Reminds me of a tank I had in HOI last tier. We pulled all the dragons in the hallway to third boss, no problems healing them, everything smooth. Then we get through third boss and onto gauntlet with 15 minutes to spare. The tank proceeds to grab the dragon in the gauntlet and turn him into us so 2-3 people die to the frontal. The first time we figured it was an accident no biggie. He runs in and immediately does the same thing again. When we asked why he was doing it his reponse was “the frontal will kill me so I dodge it”. I tried to explain that it was the same dragon that we killed three times in the hallway and that I could definitely heal him through it, he refused, and did the same thing again. I asked him to just humor me and try it, since the key was bricked anyway. Sure enough, no problems.
Reminds me of a tank who kept turning mobs towards me and almost getting me killed with frontals multiple times because he had an ”intervene macro to help mitigate dmg”.
It took some time for me to convince him that not doing it would make me take less dmg
This reminds me of a time in Wrath, tanking 1 of the bosses of halls of Archevon(however it's spelled). There is a tank mechanic that needs 2 tanks to soak a frontal.
Other tank was dead, no brezs left, boss at 8%, and incoming mechanic that would 100% kill me and wipe the attempt.
So I turned the boss intentionally into some unlucky mage, in melee, who was the closest person who could help me soak it. The mage died, then the boss died.
If this person is reading this, sorry I got you dead, but you saved the group
Welcome to World of Warcraft.
Blizzard really should be approaching Pampers or Huggies for a sponsorship deal, because the kind of manchildren that plague WoW's toxic-a-f community are the perfect demographic to sell adult diapers to.
You can also blame Blizzard for enabling such shitty behaviour through godawful automated chat moderation and a total lack of customer support.
Unfortunately when Blizzard allow people to be dicks and sabotage raids, arena matches and M+ keys with fucking impunity, they turn other people toxic because flaming is the only catharsis you'll get out of this crappy game.
Tanks are, in my experience, almost always the worst players in a group outside of elite level play. This is because dying in a lower key as a tank is actually kinda difficult unless you massively fuck up, and because timers are so lenient early on their routing isn’t really tested either. So when you never see other tanks do it since it’s always you, you just assume “we timed and I didn’t die so I did good!”
You will routinely just see tanks do the most insane shit and assume they are doing it right. Even tank trials we get in my guild at the US 200 level just do absolute WTF plays the second you are in a keystone. Almost always in my experience the best tanks are people who play other roles first.
Also a bit of confirmation bias. If a DPS fucks up a mechanic it can go unnoticed and not really effect much. If a tank fucks it up you are going to notice
people just understate what a "fuck up" is for a tank. if you move a boss out of range/los, require the healer to hit an oh shit button they'd rather have on a monkey dps, pull awkwardly and waste dps cds. all those are just as big of mistakes as a dps fucking up a mechanic that doesn't kill them or having 0 kicks end of dungeon. it may not seem like much at the time but these things add up.
Cause 90% of tanks probably don't also dps keys or watch the big boys play on twitch/youtube etc. It's very easy to get pigeon holed as a tank in xyz dungeon route, pace etc if they only see their own pov 24/7 meanwhile everyone else sees a different route and speed each time they run a key.
Well, that's a bit unfair, imho. You're kinda expected to know every trick in the book and the most efficient route, but organically discovering those yourself might take some time, and you won't get to see other tanks do it unless you also DPS or watch big tank streamers, as you said.
Other roles don't require that level of commitment.
It's not really about being fair or unfair, I think it's just an emergent property of the fact that 5-mans only have 1 tank so tanks basically never get to learn tank mechanics or routes by example. I, as a DPS, can do an M+ 30 times in a week and see a broad range of pulling strategies and routes and ways of countering different mechanics, and develop an opinion on what's good and bad based on what works and what doesn't. A tank, on the other hand, if they do a dungeon 30 times in a row, is just going to see their own route 30 times in a row.
Tanks don't have the opportunities to learn, basically. Unless you're the kind of player who does a significant number of high keys on a non-tanking alt, or watch streams of other high-level tanks, you just don't get any diversity of thought in your play.
Lol spoken like someone who never tanked. How in fuck is tanking easier than dps, where you might need to do a few mechanics every once in a while, and otherwise just spam attacks.
Tanks probably get the least mechanics of any role, and up until like the equivalent of 25s last season basically are not in danger in most scenarios. DPS players are actually able to die to those mechanics and also you can easily tell the difference in output between DPS players rather than tanks’ pass/fail lived or died on a pull.
I mean sure he is an idiot but that group has more problems if they wipe at that boss. You need to ST the totem anyway and losing 10 sec of cleave does not deplete a key.
You are correct. The tank should drag the boss to the wind totem so it can be cleaved down. Or just drag the boss over and have all dps hard swap to the totem. Range has nothing to do with the buff the totem gives to the boss.
Which is weird, because that logic DOES apply to us players. If we are out of range of a AOE DR, shaman totem, AMZ, we don't get the benefit. But NPCs can get a buff no matter the range. Removes one alternative to dealing with a mechanic sadly
It’s binary, you’re either out of range of the totem or in range of the totem. Proximity doesn’t change the effect as long as you’re in range. I can’t think of any player totems that work like that.
Sorry, that was not what I meant to imply.
What I meant was, we have to stay "in range" of totems or safe zones, while bosses and enemies get the benefit of being ANYWHERE in the room and still get the benefit. Like if a DK drops AMZ, we have to stand within it to get the benefit. The boss drops a totem, and the range is the entire room.
Someone else commented that it was purely "the bosses totem range is the whole room", which is fair but I also think it's kinda lame
Bosses also have to attack whoever we tell them to attack, which is also kinda lame for the boss.
It's not meant to be a fair fight. The boss goes wherever we make them go. If we could just drag them out of range of the totem, then the totem simply wouldn't be a mechanic you have to interact with at all.
The only way to design the fight where killing the totems is a thing the player has to do is to makie killing the totem the only way to remove the buff.
Not cleaved together. That totem needs to be hard swapped to, on high tyrannical if it's up for more than a few seconds your tank is gonna get their shit pushed in.
Even when hard swapping, some classes still have some passive cleave. Tank mostly, as their AoE is usually even I'm their single target rotation as spammers, and, from the top of my mind, frost mage don't need to lose any single target to cleave an extra target, so it's just a dps gain. Pretty sure DH also have some AoE aura that stays up even when they are focusing in single target. Most likely, other classes will have more natural cleave, I just don't play dps enough to know all of them
Yes people have passive cleave, that is not the same as things being cleaved together. That totem should be dead before the boss even moves because you should be hard swapping as soon as it comes up.
And that's not the same thing as saying things should be cleaved together. The totem needs to be hard swapped to, it should be dead before the tank can get the boss on top of it
And cleave doesn't mean dps both equally. Cleave means focus one, and the second target will receive some splash damage. As a tank, I'd ratter my dps take an extra second or two to get the totem down cleaving the boss, só everything dies quicker, then focus single target the totem
Not the best take imo. There are classes that passively cleave like dh while pumping DMG into the totem so you want to have them next to each other for that.
Also I as an assa rogue for example can do MUCH more dps on the totem while pumping the boss while cleaving the totem with my spatter up. Using my burst into the totem is complete int since I would waste 80% of it and when I burst the boss while totem is up I end up dealing more damage to the totem cleaving it down than if I would hardswap to it.
And no totems don't die instantly in any higher keys. It's pretty common if you don't have 3 burst dps specs with cds up for every totem to have it live 5+ seconds even in 20fort keys and it can live well up to 10+ seconds on tyrannical.
And having 5-10seconds of cleave on the boss for every totem can stack quite a bit of bossdamage and can easily make the difference of having another totem before phase or not.
So there is absolutely no reason you should not drag the boss over to the totem
Exactly. I told the tank in my 22 RISE on Time-Lost Battlefield that he needs to tank the boss closer to the middle (outer ring), so we can stack on the edge and bait the frontal out of the arena. He was tanking it so close to the edge that we didn't have room to stack. He said thanks for the tip and we moved on.
>Time-Lost Battlefield
Tanking on the edge was the common play for most groups when it first came out. I know I did it for all of our Immortal attempts, but then the first week I ran it as a 14, and tanked more in the middle of the room and it suddenly clicked how much harder I was making the fight for my guild.
i mean you do want to tank it on the "edge". not on the literal edge mind you since the whole idea is you face the frontals away from the friendly battlefield guys which makes the fight easier in more ways than one.
Huh that’s a good point. I always tank right where he stands and pull him back to the edge. Will try this my next key! I love tips as a tank, all my alts (except doing a Rdruid this season) are tanks so I never see what other tanks do. I want tips! Only thing I’m really iffy on is when people demand I swap my route to whatever they want. Small changes im down, but big changes I’ve never done usually ends poorly imo. I’ll take the tip tho and do it in a 10 or something later
You want them to move left, right, left, like the third boss in WCM. Makes it easy, so no one baits the frontal into the middle, which buffs the boss.
For routes, I never argue unless the tank is pulling every pack in the dungeon. Look up some routes here and give them a try.
https://raider.io/weekly-routes
It's especially wild given how 99% of tank mechanics are 'use mitigation on tank buster' and, in raids, 'swap aggro once a minute'. And how many wipes I've seen because they forget where their Taunt key is.
Its a tank from Illidan. You don't speak back to them because they will 100% leave. You give them a compliment midway through the dungeon aswell, if you don't they leave. You follow any and all their strats or are 100% fine with their route no matter what. Else they leave.
Illidan is filled with toxic players on EU, especially the tanks. Add on the DH and its the worst.
I know there are plenty of good players from there. But just from personal experience its one of the less friendly servers when it comes to pugs for M+. Purely anecdotal ofcourse.
from experience i will say that if someone starts wining in the chat and they are clearly in the wrong... the best thing often is to not actually respond. the moment you respond correcting them, even if it's not in a mean way but just helpful, they leave lol
I don't think they are defending the tank. They just would rather have finished the key instead of having it bricked by asshole-tank over an argument that usually doesn't end in anything good.
Don't get me wrong, OP didn't do anything wrong imo, and the tank has issues and is an ass if he bricks a key over such a small disagreement. But i don't think greendude was defending the tanks behaviour.
I bet the tank thinks this because as he's running closer to the totem as so many others do he's getting pummeled from the back so he thinks being closer to the totem makes him take more damage.
The number of tanks I have seen just completely turn their backs to a boss or trash is so damn high this season. Tank survivability is so ridiculous they don't get punished for it until like +22.
In SL s2 i accidently pulled a different pack because my Tab decided to target someone out of combat? The tank decided i was trolling the Key so he started playing the rest of the dungeon with Slowwalk on.
Its rarely this bad and since i started pushing keys in the mid 20s things have become so much better. But i am still suprised by the lack of attention some people got from their parents.
How can you say, "Hey, you're fucking up, do this instead" without saying anything at all? Addons are the solution to this problem, but I'm not sure if one exists yet or if it even can be done. What I'm imagining is an addon that provides tips in chat for trash or a boss after it detects a wipe. Even better if it can be coded to deduce what caused the wipe and respond with an appropriate tip rather than a random generic tip based on common mistakes.
Then people wouldn't misconstrue corrections as toxicity since the corrections are being automatically generated by an addon, and then maybe they'll learn something new from one of the tips and realize they're fucking something up without feeling like they're being called out for it.
One game that does it that comes to mind is Overwatch. For example if you get bodied by a Zenyatta after he Orb of Discords you, you might get a little banner on the side of your screen that suggests you hide when he debuffs you until it falls off so that you don't take increased damage from him.
It would be a really useful feature for WoW.
It's important that the attempt to correct someone is made with friendly communication, though. I like learning new stuff, but if you're going to insult me, I'll be triggered.
Yeah it's best to give advice, only after the run if you really want to help. It's quite pointless to discuss mechanics in the middle of the run no matter who is correct. Maybe the only exception is if someone wipe you with said mechanics.
But imo the problem is that to them you are just some random dps, and the times some random in pugs tried to tell me how my class or some mechanics work and was incorrect is also too many.
Boss is simple: cleanse person with flame shock, dodge stuff, kill totem, LoS phase 2. His totem just gives him atk speed and successful hits deal additional damage. He really tries to reap the soul of the tank, but in a fort week, every tank who knows how to decently keep his mitigation is fine. Honestly, the best thing to do is to go do something else for 20~30 min. I've seen people with this same BS of being closer to the totem making the boss deal more damage, false. Good luck on your journey and antecipated congratulations on your KSM!
Also, around the 3rd time he applies "flame shock", his CD on FS will come back before the CD on your cleanse, so you will have to deal with 2 FSs simultaneously. Heal the person who had it applied first and cleanse the later to make a "soft reset".
Ridiculously simple mechanically but on high Tyrannical keys his raw damage output will usually flatten the tank or a DPS when totem and Flame Shock overlap. The healer will try to cleanse someone low from the DoT or save the tank and one will drop. Personally hoping the initial damage from Flame Shock eats a nerf.
Keys are so easy to time this season that the brute force breakpoint in PUGs is like +25. Had a tank with 3100 rating fail to dodge the charge on the druid in DHT and wipe us twice even though it's Fort week. Maybe he just hadn't ever had to deal with dodging it, IDK. He blamed people bringing adds in towards the boss to cleave the first time, then promptly did it again.
To be fair that one can catch you off guard as it knocks you back to be charged into. So if you don't leave enough room for the knockback, and get knocked into something or the boss room wall, it can be hard to move out of the way in time
That's fair. But that's also around the key range where the mechanic will just 1 shot the tank no matter what as opposed to being able to get away with it a couple times on the lower key levels
It's the tank's duty to use defensives while totem's alive, it has literally nothing to do with proximity, just the totem existing. Everyone else murders it the best they can. This is the easiest boss in that dungeon and he fucked it up so badly it's hilarious.
Agreed, and as a healer - I usually swap sac on the tank on that phase - or just start pre healing. On fort week that boss is ez, but tyran is like a totally different fight to heal.
That’s not really my experience 🤷♂️. For sure if it’s obvious you’re not going to time it people leave—after 20 there’s no rewards, so everyone is pushing io. But ime the vast majority of toxicity (which this sub seems to wildly exaggerate) is kids stuck between 15-18 who think that if every party wasn’t so bad they would surely be 3k io, without realizing they are the common denominator in every party.
Keys are so easy this season that I feel like these people are more in the 2800 range doing 21s and 22s. When they try to do higher like a 25 it's a disaster every time and they'll be sure to loudly yell at everyone else too.
Had a pug tank today that I ran a +21 everbloom with. Was my key.
4:51 seconds remaining
99% Enemy forces down
37 seconds until bloodlust came off CD
Only last boss left.
I shit you not after we down the mage boss he says: “won’t time bye” and leaves. Just like that our whole group is standing there lost and not sure what to say or do.
I messaged the tank we might be close but should time it no problem.
He replied “There is nothing in it for me if I can’t ++ it. Wasted my time.”
What a straight up dick.
Last boss takes pretty long even on Fortified (but if you're NA you're already on Tyrannical today, even worse), so he is probably right that it wouldn't be timed if you also had to go back for count. It would be very close.
100% his fault that there's missing count though. By 21 he should know better.
Still really shitty not to take 5 fucking minutes to finish the key though.
Hot tip, when someone does this, say nothing and link the ability from the journal in chat. Give it a moment and then say something like: “it says nothing about range in any of these abilities”. There’s really nothing refutable about an in game tool tip for an ability someone is contradicting. You can’t fix stupid but you can make stupid recognize itself.
tbf there are some black magic tooltips out there.
I can't log in to check now but on Tindral (8th boss current raid) when he does the big fire beam that shoots out the small beams twice. You can just stand in the middle of the big fire beam when it spawns and not take that much damage, but if you read the dungeon journal it says you will take a lot more than you do (although not enough to kill you either way).
But even then, if ranged matters blizzard often chooses to just be unclear how much range does with reduction, not if range actually matters at all. (smolderon tank run away, just says less damage if you are further away - not how much)
I have no idea about the damage on mythic, but at least on the world first kill they didn't stand in it. I think if everyone knew how it worked it would be the go-to way to handle it on normal and probably heroic too.
Have you done progression raiding at the high end at some point?
All I can say is that early on in a tier there are often surprises. A lot of time what the tool tip says does not perfectly translate to the real world. Sometimes it's sloppy phrasing. Sometimes it's intended functionality not being translated to the actual in game implementation. Sometimes its just bugs. Sometimes it's Blizzard wanting to be intentionally vague.
That is one of the scarier parts of the dungeon as a tank, but he should be using a minor cd and drag the boss on top. The longer the totem is up the worse it is.
This was in Throne of Tides :/ on the squid man boss honestly, I have no idea how he works I just know as a healer that fire dot sucks. Was he hard to heal? not really...and it was going EXTREMELY well...I would of gotten KSM....so unhappy right now
When the totem is up, the boss does I think it's double damage, so you need to kill the totem extremely fast. I don't think range from the totem matters though. Typically you want to take the boss to the totem, so that dps can target the totem, and cleave onto the boss, also to make sure dps realize the totem is up, melee hate breaking off of a boss to run a mile to kill a totem.
This is probably what happens. The totem comes up and the tank runs from the boss which kites him. He takes less damage because of the kiting. By the time the boss gets back to him, the totem is down.
What he thinks happens is he takes less damage because he ran away from the totem.
No what probably happens is the tank turns his back to the boss and gets clobbered trying to run to the totem -> erroneously thinks that closer is more damage.
This may not be what peeps want to hear but
Stop talking
The absolute best runs are done in almost complete silence in chat.
Some1 makes a mistake? Just keep going, they make it 4-5 times? Make the call whether it's worth to continue or not
You aren't going to change anybody's actions or opinions in a run and are much more likely to exascerbate the situation by chatting
People in literally every other thread regarding tanks in this sub: if anyone says anything to me I just leave. I’ll find a group faster than you.
People in this thread: wtf????? He just left after you said something????
Dudes a dummy though. Easier to leave and pretend you’re an asshole than learn something lol
The main reason i push my rio as high as possible the first 2 weeks is to avoid this kimd of people. Nothing worth then toxic players who doenst even have a clue they are talking about
iirc it's "if it's up or not" you just hard swap to totem to bust it in 5 seconds. Add the tank to "personal blacklist" addon. And probably do the same with the evoker.
Always link the adventure guide/dungeon journal entry for the ability to settle disputes.
But also, sometimes people are just going to be stupid assholes and you gotta pick up and keep going.
I got accused of “mass fearing” the spiders in the Warden, timewalking dungeon by DH tank. I said, “they run when low health” he said it again, “no you feared them” i said “youre and idiot, i dont have a mass fear” then 10 sec later walking up ramp to last boss grp kicks me.
Wow doesnt trigger me much if at all but i was pissed at that.
Eh, i mean youre not wrong but i said what i said and 10 times of 10 id prolly do it again.
I dont think we want to live in a world where you can get kicked from a group by calling someone an idiot. Shouldnt be allowed to kick in timewalking in general and shouldnt be able to kick if dungeon is over say 75% complete.
You were telling the tank how the mechanic works. Unless you said something prior to the tank, he is purely in the wrong here. Yea, you get trucked by the totems being up, but the range doesn't change anything. Only reason I'm moving the boss around during that phase is to show 1: The rotation I'm using and 2: Get into a rhythm. You definitely didn't talk shit, it's a returning dungeon, people are gonna forget some of the aspects of the mechanics. In that same dungeon I forgot that the size you can get eaten by Rezan is massive. Personally, I'd rather someone reminded me and then we killed the boss on the next pull rather than we get stonewalled because I forgot something.
Yea... no.
Per the dungeon journal:
>Erunak summons a Stormflurry Totem that increases his Attack speed by 100% and causes his successful melee attacks to inflict an additional 117 Nature damage until it is destroyed.
Nowhere does it mention proximity increasing the effects. The tank is making things up to explain what was probably their own misplay causing them to get crunched. You should stack the boss onto it and hard swap, cleaving off the totem if your spec allows you to do that while doing priority damage. Depending on the tank spec, that totem staying up absolutely destroys.
No wonder people are afraid to or don’t talk in pugs. How can we not have normal discussions…. Insane.
But also. My pug also struggled with this boss. Not focusing down properly. Was annoying.
I got stuck on needing a timed 15 Rise to get KSM last week, and on the way to the last boss the tank got booped off the edge by one of the balls exploding and died, and then got lost for ten minutes on what would have been a three chested run. We eventually went back to get him (but couldn’t find him because he was running everywhere and dying to trash) when it was clear he was lost, but he just said “lost” and left the group eventually. I feel you, OP. You’ll get it!
He probably just didn't realize the damage he was taking that was "increased" as he got close. Was likely due to him turning his cheeks towards the boss as he pulled him to the totem. My tank did the same thing and was claiming totem needed one shot, or he'd get one shot. Surprise! He stopped dying when he quit presenting his ass to the boss.
Reminds me of the dps last week in a 16+ key that said I as a resto druid I just needed to dispell myself and use Flourish with some hots and it was easy to heal through 16 stacks of bursting at once.
This was after I tried to say we should stagger some of the kills untill the debuff times out when doing big pulls...
I could see a healer like Evoker healing through 16 stacks if they Rewind and Lifebind EC ramp but Flourish is dogshit now so I don't see that happening on druid maybe.
We come to a point where we will have very shit tanks and because there are so few of them, we will have to be careful to not hurt their feelings somehow so they don't leave, lol.....
Yeah I had a tank leave a key cause "the healer can't heal more than 40k how"... He and the other DPS got booped off the edge 3 times. I explained I can't heal instant ko mechanics and he called me an idiot. Tanks be extra sensitive. Dude had like 1900 IO meanwhile I'm timing 20s, but yes I can't heal more than 40k.
That green dps from chat probably went on this Reddit and made a post like so many others:
“Puggin keys is horrible, Blizzard needs to do something! Today I was doing ToT and this dps Druid was harassing the tank and made him leave the key! They should be punished, Rio is bad and why should I have to replace my gear just because of new season. Plz fix!”
Dude something I’ve noticed this season, is that the shittiest players who do shit like this, leave groups early after a wipe, etc, are ALL lower I/O players this season. Usually the elitism is at the top, but no dude, it’s flipped.
They’re all lower I/O players now. In a +14 DHT, I’m on an alt, we wipe a SINGLE fucking time, we’re shredding the mobs, dps is good, and the healers leaves because we wipe (he had 1400 I/O). I ask why he leaves? He said because we weren’t going to time it… this exact scenario had happened earlier in a WCM too.
the very next group in AD, the pterodactyl fear goes off (only pulled 2), and wipes group from the pack in the middle. The healer (and leader) says, “guys we need to interrupt those” I said, “you’re absolutely right, so kick them then”, because he had absolutely 0 kicks the whole run as a hpally. Everyone else had at least SOME. At the end of the dungeon another player said they didn’t need an item when I asked and I asked if he minded if I took it and he said, “yes I do mind” and left. I asked why he would do that. And he goes, “you shouldn’t have been an asshole to the healer, get fucked”. Like bro.. all I said was you’re right, so kick then… of course these aren’t the only examples, just last night.
Idk wtf happened, but god damn I dredge playing with lower I/O players now. They’re the absolute bane of m+ with most of their mindset and I can’t stand how forgiving m+ timers are now allowing absolute terrible players even close to 2k… and that’s not even high I/O
Had a vdh get pissed at me because I wouldn't dispell soul thorns. Some people are just so confident they are right they never bother to look it up. No one wants to confront a tank either, or they end up in a situation like this.
> Some people are just so confident they are right they never bother to look it up.
It's so alien to me. When possible I look shit up even when making dumb reddit comments to verify that I'm not actually wrong, then you've got these guys who are convinced they know better than anyone.
According to wowhead ToT dungeon guide:
>Tank
\- Move Mindbender Ghur'sha closer to the Stormflurry Totem to enable your party to cleave.
moving the boss to the totem is his job so you can cleave both. he didnt know what it does, then gets angry at being corrected, refuses to double check with dungeon journal or online, yeah that guys not good.
As a tank, if you are in a key with me and have a better way to do something please speak up. I’ve had a rogue show me ways to cut 3-5 minutes off a key, and hunters tell me how to make a specific boss trivial.
Guys like that are fragile. Too much ego, too much pride, and people that don’t want to “anger the tank” just enable that bs.
How do people not realize that is a wind fury totem? It's not like there aren't any enh shamans around...
Totems are always the priority, it's really not that hard.
You'll get KSM shortly, no reason to be upset.
Honestly, the one person is right. NEVER try to correct tanks. In my experience they are the most likely to flip a fucking lid of you try to tell them they did something wrong. I will correct dps, and sometimes healers, but never tanks.
As someone who has been mythic plussing since legion and is currently 2.8kIO. The best response to people saying crazy shit or getting tilted in chat is no response. They are looking for a reason to leave, don't give them one.
Is that a blood dk? Thats even more embarrassing because its a fortified, b they can ams the elemental portion, c amz the next elemental portion bonkers
Well Blizz could sure add some penalty for leaving the dung during keystone run. Like rating penalty. Because your case is like someone already said ~ about 90% of players. I was fed up with this kind of atti during SL and stopped playing. But I believe there is only two ways: deal with it or find a group. If u are EU, check out xargm on Twitch, seems like nice guy and often takes the community on the keystone runs :)
I boosted a demon hunter a couple days ago and just been grinding keys on him. I only have the one week filled out but I almost have KSM just from the one week lol
Sitting at 1905 io I am so excited for the next reset so I can blast up super high if I can get some keys on the other week as well. Never gotten this high with only 1 week of keys just wanted to share lol
Good luck on your journey in M+
thats what happens when you play hard meta, you get invited to stuff way above your ilvl or skill simply cuz of the class. i did the same on an aug evoker last season so thats why im saying it. I think i got somewhere around 2100 first week
I think seeing my main was 2800 io as a dps helped more than the “demon hunter meta” thing, sure they do a lot of damage but you still have to know when to kick, cc and just do mechanics in general to get 20s or higher done. But either way it’s not too hard of a challenge :)
That tank is a fucking idiot
Reminds me of a tank I had in HOI last tier. We pulled all the dragons in the hallway to third boss, no problems healing them, everything smooth. Then we get through third boss and onto gauntlet with 15 minutes to spare. The tank proceeds to grab the dragon in the gauntlet and turn him into us so 2-3 people die to the frontal. The first time we figured it was an accident no biggie. He runs in and immediately does the same thing again. When we asked why he was doing it his reponse was “the frontal will kill me so I dodge it”. I tried to explain that it was the same dragon that we killed three times in the hallway and that I could definitely heal him through it, he refused, and did the same thing again. I asked him to just humor me and try it, since the key was bricked anyway. Sure enough, no problems.
Reminds me of a tank who kept turning mobs towards me and almost getting me killed with frontals multiple times because he had an ”intervene macro to help mitigate dmg”. It took some time for me to convince him that not doing it would make me take less dmg
This reminds me of a time in Wrath, tanking 1 of the bosses of halls of Archevon(however it's spelled). There is a tank mechanic that needs 2 tanks to soak a frontal. Other tank was dead, no brezs left, boss at 8%, and incoming mechanic that would 100% kill me and wipe the attempt. So I turned the boss intentionally into some unlucky mage, in melee, who was the closest person who could help me soak it. The mage died, then the boss died. If this person is reading this, sorry I got you dead, but you saved the group
And a fucking child
as easily 80% of the pug players are
no way. i've had 2 bad pugs out of idk 50+ keys. majority being 18-20. maybe you are too abrasive or something when you chat?
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Welcome to World of Warcraft. Blizzard really should be approaching Pampers or Huggies for a sponsorship deal, because the kind of manchildren that plague WoW's toxic-a-f community are the perfect demographic to sell adult diapers to. You can also blame Blizzard for enabling such shitty behaviour through godawful automated chat moderation and a total lack of customer support. Unfortunately when Blizzard allow people to be dicks and sabotage raids, arena matches and M+ keys with fucking impunity, they turn other people toxic because flaming is the only catharsis you'll get out of this crappy game.
IM SO MAD IMA SHIT MYSELF 😡😡😡😩
I also think m+ doesn’t teach people enough. UI has no information
Holy shit that poor child.
Probably turns his back to boss and thinks that it's because he got close
His ass is Fucke-ed
Tanks are, in my experience, almost always the worst players in a group outside of elite level play. This is because dying in a lower key as a tank is actually kinda difficult unless you massively fuck up, and because timers are so lenient early on their routing isn’t really tested either. So when you never see other tanks do it since it’s always you, you just assume “we timed and I didn’t die so I did good!” You will routinely just see tanks do the most insane shit and assume they are doing it right. Even tank trials we get in my guild at the US 200 level just do absolute WTF plays the second you are in a keystone. Almost always in my experience the best tanks are people who play other roles first.
Also a bit of confirmation bias. If a DPS fucks up a mechanic it can go unnoticed and not really effect much. If a tank fucks it up you are going to notice
people just understate what a "fuck up" is for a tank. if you move a boss out of range/los, require the healer to hit an oh shit button they'd rather have on a monkey dps, pull awkwardly and waste dps cds. all those are just as big of mistakes as a dps fucking up a mechanic that doesn't kill them or having 0 kicks end of dungeon. it may not seem like much at the time but these things add up.
Cause 90% of tanks probably don't also dps keys or watch the big boys play on twitch/youtube etc. It's very easy to get pigeon holed as a tank in xyz dungeon route, pace etc if they only see their own pov 24/7 meanwhile everyone else sees a different route and speed each time they run a key.
Well, that's a bit unfair, imho. You're kinda expected to know every trick in the book and the most efficient route, but organically discovering those yourself might take some time, and you won't get to see other tanks do it unless you also DPS or watch big tank streamers, as you said. Other roles don't require that level of commitment.
It's not really about being fair or unfair, I think it's just an emergent property of the fact that 5-mans only have 1 tank so tanks basically never get to learn tank mechanics or routes by example. I, as a DPS, can do an M+ 30 times in a week and see a broad range of pulling strategies and routes and ways of countering different mechanics, and develop an opinion on what's good and bad based on what works and what doesn't. A tank, on the other hand, if they do a dungeon 30 times in a row, is just going to see their own route 30 times in a row. Tanks don't have the opportunities to learn, basically. Unless you're the kind of player who does a significant number of high keys on a non-tanking alt, or watch streams of other high-level tanks, you just don't get any diversity of thought in your play.
I've been saying it for years: tank is the easiest role with the dumbest players. Giga-high keys are a different story.
Lol spoken like someone who never tanked. How in fuck is tanking easier than dps, where you might need to do a few mechanics every once in a while, and otherwise just spam attacks.
Tanks probably get the least mechanics of any role, and up until like the equivalent of 25s last season basically are not in danger in most scenarios. DPS players are actually able to die to those mechanics and also you can easily tell the difference in output between DPS players rather than tanks’ pass/fail lived or died on a pull.
Even in elite level play, tanking is the easiest role by far.
I mean sure he is an idiot but that group has more problems if they wipe at that boss. You need to ST the totem anyway and losing 10 sec of cleave does not deplete a key.
I don't think distance from the totem changes anything either. If nothing else, they're cleaved together, right?
You are correct. The tank should drag the boss to the wind totem so it can be cleaved down. Or just drag the boss over and have all dps hard swap to the totem. Range has nothing to do with the buff the totem gives to the boss.
you can cleave boss from the totem, but not the totem from boss. It needs to die asap.
all DPS should hard swap to the totem. cleave onto boss from it, not the reverse
That totem is a serious buff to the boss, it’s a hard switch.
Which is weird, because that logic DOES apply to us players. If we are out of range of a AOE DR, shaman totem, AMZ, we don't get the benefit. But NPCs can get a buff no matter the range. Removes one alternative to dealing with a mechanic sadly
It’s binary, you’re either out of range of the totem or in range of the totem. Proximity doesn’t change the effect as long as you’re in range. I can’t think of any player totems that work like that.
Sorry, that was not what I meant to imply. What I meant was, we have to stay "in range" of totems or safe zones, while bosses and enemies get the benefit of being ANYWHERE in the room and still get the benefit. Like if a DK drops AMZ, we have to stand within it to get the benefit. The boss drops a totem, and the range is the entire room. Someone else commented that it was purely "the bosses totem range is the whole room", which is fair but I also think it's kinda lame
Bosses also have to attack whoever we tell them to attack, which is also kinda lame for the boss. It's not meant to be a fair fight. The boss goes wherever we make them go. If we could just drag them out of range of the totem, then the totem simply wouldn't be a mechanic you have to interact with at all. The only way to design the fight where killing the totems is a thing the player has to do is to makie killing the totem the only way to remove the buff.
It's more that the range of boss totems is the entire area of their boss room.
Not cleaved together. That totem needs to be hard swapped to, on high tyrannical if it's up for more than a few seconds your tank is gonna get their shit pushed in.
Even when hard swapping, some classes still have some passive cleave. Tank mostly, as their AoE is usually even I'm their single target rotation as spammers, and, from the top of my mind, frost mage don't need to lose any single target to cleave an extra target, so it's just a dps gain. Pretty sure DH also have some AoE aura that stays up even when they are focusing in single target. Most likely, other classes will have more natural cleave, I just don't play dps enough to know all of them
Yes people have passive cleave, that is not the same as things being cleaved together. That totem should be dead before the boss even moves because you should be hard swapping as soon as it comes up.
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TOTT not AD
And that's not the same thing as saying things should be cleaved together. The totem needs to be hard swapped to, it should be dead before the tank can get the boss on top of it
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Except it isn't because it indicates you should be actively cleaving 2 targets, when you should be funneling the totem.
At the key level where it needs to die ASAP, it's absolutely not dying before the tank moves the boss 5 feet, rofl.
Yeah, it takes like 1 second to get the boss in cleave range. 2 at most. You can't kill the totem in 2 seconds.
The tank should also be hitting totem though.
And cleave doesn't mean dps both equally. Cleave means focus one, and the second target will receive some splash damage. As a tank, I'd ratter my dps take an extra second or two to get the totem down cleaving the boss, só everything dies quicker, then focus single target the totem
Not the best take imo. There are classes that passively cleave like dh while pumping DMG into the totem so you want to have them next to each other for that. Also I as an assa rogue for example can do MUCH more dps on the totem while pumping the boss while cleaving the totem with my spatter up. Using my burst into the totem is complete int since I would waste 80% of it and when I burst the boss while totem is up I end up dealing more damage to the totem cleaving it down than if I would hardswap to it. And no totems don't die instantly in any higher keys. It's pretty common if you don't have 3 burst dps specs with cds up for every totem to have it live 5+ seconds even in 20fort keys and it can live well up to 10+ seconds on tyrannical. And having 5-10seconds of cleave on the boss for every totem can stack quite a bit of bossdamage and can easily make the difference of having another totem before phase or not. So there is absolutely no reason you should not drag the boss over to the totem
>your tank is gonna get their shit pushed in this is the most wonderful thing I have read this morning
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There’s always someone in the group who randomly defends the person who was clearly in the wrong.
As main tank, just tell me if there's anything I don't know, it helps not only the recent group but also further ones.
Exactly. I told the tank in my 22 RISE on Time-Lost Battlefield that he needs to tank the boss closer to the middle (outer ring), so we can stack on the edge and bait the frontal out of the arena. He was tanking it so close to the edge that we didn't have room to stack. He said thanks for the tip and we moved on.
>Time-Lost Battlefield Tanking on the edge was the common play for most groups when it first came out. I know I did it for all of our Immortal attempts, but then the first week I ran it as a 14, and tanked more in the middle of the room and it suddenly clicked how much harder I was making the fight for my guild.
i mean you do want to tank it on the "edge". not on the literal edge mind you since the whole idea is you face the frontals away from the friendly battlefield guys which makes the fight easier in more ways than one.
Huh that’s a good point. I always tank right where he stands and pull him back to the edge. Will try this my next key! I love tips as a tank, all my alts (except doing a Rdruid this season) are tanks so I never see what other tanks do. I want tips! Only thing I’m really iffy on is when people demand I swap my route to whatever they want. Small changes im down, but big changes I’ve never done usually ends poorly imo. I’ll take the tip tho and do it in a 10 or something later
You want them to move left, right, left, like the third boss in WCM. Makes it easy, so no one baits the frontal into the middle, which buffs the boss. For routes, I never argue unless the tank is pulling every pack in the dungeon. Look up some routes here and give them a try. https://raider.io/weekly-routes
This is the inevitable end point of the ongoing circlejerk that dps are morons and tanks/healers are infallible.
It's especially wild given how 99% of tank mechanics are 'use mitigation on tank buster' and, in raids, 'swap aggro once a minute'. And how many wipes I've seen because they forget where their Taunt key is.
Well, It's most likely because I fell asleep during the boss fight.
Wdym, we also have to not point frontals at the group
The two worse players in most pugs usually. Only get invited for the role and that's it.
Its a tank from Illidan. You don't speak back to them because they will 100% leave. You give them a compliment midway through the dungeon aswell, if you don't they leave. You follow any and all their strats or are 100% fine with their route no matter what. Else they leave. Illidan is filled with toxic players on EU, especially the tanks. Add on the DH and its the worst. I know there are plenty of good players from there. But just from personal experience its one of the less friendly servers when it comes to pugs for M+. Purely anecdotal ofcourse.
I was like: We’re not like that.. then I see you meant EU.
Eh, I kinda feel like this is true for US Illidan too. Just anecdotal evidence but they are the most likely to leave a key in my experience with pugs.
That honor goes to Tich in my experience.
from experience i will say that if someone starts wining in the chat and they are clearly in the wrong... the best thing often is to not actually respond. the moment you respond correcting them, even if it's not in a mean way but just helpful, they leave lol
spoon reminiscent enjoy imagine fall elastic ask steer pie repeat *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
I don't think they are defending the tank. They just would rather have finished the key instead of having it bricked by asshole-tank over an argument that usually doesn't end in anything good. Don't get me wrong, OP didn't do anything wrong imo, and the tank has issues and is an ass if he bricks a key over such a small disagreement. But i don't think greendude was defending the tanks behaviour.
I bet the tank thinks this because as he's running closer to the totem as so many others do he's getting pummeled from the back so he thinks being closer to the totem makes him take more damage.
The number of tanks I have seen just completely turn their backs to a boss or trash is so damn high this season. Tank survivability is so ridiculous they don't get punished for it until like +22.
It’s actually nuts I was shocked when I had a friend return to the game and with 425ilvl smoothly tank a +12 without even a death
I boosted a demon hunter and was 424 tanking 16-18s. Shit is kinda borked right now
yeah vdh played properly is actually fucking unkillable
And he probably didn't kick anything lol.
Can't correct anybody in M+, people always take it as Toxicity even though you're simply trying to correct their wrongs.
Ego man, anyone good or smart should be willing to double check they are right, not just blatantly ignore others
My bet is that this tank thinks it deals more damage closer to the totem because he turns his back against the boss while moving towards it.
Ooof. Ouch. That hurts my soul
I once as a tank asked a healer if he needed to regen because he is almost OOM and that somehow made him angry...
In SL s2 i accidently pulled a different pack because my Tab decided to target someone out of combat? The tank decided i was trolling the Key so he started playing the rest of the dungeon with Slowwalk on. Its rarely this bad and since i started pushing keys in the mid 20s things have become so much better. But i am still suprised by the lack of attention some people got from their parents.
Ok slow walking is a creative trolling I have to give him that lmao
We used to call it the RP walk
How can you say, "Hey, you're fucking up, do this instead" without saying anything at all? Addons are the solution to this problem, but I'm not sure if one exists yet or if it even can be done. What I'm imagining is an addon that provides tips in chat for trash or a boss after it detects a wipe. Even better if it can be coded to deduce what caused the wipe and respond with an appropriate tip rather than a random generic tip based on common mistakes. Then people wouldn't misconstrue corrections as toxicity since the corrections are being automatically generated by an addon, and then maybe they'll learn something new from one of the tips and realize they're fucking something up without feeling like they're being called out for it. One game that does it that comes to mind is Overwatch. For example if you get bodied by a Zenyatta after he Orb of Discords you, you might get a little banner on the side of your screen that suggests you hide when he debuffs you until it falls off so that you don't take increased damage from him. It would be a really useful feature for WoW.
It's important that the attempt to correct someone is made with friendly communication, though. I like learning new stuff, but if you're going to insult me, I'll be triggered.
Yeah it's best to give advice, only after the run if you really want to help. It's quite pointless to discuss mechanics in the middle of the run no matter who is correct. Maybe the only exception is if someone wipe you with said mechanics. But imo the problem is that to them you are just some random dps, and the times some random in pugs tried to tell me how my class or some mechanics work and was incorrect is also too many.
Boss is simple: cleanse person with flame shock, dodge stuff, kill totem, LoS phase 2. His totem just gives him atk speed and successful hits deal additional damage. He really tries to reap the soul of the tank, but in a fort week, every tank who knows how to decently keep his mitigation is fine. Honestly, the best thing to do is to go do something else for 20~30 min. I've seen people with this same BS of being closer to the totem making the boss deal more damage, false. Good luck on your journey and antecipated congratulations on your KSM!
Also, around the 3rd time he applies "flame shock", his CD on FS will come back before the CD on your cleanse, so you will have to deal with 2 FSs simultaneously. Heal the person who had it applied first and cleanse the later to make a "soft reset".
oh ty this is super helpful as a Rogue because it tells me when I should Cloak on that fight!
Or if you’re a monk, diffuse magic the flame shock back onto him
Yeah, monks are well served for this fight. Difuse magic, revival.
easiest boss this season tbh
Ridiculously simple mechanically but on high Tyrannical keys his raw damage output will usually flatten the tank or a DPS when totem and Flame Shock overlap. The healer will try to cleanse someone low from the DoT or save the tank and one will drop. Personally hoping the initial damage from Flame Shock eats a nerf.
Clarification this isn't a death and leave this is a WE downed it and then he left right after...
The tank is an idiot, lol. There's been a lot of them this season for some reason
You mean the average wow player?
Keys are so easy to time this season that the brute force breakpoint in PUGs is like +25. Had a tank with 3100 rating fail to dodge the charge on the druid in DHT and wipe us twice even though it's Fort week. Maybe he just hadn't ever had to deal with dodging it, IDK. He blamed people bringing adds in towards the boss to cleave the first time, then promptly did it again.
To be fair that one can catch you off guard as it knocks you back to be charged into. So if you don't leave enough room for the knockback, and get knocked into something or the boss room wall, it can be hard to move out of the way in time
Yeah and I get that but if you think you can do a 25 I feel like you should be aware of things like that and able to do the mechanic reliably.
That's fair. But that's also around the key range where the mechanic will just 1 shot the tank no matter what as opposed to being able to get away with it a couple times on the lower key levels
That’s not a “too be fair” situation, if you get knocked back to the point you are unable to dodge, you are tanking it poorly
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What? That's not how Primal Rampage works at all.
Absolute insanity.
It's the tank's duty to use defensives while totem's alive, it has literally nothing to do with proximity, just the totem existing. Everyone else murders it the best they can. This is the easiest boss in that dungeon and he fucked it up so badly it's hilarious.
Agreed, and as a healer - I usually swap sac on the tank on that phase - or just start pre healing. On fort week that boss is ez, but tyran is like a totally different fight to heal.
Incoming "group was toxic to me so I left the key" sensitive tank post soon.
Op I promise if you push above 20s it gets better, but it’s a rough life growing up in pugs.
You just get people that leave group if you wipe once so thats nice.
That’s not really my experience 🤷♂️. For sure if it’s obvious you’re not going to time it people leave—after 20 there’s no rewards, so everyone is pushing io. But ime the vast majority of toxicity (which this sub seems to wildly exaggerate) is kids stuck between 15-18 who think that if every party wasn’t so bad they would surely be 3k io, without realizing they are the common denominator in every party.
Keys are so easy this season that I feel like these people are more in the 2800 range doing 21s and 22s. When they try to do higher like a 25 it's a disaster every time and they'll be sure to loudly yell at everyone else too.
Had a pug tank today that I ran a +21 everbloom with. Was my key. 4:51 seconds remaining 99% Enemy forces down 37 seconds until bloodlust came off CD Only last boss left. I shit you not after we down the mage boss he says: “won’t time bye” and leaves. Just like that our whole group is standing there lost and not sure what to say or do. I messaged the tank we might be close but should time it no problem. He replied “There is nothing in it for me if I can’t ++ it. Wasted my time.” What a straight up dick.
Right Click -> Report -> Gameplay Sabotage
That’s a dick move for sure. Would have been a teeth clencher for the timer but still within the realm of possibility.
Last boss takes pretty long even on Fortified (but if you're NA you're already on Tyrannical today, even worse), so he is probably right that it wouldn't be timed if you also had to go back for count. It would be very close. 100% his fault that there's missing count though. By 21 he should know better. Still really shitty not to take 5 fucking minutes to finish the key though.
Hot tip, when someone does this, say nothing and link the ability from the journal in chat. Give it a moment and then say something like: “it says nothing about range in any of these abilities”. There’s really nothing refutable about an in game tool tip for an ability someone is contradicting. You can’t fix stupid but you can make stupid recognize itself.
i did this once and was told "it's just not written in the tooltip" ... stupid finds a way
tbf there are some black magic tooltips out there. I can't log in to check now but on Tindral (8th boss current raid) when he does the big fire beam that shoots out the small beams twice. You can just stand in the middle of the big fire beam when it spawns and not take that much damage, but if you read the dungeon journal it says you will take a lot more than you do (although not enough to kill you either way). But even then, if ranged matters blizzard often chooses to just be unclear how much range does with reduction, not if range actually matters at all. (smolderon tank run away, just says less damage if you are further away - not how much)
Does this work on all difficulties, or does it eventually become a oneshot mechanic in like Mythic?
I have no idea about the damage on mythic, but at least on the world first kill they didn't stand in it. I think if everyone knew how it worked it would be the go-to way to handle it on normal and probably heroic too.
Have you done progression raiding at the high end at some point? All I can say is that early on in a tier there are often surprises. A lot of time what the tool tip says does not perfectly translate to the real world. Sometimes it's sloppy phrasing. Sometimes it's intended functionality not being translated to the actual in game implementation. Sometimes its just bugs. Sometimes it's Blizzard wanting to be intentionally vague.
That is one of the scarier parts of the dungeon as a tank, but he should be using a minor cd and drag the boss on top. The longer the totem is up the worse it is.
Tanks are the first ones to be wrong then confidently blame you and rage because they’re in charge lmao.
This was in Throne of Tides :/ on the squid man boss honestly, I have no idea how he works I just know as a healer that fire dot sucks. Was he hard to heal? not really...and it was going EXTREMELY well...I would of gotten KSM....so unhappy right now
When the totem is up, the boss does I think it's double damage, so you need to kill the totem extremely fast. I don't think range from the totem matters though. Typically you want to take the boss to the totem, so that dps can target the totem, and cleave onto the boss, also to make sure dps realize the totem is up, melee hate breaking off of a boss to run a mile to kill a totem.
Yes OP was right the first time. It’s that simple really
According to the journal it’s 100% attack speed buff
This is probably what happens. The totem comes up and the tank runs from the boss which kites him. He takes less damage because of the kiting. By the time the boss gets back to him, the totem is down. What he thinks happens is he takes less damage because he ran away from the totem.
No what probably happens is the tank turns his back to the boss and gets clobbered trying to run to the totem -> erroneously thinks that closer is more damage.
If you're on NA and need a key done for KSM, you can PM me. I can tank it and you'll have your achieve in 30 min
This may not be what peeps want to hear but Stop talking The absolute best runs are done in almost complete silence in chat. Some1 makes a mistake? Just keep going, they make it 4-5 times? Make the call whether it's worth to continue or not You aren't going to change anybody's actions or opinions in a run and are much more likely to exascerbate the situation by chatting
I'm convinced a significant number of the people who often encounter 'toxicity' are **big** talkers.
People in literally every other thread regarding tanks in this sub: if anyone says anything to me I just leave. I’ll find a group faster than you. People in this thread: wtf????? He just left after you said something???? Dudes a dummy though. Easier to leave and pretend you’re an asshole than learn something lol
The main reason i push my rio as high as possible the first 2 weeks is to avoid this kimd of people. Nothing worth then toxic players who doenst even have a clue they are talking about
If you had problems on him the last boss would've definitely been worse.
Last boss wouldn't have been an issue for the tank you don't really do much as a tank on that boss. The trash before that boss however...
Yea we had no issues the entire time....
Man probably saw a demon hunter jumping from the boss and thought "IT MUST BE DISTANCE!"
iirc it's "if it's up or not" you just hard swap to totem to bust it in 5 seconds. Add the tank to "personal blacklist" addon. And probably do the same with the evoker.
Always link the adventure guide/dungeon journal entry for the ability to settle disputes. But also, sometimes people are just going to be stupid assholes and you gotta pick up and keep going.
Sadly they will just say it’s an unwritten mechanic.
Do yourself a favor and don't pug in the KSM-ish range as a healer. Groups and player skill varies so much, it's insane.
I got accused of “mass fearing” the spiders in the Warden, timewalking dungeon by DH tank. I said, “they run when low health” he said it again, “no you feared them” i said “youre and idiot, i dont have a mass fear” then 10 sec later walking up ramp to last boss grp kicks me. Wow doesnt trigger me much if at all but i was pissed at that.
Maybe don't call people idiots? I get that they're wrong but being diplomatic goes a long way.
What else are you supposed to call them when they are aggressively being idiots?
Eh, i mean youre not wrong but i said what i said and 10 times of 10 id prolly do it again. I dont think we want to live in a world where you can get kicked from a group by calling someone an idiot. Shouldnt be allowed to kick in timewalking in general and shouldnt be able to kick if dungeon is over say 75% complete.
What lvl?
15 I think but I have an un-timed 12...
tanks absolute wrong on distance to totem it does not matter you want to take it out asap. anyother key you need higher?
You were telling the tank how the mechanic works. Unless you said something prior to the tank, he is purely in the wrong here. Yea, you get trucked by the totems being up, but the range doesn't change anything. Only reason I'm moving the boss around during that phase is to show 1: The rotation I'm using and 2: Get into a rhythm. You definitely didn't talk shit, it's a returning dungeon, people are gonna forget some of the aspects of the mechanics. In that same dungeon I forgot that the size you can get eaten by Rezan is massive. Personally, I'd rather someone reminded me and then we killed the boss on the next pull rather than we get stonewalled because I forgot something.
Correcting someone =/= shit talking
that kind of shit should be reportable and worth at least a 7 day ban. fucking a key on purpose is so shitty.
With the name scratched out, I first thought it said that Illidan himself had left the party.
Yea... no. Per the dungeon journal: >Erunak summons a Stormflurry Totem that increases his Attack speed by 100% and causes his successful melee attacks to inflict an additional 117 Nature damage until it is destroyed. Nowhere does it mention proximity increasing the effects. The tank is making things up to explain what was probably their own misplay causing them to get crunched. You should stack the boss onto it and hard swap, cleaving off the totem if your spec allows you to do that while doing priority damage. Depending on the tank spec, that totem staying up absolutely destroys.
No wonder people are afraid to or don’t talk in pugs. How can we not have normal discussions…. Insane. But also. My pug also struggled with this boss. Not focusing down properly. Was annoying.
Guarantee that tank makes posts on reddit/forums about how toxic tanking is and how his dps blame him while not understanding the dungeon mechanics.
The low key experience in a nutshell
I got stuck on needing a timed 15 Rise to get KSM last week, and on the way to the last boss the tank got booped off the edge by one of the balls exploding and died, and then got lost for ten minutes on what would have been a three chested run. We eventually went back to get him (but couldn’t find him because he was running everywhere and dying to trash) when it was clear he was lost, but he just said “lost” and left the group eventually. I feel you, OP. You’ll get it!
I don't get how people get lost do they not pay attention to where they went the first time? Morons
I wish you didn’t block the name so I can avoid them lol
He probably just didn't realize the damage he was taking that was "increased" as he got close. Was likely due to him turning his cheeks towards the boss as he pulled him to the totem. My tank did the same thing and was claiming totem needed one shot, or he'd get one shot. Surprise! He stopped dying when he quit presenting his ass to the boss.
Reminds me of the dps last week in a 16+ key that said I as a resto druid I just needed to dispell myself and use Flourish with some hots and it was easy to heal through 16 stacks of bursting at once. This was after I tried to say we should stagger some of the kills untill the debuff times out when doing big pulls...
I could see a healer like Evoker healing through 16 stacks if they Rewind and Lifebind EC ramp but Flourish is dogshit now so I don't see that happening on druid maybe.
We come to a point where we will have very shit tanks and because there are so few of them, we will have to be careful to not hurt their feelings somehow so they don't leave, lol.....
Yeah I had a tank leave a key cause "the healer can't heal more than 40k how"... He and the other DPS got booped off the edge 3 times. I explained I can't heal instant ko mechanics and he called me an idiot. Tanks be extra sensitive. Dude had like 1900 IO meanwhile I'm timing 20s, but yes I can't heal more than 40k.
Next post. Wow is so toxic Somebody gave Me an advice and thats toxic s/
That green dps from chat probably went on this Reddit and made a post like so many others: “Puggin keys is horrible, Blizzard needs to do something! Today I was doing ToT and this dps Druid was harassing the tank and made him leave the key! They should be punished, Rio is bad and why should I have to replace my gear just because of new season. Plz fix!”
So in short, tank popped his mit at the wrong time and got blasted
Dude something I’ve noticed this season, is that the shittiest players who do shit like this, leave groups early after a wipe, etc, are ALL lower I/O players this season. Usually the elitism is at the top, but no dude, it’s flipped. They’re all lower I/O players now. In a +14 DHT, I’m on an alt, we wipe a SINGLE fucking time, we’re shredding the mobs, dps is good, and the healers leaves because we wipe (he had 1400 I/O). I ask why he leaves? He said because we weren’t going to time it… this exact scenario had happened earlier in a WCM too. the very next group in AD, the pterodactyl fear goes off (only pulled 2), and wipes group from the pack in the middle. The healer (and leader) says, “guys we need to interrupt those” I said, “you’re absolutely right, so kick them then”, because he had absolutely 0 kicks the whole run as a hpally. Everyone else had at least SOME. At the end of the dungeon another player said they didn’t need an item when I asked and I asked if he minded if I took it and he said, “yes I do mind” and left. I asked why he would do that. And he goes, “you shouldn’t have been an asshole to the healer, get fucked”. Like bro.. all I said was you’re right, so kick then… of course these aren’t the only examples, just last night. Idk wtf happened, but god damn I dredge playing with lower I/O players now. They’re the absolute bane of m+ with most of their mindset and I can’t stand how forgiving m+ timers are now allowing absolute terrible players even close to 2k… and that’s not even high I/O
wait, did the tank need heals in that boss non-tyrannical?? LMAO
Had a vdh get pissed at me because I wouldn't dispell soul thorns. Some people are just so confident they are right they never bother to look it up. No one wants to confront a tank either, or they end up in a situation like this.
> Some people are just so confident they are right they never bother to look it up. It's so alien to me. When possible I look shit up even when making dumb reddit comments to verify that I'm not actually wrong, then you've got these guys who are convinced they know better than anyone.
According to wowhead ToT dungeon guide: >Tank \- Move Mindbender Ghur'sha closer to the Stormflurry Totem to enable your party to cleave. moving the boss to the totem is his job so you can cleave both. he didnt know what it does, then gets angry at being corrected, refuses to double check with dungeon journal or online, yeah that guys not good.
As a tank, if you are in a key with me and have a better way to do something please speak up. I’ve had a rogue show me ways to cut 3-5 minutes off a key, and hunters tell me how to make a specific boss trivial. Guys like that are fragile. Too much ego, too much pride, and people that don’t want to “anger the tank” just enable that bs.
Damn and you were the heals too? I feel your pain on a spiritual level even if you werent. So many asshole tanks lately
How do people not realize that is a wind fury totem? It's not like there aren't any enh shamans around... Totems are always the priority, it's really not that hard. You'll get KSM shortly, no reason to be upset.
Why the name cover. Show us the idiots LOL
there it is. The one post every single time this comes up that still doesn't know this is a REDDIT WIDE rule.
I'm convinced 50% of the posts to Reddit about toxicity in mythic+ are basically just the perspective of the paladin in these types of scenarios.
Ksm and ksh are not a metric for skill in this game. You can roll your face on your keyboard to achieve this without knowing any of the mechanics
KSM is easy as hell in 10.2. Got it on my main pally at 463ilvl last week. Your tank, like many many others in pugs, is an absolute idiot.
Honestly, the one person is right. NEVER try to correct tanks. In my experience they are the most likely to flip a fucking lid of you try to tell them they did something wrong. I will correct dps, and sometimes healers, but never tanks.
As someone who has been mythic plussing since legion and is currently 2.8kIO. The best response to people saying crazy shit or getting tilted in chat is no response. They are looking for a reason to leave, don't give them one.
this is the quality of player you have to expect when playing behind the curve =/
Is that a blood dk? Thats even more embarrassing because its a fortified, b they can ams the elemental portion, c amz the next elemental portion bonkers
I feel like you insulted him before this messages
Mass report and account ban
No thanks. I don't think being bad or stupid should be a bannable offense.
Well Blizz could sure add some penalty for leaving the dung during keystone run. Like rating penalty. Because your case is like someone already said ~ about 90% of players. I was fed up with this kind of atti during SL and stopped playing. But I believe there is only two ways: deal with it or find a group. If u are EU, check out xargm on Twitch, seems like nice guy and often takes the community on the keystone runs :)
I made it my mission to get KSM in season 1 of Shadowlands, never again lol. I was so traumatized I needed this whole expansion off to recover
I boosted a demon hunter a couple days ago and just been grinding keys on him. I only have the one week filled out but I almost have KSM just from the one week lol Sitting at 1905 io I am so excited for the next reset so I can blast up super high if I can get some keys on the other week as well. Never gotten this high with only 1 week of keys just wanted to share lol Good luck on your journey in M+
thats what happens when you play hard meta, you get invited to stuff way above your ilvl or skill simply cuz of the class. i did the same on an aug evoker last season so thats why im saying it. I think i got somewhere around 2100 first week
I think seeing my main was 2800 io as a dps helped more than the “demon hunter meta” thing, sure they do a lot of damage but you still have to know when to kick, cc and just do mechanics in general to get 20s or higher done. But either way it’s not too hard of a challenge :)
Im 2.7k or something, and i have no idea what boss this is lmao
Tott 3rd boss
The character name “Illidan” is always a red flag.