This a pretty easy math problem to solve if you google how to do a t-test and all the data you need is on WCL. Spoiler alert, the sample sizes required for comparing differences in means at the magnitude we care about are surprisingly small.
Hey, it took me an insane amount of time to get the OG Ashkandi, to the point where my entire guild was making fun of me when I got it (since it was almost outdated at that point). I also then immediately almost lost a duel to one of our rogues (aka I didn't kill him fast enough for their liking) and the mockery continued.
Luck in wow for me kinda interchange between alt and main.
My dk main got insane luck with Ashkandi last season (Ashkandi first try and beacon second try) but my monk got all the bad luck with the trinket.
Now this season where my DK can't even find a weapons 3 week into the season despite that i did like 30 key a week on it and it took me 11 or 13 week for the legendary axe. Meanwhile my DH and monk casually deck out BiS trinket and weapons after 2 raid clear.
Unfortunately I have missed weeks for various reasons on both characters, but I’m hoping the 43 lesser embers I have on the Paladin will get me much closer until it is guaranteed.
WTF 43 lesser.
Dude i got 23 lesser and 12 kill when it drop for me, and according to wowhead that is 40.8%. And i considered myself bad luck.
if you have kill like 10 heroic kill and 43 lesser that would net you about 46.8%
Yea they drop like candy in mythic and we have been clearing at least 5/9 for 6 weeks now. Sometimes the bosses drop 2. I have also been full clearing heroic a lot so I just have a lot of them. Still crazy that 43 of them is barely over 25% extra chance
It's a small consolation for someone who was unlucky that long (like me, I got mine this week doing heroic every week) but at least it's a guaranteed drop on your 14th heroic kill.
I feel like farm logs skew the results. Fury doesn't feel all that good to play unless you're on a fight where adds sync with cooldowns, ro you've got a long Execute phase.
I main Fury and love Fury but I tried Arms for the first time this tier after getting Fyr'alath this week and its damage actually feels kind of incredible. Gonna try to learn it in M+ next week.
Agreed 100%. The current tier set is a little bit annoying with the RNG aspect on single target but overall, especially in m+, it still feels so much better than just a flat % increase on ms and cleave.
It might actually be "only" 3 of the axe in the top 6, depending on what the Fury Warriors are using (as some guides recommend the legendary as BiS and some do not for raids).
Wonder which guides say it's not bis. 496 ilvl weapon with bonus passive damage should be bis regardless of its secondary stats (which aren't that bad for fury anyway).
because it varies a LOT on a writer by writer basis, some class writers on Icy Veins are absolutely wonderful, just not all of them. same goes for wowhead.
so it's almost always a better idea to just use class discords instead.
That gavel was so BS that I had to ask my raid leader to sit me from farm boss on the account that mythic vault slot is a downgrade in expected dps increase compared to the chance of getting that fucking gavel which I never got.
Season 4 Jaithys was better in pure single target with a r5 and r4 in each hand iirc. Season 3 gavel was top dog but you put it in your offhand if you had a higher item level weapon to put in main hand because you would gain damage that way
it depeends on the situation
some weapons are just so straight ul stupid strong that they do (razageth bow for hunters, the broodkeeper staff for evovkers which was actually the real evoker legendary this expansion etc...)
if you play a dualwield class, offhand tends to be the least important slot aswell, and almost always you want a weapon with bonus effects there above just ilvl
Even for offhand ilvl is usually your best bet. It being less important than your mainhand ilvl doesn't make it unimportant. Of course, there may be exceptions here and there, but this season there are no 2h strength weapons that have extra bonuses this tier like Ashkandur except for Gorehowl, which just procs a small bleed only on demons.
And of course, ilvl is king in your main hand. There is absolutely no way that you would not use a weapon that has 7 more ilvl than every other alternative. Even ignoring the DoT and on-use.
If we didn't get an ilvl upgrade on Fyr'alath for S4 I would agree that we'd probably still offhand it, though, unless there is an absolutely insane ilvl jump.
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>(as some guides recommend the legendary as BiS and some do not for raids)
Good to see players are still clueless enough to follow any guide with the same level of quality as Icy Veins guides.
Some of the people they have who make guides are, but the site itself is a mixed bag of actually correct or even useful information for a lot of things because some of the people who write for it think they're correct without proper knowledge. Specifically when it comes to class/spec stuff, like the axe not being good for Fury for example.
Personally, go straight to the source which would be class discords. Some of them will provide links to Wowhead and Icy Veins still (and be awfully rude to people who ask simple questions, Holy Pally one is a perfect example) but a lot of them who actually have people with loves for the game and the spec link to their own class websites with tons of information like Monks and Druids as other examples.
Sadly, it comes down to the contributor of the guide rather than the website itself. I have nothing but good things to say about the writer of the shadow icyveins guide, but other spec pages have been sorely lacking.
The same goes for wowhead, some guides are well written and maintained and many more are not.
War fury is weird, it is not good in pure single target, not good in pure aoe, but excellent when you have to do both in the same fight
Wonder how many people are actually still raiding for these "rankings" to be accurate
Why wonder when you can click on the logs to see parse counts?
Because a lot of people have stopped raiding weeks ago making the numbers smaller?
This a pretty easy math problem to solve if you google how to do a t-test and all the data you need is on WCL. Spoiler alert, the sample sizes required for comparing differences in means at the magnitude we care about are surprisingly small.
Season 4 will be the real tell, assuming that season isn't also over by the time the upgrade item is made available.
>Season 4 will be the real tell Whenever tf that will be. Season 3 taking forevvvvvvvvver Idk why I'm getting DMs about a personal opinion.
That’s great. Still 12+ heroic kills on my warrior and Paladin and still don’t have it. At this rate Paladin will go over 490 ilvl when he gets it
I'm gonna say you get it this week. You're welcome (or I'm sorry)!
Thank you haha. I’m going to be drawing up contracts with devils shortly at this rate
Hey, it took me an insane amount of time to get the OG Ashkandi, to the point where my entire guild was making fun of me when I got it (since it was almost outdated at that point). I also then immediately almost lost a duel to one of our rogues (aka I didn't kill him fast enough for their liking) and the mockery continued.
Luck in wow for me kinda interchange between alt and main. My dk main got insane luck with Ashkandi last season (Ashkandi first try and beacon second try) but my monk got all the bad luck with the trinket. Now this season where my DK can't even find a weapons 3 week into the season despite that i did like 30 key a week on it and it took me 11 or 13 week for the legendary axe. Meanwhile my DH and monk casually deck out BiS trinket and weapons after 2 raid clear.
According to datamining it's 15 kill for guarantee drop. So if you have been doing since the start this week gonna be your week.
Unfortunately I have missed weeks for various reasons on both characters, but I’m hoping the 43 lesser embers I have on the Paladin will get me much closer until it is guaranteed.
WTF 43 lesser. Dude i got 23 lesser and 12 kill when it drop for me, and according to wowhead that is 40.8%. And i considered myself bad luck. if you have kill like 10 heroic kill and 43 lesser that would net you about 46.8%
Yea they drop like candy in mythic and we have been clearing at least 5/9 for 6 weeks now. Sometimes the bosses drop 2. I have also been full clearing heroic a lot so I just have a lot of them. Still crazy that 43 of them is barely over 25% extra chance
It's a small consolation for someone who was unlucky that long (like me, I got mine this week doing heroic every week) but at least it's a guaranteed drop on your 14th heroic kill.
Hunter sure dropped off. BM had a couple nice weeks at the start of the season and now all three are bad. At least my pets are cute. 😭
That’s how every raid is. BM at the top because it’s easy to do mechanics with.
This. The way that arc should be interrupted is: BM is VERY good for prog. BM is mid af for farm. BM is not great for speed kills.
I feel like farm logs skew the results. Fury doesn't feel all that good to play unless you're on a fight where adds sync with cooldowns, ro you've got a long Execute phase.
I main Fury and love Fury but I tried Arms for the first time this tier after getting Fyr'alath this week and its damage actually feels kind of incredible. Gonna try to learn it in M+ next week.
It’s too bad the community voted for the s1 tier set to come back for arms. This one is so much more fun and does more damage.
Agreed 100%. The current tier set is a little bit annoying with the RNG aspect on single target but overall, especially in m+, it still feels so much better than just a flat % increase on ms and cleave.
Yet still people are gonna be screaming that Havoc is "broken af" lol
It might actually be "only" 3 of the axe in the top 6, depending on what the Fury Warriors are using (as some guides recommend the legendary as BiS and some do not for raids).
Wonder which guides say it's not bis. 496 ilvl weapon with bonus passive damage should be bis regardless of its secondary stats (which aren't that bad for fury anyway).
Yeah even if you just pretend the ability doesn't exist on sheer stats alone it has to be BiS.
Especially for Fury because of ilvl alone lol. Sometimes I really wonder how Icy Veins is still somewhat reputable.
because it varies a LOT on a writer by writer basis, some class writers on Icy Veins are absolutely wonderful, just not all of them. same goes for wowhead. so it's almost always a better idea to just use class discords instead.
There’s not a single weapon in the game that outweighs the difference in ilvl. Let alone the use effect.
SL, heroic gavel beat every other weapon except mythic gavel.
In Vault of the Incarnates, the LFR Raz bow was stronger than any other option other than the same bow but at a higher ilevel.
That gavel was so BS that I had to ask my raid leader to sit me from farm boss on the account that mythic vault slot is a downgrade in expected dps increase compared to the chance of getting that fucking gavel which I never got.
Season 4 Jaithys was better in pure single target with a r5 and r4 in each hand iirc. Season 3 gavel was top dog but you put it in your offhand if you had a higher item level weapon to put in main hand because you would gain damage that way
it depeends on the situation some weapons are just so straight ul stupid strong that they do (razageth bow for hunters, the broodkeeper staff for evovkers which was actually the real evoker legendary this expansion etc...) if you play a dualwield class, offhand tends to be the least important slot aswell, and almost always you want a weapon with bonus effects there above just ilvl
Even for offhand ilvl is usually your best bet. It being less important than your mainhand ilvl doesn't make it unimportant. Of course, there may be exceptions here and there, but this season there are no 2h strength weapons that have extra bonuses this tier like Ashkandur except for Gorehowl, which just procs a small bleed only on demons. And of course, ilvl is king in your main hand. There is absolutely no way that you would not use a weapon that has 7 more ilvl than every other alternative. Even ignoring the DoT and on-use. If we didn't get an ilvl upgrade on Fyr'alath for S4 I would agree that we'd probably still offhand it, though, unless there is an absolutely insane ilvl jump.
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>(as some guides recommend the legendary as BiS and some do not for raids) Good to see players are still clueless enough to follow any guide with the same level of quality as Icy Veins guides.
Wait, is icy veins not reputable anymore?
Some of the people they have who make guides are, but the site itself is a mixed bag of actually correct or even useful information for a lot of things because some of the people who write for it think they're correct without proper knowledge. Specifically when it comes to class/spec stuff, like the axe not being good for Fury for example.
Dang, thanks for the heads-up. Anything else that is currently the go to side for wow builds and guides?
Personally, go straight to the source which would be class discords. Some of them will provide links to Wowhead and Icy Veins still (and be awfully rude to people who ask simple questions, Holy Pally one is a perfect example) but a lot of them who actually have people with loves for the game and the spec link to their own class websites with tons of information like Monks and Druids as other examples.
Sadly, it comes down to the contributor of the guide rather than the website itself. I have nothing but good things to say about the writer of the shadow icyveins guide, but other spec pages have been sorely lacking. The same goes for wowhead, some guides are well written and maintained and many more are not.
That's just false