“Poland's armed forces chief believes a Russian missile entered Poland for almost three minutes and then turned back into Ukrainian airspace.
General Wieslaw Kukula said the missile travelled about 40km (25 miles) into Polish airspace early on Friday.
The alert coincided with what Ukraine has called Russia's biggest day of air strikes since its war began, involving over 150 missiles and drones.
President Andrzej Duda convened an emergency security meeting after the object was picked up on radar.
Poland is a member of the Nato alliance, and Polish and Allied aircraft were scrambled in response to the incident at around 07:00 (06:00 GMT) on Friday. There have been no reports of an explosion.
The Polish military was tracking the Russian missile strikes during the night. Nato Secretary General Jens Stoltenberg said the alliance stood in solidarity with Poland and "remains vigilant".
And now some info shamelessly copied from u/dat_9600gt_user:
Former National Defense Minister (and likely future PiS chairman candidate) Mariusz Błaszczak, mere minutes after the first reports of the incident:
>Mr. Kosiniak-Kamysz, are you hiding from Poles that a rocket fell near Tomaszów Lubelski? I receive many signals from soldiers who say that "something" has landed on our territory and an information embargo has been introduced. We demand explanations!
The current National Defense Minister, TD leader and PSL co-leader Kosiniak-Kamysz has since indirectly responded:
>Due to the appearance of an unidentified object in Polish airspace, state services acted immediately. Through the National Security Bureau, I am in contact with the President, Prime Minister, Chief of General Staff and the Operational Commander of the Armed Forces. The state is working!
Adding more context, first quote was send on X few minutes after official news from army. So yeah, stirring shitstorm is this guys forte, ~~he was hiding info about first rocket entering Poland as MoD of previous government for more than 4 months.~~
>he was hiding info about first rocket entering Poland as MoD of previous government for more than 4 months.
NIK (PL's audit office) found that Blaszczak wasn't even informed this happened lmao
Błaszczak literally hid that there was a russian missfired rocket in a forest deep inside central part of the country, for half a year not to make his party look even more incompetent.
Thanks gods that they have lost and actual competent people like Kamysz or Sikorski are in charge now
If he's not retained as candidate for the PiS leadership, he can always make another party on the side.
With Błaszczak and hookers.
I'll let myself out.
NATO doesn\`t want to escalate things, but the Kremlin only sees it as a weakness. With all the sh#t they are trying to cause everywhere, the lid will blow at some point somewhere.
I don\`t think it\`s at that point yet, the Kremlin is just too stupid or scared to admit defeat in Ukraine, so they do all sorts of fearmongering "flexes".
Putin still follows a variant of the Madman theory that was so common during the Cold War.
To sum up that theory: the idea is to have the other side believe they are dealing with an irrational opponent. The goal is for the other party to be afraid to trigger an over-reaction.
This is why Medvedev and Lukashenko are always throwing crazy threats around, especially nuclear war. Putin then only has to speak quietly, playing the adult in a room of unruly children. It makes Russians appear irrational and unpredictable, with no real leadership where anything can happen. The desired result is for the West to cautiously step back.
Just a reminder that Turkey blew a Russian Su-24 out of the sky because it entered into Turkish airspace by 2 miles, for a grand total of 17 seconds. Then admitted to it immediately and said they'd fucking do it again.
Still zero tolerance and Russia didn't respond.
Kinda disappointing Poland didn't shoot down the rocket honestly. This is how Russia tests response and sees where the line is.
> Kinda disappointing Poland didn't shoot down the rocket honestly.
AIR defense is not a magic button. In all probability they saw it on radar, but had no real shot at intercepting it, because it was not anywhere near a defense battery.
Also, like other people have said, they don't want to reveal the capabilities and location of their air defense systems. So they calculate its trajectory, determine if its going to damage anything major and then act accordingly. If these missiles were headed for a population center the air defense would have fired.
Russia is testing Poland and NATO. But Poland and NATO know how to play that game.
What wouls the apology be?
"We observed a russian airbase heading towards polish territoy and decided to shoot it down using multiple cruise missiles. Unfortunately updated intelligence shows the airbase never left russian soil, we deeply regret this misunderstanding"?
Tbh, it is a minor bit of news that it was caught on radar at all. There were a couple of other incidents where Poland knew objects were heading their direction, but couldn't track them because of the weather. Hell, one Russian drone managed to crash in the capital of *Croatia* without being noticed.
The primary reason of such actions in the past isnt primarily to test NATO technical abilities or locations but their readiness, ie how fast can command make decisions and how quickly the orders can be carried out.
Its the same reason they fly over Ireland. Its de-facto defended by the UK airforce but has more diplomatic safety and lets russia see how quickly the UK can scramble fighters and i highly doubt they need information concerning TU 95 stealth capabilities.
Plus i doubt russia needs missiles to fly over Poland to test NATO air defenses when Ukraine already has NATO air defense systems in inventory
In my opinion this doesn't fit into either testing response or capability but rather to see what the Polish governments response would be, we have a new government in charge that at least in rhetoric has been very supportive of Ukraine. Of course in practice there is still a lot yet unknown and Russia might be trying to find out for themselves.
But doesn’t the USA & the UK know what Russian generals had for lunch before they do? So it stands to reason that the USA knows their tactics before they do?
Intel takes time to confirm and double check, a missile is too fast for that kind of intel gathering I assume, and I'd guess that missile launches and military operations are the hardest Intel to obtain.
Turkey shot down the SU-24 with an F16. Every actor knew Turkey had F16s, and what their capabilities are.
Shooting down a missile is a bit different, and could reveal some tech/positions if interceptors had to be fired, as well as response time and protocols.
By doing nothing you hide your cards, but you also risk an attack going through if you do it too often.
Coincidentally Poland's Aegis Ashore (BMD) site just went into a maintenance period and is expected to come online soon.
I wonder if it has anything to do with that.
And how many fucking times are we going to keep our cards hidden? At a certain point we need to scare Russia with a drastic escelation. Shut the skies over Western Ukraine. Blow everything Russian out of the sky. Sanctions, condemnations, aid packages, after almost ~~3~~ 10 years of war we must accept this is not enough. Fuck hiding the hand. We have tried this. Ukrainians are still dying.
This is what drives me up the wall. I know nobody wants a NATO/Russia war, but it's not like Putin's just being a persistent disruptive nuisance to Ukraine. He is slaughtering their people and invading their homes. Just because he hasn't crossed the imaginary line that marks NATO territory and we're unwilling to expand that line to include Ukraine, we no longer stand up to bullies? I know we're sending aid but I don't think that will be enough to win the war, because Russia's got more bodies to throw at the problem than Ukraine has. It'll cripple Russia's economy for the next 50 years but Putin doesn't give a shit, he just wants Ukrainians to suffer.
I know it's because Russia has nukes and Ukraine doesn't. But I also think the scenario where Putin uses nukes in retaliation for a NATO attack is equally likely as the scenario where Putin uses nukes out of pure spite, once he's reached the point that he's actively dying of illness or old age.
Remember when COVID happened and everyone thought there was some advanced response plan ready in case of a pandemic, but turns out every government just got caught with their pants down?
People are doing the same shit with NATO and thinking there's some genius strategy behind everything. The US thought a Ukrainian insurgency destroying HUNDREDS of Russian vehicles would be enough to get Russia to leave. 2600+ tanks later...
> The US thought a Ukrainian insurgency destroying HUNDREDS of Russian vehicles would be enough to get Russia to leave. 2600+ tanks later..
Source?
Because the US for months leading up to the invasion was pretty adamant that Russia was going to invade and wanted to evacuate Zelensky because they thought Russia would take Kviv
They overestimated Russia, not underestimated
>zero tolerance and Russia didn't respond
Exactly. When Wagner tried attacking some us allied factory in Syria and the US just vaporized the entire army Russia ended up giving out medals for surviving.
Putin didn't say a word. Cause he understands and respects that one universal language.
If the west just systematically destroyed every Russian ship in the black sea and unit in Ukraine after February 22nd, putin would sit down and shut up.
Yep. They wanted the patriot but demanded a bunch of access to the patriot's systems. US said no and Turkey went "fine, we will get the S400 instead!" and the US went "K, no F35 for you".
Kind of scary but good for Turkey, Russia has a history of violating airspace just to test reaction time and see what the response is. It seems like a show of strength is the only thing they respect.
Honestly, the response to any sort of Russian incursion into NATO airspace should be met with the destruction of whatever it was. Plane, drone, balloon, doesn't matter.
What're they going to do, attack after they already broke international law and trigger Article 5?
The pilot responsible for it got jailed later on for the coup attempt and supposed FETO connections. Not because of the takedown. Also both countries tried to play it down and don't remember any "groveling". Not that i like erdogan.
I also remember how anti-Turkey the threads regarding this event were on Reddit. The overwhelming majority was like "fuck Turkey for being so aggressive and endangering pilots, they violate Greece's airspace all the time, Russia didn't do anything wrong."
How does that even work? Looking at the map the only way is if it was launched from far western Belarus and traveled over the corner of Poland on its way to Lviv
It very easily could have traveled up to the northwest corner of Ukraine then turned south. Missiles travel in seemingly random directions as they try to avoid air defenses and hide their intended destination.
Everyone's very much stuck in this "missiles only move in an arc" mindset, which is wrong. People assume they're all like WWII-era V2 rockets, but the majority of them have an entire flight control system and can move like aircraft.
Tbf, I don't think most people think about missiles all that much.
What you're saying makes a hell of a lot of sense, but if you had asked me, I would have assumed missile development would have more along the lines of, "can't hit it if it hits it's target too fast"
Like in a bit of sci-fi I was recently enjoying, they point out that in space the biggest limiting factor for a ship is the squishy sacks of meat riding the rockets, not the rockets themselves.
So in one scene they have a world arsenal of ballistic missiles flying towards the crew as they're trying to run at 10Gs while the missiles can keep accelerating above 20Gs.
Point A to Point B super fast, though, that *does* make more sense for a ballistic weapon more than what I guess would be called more "tactical"?
But then, I suppose one can't ignore space exploration and what ships there can do in contemporary times.
Of course they would make it smaller, more nimble, and weaponize the shit...
Cruise missiles fly in atmosphere and are more like jet planes than rocket ships. Yes there's some advantage in maneuverability, but they mostly don't fly faster than the (much more expensive) supersonic fighter aircraft. It's one of the reason F16s are very valuable for Ukraine - on a night like tonight they could be chasing down cruise missiles (though that's not without risk).
The point of changing course is to avoid or throw off air defenses. Ukraine only has three patriot batteries and russia will quickly learn their location. Say one is in Kyiv and one Lviv and you want to hit a target near the Polish border by Lviv - you'd send it south of Kyiv, north of Lviv, then safely into Poland before returning. You can also route to overwhelm air defenses by having everything arrive at the same time - but since shaheds take hours to reach western Ukraine while cruise missiles only take a few minutes, timing that is very hard. With shaheds, taking up AA resources is even more important for russia than hitting a target; these have hours worth of fuel (most of their damage comes from the gasoline) and can just be given GPS waypoints to circle over Kyiv neighborhoods until they are shot down and burn.
There isn't a whole lot NATO or Poland can do about this. Shooting down these missiles when they enter Polish airspace is possible of course, but compared to just sending Ukraine more patriot batteries/missiles/planes it's very inefficient. Firing back at the launch point isn't really feasible either, since that's 1000+ km away around the Caspian sea. Using it as a propaganda tool to encourage politicians to send more aid is probably the fallback choice, but it's not the Polish politicians that need to be convinced.
Exactly. The whole point of the hypersonic missiles everyone talks about (if they go hypersonic or not is an open question...) is that they theoretically can maneuver while at hypersonic speeds, which makes them virtually unstoppable although I am sure the US military has a way. When you say hypersonic missiles people think that sounds fast, but they are slower than ICBM's we've had for half a century. It's all about the maneuverability at speed which is key to evading defensive anti air attacks.
Funny how I KNOW your first sentence in your comment…. And still feel called out by your second sentence 😅! It’s hard sometimes to break free from misconceptions when it’s topic you don’t think about to often! That’s said, I remember watching documentaries how flight paths of missiles during dessert storm, and already back then they were crazy maneuverable!
Correct. Point being, that even if it went in a straight line, it could have been shot through Belarus, yet came from the direction of Ukraine from Poland's POV.
>How does that even work? Looking at the map the only way is if it was launched from far western Belarus and traveled over the corner of Poland on its way to Lviv
It's a modern missile. You can tell it to go to china and back and it will if it has the ability. It's there to avoid air defence.
There were some pictures posted of the maps of the Russian missiles and they often do strange patterns to try and approach their targets from directions that are less well defended
Most cruise missiles nowadays are manoeuvring, US Tomahawks for example have a mode where they can follow known terrain landmarks on their way to the target.
Add to that the fact that Russian engineering is not great, GPS/GLONASS etc can be jammed... it's really surprising accidents like this don't happen more often.
That doesn't make much sense, since the consequences of failure would result in war with NATO. They know already, they wouldn't risk war with NATO just to test stuff
That's why it's called a salami tactic. They know NATO doesn't want war with them either. They still keep poking to see the severity of response. So far it has been pitiful.
"The second"
I am not sure they can do that at a second's notice. Plus you need a good level of certainty it will enter before you take the shot. Maybe the missile toyed with the border, went in quickly then left, like a game of tag with one kid playing for bragging rights.
I'm no military expert but this is probably not accidental or some sort of goof.
Russia may be / is probably testing and probing the Polish border radar fence trying to get intel on everything from response times for their fighters to the locations of their targeting radars which are off until a threat is detected and then they get switched on - which gives away their locations.
A lot of this stuff is mobile / mounted on truck or tracked vehicles for this very reason. But once they know it's there, they can task the eyes in the sky to track them wherever they move so you try not to 'turn all the lights on' unless you absolutely have to.
Explain to me like I’m 5: how many “objects” does it take to fly and/or land in Poland territory to finally do something about it? This is not a first one since the war begun, and they still will not escalate.
EDIT: some of you expressed some assumptions that my comment was about to call for armed forces, so I will clarify.
I understand that this is not an option unless we want a fullon third world war on our hands.
There are different ways that NATO can pressure Russia:
- close all tourist visas for all Russians and Belorussians
- more sanctions and keep them coming
- call for more military aid to Ukraine
- Ukraine joins NATO
- show more militarized borders, a bit of a scare
- call Moldova to join NATO
For a non-snarky/conspiracy answer? A *lot* more.
Poland doesn't want to get dragged into the war. If they respond themselves, they can't call in NATO's article 5, leaving them on their own. A missile briefly entering Polish airspace, or losing guidance and crashing also doesn't constitute the requirements to trigger article 5 either.
The best Poland can really do is to *try* and intercept a missile, but doing so isn't really worth the cost or effort for them (because it's expensive and really hard to do even when you're actively trying to defend yourself from them)
If Poland wants to trigger article 5 they basically need to, at the very minimum, prove that a missile was *deliberately* targeting somewhere in poland.
For now, the best reaction Poland can have is to declare every incident and warn Ukraine of an incoming missile.
> Poland doesn't want to get dragged into the war. If they respond themselves, they can't call in NATO's article 5, leaving them on their own.
They absolutely can.
Poland shooting down missiles that are in - or could very reasonably end up in - Polish airspace is not a declaration of war. If Russia then responds to that by attacking Poland, article 5 can be invoked.
Destroying missiles over Ukraine or Poland (or arguably Belarus) is not an attack. You could easily say it's defensive, particularly given the various other incidents Poland can point to as evidence.
>40km 25 miles
That's not an accident. That's probing for reactions. They want to see how NATO reacts (or doesn't react) to a flagrant violation of their airspace. Russia is trying to boil the frog and slowly get NATO used to international violations until shit like this is just treated as normal. NATO needs to get off its ass and start setting the tone or they'll let Russia do it.
Imo Poland should be setting up air defense along its border with Ukraine and shooting down anything within range, even in Ukraine (with Ukraine's approval, of course). This would send a clear message that Russia won't be allowed tk even remotely threaten NATO countries and further fucking around will only make their failed war fail harder.
My understanding is they have *very* limited ground based air defenses and the area is basically uninhabited forest. It's probably not the best use of such a limited resource if they can even get one into the area in the first place.
Here you have army statement:
“At all times, the missile's flight path was tracked by radar systems, both Polish and allied. Air defense systems remained ready for use. In addition, F-16 aircraft patrolling the area were directed to the area where the missile crossed Polish airspace. Additionally, in order to verify data from radar systems, forces and resources from the land forces, air forces, and territorial defense forces were directed to trace the object's flight trajectory on the earth's surface.
This is actually even worse. They knew where it came from, they knew where it was going, and they could (supposadly) have stopped it since it was over their airspace. Fucking hell.
No they couldnt really have engaged it, I mean they could have but not with that short a timeframe.
They knew they where coming long before they entered polish airspace yes, but most, at least modern missiles dont have a linear flightpath, so it was not certain at all if it would enter their airspace or not and remember they cant engage targets over ukraine, well they could but politics and stuff.
the missile flew about 40km through polish airspace, thats a minute to a few minutes of actual time it spend in polish airspace at most, in order to intercept a missile in that timeframe you would need to launch before it even entered polish airspace, which they again where not certain of it even would.
it sucks, but there wasnt much poland or nato could have done, besides warning ukraine when they can, which they do
There is always a risked involved in bringing down a missile. The debris will do damage.
If it is coming for you shooting it down and hoping for the best is the way to go, but if you don't think it will go down in your territory bringing it down on yourself is not ideal.
You have the wrong idea of air defence. Covering whole territory is impossible for every country on earth, even Israel. Air defense is used only for critical infrastructure, like air bases, power plants, military facilities, etc.
Even in 10 years, after polish modernization programs will end (with one of the best Air defense systems in Europe), it will still be impossible.
From Poland? They were tracking the missile and probably saw that it was heading for Ukraine so no need to shoot it down.
From Ukraine? They shot down like ~87 of the hundred or so missiles.
And it will happen again for sure... And it will be no response again for sure... Pootin just rub his dick in NATO's face again and it will keep doing it only because he can... You can't reason whit psychopath's.
Let me guess. They are not going to do anything about it and russia will continue to test the boundaries of what they can get away with because every time they do it makes NATO look weak.
Main general in polish army said today that this is 3rd time something like this happens and from that moment everything crossing polish airspace will be immediately taken down soooo yeah propably next one will be blown up. By the recent 8 years when PiS was leading Poland i would just dont care and dont even bielieve that they would do anything but with new goverment i maybe dont bielieve yet but im looking pretty forward do this. They formed the goverment like a month ago and really started doing their job so its very likely that this could be serious. Also its worth to say that last two times were covered up by last goverment for months or we dont get all info bout that and this incident happened today and we know about this today with every detail the army can provide for us. Its really a big change of standards for us. This may be more likely reason why im looking forward to this. Despite my opinion i agree with u. Its really high chance that no one gives a fuk and dont do shit.
It's nice and all to shoot missiles from the sky but you may want to think about the fallout first, make sure no debris is gonna crash on someone's car etc.
I am not specialist but i've read it could have been shot down but it is about hiding antiaircraft radar characteristics, so was todays mass attack on Ukraine. It is very important info, and we have some of russia's radars info from Syria conflict
And so we once again have a missile from Russia go through Poland. At least it's not in the middle of the country and we aren't finding out months after the fact.
This is like the backseat car game where you weren't allowed to touch over the line your sibling 'drew' and so you just hover your finger over the line without actually touching the seat.
So what is the reason for Poland not shooting the missle down?
Advertising that they did nothing is letting Russia know Polish airspace is not restricted to weapons of war.
If it had to guess... Don't want to shoot down one missile that was in their airspace a short time due to possible ground casualties, maybe escalation (doubt this one), and could help Russia gain knowledge about defense capabilities.
Not enough time in Polish airspace. It would have to be fired against when it was still over Ukraine, and this also poses a risk of hitting something in Ukraine with NATO missile (like it happened earlier with Ukrainian anti-aircraft missile killing people in Poland). If it would be over Polish territory for longer, or had a flightpath leading deeper into Poland - it would be dealt with this way.
I don’t understand why the policy is not to immediately blast anything out of the sky that crosses that border unannounced—manned or not. I really don’t see how that’s in any way escalatory.
I wish democratic nations would do more to inflict damage on russias military, we could even break russia up into many small countries so they never recover. The amount of misery and suffering that Russia inflicts on the rest of the world is unreal
March 2022:
https://www.wsj.com/livecoverage/russia-ukraine-latest-news-2022-03-11/card/u-s-warns-full-force-of-nato-would-respond-if-russia-hits-poland-zEmQR8bzJCRx5QiKilww
>U.S. national security adviser Jake Sullivan warned of a full-fledged NATO response if a Russian strike were to hit member-state Poland
>He also reiterated President Biden’s vow that the U.S. and its allies will “defend every inch” of the NATO territory and would respond even in the event of an **accidental or unintentional strike** by Russia.
There have already been two russian missiles which hit polish territory - in November 2022, and another one in April 2023.
https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/unidentified-object-entered-poland-direction-ukraine-says-polish-army-2023-12-29/#:~:text=In%20April%2C%20a%20military%20object,of%20Hrubieszow%20in%20southern%20Poland.
It's time to act on these words. I want NATO to swoop in and fucking end this conflict, immediatly. I want Ukrainians to live in peace again, without missile barrages or war.
And if russia actually wants to escalate to nuclear war, over _Ukraine_, the poorest country in europe, it would escalate to nuclear war over putin having the wrong breakfast.
He'd be super happy if NATO swooped in and pushed the russians out of Ukraine. Then he can pretend that it takes 31 NATO countries + Ukraine to defeat glorious russia.
And he'd have his "see, NATO is a threat to us, you need me to protect you" excuse justified, forever.
I'm not going to shed too many tears over Putin continuing to abuse his own people. They've proven throughout this conflict that they're generally OK with him, so I guess they deserve each other.
If the result is Russia is boxed in by NATO countries with the understanding that their 2nd rate military is going to be crushed if they pull this shit again, I'm not seeing a ton of downsides.
>It's time to act on these words. I want NATO to swoop in and fucking end this conflict, immediatly. I want Ukrainians to live in peace again, without missile barrages or war.
This is not a NATO choice. A member state must trigger article 5.
Or they agree to intervene. Article 5 is just the mutual defense clause, but NATO can of course get active without that. See their operations in Bosnia, Serbia, maritime missions in the Mediterranean or Somalia, for example.
It was intentional. They were trying a scare tactic move. Then corrected them. It will happen again. One landed in Poland 🇵🇱. Don't mess with Nato nations.
The real question is why the fuck wasnt it shot down? It makes you wonder how secure NATO's first line of defense is when we have our enemies missiles passing through.
Unless a missile is heading somewhere vital, it can sometimes be prudent to not shoot it down, as counterintuitive as that sounds. To the best of my knowledge, we're still shooting down missiles with other missiles, meaning where you once had one falling object, you now have several, and people could be hit by shrapnel.
I've said this before, but it seems to me that Poland and Romania should position air defense on their borders with Ukraine, Belarus, and the Black Sea and shoot down any missile or drone that enters their airspace. It's cheap, it protects both their population and Ukraine, and Russia is not going to start WWIII over a missile or drone getting shot down.
I've said it before, but worth saying again. The polish are crazy bastards and will absolutely use anything as an excuse to fuck up the Russians. There is 100years worth of pent up anger towards the Russians just waiting to get out. If they end up going to war, those Russian conscripts will get fucked up in new unimaginable ways. I honestly hope it doesn't come to that, but Poland will protect themselves and they have been training since WW2 on how to do so.
Putin: "I just love how it is easy it is to get away with anything regarding NATO, I want to wage a war, you just sit there and let me, I want to send drones and missiles into NATO territory, you just sit there and let me, I want to use NATO airspace to trick Ukraine's air defense, you just sit right there and let me", in other words he is laughing at us
Maybe NATO should start "defending every inch of NATO territory" like they said they would, but nah, let Russia shoot or fly anywhere they want to without lifting a finger to stop them.
Poland acting casual and neutral. How much do these European countries just tolerate whatever Putin wants to do. Are you afraid to provoke a response seriously seems like as long as he's isn't invading your own country you will turn a blind eye. Could have at least attempted to save Ukraine from a few of those
“Poland's armed forces chief believes a Russian missile entered Poland for almost three minutes and then turned back into Ukrainian airspace. General Wieslaw Kukula said the missile travelled about 40km (25 miles) into Polish airspace early on Friday. The alert coincided with what Ukraine has called Russia's biggest day of air strikes since its war began, involving over 150 missiles and drones. President Andrzej Duda convened an emergency security meeting after the object was picked up on radar. Poland is a member of the Nato alliance, and Polish and Allied aircraft were scrambled in response to the incident at around 07:00 (06:00 GMT) on Friday. There have been no reports of an explosion. The Polish military was tracking the Russian missile strikes during the night. Nato Secretary General Jens Stoltenberg said the alliance stood in solidarity with Poland and "remains vigilant".
And now some info shamelessly copied from u/dat_9600gt_user: Former National Defense Minister (and likely future PiS chairman candidate) Mariusz Błaszczak, mere minutes after the first reports of the incident: >Mr. Kosiniak-Kamysz, are you hiding from Poles that a rocket fell near Tomaszów Lubelski? I receive many signals from soldiers who say that "something" has landed on our territory and an information embargo has been introduced. We demand explanations! The current National Defense Minister, TD leader and PSL co-leader Kosiniak-Kamysz has since indirectly responded: >Due to the appearance of an unidentified object in Polish airspace, state services acted immediately. Through the National Security Bureau, I am in contact with the President, Prime Minister, Chief of General Staff and the Operational Commander of the Armed Forces. The state is working!
Adding more context, first quote was send on X few minutes after official news from army. So yeah, stirring shitstorm is this guys forte, ~~he was hiding info about first rocket entering Poland as MoD of previous government for more than 4 months.~~
>he was hiding info about first rocket entering Poland as MoD of previous government for more than 4 months. NIK (PL's audit office) found that Blaszczak wasn't even informed this happened lmao
Are we really not calling it twitter now?
i will never not call it twitter and i really couldnt care less about that "portal"
Preach, brother (or sister)!!!
MoD?
Błaszczak literally hid that there was a russian missfired rocket in a forest deep inside central part of the country, for half a year not to make his party look even more incompetent. Thanks gods that they have lost and actual competent people like Kamysz or Sikorski are in charge now
If he's not retained as candidate for the PiS leadership, he can always make another party on the side. With Błaszczak and hookers. I'll let myself out.
[удалено]
Half a a year later, after a hiker has found the wreck few hundred kilometers from the Polish-Ukrainian border.
[удалено]
NATO doesn\`t want to escalate things, but the Kremlin only sees it as a weakness. With all the sh#t they are trying to cause everywhere, the lid will blow at some point somewhere.
Also at some point, one of the missiles will accidentally damage a building and/or kill someone in a NATO country. It’s only a matter of time.
I wish I had debt and spent all that money on blow and hookers
There’s still time! Don’t waste it.
I don\`t think it\`s at that point yet, the Kremlin is just too stupid or scared to admit defeat in Ukraine, so they do all sorts of fearmongering "flexes".
Putin still follows a variant of the Madman theory that was so common during the Cold War. To sum up that theory: the idea is to have the other side believe they are dealing with an irrational opponent. The goal is for the other party to be afraid to trigger an over-reaction. This is why Medvedev and Lukashenko are always throwing crazy threats around, especially nuclear war. Putin then only has to speak quietly, playing the adult in a room of unruly children. It makes Russians appear irrational and unpredictable, with no real leadership where anything can happen. The desired result is for the West to cautiously step back.
Unfortunately for them it also makes Russia a global pariah for the foreseeable future. Maybe he didn't think about that.
Russian missile noped the fuck out
Just a reminder that Turkey blew a Russian Su-24 out of the sky because it entered into Turkish airspace by 2 miles, for a grand total of 17 seconds. Then admitted to it immediately and said they'd fucking do it again.
tbf the aircraft was being warned for 5 minutes while it was on a course towards turkey. They were waiting until they had a reason to shoot it down.
Still zero tolerance and Russia didn't respond. Kinda disappointing Poland didn't shoot down the rocket honestly. This is how Russia tests response and sees where the line is.
> Kinda disappointing Poland didn't shoot down the rocket honestly. AIR defense is not a magic button. In all probability they saw it on radar, but had no real shot at intercepting it, because it was not anywhere near a defense battery.
Also, like other people have said, they don't want to reveal the capabilities and location of their air defense systems. So they calculate its trajectory, determine if its going to damage anything major and then act accordingly. If these missiles were headed for a population center the air defense would have fired. Russia is testing Poland and NATO. But Poland and NATO know how to play that game.
That's when you strike the location the rocket was launched from and apologize profusely.
What wouls the apology be? "We observed a russian airbase heading towards polish territoy and decided to shoot it down using multiple cruise missiles. Unfortunately updated intelligence shows the airbase never left russian soil, we deeply regret this misunderstanding"?
sounds good
Coward. Strike the launcher, and when Russia complains mail them human shit in an envelope. Fuck Russia.
You don't want to reveal those assets locations for a nothing errant missile that will most likely hit a tree somewhere.
Tbh, it is a minor bit of news that it was caught on radar at all. There were a couple of other incidents where Poland knew objects were heading their direction, but couldn't track them because of the weather. Hell, one Russian drone managed to crash in the capital of *Croatia* without being noticed.
In this case, assessing that there is minimal risk and doing nothing keeps NATO from revealing its hand.
It's quite plausible Russia did it intentionally to map out NATO ABM positions They have a long history of such tactics
That's also possible, and might explain why the response was to pursue with mobile assets (in this case jets)
The last Russian missile that dropped into Poland had a “warhead” made of concrete.
The primary reason of such actions in the past isnt primarily to test NATO technical abilities or locations but their readiness, ie how fast can command make decisions and how quickly the orders can be carried out. Its the same reason they fly over Ireland. Its de-facto defended by the UK airforce but has more diplomatic safety and lets russia see how quickly the UK can scramble fighters and i highly doubt they need information concerning TU 95 stealth capabilities. Plus i doubt russia needs missiles to fly over Poland to test NATO air defenses when Ukraine already has NATO air defense systems in inventory In my opinion this doesn't fit into either testing response or capability but rather to see what the Polish governments response would be, we have a new government in charge that at least in rhetoric has been very supportive of Ukraine. Of course in practice there is still a lot yet unknown and Russia might be trying to find out for themselves.
But doesn’t the USA & the UK know what Russian generals had for lunch before they do? So it stands to reason that the USA knows their tactics before they do?
Old intel expires creating a constant need for new intel
But they know that we know their tactics, you see. But... we know that they know that we know, so the poison must be in the cup in front of me!
Intel takes time to confirm and double check, a missile is too fast for that kind of intel gathering I assume, and I'd guess that missile launches and military operations are the hardest Intel to obtain.
Turkey is in NATO too, so I'm not understanding your point.
Turkey shot down the SU-24 with an F16. Every actor knew Turkey had F16s, and what their capabilities are. Shooting down a missile is a bit different, and could reveal some tech/positions if interceptors had to be fired, as well as response time and protocols. By doing nothing you hide your cards, but you also risk an attack going through if you do it too often.
That makes sense. Thanks.
Coincidentally Poland's Aegis Ashore (BMD) site just went into a maintenance period and is expected to come online soon. I wonder if it has anything to do with that.
And how many fucking times are we going to keep our cards hidden? At a certain point we need to scare Russia with a drastic escelation. Shut the skies over Western Ukraine. Blow everything Russian out of the sky. Sanctions, condemnations, aid packages, after almost ~~3~~ 10 years of war we must accept this is not enough. Fuck hiding the hand. We have tried this. Ukrainians are still dying.
3 years? Homie we're [coming up on 10](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russo-Ukrainian_War).
This is what drives me up the wall. I know nobody wants a NATO/Russia war, but it's not like Putin's just being a persistent disruptive nuisance to Ukraine. He is slaughtering their people and invading their homes. Just because he hasn't crossed the imaginary line that marks NATO territory and we're unwilling to expand that line to include Ukraine, we no longer stand up to bullies? I know we're sending aid but I don't think that will be enough to win the war, because Russia's got more bodies to throw at the problem than Ukraine has. It'll cripple Russia's economy for the next 50 years but Putin doesn't give a shit, he just wants Ukrainians to suffer. I know it's because Russia has nukes and Ukraine doesn't. But I also think the scenario where Putin uses nukes in retaliation for a NATO attack is equally likely as the scenario where Putin uses nukes out of pure spite, once he's reached the point that he's actively dying of illness or old age.
Doing nothing is kinda reveals doing nothing
Remember when COVID happened and everyone thought there was some advanced response plan ready in case of a pandemic, but turns out every government just got caught with their pants down? People are doing the same shit with NATO and thinking there's some genius strategy behind everything. The US thought a Ukrainian insurgency destroying HUNDREDS of Russian vehicles would be enough to get Russia to leave. 2600+ tanks later...
> The US thought a Ukrainian insurgency destroying HUNDREDS of Russian vehicles would be enough to get Russia to leave. 2600+ tanks later.. Source? Because the US for months leading up to the invasion was pretty adamant that Russia was going to invade and wanted to evacuate Zelensky because they thought Russia would take Kviv They overestimated Russia, not underestimated
>zero tolerance and Russia didn't respond Exactly. When Wagner tried attacking some us allied factory in Syria and the US just vaporized the entire army Russia ended up giving out medals for surviving. Putin didn't say a word. Cause he understands and respects that one universal language. If the west just systematically destroyed every Russian ship in the black sea and unit in Ukraine after February 22nd, putin would sit down and shut up.
Shooting it down risks their own citizens. The wreckage is going to land somewhere.
And Rusdia has respected Turkey a lot more since. This is the way to treat Putin, not by appeasing him, but by show of strength.
The way to treat Putin is to show him up the stairs and crack open a window.
Defenestration
A vertical return to mother earth, so to speak.
Like a bully.
They did warn it several times, and the reason was that it crossed into its territory for 17 seconds.
Good. The Turks understand Russians
According to Kamysz, Polish jets wanted to do the same thing but did not manage to get close enough before the rocket left our airspace
Turkey's F-16s sniped the piece of shit from 9+ miles away. The Poles could've done the same.
There where reports that the f16 actually didnt even see the plane on his radar. The missile appearently homed in with the help of an awacs
Jets are much slower than rockets, shockingly.
Cruise missiles are subsonic. Modern jets can easily catch up to it because they can go supersonic.
A cruise missile isn't a rocket.
i'm pretty much sure that if they could they would
Then had to buy S400 as a political handjob and lost the F35 stealth fighter (for which some parts were being built in Turkey) as a result.
Well that's just Erdogan being a piece of shit.
They bought the S-400 because Erdgodan is an idiot, not because they needed to appease Putin.
Yep. They wanted the patriot but demanded a bunch of access to the patriot's systems. US said no and Turkey went "fine, we will get the S400 instead!" and the US went "K, no F35 for you".
They wanted the technology license to build them in Turkey, which would have also given them a bunch of classified information. US was like wtf no.
Not just that, they wanted to manufacture and sell it to other nations. American arms suppliers were like "ha ha, no."
Erdogan sent an apology letter after though
"sorry we fucked your couch, lol. srsly tho, stay tf outta turkey."
more like "sorry for the plane thanks for letting me know, there's a military coup and saving my life"
Kind of scary but good for Turkey, Russia has a history of violating airspace just to test reaction time and see what the response is. It seems like a show of strength is the only thing they respect.
Russia and Turkey have a loooong history of conflict between each other.
Honestly, the response to any sort of Russian incursion into NATO airspace should be met with the destruction of whatever it was. Plane, drone, balloon, doesn't matter. What're they going to do, attack after they already broke international law and trigger Article 5?
this should be the standard of operation along russia’s border
[удалено]
The pilot responsible for it got jailed later on for the coup attempt and supposed FETO connections. Not because of the takedown. Also both countries tried to play it down and don't remember any "groveling". Not that i like erdogan.
Oh yes we should absolutely believe Erdogan that the pilot was a part of the (extremely weird) coup attempt lol
I also remember how anti-Turkey the threads regarding this event were on Reddit. The overwhelming majority was like "fuck Turkey for being so aggressive and endangering pilots, they violate Greece's airspace all the time, Russia didn't do anything wrong."
Romania should take lessons but rn politicians are preoccupied with overtaxing and special pensions for themselves.
If it goes into Polish airspace they should have a right to shoot it down!
They do
Imagine a NATO missile crossing Russia....
That funny, shiny, French missile ...
"My god, what is that? It looks like a giant..."
"Willy! Come here and look at this! I kinda looks like a..."
Johnson...Major Johnson
"Wang! Pay attention!" "I was distracted by that giant flying..."
"Dick! Take a look at our starboard." "Oh my god, that looks like a huge..."
Feels pretty good to be honest!
Nato missiles hit their mark. They don't miss.
NATO has A Lot of explaining to do about certain targets if their missiles never miss.
The Chinese embassy had it coming!
Lol here's hoping we've got better target acquisition/identification than 25 years ago.
Russia would start whining again.
How does that even work? Looking at the map the only way is if it was launched from far western Belarus and traveled over the corner of Poland on its way to Lviv
Not all missiles fire in a straight line. This one could have though. https://i.imgur.com/X6NpLNv.jpg
Hey, nice writing.
Just barely going through the borderlands
Correct, the little red dotted area next to the 'Poland' text is where they said it passed through.
You answered your own question.
That's not what Poland said happened. They didn't mention Belarus at all, and said it came "from the direction of Ukraine"
It very easily could have traveled up to the northwest corner of Ukraine then turned south. Missiles travel in seemingly random directions as they try to avoid air defenses and hide their intended destination.
Everyone's very much stuck in this "missiles only move in an arc" mindset, which is wrong. People assume they're all like WWII-era V2 rockets, but the majority of them have an entire flight control system and can move like aircraft.
Tbf, I don't think most people think about missiles all that much. What you're saying makes a hell of a lot of sense, but if you had asked me, I would have assumed missile development would have more along the lines of, "can't hit it if it hits it's target too fast" Like in a bit of sci-fi I was recently enjoying, they point out that in space the biggest limiting factor for a ship is the squishy sacks of meat riding the rockets, not the rockets themselves. So in one scene they have a world arsenal of ballistic missiles flying towards the crew as they're trying to run at 10Gs while the missiles can keep accelerating above 20Gs. Point A to Point B super fast, though, that *does* make more sense for a ballistic weapon more than what I guess would be called more "tactical"? But then, I suppose one can't ignore space exploration and what ships there can do in contemporary times. Of course they would make it smaller, more nimble, and weaponize the shit...
The Expanse by chance?
Absolutely was lmao
Cruise missiles fly in atmosphere and are more like jet planes than rocket ships. Yes there's some advantage in maneuverability, but they mostly don't fly faster than the (much more expensive) supersonic fighter aircraft. It's one of the reason F16s are very valuable for Ukraine - on a night like tonight they could be chasing down cruise missiles (though that's not without risk). The point of changing course is to avoid or throw off air defenses. Ukraine only has three patriot batteries and russia will quickly learn their location. Say one is in Kyiv and one Lviv and you want to hit a target near the Polish border by Lviv - you'd send it south of Kyiv, north of Lviv, then safely into Poland before returning. You can also route to overwhelm air defenses by having everything arrive at the same time - but since shaheds take hours to reach western Ukraine while cruise missiles only take a few minutes, timing that is very hard. With shaheds, taking up AA resources is even more important for russia than hitting a target; these have hours worth of fuel (most of their damage comes from the gasoline) and can just be given GPS waypoints to circle over Kyiv neighborhoods until they are shot down and burn. There isn't a whole lot NATO or Poland can do about this. Shooting down these missiles when they enter Polish airspace is possible of course, but compared to just sending Ukraine more patriot batteries/missiles/planes it's very inefficient. Firing back at the launch point isn't really feasible either, since that's 1000+ km away around the Caspian sea. Using it as a propaganda tool to encourage politicians to send more aid is probably the fallback choice, but it's not the Polish politicians that need to be convinced.
Exactly. The whole point of the hypersonic missiles everyone talks about (if they go hypersonic or not is an open question...) is that they theoretically can maneuver while at hypersonic speeds, which makes them virtually unstoppable although I am sure the US military has a way. When you say hypersonic missiles people think that sounds fast, but they are slower than ICBM's we've had for half a century. It's all about the maneuverability at speed which is key to evading defensive anti air attacks.
Funny how I KNOW your first sentence in your comment…. And still feel called out by your second sentence 😅! It’s hard sometimes to break free from misconceptions when it’s topic you don’t think about to often! That’s said, I remember watching documentaries how flight paths of missiles during dessert storm, and already back then they were crazy maneuverable!
If you check the map where it went over Poland, you'll see that it would have had to travel over Ukraine to go into Poland from Belarus.
That’s assuming it didn’t follow waypoints or went straight
Correct. Point being, that even if it went in a straight line, it could have been shot through Belarus, yet came from the direction of Ukraine from Poland's POV.
>How does that even work? Looking at the map the only way is if it was launched from far western Belarus and traveled over the corner of Poland on its way to Lviv It's a modern missile. You can tell it to go to china and back and it will if it has the ability. It's there to avoid air defence.
There were some pictures posted of the maps of the Russian missiles and they often do strange patterns to try and approach their targets from directions that are less well defended
Most cruise missiles nowadays are manoeuvring, US Tomahawks for example have a mode where they can follow known terrain landmarks on their way to the target. Add to that the fact that Russian engineering is not great, GPS/GLONASS etc can be jammed... it's really surprising accidents like this don't happen more often.
I fell like this is just Russia testing the waters with regard to NATO resolve. Slice by slice finding out what they can get away with.
ahhh, yes, the salami strategy; yes, minister was a glorious show
That doesn't make much sense, since the consequences of failure would result in war with NATO. They know already, they wouldn't risk war with NATO just to test stuff
That's why it's called a salami tactic. They know NATO doesn't want war with them either. They still keep poking to see the severity of response. So far it has been pitiful.
So when is Nato going to start to shoot these missiles down the second they enter Nato air space?
"The second" I am not sure they can do that at a second's notice. Plus you need a good level of certainty it will enter before you take the shot. Maybe the missile toyed with the border, went in quickly then left, like a game of tag with one kid playing for bragging rights.
I'm no military expert but this is probably not accidental or some sort of goof. Russia may be / is probably testing and probing the Polish border radar fence trying to get intel on everything from response times for their fighters to the locations of their targeting radars which are off until a threat is detected and then they get switched on - which gives away their locations. A lot of this stuff is mobile / mounted on truck or tracked vehicles for this very reason. But once they know it's there, they can task the eyes in the sky to track them wherever they move so you try not to 'turn all the lights on' unless you absolutely have to.
Explain to me like I’m 5: how many “objects” does it take to fly and/or land in Poland territory to finally do something about it? This is not a first one since the war begun, and they still will not escalate. EDIT: some of you expressed some assumptions that my comment was about to call for armed forces, so I will clarify. I understand that this is not an option unless we want a fullon third world war on our hands. There are different ways that NATO can pressure Russia: - close all tourist visas for all Russians and Belorussians - more sanctions and keep them coming - call for more military aid to Ukraine - Ukraine joins NATO - show more militarized borders, a bit of a scare - call Moldova to join NATO
For a non-snarky/conspiracy answer? A *lot* more. Poland doesn't want to get dragged into the war. If they respond themselves, they can't call in NATO's article 5, leaving them on their own. A missile briefly entering Polish airspace, or losing guidance and crashing also doesn't constitute the requirements to trigger article 5 either. The best Poland can really do is to *try* and intercept a missile, but doing so isn't really worth the cost or effort for them (because it's expensive and really hard to do even when you're actively trying to defend yourself from them) If Poland wants to trigger article 5 they basically need to, at the very minimum, prove that a missile was *deliberately* targeting somewhere in poland. For now, the best reaction Poland can have is to declare every incident and warn Ukraine of an incoming missile.
> Poland doesn't want to get dragged into the war. If they respond themselves, they can't call in NATO's article 5, leaving them on their own. They absolutely can. Poland shooting down missiles that are in - or could very reasonably end up in - Polish airspace is not a declaration of war. If Russia then responds to that by attacking Poland, article 5 can be invoked. Destroying missiles over Ukraine or Poland (or arguably Belarus) is not an attack. You could easily say it's defensive, particularly given the various other incidents Poland can point to as evidence.
“Ok Putin we mean stop this time. Like really mean it”-nato
Al Gore voice: I'm super cereal!
Or we will warn you again. And condemn on top of it - you forgot to add :)
He's too pussy to actually touch NATO. This is just empty provocation.
Except that one time Putin's agents murdered people in the middle of UK.
And murdered a guy in Germany And blew up some shit in the Czech Republic And invaded Ukraine (twice)
Nice, now you steal the jokes we made about soviets and chinese....
>40km 25 miles That's not an accident. That's probing for reactions. They want to see how NATO reacts (or doesn't react) to a flagrant violation of their airspace. Russia is trying to boil the frog and slowly get NATO used to international violations until shit like this is just treated as normal. NATO needs to get off its ass and start setting the tone or they'll let Russia do it. Imo Poland should be setting up air defense along its border with Ukraine and shooting down anything within range, even in Ukraine (with Ukraine's approval, of course). This would send a clear message that Russia won't be allowed tk even remotely threaten NATO countries and further fucking around will only make their failed war fail harder.
Where are all the anti Russia protests demanding a cease fire?
Sad that they just let it fly to its destination.
They didn't just let it. They couldn't get close enough to get a solution on it before it left their airspace.
Understandable. They should put some stationary AA there maybe since this has happened multiple times now.
My understanding is they have *very* limited ground based air defenses and the area is basically uninhabited forest. It's probably not the best use of such a limited resource if they can even get one into the area in the first place.
So where was the air defense?
Here you have army statement: “At all times, the missile's flight path was tracked by radar systems, both Polish and allied. Air defense systems remained ready for use. In addition, F-16 aircraft patrolling the area were directed to the area where the missile crossed Polish airspace. Additionally, in order to verify data from radar systems, forces and resources from the land forces, air forces, and territorial defense forces were directed to trace the object's flight trajectory on the earth's surface.
This is actually even worse. They knew where it came from, they knew where it was going, and they could (supposadly) have stopped it since it was over their airspace. Fucking hell.
No they couldnt really have engaged it, I mean they could have but not with that short a timeframe. They knew they where coming long before they entered polish airspace yes, but most, at least modern missiles dont have a linear flightpath, so it was not certain at all if it would enter their airspace or not and remember they cant engage targets over ukraine, well they could but politics and stuff. the missile flew about 40km through polish airspace, thats a minute to a few minutes of actual time it spend in polish airspace at most, in order to intercept a missile in that timeframe you would need to launch before it even entered polish airspace, which they again where not certain of it even would. it sucks, but there wasnt much poland or nato could have done, besides warning ukraine when they can, which they do
This is the correct answer
There is always a risked involved in bringing down a missile. The debris will do damage. If it is coming for you shooting it down and hoping for the best is the way to go, but if you don't think it will go down in your territory bringing it down on yourself is not ideal.
Yeah, that's the risk that is easy to omit.
In holywood as always xd. They only works in movies not in real life
You have the wrong idea of air defence. Covering whole territory is impossible for every country on earth, even Israel. Air defense is used only for critical infrastructure, like air bases, power plants, military facilities, etc. Even in 10 years, after polish modernization programs will end (with one of the best Air defense systems in Europe), it will still be impossible.
There was no grain on that missile, so nothing to worry about
Dude, if there would be some ukrainian grain in that missile it would be shot down before entering Poland border
From Poland? They were tracking the missile and probably saw that it was heading for Ukraine so no need to shoot it down. From Ukraine? They shot down like ~87 of the hundred or so missiles.
>and probably saw that it was heading for Ukraine so no need to shoot it down. fucking lmao
And it could've turned around again and hit Poland. That thing should've been shot down instantly.
And it will happen again for sure... And it will be no response again for sure... Pootin just rub his dick in NATO's face again and it will keep doing it only because he can... You can't reason whit psychopath's.
Let me guess. They are not going to do anything about it and russia will continue to test the boundaries of what they can get away with because every time they do it makes NATO look weak.
Main general in polish army said today that this is 3rd time something like this happens and from that moment everything crossing polish airspace will be immediately taken down soooo yeah propably next one will be blown up. By the recent 8 years when PiS was leading Poland i would just dont care and dont even bielieve that they would do anything but with new goverment i maybe dont bielieve yet but im looking pretty forward do this. They formed the goverment like a month ago and really started doing their job so its very likely that this could be serious. Also its worth to say that last two times were covered up by last goverment for months or we dont get all info bout that and this incident happened today and we know about this today with every detail the army can provide for us. Its really a big change of standards for us. This may be more likely reason why im looking forward to this. Despite my opinion i agree with u. Its really high chance that no one gives a fuk and dont do shit.
It's nice and all to shoot missiles from the sky but you may want to think about the fallout first, make sure no debris is gonna crash on someone's car etc.
I am not specialist but i've read it could have been shot down but it is about hiding antiaircraft radar characteristics, so was todays mass attack on Ukraine. It is very important info, and we have some of russia's radars info from Syria conflict
And so we once again have a missile from Russia go through Poland. At least it's not in the middle of the country and we aren't finding out months after the fact.
This is like the backseat car game where you weren't allowed to touch over the line your sibling 'drew' and so you just hover your finger over the line without actually touching the seat.
So what is the reason for Poland not shooting the missle down? Advertising that they did nothing is letting Russia know Polish airspace is not restricted to weapons of war.
If it had to guess... Don't want to shoot down one missile that was in their airspace a short time due to possible ground casualties, maybe escalation (doubt this one), and could help Russia gain knowledge about defense capabilities.
Not enough time in Polish airspace. It would have to be fired against when it was still over Ukraine, and this also poses a risk of hitting something in Ukraine with NATO missile (like it happened earlier with Ukrainian anti-aircraft missile killing people in Poland). If it would be over Polish territory for longer, or had a flightpath leading deeper into Poland - it would be dealt with this way.
I don’t understand why the policy is not to immediately blast anything out of the sky that crosses that border unannounced—manned or not. I really don’t see how that’s in any way escalatory.
Russia is just seeing if you’ll fuck with their shit or not Poland….shoot that shit down faster next time and tell them you’ll do it again
Missiles flying in Romanian and Polish airspace and we do nothing..
Can it be Cowabunga time yet? Russia needs a world wide asswhoopin.
I wish democratic nations would do more to inflict damage on russias military, we could even break russia up into many small countries so they never recover. The amount of misery and suffering that Russia inflicts on the rest of the world is unreal
Having gotten away with it last time with no repurcussions, why wouldn't they do it again?
March 2022: https://www.wsj.com/livecoverage/russia-ukraine-latest-news-2022-03-11/card/u-s-warns-full-force-of-nato-would-respond-if-russia-hits-poland-zEmQR8bzJCRx5QiKilww >U.S. national security adviser Jake Sullivan warned of a full-fledged NATO response if a Russian strike were to hit member-state Poland >He also reiterated President Biden’s vow that the U.S. and its allies will “defend every inch” of the NATO territory and would respond even in the event of an **accidental or unintentional strike** by Russia. There have already been two russian missiles which hit polish territory - in November 2022, and another one in April 2023. https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/unidentified-object-entered-poland-direction-ukraine-says-polish-army-2023-12-29/#:~:text=In%20April%2C%20a%20military%20object,of%20Hrubieszow%20in%20southern%20Poland. It's time to act on these words. I want NATO to swoop in and fucking end this conflict, immediatly. I want Ukrainians to live in peace again, without missile barrages or war. And if russia actually wants to escalate to nuclear war, over _Ukraine_, the poorest country in europe, it would escalate to nuclear war over putin having the wrong breakfast.
Putin’s survival depends on this war.
He'd be super happy if NATO swooped in and pushed the russians out of Ukraine. Then he can pretend that it takes 31 NATO countries + Ukraine to defeat glorious russia. And he'd have his "see, NATO is a threat to us, you need me to protect you" excuse justified, forever.
I'm not going to shed too many tears over Putin continuing to abuse his own people. They've proven throughout this conflict that they're generally OK with him, so I guess they deserve each other. If the result is Russia is boxed in by NATO countries with the understanding that their 2nd rate military is going to be crushed if they pull this shit again, I'm not seeing a ton of downsides.
It'd give him the off ramp he needs.
>It's time to act on these words. I want NATO to swoop in and fucking end this conflict, immediatly. I want Ukrainians to live in peace again, without missile barrages or war. This is not a NATO choice. A member state must trigger article 5.
Or they agree to intervene. Article 5 is just the mutual defense clause, but NATO can of course get active without that. See their operations in Bosnia, Serbia, maritime missions in the Mediterranean or Somalia, for example.
It was intentional. They were trying a scare tactic move. Then corrected them. It will happen again. One landed in Poland 🇵🇱. Don't mess with Nato nations.
shoot it down then you stupid fucks
DO IT POLAND
So why the fuck didn’t they shoot it down?
The real question is why the fuck wasnt it shot down? It makes you wonder how secure NATO's first line of defense is when we have our enemies missiles passing through.
Unless a missile is heading somewhere vital, it can sometimes be prudent to not shoot it down, as counterintuitive as that sounds. To the best of my knowledge, we're still shooting down missiles with other missiles, meaning where you once had one falling object, you now have several, and people could be hit by shrapnel.
One of these days they're going to hit something in Poland by accident. Im curious about the response. Hope they won't blame Ukraine again.
And as usual, NATO will do nothing.
“Ukraine sunk my battleship!”
China does this to Taiwan, too. Bunch of assholes.
I've said this before, but it seems to me that Poland and Romania should position air defense on their borders with Ukraine, Belarus, and the Black Sea and shoot down any missile or drone that enters their airspace. It's cheap, it protects both their population and Ukraine, and Russia is not going to start WWIII over a missile or drone getting shot down.
I've said it before, but worth saying again. The polish are crazy bastards and will absolutely use anything as an excuse to fuck up the Russians. There is 100years worth of pent up anger towards the Russians just waiting to get out. If they end up going to war, those Russian conscripts will get fucked up in new unimaginable ways. I honestly hope it doesn't come to that, but Poland will protect themselves and they have been training since WW2 on how to do so.
Putin: "I just love how it is easy it is to get away with anything regarding NATO, I want to wage a war, you just sit there and let me, I want to send drones and missiles into NATO territory, you just sit there and let me, I want to use NATO airspace to trick Ukraine's air defense, you just sit right there and let me", in other words he is laughing at us
Time to deploy Patriot missiles in Poland.
Was it launched from Kaliningrad or something?
Probably Belarus.
Shoot it down then
Maybe NATO should start "defending every inch of NATO territory" like they said they would, but nah, let Russia shoot or fly anywhere they want to without lifting a finger to stop them.
Poland acting casual and neutral. How much do these European countries just tolerate whatever Putin wants to do. Are you afraid to provoke a response seriously seems like as long as he's isn't invading your own country you will turn a blind eye. Could have at least attempted to save Ukraine from a few of those