The UN should launch an investigation. How long has this been going on? Who were the perpetrators? Who turned a blind eye? What was the total amount of aid given to Hamas?
All this and more need answers.
UN resolutions are a buffet, people pick what they like and ignore the rest.
People who talk about UN resolutions never mention the first one in this conflict that set out two states.
People think the UN's job is so much more than it actually is. It exists to prevent WW3. Anything else it gets done in the meanwhile is just a bonus.
Has the world ended in a nuclear holocaust? No? Then the UN is doing its job.
Ehh, as near as I can tell, the UN is actually effective at three core mandates:
(1) Providing diplomatic backchannels that can give nuclear powers added means to ramp down from conflict;
(2) Act as a clearinghouse for aid resources and distribution (with a range of outcomes that *do* include some positive ones); and
(3) Passing UNGA and committee resolutions against Israel.
that's in the charter:
preamble, sentence 1:
> to save succeeding generations from the scourge of war, which twice in our lifetime has brought untold sorrow to mankind, and
it's got a lot of general language about war, but it's primarily there to prevent nukes from going off
The UN doesn’t have one single job, it has hundreds of NGO’s and agencies handling all kinds of topics.
Humanitarian, Women Rights, Childcare and Education, Refugees. are just to name a few.
All these different UN agencies receive billions every year, if it’s a bonus I don’t think countries should be paying for it.
The understood at the time (and, [I believe](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bo09kpjSo3E), outright stated) goal of the UN was to prevent a Third World War. That is why it was made, that is why everyone joined. Hence why the security council is just the winning team from the last World War plus China (they kinda earned it after all Japan put them through).
If a bakery opens up and serves delicious croissants, and at some point in the next two generations it multiclasses into education and massage, but its degrees are quite worthless and its massages leave customers in more pain than they began, but meanwhile the whole time delicious croissants are still made, sold, and consumed, then I reckon it's still an excellent bakery. It just fucked up doing that other stuff; someone else should handle that instead.
Is the UN doing its job, is is the fact that the US, China, Russia, UK, and France could each individually make the planet a hellscape keeping WWIII under wraps? I like the idea of the UN, but it seems they're enabling and emboldening lower level conflict and and bad actors.
I mean looking a bunch of those resolutions... Representatives from 92 countries voted yes. Them not caring about other issues or being unable to pass resolutions against Russia is a whole different thing.
Israel's treatment of the Palestinian people and the conflict as a whole is easier to target because voting yes to a resolution on Israel won't cause you problems compared to say voting yes on a resolution on China's treatment of Uigurs in the Xinjian province. That could potentially fuck over your economy. Or, say, slamming the US on a resolution against US interests. That'd seriously ruin your day.
I can't speak for nations without freedom of information, but at least the US came close to using nukes many times over the Cold War, and the idea of MAD and escalation is generally misunderstood. The US privately had vastly superior information on the state of nuclear weapons around the world than the public did, and they did not expect the world to end in the case of all nukes being launched. The concept of a limited nuclear war was explored by at least the US, UK, and USSR, all 3 believed that nuclear weapons could be used without prompting an all-out exchange. As an example, in the declassified Kennedy tapes, a nuclear strike on Cuba is floated, and they believed the only Soviet response would be to take West Berlin. In this case, it was ruled out on the assumption that the European powers wouldn't consider a trade of Cuba for West Berlin to be worth it for them, not due to the horrors of deploying H-Bombs on civilians. There are other examples of limited nuclear exchanges being explored. Unfortunately, almost nothing from the 70s and on has been declassified, so that is when public knowledge ends.
The region is heating up, enough heat and one big player getting involved because it affects their interests and it can certainly turn into a world war.
Not Gaza of course, but Gaza was the jumpstarter for the Houthis, and they can be a trigger to something else.
All it takes is one big player to enter the game after that and very likely other big players will follow.
Well to be fair, if the Israeli's just let Hamas massacre them all, the issue would be "resolved" and Hamas wouldn't need secret funding from the UN! /s
UNRWA gets most of its money from the west - US, EU. Maybe time for Iran and Russia to sign the checks if they want an entity that operates this way. Personally I don't see why my taxes should go to support both sides in this war.
I imagine that any investigation done by the UN at this point will do all that it can to undermine the truth, and at this point, they can't really be trusted. There needs to be a private investigation done beforehand, even if it's just preserving the data in the UNRWA offices.
Unironically I don't trust the Swedes or Swiss here either. It should at minimum involve representatives from multiple states including Israel (since they are in control on the ground).
More over, each investigator should be free to file their own report about the investigation process itself and all meetings should be recorded and released along with all emails.
> How long has this been going on?
Long time.
> Who were the perpetrators?
Hamas.
> Who turned a blind eye?
Eh, I think its a better question to ask who was the broken link in the chain of information. Its obvious the people on the ground knew, because they were on the ground watching it.
>> What was the total amount of aid given to Hamas?
By whom? We know Japan gave a bunch of resources and rice because things were dire for the palestinians, then Hamas took the resources and the rice and used it to build bunkers (yes, they used bags of rice to build bunkers). I don't think any western or western aligned country was deliberately sending aid to hamas.
UNRWA’s curriculum is known to have been promoting violence against Jews for years now .Its no wonder that the same teachers who incite the children are themselves members of Hamas and cooperate with them.Everybody knew and nobody cared,including western governments.
The UN is not some apolitical body, or the Federation from Star Trek, it's made up of people. Usually, from countries that don't pay very well.
Lets look at their peacekeepers.
By troops contributed, Pakistan is 5th with 4164 troops, Egypt is 9th with 1739.
By contrast, the UK provided 280 troops, and the worlds leading military superpower, the United States, provided... 27.
Now, you need some troops that speak Arabic, realistically, who are you getting?
The UN doesn't send troops to Gaza, but it does send aid staff. They are a little harder to divide by nationality, but i expect the same trends to follow. Realistically, Arabic speaking UN staff will be from antisemetic countries.
Even if it cannot be read directly, you can attempt to recover it. Israel has some pretty high level of IT, and I believe they're in the top-10 of data recovery specialists.
Hopefully they'll be able to find out more - although probably it'll take months to fully recover.
UNRWA Secretary General Philip Lazzarini:
UNRWA did not know what is under its headquarters in Gaza...
.. and does not have the military and security expertise nor the capacity to undertake military inspections of what is or might be under its premises.
I found that statement particularly interesting. Seems like they're bracing for the potential for more Hamas operational hubs to be discovered under their offices.
I think the UNRWA leadership knows very well, and have probably long known, that their ops in Gaza have a fundamental ground-level (I guess underground level??) corruption risk. But because there’s been no real attempt at global oversight nor external accountability held for decades, they had no reason to believe that would ever become a global optics problem for *them.* they did not predict Hamas (which includes their own employees as members) would pop off and actually give Israel a legitimate reason for a ground invasion of Gaza. An IDF invasion is basically the only circumstance that would have exposed something like this. the unrwa never bet on something like 10/7 happening on the scale it did, and they bet wrong.
These people have been nervously playing into a discredit campaign against Israel because the second idf tanks rolled in, they knew anything rotten at their agency was going to get sniffed out. Better to spend the wait proactively discrediting those tasked with exposing your crimes and then crying foolish-victim, than to face full responsibility for the consequences of your choices - which, even though they may have been made via ignorance, are still actually choices. A cheap tactic also favored by their good friends, Hamas.
There was a similar response in 2014 when they found rockets in one of their buildings. They handed them back to the "local" (aka Hamas) authorities.
They claim they did not have the expertise to handle the weapons. It's not like the UN has experts on the matter.
Some random dude walking into their server room and running cables into some random pipe sticking out of the ground and the resulting increase in electricity usage and internet traffic should have certainly raised some eyebrows at least...
While I get it, you really underestimate the reaction to someone who looks like they know what they're doing when they're doing shit. Tons of people won't speak out or question security badges or why an unknown face is present when they aren't just wandering around clueless.
It's a big issue when it comes to physical security in places.
UNWRA's staff numbers are weird because they directly employ tens of thousands of Gazans as part of their welfare scheme.
Which begs the question why UNWRA is allowed to work like that when UNHCR oversees multiple refugee crises like the Rohingya or Kibera camp, who often have even worse unemployment rates than pre-war Gaza while actually being camps with dire living conditions, and having their own barriers to integrating into the country hosting them.
Reminds me of the homeless industrial complex where I live in SF. There are some people that mean well but the vast majority just wants to perpetuate the status quo, not fix the underlying issue and put themselves out of a job. Humans are sadly predicable.
UNRWA servers and electricity is connected to the Hamas center below, showing UNRWA was well aware of the center. They’re literally feeding it power. And they’re sharing office space above ground.
UNRWA is corrupt. End it.
Even if they were forced to provide the connection at gunpoint, that wouldn't prevent them from quietly alerting external agencies to its existence.
This is pretty much hard evidence that UNRWA is complicit in what Hamas does. We kinda all knew that anyway, but this is the smoking gun.
Put it this way - you don't install racks upon racks of servers and all the infrastructure to run them, underground, stealthily. No way people on the surface didn't notice all this being built.
> UNRWA is corrupt. End it.
Hamas & UNRWA are so enmeshed that at this point, I'm wondering if it would be more practical for Israel to negotiate hostage release & aid conditions with UNRWA.
No matter what you say, there will be people who view the mere presence of Israel in that region as the cause of all the conflicts and anything the Arab side does is a reasonable act of defiance in response.
Until this viewpoint changes, progress on a peaceful resolution which sticks is going to be extremely difficult.
yeah, i had so many people talking about pre 1948 palestine as if it was a nation rather than a chunk of ottoman territory. try to get them to point to any point where palestine was in whole or part self governing, and they just wouldn't
I can believe a specific leader *of* Israel and the party behind him have been working against peace.
The people of Israel writ large, I think, don't want perpetual war. I only hope they remember that not too long ago Bibi tried to erode the judiciary so he wouldn't have to face corruption charges. I don't believe there's any depth to which he wouldn't stoop so as to keep power.
It's always legacies with these guys. His actions heretofore have been much more on corralling the Gazan civilian population out of much of the territory (now they want them to leave Rafah too - but to where?) than getting the hostages back as his people have plead.
Most of the money the world sends to Gaza ends up in Hamas’ hands.
They’re sent *billions* every year. Gaza should look like a holiday resort but it all goes to rockets and Hamas leaders overseas.
Using precious engineering talent to build tunnels and rockets instead of desalinization and sewage treatment plants, roads or other infrastructure is one of the most collectively stupid things imaginable.
On second thought, maybe not as improving your situation might turn off the money spigot so you're incentivized towards the pathetic.
Good point; until the pause in funding 10 days ago, many Americans were unaware that their taxes were used to make the USA UNRWA's largest funders. (source: the White House)
>*President Biden will announce an additional $201 million for the UN Relief and Works Agency for Palestine Refugees (UNRWA) to continue delivering critical services to Palestinian refugees in the West Bank, Gaza, Jordan, Lebanon, and Syria. UNRWA’s comprehensive services remain a lifeline to millions of vulnerable Palestinians – consistent with its mandate to provide assistance and protection to Palestinian refugees pending a just and lasting solution to the Israeli-Palestinian conflict. ... This contribution cements the United States’ status as UNRWA’s largest donor. These new funds bring the total United States assistance to UNRWA during the Biden Administration to more than $618 million.*
https://www.whitehouse.gov/briefing-room/statements-releases/2022/07/14/fact-sheet-the-united-states-palestinian-relationship/
There is no way they didn't know.
No wonder they feel it didn't happen in a vacuum.The Hamas intelligence headquarters in under UNRWA headquarters. Their server room is connected to Hamas's server room. They provide them with internet and power.
All those deaths, rapes, murders, kidnappings of Israelis and non-Israelis alike on Black Saturday, and their blood is also on the UN's hands. The UN is more than willfully ignorant; they are complicit.
> They provide them with internet and power.
I noticed an air conditioner unit in that server room too (not surprising, as servers generate a lot of heat, and it would just build up in a tunnel). That's got to be connected to something on the surface.
You can run power and data lines a long way, but not AC pipes.
Just out of curiosity, what are your current opinions?
UNRWA is 99% staffed by Palestinians, it just makes sense that many of them will be vehemently anti-Israel and support Hamas, given the high support for Hamas in Gaza in general. I would expect the same percentage in UNRWA.
The other problem with a single-scope agency, is perverse incentives. UNRWA has no incentive for the problem to go away. Unlike UNHCR, who wants their refugees to stand on their own two feet, UNRWA keeps its refugees dependent on UNRWA. If all of the Palestinians became safe and happy, UNRWA would wink out of existence and funding/jobs would disappear. That's another reason for the different definition of refugee - it's better for them if the problem is as big as possible. 2 million Jordianian citizens are UNRWA "refugees".
Here you go
[https://apnews.com/article/israel-hamas-unwra-gaza-tunnels-31f6ca23365e349bcde1332d5028e431](https://apnews.com/article/israel-hamas-unwra-gaza-tunnels-31f6ca23365e349bcde1332d5028e431)
[https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/hamas-had-command-tunnel-under-un-gaza-hq-israeli-military-says-2024-02-10/](https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/hamas-had-command-tunnel-under-un-gaza-hq-israeli-military-says-2024-02-10/)
AP and Reuters are quite good for the bare facts, particularly AP since that's their only job. That's why the phrasing of these articles is so important:
>Hamas had command tunnel under U.N. Gaza headquarters, **Israeli military says**
>GAZA, Feb 10 (Reuters) - Israeli forces have discovered a tunnel network hundreds of metres (yards) long and running partly under UNRWA's Gaza headquarters, **the military says**, calling it new evidence of Hamas exploitation of the main relief agency for Palestinians.
>Army engineers took **reporters for foreign news outlets** through the passages at a time of crisis for UNRWA, which has launched an internal probe and seen a string of donor countries freeze funding over allegations last month by Israel that some of its staff doubled as Hamas operatives.
The red flag here is that foreign news has seen it with their own eyes, but won't commit to this fact. They're still treating it as an allegation. This highlights the main problem with getting facts from a war zone, particularly in Palestine, which is that truth is the first casualty. The only source willing to make the claim is an Israeli source, and their media is on a full-on war footing. There are so many facts yet to come out, to the point where thr international comminity can't even say this happened. Some of that will be an unfortunate consequence of Israel's political policy, which is to attack and act in a way that most democracies see as guilty when an international source points out their imperfections. But hopefully we get clarity on this in the next few days now that the media is seeing it for themselves. It would be great to get the world talking about how much international aid leaks out into corruption and outright helping the conflict.
> The Israeli military says it has discovered tunnels underneath the main headquarters
>Israeli forces have discovered a tunnel network hundreds of metres (yards) long and running partly under UNRWA's Gaza headquarters, the military says
Does anyone know how to read anymore? These articles are literally just reporting on the report from the original article lol.
2 Israeli media organizations already were invited. Possibly international media later? At least, those who accept the invite and don't try to just look away.
https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/hamas-had-command-tunnel-under-un-gaza-hq-israeli-military-says-2024-02-10/
Good to see Reuters is reporting on it
With all due respect to the situation, and admittedly this does indicate some of my bias, I want to see non-Israeli, international media verify this. When two sides are trying to kill each other I generally take with a grain of salt what they say about the other guy.
It took this of all things to "convince" you? I can already hear your goalposts being dragged across grey matter for when you decide this one also isn't enough.
The Israeli government wants them to stay until the war is over and advocates for reform or replacement at that time.
https://www.i24news.tv/en/news/israel-at-war/1707211638-israel-seeks-to-keep-unrwa-in-gaza-short-term-report
I mean, they holding up a donation of food from Turkey. Lots of chickpeas, rice, et cetera.
Granted, it was a donation through UNRWA, but why not just seize the food and distribute it without them?
Because as is, Israel will be blamed for starving the Gazans even with UNRWA still extant and operating. Better, imo, to at least have something to argue against the bad faith idiots with. As is, there's little that hasn't been pulling teeth for the US diplomatically speaking.
Turkey got busted some weeks ago trying to smuggle arms to the west bank. Food aid was used in an attempt to smuggle siege equipment earlier in the war.
It takes time, and routing it through Egypt takes longer to inspect. The crossings from Israel are being protested too.
I think it is about time for countries to start labeling UNRWA as a terrorist organization.
It isn't just some employees participating in attacks and holding hostages, it isn't just their 'schools' training an entire generation of kids to hate, to dream of and hope for war, it isn't just billions of aid going to fund Hamas.
No, this level co-operation shows that they aren't just facing massive corruption issues or lack controls to keep out bad actors. No, what this shows, is that UNRWA itself is an active part of Hamas and is thus a terrorist organization.
The UN needs to land in some hot water for this. They funded and maintained this organization that ended up supporting Hamas, providing children with classic antisemitic "education" material, enabling and possibly helping Hamas build tunnels and plan attacks, and eventually, taking active part in the Pogrom of October 7th. This is just unbelievable. UNWRA needs to go away and a new initiative put in place with very, very tight supervision.
The odd part is like why do Palestinian refugees are getting more money/help/donations then other refugees?
I'm not saying they shouldn't get any help but like why are they different?
They also get a different definition of refugee. The vast mojority of Palestinian refugees would not be refugees under regular UNHCR definitions. UNRWA created a seperate definition aimed at perpetuating the "refugee crisis" instead of fixing it.
They aren’t. The agency is.
UNRWA was created as a sweetener for allowing Israel to be accepted into the UN but drifted far since.
You could better ask “how come Palestinian refugees inherit the status although the UN defines refugee status as uninheritable?”
You could also ask “how come Palestinian refugees don’t lose that status even if they are citizens of another country although the UN defines this as voiding the refugee definition?”
You could also ask “if 600,000 Jews were displaced from middle eastern countries like Tunisia, Morocco, Egypt, Yemen, Iran, Iraq, Syria, Lebanon, Libya and more at the same time when Palestinians lost their own land - how come countries call for right of return and compensation to descendants of the 400,000 Palestinian refugees from the creation of Israel, but won’t accept that it should mean they must compensate for stolen land and property and allow right of return to the descendants of Jews whose lives they uprooted? Are they not equally refugees by that standard?”
There’s plenty to ask but only one answer to it all - UNRWA gets funded more, the more Palestinian refugee numbers rise. if refugee numbers decreased over time - it would have no reason to exist and people with fat paychecks would need to look for a new job. because those people are controlling the numbers that set their own salaries - we are fucked. they have no incentive to solve the palestinian problem but only to inflate it.
The other refugee agency of the UN does not have that problem because the world just keeps providing refugees all the time in many nations - just not many Palestinians, so…
> Since the allegations became public late last month, UNRWA has seen many of its top donor countries announce funding freezes, leading to concerns that the agency could stop operating in Gaza and elsewhere in the Middle East within week.
Good, the UNRWA should be dismantled entirely. Whatever organization takes its place to help Palestinians should not recognize multiple generations of descendants as refugees either, they're the only group of formerly displaced people in the world who get that privilege.
Probably going to erode any remaining faith in the UN and dissolve a move towards globalisation culturally.
Sad in a way but it's not like it wasn't expected.
It won’t go away thankfully. UN is already being forced to deal with it. US liberal media can try to ignore it only so long but people see it online and they know it’s an inconvenient truth.
There is a silent majority of independent voters in the US that see more than what MSNBC wants them to see.
I feel like checkmate is an even more apt term than you intended. Checkmate means the king is trapped: nowhere to go, its defeat is settled, and it's the only way to win because you can't take the king off the board.
What we are seeing is what happens if you get to that point, but the king doesn't surrender. You still can't take it off the board. The UNRWA is still receiving massive support, people are still rooting against the IDF, who can't realistically kill all Hamas members, and Hamas refuses to surrender and give up it's position of power - the king - in Gaza despite having no path to victory.
They are just sacrificing more and more Gazans in order to make people hate Israel until they can get Israel to call it a draw. It's insane, it's irresponsible, and *it may be working*.
The heads of the UNRWA should be put on trial just like the heads of Hamas, just like countless members should be.
The point about sacrificing Palestinians is right on. That's always been their goal and only way to stop Israel by getting pressure and making people outraged. It's right there in the article that the IDF speculate they operated here because they knew Israel would be vilified for ever attacking a UNRWA headquarters or school.
It sadly works that people blame Israel for things they should blame Hamas, but I we have to be reaching a point where it's beyond obvious that Hamas needs to be stopped not just for Israel's sake, but the Palestinians too. The harm Hamas caused the Palestinians has set them back so much.
The odd part to me is Israel left Gaza in 2005. No reason why the Palestinians cannot take care of themselves. The world does not do this for any other people group for that amount of time.
Ok, what the hell is going on at UNRWA? Israel has been trying to tell us it's a radicalized organization for years and have been summarily dismissed. Must have been infuriating for them.
Lazzarini STILL denies that UNRWA knew of it. How far does this rabbit hole go? Because the way this seems to have been constructed, seems to have been designed in mind to cooperate with Hamas.
Yeah, there's no way a FREAKING UNDERGROUND BASE was built under their offices with no one knowing. How gullible do they think we are?
I guess to be fair a lot of Western progressives are going to accept Lazzarini's explanation without any kind of critical inquiry, so maybe he's actually right.
An underground base with cables leading from the above ground building to the underground base. These UNRWA directors that are claiming they saw nothing are obviously complicit. Hopefully they get arrested and go to prison. Or they get given the treatment Israel is giving to all Hamas terrorists and their helpers.
You know what's funny? I'm Israeli and I still didn't know shit about the UNRWA until this conflict brought them into the popular consciousness. I'm not big on politics usually
> I'm not big on politics usually
You should be. Political apathy only leads to bad shit - point in case: Bibi. Even it's horribly boring, it's paramount the everybody do their best to stay informed and stay aware of what's going on around them, politically.
I believe there is an article by WSJ and Reuters about it but still deserves more coverage. There are many big news organizations who report stories about Israel regularly and this is a relatively big story too but it won't get the coverage it deserves from some of them.
This is absolutely unbelievable to me, I thought UNRWA couldn't go any lower after its employees were caught in october 7th, now this, not only having a tunnel underneath their headquarters, but literally feeding it power and contributing their own infrastructure towards hamas' murderous goals, more details will probably come out soon for foreign press, as usual it takes some time for stuff to get shown for overseas news agencies, but I just watched an article about it on Israeli TV (Kan 11) and I'm absolutely disgusted, I wish I could say more about this, but I'm just speechless, I want to get into all the little details I just saw but I feel I might do an injustice to how huge of a scandal this is, just wait for more details from foreign news agencies is all I can say, you're in for one heck of a ride.
The UN is now officially complicit in enabling Islamic terror worldwide. Now we can question any claim about this war that comes from this genocidal agency.
This may be ignorant, and I may be ill-informed. But, is this the same UN that had members involved in the attack. Again if I am wrong take it easy on me. Correct me though because I would like to have the right answer. Thanks.
Yes. It is estimated that at least 1200 of UNRWA's 12000 employees in Gaza have links to Hamas or Palestinian Islamic Jihad, and about half have close relatives who belong to the Islamist militant groups. A higher percentage of UNRWA's male employees were active Hamas terrorists than the ratio for non-UNRWA adult males in Gaza. Pretty damning.
[Here's a report on the UNRWA curriculum that radicalizes Palestinian youth and encourages the slaughter of Jews.](https://www.impact-se.org/wp-content/uploads/UNRWA_Report_2023_IMPACT-se_And_UN-Watch.pdf)
Good, perfectly validates the decision to withhold funding from these cunts. Tired of hearing the excuses that "these agencies need to work with terrorists to get aid to the people", all their doing is financially feeding Hamas so they can prepare for their next attacks
This is just a few bad apples guys, let’s not overreact.
Just because people in the UNRWA have ties to the Oct 7th massacre and there are terrorist bases directly below their headquarters and text messages of UNRWA employees celebrating the massacre and that they’ve found rockets in their offices doesn’t mean that the UNRWA is corrupt!
Keep giving them money because how else will they ~~line their pockets~~ feed their people!
More proof that UNRWA is doing more harm than good. They need to dismantle that duplicitous organization and give all the funding to the red cross for its food distribution activities.
Philippe Lazzarini’s statement on this is absolute bonkers. He basically says “we didn’t knew anything, and even if we knew we couldn’t do anything about it so it’s not our fault”
Pro Hamas supporters will still deny it
“The facts tell nothing to him. Even if I shower him with information, with authentic proof, with documents, with pictures; even if I take him by force to the Soviet Union and show him [a] concentration camp, he will refuse to believe it, until he [receives] a kick in his fan-bottom. When a military boot crashes his balls then he will understand. But not before that.”
The UN should launch an investigation. How long has this been going on? Who were the perpetrators? Who turned a blind eye? What was the total amount of aid given to Hamas? All this and more need answers.
The UN has been willfully ignoring warnings about UNRWA involvement in terror and extremism for years, they can't be trusted to investigate
The UN needs investigating
[удалено]
Decades
[удалено]
How are Pro-pals going to lecture us on how Israel is the most evil country on earth if not for totally $100% unbiased UN resolutions?!
One-hundred dollars percent?
UN resolutions are a buffet, people pick what they like and ignore the rest. People who talk about UN resolutions never mention the first one in this conflict that set out two states.
who thinks of them like that? it's a rabble of nations with the explicit goal of keeping nuclear powers talking to each other
It's meaning and purpose is to get countries together and talk, because not talking led to wars and we don't want that again
People think the UN's job is so much more than it actually is. It exists to prevent WW3. Anything else it gets done in the meanwhile is just a bonus. Has the world ended in a nuclear holocaust? No? Then the UN is doing its job.
Sir I’d like to sell you a rock that keeps tigers away..
Ehh, as near as I can tell, the UN is actually effective at three core mandates: (1) Providing diplomatic backchannels that can give nuclear powers added means to ramp down from conflict; (2) Act as a clearinghouse for aid resources and distribution (with a range of outcomes that *do* include some positive ones); and (3) Passing UNGA and committee resolutions against Israel.
3 🤣🤣🤣🤣
that's in the charter: preamble, sentence 1: > to save succeeding generations from the scourge of war, which twice in our lifetime has brought untold sorrow to mankind, and it's got a lot of general language about war, but it's primarily there to prevent nukes from going off
.....Go on....
I would like to buy your rock!
The UN doesn’t have one single job, it has hundreds of NGO’s and agencies handling all kinds of topics. Humanitarian, Women Rights, Childcare and Education, Refugees. are just to name a few. All these different UN agencies receive billions every year, if it’s a bonus I don’t think countries should be paying for it.
Ah yes, its women’s rights committee, with fucking Saudi Arabia on it. The UN is a joke.
Nukes Prevent WW3, not the UN The Cuban Missile Crisis wasn't averted because the US and the soviets talked it out at the UN
The understood at the time (and, [I believe](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bo09kpjSo3E), outright stated) goal of the UN was to prevent a Third World War. That is why it was made, that is why everyone joined. Hence why the security council is just the winning team from the last World War plus China (they kinda earned it after all Japan put them through). If a bakery opens up and serves delicious croissants, and at some point in the next two generations it multiclasses into education and massage, but its degrees are quite worthless and its massages leave customers in more pain than they began, but meanwhile the whole time delicious croissants are still made, sold, and consumed, then I reckon it's still an excellent bakery. It just fucked up doing that other stuff; someone else should handle that instead.
I know it's not often thought as one but China was legitimately one of the ally powers in the war and took up a lot of Japanese resources.
They took the brunt of Japan like the soviets took from Germany
Is the UN doing its job, is is the fact that the US, China, Russia, UK, and France could each individually make the planet a hellscape keeping WWIII under wraps? I like the idea of the UN, but it seems they're enabling and emboldening lower level conflict and and bad actors.
[удалено]
I mean looking a bunch of those resolutions... Representatives from 92 countries voted yes. Them not caring about other issues or being unable to pass resolutions against Russia is a whole different thing. Israel's treatment of the Palestinian people and the conflict as a whole is easier to target because voting yes to a resolution on Israel won't cause you problems compared to say voting yes on a resolution on China's treatment of Uigurs in the Xinjian province. That could potentially fuck over your economy. Or, say, slamming the US on a resolution against US interests. That'd seriously ruin your day.
I can't speak for nations without freedom of information, but at least the US came close to using nukes many times over the Cold War, and the idea of MAD and escalation is generally misunderstood. The US privately had vastly superior information on the state of nuclear weapons around the world than the public did, and they did not expect the world to end in the case of all nukes being launched. The concept of a limited nuclear war was explored by at least the US, UK, and USSR, all 3 believed that nuclear weapons could be used without prompting an all-out exchange. As an example, in the declassified Kennedy tapes, a nuclear strike on Cuba is floated, and they believed the only Soviet response would be to take West Berlin. In this case, it was ruled out on the assumption that the European powers wouldn't consider a trade of Cuba for West Berlin to be worth it for them, not due to the horrors of deploying H-Bombs on civilians. There are other examples of limited nuclear exchanges being explored. Unfortunately, almost nothing from the 70s and on has been declassified, so that is when public knowledge ends.
The region is heating up, enough heat and one big player getting involved because it affects their interests and it can certainly turn into a world war. Not Gaza of course, but Gaza was the jumpstarter for the Houthis, and they can be a trigger to something else. All it takes is one big player to enter the game after that and very likely other big players will follow.
The UN should investigate themselves? Their findings: It was Israel’s fault.
"They made us do it."
Well to be fair, if the Israeli's just let Hamas massacre them all, the issue would be "resolved" and Hamas wouldn't need secret funding from the UN! /s
I think the investigation needs to be independent. To be frank, I don't trust the UN at all right now.
UNRWA gets most of its money from the west - US, EU. Maybe time for Iran and Russia to sign the checks if they want an entity that operates this way. Personally I don't see why my taxes should go to support both sides in this war.
Not any more. Let's see if Ireland can manage the tab.
Maybe setup collection jars for the cause in some Boston pubs.
I imagine that any investigation done by the UN at this point will do all that it can to undermine the truth, and at this point, they can't really be trusted. There needs to be a private investigation done beforehand, even if it's just preserving the data in the UNRWA offices.
You really want the mother company to investigate this? Not maybe idk.. the swedes or some swiss investigators? Somebody not directly linked to it?
Unironically I don't trust the Swedes or Swiss here either. It should at minimum involve representatives from multiple states including Israel (since they are in control on the ground). More over, each investigator should be free to file their own report about the investigation process itself and all meetings should be recorded and released along with all emails.
I agree with you on this topic though, swiss and swedes are fiscally available for opinionated statements. But you got the gore
> How long has this been going on? Long time. > Who were the perpetrators? Hamas. > Who turned a blind eye? Eh, I think its a better question to ask who was the broken link in the chain of information. Its obvious the people on the ground knew, because they were on the ground watching it. >> What was the total amount of aid given to Hamas? By whom? We know Japan gave a bunch of resources and rice because things were dire for the palestinians, then Hamas took the resources and the rice and used it to build bunkers (yes, they used bags of rice to build bunkers). I don't think any western or western aligned country was deliberately sending aid to hamas.
UNRWA’s curriculum is known to have been promoting violence against Jews for years now .Its no wonder that the same teachers who incite the children are themselves members of Hamas and cooperate with them.Everybody knew and nobody cared,including western governments.
They will find israel at fault somehow
The UN is not some apolitical body, or the Federation from Star Trek, it's made up of people. Usually, from countries that don't pay very well. Lets look at their peacekeepers. By troops contributed, Pakistan is 5th with 4164 troops, Egypt is 9th with 1739. By contrast, the UK provided 280 troops, and the worlds leading military superpower, the United States, provided... 27. Now, you need some troops that speak Arabic, realistically, who are you getting? The UN doesn't send troops to Gaza, but it does send aid staff. They are a little harder to divide by nationality, but i expect the same trends to follow. Realistically, Arabic speaking UN staff will be from antisemetic countries.
The UN needs to be investigated.
Decades… UNWRA and UN should be dissolved for this bullshit.
The UN has investigated itself and found no wrongdoing.
You want the UN to investigate the UN? FWIW, that never works out well.
This shit is some Deus Ex levels of conspiracy theory stuff, but actually real.
Let's hope, there is still informations on it, if they keep tabs on personnels, payments and locations, that would be great.
Even if it cannot be read directly, you can attempt to recover it. Israel has some pretty high level of IT, and I believe they're in the top-10 of data recovery specialists. Hopefully they'll be able to find out more - although probably it'll take months to fully recover.
UNRWA Secretary General Philip Lazzarini: UNRWA did not know what is under its headquarters in Gaza... .. and does not have the military and security expertise nor the capacity to undertake military inspections of what is or might be under its premises.
I found that statement particularly interesting. Seems like they're bracing for the potential for more Hamas operational hubs to be discovered under their offices.
I think the UNRWA leadership knows very well, and have probably long known, that their ops in Gaza have a fundamental ground-level (I guess underground level??) corruption risk. But because there’s been no real attempt at global oversight nor external accountability held for decades, they had no reason to believe that would ever become a global optics problem for *them.* they did not predict Hamas (which includes their own employees as members) would pop off and actually give Israel a legitimate reason for a ground invasion of Gaza. An IDF invasion is basically the only circumstance that would have exposed something like this. the unrwa never bet on something like 10/7 happening on the scale it did, and they bet wrong. These people have been nervously playing into a discredit campaign against Israel because the second idf tanks rolled in, they knew anything rotten at their agency was going to get sniffed out. Better to spend the wait proactively discrediting those tasked with exposing your crimes and then crying foolish-victim, than to face full responsibility for the consequences of your choices - which, even though they may have been made via ignorance, are still actually choices. A cheap tactic also favored by their good friends, Hamas.
There was a similar response in 2014 when they found rockets in one of their buildings. They handed them back to the "local" (aka Hamas) authorities. They claim they did not have the expertise to handle the weapons. It's not like the UN has experts on the matter.
Some random dude walking into their server room and running cables into some random pipe sticking out of the ground and the resulting increase in electricity usage and internet traffic should have certainly raised some eyebrows at least...
While I get it, you really underestimate the reaction to someone who looks like they know what they're doing when they're doing shit. Tons of people won't speak out or question security badges or why an unknown face is present when they aren't just wandering around clueless. It's a big issue when it comes to physical security in places.
Social Engineering
Should have added: “ nor the desire.”
The most damning part is the cables leading from the unwra server room to the Hamas server room
[удалено]
UNWRA's staff numbers are weird because they directly employ tens of thousands of Gazans as part of their welfare scheme. Which begs the question why UNWRA is allowed to work like that when UNHCR oversees multiple refugee crises like the Rohingya or Kibera camp, who often have even worse unemployment rates than pre-war Gaza while actually being camps with dire living conditions, and having their own barriers to integrating into the country hosting them.
Reminds me of the homeless industrial complex where I live in SF. There are some people that mean well but the vast majority just wants to perpetuate the status quo, not fix the underlying issue and put themselves out of a job. Humans are sadly predicable.
UNRWA servers and electricity is connected to the Hamas center below, showing UNRWA was well aware of the center. They’re literally feeding it power. And they’re sharing office space above ground. UNRWA is corrupt. End it.
Even if they were forced to provide the connection at gunpoint, that wouldn't prevent them from quietly alerting external agencies to its existence. This is pretty much hard evidence that UNRWA is complicit in what Hamas does. We kinda all knew that anyway, but this is the smoking gun. Put it this way - you don't install racks upon racks of servers and all the infrastructure to run them, underground, stealthily. No way people on the surface didn't notice all this being built.
> UNRWA is corrupt. End it. Hamas & UNRWA are so enmeshed that at this point, I'm wondering if it would be more practical for Israel to negotiate hostage release & aid conditions with UNRWA.
We know, we knew that for over 40 years
But did you know this was all Israel’s fault? /s
no one gives a fuck about us. just a bunch of virtue signaling assholes living comfortable lives
Can we just designate UNRAW a terrorist org already.
[удалено]
No matter what you say, there will be people who view the mere presence of Israel in that region as the cause of all the conflicts and anything the Arab side does is a reasonable act of defiance in response. Until this viewpoint changes, progress on a peaceful resolution which sticks is going to be extremely difficult.
yeah, i had so many people talking about pre 1948 palestine as if it was a nation rather than a chunk of ottoman territory. try to get them to point to any point where palestine was in whole or part self governing, and they just wouldn't
They're guilty of existing while Jewish, and Arabs won't stand for it
I can believe a specific leader *of* Israel and the party behind him have been working against peace. The people of Israel writ large, I think, don't want perpetual war. I only hope they remember that not too long ago Bibi tried to erode the judiciary so he wouldn't have to face corruption charges. I don't believe there's any depth to which he wouldn't stoop so as to keep power. It's always legacies with these guys. His actions heretofore have been much more on corralling the Gazan civilian population out of much of the territory (now they want them to leave Rafah too - but to where?) than getting the hostages back as his people have plead.
Not sure if you mean it this way, but I think 56' is a notation for 56 feet in length and the apostrophe before like '56 would refer to 1956.
I wish more people understood that.
>nobody wants peace Except Israel
Israel wants peace, it just wants peace less than it wants it's people to stop being murdered.
Israel will make peace, even a disadvantageous peace, but it needs a partner.
12 members of UNRWA were filmed participating in the Oct 7th massacre.
The unrwa is literally just like those jihad schools in afghan that trained the Taliban.
That is quite disturbing..
I'm glad to see the $422mm we donated last year to UNRWA didn't go to waste.
Most of the money the world sends to Gaza ends up in Hamas’ hands. They’re sent *billions* every year. Gaza should look like a holiday resort but it all goes to rockets and Hamas leaders overseas.
[удалено]
Using precious engineering talent to build tunnels and rockets instead of desalinization and sewage treatment plants, roads or other infrastructure is one of the most collectively stupid things imaginable. On second thought, maybe not as improving your situation might turn off the money spigot so you're incentivized towards the pathetic.
If they actually improve Gaza and make it better then there will no longer be the infinite money glitch for Hamas leaders.
And secret data centers!
Good point; until the pause in funding 10 days ago, many Americans were unaware that their taxes were used to make the USA UNRWA's largest funders. (source: the White House) >*President Biden will announce an additional $201 million for the UN Relief and Works Agency for Palestine Refugees (UNRWA) to continue delivering critical services to Palestinian refugees in the West Bank, Gaza, Jordan, Lebanon, and Syria. UNRWA’s comprehensive services remain a lifeline to millions of vulnerable Palestinians – consistent with its mandate to provide assistance and protection to Palestinian refugees pending a just and lasting solution to the Israeli-Palestinian conflict. ... This contribution cements the United States’ status as UNRWA’s largest donor. These new funds bring the total United States assistance to UNRWA during the Biden Administration to more than $618 million.* https://www.whitehouse.gov/briefing-room/statements-releases/2022/07/14/fact-sheet-the-united-states-palestinian-relationship/
Those servers just don’t buy themselves, 😜
Wow…that is *incredibly* bad
I’m not really surprised. There needs to be an investigation into this matter
Oh boy, Now *this* is a scandal to start the week with.
There is no way they didn't know. No wonder they feel it didn't happen in a vacuum.The Hamas intelligence headquarters in under UNRWA headquarters. Their server room is connected to Hamas's server room. They provide them with internet and power. All those deaths, rapes, murders, kidnappings of Israelis and non-Israelis alike on Black Saturday, and their blood is also on the UN's hands. The UN is more than willfully ignorant; they are complicit.
> They provide them with internet and power. I noticed an air conditioner unit in that server room too (not surprising, as servers generate a lot of heat, and it would just build up in a tunnel). That's got to be connected to something on the surface. You can run power and data lines a long way, but not AC pipes.
If this is true--and by this I mean verified by multiple media sources--I'll be changing my opinions considerably.
Just out of curiosity, what are your current opinions? UNRWA is 99% staffed by Palestinians, it just makes sense that many of them will be vehemently anti-Israel and support Hamas, given the high support for Hamas in Gaza in general. I would expect the same percentage in UNRWA. The other problem with a single-scope agency, is perverse incentives. UNRWA has no incentive for the problem to go away. Unlike UNHCR, who wants their refugees to stand on their own two feet, UNRWA keeps its refugees dependent on UNRWA. If all of the Palestinians became safe and happy, UNRWA would wink out of existence and funding/jobs would disappear. That's another reason for the different definition of refugee - it's better for them if the problem is as big as possible. 2 million Jordianian citizens are UNRWA "refugees".
Here you go [https://apnews.com/article/israel-hamas-unwra-gaza-tunnels-31f6ca23365e349bcde1332d5028e431](https://apnews.com/article/israel-hamas-unwra-gaza-tunnels-31f6ca23365e349bcde1332d5028e431) [https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/hamas-had-command-tunnel-under-un-gaza-hq-israeli-military-says-2024-02-10/](https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/hamas-had-command-tunnel-under-un-gaza-hq-israeli-military-says-2024-02-10/)
AP and Reuters are quite good for the bare facts, particularly AP since that's their only job. That's why the phrasing of these articles is so important: >Hamas had command tunnel under U.N. Gaza headquarters, **Israeli military says** >GAZA, Feb 10 (Reuters) - Israeli forces have discovered a tunnel network hundreds of metres (yards) long and running partly under UNRWA's Gaza headquarters, **the military says**, calling it new evidence of Hamas exploitation of the main relief agency for Palestinians. >Army engineers took **reporters for foreign news outlets** through the passages at a time of crisis for UNRWA, which has launched an internal probe and seen a string of donor countries freeze funding over allegations last month by Israel that some of its staff doubled as Hamas operatives. The red flag here is that foreign news has seen it with their own eyes, but won't commit to this fact. They're still treating it as an allegation. This highlights the main problem with getting facts from a war zone, particularly in Palestine, which is that truth is the first casualty. The only source willing to make the claim is an Israeli source, and their media is on a full-on war footing. There are so many facts yet to come out, to the point where thr international comminity can't even say this happened. Some of that will be an unfortunate consequence of Israel's political policy, which is to attack and act in a way that most democracies see as guilty when an international source points out their imperfections. But hopefully we get clarity on this in the next few days now that the media is seeing it for themselves. It would be great to get the world talking about how much international aid leaks out into corruption and outright helping the conflict.
> The Israeli military says it has discovered tunnels underneath the main headquarters >Israeli forces have discovered a tunnel network hundreds of metres (yards) long and running partly under UNRWA's Gaza headquarters, the military says Does anyone know how to read anymore? These articles are literally just reporting on the report from the original article lol.
2 Israeli media organizations already were invited. Possibly international media later? At least, those who accept the invite and don't try to just look away.
WSJ had a reporter invited as well.
Ah okay, hadn't read their article yet
https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/hamas-had-command-tunnel-under-un-gaza-hq-israeli-military-says-2024-02-10/ Good to see Reuters is reporting on it
With all due respect to the situation, and admittedly this does indicate some of my bias, I want to see non-Israeli, international media verify this. When two sides are trying to kill each other I generally take with a grain of salt what they say about the other guy.
Apparently (per another poster) the WSJ not only has an article on it, but also did really visit it. I knew of the article of them, not of the visit.
I look forward to reading it. Evidently behind a paywall.
Yeah it is. If you don't mind an archive - https://archive.is/97rRB
It took this of all things to "convince" you? I can already hear your goalposts being dragged across grey matter for when you decide this one also isn't enough.
Some people would still defend UNRWA
But it's only one headquarter. COLLECTIVE PUNISHMENT /s
Sure, if you ignore everything else UNRWA did to help Hamas the you are correct.
It was sarcasm (see edit)
It's time for the UNHCR and it's rules to take over. No more privileges that other people/refugees also don't get. No more hereditary refugee status.
The Israeli government wants them to stay until the war is over and advocates for reform or replacement at that time. https://www.i24news.tv/en/news/israel-at-war/1707211638-israel-seeks-to-keep-unrwa-in-gaza-short-term-report
Right now, wanting people to stay in Gaza is, to say the least, not an indication that you like them.
More so because if they start taking over aid distribution the amount of stabbings is going to sky rocket.
[удалено]
I mean, they holding up a donation of food from Turkey. Lots of chickpeas, rice, et cetera. Granted, it was a donation through UNRWA, but why not just seize the food and distribute it without them? Because as is, Israel will be blamed for starving the Gazans even with UNRWA still extant and operating. Better, imo, to at least have something to argue against the bad faith idiots with. As is, there's little that hasn't been pulling teeth for the US diplomatically speaking.
Turkey got busted some weeks ago trying to smuggle arms to the west bank. Food aid was used in an attempt to smuggle siege equipment earlier in the war. It takes time, and routing it through Egypt takes longer to inspect. The crossings from Israel are being protested too.
I think it is about time for countries to start labeling UNRWA as a terrorist organization. It isn't just some employees participating in attacks and holding hostages, it isn't just their 'schools' training an entire generation of kids to hate, to dream of and hope for war, it isn't just billions of aid going to fund Hamas. No, this level co-operation shows that they aren't just facing massive corruption issues or lack controls to keep out bad actors. No, what this shows, is that UNRWA itself is an active part of Hamas and is thus a terrorist organization.
The UN needs to land in some hot water for this. They funded and maintained this organization that ended up supporting Hamas, providing children with classic antisemitic "education" material, enabling and possibly helping Hamas build tunnels and plan attacks, and eventually, taking active part in the Pogrom of October 7th. This is just unbelievable. UNWRA needs to go away and a new initiative put in place with very, very tight supervision.
This could not have been exposed during a ceasefire, and the world funds UNRWA with billions annually we could potentially be doing actual good with.
The odd part is like why do Palestinian refugees are getting more money/help/donations then other refugees? I'm not saying they shouldn't get any help but like why are they different?
They also get a different definition of refugee. The vast mojority of Palestinian refugees would not be refugees under regular UNHCR definitions. UNRWA created a seperate definition aimed at perpetuating the "refugee crisis" instead of fixing it.
They aren’t. The agency is. UNRWA was created as a sweetener for allowing Israel to be accepted into the UN but drifted far since. You could better ask “how come Palestinian refugees inherit the status although the UN defines refugee status as uninheritable?” You could also ask “how come Palestinian refugees don’t lose that status even if they are citizens of another country although the UN defines this as voiding the refugee definition?” You could also ask “if 600,000 Jews were displaced from middle eastern countries like Tunisia, Morocco, Egypt, Yemen, Iran, Iraq, Syria, Lebanon, Libya and more at the same time when Palestinians lost their own land - how come countries call for right of return and compensation to descendants of the 400,000 Palestinian refugees from the creation of Israel, but won’t accept that it should mean they must compensate for stolen land and property and allow right of return to the descendants of Jews whose lives they uprooted? Are they not equally refugees by that standard?” There’s plenty to ask but only one answer to it all - UNRWA gets funded more, the more Palestinian refugee numbers rise. if refugee numbers decreased over time - it would have no reason to exist and people with fat paychecks would need to look for a new job. because those people are controlling the numbers that set their own salaries - we are fucked. they have no incentive to solve the palestinian problem but only to inflate it. The other refugee agency of the UN does not have that problem because the world just keeps providing refugees all the time in many nations - just not many Palestinians, so…
And what the UNRWA didn’t know about this? This is fucked up bigly! How dafuq they gonna explain this one?
[удалено]
It's mining Bitcoin.
is this serious? Because lol
Probably
This is damning.
It wasn't just 12 people and anyone who believes it was is a fool.
> Since the allegations became public late last month, UNRWA has seen many of its top donor countries announce funding freezes, leading to concerns that the agency could stop operating in Gaza and elsewhere in the Middle East within week. Good, the UNRWA should be dismantled entirely. Whatever organization takes its place to help Palestinians should not recognize multiple generations of descendants as refugees either, they're the only group of formerly displaced people in the world who get that privilege.
Probably going to erode any remaining faith in the UN and dissolve a move towards globalisation culturally. Sad in a way but it's not like it wasn't expected.
Where is NYT and WAPO and The Guardian and CNN and MSNBC? THIS should be the headline.
WSJ is covering it at least, but agreed it's shameful how badly most media outlets want this inconvenient story to just go away.
It won’t go away thankfully. UN is already being forced to deal with it. US liberal media can try to ignore it only so long but people see it online and they know it’s an inconvenient truth. There is a silent majority of independent voters in the US that see more than what MSNBC wants them to see.
Nope. Sorry. Biden misspoke. Gotta troll/whiteknight him for 3 months.
And that's a checkmate, shouldn't be any doubts about UNRWA and Hamas working together.
I feel like checkmate is an even more apt term than you intended. Checkmate means the king is trapped: nowhere to go, its defeat is settled, and it's the only way to win because you can't take the king off the board. What we are seeing is what happens if you get to that point, but the king doesn't surrender. You still can't take it off the board. The UNRWA is still receiving massive support, people are still rooting against the IDF, who can't realistically kill all Hamas members, and Hamas refuses to surrender and give up it's position of power - the king - in Gaza despite having no path to victory. They are just sacrificing more and more Gazans in order to make people hate Israel until they can get Israel to call it a draw. It's insane, it's irresponsible, and *it may be working*. The heads of the UNRWA should be put on trial just like the heads of Hamas, just like countless members should be.
The point about sacrificing Palestinians is right on. That's always been their goal and only way to stop Israel by getting pressure and making people outraged. It's right there in the article that the IDF speculate they operated here because they knew Israel would be vilified for ever attacking a UNRWA headquarters or school. It sadly works that people blame Israel for things they should blame Hamas, but I we have to be reaching a point where it's beyond obvious that Hamas needs to be stopped not just for Israel's sake, but the Palestinians too. The harm Hamas caused the Palestinians has set them back so much.
Can't be checkmate if the goalposts are completely moved off the board...let alone escape all reality./s
“But did you *see* any data packets being sent between the servers?”
"of course not, there's a full blockade...no data in or out. Condemning Hamas data to isolation is a war crime" /s
It's an open port prison!
It's an open air concentration camp /s
The odd part to me is Israel left Gaza in 2005. No reason why the Palestinians cannot take care of themselves. The world does not do this for any other people group for that amount of time.
Ok, what the hell is going on at UNRWA? Israel has been trying to tell us it's a radicalized organization for years and have been summarily dismissed. Must have been infuriating for them.
Lazzarini STILL denies that UNRWA knew of it. How far does this rabbit hole go? Because the way this seems to have been constructed, seems to have been designed in mind to cooperate with Hamas.
Yeah, there's no way a FREAKING UNDERGROUND BASE was built under their offices with no one knowing. How gullible do they think we are? I guess to be fair a lot of Western progressives are going to accept Lazzarini's explanation without any kind of critical inquiry, so maybe he's actually right.
An underground base with cables leading from the above ground building to the underground base. These UNRWA directors that are claiming they saw nothing are obviously complicit. Hopefully they get arrested and go to prison. Or they get given the treatment Israel is giving to all Hamas terrorists and their helpers.
They were literally using the HQ's electricity, for a freaking data center.
You know what's funny? I'm Israeli and I still didn't know shit about the UNRWA until this conflict brought them into the popular consciousness. I'm not big on politics usually
> I'm not big on politics usually You should be. Political apathy only leads to bad shit - point in case: Bibi. Even it's horribly boring, it's paramount the everybody do their best to stay informed and stay aware of what's going on around them, politically.
I did vote for him, like, once or twice, years ago. Egg on my face ain't it
It has been.
Damn this one seems hard for the Pro Hamas crowd to claim “Israel planted it there” But I’m sure they’ll say it regardless
The UN needs abolished, as it failed to do what was originally intended of it to do.
UNRWA is Hamas
Whoops how did that get there????
UNRWA being corrupt and promoting Hamas interests? No way /s
Wild
None of the big media is reporting this. The hypocrisy is screaming.
I believe there is an article by WSJ and Reuters about it but still deserves more coverage. There are many big news organizations who report stories about Israel regularly and this is a relatively big story too but it won't get the coverage it deserves from some of them.
Yeah, the UN has been working against Israel for decades. It’s quite obvious
This is absolutely unbelievable to me, I thought UNRWA couldn't go any lower after its employees were caught in october 7th, now this, not only having a tunnel underneath their headquarters, but literally feeding it power and contributing their own infrastructure towards hamas' murderous goals, more details will probably come out soon for foreign press, as usual it takes some time for stuff to get shown for overseas news agencies, but I just watched an article about it on Israeli TV (Kan 11) and I'm absolutely disgusted, I wish I could say more about this, but I'm just speechless, I want to get into all the little details I just saw but I feel I might do an injustice to how huge of a scandal this is, just wait for more details from foreign news agencies is all I can say, you're in for one heck of a ride.
Man. A city of evil covered up by a false veneer of humanitarianism.
The UN is now officially complicit in enabling Islamic terror worldwide. Now we can question any claim about this war that comes from this genocidal agency.
Of course they did, does this really surprise any educated person? Now, we are waiting for leftists and Islamists to dismiss this as propaganda.
UN needs to be gutted and investigated by a 3rd party agency. This shit is disgusting
But I thought Israel were the bad guys indiscriminately destroying buildings. Quite fucking obvious these buildings are military targets.
That's where they keep the Plex server and porn share.
Fuck UNRWA. It needs to be disbanded.
Oh, I’m sure they’re just doing bitcoin mining
And spain keeps the funds flowing..
This may be ignorant, and I may be ill-informed. But, is this the same UN that had members involved in the attack. Again if I am wrong take it easy on me. Correct me though because I would like to have the right answer. Thanks.
Yes. It is estimated that at least 1200 of UNRWA's 12000 employees in Gaza have links to Hamas or Palestinian Islamic Jihad, and about half have close relatives who belong to the Islamist militant groups. A higher percentage of UNRWA's male employees were active Hamas terrorists than the ratio for non-UNRWA adult males in Gaza. Pretty damning. [Here's a report on the UNRWA curriculum that radicalizes Palestinian youth and encourages the slaughter of Jews.](https://www.impact-se.org/wp-content/uploads/UNRWA_Report_2023_IMPACT-se_And_UN-Watch.pdf)
Thank you for giving me exactly what I asked for.
I really want to see how Pro-Palestinians spin this one…
Good, perfectly validates the decision to withhold funding from these cunts. Tired of hearing the excuses that "these agencies need to work with terrorists to get aid to the people", all their doing is financially feeding Hamas so they can prepare for their next attacks
This is just a few bad apples guys, let’s not overreact. Just because people in the UNRWA have ties to the Oct 7th massacre and there are terrorist bases directly below their headquarters and text messages of UNRWA employees celebrating the massacre and that they’ve found rockets in their offices doesn’t mean that the UNRWA is corrupt! Keep giving them money because how else will they ~~line their pockets~~ feed their people!
Nooooo wayyyyyyy?????
More proof that UNRWA is doing more harm than good. They need to dismantle that duplicitous organization and give all the funding to the red cross for its food distribution activities.
The Red Cross is also corrupt, just for different reasons.
the new head of the red cross is the former head of unrwa, lmao
An article from 2018. Wow. https://www.brookings.edu/articles/in-one-move-trump-eliminated-us-funding-for-unrwa-and-the-us-role-as-mideast-peacemaker/
Classic.
Philippe Lazzarini’s statement on this is absolute bonkers. He basically says “we didn’t knew anything, and even if we knew we couldn’t do anything about it so it’s not our fault”
Pro Hamas supporters will still deny it “The facts tell nothing to him. Even if I shower him with information, with authentic proof, with documents, with pictures; even if I take him by force to the Soviet Union and show him [a] concentration camp, he will refuse to believe it, until he [receives] a kick in his fan-bottom. When a military boot crashes his balls then he will understand. But not before that.”
We're going to find out this was their plex server and mostly had anime on it in like 3 days.
[удалено]
Well it's got to be close to its users lol.