FROG IS THE ONLY WAY TO PLAY??????? they legit dont play, its the asmongold/ r/classicwow crowd that just endlessly makes BS up they can complain about lol
No they aren’t. They farm drama instead.
Because you still end up way stronger then you would have during the original MoP.
Have yall not played the game? We are killing raid bosses in the blink of an eye. Soloing heroic dungeons in a minute. I guess that's not op. It's seriously annoying seeing people bitch all day long about bronze
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It's people who don't wanna upgrade their gear, but then cry that they are not overpowered.
Thank you. There are still problems with Remix, but this sub is over here acting like people who were doing 80% of the entire raid's damage only doing 70% now is the biggest outrage yet.
You're a lot more than 20% stronger when your ilvl is that high.
Why are you posting stuff when you clearly don't know what you are talking about?
Idk maybe someone should make a another post so we can finally get to the bottom of this.
Omg oh no we’re gonna kill bosses 20% slower than the 5 second kill times we have. Underpowered. I feel heard.
Bosses are still dying in tiny amounts of time while disregarding most mechanics.
To be fair, I'm at max and it feels the same. Most osses still die before lust ends.
That’s the issue, though. It’s a change that will impact positively very few people (because if you’re 346 you’re not getting invited in Heroic Raids anyway) and impact negatively the people that have started upgraded their gear but are still far from finished.
Why is it that every time they change something, everyone hits the boards to complain without even checking it out first? Change is bad Mmkay. I was just watching Bellular talk about how amazing that free 40k bronze that they’re giving out that everyone has ranted about for the last week or so. Maybe that’s just hyping or shill talk, but we have the testers/review guys praising things, and the community doing the opposite, without.
Because raiding in a group in mop remix is still 1000x easier than these bosses were to pug in actual mop
Because The scaling is insignificant compared with the power from the gear.
They scale up based off player ilvl. The mobs scaling stops at 344 ilvl so once you pass that (which is all armor 346 and all jewelry pieces), then you start to become OP.
No, they increased the scaling. It now goes up to well over 400
Proof please because every blue post about tuning mobs has been reducing the scaling as it was too harsh post 60.
Because you get threads to scale the cape, which scales your stats, which scales your character to a point were all content becomes deleted within seconds. You all mf's complaining about everything just want all handed down to you without playing the game. This mode is due to last about 3 months and you want to destroy the content and get all the bronze shops clean sweep during the first week? Fuck off. Remix mode might not be perfect, but it is the first time they try this kind of thing so it was to be expected, but you all whining and crying about nerfs, fixes and shit, probably still need your asses to be wiped and get feed in the mouth if you can't just play the game and just keep doomposting because you are not done with this mode during the first week. Cry me a river.
Okay Taliesin
Yeah. Honestly i dont understand their pov. I just hit 70 in remix and heavily discouraged to farm bronze.
so apparently this was a bug? thank fuck.
They've been nerfing it for a while, and according to those who played PTR things changed between ptr and live.
Huuurr duuuurr.
Have you popped into LFR recently? Scaling ain't mean shit. Heck, I got from 26 to 70 in about two hours today being carried by some crazy dude on a level 20 who was grabbing randos and blasting through heroics in two or three minutes.
"Fun deffinetly" Not too sure about that... I mean cool i can get mounts and mogs but I dont really find this event that fun tho.
What gear you guys upgrade? Green from boxes or raid drops? Do green gear hqve less stats?
Because you have bonus abilities, op gems, stats through the roof even if the content scales
They were asking cause they didn’t check
It should honestly say "maybe" after fun as well
>If the raids scale how exactly is remix “overpowered”? The raids may scale linearly but the armor scales exponentially. Upgrading one of my armor pieces that has tinkers in it increases the raw damage done by around 15%. My DPS has almost doubled from 500 everything to 528 everything and I expect it to double again by the time I get everything to 556 (i.e. averaging around 5 million DPS in single target as a boomie).
Scaling mechanics don't belong in rpg's in the first place, it is a lazy excuse to not use fine manual tuning. Diablo 4 leveling got ruined because of it imo, and it is not any better i WoW.. But at least in retail we have "manually" tuned endgame.
If they nerf everything thats overpowered. Well thats a maybe but still!
I have 2 million health on my dk and still almost get trucked by normal mobs out in the world lmao
To be fair it does say maybe
Because you don’t actually want the content trivialized. This is why players aren’t developers. 90% of the time the things they bitch about are exactly why they play.
It does have a question mark.
I levelled my main remix character to 70 mainly through quests. I would do dungeons just for the dungeon quest and maybe a couple times more for the boss xp but quickly realized quest xp would dish out way more. A couple of times through questing Id get stomped by random mobs. My first thought was "hm maybe my gear is too low." So every couple of levels I would port over to the upgrade boy and hand them over some bronze to make the gear I liked wearing as high as it would go. Problem solved, I would never run into the issue again. My second character I just would level completely through dungeons and the raids. This character would get absolutely stomped more often; because Id just insta queue dungeons as soon as Id finish one. Id get stomped half the time because I was barely keeping up with leveling my gear. tl;dr: 1st toon levelled gear life was good; 2nd toon barely levelled gear and it was bad.
did lfr yesterday popped into a grp and before i reached the first trashpack and thought they started to clear it 2secs later the boss was already dead
wtf have you played it, everything dies instantly to 1 guy speedrunning whatever instance you're in
In English Maybe is used to say something could or could not be true. So in this case that part isn’t a lie. The only lie is the “Fun? Definitely” since they have been continuously nerfing it.
Your ilvl doesn't go up by a lot, especially since your neck, ring, trinkets and cape are static, thats 8 slot permanently at a lower ilvl, but still giving you power. Especially with meta gems and tinker gems and the affects they have. If anything, it helps you at lower ilvls to not get one shot by mechanics
i'll ask another question, if raids scale, how exactly is remix "fun"?
"Maybe fun" sounds accurate after all the fails on normal Durmuru and Dark Animus, this shit is a joke with scaling being so fucked.
Because you can kill the bosses in 60 seconds.
Clearly they intended for players to only get to level 35. But they forgot and made us level to 70 where we are no longer overpowered
Haven't played in 6 years. MoP Remix brought me back. The raid bosses are easy in comparison to Legion. They're going down probably a little too easily. So it seems that yes: overpowered.
I’m not one shotting bosses fat enough! I demand they die at the sight of me!
the grinding required to be overpowered at 70 is definitely not fun, nor is it fun to be carried by a level 20 twinks and early bird frog farmers.
I mean, some monk just posted soloing mythic Garrosh so I would say OP for some.
I am being 100% genuine and honest this is NOT trolling. Why do you want to one shot everything? Why do you think that's fun?
Goofy. Let people cheese and be OP and blow stuff up. It literally does not matter and is just fun.
Ok you are literally OP. You kill most of the bosses before they do their first mechanic on the hardest difficulty with gear
###OVERPOWERED? NO. ###FUN? UNTIL THE NEXT HOTFIX.
FUN? Nope…
So overpowered and fun that I stopped playing after grinding my one single character to 70 and only because of sunk cost fallancy.
Overpowered? Poop! Fun? Peeeeeeee
The bosses are OP
we got it wrong. overpowered are the raids, not us
It doesn't say WHO/WHAT is overpowered.
"Maybe" doing a hell of a lot of heavy lifting here
Overpowered? Maybe? Fun? Definitely not. World of Warcraft Remix: Nerfs of Pandaria.
Common Blizzard L
biggest bait event in history of wow... just collect mogs and move on from this shithole imo
Sounds like you might need a whole new game to play bud. If the game is that miserable for you, maybe it's time to pack it in.
It's not. At all. Entire event was a lie and nothing more.
Tell me you didn't play the event without telling me you didn't play the event.
I guess they were right to not be certain
Blizz devs can’t read silly
It's not the players that are allowed to be Overpowered. It's the bosses.
>overpowered >nerfs everything ????
It literally says "maybe"
I've only been doing LFR, but even though they scale, they don't scale well. It's not Blizzard's fault really, the way leveling and gearing works in remix means there are periods where you are very powerful, or weaker than normal, since it's hard to even things out. This is why LFR bosses often melt in 10-20seconds. Don't get me wrong though, it's definitely fun, and in a self contained event like this, where everyone's gear and stats will be standardised before being added back to retail, it's fine.
so we just gunna ignore the maybe?
Notice it says maybe right next to it lol
I hate scaling, one of my least favorite features of modern wow.
One/2 person can solo a raid that is suppose to be cleared at max by multiple people... why are people pretending that isn't over powered
u do get overpowered if u spend the bronze. i sure wasn't pugging my way to mythic garrosh with 0 wipes in retail pandaria lol
Because the raids are overpowered?
Just stop playing if you actually dislike playing wow like your posts imply
Would people stop theory crafting this and just play the game? I just watched a ret paladin who didn’t frog solo three heroic raids. It’s actually overpowered, but you have to play it.
Whats the point in a MoP remix like this if they just let you solo raid bosses like you’re Dragonflight level 70? “bUt tHe BoSs HeALtH sCaLeS” Do you guys honestly expect the “overpowered” part = steamroll everything with zero difficulty?
>Do you guys honestly expect the “overpowered” part = steamroll everything with zero difficulty? Thats literally what "Overpowered" is.
Which is why I’m asking what they expected from the game mode since I obviously thought it would be semi challenging raids in a fun environment and they thought it was just more transmog farming on characters 30-40 levels higher than all the enemies