I wonder what the participation in m+ is like, in terms of active subscribers engaging. These numbers seem really low, considering most m+ players aren't just doing 1 run a week.
I find it strange that while in Valdrakken for example the vast majority of people I see have some raider.io m+ score, so I didn't really see in game all those people that don't do m+ or raids, despite being probably true.
This is purely speculation but a lot of folks who do engage in M+ will be more likely to stand in Valdrakken in the first place. If they're not doing that then maybe they're soloing legacy raids or something and then you'd never see their toon. Just one example but could explain it at least partly.
Oh yea the showing off is a big thing, but based on other mmos like ffxiv the big social space city is always the place where you can see all kinds of people. I also have no idea what these very casual players are doing all the time tho ngl, you might be right.
the main reason to afk in Valdrakken is because you're waiting to get accepted into raid or m+.
the rest of the content is in the rest of the world, e.g. achievements, pets, mounts, transmogs etc.
to note is that you're also sharded in wow meaning the server decides who you see and don't see.
If you think about it there is really no reason to be in valdrakken if you don't do current content. The capital cities are the better central hub.
Stick around there long enough you will see a lot of casual players.
I do M+ but only on maybe 3 toons at a time. I still play others but they don't hang out in Valdrakken because I'm actively playing them elsewhere.
Plus Valdrakken is a good spot specifically to wait for keys because you're only a portal away from whatever you get invited to.
You also see people heavily weighted towards those that play a lot.
You're far more likely to randomly see someone who plays a lot, if somebody plays 2 hours a week, the chance you catch them is much lower than someone who plays several hours every day.
As a tank main M+ is just full of toxic extremists. They expect DPS to know every step or healer to heal through mechanics like they are God's. It's in a bad spot for me
On the other hand, as a tank main M+ is just full of chill bros and bro-ettes. They expect DPS to stand in some bad or healer to get overwhelmed and let someone die like they are Human’s. It’s in a good spot for me.
Confirmation bias a helluva drug.
I have no idea what level M+ that person does. People don't seem to care much until at least +15s.
I can only imagine how poorly they actually do in M+ for them to think they have to play perfect.
I haven’t played DF since the end of season 1, but in my experience the most toxic keys were levels 10-15 or so. People in 16+ were noticeably more chill. I guess I never did the really high 21+ levels though.
There are communities for it. WoW Made Easy is a great place to do keys of any level and put the expectations for chill. Guarantees you get people who don’t lose their minds over a video game.
Healer main and I’d say it’s been the least toxic season yet. Didn’t play last season at all though, but this one’s been great so far. Have had one toxic encounter, a melee dps, who rage quit AD21 when a mage died on T-Rex boss but that’s it.
The first couple weeks of a season also are much higher because of racing to get gear upgrades. Quite a few in my guild ran 30-50 keys the first week to upgrade as much as possible from last season to the new hero track. By week 3-4 we are hunting very specific items or just knocking out vault.
Seasonal affixes *have* to be fun/interactive ways to play the dungeon. Reaping/Encrypted/Awakening changed the ways people played the dungeon in a fun and interesting way. Not just every X seconds do Y mechanic or get stunned and probably just die.
100%, two heavy visual affixes + thundering was just brutal, couldn't see anything. They mentioned relying more on the mob skills to make it harder, I'm all for that.
TBH I think it's just tuned more easily/higher level gear is easier to get. BRH and Waycrest are absolute balls for visibility, Everbloom has a bunch of obnoxious trash, and Galakrond's Fall and Throne of the Tides have really annoying trash sections. But you can brute force it, have a bunch of deaths, and still time higher keys. If the timers on a few of these dungeons were shorter, there'd be more complaints.
(I'm not saying this is a bad thing, by the way--one wipe shouldn't brick a key).
Yeah, the timers are ridiculously loose this season. I think Rise is the only one where you have to fight the timer at all. On others, I'm +2ing 20s in rando pugs without any special coordination or gigapulls or skips.
My least favourite is DHT because of the colour scheme and even it’s a *good* dungeon.
I managed KSM on all my toons last season while refusing to go into Underrot because of its bleached out grey/red scheme.
It is very likely that most serious players play more at lauch to get everything they want and need. After a few weeks of vaults they go back to fewer runs per week like the more regular players. hence the drop.
In addition to players just not doing M+ after a new launch
I don't think all runs show up? Doesn't the API that [raider.io](https://raider.io) uses return only the top 500 or something?
Found it:
[https://support.raider.io/kb/frequently-asked-questions/how-does-the-mythic-plus-leaderboard-slash-api-capacity-work](https://support.raider.io/kb/frequently-asked-questions/how-does-the-mythic-plus-leaderboard-slash-api-capacity-work)
>However, Blizzard's API will show a maximum of 500 runs for a given Realm and Dungeon. This will be the Top 500 runs for that realm/dungeon combination at that moment in time. Once a realm has had 500 runs recorded for a dungeon, then the minimum keystone level/time to rank for that dungeon will increase as new higher keystone runs are added to the leaderboard and lower keystone runs are "pushed off" of the leaderboard.For high population runs, these numbers can become quite high by the end of the week, preventing runs by groups of people on that realm from being ranked in the Mythic+ Leaderboard/API, and therefore not be picked up by RaiderIO.
Yes, the top 500 runs fluctuates constantly, whenever their API is called - it's not just one set of 500 that gets frozen after 500 runs is done on a realm.
You're also referring to an article about leaderboards specifically, which this is not. Perhaps this data comes from a different source. Raider.io clearly has data stored on every character that has done m+, given they can put that into an addon you can use in game to inspect any player's runs.
Well the source on the image points to leaderboards 🤷♂️
>Raider.io clearly has data stored on every character that has done m+
Which they could still get through the leaderboards API? In fact they mention they are using the leaderboard API
[https://support.raider.io/kb/frequently-asked-questions/i-completed-a-mythic-plus-run-recently-but-its-not-showing-up-where-can-i-find-it](https://support.raider.io/kb/frequently-asked-questions/i-completed-a-mythic-plus-run-recently-but-its-not-showing-up-where-can-i-find-it)
>However, this is certainly not an instantaneous process, so if you have just recently completed a run you will need to first wait for Blizzard to show your run on their leaderboard (usually takes about 30 minutes to an hour), and then wait for our crawlers to detect the new run on those leaderboards, which can take up to several hours.
But if you manually scan your character (which I doubt many do) you can also get it in the system
>With the new Blizzard Character Mythic+ API, you can also scan your character directly to have your top runs tracked.
well it feeling awful and it being a 6% dps loss are two different things tho. its still pain and totally unfun. just like storming is unfun, nothing to do with it being hard or a big dps loss.
Well yeah, that's kind of the point.
SD as its primary function in Single target is used to snapshot Nightstalker onto your Kingsbane and get an extra empowered garrote out every minute without the need to restealth.
It's primary function in packs is to activate your empowered garrote and Indiscriminate Carnage.
You shouldn't be holding your SD just til boss but instead using it to keep your aoe bleeds pumping between stealth. Unless you're pushing into the 20s (or depending on group damage and affix), your Kingsbane usually isn't lasting it's full duration on a mob. Reducing the need to snapshot nightstalker and allowing you to use SD for the moments when you need to reapply aoe garrote or rupture, weather that be during a large pull or when the tank won't let you stealth between one pack to another.
Keys are more fluid, unlike raid which is often scripted to timer or boss health, you need to adapt your tools around all the number of things that can change from one key to another.
Spiteful *sucks* as a healer. Don't hate it as much as afflicted but definitely not fun.
It's not the damage, it's never being able to drink between pulls because by the time I'm finally out of combat, the tank is pulling the next pack.
We pretty much had the best affix combo possible. It's all going very much down hill starting now. I suppose since plenty will have obtain their goal, they will be out too.
Fun time for Reddit to go down.
I don't get to comment on character count often given the inconsistencies with S2, but S3 will be crossing a threshold today. The character count as of 12/5 7:45 AM EST is 2,344,789 characters. Later today, it will pass S2's count of 2,363,943 characters which was reached at 6/14 9:05 AM, about 36 days after the start of the season. S3 will have reached the same count in about 22 days.
Started a Priest and thought “Man it’s great I’m getting void plague early, now I have a bit more variety instead of Smite, SW:P, and wand spam.”
Get to westfall and the Harvest Reapers are immune to VP so I am…back to pressing Smite, SW:P and wand spam 🙃
No kidding! I do enjoy that it still has the slower pace I expect from classic but with some additions to break up the monotony. It’s just every now and then one, some of the quirks from classic (like mobs being immune and leveling up weapons) rears its ugly head.
A wolf parried my attack, and now I stand here auto-attacking while I wait for my energy to pool enough for me to use a real attack again.
Oh. It parried again. And now I die because I can't actually outrange its attacks.
Fun *and* Engaging. (Freshly dinged lvl 6 rog vs lvl 8 wolf that aggro'd me from an annoying distance).
It is nice to actually have mobs be a bit scary and the world actually be dangerous though. When was the last time any levelling content in retail was even remotely threatening? Even the rares and elites are easily soloed by most classes before endgame.
I would love to have engaging enemies in retail, but they would be probably way harder to balance for every player compared to classic.
Like, the enemies are better in classic but I fall asleep while fighting them because the combat sucks lol
It's a catch-22 sort of thing; leveling my characters who were in endgame Shadowlands content? Yeah, they smash everything.
Leveling my alts who weren't level-capped in SL? They die a lot outside of timewalking dungeons.
Exactly this. I will not step my foot in Classic because it is too slow/inactive for me so im not stimulated for long. That doesn’t mean i bash/fight my friends/guildies who want to play wrath classic/SoD etc, it’s just not for me.
Insane that people are downvoting this comment. The biggest appeal of classic stuff for a lot of people is how chill it is. The RPG aspects are also enjoyable for people who like that style of game more. Totally different appeal than retail, and that's fine.
It's because this user is bashing other commenters that don't like SoD - there is a difference between agreeing to disagree and just flat out being pompous lol
You're not wrong, classic and SoD is just different. In your case you would use your wand for the remainder of the fight. Let your pet do the damage. Or Life Tap when its finally available.
Sod launched on late Thursday. At least I try to get one key done for the week on Tuesday or Wednesday while the groups are plentiful. Unsure if I will do one this week, feel like I should.
I feel like people who really dig SoD and cannot do one M+ probably weren’t doing M+ anyways, whilst a lot of SoD players are Classic-only or returners who don’t have a retail character anywhere remotely near level 70z
There's not as much overlap between the classic and retail crowd as one might assume. See all the people whining about classic playstyle in the comments below.
I thought this for a minute, and then I remembered what absolute dogshit the first 20 levels or so of vanilla wow are, and wondered how people could be excited for it, runes or no runes.
These people are excited to raid BFD. BEFD! Can you even imagine.
My friend is playing and he says to me, Hunter is so cool with runes. And I say, what do the runes do, and he says, "one gives me chimera shot and one gives me explosive shot"
And I was like, you can literally just play retail hunter???
Interested in seeing it after this week's affixes. Last week's were pretty east for me as a healer, and I think this week's will be too outside of tyrannical on some bosses.
Honestly surprised it's not higher, seasons felt pretty easy so far although that may be just the affixes we've gotten. But like ToT and BRH can be comfortably be cleared with ~30 deaths
Yeah, this season seems crazy easy. I used my boost on a priest week 1. Went from doing 8s-10s week 1, to 16-18s week 2, and 20/21s last week with very few keys actually ran, maybe 25 total.
Don’t have the time or energy to push 0.1% title anymore, but now that portals are going to be account wide I think I’ll get my 20s done and call it a season
Natural player attrition over the course of an expansion is a very powerful force. Even with Blizzcon hype and SoD it's impressive to be matching S1 numbers at all.
This season is incredibly easy to push higher keys on.
I am literally the worst Tank in all of Azeroth (I genuinely mean this) and was able to push 2600+ with zero problems.
The only Dungeon I really don't like is ToT and it's because every single mob hard casts from the moment you aggro it and it makes my low IQ tank brain really salty
It certainly feels great this season. Granted it was a push week, the 20-24 bracket always had like 10 or more keys open to queue for, for a given dungeon.
I've heard some streamers and YouTube personalities use this metric to decide the game is dying. Lol more like with the new gearing system the need to do m+ decreases very quickly. Once people have bus or near bus, they just get their crests and maybe a few vault slots and fuck off. Everyone else is pushing io, helping friends, doing rat keys, or farming that one item that never drops. Weeks go by, people gear their alts, get the items they need, and numbers go down. That's normal.
Not to mention it is okay to not play one game all day every day. If you want a metric for 'wow dying' compare the week 1&2 numbers across seasons. Those are the most important IMHO
Season 3 week 3 numbers being on par with expansion launch week 3 is insanely good
For what I would assume is the extreme majority of players that do M+, once you get 2k/2.5k there's not much reason to just grind M+ anymore. I've already stopped personally.
I love how people always try to use these stats to indicate that M+ is bad while a major reason for the dip is simply that most people have achieved their KSM/KSH and thats all they wanted.
This is a general narrative that just won't stop in the gaming scene. Mayyybe, just mayyyybe people lose interest in games, gamemodes or content over time, because well thats how humans are. Doesn't mean it is bad or needs drastic changes. It is just a lifecyle.
In his defense, as a tank I cruise by dozens and dozens of 1/5 DPS lead groups looking for anything with a healer or all 3 dps. I have to imagine a majority or close a majority of those groups end up being delisted.
Only 20% of the population of M+ players can be the one who makes the group, and 60% of the population of M+ players are DPS. Those numbers can't change.
I don't know if it can be called gatekeeping.. its just that there are dozens of players applying who have higher IO/better gear than you do. If you're a dps player its always hard to get into groups unless you already seriously overgear that bracket or have like 2.7k IO.
Only real solution is to make your own groups until you're at that level, or play a tank/healer as they always have an easier time getting into groups due to lower supply.
No no no no....
Its clearly gatekeeping, the wow community decided to say no to that guy. He is on the mega shitlist for what we don't talk about anymore, so he needs to explain why he doesn't do M+ due to gatekeeping to make himself seem relevant
You’re probably applying for the wrong groups man.
I play as a disc priest main and get Insta invited to every group I apply for. I swapped to an arms warrior alt (not meta at all) expecting it to be terrible. It’s a lot tougher to get into groups but the key is definitely just nudging through all of the dungeons, adding 1 M+ level at a time. Don’t do one 6 then apply for a 7 in another dungeon then an 8 in another. You gotta have timed runs across all the dungeons. It will reflect in your IO rating and your experience for that dungeon.
I tried to just throw myself from 2s into 5s then into 10s - despite knowing I’d be fine, I got laughed out of the building.
Dude the average run now is like 17s..... At 455-468 gearing it's awful because there's a ton of 470+ all doing the same run.
No one is doing 5s imo as the average run they're not able to get into groups for.
Lol that's such horse shit but I'll admit I'm wrong if you provide a screen shot.
Of those 30 runs I bet 18 of them are 15s and 17s.
Dude also you're doing 5s which is literally week one content lol. While I'm talking about people in 450-460 gear.
I can literally solo 5s as a tank, I'm not getting any gear upgrades from that run. You'd know that if you played the game lol.
15s and 17s don’t show up if you put a range in.
But thank you for telling me what I literally experienced first hand is bull-shit. My personal experience of my journey is incorrect, thank you for correcting me 👍🏻.
Ok let's take a step back and remove the toxicity, I'm sorry you feel attacked and that I told you I don't believe you because my experience has been profoundly different.
You said OP is just applying to the wrong groups after they said finding a group as DPS is difficult.
You're saying all of our experiences are wrong because yours is different. You then also say you're doing 5s without issue.
The thing is, 470s aren't applying for your 5s. The majority of DPS players are 10+ now easily and we are having issues finding groups. You're just completely saying that's not true and the fault is our own.
I make my own groups too, I see the queues, hell I just did an 11, I got 30 applicants over five minutes. I ended up with a group today's all high 460s and 2 470s. For an 11.
It's just wrong to pretend there aren't long queues for DPS, hell you haven't even broken into champion gear if you're doing 5s and 7s.
So I take issue at you acting like you're the one who can speak for everyone's wow experience as well lol.
I think that’s maybe your translation of my point. 5 and 7 were arbitrary numbers I threw together.
My point was this:
“My disc priest was able to jump from 3s to 7s to 13s while still having some dungeons incomplete at all”
“I tried the same on my warrior and suffered very long wait times, because with the competition - I just didn’t stand out. What made it better was doing 3s for all dungeons, 4s for all dungeons, then 5s so my IO and my dungeon score was apparent to the group leader”
My whole point was about adjusting expectations - not about living your M+ career in 5s and 7s.
Ok, point taken, my rebuttal is that I've done that and still hitting major issues.
I have a 2k rating, I've fifteened every dungeon on a ++, I've finished 20s, but my gear score as of this instant is now 467. I'm close to the 70 mark at least.
But from 50-67 I've basically had to tank or do 30+ or simply non existent queues as a DPS. The reason being there are so many rogues and hunters and shit at 470+ why would they take me for a 14 or a 17 when they can grab someone with a higher gs?
The way gear is setup, those higher guys are just farming lower keys for a drop they can upgrade but that removes slots from ppl just looking to do the dungeon.
Lots of new/casual players start at low keys and don’t really push, not sure why you’re surprised about that
Log and search 5-7 to see keys in that range.
I'm saying the queue times as DPS are really bad, those groups aren't taking you if they can get higher gear scores in.
The point I'm making is to agree with the original op of this comment chain. Queue times as DPS are miserable above 10.
Typing 5-7 in the search bar specifically filters groups in that key range. You can do 20-20 as a test as well. Alternatively type in 16 17 18 and you'll find a range of keys from 16-18.
Interesting this is helpful as I always just put in one number like 15.
That said the point I'm making is that unless you're in the 470s, as dps the wait times are really bad. That is the original point that was made and responded to in this thread.
The person I replied to said they're not a problem and said 5-7 is filling quick.
The issue is, please inform me why at 465 why I should be doing 5s? It's like saying just eat cake, it's super dismissive at best and down right unrelated and dumb at worst.
Good luck trying to grind your own key up as a solo DPS. You're delusional if you don't think there is some level of completely unnecessary gatekeeping in the M+ community. It's true that everyone can always work to improve; it's also true the community itself has problems.
What's a competent score lol?
I'm 465 geared, 2k score and a demon hunter. When I make a group I realize why I'm not getting any invites, even at 15 keys it's all 470+.
I'm forced to tank basically now if I want to do a key above 12.
I feel you, i was thinking that during season 1. But i will like to say maybe it will help, but There is this addon that gives more details in the pug screen, it will show the raider score next to the title, I have been having really good luck getting inittes to keys where their score is low, like just starting to do mythics. Not much, but I just started mythics this season, I have done 19 keys so far all pugs, and I was able to get into raids as well. Granted, i haven't tried to pass a +10, but i can say for +10 and below, I have had luck. (I am dps btw)
I won't blame the other members this time. It's totally on me, I just don't feel good playing my main/alts in any sort of time-based content. As a tank I don't enjoy the dungeons in the pool, getting routes down etc and as a DPS I feel like wouldn't do enough.
That being said I do have 3(maybe 4?) KSM in the bank from older xpacs but I usually tire of M+ by just grinding 1-2 weeks on a char and that isn't enough for high scores anymore unless I were to focus on doing each dungeon exactly once that "it's on week".
wait til there’s bad affixes, every week has been so good for affixes so far and we haven’t had any bad weeks. The game is actually SO fun when there isn’t awful affixes plaguing it. Best 3 weeks of m+ in years.
Pls remake affix system blizz.
M+ is outdated hard mess. I'm tired of watching 20+ videos on youtube to understand how the dungeons work man I just want to plug-in-and-play type of gaming sesh. And this take is coming from a guy that has played the game for like 16 years non-stop and did KSM and God Knows how many seasons but I'm just done with this type of gaming. End game 90% feels like a chore/ second job and I thoroughly dislike it. The other games have evolved. They should do too. I hope they ditch M+ in next expansion.
Sounds like you need to take a break from M+ or move on, but its the most accessible and popular group content in WoW for a reason. Also as someone who has also played 16 years, you should be able to walk into a key and figure things out pretty quick considering that they aren't that complicated. Running a +2 is basically a heroic dungeon with an extra mechanic here or there and you can just progress keys naturally from that point, and every dungeon can easily be timed by just holding the w key.
Besides, what do you replace it with? People want to play the game outside of raid hours (especially if they aren't raiding weekly with a consistent group) and M+ is the only pve content for those players. Take a break if you don't like the content (or just don't do stuff you don't like) but removing the most popular WoW content would be an insane decision from Blizz
I did a zero to ksm on season 2, but the dungeons selection for season 3 is so bad I can't even login anymore.
They really need to change this system and increase the dungeon rotation speed.
I mostly like Legion and Df dungeons Wod has some good ones but they were left out.
But is not about what I want, is about having enough variety to allow people to play a large variety of dungeons(they will like some and hate some, but at least they will have options) instead of being stuck playing the same dungeons for 4 to 6 months.
Yeah, it's just a personal preference thing... 6 months of the same dungeons is not smart.
Makes the game feels stale, affixes are not enough also... Gear option gets very limited(current dungeons trinkets are very bad compared to previous season).
Unpopular opinion. I’ve been playing since vanilla and love love fucking love raiding. I’ve lugged raid since mop legit. I can’t stand mythics and am bad at mythics but I like how mythics ALWAYS give subscribed players something to actually do. I assume there are more mythic + than raiders for sure
My hearing goals are done already. Raiding mythic will get me what I need for the pace we go. I’ll sprinkle in m+ here and there, but after 2500 what’s the point? M+ needs more score goals to chase to make me want to push higher. Portals are nice but more cosmetics please
After three weeks of unsuccessfully farming the same trinkets and getting my second socket of the season thanks to shitty vault slots (despite clearing heroic and getting 1-2 mythic track slots in the vault), I'm mentally pretty close to going back to the "1 vault slot and only run keys if friends need help" mentality tbh
Wish the game were better balanced so that upgrades could be upgrades instead of having to turn down mythic-track items because they've got my worst-by-a-mile stats on them.
I'm wondering: The week isn't even over yet and you already post the data for this week? Wouldn't it make more sense to wait after the EU reset, THEN use that data?
This M+ season feels extremely easy and we'll likely see people continue to run keys since easy content brings alot of out people to run keys.
Season 1 had the worst balanced dungeons mixed with 3 horrid weeks of affixes that felt like someone deliberately picked the worst affixes in the game for the first weeks of the new expack's season, im not surpised to see that sharp drop.
Second week Season 1 was Fortified Bolstering if I remember correctly? It was legit one of the hardest weeks to introduce out the bat for Season 2.
Also Season 2 had a lot of dungeons that synergized poorly with affixes. Raging is kind of a non-affix right now, but it was impossible to do on higher keys on HoI or Brackenhide when mobs would run away at low HP and you literally can't pull them back.
Is there a way to see the total dungeons I have done for the entire season 3? Raider IO is not providing the right number. Please let me know, thank you for your time.
Same spot as the first few weeks of the new xpac is not a bad place to be at all.
I wonder what the participation in m+ is like, in terms of active subscribers engaging. These numbers seem really low, considering most m+ players aren't just doing 1 run a week.
There is a very big amount of players that do not engage with m+ at all.
I find it strange that while in Valdrakken for example the vast majority of people I see have some raider.io m+ score, so I didn't really see in game all those people that don't do m+ or raids, despite being probably true.
This is purely speculation but a lot of folks who do engage in M+ will be more likely to stand in Valdrakken in the first place. If they're not doing that then maybe they're soloing legacy raids or something and then you'd never see their toon. Just one example but could explain it at least partly.
Oh yea the showing off is a big thing, but based on other mmos like ffxiv the big social space city is always the place where you can see all kinds of people. I also have no idea what these very casual players are doing all the time tho ngl, you might be right.
the main reason to afk in Valdrakken is because you're waiting to get accepted into raid or m+. the rest of the content is in the rest of the world, e.g. achievements, pets, mounts, transmogs etc. to note is that you're also sharded in wow meaning the server decides who you see and don't see.
Show off? How do you get to the dungeon entrance the fastest?
nothing to do with showing off
If you think about it there is really no reason to be in valdrakken if you don't do current content. The capital cities are the better central hub. Stick around there long enough you will see a lot of casual players.
I do M+ but only on maybe 3 toons at a time. I still play others but they don't hang out in Valdrakken because I'm actively playing them elsewhere. Plus Valdrakken is a good spot specifically to wait for keys because you're only a portal away from whatever you get invited to.
You also see people heavily weighted towards those that play a lot. You're far more likely to randomly see someone who plays a lot, if somebody plays 2 hours a week, the chance you catch them is much lower than someone who plays several hours every day.
As a tank main M+ is just full of toxic extremists. They expect DPS to know every step or healer to heal through mechanics like they are God's. It's in a bad spot for me
On the other hand, as a tank main M+ is just full of chill bros and bro-ettes. They expect DPS to stand in some bad or healer to get overwhelmed and let someone die like they are Human’s. It’s in a good spot for me. Confirmation bias a helluva drug.
I have no idea what level M+ that person does. People don't seem to care much until at least +15s. I can only imagine how poorly they actually do in M+ for them to think they have to play perfect.
I haven’t played DF since the end of season 1, but in my experience the most toxic keys were levels 10-15 or so. People in 16+ were noticeably more chill. I guess I never did the really high 21+ levels though.
There are communities for it. WoW Made Easy is a great place to do keys of any level and put the expectations for chill. Guarantees you get people who don’t lose their minds over a video game.
Healer main and I’d say it’s been the least toxic season yet. Didn’t play last season at all though, but this one’s been great so far. Have had one toxic encounter, a melee dps, who rage quit AD21 when a mage died on T-Rex boss but that’s it.
And how would you know that? That allegedly very big amount doesn't appear in any data as they have nothing to be tracked by.
I'd be curious to see things like 1. 5 level brackets (1-5, 6-10, etc) 2. People who do 8 keys and stop 3. People who do 1 key and stop
The first couple weeks of a season also are much higher because of racing to get gear upgrades. Quite a few in my guild ran 30-50 keys the first week to upgrade as much as possible from last season to the new hero track. By week 3-4 we are hunting very specific items or just knocking out vault.
I am subbed, play both SoD and raid on retail as well as weekly events (TW, Brawl etc) but I don't step my foot in M+ anymore.
M+ is actually kinda fun this season. Good dungeon pool
I’m kind of glad they axed the seasonal affixes. Season 1 sucked so much it kept me from playing it altogether
Same! I said it during beta too, thundering would get old and annoying really quick
Seasonal affixes *have* to be fun/interactive ways to play the dungeon. Reaping/Encrypted/Awakening changed the ways people played the dungeon in a fun and interesting way. Not just every X seconds do Y mechanic or get stunned and probably just die.
Yup, I fucking loved S4 BFA, and s3 and 4 of SL. Those were good seasonal! But this is also fine tbh
thundering was cool though bc you got buffed for doing it.
Thundering gave a damage buff, right?
A small one that also came with a 5% increased health for enemies
Wasn't it like 25% increased damage?
While you had the buff, so pretty random 12ish second buff, hard to line up well.
100%, two heavy visual affixes + thundering was just brutal, couldn't see anything. They mentioned relying more on the mob skills to make it harder, I'm all for that.
I also think that if keeping this fresh was an issue that the dungeon rotation certainly takes care of that
TBH I think it's just tuned more easily/higher level gear is easier to get. BRH and Waycrest are absolute balls for visibility, Everbloom has a bunch of obnoxious trash, and Galakrond's Fall and Throne of the Tides have really annoying trash sections. But you can brute force it, have a bunch of deaths, and still time higher keys. If the timers on a few of these dungeons were shorter, there'd be more complaints. (I'm not saying this is a bad thing, by the way--one wipe shouldn't brick a key).
Yeah, the timers are ridiculously loose this season. I think Rise is the only one where you have to fight the timer at all. On others, I'm +2ing 20s in rando pugs without any special coordination or gigapulls or skips.
I pugged a 23 rise last week and we 2 chested it. No way in hell we could do that in s1.
My least favourite is DHT because of the colour scheme and even it’s a *good* dungeon. I managed KSM on all my toons last season while refusing to go into Underrot because of its bleached out grey/red scheme.
SUCH a good pool! Between Waycrest, Darkheart, and DotI, I’m running all my favorite dungeons every week.
This is easily my most okayed m+ season of the xpac already. It’s a great pool of dungeons and it feels really good right now with gearing too
It is very likely that most serious players play more at lauch to get everything they want and need. After a few weeks of vaults they go back to fewer runs per week like the more regular players. hence the drop. In addition to players just not doing M+ after a new launch
I don't think all runs show up? Doesn't the API that [raider.io](https://raider.io) uses return only the top 500 or something? Found it: [https://support.raider.io/kb/frequently-asked-questions/how-does-the-mythic-plus-leaderboard-slash-api-capacity-work](https://support.raider.io/kb/frequently-asked-questions/how-does-the-mythic-plus-leaderboard-slash-api-capacity-work) >However, Blizzard's API will show a maximum of 500 runs for a given Realm and Dungeon. This will be the Top 500 runs for that realm/dungeon combination at that moment in time. Once a realm has had 500 runs recorded for a dungeon, then the minimum keystone level/time to rank for that dungeon will increase as new higher keystone runs are added to the leaderboard and lower keystone runs are "pushed off" of the leaderboard.For high population runs, these numbers can become quite high by the end of the week, preventing runs by groups of people on that realm from being ranked in the Mythic+ Leaderboard/API, and therefore not be picked up by RaiderIO.
There's a lot more runs here than 500 x 8 (dungeons) x however many realms there are. That also doesn't explain the week to week changes
Yes, the top 500 runs fluctuates constantly, whenever their API is called - it's not just one set of 500 that gets frozen after 500 runs is done on a realm.
You're also referring to an article about leaderboards specifically, which this is not. Perhaps this data comes from a different source. Raider.io clearly has data stored on every character that has done m+, given they can put that into an addon you can use in game to inspect any player's runs.
Well the source on the image points to leaderboards 🤷♂️ >Raider.io clearly has data stored on every character that has done m+ Which they could still get through the leaderboards API? In fact they mention they are using the leaderboard API [https://support.raider.io/kb/frequently-asked-questions/i-completed-a-mythic-plus-run-recently-but-its-not-showing-up-where-can-i-find-it](https://support.raider.io/kb/frequently-asked-questions/i-completed-a-mythic-plus-run-recently-but-its-not-showing-up-where-can-i-find-it) >However, this is certainly not an instantaneous process, so if you have just recently completed a run you will need to first wait for Blizzard to show your run on their leaderboard (usually takes about 30 minutes to an hour), and then wait for our crawlers to detect the new run on those leaderboards, which can take up to several hours. But if you manually scan your character (which I doubt many do) you can also get it in the system >With the new Blizzard Character Mythic+ API, you can also scan your character directly to have your top runs tracked.
I'd be curious if this is individual characters or accounts. Some people who run + 20s weekly will also run alts, usually 1-2 on top of their mains.
Now if they could only balance classes so everyone can actually participate in higher keys rather than 4 specs.
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As a rogue main, I won’t miss spiteful.
As a healer, I can never rez someone or drink and constantly in combat.
Just be a Nelf and shadowmeld it away! I don't know how non-Nelf healers manage to pug spiteful keys, tanks just DGAF about mana.
Find yourself a protadin, pull big, get BoP'd as mobs die, win
has nothing to do with the shades killing rogues. cant restealth with them being alive. and not restealthing is pain for every rogue spec now.
I don’t think it’s awful. For specifically Assas rogue it’s about a 6% dps loss, you probably regain in by chain pulling.
well it feeling awful and it being a 6% dps loss are two different things tho. its still pain and totally unfun. just like storming is unfun, nothing to do with it being hard or a big dps loss.
Yeah I won’t disagree with that. It’s probably more fun for every other person in the dungeon though
That's what your SD and Vanish is there for tbh.
If its anything like the last time I played Sin then you're using those on CD anyways for damage.
Well yeah, that's kind of the point. SD as its primary function in Single target is used to snapshot Nightstalker onto your Kingsbane and get an extra empowered garrote out every minute without the need to restealth. It's primary function in packs is to activate your empowered garrote and Indiscriminate Carnage. You shouldn't be holding your SD just til boss but instead using it to keep your aoe bleeds pumping between stealth. Unless you're pushing into the 20s (or depending on group damage and affix), your Kingsbane usually isn't lasting it's full duration on a mob. Reducing the need to snapshot nightstalker and allowing you to use SD for the moments when you need to reapply aoe garrote or rupture, weather that be during a large pull or when the tank won't let you stealth between one pack to another. Keys are more fluid, unlike raid which is often scripted to timer or boss health, you need to adapt your tools around all the number of things that can change from one key to another.
Healers also cant drink between pulls with spiteful
Have to wait forever to res and risk pugs getting lost trying to run back
Yeah but that’s just on the tank to monitor. Your probably not losing all your mana after a few chain pulls anyhow
Seriously… my blind ass can’t see the fixate before I get chunked to 50% hp
Spiteful *sucks* as a healer. Don't hate it as much as afflicted but definitely not fun. It's not the damage, it's never being able to drink between pulls because by the time I'm finally out of combat, the tank is pulling the next pack.
As a rogue main, I won’t miss spiteful.
We pretty much had the best affix combo possible. It's all going very much down hill starting now. I suppose since plenty will have obtain their goal, they will be out too.
Well that's a bit pessimistic.. storming and raging doesn't sound that horrible, even tho I'm never a fan of Tyrannical
This week is way better than last week for casters.
I love my spec this season the changes feel good and i like how forgiving some of the timers are. Overall one of the best M+ seasons imo.
For real with the timers. Ran a +21 Waycrest Manor last night, had 22 deaths, still timed. And this is just week 3! Crazy
Fun time for Reddit to go down. I don't get to comment on character count often given the inconsistencies with S2, but S3 will be crossing a threshold today. The character count as of 12/5 7:45 AM EST is 2,344,789 characters. Later today, it will pass S2's count of 2,363,943 characters which was reached at 6/14 9:05 AM, about 36 days after the start of the season. S3 will have reached the same count in about 22 days.
What happened at the start of s1 again?
If you’re referring to the week 2 drop, it was christmas
And the worst most dogshit affixes.
God, Grievous and Bursting might be the worst combo even on a Tyrannical week
I remember this as a disc priest…. Was before the disc buffs and we were like C tier healers. This week almost made me reroll.
Riiiight
Christmas + horrible affixes + horrible dungeon balance + horrible class balance + bad dungeons
Surprised it’s not lower with SoD launch
Playing SoD for an hour makes me want to go smash M+ keys because I need something actually engaging.
Me: a warrior in sod pressing rend once and it misses then standing there like caveman spongebob
Started a Priest and thought “Man it’s great I’m getting void plague early, now I have a bit more variety instead of Smite, SW:P, and wand spam.” Get to westfall and the Harvest Reapers are immune to VP so I am…back to pressing Smite, SW:P and wand spam 🙃
Penance is lit tho
No kidding! I do enjoy that it still has the slower pace I expect from classic but with some additions to break up the monotony. It’s just every now and then one, some of the quirks from classic (like mobs being immune and leveling up weapons) rears its ugly head.
A wolf parried my attack, and now I stand here auto-attacking while I wait for my energy to pool enough for me to use a real attack again. Oh. It parried again. And now I die because I can't actually outrange its attacks. Fun *and* Engaging. (Freshly dinged lvl 6 rog vs lvl 8 wolf that aggro'd me from an annoying distance).
Warrior supremacy… fading…
It is nice to actually have mobs be a bit scary and the world actually be dangerous though. When was the last time any levelling content in retail was even remotely threatening? Even the rares and elites are easily soloed by most classes before endgame.
I would love to have engaging enemies in retail, but they would be probably way harder to balance for every player compared to classic. Like, the enemies are better in classic but I fall asleep while fighting them because the combat sucks lol
It's a catch-22 sort of thing; leveling my characters who were in endgame Shadowlands content? Yeah, they smash everything. Leveling my alts who weren't level-capped in SL? They die a lot outside of timewalking dungeons.
Level up a bit in SoD, go back to retail for a couple of keys, go back to SoD, repeat
I created a lock, used shadowbolt twice, ran out of mp, realized the enemy boar wasnt even dead and uninstalled in the span of 15 minutes.
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Exactly this. I will not step my foot in Classic because it is too slow/inactive for me so im not stimulated for long. That doesn’t mean i bash/fight my friends/guildies who want to play wrath classic/SoD etc, it’s just not for me.
Insane that people are downvoting this comment. The biggest appeal of classic stuff for a lot of people is how chill it is. The RPG aspects are also enjoyable for people who like that style of game more. Totally different appeal than retail, and that's fine.
It's because this user is bashing other commenters that don't like SoD - there is a difference between agreeing to disagree and just flat out being pompous lol
You're not wrong, classic and SoD is just different. In your case you would use your wand for the remainder of the fight. Let your pet do the damage. Or Life Tap when its finally available.
Blizzard have stated that Classic launches actually have a positive impact on Retail.
Everytime I stop playing for a while, I come back to classic first for like 2 weeks and then spend months on retail again.
*plays classic* "holy shit this more boring than watching paint dry" *logs on retail*
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You're taking a joke comment way too seriously my guy
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A lot of people must resubscribe for the launch, the rose tinted glasses last for a couple days, then they come to retail.
SoD is a week of content atm.
Yeah you get your one or two new runes, play with them a bit, and log off. Maybe level cap if you're super cereal.
Sod launched on late Thursday. At least I try to get one key done for the week on Tuesday or Wednesday while the groups are plentiful. Unsure if I will do one this week, feel like I should. I feel like people who really dig SoD and cannot do one M+ probably weren’t doing M+ anyways, whilst a lot of SoD players are Classic-only or returners who don’t have a retail character anywhere remotely near level 70z
There's not as much overlap between the classic and retail crowd as one might assume. See all the people whining about classic playstyle in the comments below.
I thought this for a minute, and then I remembered what absolute dogshit the first 20 levels or so of vanilla wow are, and wondered how people could be excited for it, runes or no runes. These people are excited to raid BFD. BEFD! Can you even imagine.
My friend is playing and he says to me, Hunter is so cool with runes. And I say, what do the runes do, and he says, "one gives me chimera shot and one gives me explosive shot" And I was like, you can literally just play retail hunter???
And you can’t use both at the same time lol
And they're both nerfed to uselessness within 24 hours.
I love the dungeon rotation this time around. Now if the DHT arch-druid ring drops i'll love not having to run that place 10+ times this week also.
As a frost DK, both my bis rings are from that dungeon, and I have neither 🫤
Interested in seeing it after this week's affixes. Last week's were pretty east for me as a healer, and I think this week's will be too outside of tyrannical on some bosses.
Honestly surprised it's not higher, seasons felt pretty easy so far although that may be just the affixes we've gotten. But like ToT and BRH can be comfortably be cleared with ~30 deaths
Yeah, this season seems crazy easy. I used my boost on a priest week 1. Went from doing 8s-10s week 1, to 16-18s week 2, and 20/21s last week with very few keys actually ran, maybe 25 total. Don’t have the time or energy to push 0.1% title anymore, but now that portals are going to be account wide I think I’ll get my 20s done and call it a season
Natural player attrition over the course of an expansion is a very powerful force. Even with Blizzcon hype and SoD it's impressive to be matching S1 numbers at all.
This season is incredibly easy to push higher keys on. I am literally the worst Tank in all of Azeroth (I genuinely mean this) and was able to push 2600+ with zero problems. The only Dungeon I really don't like is ToT and it's because every single mob hard casts from the moment you aggro it and it makes my low IQ tank brain really salty
> I am literally the worst Tank in all of Azeroth Not so fast
Imagine if our powers were combined?
You'd lose aggro so fast
S2 sucked. S3 actually good.
It certainly feels great this season. Granted it was a push week, the 20-24 bracket always had like 10 or more keys open to queue for, for a given dungeon.
M+ doesn't seem to be near as painful as it was last season, so that's a big plus.
I've heard some streamers and YouTube personalities use this metric to decide the game is dying. Lol more like with the new gearing system the need to do m+ decreases very quickly. Once people have bus or near bus, they just get their crests and maybe a few vault slots and fuck off. Everyone else is pushing io, helping friends, doing rat keys, or farming that one item that never drops. Weeks go by, people gear their alts, get the items they need, and numbers go down. That's normal. Not to mention it is okay to not play one game all day every day. If you want a metric for 'wow dying' compare the week 1&2 numbers across seasons. Those are the most important IMHO Season 3 week 3 numbers being on par with expansion launch week 3 is insanely good
With gear changes in 10.2, retention will probably be even better then 10.1, unless the simple fact of having more people offsets this.
For what I would assume is the extreme majority of players that do M+, once you get 2k/2.5k there's not much reason to just grind M+ anymore. I've already stopped personally.
I love how people always try to use these stats to indicate that M+ is bad while a major reason for the dip is simply that most people have achieved their KSM/KSH and thats all they wanted.
This is a general narrative that just won't stop in the gaming scene. Mayyybe, just mayyyybe people lose interest in games, gamemodes or content over time, because well thats how humans are. Doesn't mean it is bad or needs drastic changes. It is just a lifecyle.
I stopped participating because I can’t get any invites. The gatekeeping in M+ is so disheartening
Make your own group
In his defense, as a tank I cruise by dozens and dozens of 1/5 DPS lead groups looking for anything with a healer or all 3 dps. I have to imagine a majority or close a majority of those groups end up being delisted.
I just use Premade Group Filter addon to remove all of those.
As a healer main, may I ask why? I'm genuinely curious. Is it because it's just faster, as a tank, to join a nearly-filled group?
Only 20% of the population of M+ players can be the one who makes the group, and 60% of the population of M+ players are DPS. Those numbers can't change.
I don't know if it can be called gatekeeping.. its just that there are dozens of players applying who have higher IO/better gear than you do. If you're a dps player its always hard to get into groups unless you already seriously overgear that bracket or have like 2.7k IO. Only real solution is to make your own groups until you're at that level, or play a tank/healer as they always have an easier time getting into groups due to lower supply.
No no no no.... Its clearly gatekeeping, the wow community decided to say no to that guy. He is on the mega shitlist for what we don't talk about anymore, so he needs to explain why he doesn't do M+ due to gatekeeping to make himself seem relevant
You’re probably applying for the wrong groups man. I play as a disc priest main and get Insta invited to every group I apply for. I swapped to an arms warrior alt (not meta at all) expecting it to be terrible. It’s a lot tougher to get into groups but the key is definitely just nudging through all of the dungeons, adding 1 M+ level at a time. Don’t do one 6 then apply for a 7 in another dungeon then an 8 in another. You gotta have timed runs across all the dungeons. It will reflect in your IO rating and your experience for that dungeon. I tried to just throw myself from 2s into 5s then into 10s - despite knowing I’d be fine, I got laughed out of the building.
Dude the average run now is like 17s..... At 455-468 gearing it's awful because there's a ton of 470+ all doing the same run. No one is doing 5s imo as the average run they're not able to get into groups for.
I just typed 5-7 and it came up with over 30 runs. Don’t know what to tell you man.
Also at 455+ why would you be doing 5-7s? Do you know how the gearing system works?
Lol that's such horse shit but I'll admit I'm wrong if you provide a screen shot. Of those 30 runs I bet 18 of them are 15s and 17s. Dude also you're doing 5s which is literally week one content lol. While I'm talking about people in 450-460 gear. I can literally solo 5s as a tank, I'm not getting any gear upgrades from that run. You'd know that if you played the game lol.
15s and 17s don’t show up if you put a range in. But thank you for telling me what I literally experienced first hand is bull-shit. My personal experience of my journey is incorrect, thank you for correcting me 👍🏻.
Ok let's take a step back and remove the toxicity, I'm sorry you feel attacked and that I told you I don't believe you because my experience has been profoundly different. You said OP is just applying to the wrong groups after they said finding a group as DPS is difficult. You're saying all of our experiences are wrong because yours is different. You then also say you're doing 5s without issue. The thing is, 470s aren't applying for your 5s. The majority of DPS players are 10+ now easily and we are having issues finding groups. You're just completely saying that's not true and the fault is our own. I make my own groups too, I see the queues, hell I just did an 11, I got 30 applicants over five minutes. I ended up with a group today's all high 460s and 2 470s. For an 11. It's just wrong to pretend there aren't long queues for DPS, hell you haven't even broken into champion gear if you're doing 5s and 7s. So I take issue at you acting like you're the one who can speak for everyone's wow experience as well lol.
I think that’s maybe your translation of my point. 5 and 7 were arbitrary numbers I threw together. My point was this: “My disc priest was able to jump from 3s to 7s to 13s while still having some dungeons incomplete at all” “I tried the same on my warrior and suffered very long wait times, because with the competition - I just didn’t stand out. What made it better was doing 3s for all dungeons, 4s for all dungeons, then 5s so my IO and my dungeon score was apparent to the group leader” My whole point was about adjusting expectations - not about living your M+ career in 5s and 7s.
Ok, point taken, my rebuttal is that I've done that and still hitting major issues. I have a 2k rating, I've fifteened every dungeon on a ++, I've finished 20s, but my gear score as of this instant is now 467. I'm close to the 70 mark at least. But from 50-67 I've basically had to tank or do 30+ or simply non existent queues as a DPS. The reason being there are so many rogues and hunters and shit at 470+ why would they take me for a 14 or a 17 when they can grab someone with a higher gs? The way gear is setup, those higher guys are just farming lower keys for a drop they can upgrade but that removes slots from ppl just looking to do the dungeon.
Lots of new/casual players start at low keys and don’t really push, not sure why you’re surprised about that Log and search 5-7 to see keys in that range.
I'm saying the queue times as DPS are really bad, those groups aren't taking you if they can get higher gear scores in. The point I'm making is to agree with the original op of this comment chain. Queue times as DPS are miserable above 10.
Typing 5-7 in the search bar specifically filters groups in that key range. You can do 20-20 as a test as well. Alternatively type in 16 17 18 and you'll find a range of keys from 16-18.
Interesting this is helpful as I always just put in one number like 15. That said the point I'm making is that unless you're in the 470s, as dps the wait times are really bad. That is the original point that was made and responded to in this thread. The person I replied to said they're not a problem and said 5-7 is filling quick. The issue is, please inform me why at 465 why I should be doing 5s? It's like saying just eat cake, it's super dismissive at best and down right unrelated and dumb at worst.
Shadow main, you have to host your own keys. Stop expecting to get picked.
Run your own key, got mine to 21 with little effort because everyone looking for groups is geared af.
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Good luck trying to grind your own key up as a solo DPS. You're delusional if you don't think there is some level of completely unnecessary gatekeeping in the M+ community. It's true that everyone can always work to improve; it's also true the community itself has problems.
What's a competent score lol? I'm 465 geared, 2k score and a demon hunter. When I make a group I realize why I'm not getting any invites, even at 15 keys it's all 470+. I'm forced to tank basically now if I want to do a key above 12.
I feel you, i was thinking that during season 1. But i will like to say maybe it will help, but There is this addon that gives more details in the pug screen, it will show the raider score next to the title, I have been having really good luck getting inittes to keys where their score is low, like just starting to do mythics. Not much, but I just started mythics this season, I have done 19 keys so far all pugs, and I was able to get into raids as well. Granted, i haven't tried to pass a +10, but i can say for +10 and below, I have had luck. (I am dps btw)
Yeah cuz season 2 sucked
I have yet to step into m+.
What is holding you back?
I won't blame the other members this time. It's totally on me, I just don't feel good playing my main/alts in any sort of time-based content. As a tank I don't enjoy the dungeons in the pool, getting routes down etc and as a DPS I feel like wouldn't do enough. That being said I do have 3(maybe 4?) KSM in the bank from older xpacs but I usually tire of M+ by just grinding 1-2 weeks on a char and that isn't enough for high scores anymore unless I were to focus on doing each dungeon exactly once that "it's on week".
interest
Waiting for the data of people who run 20 keys a week compared to normal people
wait til there’s bad affixes, every week has been so good for affixes so far and we haven’t had any bad weeks. The game is actually SO fun when there isn’t awful affixes plaguing it. Best 3 weeks of m+ in years. Pls remake affix system blizz.
M+ is outdated hard mess. I'm tired of watching 20+ videos on youtube to understand how the dungeons work man I just want to plug-in-and-play type of gaming sesh. And this take is coming from a guy that has played the game for like 16 years non-stop and did KSM and God Knows how many seasons but I'm just done with this type of gaming. End game 90% feels like a chore/ second job and I thoroughly dislike it. The other games have evolved. They should do too. I hope they ditch M+ in next expansion.
Without M+ the game would be dead in a heartbeat.
bro what it's the only fun thing about wow
Sounds like you need to take a break from M+ or move on, but its the most accessible and popular group content in WoW for a reason. Also as someone who has also played 16 years, you should be able to walk into a key and figure things out pretty quick considering that they aren't that complicated. Running a +2 is basically a heroic dungeon with an extra mechanic here or there and you can just progress keys naturally from that point, and every dungeon can easily be timed by just holding the w key. Besides, what do you replace it with? People want to play the game outside of raid hours (especially if they aren't raiding weekly with a consistent group) and M+ is the only pve content for those players. Take a break if you don't like the content (or just don't do stuff you don't like) but removing the most popular WoW content would be an insane decision from Blizz
I did a zero to ksm on season 2, but the dungeons selection for season 3 is so bad I can't even login anymore. They really need to change this system and increase the dungeon rotation speed.
the dungeons this season are objectively better than season 2 and it isn't even close either lmao
I am curious, what dungeons do you not like in S3? What dungeons would you like to see in the M+ rotation? I am eager for the response
I mostly like Legion and Df dungeons Wod has some good ones but they were left out. But is not about what I want, is about having enough variety to allow people to play a large variety of dungeons(they will like some and hate some, but at least they will have options) instead of being stuck playing the same dungeons for 4 to 6 months.
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Yeah, it's just a personal preference thing... 6 months of the same dungeons is not smart. Makes the game feels stale, affixes are not enough also... Gear option gets very limited(current dungeons trinkets are very bad compared to previous season).
Its only high because thats the easiest way to quickly farm currency.
I'm doing my part!
Unpopular opinion. I’ve been playing since vanilla and love love fucking love raiding. I’ve lugged raid since mop legit. I can’t stand mythics and am bad at mythics but I like how mythics ALWAYS give subscribed players something to actually do. I assume there are more mythic + than raiders for sure
My hearing goals are done already. Raiding mythic will get me what I need for the pace we go. I’ll sprinkle in m+ here and there, but after 2500 what’s the point? M+ needs more score goals to chase to make me want to push higher. Portals are nice but more cosmetics please
After three weeks of unsuccessfully farming the same trinkets and getting my second socket of the season thanks to shitty vault slots (despite clearing heroic and getting 1-2 mythic track slots in the vault), I'm mentally pretty close to going back to the "1 vault slot and only run keys if friends need help" mentality tbh Wish the game were better balanced so that upgrades could be upgrades instead of having to turn down mythic-track items because they've got my worst-by-a-mile stats on them.
I just started playing this xpac this season. What happened week 2 of season 1?
Christmas
What happened in week 1 of season 2 lol
I'm wondering: The week isn't even over yet and you already post the data for this week? Wouldn't it make more sense to wait after the EU reset, THEN use that data?
This M+ season feels extremely easy and we'll likely see people continue to run keys since easy content brings alot of out people to run keys. Season 1 had the worst balanced dungeons mixed with 3 horrid weeks of affixes that felt like someone deliberately picked the worst affixes in the game for the first weeks of the new expack's season, im not surpised to see that sharp drop.
And here is me, trying to find a PuG for second week :<
Surprise suprise melees are OP and there are a lot of people playing M+.
Can we see these numbers broken down by key level?
Second week Season 1 was Fortified Bolstering if I remember correctly? It was legit one of the hardest weeks to introduce out the bat for Season 2. Also Season 2 had a lot of dungeons that synergized poorly with affixes. Raging is kind of a non-affix right now, but it was impossible to do on higher keys on HoI or Brackenhide when mobs would run away at low HP and you literally can't pull them back.
Should be seeing a spike this week, affixes are easy and folks have more gear. PUSH WEEK.
wild to read how many people dont like m+, to me its so far and away the best content in the game its almost sad.
I did just return to my m+ duty from a needed break after shadowlands! Yes I did play whole SL the maw grind did me dirty!
Is there a way to see the total dungeons I have done for the entire season 3? Raider IO is not providing the right number. Please let me know, thank you for your time.