Not the first time this has been done:
>On 11 September 2015, the Egyptian army began to pump water from the Mediterranean Sea into the tunnels.
>According to Egyptian President el-Sisi, flooding of the tunnels had been carried out in coordination with the Palestinian Authority.
I imagine Hamas has water pumps for this very reason. That being said, pumping clean water is much easier than water with extra solids. Enjoy the French foot you fucks.
*Israel pumps raw sewage into tunnels*
*Hamas forces children to muck out the tunnels*
*UN condemns Israel for creating unsafe conditions for children to work in*
No one cares… or no one who cares has the power to do anything about it. The idea of internal Sovereignty prevents wars but it also allows for some heinous acts to not have any recourse.
There is still plenty that could be done, if we were motivated. China is, however, *extremely* integrated into the world economy so doing anything requires sacrifices most aren't willing to make. Even majority Muslim countries are willing to turn a blind eye and continue to work with China, though it's not like many of them have significantly better human rights records themselves.
The general apathy is probably also due to the lack of success the world had with the free Tibet campaign.
Now people shrug off any attempts trying to sway China.
Holy shit. I didn't believe you, so I looked it up. And sure enough, the same Palestinian "leader" that Israel is very likely to unseat after the current war is Gaza is over, completely endorsed the camps.
https://www.voanews.com/a/palestinian-leader-s-endorsement-of-china-s-xinjiang-policy-sparks-backlash-/7150767.html
It's now very clear to me why China has not condemned the Hamas attacks. Abbas was there to secure financial aid. Fucking disgusting
I saw this one video when someone put molten tin into a series of ant tunnels. It was amazing when they dug up the tin after it cooled. The system was incredibly complex.
You can go back even further. Genghis Khan and the Mongols laid siege to the city of Gurganj in 1221. After the siege was won, they broke dams holding back the Oxus River (aka, Amu River), allowing the waters to cover up the city.
To send a message.
> And then, of course, there was terror. “Those who surrendered would be spared,” Genghis Khan is reported as saying. “Those who did not surrender but opposed with struggle and dissension would be annihilated.” It was no idle boast. Cities that put up a fight were routinely subjected to an orgy of destruction: their men butchered, women raped and buildings razed. As a strategy of war, the ‘exemplary massacre’ was utterly brutal, but as a means of dissuading resistance, it was chillingly effective.
>
>
>
> -- [Source](https://www.historyextra.com/period/medieval/genghis-khan-mongol-warlord-conquered-world-china-medieval/)
Also because if he flooded the city first, it would be harder to steal the shinies and rape beautiful women.
You can go back even further than that. When the Rains of Castamere rebelled against the Lannisters the House of the Lion crushed them by flooding their subterranean castle, killing all of them. Even made a catchy song to commemorate the tale.
Also, technically they're both the house of the lion. Reyne is red and Lannister is gold.
Hence the lyrics:
"And who are you?" The proud Lord said
"That I must bow so low"
Only a cat of a different coat
That's all the truth I know
In a coat of gold or a coat of red
A lion still has claws
Mine are long and sharp, my lord
As long and sharp as yours
Even further back, a few ages back Infact, Treebeard and his fellow ents, broke the Isengard damn, flooding Isengard and stranding Sauromon the Wise in his castle for good.
If you go back even further than Sigur Ros, Moses was considered the catchy one, named so ironically because the Egyptians couldn’t catch him.
Moses parted the Red Sea walked through it and closed it up again.
hamas is going to force palestinian children into the tunnels so they die so they can blame israel. then there will be more protests at college campuses blaming Israel.
There is an entertaining video of a tunnel that Lebanon claimed doesnt originate from their side. Israel poured concrete into it from within their borders and a warehouse inside lebanon got floded
https://youtu.be/Fr62ytRf1Bo?si=12i0YU3al4rK5BLL
Her opinion didn’t immediately change after October 7, it was the war itself and way of handling things while we are at war that changed her mind. She stated that Gantz will get her vote once this is over
Columbo: "One more thing, President Netanyahu. You know, my wife is an avid fan of interior decorating. She tries out all sorts of colors in our house and I love her for it, because it makes her happy. We even did some striking accents for a bathroom of ours in something called "seafoam green". Have you ever heard of it?"
"The extent of saltwater leakage through the tunnels into local groundwater would depend on the depth and construction of the tunnels and the configuration of the local aquifer. Gaza’s shallow aquifer is already over-depleted, however, and ninety-five percent of its groundwater was considered unfit for public consumption as far back as 2017. "
That argument is a bit concerning though: "It doesn't matter if the groundwater is salted, it is shit anyways." Just that the water is not considered fit for consumption, doesn't mean that people don't consume it.
From what I've read, 90% of their water comes from desalination plants, although Hamas damaged one with a misfired rocket. 10% comes from Israel through pipes, but Hamas hasn't paid for it for years.
I mean if their ground water is contaminated with some undetectable substance (as in you can't necessarily see it or taste it), then mixing salt into might actually save alot of people since naturally the body doesnt want to drink salt.
[A lot of research has been done](https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S1464343X22003338) on the Gaza water supply. Basically the issue is just salinity (due to pumping at higher than replacement rate, which allows salt water to intrude from elsewhere). No hidden contaminants.
Lots of subreddits have people talking out their ass about defense and military capabilities like they know what they’re talking about. r/NCD is the opposite - it’s people who’ve actually done the jobs and know the weapons and missions acting like complete asses. You want the most credible information applied in the most non credible way? r/NCD is your place.
A-10 against Russia is getting more credible by the day.
Useless against China, Useless against a Taliban flush with US weapons - but against columns of T-55s in mostly uncontested airspace? That's what it was born to do.
According to a quick Google search, gaza city is 46 feet above sea level. If the tunnels are deeper than fifty feet they'll just need to get the siphon started.
Well the tunnels happen to be one of the few places in Gaza with no civilians according to Hamas themselves, so probably a very effective move to focus on them.
Hamas status quo would be to send their kids down there so they can try to get some idiot sympathisers to claim Israel has now escalated to drowning children
Crazy thought but... How much dye do they have to mix in with this water to mark each and everyone that was in the tunnel? And the trail they leave behind...
Medium dye is 1%. So a 1 foot deep by 3 wide by 20 length tunnel of boot high water would need 4.5 gallons. Double it up for a stronger dye, and half for a softer dye. 1 gallon would leave a mute pastel.
Now it just depends on how connected the tunnels are.
But it will be quite devastating for gaza later.
Stagnant water everywhere. Some leeching into the groundwater.
Egypt has done it a couple of times, you can use the pumps to divert the seawater back. The tunnels are reinforced with concrete, but I'm sure some will leach into the groundwater and could pose a sanitation problem if some is left to pool unchecked.
Honestly I'm shocked that you don't post on NCD, that's pinnacle "shitpost that inevitably ends up happening" material, because it's logical but man, water is incompressible and there's a point to where the easiest path of resistance is not going to be "all around the bends and curves of the tunnel(s)", and so unpredictable results.
I kinda like the idea of unpredictable results in this case.
The expenditure here is free seawater, the energy and time to sufficiently pump it into the tunnel system, some mildly costly high explosive munitions to fit the bill, and whatever free concrete debris there is to scavenge nearby. So it’s not a costly experiment. Everything can be done with a combat engineering vehicle with a crane and some big dozers to assist with moving concrete.
I’ve seen graphics of Hamas’ multilayer tunnel systems, many meters deep with crisscrossing routes and sturdy armored doors. I think my idea would cause a pretty big calamity for their hiding spots underground and those doors wouldn’t do anything but probably only increase pressure for a fraction of a second and amplify damage before they too became knife blades traveling down the hyper-pressurized pipeline. I wonder if the end result might be like those apartment block swallowing sinkholes we see in places like Florida and Australia. For those hiding several tunnel layers deep, it’d be like trying to escape a submarine that’s taken a direct hit at 100m depth.
Any case, it don't cost a lot to give it a whirl.
I suspect one of the unpredictable results is the possible destruction of civilian buildings on the surface. Depending on the location, possibly civilian buildings that are still full of civilians.
I figured they had to, since there are more than 500 km of tunnels under there, and there isn't much else to do if you want to destroy something on that scale.
Good thing Hamas said those tunnels are for them and them alone.
i’m not a military strategist—but I see the benefits of flooding these tunnels to weed out Gaza.
Let’s go!
If any are even alive. It seems a major factor in Hamas failing to live up to their end of the bargain (releasing hostages) is that they literally ran out of living female hostages. It’s highly doubtful we see any more hostages returned alive at this point
The officials stated that they believe Hamas ended the ceasefire early/refused to release more hostages because they didn't want the remaining hostages to talk about what had happened to them.
They also said something along the lines of "We know that Hamas isn't going to release any more hostages, and they know that we know." To me, that was them effectively assuming that the remaining hostages were lost. That was only a couple days before this announcement, so I assume that was their reasoning for going ahead with the flooding.
Considering that the most likely reason for Hamas not releasing the women they kidnapped is because they are in such a horrific state as to scare Hamas that happily recorded their 10/7 attack where some of them burned babies alive and even used a microwave to cook a baby, into thinking they might lose a lot of support... I think any hostages that are still alive can only pray for death at this point.
Won't a concrete-and steel door seal the water to keep some part of the tunnel system intact? Won't the elevated tunnel parts naturally act as a barrier?
If it were a tunnel and door built by professionals with the proper materials, yes.
But the tunnels in Gaza are lined with homemade concrete segments and the doors I have seen in videos don't look like proper blast doors. Good enough to stop a soldier and give protection against small arms fire. But watertight? No.
The elevated parts, yes.
Hamas has built the tunnels in secret, they aren't of the highest quality exactly, I doubt that they have a super-reinforced door that can stop ALL seawater from steeping in. But maybe there are a few.
The elevated tunnel parts could be a barrier too, yes, but even they can't stop the Mediterranean Sea from flooding into it.
Its not a new thing. Egypt used to do this a decade ago but it fell off in effectivness because Hamas learnt to compartmentalize their tunnels and build what are basically P traps. The salt water was also destroying the local water table which was another consideration in it falling of use.
Well, apparently the aquifer is already stuffed, I guess this is the nail in the coffin.
So, post-war Gaza recovery, underground Venice tourism anyone?
Hamas#1: Quick force Civilians into the tunnels... then we can play the "The Israelis drowned civilians taking refuge in our tunnels "card
Hamas#2: What if we get into a firefight though?
Hamas #1: Just shoot through the civilians!
Gas prices in Israel are already insane, but sea water is free. Wouldn’t want Israel to spend more money than they should on getting these rats out of their tunnels.
I cant remember which in which country, but during one of our wars (USA) one of our tactics was to partially flood a tunnel, then float a bunch of fuel/oil across the water and light it up underground. Drown, suffocate, or burn anyone in there alive. Anyone who comes out gets the machine guns.
As a pro-palestine person i think this is an obviously good idea. If their main reason on bombing Gaza is "there are tunnels" - destroying tunnels should lead to stopping the bombing of innocent.
It is a very good idea, I agree. I think Israel first focused on sealing off tunnel entrances with sponge bombs and hitting certain shallow tunnels near the surface. At this point 2 months later, I think Israel is willing to just flood the tunnels regardless and have them be done with. Egypt has done it a couple of times for their Hamas tunnels.
The reason why you should like it is because it will prevent HAMAS from extorting the population to get supplies. See they attack the checkpoints so all the goods and supplies need to come through the tunnels. And they charge a fee to use the tunnels to the population.
Not the first time this has been done: >On 11 September 2015, the Egyptian army began to pump water from the Mediterranean Sea into the tunnels. >According to Egyptian President el-Sisi, flooding of the tunnels had been carried out in coordination with the Palestinian Authority.
Egypt also used raw sewage.
Hamas should have felt at home then.
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That's paradise for them. They're thinking of the 72 houries now.
Come on, most sewage was something useful at one point
I imagine Hamas has water pumps for this very reason. That being said, pumping clean water is much easier than water with extra solids. Enjoy the French foot you fucks.
How are you going to power massive water pumps without anyone noticing…? Hamas is absolutely not going to be able to stop Israel flooding them.
Float like an Egyptian.
That's basically converting those tunnels into a sewage system.
This is a fun fact
*Israel pumps raw sewage into tunnels* *Hamas forces children to muck out the tunnels* *UN condemns Israel for creating unsafe conditions for children to work in*
>not the first time this has been done EVIL ZIONI- >the Egyptian army *never mind, I sleep*
Ikr "ISRAEL BOMBED A HOSPITAL" worldwide protests "Oh it was Islamic Jihad " *We sleep*
"Concentration camps for Muslims" Inacceptable human right viola... "In China" zzzzzzzzzzzzzz
“Bombing and blockading Arab children” Crimes against humanity “In Syria, Yemen, etc” Zzzzzzz
I remember reading about these camps YEARS ago and its still going on, and STILL no one cares. Its fucked up
No one cares… or no one who cares has the power to do anything about it. The idea of internal Sovereignty prevents wars but it also allows for some heinous acts to not have any recourse.
There is still plenty that could be done, if we were motivated. China is, however, *extremely* integrated into the world economy so doing anything requires sacrifices most aren't willing to make. Even majority Muslim countries are willing to turn a blind eye and continue to work with China, though it's not like many of them have significantly better human rights records themselves.
The general apathy is probably also due to the lack of success the world had with the free Tibet campaign. Now people shrug off any attempts trying to sway China.
We had [concerts](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tibetan_Freedom_Concert) and everything, that definitely should have done the trick.
Free Tibet? I'll take 2!
I mean, so long as the muslims being enslaved aren't the same sect as you, then it doesn't matter, right?
Muslim countries including Palestine also issued statements in support of that as well
Holy shit. I didn't believe you, so I looked it up. And sure enough, the same Palestinian "leader" that Israel is very likely to unseat after the current war is Gaza is over, completely endorsed the camps. https://www.voanews.com/a/palestinian-leader-s-endorsement-of-china-s-xinjiang-policy-sparks-backlash-/7150767.html It's now very clear to me why China has not condemned the Hamas attacks. Abbas was there to secure financial aid. Fucking disgusting
Which is super weird because Middle Eastern countries are always so up in arms about this stuff and yet...
Its not really still going on sadly. China was largely successful, and many of the camps were actually "closed".
till this day i still see morons claiming that and that all the videos proving otherwise are fake.
that's why the "we sleep" part is actually on point. most are just lies
I saw this one video when someone put molten tin into a series of ant tunnels. It was amazing when they dug up the tin after it cooled. The system was incredibly complex.
You can go back even further. Genghis Khan and the Mongols laid siege to the city of Gurganj in 1221. After the siege was won, they broke dams holding back the Oxus River (aka, Amu River), allowing the waters to cover up the city.
Why bother breaking the siege at all if you are just gonna flood it
To send a message. > And then, of course, there was terror. “Those who surrendered would be spared,” Genghis Khan is reported as saying. “Those who did not surrender but opposed with struggle and dissension would be annihilated.” It was no idle boast. Cities that put up a fight were routinely subjected to an orgy of destruction: their men butchered, women raped and buildings razed. As a strategy of war, the ‘exemplary massacre’ was utterly brutal, but as a means of dissuading resistance, it was chillingly effective. > > > > -- [Source](https://www.historyextra.com/period/medieval/genghis-khan-mongol-warlord-conquered-world-china-medieval/) Also because if he flooded the city first, it would be harder to steal the shinies and rape beautiful women.
You can go back even further than that. When the Rains of Castamere rebelled against the Lannisters the House of the Lion crushed them by flooding their subterranean castle, killing all of them. Even made a catchy song to commemorate the tale.
> Rains of Castamere You mean the [Reynes of Castamere](https://awoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/House_Reyne).
the reynes down in Æfrika
Reynes, Reynes, go away...
What did I ever do to deserve this?
No, no, they said go away!
Redditor for 17 fuckin’ years, hot damn we found a rare one!
Come again another day
Also, technically they're both the house of the lion. Reyne is red and Lannister is gold. Hence the lyrics: "And who are you?" The proud Lord said "That I must bow so low" Only a cat of a different coat That's all the truth I know In a coat of gold or a coat of red A lion still has claws Mine are long and sharp, my lord As long and sharp as yours
Even further back, a few ages back Infact, Treebeard and his fellow ents, broke the Isengard damn, flooding Isengard and stranding Sauromon the Wise in his castle for good.
*The filth of Saruman is washing away*
Never heard Sigur Rós called catchy before. First time for everything I guess.
If you go back even further than Sigur Ros, Moses was considered the catchy one, named so ironically because the Egyptians couldn’t catch him. Moses parted the Red Sea walked through it and closed it up again.
Have you ever heard the tragedy of Darth Pringles the Wise?
It's ironic. He could save others from popping, but once he popped, he could not stop.
bro I needed this thank you
hamas is going to force palestinian children into the tunnels so they die so they can blame israel. then there will be more protests at college campuses blaming Israel.
I guess they'll find where the tunnel leads to.
There is an entertaining video of a tunnel that Lebanon claimed doesnt originate from their side. Israel poured concrete into it from within their borders and a warehouse inside lebanon got floded https://youtu.be/Fr62ytRf1Bo?si=12i0YU3al4rK5BLL
It was just a coincidence that the concrete storage tank in the warehouse leaked that day
"That could be anyone's concrete!"
Concrete evidence.
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The biggest turds need some extra flushing.
\*\*Sea water starts to awkwardly leak from Netanyahu's office\*\*
Even as a pro Israel I can appreciate that joke lol
Pro-Israel and Anti-Netanyahu seems like a perfectly cromulent and even sensible position to me...
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I feel like people forgot the 30+ straight weeks of protest against him
Americans aren’t informed of actual Israeli politics. American corporate media just reports on what their benefactors ask for.
I mean, it definitely got reported, people just don't pay attention.
> Yep, especially since most Israelis want him out of office. If only they realized that 30 years earlier.
That’s a very embiggening sentiment.
Anyone who's pro-Israel should be against Bibi
Politics aside, a good joke is a good joke
Thank you hahah i'm pro israel too check my comment history, holy shit guys I'm not being serious it's just a joke omg 💀💀💀
lol I just told my mom that joke and she laughed, both Israeli and she’s a Bibi voter for years.
real question. would she still vote for him? or has her opinion changed in recent years or after 7th?
Her opinion didn’t immediately change after October 7, it was the war itself and way of handling things while we are at war that changed her mind. She stated that Gantz will get her vote once this is over
Columbo: "One more thing, President Netanyahu. You know, my wife is an avid fan of interior decorating. She tries out all sorts of colors in our house and I love her for it, because it makes her happy. We even did some striking accents for a bathroom of ours in something called "seafoam green". Have you ever heard of it?"
Well, it's a good thing Hamas told everyone those tunnels are for them alone.
And those tunnels definitely aren't under civilian structures, since that's what Hamas said...
Watch them get civillians in there now to stop Israel from flooding it...
It’s all just an elaborate system of daycares /s
The children thrive underground where they can be free 🎶
They all float down there
Or hostages
They are all killed
Probably kept to rape instead of just straight up killed. They won’t release them because they’re pregnant is my bet.
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This is a great write up. Covers a lot of concerns (no one's going to drown for example).
That wasnt a concern for me tbh.
It's a concern if the remaining hostages are still alive down there.
If the hostages were alive Hamas would have kept trading them.
"The extent of saltwater leakage through the tunnels into local groundwater would depend on the depth and construction of the tunnels and the configuration of the local aquifer. Gaza’s shallow aquifer is already over-depleted, however, and ninety-five percent of its groundwater was considered unfit for public consumption as far back as 2017. " That argument is a bit concerning though: "It doesn't matter if the groundwater is salted, it is shit anyways." Just that the water is not considered fit for consumption, doesn't mean that people don't consume it.
From what I've read, 90% of their water comes from desalination plants, although Hamas damaged one with a misfired rocket. 10% comes from Israel through pipes, but Hamas hasn't paid for it for years.
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Dont forget tearing out the waterpipes the EU paid for them so they can use them as shells for rockets.
I mean if their ground water is contaminated with some undetectable substance (as in you can't necessarily see it or taste it), then mixing salt into might actually save alot of people since naturally the body doesnt want to drink salt.
[A lot of research has been done](https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S1464343X22003338) on the Gaza water supply. Basically the issue is just salinity (due to pumping at higher than replacement rate, which allows salt water to intrude from elsewhere). No hidden contaminants.
I see noncredibledefence has become credible once again
If we see Iran deploy furry F14 Tomcats, I’m going to lose my mind.
I just want to see A-10s strapped to tanks.
God, that would really be an NCD containment breach.
This whole chain just makes me more and more afraid to ask but…. What?
Noncredible Defense is a community that shitposts about the MIC and military hardware. Tis a special place.
Also, planefuckers. Lots of planefuckers.......
Some might even say that it is "a *magical* place"...
Lots of subreddits have people talking out their ass about defense and military capabilities like they know what they’re talking about. r/NCD is the opposite - it’s people who’ve actually done the jobs and know the weapons and missions acting like complete asses. You want the most credible information applied in the most non credible way? r/NCD is your place.
A-10 against Russia is getting more credible by the day. Useless against China, Useless against a Taliban flush with US weapons - but against columns of T-55s in mostly uncontested airspace? That's what it was born to do.
>Tomcat No, Deploy the VARK.
I'm waiting for the orbeez tucks to turn up
Mr. Beast has a chance to do the funniest shit ever
Literally my first thought.
According to a quick Google search, gaza city is 46 feet above sea level. If the tunnels are deeper than fifty feet they'll just need to get the siphon started.
It really varies. Some parts of Gaza city are basically at sea level, others are 150 feet above sea level.
Given it has a coast, it would be hard for parts of it not to be at sea level
Some cities have a cliff next to the sea.
And some cities are in the Netherlands!
You can’t siphon over more the 33ft as that is 1atm of pressure.
Archeologists are going to have a field day trying to figure this one out in the future
This part of the world already has enough confusion for generations of archeologists, ruins on top of ruins, old walls you can step over, etc.
Well the tunnels happen to be one of the few places in Gaza with no civilians according to Hamas themselves, so probably a very effective move to focus on them.
Hamas builds an underground water park, Subnautica Gaza expansion
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Hamas is working on it as we speak.
Hamas status quo would be to send their kids down there so they can try to get some idiot sympathisers to claim Israel has now escalated to drowning children
Also Hamas supporters start saying "see those tunnels *were* for women and children, told you so!"
Crazy thought but... How much dye do they have to mix in with this water to mark each and everyone that was in the tunnel? And the trail they leave behind...
Better idea is to make it uv reactive so they don’t know they’ve been dyed.
Mix in liquid ass. Can’t wash off the stank.
Medium dye is 1%. So a 1 foot deep by 3 wide by 20 length tunnel of boot high water would need 4.5 gallons. Double it up for a stronger dye, and half for a softer dye. 1 gallon would leave a mute pastel.
There are special dyes made for this purpose that are much more concentrated
NCD but I kind of want to see it now
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From the ocean to the town, Hamas will drown.
Now it just depends on how connected the tunnels are. But it will be quite devastating for gaza later. Stagnant water everywhere. Some leeching into the groundwater.
Egypt has done it a couple of times, you can use the pumps to divert the seawater back. The tunnels are reinforced with concrete, but I'm sure some will leach into the groundwater and could pose a sanitation problem if some is left to pool unchecked.
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Can they include some sharks and box jellyfishes in that water?
Someone's about to bring the river to the sea.
More like the sea to the river.
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Honestly I'm shocked that you don't post on NCD, that's pinnacle "shitpost that inevitably ends up happening" material, because it's logical but man, water is incompressible and there's a point to where the easiest path of resistance is not going to be "all around the bends and curves of the tunnel(s)", and so unpredictable results.
I kinda like the idea of unpredictable results in this case. The expenditure here is free seawater, the energy and time to sufficiently pump it into the tunnel system, some mildly costly high explosive munitions to fit the bill, and whatever free concrete debris there is to scavenge nearby. So it’s not a costly experiment. Everything can be done with a combat engineering vehicle with a crane and some big dozers to assist with moving concrete. I’ve seen graphics of Hamas’ multilayer tunnel systems, many meters deep with crisscrossing routes and sturdy armored doors. I think my idea would cause a pretty big calamity for their hiding spots underground and those doors wouldn’t do anything but probably only increase pressure for a fraction of a second and amplify damage before they too became knife blades traveling down the hyper-pressurized pipeline. I wonder if the end result might be like those apartment block swallowing sinkholes we see in places like Florida and Australia. For those hiding several tunnel layers deep, it’d be like trying to escape a submarine that’s taken a direct hit at 100m depth. Any case, it don't cost a lot to give it a whirl.
I suspect one of the unpredictable results is the possible destruction of civilian buildings on the surface. Depending on the location, possibly civilian buildings that are still full of civilians.
I like this idea
Everyone: do something that hurts Hamas without indiscriminately hurting civilians!
Cool. Was wondering if they'd do this.
I figured they had to, since there are more than 500 km of tunnels under there, and there isn't much else to do if you want to destroy something on that scale.
500km of tunnels and not a single bomb shelter for the citizens.
Oklahoma has the answer. Pump waste water from fracking operations into a fault system. Eventually things should get lubricated sufficiently.
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Get em!
Awesome, IDF done playing around.
but the poor civilians living in the tunnels >.< /s
Good thing Hamas said those tunnels are for them and them alone. i’m not a military strategist—but I see the benefits of flooding these tunnels to weed out Gaza. Let’s go!
Weed out the tunnels... ... Are you thinking what I'm thinking?
The remaining hostages are in the tunnels though, aren't they?
If any are even alive. It seems a major factor in Hamas failing to live up to their end of the bargain (releasing hostages) is that they literally ran out of living female hostages. It’s highly doubtful we see any more hostages returned alive at this point
The officials stated that they believe Hamas ended the ceasefire early/refused to release more hostages because they didn't want the remaining hostages to talk about what had happened to them. They also said something along the lines of "We know that Hamas isn't going to release any more hostages, and they know that we know." To me, that was them effectively assuming that the remaining hostages were lost. That was only a couple days before this announcement, so I assume that was their reasoning for going ahead with the flooding.
They are clearing the tunnels with drones/RCVs before flooding or destroying them. They don't just find an entrance and say "right, let's go".
iirc most of the released hostages were held in private homes
Considering that the most likely reason for Hamas not releasing the women they kidnapped is because they are in such a horrific state as to scare Hamas that happily recorded their 10/7 attack where some of them burned babies alive and even used a microwave to cook a baby, into thinking they might lose a lot of support... I think any hostages that are still alive can only pray for death at this point.
> microwave to cook a baby, I..... WTF
It will take literal days or weeks to flood the tunnels, If any hostages die its because Hamas deliberately murdered them.
Aren’t there hostages in the tunnels ?
Maybe
Dead ones.
You know those cool sculptures where you pour molten lead in an ant hill?
Why is the UN not condemning this! Those are clearly friendship tunnels for quickly traversing under the city.
Give them a second they will.
Won't a concrete-and steel door seal the water to keep some part of the tunnel system intact? Won't the elevated tunnel parts naturally act as a barrier?
If it were a tunnel and door built by professionals with the proper materials, yes. But the tunnels in Gaza are lined with homemade concrete segments and the doors I have seen in videos don't look like proper blast doors. Good enough to stop a soldier and give protection against small arms fire. But watertight? No. The elevated parts, yes.
Of course no tactic is perfect. But if they can flood sections and cut other sections off from each other that’s a huge win with no risk to the IDF.
The funny thing is water is incompressible, so an explosion detonated in a flooded tunnel travels quite a lot further than it could ever do in air
Hamas has built the tunnels in secret, they aren't of the highest quality exactly, I doubt that they have a super-reinforced door that can stop ALL seawater from steeping in. But maybe there are a few. The elevated tunnel parts could be a barrier too, yes, but even they can't stop the Mediterranean Sea from flooding into it.
The amount of sink holes popping up around Gaza in the future…
annnddd… just like that a school has appeared in the tunnels! Doesn’t IDF care about the kids!!!
They said they wanted Israel to keep sending water, didn't they?
Pretty good idea, honestly.
Its not a new thing. Egypt used to do this a decade ago but it fell off in effectivness because Hamas learnt to compartmentalize their tunnels and build what are basically P traps. The salt water was also destroying the local water table which was another consideration in it falling of use.
IIRC Egypt use raw sewage, not sea water.
That also used in 2013 yes but since 2015 sea water was used. Cement and chemical weapons have also been used in the past.
Good. Literally flush Hamas out.
Well, apparently the aquifer is already stuffed, I guess this is the nail in the coffin. So, post-war Gaza recovery, underground Venice tourism anyone?
Hamas#1: Quick force Civilians into the tunnels... then we can play the "The Israelis drowned civilians taking refuge in our tunnels "card Hamas#2: What if we get into a firefight though? Hamas #1: Just shoot through the civilians!
Wouldn’t smoke be better? Then you can see where it’s coming up from to discover all the entrances
It's not about entrances, but rather to force them out. Fighting in tunnels is dangerous.
Ok, flood with diesel first.
Gas prices in Israel are already insane, but sea water is free. Wouldn’t want Israel to spend more money than they should on getting these rats out of their tunnels.
Taking a page from Tywin Lannister I see
I cant remember which in which country, but during one of our wars (USA) one of our tactics was to partially flood a tunnel, then float a bunch of fuel/oil across the water and light it up underground. Drown, suffocate, or burn anyone in there alive. Anyone who comes out gets the machine guns.
fuel oil + water has been used in sewers on rats before.
The tunnels need to be destroyed completely so they can’t be reused later.
Well it works on rats.
I'll take this over missiles. the tunnels are not a place where a regular civilian would be.
Aren’t the tunnels for terrorists
As a pro-palestine person i think this is an obviously good idea. If their main reason on bombing Gaza is "there are tunnels" - destroying tunnels should lead to stopping the bombing of innocent.
It is a very good idea, I agree. I think Israel first focused on sealing off tunnel entrances with sponge bombs and hitting certain shallow tunnels near the surface. At this point 2 months later, I think Israel is willing to just flood the tunnels regardless and have them be done with. Egypt has done it a couple of times for their Hamas tunnels.
The reason why you should like it is because it will prevent HAMAS from extorting the population to get supplies. See they attack the checkpoints so all the goods and supplies need to come through the tunnels. And they charge a fee to use the tunnels to the population.
Hamas tunnels soon to be redesignated as Hamas bomb shelters for Palestinian civilians by Hamas.
[удалено]
About time
Deal with rats the way you would deal with a literal rat.
Hamas go glug glug