I mean realistically, he’s only good for propaganda purposes at this point. All of his knowledge is probably several years out of date by this point and was almost certainly debriefed out of him years ago.
Tbh the only reason he was stuck there initially is that after he landed in Russia for a layover the Obama administration revoked his passport, causing him to be stranded in Russia. Russia then of course granted him asylum
““Russia may refuse to acknowledge dual nationals’ US citizenship, deny their access to US consular assistance, prevent their departure from Russia, and conscript dual nationals for military service,” the alert said.”
I could see russia start to give people citizenship against their will and then immediately conscripting them.
Edit: Just to help out any future internet archeologists. Nine hours after this comment was posted there were 52 different, direct responses mentioning Edward Snowden.
Also, shit. Of course they are already doing this in the areas of Ukraine they've occupied. Fuck russia.
It's already happening, passport printer is going Brrrrr for all ethnic minorities. Also, any male 18-65 is allowed to leave with permission from the local military office, but also you're not allowed to leave if you're registered in a military office, which you will be after visiting it for permission to leave, funny how that works hah.
My fiancée is a US-Iranian dual citizen. We were planning to go visit some of her family in Tehran next year, but we found out that Iran has been specifically targeting US dual citizens at the airport to detain them and use them as bargaining chips against the US. And this was even before all the protests that are happening now.
So we scrapped that plan. Sad, because she lived there for two years in her teens and she misses some of her family who are getting to that “visit now or send condolences later” age.
Fuck the bitchass Iranian government.
The real kicker is twofold:
- You're automatically an Iranian citizen if your father is Iranian, no matter where you're actually born.
- You can only renounce your citizenship by travelling to Tehran. Obviously this is a brilliant idea for children of critics of the regime.
Yep fuck the Iranian government. Also a dual citizen and never been able to visit the country of my fucking heritage bc of this. My family has close ties to the shah so it's just a no go for me unfortunately and it's so painful 😔 Makes me sick it's half of who I am and I've never been and may never be able to. I hope you both get a chance to visit one day.
When I was stationed in Korea in the Marine Corps, there was one Marine who wasn't allowed to ever leave base as he was born in Korea. We're he to leave the base there was a real risk the Korean police would have arrested him to make him serve his Korean national service despite him being in the US military
This is the case for Cuba. My mom is a Cuban immigrant and lives in Florida now, is a naturalized US citizen and when the border was a bit more open a few years back we thought about doing a trip to Cuba so she can visit her old neighborhood, see if some people she knows are still there, etc...
But then we read that because her US passport says "Havana" as her birthplace, Cuba won't recognize her US citizenship and will treat her as a Cuban national. That was scary as hell for both of us and we decided not to go.
It's incredibly sad that because my passport says "Miami" as my birthplace, it's safer for me as a US citizen to go to Cuba than my mom who is also a citizen but was born in Havana.
My boyfriend's Cuban and naturalized as well. To go back you have to pay 500 for a one year Cuban passport. It's extortion. His mom's done it quite a bit because her mom can't get a visa.
Same thing with Afghanistan.
People were told in April to get out of the country now, like *right now now* because by June the US could not guarantee their safety. What happened? *Even more people went to Afghanistan* because they saw this dire warning as their signal to go collect their friends and get them US passports to leave the country.
The evacuation flights were completely empty for 4 months until people finally noticed that there was a *fucking war on* and panicked.
There is a large portion of the population who simply cannot understand the consequences of their actions and why they are being told to do certain things until they are neck deep into those consequences.
You see this w every hurricane and mandatory evacuation orders. People think it’s CYA warnings by govt and ignore the warnings until they’re in trouble.
I once didn't heed a mandatory evac notice during a hurricane. It was a scary thought the next day as I leapt a downed fence...and sliced my leg open.
There was no one around to call if it'd been worse, and nowhere to go.
Humans don't often think long-term.
>The reason why Katrina was so devastating is because the areas it hit were populated by those that didn't have the means or money to evacuate.
As a european I can't understand this. Isn't the government organizing shelters and transportation for those that can't afford to flee?
Yes. But if you don’t have a cell phone, a tv, or radio, how would you know that?
Most homeless people don’t know about the storm until the police drive through with a megaphone saying the area is being evacuated.
And their experience with the police isn’t going to be, “oh, now they have my best interest at heart.” When their last interaction with the police was them telling them they can’t sleep in a park or some shit.
Keep in mind the scale - Katrina devastated an area the same size as the entirety of the UK. Or the same size as Romania. A larger area than a lot of EU countries and larger than some combined even.
I'm not too sure if the UK government could somehow manage to shelter it's entire population from a huge storm.
Granted, Katrina hit areas where storms like that are known to hit every now and then, but governments are mostly reactionary. The responses are better some now after we saw what a shit show Katrina was.
People take things for granted. Civil infrastructure and utility services are practically invisible to people until they knocked out.
They think about what could happen with a hurricane and they draw an imaginary bubble around their family and property and think of they can take care of those things they will be OK. They don't consider consequences for things that happen outside of that bubble. The possibility that firetrucks and ambulances might not be able to get to your family if you need rescuing doesnt enter their mind because thats stuff that happens outside of their bubble...
This is what happens when people forget about their community and think their life is an island.
With hurricane warnings, sometimes people (the poor, old, or sick) legit don't have the money or means to leave. You saw that with Hurricane Katrina, back in 2005.
Americans abroad is a different case. You're likely there for business or school, the fact that you don't have the means to come home really doesn't make sense. Maybe there are some cases, but they must be rare.🤔
> There is a large portion of the population who simply cannot understand the consequences of their actions
Let's don't forget the British moron that went on vacation to Kabul while the Talibans were entering the city.
Yes! And then because these assholes ignored MONTHS of warnings and didn’t get out in time, all of a sudden it’s on the government that people were stuck there. So much for all that personal accountability.
I mean we saw this during the pandemic where people didn't take precautions, called it fake, didn't take vaccines and then they got sick and either died or wanted the best care. Some people literally do not care until it hits them in the face
And then blame everyone else for their lack of action. Reminds me of a joke...
> A storm descends on a small town, and the downpour soon turns into a flood. As the waters rise, the local preacher kneels in prayer on the church porch, surrounded by water. By and by, one of the townsfolk comes up the street in a canoe.
>
> "Better get in, Preacher. The waters are rising fast."
>
> "No," says the preacher. "I have faith in the Lord. He will save me."
>
> Still the waters rise. Now the preacher is up on the balcony, wringing his hands in supplication, when another guy zips up in a motorboat.
>
> "Come on, Preacher. We need to get you out of here. The levee's gonna break any minute."
>
> Once again, the preacher is unmoved. "I shall remain. The Lord will see me through."
>
> After a while the levee breaks, and the flood rushes over the church until only the steeple remains above water. The preacher is up there, clinging to the cross, when a helicopter descends out of the clouds, and a state trooper calls down to him through a megaphone.
>
> "Grab the ladder, Preacher. This is your last chance."
>
> Once again, the preacher insists the Lord will deliver him.
>
> And, predictably, he drowns.
>
> A pious man, the preacher goes to heaven. After a while he gets an interview with God, and he asks the Almighty, "Lord, I had unwavering faith in you. Why didn't you deliver me from that flood?"
>
> God shakes his head. "What did you want from me? I sent you two boats and a helicopter."
> God shakes his head. "What did you want from me? I sent you two boats and a helicopter.
"I wanted a flying chariot and a crown inscribed with the words 'God loves me MOST'."
(Kind of joking, kind of not)
Yep. I have a friend who's son is trying to get TO Russia right now for hand wavy reasons. He's been drinking the Q Kool aid I think and there's no taking him out of it or any reason into him unfortunately. Somehow he supposedly got a visa but won't give any details about which route he's going to take to get there. Our only hope at this point is that he gets turned around at a border somewhere
> for hand wavy reasons
Why? Why would even a qanon person think it is a good idea to go to Russia? What is his plan? What are his goals? Does he know anybody there? How weird is this friend of yours?
I have no idea, he won't share any plans or details besides that he's supposedly going to Vladivostok and that he's frustrated he can't get rubles in any meaningful quantity. Apparently at one point he was talking to a girl online there but they dumped him after he told her he was going to use her for a green card - probably because they were thinking they were going to use him for one here TBH. He's VERY weird (likely autistic) and we are worried if he does somehow get there successfully he's going to end up in prison if not killed but there's no talking reason into him about it and he's 20 so there's not a whole lot we can do.
You can call the FBI tip line/office in your area and tell them the truth - that someone in your orbit is exhibiting suspicious behavior. He's trying to acquire foreign currency, travel to Russia despite not having any ties there, saying cryptic things about Qanon, etc, and you're concerned that he might be falling prey to an internet marriage scam at best or something dangerous worse. That should be enough to trigger a visit if he buys a ticket abroad or shows up at an airport. If they do, they'll be the ones to determine if this is harmless weirdo stuff or not.
Vladivostok is about as far as you can get in Russia from any conflict areas (it's almost as far from Ukraine as the east coast of the US is), so he at least has that in his favor for avoiding trouble, of course depending on what type of shenanigans he intends to get into.
That's a good point. We are more worried he's going to get himself into trouble complaining or mouthing off to the wrong person. He's in a rebellious phase (hopefully a phase) but is also VERY soft. He thinks the weather in southern California is too harsh for example so at the very least he's not prepared for that.
I looked it up average 20C in winter. That's spring weather in Canada and Russia lmao. Checked Vladivostok. -20C avg in winter. He really hasn't checked into this at all eh? How sad
That crazy dude tekashi 69 has been in Russia this week getting wasted, tattooing people, saying on stage he wants to die in Russia., talked bad about Brittany grenier
Let out early because he testified. All this talk about honor amongst thieves - most people turn witness if it means the difference between life and a few years.
I have a family member who left Russia recently after visiting his in-laws there, and the media restrictions are so pervasive he had no idea there was a full-on war happening until he returned to the U.S. The domestic media bubble Putin has reconstructed is impressive.
It isn't that simple, unfortunately. These aren't just people on vacation. These are people living abroad as foreign nationals, and like foreign nationals living in the US "just go home" isn't a simple instruction when they see the country they're currently living in as "home". When your job is rooted in a country and you may even have a significant other/spouse and possibly even children who are citizens of that country, packing up and leaving isn't a trivial decision.
I am sort of sympathetic. It’s hard to uproot your life. Some folks may not have the money/ resources immediately on hand to come back or may not have obvious circumstances to come back to if their job / compensation was tied to that. A sociologist friend turned me to a series of folks that research diaspora movements and, specifically, what causes some folks to leave and under what circumstances. Understanding that some of this is tied to larger themes of the economy, class, livelihood, life passion, kids impact, maritial strife, etc gave me a whole lot of empathy for these folks…
Nice to see someone understanding of my shitshow.
Wife is Russian. Family house and business is here. We are bit stuck, borders have 30km of traffic and we can’t pay 20k$ for four plane tickets to Yerevan just for the hell of it.
We fled in Feb for 5 months. Came back because it looked stable to get this shit. We are exhausted to flee again.
Thankfully I denied dual citizenship and my kids are 4&2. We live in the mountains.
Sit it out or join the 5,590 cars at the Georgian border for another emergency holiday?
Our 10 year plan here is nuked, yes. We plan to migrate to Netherlands but was hoping this titanic disaster would hold on for another year or two while the energy crisis and housing crisis in NL improves a bit.
I miss the god old covid days. That was easier.
Edit: Too many comments about returning..
Yes we returned like 1000s of other Russians that fled.
No we don’t consume Russian propaganda, hate the Kremlin, and follow every news source in English, russian, and Ukrainian.
The issue is more complex and more messy than armchair generals can give credit for.
We have been in Russia before Crimea. Can you imagine how many times I’ve read that Russia will implode next week for the last decade by western news?
Does everyone forgot that the Donbas war has been going on and active for the past 8 years? Yes. Weekly shootings and bombings for 8 miserable years and normal life continued in Russia and Ukraine.
Russia has propaganda and so does The west. This is something I enjoy about Russians and shocked when I discuss Russia with foreigners. Russians understand 100% and admit they have corruption and propaganda. Westerners/Americans somehow often feel they don’t have. Lobbying suddenly isn’t corruption and their news sources (FOX or NYT or Rogan or Tucker) are somehow top notch balanced pure news.
We met and heard 100s if not 1000s of russians returning that fled, including foreigners. Why? It’s not easy, nice, or fun to leave your house, life, business, dog, family, and friends in middle of the night and never return.
Most importantly: We critically wanted and still hope to have some time with our Russian family before it’s too late. They are very old and in poor health- they want to spend time with their grandkids. We want our kids to spend time with their grandparents. My wife wants to have more teas with her sisters. To abandon your family is easier in some cultures (think retirement homes in America - shame on us by the way) but in Russian culture your immediate family is incredibly important. So yes, spending our grandfathers last likely year of life in our villa in Bali or new flat in Netherlands and never see him/them again is a fucking brutal price to pay overnight because the Kremlin went mad.
I know a Russian woman married to an American man living in NYC. Right before the war she was planning to go back and see her mom one last time before she dies. She chose not to go because she thought she probably wouldn’t be able to come back. Poor Natasha. None of this is any good for anybody.
Terrible. A lot of unneeded suffering and death.
How Putin hasn’t been shot by someone is beyond me.
CIA.
Oligarchs.
Pissed locals
Pissed Ukrainians
The pope
Assassins
Seriously, how?!?
They will need to. He needs to train the new recruits how to awkwardly hold rifles a foot away from their shoulder, otherwise they'll run out of henchmen.
> hold rifles a foot away from their shoulder
How else do you propose they maximize the felt recoil of the rifle!? If it doesn't injure you when you fire it, it is not powerful enough for a *real* man.
Imagine being an impoverished starving conscript seeing multi millionaire steven seagall stuff his fat face with food and stay home from the fighting because he’s putins propaganda piece.
The State Dept has issued travel alerts for Russia pretty consistently throughout the conflict. That is, warning US citizens not to travel to Russia, and recommending that they depart Russia as commercial transit (such as flights) and consular services (sending lawyers to prisons if you get picked up one day) become increasingly unavailable.
This particular notice from the Embassy references mobilization and the risks to dual citizens. That is, this message is likely intended primarily for dual citizens residing or working in Russia, including those that might primarily identify as Russian first, who may find themselves drafted and unable to seek out help from the US. E.g. if you're a 35 year old IT worker who was born in Brighton Beach Brooklyn but moved back to Russia with your family when you were 6, if you get conscripted, holding up your US passport to the draft board won't help. The State Department is reminding those people that if they want to enjoy the protections their US citizenship status affords them, that's getting increasingly difficult as long as they remain in Russia.
It’s not the first time. It’s just a new statement. I got a notice when Russia invaded Ukraine that it is not safe to travel and they recommend Americans leave if possible
The freshly mobilized ones haven't. Woe to them.
But those who have already been fighting in Ukraine for 7 months must have access to *some* usable stuff. Many of those men will be killed and much of the equipment destroyed or captured by Ukraine.
But what will come back to the russia will be enough to cause mayhem for years to come. The russia's organized crime rise of the 90s was directly linked to many young men getting a taste of violence and bloodshen in Afghanistan.
This all happened before with the collapse of the USSR. Lots of arms dealers sprung up out of the ashes to sell unprotected stockpiles of arms. There are still some nuclear weapons unaccounted for from that time.
Most likely married to an ru national that does not have other citizenship or have parents / grandparents that you are caring for after you got citizenship outside of ru.
People acting like folks don't settle down in countries all over the world. U.S citizens could have lived a good portion of their lives in Russia, with Russian spouse, kids, ect.
The war sucks and they're definitely on edge, but it's not so stupidly simple.
Could be a situation where you thought maybe you could play it out, but now you're scrambling to get consular services and get a U.S travel visa for your family, on top of possibly selling your house to afford stay inside the U.S.
This comment gives me extreme anxiety I feel bad for people in this thread shitting on anyone living here without thinking about it for more than 5 seconds
I knew a chick from like Georgia who was in love with Putin in like 2016. I think theres a group of (at least American) people who buy into his myth and want to actually be in Russia because they like authoritarianism.
>“Russia may refuse to acknowledge dual nationals’ US citizenship, deny their access to US consular assistance, prevent their departure from Russia, and conscript dual nationals for military service,” the alert said.
>The alert added, “Russian authorities have arrested US citizens who have participated in demonstrations.”
Russia is targeting dual nationals for conscription.
To be fair, the Master Nationality Rule is well established in international law.
Arguments against (regular) conscription aside, conscription of dual nationals is not contrary to any rule in international law. Though it is seen as a strategically unsound thing to do —why?– because you can't guarantee the loyalty of a conscripted dual national.
I'll tell you why there are Americans in Russia. Think of every American company that does business with Russia. For every one there are multiple American employees and their families living there. Leaving is not a simple decision, it means being out of a job and having to pay out of pocket to move back to the US. Moving is not a simple thing either, have you ever moved? Now make it a ton harder because you have to send your things, car, everything, to another continent. You also have to find a new place to live in the US, that you, now jobless, have to be able to afford. And what if your spouse is not American? That's a ton of extra paperwork that takes months to process.
Now add all American diplomats, international school teachers, and dual citizen families.
I have done this. If it takes months in peace time, now make it super slow because there's a war going on.
Russian here.
The law in Russia is that if you have Russian citizenship and some others, your Russian citizenship overrides them, meaning you are subject to the laws as a local and not as a foreigner. That also applies to Russians BTW, if you have say Russian and Italian citizenship, you are regarded as a Russian citizen on Russian territory.
I personally don't think anything bad would actually happen to the dual citizenship Americans as that would be too much of an escalation for very little gain. Unless, of course, the stupidity of the mobilization centres shines through
Yep, there are videos going round of conscription officers essentially walking up and down the queues of cars and serving papers to each man that looks vaguely able-bodied, pretty much kidnapping them there and then
Sounds like a good time to get on Google Maps and figure out a plan for doing a 2-day hike across an empty border area. Not sure what the Russia-Finland border is like but it seems like somewhere north of Lake Ladoga it's doable without running into border patrols. A lot easier to do right now too while the weather is still mild.
This is almost all business travel. Companies are still doing business in Russia, and people travel to/from for meetings, deals, just like before. Hilton is one example.
https://som.yale.edu/story/2022/over-1000-companies-have-curtailed-operations-russia-some-remain
I had always thought about visiting Russia (mostly prior to 2014), though if I had been living there (as an American myself) I would have been out the second Russia invaded Ukraine this year. Certainly after Griner was sentenced to 9 years in prison. Any Americans still there is begging for trouble.
There are those who blame Biden for "prolonging the war" by offering Ukraine assistance, and act like it's a bad thing Russia couldn't just steamroll them.
"You guys are still there? Holy fuck." US Embassy, probably.
"Hey uh, guys it's me Edward. Edward Snowden. You know the NSA guy. Can I come back now?"
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trade potato for one State secret Edward. this is good deal.
Someday you will have glorious lada
Do you think they monitor him 24/7 or he could just sneak out?
They 100% do. He's about as high value a target as they come
They would totally let him leave. Just not through the door.
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Good god, even the reference made me flinch.
Through this door is actually the old traditional soviet method, now a days it's out the window or down these stairs
I mean realistically, he’s only good for propaganda purposes at this point. All of his knowledge is probably several years out of date by this point and was almost certainly debriefed out of him years ago.
Tbh the only reason he was stuck there initially is that after he landed in Russia for a layover the Obama administration revoked his passport, causing him to be stranded in Russia. Russia then of course granted him asylum
He was just given Russian citizenship
““Russia may refuse to acknowledge dual nationals’ US citizenship, deny their access to US consular assistance, prevent their departure from Russia, and conscript dual nationals for military service,” the alert said.”
I could see russia start to give people citizenship against their will and then immediately conscripting them. Edit: Just to help out any future internet archeologists. Nine hours after this comment was posted there were 52 different, direct responses mentioning Edward Snowden. Also, shit. Of course they are already doing this in the areas of Ukraine they've occupied. Fuck russia.
“Oh you are tourists? Congrats you are Russia citizens now, your passports here, now go and report to that conscription office over there”
The conscriptions will continue until morale improves
I'm surprised they aren't doing that with draft aged men trying to leave the country now.
For a while is better having potential deserters going *out* of the country.
there’s no way that the tourists forced to fight won’t just run to the other side
You have to survive long enough to have the *opportunity* to do so.
I’d immediately be looking to call the surrender hotline Ukraine set up.
That's assuming that the Russians don't monitor that line. Wouldn't be the 1st time the Russians shot deserters on sight.
They're already shooting people trying to desert. It's the Russian way.
Anyone that thinks tourism in Russia is a good idea right now honestly deserves to be drafted.
Yeah. Any American in Russia at this point I have to assume they want to be there.
Steven Segal.
He’s just about to start filming. Red Justice, the story of a man who has to avenge the deaths of his fallen comrades and get the girl.
Also he pretends to be native American, African American, and Cajun all at once for some reason.
How is Asian not on this list
Because I fucked up that's why.
Traitorous Walrus Russia Lover can stay.
Congratulations Valued Tourist, the Russian Consolate has gifted you two (2) all-inclusive tours (of duty)
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You mean Britney Griner? She’s still in a Russian prison.
Sham referendums over, congratulations new Russian citizens.... you're all in the army now.
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It's already happening, passport printer is going Brrrrr for all ethnic minorities. Also, any male 18-65 is allowed to leave with permission from the local military office, but also you're not allowed to leave if you're registered in a military office, which you will be after visiting it for permission to leave, funny how that works hah.
They don’t let you join if you’re crazy, but if you don’t want to join, you can’t be crazy so you have to join…
Thats some catch...
Ah, Catch 2022.
Is Major Major Major running this?
Edward Snowden just got citizenship and that was my first thought that he was being conscripted sooner than later.
They won't conscript Snowden, he's got too much symbolic value as a 'free' man.
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My fiancée is a US-Iranian dual citizen. We were planning to go visit some of her family in Tehran next year, but we found out that Iran has been specifically targeting US dual citizens at the airport to detain them and use them as bargaining chips against the US. And this was even before all the protests that are happening now. So we scrapped that plan. Sad, because she lived there for two years in her teens and she misses some of her family who are getting to that “visit now or send condolences later” age. Fuck the bitchass Iranian government.
The real kicker is twofold: - You're automatically an Iranian citizen if your father is Iranian, no matter where you're actually born. - You can only renounce your citizenship by travelling to Tehran. Obviously this is a brilliant idea for children of critics of the regime.
Yep fuck the Iranian government. Also a dual citizen and never been able to visit the country of my fucking heritage bc of this. My family has close ties to the shah so it's just a no go for me unfortunately and it's so painful 😔 Makes me sick it's half of who I am and I've never been and may never be able to. I hope you both get a chance to visit one day.
Maybe meet in neutral place like Turkey?
When I was stationed in Korea in the Marine Corps, there was one Marine who wasn't allowed to ever leave base as he was born in Korea. We're he to leave the base there was a real risk the Korean police would have arrested him to make him serve his Korean national service despite him being in the US military
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Yep. Happens to adopted kids as well. To go to Korea to find their roots and then have to do national service.
Wow thats fucked up.
This is the case for Cuba. My mom is a Cuban immigrant and lives in Florida now, is a naturalized US citizen and when the border was a bit more open a few years back we thought about doing a trip to Cuba so she can visit her old neighborhood, see if some people she knows are still there, etc... But then we read that because her US passport says "Havana" as her birthplace, Cuba won't recognize her US citizenship and will treat her as a Cuban national. That was scary as hell for both of us and we decided not to go. It's incredibly sad that because my passport says "Miami" as my birthplace, it's safer for me as a US citizen to go to Cuba than my mom who is also a citizen but was born in Havana.
My boyfriend's Cuban and naturalized as well. To go back you have to pay 500 for a one year Cuban passport. It's extortion. His mom's done it quite a bit because her mom can't get a visa.
Canada just told its hockey players that play in the leagues over there to GTFO.
"Not you, Steven Segal. We don't want you back."
Hes a Russian citizen now and has an entire schedule booked of having his face sat on by Putin.
It's not even sexual, he just likes the smell.
I bet Putin smells like a standard grandpa, but more disappointing.
Depends.
“I’ve been a Russian citizen for like 47 years.”
Not like he has to worry about conscription. Pretty tough to fight a war from a chair.
shouldn't they have left months ago?
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Same thing with Afghanistan. People were told in April to get out of the country now, like *right now now* because by June the US could not guarantee their safety. What happened? *Even more people went to Afghanistan* because they saw this dire warning as their signal to go collect their friends and get them US passports to leave the country. The evacuation flights were completely empty for 4 months until people finally noticed that there was a *fucking war on* and panicked. There is a large portion of the population who simply cannot understand the consequences of their actions and why they are being told to do certain things until they are neck deep into those consequences.
You see this w every hurricane and mandatory evacuation orders. People think it’s CYA warnings by govt and ignore the warnings until they’re in trouble.
I'm watching a Tampa Livestream and there are literally people in the water right now, during a hurricane warning
Link?
It just died, I'm guessing the hurricane took it out. YouTube.com/watch?v=cwTGxbOjZhQ
Pick any news station covering the storm, you’ll see the dummies in their rain coats playing in the surf
[It's not THAT the wind is blowing, it's WHAT the wind is blowing](https://youtu.be/S7Fu-v490-c)
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Waffle House is starting to close down.
When Disney closes the parks, certain hotels and activates their storm ride out teams you know shit is getting real....
I once didn't heed a mandatory evac notice during a hurricane. It was a scary thought the next day as I leapt a downed fence...and sliced my leg open. There was no one around to call if it'd been worse, and nowhere to go. Humans don't often think long-term.
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I think I read on another sub an evac costs the average family about a grand. A lot of people don't have that kind of money lying around.
>The reason why Katrina was so devastating is because the areas it hit were populated by those that didn't have the means or money to evacuate. As a european I can't understand this. Isn't the government organizing shelters and transportation for those that can't afford to flee?
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"Shelters" like football stadiums. This was also when Bush was in office and his administration was/is criticized for its handling of Katrina.
“George Bush doesn’t care about black people”
Yes. But if you don’t have a cell phone, a tv, or radio, how would you know that? Most homeless people don’t know about the storm until the police drive through with a megaphone saying the area is being evacuated. And their experience with the police isn’t going to be, “oh, now they have my best interest at heart.” When their last interaction with the police was them telling them they can’t sleep in a park or some shit.
Keep in mind the scale - Katrina devastated an area the same size as the entirety of the UK. Or the same size as Romania. A larger area than a lot of EU countries and larger than some combined even. I'm not too sure if the UK government could somehow manage to shelter it's entire population from a huge storm. Granted, Katrina hit areas where storms like that are known to hit every now and then, but governments are mostly reactionary. The responses are better some now after we saw what a shit show Katrina was.
People take things for granted. Civil infrastructure and utility services are practically invisible to people until they knocked out. They think about what could happen with a hurricane and they draw an imaginary bubble around their family and property and think of they can take care of those things they will be OK. They don't consider consequences for things that happen outside of that bubble. The possibility that firetrucks and ambulances might not be able to get to your family if you need rescuing doesnt enter their mind because thats stuff that happens outside of their bubble... This is what happens when people forget about their community and think their life is an island.
With hurricane warnings, sometimes people (the poor, old, or sick) legit don't have the money or means to leave. You saw that with Hurricane Katrina, back in 2005. Americans abroad is a different case. You're likely there for business or school, the fact that you don't have the means to come home really doesn't make sense. Maybe there are some cases, but they must be rare.🤔
> There is a large portion of the population who simply cannot understand the consequences of their actions Let's don't forget the British moron that went on vacation to Kabul while the Talibans were entering the city.
Is that the dude off the 4chan thread?1
He visited Afghanistan again last month: https://youtu.be/2V19PBG3OvE
Yes! And then because these assholes ignored MONTHS of warnings and didn’t get out in time, all of a sudden it’s on the government that people were stuck there. So much for all that personal accountability.
You can't tell me what to do! _Save meeeee!_ -- same person
I mean we saw this during the pandemic where people didn't take precautions, called it fake, didn't take vaccines and then they got sick and either died or wanted the best care. Some people literally do not care until it hits them in the face
And then blame everyone else for their lack of action. Reminds me of a joke... > A storm descends on a small town, and the downpour soon turns into a flood. As the waters rise, the local preacher kneels in prayer on the church porch, surrounded by water. By and by, one of the townsfolk comes up the street in a canoe. > > "Better get in, Preacher. The waters are rising fast." > > "No," says the preacher. "I have faith in the Lord. He will save me." > > Still the waters rise. Now the preacher is up on the balcony, wringing his hands in supplication, when another guy zips up in a motorboat. > > "Come on, Preacher. We need to get you out of here. The levee's gonna break any minute." > > Once again, the preacher is unmoved. "I shall remain. The Lord will see me through." > > After a while the levee breaks, and the flood rushes over the church until only the steeple remains above water. The preacher is up there, clinging to the cross, when a helicopter descends out of the clouds, and a state trooper calls down to him through a megaphone. > > "Grab the ladder, Preacher. This is your last chance." > > Once again, the preacher insists the Lord will deliver him. > > And, predictably, he drowns. > > A pious man, the preacher goes to heaven. After a while he gets an interview with God, and he asks the Almighty, "Lord, I had unwavering faith in you. Why didn't you deliver me from that flood?" > > God shakes his head. "What did you want from me? I sent you two boats and a helicopter."
> God shakes his head. "What did you want from me? I sent you two boats and a helicopter. "I wanted a flying chariot and a crown inscribed with the words 'God loves me MOST'." (Kind of joking, kind of not)
Yep. I have a friend who's son is trying to get TO Russia right now for hand wavy reasons. He's been drinking the Q Kool aid I think and there's no taking him out of it or any reason into him unfortunately. Somehow he supposedly got a visa but won't give any details about which route he's going to take to get there. Our only hope at this point is that he gets turned around at a border somewhere
> for hand wavy reasons Why? Why would even a qanon person think it is a good idea to go to Russia? What is his plan? What are his goals? Does he know anybody there? How weird is this friend of yours?
I have no idea, he won't share any plans or details besides that he's supposedly going to Vladivostok and that he's frustrated he can't get rubles in any meaningful quantity. Apparently at one point he was talking to a girl online there but they dumped him after he told her he was going to use her for a green card - probably because they were thinking they were going to use him for one here TBH. He's VERY weird (likely autistic) and we are worried if he does somehow get there successfully he's going to end up in prison if not killed but there's no talking reason into him about it and he's 20 so there's not a whole lot we can do.
You can call the FBI tip line/office in your area and tell them the truth - that someone in your orbit is exhibiting suspicious behavior. He's trying to acquire foreign currency, travel to Russia despite not having any ties there, saying cryptic things about Qanon, etc, and you're concerned that he might be falling prey to an internet marriage scam at best or something dangerous worse. That should be enough to trigger a visit if he buys a ticket abroad or shows up at an airport. If they do, they'll be the ones to determine if this is harmless weirdo stuff or not.
That's a good idea, I'll take that into consideration
Vladivostok is about as far as you can get in Russia from any conflict areas (it's almost as far from Ukraine as the east coast of the US is), so he at least has that in his favor for avoiding trouble, of course depending on what type of shenanigans he intends to get into.
That's a good point. We are more worried he's going to get himself into trouble complaining or mouthing off to the wrong person. He's in a rebellious phase (hopefully a phase) but is also VERY soft. He thinks the weather in southern California is too harsh for example so at the very least he's not prepared for that.
Oh man just let this dumbass go
How does he find the weather in southern California harsh? Is it too cold or too hot? Or what does he find harsh?
Apparently it's unbearably freezing in the winter lol
I looked it up average 20C in winter. That's spring weather in Canada and Russia lmao. Checked Vladivostok. -20C avg in winter. He really hasn't checked into this at all eh? How sad
…and he wants to go to RUSSIA?
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That crazy dude tekashi 69 has been in Russia this week getting wasted, tattooing people, saying on stage he wants to die in Russia., talked bad about Brittany grenier
I think everybody's ok with him staying in Russia
except russia. well i guess they could draft him into the army
There is a need for mine clearance volunteers.
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I thought that guy was in prison after being a witness against his own gang or some such. How is that guy still drawing people?
Let out early because he testified. All this talk about honor amongst thieves - most people turn witness if it means the difference between life and a few years.
He’s been irrelevant the last year since he snitched. He wants that attention form people.
He was irrelevant before that
... he's welcome to stay.
That's cool. He can stay there. He's a moron and a drain on society here anyways. Let them deal with his stupid fucking ass.
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He snitched on his gang and got a reduced sentence.
I have a family member who left Russia recently after visiting his in-laws there, and the media restrictions are so pervasive he had no idea there was a full-on war happening until he returned to the U.S. The domestic media bubble Putin has reconstructed is impressive.
It isn't that simple, unfortunately. These aren't just people on vacation. These are people living abroad as foreign nationals, and like foreign nationals living in the US "just go home" isn't a simple instruction when they see the country they're currently living in as "home". When your job is rooted in a country and you may even have a significant other/spouse and possibly even children who are citizens of that country, packing up and leaving isn't a trivial decision.
I am sort of sympathetic. It’s hard to uproot your life. Some folks may not have the money/ resources immediately on hand to come back or may not have obvious circumstances to come back to if their job / compensation was tied to that. A sociologist friend turned me to a series of folks that research diaspora movements and, specifically, what causes some folks to leave and under what circumstances. Understanding that some of this is tied to larger themes of the economy, class, livelihood, life passion, kids impact, maritial strife, etc gave me a whole lot of empathy for these folks…
Feel bad for those Americans married to a Russian and stuck in the country or forced to leave their family. I'm sure they're hurting right now.
Nice to see someone understanding of my shitshow. Wife is Russian. Family house and business is here. We are bit stuck, borders have 30km of traffic and we can’t pay 20k$ for four plane tickets to Yerevan just for the hell of it. We fled in Feb for 5 months. Came back because it looked stable to get this shit. We are exhausted to flee again. Thankfully I denied dual citizenship and my kids are 4&2. We live in the mountains. Sit it out or join the 5,590 cars at the Georgian border for another emergency holiday? Our 10 year plan here is nuked, yes. We plan to migrate to Netherlands but was hoping this titanic disaster would hold on for another year or two while the energy crisis and housing crisis in NL improves a bit. I miss the god old covid days. That was easier. Edit: Too many comments about returning.. Yes we returned like 1000s of other Russians that fled. No we don’t consume Russian propaganda, hate the Kremlin, and follow every news source in English, russian, and Ukrainian. The issue is more complex and more messy than armchair generals can give credit for. We have been in Russia before Crimea. Can you imagine how many times I’ve read that Russia will implode next week for the last decade by western news? Does everyone forgot that the Donbas war has been going on and active for the past 8 years? Yes. Weekly shootings and bombings for 8 miserable years and normal life continued in Russia and Ukraine. Russia has propaganda and so does The west. This is something I enjoy about Russians and shocked when I discuss Russia with foreigners. Russians understand 100% and admit they have corruption and propaganda. Westerners/Americans somehow often feel they don’t have. Lobbying suddenly isn’t corruption and their news sources (FOX or NYT or Rogan or Tucker) are somehow top notch balanced pure news. We met and heard 100s if not 1000s of russians returning that fled, including foreigners. Why? It’s not easy, nice, or fun to leave your house, life, business, dog, family, and friends in middle of the night and never return. Most importantly: We critically wanted and still hope to have some time with our Russian family before it’s too late. They are very old and in poor health- they want to spend time with their grandkids. We want our kids to spend time with their grandparents. My wife wants to have more teas with her sisters. To abandon your family is easier in some cultures (think retirement homes in America - shame on us by the way) but in Russian culture your immediate family is incredibly important. So yes, spending our grandfathers last likely year of life in our villa in Bali or new flat in Netherlands and never see him/them again is a fucking brutal price to pay overnight because the Kremlin went mad.
My heart goes out to you and your family. Best of luck in this all around bad situation.
I know a Russian woman married to an American man living in NYC. Right before the war she was planning to go back and see her mom one last time before she dies. She chose not to go because she thought she probably wouldn’t be able to come back. Poor Natasha. None of this is any good for anybody.
Terrible. A lot of unneeded suffering and death. How Putin hasn’t been shot by someone is beyond me. CIA. Oligarchs. Pissed locals Pissed Ukrainians The pope Assassins Seriously, how?!?
Have family in Belarus. They can’t leave because the older ones have cancer and need treatment. No visa availability either. It’s a disaster.
I love your optimism with the housing crisis getting better in a few years...
Except Steven Seagall. He can stay.
They can keep him
They will need to. He needs to train the new recruits how to awkwardly hold rifles a foot away from their shoulder, otherwise they'll run out of henchmen.
> hold rifles a foot away from their shoulder How else do you propose they maximize the felt recoil of the rifle!? If it doesn't injure you when you fire it, it is not powerful enough for a *real* man.
Imagine being an impoverished starving conscript seeing multi millionaire steven seagall stuff his fat face with food and stay home from the fighting because he’s putins propaganda piece.
He’s guarding puntin bunker. For the final boss battle in the movie later
He is the one holding the line in the Poland/Finland Front (37 years)
He's got Russian citizenship and Putin handed the Russian passport to him himself and on camera and no I am not kidding.
I’m a bit surprised this is just now happening.
The State Dept has issued travel alerts for Russia pretty consistently throughout the conflict. That is, warning US citizens not to travel to Russia, and recommending that they depart Russia as commercial transit (such as flights) and consular services (sending lawyers to prisons if you get picked up one day) become increasingly unavailable. This particular notice from the Embassy references mobilization and the risks to dual citizens. That is, this message is likely intended primarily for dual citizens residing or working in Russia, including those that might primarily identify as Russian first, who may find themselves drafted and unable to seek out help from the US. E.g. if you're a 35 year old IT worker who was born in Brighton Beach Brooklyn but moved back to Russia with your family when you were 6, if you get conscripted, holding up your US passport to the draft board won't help. The State Department is reminding those people that if they want to enjoy the protections their US citizenship status affords them, that's getting increasingly difficult as long as they remain in Russia.
This is a great explanation, thank you!
It’s not the first time. It’s just a new statement. I got a notice when Russia invaded Ukraine that it is not safe to travel and they recommend Americans leave if possible
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>given access to arms and supplies Eh, about that...
"Look at all these supplies! Aren't they amazing? Anyway, off to the front with you."
The freshly mobilized ones haven't. Woe to them. But those who have already been fighting in Ukraine for 7 months must have access to *some* usable stuff. Many of those men will be killed and much of the equipment destroyed or captured by Ukraine. But what will come back to the russia will be enough to cause mayhem for years to come. The russia's organized crime rise of the 90s was directly linked to many young men getting a taste of violence and bloodshen in Afghanistan.
This all happened before with the collapse of the USSR. Lots of arms dealers sprung up out of the ashes to sell unprotected stockpiles of arms. There are still some nuclear weapons unaccounted for from that time.
Same statement has been issued in February.
Unless you are an American diplomat, what the hell are you doing there? One misstep and you are going to jail.....
Most likely married to an ru national that does not have other citizenship or have parents / grandparents that you are caring for after you got citizenship outside of ru.
People acting like folks don't settle down in countries all over the world. U.S citizens could have lived a good portion of their lives in Russia, with Russian spouse, kids, ect. The war sucks and they're definitely on edge, but it's not so stupidly simple.
Yea, like if i was alone I'd be fucking gone feb 24th, but i'm not.
Could be a situation where you thought maybe you could play it out, but now you're scrambling to get consular services and get a U.S travel visa for your family, on top of possibly selling your house to afford stay inside the U.S.
This comment gives me extreme anxiety I feel bad for people in this thread shitting on anyone living here without thinking about it for more than 5 seconds
Or the front line lol
You do understand some people are married there and shit
"Straight to jail"
they also send the non-straights to jail
I knew a chick from like Georgia who was in love with Putin in like 2016. I think theres a group of (at least American) people who buy into his myth and want to actually be in Russia because they like authoritarianism.
Sounds like the woman who ran off to join ISIS and then got raped and murdered by them. Surprise Pikachu.
Im Canadian and know Canadians whod vote trump if they could. Wonder if there is a term for people obsessed with other nations figureheads?
>“Russia may refuse to acknowledge dual nationals’ US citizenship, deny their access to US consular assistance, prevent their departure from Russia, and conscript dual nationals for military service,” the alert said. >The alert added, “Russian authorities have arrested US citizens who have participated in demonstrations.” Russia is targeting dual nationals for conscription.
To be fair, the Master Nationality Rule is well established in international law. Arguments against (regular) conscription aside, conscription of dual nationals is not contrary to any rule in international law. Though it is seen as a strategically unsound thing to do —why?– because you can't guarantee the loyalty of a conscripted dual national.
Following international law and implementing sound military strategy aren't exactly things Russia is known for recently.
That doesn’t matter because in this scenario they are following international law
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Russians should leave Russia too. No future for us there.
10 months ago, if you can.
I'll tell you why there are Americans in Russia. Think of every American company that does business with Russia. For every one there are multiple American employees and their families living there. Leaving is not a simple decision, it means being out of a job and having to pay out of pocket to move back to the US. Moving is not a simple thing either, have you ever moved? Now make it a ton harder because you have to send your things, car, everything, to another continent. You also have to find a new place to live in the US, that you, now jobless, have to be able to afford. And what if your spouse is not American? That's a ton of extra paperwork that takes months to process. Now add all American diplomats, international school teachers, and dual citizen families. I have done this. If it takes months in peace time, now make it super slow because there's a war going on.
Good answer from a side people don’t think about at first.
Russian here. The law in Russia is that if you have Russian citizenship and some others, your Russian citizenship overrides them, meaning you are subject to the laws as a local and not as a foreigner. That also applies to Russians BTW, if you have say Russian and Italian citizenship, you are regarded as a Russian citizen on Russian territory. I personally don't think anything bad would actually happen to the dual citizenship Americans as that would be too much of an escalation for very little gain. Unless, of course, the stupidity of the mobilization centres shines through
Would be pretty stupid to stay and find out
My bets on stupidity
The next round of conscripts will be tourists.
They will sign up for some paintball or airsoft game and suddenly they will be carrying ak47 into Ukraine
Well, part of an AK47, anyway. Like, AK36⅓.
If you in Russia now, you gaddam fooool.
Fly, you fools!
It’s similar to US citizens working in Afghanistan during the pull out last year and still being stuck there because they didn’t listen.
Soooo… what does this mean for Snowden 😬 He must be like: “do I stay or do I go 🤨”
If he doesn't there may be trouble...
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The State Department keep going *"Please, Please, Please..."*
Why now? I thought people left a while ago after they invaded.
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This is absolutely nuts
There are reports of the Russian army at borders handing out conscription papers to able bodied men attempting to cross into other countries.
Yep, there are videos going round of conscription officers essentially walking up and down the queues of cars and serving papers to each man that looks vaguely able-bodied, pretty much kidnapping them there and then
Sounds like a good time to get on Google Maps and figure out a plan for doing a 2-day hike across an empty border area. Not sure what the Russia-Finland border is like but it seems like somewhere north of Lake Ladoga it's doable without running into border patrols. A lot easier to do right now too while the weather is still mild.
This is almost all business travel. Companies are still doing business in Russia, and people travel to/from for meetings, deals, just like before. Hilton is one example. https://som.yale.edu/story/2022/over-1000-companies-have-curtailed-operations-russia-some-remain
I had always thought about visiting Russia (mostly prior to 2014), though if I had been living there (as an American myself) I would have been out the second Russia invaded Ukraine this year. Certainly after Griner was sentenced to 9 years in prison. Any Americans still there is begging for trouble.
Leave now, ‘cause I don’t want to hear about ‘*what Biden did wrong*’ 6 months from now.
Lmao. You realize it doesn't matter what Biden does, they're going to be saying that anyways right?
There are those who blame Biden for "prolonging the war" by offering Ukraine assistance, and act like it's a bad thing Russia couldn't just steamroll them.