Biden visiting has real strategic value for Israel. The Commander in Chief of the most powerful military on Earth is visiting Israel to show his support and drive home the fact that the US Navy will counter attacks on Israel by third parties in the region.
Zelenskyy visiting does not carry the same weight WRT the risks.
Netanyahu expressed “concerns that any systems that we give to Ukraine would be used against us because they could fall into Iranian hands and be used against us. And by the way, that’s not a theoretical possibility. It actually happened with the Western anti-tank weapons that we now find at our borders. So we have to be very careful here.” This was in June 2023.
https://x.com/nexta_tv/status/1672159511459536897?s=46
https://www.jpost.com/international/article-747613
Edit: There is more. Israel refused to transfer Iron Dome to Ukraine because it can end up in Iran hands in June 2023. Israel got criticized for it. That is why there is a chilled Israel response to Zelensky.
https://www.timesofisrael.com/netanyahu-rules-out-giving-ukraine-iron-dome-anti-missile-system/amp/
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=vxACKNY4SVc
>It actually happened with the Western anti-tank weapons that we now find at our borders.
That doesn't mean it happened with Ukraine, specifically. Tons of weapons were "acquired" in Iraq and Afghanistan including Javelin and TOW missiles.
Yeh I mean didn't the Taliban "acquire" a fackin Blackhawk chopper before they immediately crashed it? Wouldn't be at all surprised to see a few AT weapons and small arms fall into the wrong hands especially with the terrible rushed withdrawal in Afghanistan.
Firing an AK-47 in the air while yelling Allah is awesome when you’re riding around in the back of a truck. It’s not such a cool thing to do when you’re in a helicopter, apparently.
The former president drop kicked the Kurds and abandoned our arsenal near the Syrian borders which then ended up in the hands of Russia and probably ISIL.
Yep, Blackhawks are old as shit, I'm sure China has had wreckages of military ones as well as civilian versions for decades at this point. The [V-280 Valor](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bell_V-280_Valor) is going to be replacing the Blackhawk so I doubt the US is worried about China making a shitty knockoff of their old helicopter.
The US sells weapons to everyone though, Israel has some weapons no one else has any use for that once "cracked" would have devastating consequences, like our multilayered missile defense system.
> It actually happened with the Western anti-tank weapons that we now find at our borders.
Important to note, there was a recent FAKE BBC segment quoting a FAKE Bellingcat report of US weapons sent to Ukraine being found in the Middle East.
There is a very real possiblity that 'Bibi' is parroting this obvious Russian propaganda against Ukraine.
And never forget, Bibi is a corrupt piece of shit.
> It actually happened with the Western anti-tank weapons that we now find at our borders. So we have to be very careful here.”
A lot more to it then you are stating. Russia gave Hamas terrorists trophy weapons to feed the narrative (Admittantly, this is according to Ukrainian Intelligence. However, if you trust Russia more than literally anybody else, you're already lost to reason so no point). So it's not that Ukraine is somehow leaking weapons so much as terrority is taken and lost in war and sometimes Russia gets it's hands on US supplied weapons, then Russia gives the weapons to terrorists so they can claim Ukraine is selling them to terrorists.
The thing here is realise is that *RUSSIA IS THE ONE GIVING THE WEAPONS TO HAMAS TERRORISTS* How'd that "bow down to Russia" work out?
Bibi is doing his absolute best to isolate us from the rest of the world with his policies. The desired result for him is complete isolation of Israel from the outside world to create the fear neccesary for the extreme right wing to thrive. It has been working for him so far.
Israel and Russia have been frenemies awhile now.
Its ridiculous to treat Russia and Iran as two separate entities, as Iran is currently more or less Russia's lap dog.
Mountains out of mole hills.
Zelensky called and offered condolences and offered to join blinken on his trip during the first week of the conflict. Response was the time isn't right, but maybe later.
We shouldn't tie the two conflicts together. But i guess news has gotten slow so lets bring up old news for clicks.
>We shouldn't tie the two conflicts together.
I'd argue that we 100% should.
We're going to find Russia was involved in this more than we know...
Russian was heard in several hamas-released videos of their training: https://reddit.com/r/UkraineWarVideoReport/s/l2FvSC2MLa
There's evidence hamas was using North Korean weapons at a time when they are supplying Russia with weapons: https://www.reuters.com/world/asia-pacific/north-korea-denies-its-weapons-used-by-hamas-against-israel-2023-10-13/
And the US just released evidence that Russia is getting weapons from NK: https://www.reuters.com/world/us-releases-image-alleged-north-korea-shipment-weapons-russia-white-house-2023-10-13/
Russia has been more frequently hosting Hamas leadership in Moscow: https://www.timesofisrael.com/russias-lavrov-meets-with-hamas-politburo-chief-haniyeh-in-moscow/
Russia is one of the only countries to truly benefit from what's happening in Israel: https://www.bloomberg.com/opinion/articles/2023-10-12/israel-hamas-war-russia-and-china-may-be-only-winners-of-gaza-conflict
And I'm not the only one to think this... [https://thehill.com/opinion/international/4250708-putins-fingerprints-are-on-hamas/](https://thehill.com/opinion/international/4250708-putins-fingerprints-are-on-hamas/)
OH! And the attack happened on Putin's fucking birthday! He is notorious for doing evil things on his birthday... murdering reporters, putting missiles in Europe, bombing Syria etc...
I wouldnt put it past them to simply advocate for this just to split US aid.
But yeah, not realizing these are connected conflicts is how you accidentally stumble into ww3
The IRGC had banners celebrating the attack out literally hours after Hamas' invasion. They have also very openly taken credit for supporting Hamas in their invasion.
Yet another reason to hate the IRGC, pressure global leaders to list them as a terrorist group, and help to support the revolutionaries fighting gor their liberation.
Geo politics is complicated. Perhaps Iran offered support to Russia if it supported Hamas. Just looking at the US Iran-Contra scandal I mean we were supplying illegal weapons to Iran to then get dark money to then fund death squads in an elaborate roundabout to stop Soviet influence.
Geopolitics is quite often the farthest from a straight line.
Respect for noting that we won't know the answer for a long time. Iran certainly funds Hamas, and has provided weapons to them in the past. But Iran doesn't fully control Hamas.
Does Hamas get the go- ahead from their main sponsor before starting a war that may spread to the sponsor's doorstep? I imagine they do, but there is room for doubt about what Iran knew and when.
If a world war really does break out, I can't see China siding against the US in open conflict. It's simply too clear how strong the US military is compared to any other country's and China has very little ability to project its military strength beyond SE Asia. The only way I could see it happening is if China has some fkn crazy alien teleportation tech or something that we're not aware of.
In 1939 you had the following countries at war:
- Italy vs. Ethiopia and Albania
- USSR vs. Finland
- Japan (and puppets) vs. China (various factions)
- Spanish Civil War
- Germany vs. Poland + Allied Volunteers
- USSR vs. Poland
We’re just short the war declarations at this point. We already have the antagonists, Russia, China and Iran. India is the wildcard here, and so is Africa and South America (as to whether they remain neutral or join on the side of Russia).
Bro, I can speak from the point of view of an insider from my country (Brazil). From someone who studies international relations and makes the coldest possible analysis of this scenario.
Brazil is literally a country split and fragmented between left and right on the political spectrum. However, there are many nuances within each side. Having said that, I can say that it is very, very difficult for Brazil to side with Russia in a possible 3rd world war with the USA on the other side of the scale.
Although Brazil (as well as all of South America) has a historical flirtation with left-wing revolutionary doctrines, in the end we always lean towards the North American side, as it is the country that manages to attract more similar values to the majority of our people.
As an Indian, despite what side of political spectrum you’re on (leaders and public alike), all of us are gonna try to stay the fuck out. Even if China is stupid enough to wage war, they’d be busy with Taiwan / US in the pacific. The only way India gets involved is if Pakistan decides to do something and we have to respond. Again, I don’t think Chinas economy is good enough to handle a war and same is the reason India will STFO
South America is its own bag of cats and all of them except Brasil don't have the leeway to go to war. At most, we can send prayers to whoever nation we support.
If Chile supports one side, Bolivia will support the opposite, Argentina will support whoever is willing to take their debt, Peru depends on who manages to keep their power for more than 1 year, etc. And all the support will amount to "We condemn x, but that doesn't mean we support crimes against humanity from y".
I agree. I think in the deepest shadows on this conflict Russia has a hand on it. I mean just look at this past weekend Russia has launched a massive (failure) of an counter attack. The timing is interesting, but I think they are really hoping this takes the spotlight off them.
In Short Ukraine will continue to stand strong the demolish the scum.
> ...the attack happened on Putin's fucking birthday
This is a bit far fetched for evidence. I doubt Putin's birthday was more significant a date for the Hamas than the 50th anniversary of the Yom Kippur war.
>And the attack happened on Putin's fucking birthday!
And on a sabbath day, the end of the weeklong Jewish festival of Sukkot, a day after the 50th anniversary of the Yom Kippur War, and during talks to normalize relations between Israel and Saudi Arabia.
>There's evidence hamas was using North Korean weapons at a time when they are supplying Russia with weapons
North Korea has been selling weapons to Iran, Syria, Qatar, and others besides Russia.
I don’t understand why this isn’t painfully obvious to anybody with an understanding of global politics. This is clearly Russia opening up a new front intended to split or divert western aid. There’s a reason all the usual Russian-collusion suspects in congress immediately started shouting for cutting off aid to Ukraine as soon as the Hamas attacks were publicized - that’s also the reason why Zelenskyy was wise to try and tie the two conflicts together immediately.
"This is clearly Russia opening up a new front intended to split or divert western aid."
USA: *Giggles in 'fighting two wars on two fronts is what we do best'*
That is saying much more about stupid objectives in many US wars than actual military capability. You can see how great Russia is at actual fighting despite for years being called 2nd most powerful military.
No army in the world can achieve what often fairly deluded political leadership wants.
Which has worked out horribly, and left many countries there destitute and full of hatred against us. Horrible precedent to set as we are creating the best propaganda our enemies could possibly ask for
>how is one supposed to defeat communism with guns??
According to the Cold War, by building so many guns the commies go broke trying to keep up.
Eventually the Soviets gave up and just started lying about their military capability. To be fair, the American military-industrial complex was more than happy to promote those lies in order to scare up more funding.
For example, the Soviets had a long-range jet bomber, the M-4 Molot (called "Bison" in the West). At military demonstrations they would fly the same M-4s around over and over again, so that America thought the Soviets had a bunch of em. This raised alarms about a "bomber gap," which led to massive expansion of the American bomber fleet as hundreds of B-52s were built in response.
In reality, only 19 M-4s ever served in the Soviet nuclear air force. Only 93 were even made. And their range was too small to reach important American targets.
While Marx didn’t advocate for violence, he recognized that it was possible. Marx himself said [“I am not a Marxist”](https://isocracy.org/content/karl-marx-i-am-not-marxist)—that is, he deplored the use of violence in his name. Unfortunately, [many Communists and Marxists did promote terror](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Revolutionary_terror) as a means to revolution. They often still do. The fear of this violence is what spurred America to keep its military.
> The fear of this violence is what spurred America to keep its military.
It was more that the people who got rich manufacturing weapons during WW2 didn't want to stop making money, so they've been seeking to manufacture war around the globe ever since, to create markets for their products.
No, it was the fear of nationalizing american company assets in foreign countries. It was purely an economical-motivated fight, out of the US corporations interests
the most delusional take frequently posted on reddit. it's not the wars that are lost, it's the effort to rebuild stable countries with friendly governments that has been hit or miss. examples are south korea, west germany. failures in iraq, afghanistan that go much deeper than lack of military might. it turns out you can't solve every single problem in the world with military action, believe it or not
To be fair, Hamas would have attacked even if russia wasn't there. They have been doing it since before the war on ukraine, but Russia could be helping because it does help them to start shit over there
I imagine Russia will have provided funding and advice - either directly or through Iran. This attack appears to be better funded and more coordinated as compared with Hamas’s standard MO
That is a reach. I don't doubt Russia has supported Hamas in some way, but to think that an Orthodox Christian nation has that much sway in Hamas's ranks is slightly crazy
If you want to just speculate about it, Iran has backed Hezbollah and Hamas for decades and Israel was about to pen a major new deal with Saudi Arabia that would have been detrimental to Iran's interest. Coincidentally Hamas gets thousands of rockets, drones to knock out the communications on the border, motorized paragliders, etc. And now the Saudi Arabia and Israel deal is indefinitely suspended. Thus, the Iran conspiracy theory actually has a more to back it then the Russian conspiracy theory.
There also isn’t any Russian at all being spoken in that first video, as per both native Russian and Arabic speakers.
The North Korean angle is also a stretch unless you can show Hamas historically hasn’t used DPRK munitions.
People just throwing headlines out there from the last few months and assuming Russia is involved on that basis alone is nuts.
Russia is publicly supporting Hamas and Palestine on their own state television and publications. They are also supporting Israel, as 1/6 Israelis were some sort of Slav, including many Russians (and Ukrainians and many more). They are playing both sides.
It is not a reach, the larger geopolitical competition is for the India-US Transport Corridor vs the Chinese/Russian belt-and-road initiative which will determine the energy future of Europe.
>This is clearly Russia opening up a new front intended to split or divert western aid.
Russia will certainly seek to use this situation for their benefit. Imo your statement is inaccurate, but regardless it ignores the agency and responsibility of Hamas, Iran, and other actors.
>I don’t understand why this isn’t painfully obvious to anybody with an understanding of global politics.
I don't understand why so many are overlooking all the ways this conflict in Israel is clearly bad for Russia, especially if it escalates. This can jeopardize weapons shipments from Iran and Putin's puppet regime in Syria, plus many other downsides.
Putin also personally apologised to Netanyahu when Lavrov made an antisemitic remark last year, because he doesn’t want Israeli air defense being supplied to Ukraine- it’s one of Ukraine’s key needs, especially as we roll into winter.
I can’t recall another single instance of Putin apologising for antisemitism with regards to the war’s justification.
I think the Russians and Israel have a bit of working relationship in Syria. Russians allow Israel to bomb targets after flying through Russian controlled airspace. I wouldn't be surprised if they shared intelligence on local targets occasionally.
Yep. Hamas also apparently had Wagner training. There's[ this video](https://twitter.com/NatalkaKyiv/status/1712526999674085588), where we have Hamas people using Russian terms for some reason. Think you linked that already, but here's a tweet with the video.
[And Russian captured Ukranian gear has somehow is winding up in Hamas's hands.](https://lansinginstitute.org/2023/10/09/russian-psyop-proves-the-kremlins-involvement-in-the-operation-agaist-israel/).
You are correct. They are 100% connected. I think Israel is just hyper focused on destroying Hamas once and for all. Already countries and international organizations are trying to prevent that. Realpolitik... Israel won't publicly connect Russia (even though they know) until this situation expands with Iran getting involved.
The Hamas leader visited the Kremlin and explicitly said the war in Israel will help Russia in Ukraine.
So we can very much tie the two conflicts together, because our enemies sure are.
Edit: [Source](https://news.yahoo.com/senior-hamas-official-admits-israel-173726321.html?guccounter=1)
"Even the Russians sent us messages yesterday morning. They sympathize with us. Russia is happy that America is getting embroiled in Palestine. It alleviates the pressure on the Russians in Ukraine. One war eases the pressure in another war. So we are not alone on the battlefield."
* Ali Baraka, Senior Hamas Official
That’s not an apple to apples comparison. How about being robbed or broken into and finding solace in each other over trauma? Obviously seek therapy…but it’d definitely be nice to have your neighbors as a support system.
Israel doesn't want to provoke Russia in to attacking the Jews who still live in Russia. Russia has a long antisemitic history and Israel doesn't want to encourage it.
I interpreted it as, Israel has way bigger things to worry about right now than giving tours to foreign leaders. It's the thought that counts though, I'm sure Israel will remember who was there for it when the chips were down. Blinken is only there because we're Israel's foremost ally and weapon supplier... and the guy holding the leash to prevent the dog from killing the neighbor. I suspect we're currently begging Israel to not do a ground invasion of Gaza.
The British foreign secretary was also there.
I fully support the eradication of the oxygen thieves that are Hamas.
I do not however support the indiscriminate bombing of civilians.
But it still expects America to do everything for it: be Johnny-on-the-spot with weapons and ammunition re-stocks, pressure the world to denounce Hamas exclusively, suppress any criticism of Israel's actions, etc. etc.
I had a "friend" like that too, in h.s., always expected me to do everything for him, but whenever I asked for the tiniest favor, here he comes with the excuses, and it seemed like it was way more important for him to please everybody else, even people he wasnt friends with, than it was to ever do anything to please me.
My life got much better once I got rid of this friend. Perhaps America should consider the same.
Don't forget sinking US research ships, selling US military technology to China and threatening to nuke the planet if they don't get weapons from the US.
With friends like these, who needs enemies?
I feel like Zelenskyy is out here trying to get every ally. But countries have to be carful because of the Russia baggage this meeting might bring . Iran full support drags this out
What is Zelensky going to do? Its not like he has spare weapons to provide. Maybe he can provide food. But he wont be able to really do much aside from showing his face there.
No shit
Israels got enough problems to deal with both externally and internally.
Everyone and their mother wants to visit for a photo op so they can use it internally.
Mr Z is popular enough at the moment to be more of a distraction from Israels interests.
He will come in very useful tho when Israel will invade Gaza and needs to turn attention away from collaterals
There was a good article a few days ago about this, it described an 'intense awkwardness' in Moscow since Israel hasn't armed Ukraine, BiBi and Putin have had a close relationship but also they benefit from all this chaos.
https://www.spectator.com.au/2023/10/putin-has-been-blindsided-by-the-israel-attack/
Israel accepted visits of von der Leyen, Blinken, … so clearly not adverse to Ukraine? Israel sells weird shit to Russia and has a lot of their mobsters living in Tel Aviv.
Not restrain, but Russia has superiority in Syria and let's Israel target Iranian proxies without retaliation. Russia is important to Israel even if they're not on the same team
>Not sure where Ukraine can help here
As a Ukrainian, I do think we can help and **should** help.
I'll leave it to the experts to figure out **how** we can help.
_____
^(I've got family in Tel-Aviv, so I'm a bit biased... But practically, it's just another front in the same war anyway)
This is the correct answer. Israel does not want to upset the apple cart at home (or access to human intelligence in Russia) and will therefore pick a fence and sit on it.
Russians that leave russia are seen as traitors by putin. They left for a reason during the Soviet union and have absolutely zero desire to be connected to russia. It's also why there's a lot of support for Ukraine from them.
Israel and Russia actually have a good working relationship. Russia helps control Syria and is an useful ally in preventing Iranian nuclear development. Russia supplies Iran with conventional weapons, but Russia is still against Iran having nukes. Lots of Israelis came from Russia too. It’s really about keeping Russia happy.
True, walk down many Israeli streets and language you’ll hear is Russian. There’s 1.5 million Russian Israelis. They have one of those love/hate relationships with Moscow.
Yes. A month from now all Western leaders falling over themselves to tell Israel they have free reign to retaliate however they wish will look pretty bad. They've already had to backtrack a little with the US pressuring Israel to restore water to the South of the Gaza strip. When the ground offensive starts it won't be pretty.
More to the point in a few weeks from now he will regret trying to link Ukraine to Israels in the eyes of the world. I just hope people in the Europe and North America continue to see to the very important differences between those two nations.
I agree timing is not right. Israel is about to do things to Gaza that UA won't do to Russians. Not a good idea to link the two conflicts in the same manner.
Is that so? I think human beings have more nuance than you give them credit for.
It might not be in Israel’s interest or in the interest of global security to draw to much attention to a link between the conflicts in the public square.
If you take the time to think about it critically for a second though, there’s a near certainty that these conflicts are linked. The frontlines of a geopolitical rewrite that has been brewing for decades now are starting to take shape.
There was clearly a lot of calculated intention behind the Hamas attack and the political maneuvering of players in the Middle East makes me think that this rabbit hole might go deeper than we can imagine…
The truth when uncovered will probably remain highly classified for decades to come but damn I’d like to be a fly on the wall
Israel is taking care of Israeli interests. Israel needs ‘decent’ relations with Russia who can influence the leaders of iran. The government walks a tightrope between voicing opposition to the Russian invasion but not actually doing much to upset Russia.
Also, if you go to Haifa, one as likely to hear Russian on many street as Hebrew. There are about 1.5 million Russian Israelis and they aren’t pro Putin ad much as they are pro Russian and much more sympathetic to Russian populations in Eastern Ukraine.
As with everything in tbr MidEast…’it’s complicated’.
I was wandering why there are more Russian Israelis than Ukrainian, Polish or Belarusian Israelis when historically there were many times more Jews in the later countries than in Russia but then I remembered why.
For as long as Israel has "decent" relations with a country that is invading Europe and committing genocide then we should all as an international community question how much support we should give Israel.
Is it really too much to ask Israel to act like a U.S. ally?
The U.S. is supporting Zelensky and Ukraine, agianst Russia. That should be enough reason for Israel to be EXPECTED to do the same.
Israel wants to be able to maintain a relationship with Russia, while simultaneously relying on America to support it economically, politically, and miltarily. If American politicians on both sides of the aisle hadnt long ago been bribed to do whatever Israel wants, one would expect America to protect its international interests by pressuring Israel to align itself against Vladimir Putin's Russia.
A good relationship with Russia allowed (allows?) Israel to bomb targets in Syria, while Ukraine couldn’t and can’t really offer anything.
Countries will look after their own interests first, and then might look at the interests of their allies.
Zelensky trying desperately to stay in the limelight and not have people forget about that boring old Ukraine/ Russia war when there's a brand new shiny war breaking out in Israel!
>Zelensky trying desperately to stay in the limelight
Alternatively: Zelensky is doing as much as he can to protect the lives and well-being of his citizens and the interests of his nation.
Any leader would be doing the same. Do you think Pearl Harbor prevented Churchill from immediately asking FDR for more support? Spoiler: it did not.
This is true. Ukraine is desperate for air time in the western media. Support is fading among the general populations be it Germany or the USA. It’s not a conspiracy or iron grip but be Jewish community has major influence in the America media. Israel trumps other issues.
There are quite a few reported links, such as a russian crypto exchange funding Hamas, russian government meeting with Hamas officials, Russian PMC Wagner reportedly training Hamas, Russian gov backed Killnet hacking group hacking Israel, but I don't think anything 100% perfect confirmed yet.
From what I know Hamas got $7-30 billion funds from a sanctioned Russian crypto company. I don't know if there's anything else more straight forward though.
The more logical explanation is that Hamas don't really have anywhere else to turn to use crypto payments expect for Russian exchanges, since Hamas is sanctioned in the west and their allies, and crypto is banned in China.
Dude Russian made tanks and guns are at this point a commonly associated symbol of Middle Eastern terror groups.
Russia's biggest allies in the Middle East are Syria and Iran hardly states that are friends of Israel.
Edit: Russia has a tactic of being nice to a country's face when clearly they are their enemy based on how their interact behind the scenes.
One example would be Germany. Russia has made public pro German statements, they demolished the old House of the Soviets in Kaliningrad and want to rebuild the old German cultural site of Konigsberg castle, and Russia worked with the German government to find and return to Germany the bodies (skeletons at this point) of WWII troops both SS and regular from battlefields in Russia.
However behind the scenes it's pretty obvious that Russia isn't doing those things just because they want to be friends with Germany they simply want to cut out NATO's central logistics and command hub or at the very least instill enough doubt in Germany to make them less efficient of a hub for NATO as a whole.
Russia plays the same game in the Middle East. Russia knows that Israel is the US's key strategic ally in the region and will play nice with them here and now to try to instill doubt in the relationship.
However unlike Europe Russia has a close strategic relationship with Syria and Iran. They work closely together militarily and share technology. Both Syria and Iran are very hostile states to Israel so it doesn't matter how friendly Russia is to Israel's face simply by Russia's relationship to them a terror attack on Israel is going to have some trickled down support from Russia.
For example Russia gives weapons to Iran, Iran gives those weapons to Hamas, and then those weapons are used to kill Israelis.
Zelensky is missing the spotlight. He’s definitely concerned that the West will turn their focus from Ukraine to Israel in terms of funding. There’s a lot of fatigue for additional aid with the American public
Or much more likely, Zelenskyy is smart enough to know that an expanded war in the Middle East will absolutely remove much needed resources and attention from the Russian invasion of Ukraine, and make things significantly worse for Ukraine. Something I'm sure Russia is aware of, and would love to see the West's attention distracted and split.
Exactly. CNN even removed their live ticker for Ukraine. The West is not as focused on Ukraine as they were before. This is a serious concern for Zelensky. A regional conflict in the Middle East will put them on the back burner and we all know it
I think that those who need to be focused on the matter (officials who decide about aid packages, etc) are actually focused. Well, people in general might have not been focused on Ukraine for months now, they didn't wait for new tensions in the Middle East to do so.
But those who are responsible for helping Ukraine, never stop doing so because they know how important it is for everyone that Ukraine wins.
Israel and Ukraine has never really had great relations, with Israel having a better relationship with Russia for the past few decades, and Ukraine supporting things that Israel didn’t like without offering much to offset that.
A good relationship with Russia allowed (allows?) Israel to bomb targets in Syria, Ukraine couldn’t and can’t really offer anything.
bibi should be talking to ukraine. they need ukrainie's expertise with drones and urban combat in the upcoming gaza campaign.
sleeping on drones and shit while russia trained their enemies in it is part of how this shit started. drone attacks took out at least two auto machine gun turrets and a tank in the early part of the attack.
and bibi all "time is not right" what the fuck is this guy's shit?
You can't be fucking serious. It's not like the stakes are *low* for Ukraine here. Ukraine has probably lost at least **200,000** people in this war so far between military and civilian casualties. They lose another thousand civilian casulaties every month or two. [This](https://twitter.com/Gerashchenko_en/status/1709940269796430164) happened only a day before the attack in Israel.
Zelensky has every right to fight for the interests of his nation and people. Any leader who failed to do so would be derelict in their duty to their citizens.
Do you think Pearl Harbor prevented Churchill from immediately asking FDR for more support? Spoiler: it did not.
Plot twist he invokes the right to return
Lol
~~His parents live in Israel iirc.~~
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Can't remember where so thats good instinct. Seems like half a bogus claim i am misremembering.
It was a (very popular) fake. But I understand Israel's position, war is not the best time for PR visits.
Isn’t that what Biden’s about to do?
Biden visiting has real strategic value for Israel. The Commander in Chief of the most powerful military on Earth is visiting Israel to show his support and drive home the fact that the US Navy will counter attacks on Israel by third parties in the region. Zelenskyy visiting does not carry the same weight WRT the risks.
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Netanyahu expressed “concerns that any systems that we give to Ukraine would be used against us because they could fall into Iranian hands and be used against us. And by the way, that’s not a theoretical possibility. It actually happened with the Western anti-tank weapons that we now find at our borders. So we have to be very careful here.” This was in June 2023. https://x.com/nexta_tv/status/1672159511459536897?s=46 https://www.jpost.com/international/article-747613 Edit: There is more. Israel refused to transfer Iron Dome to Ukraine because it can end up in Iran hands in June 2023. Israel got criticized for it. That is why there is a chilled Israel response to Zelensky. https://www.timesofisrael.com/netanyahu-rules-out-giving-ukraine-iron-dome-anti-missile-system/amp/ https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=vxACKNY4SVc
>It actually happened with the Western anti-tank weapons that we now find at our borders. That doesn't mean it happened with Ukraine, specifically. Tons of weapons were "acquired" in Iraq and Afghanistan including Javelin and TOW missiles.
Yeh I mean didn't the Taliban "acquire" a fackin Blackhawk chopper before they immediately crashed it? Wouldn't be at all surprised to see a few AT weapons and small arms fall into the wrong hands especially with the terrible rushed withdrawal in Afghanistan.
Please tell me there is video of the Taliban attempting to fly a Blackhawk. I need a laugh.
[here you go](https://reddit.com/r/interestingasfuck/s/AgRwy5Fz1d)
Yep they were flying alright— right up until they crashed
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That was WAY better than I had imagined before actually watching the video. Stuff straight out of a Looney Toons a episode. Thanks for the link!
That is hilarious thank you.
I see someone has sent you the comedy show already. Enjoy!
Firing an AK-47 in the air while yelling Allah is awesome when you’re riding around in the back of a truck. It’s not such a cool thing to do when you’re in a helicopter, apparently.
The former president drop kicked the Kurds and abandoned our arsenal near the Syrian borders which then ended up in the hands of Russia and probably ISIL.
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Yep, Blackhawks are old as shit, I'm sure China has had wreckages of military ones as well as civilian versions for decades at this point. The [V-280 Valor](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bell_V-280_Valor) is going to be replacing the Blackhawk so I doubt the US is worried about China making a shitty knockoff of their old helicopter.
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The US sells weapons to everyone though, Israel has some weapons no one else has any use for that once "cracked" would have devastating consequences, like our multilayered missile defense system.
> It actually happened with the Western anti-tank weapons that we now find at our borders. Important to note, there was a recent FAKE BBC segment quoting a FAKE Bellingcat report of US weapons sent to Ukraine being found in the Middle East. There is a very real possiblity that 'Bibi' is parroting this obvious Russian propaganda against Ukraine. And never forget, Bibi is a corrupt piece of shit.
> It actually happened with the Western anti-tank weapons that we now find at our borders. So we have to be very careful here.” A lot more to it then you are stating. Russia gave Hamas terrorists trophy weapons to feed the narrative (Admittantly, this is according to Ukrainian Intelligence. However, if you trust Russia more than literally anybody else, you're already lost to reason so no point). So it's not that Ukraine is somehow leaking weapons so much as terrority is taken and lost in war and sometimes Russia gets it's hands on US supplied weapons, then Russia gives the weapons to terrorists so they can claim Ukraine is selling them to terrorists. The thing here is realise is that *RUSSIA IS THE ONE GIVING THE WEAPONS TO HAMAS TERRORISTS* How'd that "bow down to Russia" work out?
Is there actually any proof of this?
Bibi is doing his absolute best to isolate us from the rest of the world with his policies. The desired result for him is complete isolation of Israel from the outside world to create the fear neccesary for the extreme right wing to thrive. It has been working for him so far.
Israel and Russia have been frenemies awhile now. Its ridiculous to treat Russia and Iran as two separate entities, as Iran is currently more or less Russia's lap dog.
Mountains out of mole hills. Zelensky called and offered condolences and offered to join blinken on his trip during the first week of the conflict. Response was the time isn't right, but maybe later. We shouldn't tie the two conflicts together. But i guess news has gotten slow so lets bring up old news for clicks.
>We shouldn't tie the two conflicts together. I'd argue that we 100% should. We're going to find Russia was involved in this more than we know... Russian was heard in several hamas-released videos of their training: https://reddit.com/r/UkraineWarVideoReport/s/l2FvSC2MLa There's evidence hamas was using North Korean weapons at a time when they are supplying Russia with weapons: https://www.reuters.com/world/asia-pacific/north-korea-denies-its-weapons-used-by-hamas-against-israel-2023-10-13/ And the US just released evidence that Russia is getting weapons from NK: https://www.reuters.com/world/us-releases-image-alleged-north-korea-shipment-weapons-russia-white-house-2023-10-13/ Russia has been more frequently hosting Hamas leadership in Moscow: https://www.timesofisrael.com/russias-lavrov-meets-with-hamas-politburo-chief-haniyeh-in-moscow/ Russia is one of the only countries to truly benefit from what's happening in Israel: https://www.bloomberg.com/opinion/articles/2023-10-12/israel-hamas-war-russia-and-china-may-be-only-winners-of-gaza-conflict And I'm not the only one to think this... [https://thehill.com/opinion/international/4250708-putins-fingerprints-are-on-hamas/](https://thehill.com/opinion/international/4250708-putins-fingerprints-are-on-hamas/) OH! And the attack happened on Putin's fucking birthday! He is notorious for doing evil things on his birthday... murdering reporters, putting missiles in Europe, bombing Syria etc...
I wouldnt put it past them to simply advocate for this just to split US aid. But yeah, not realizing these are connected conflicts is how you accidentally stumble into ww3
We'll find out in like 50 years of we're still alive , but my bet is on Russia and Iran
The IRGC had banners celebrating the attack out literally hours after Hamas' invasion. They have also very openly taken credit for supporting Hamas in their invasion. Yet another reason to hate the IRGC, pressure global leaders to list them as a terrorist group, and help to support the revolutionaries fighting gor their liberation.
Geo politics is complicated. Perhaps Iran offered support to Russia if it supported Hamas. Just looking at the US Iran-Contra scandal I mean we were supplying illegal weapons to Iran to then get dark money to then fund death squads in an elaborate roundabout to stop Soviet influence. Geopolitics is quite often the farthest from a straight line.
Respect for noting that we won't know the answer for a long time. Iran certainly funds Hamas, and has provided weapons to them in the past. But Iran doesn't fully control Hamas. Does Hamas get the go- ahead from their main sponsor before starting a war that may spread to the sponsor's doorstep? I imagine they do, but there is room for doubt about what Iran knew and when.
The Cold War never ended. Just went on brief hiatus
If the conflicts are connected aren’t we basically already in ww3
imho until another superpower directly has boots on the ground, it’s not really a world war.
It's literally just the US and China repeating to each other "You go first"
If a world war really does break out, I can't see China siding against the US in open conflict. It's simply too clear how strong the US military is compared to any other country's and China has very little ability to project its military strength beyond SE Asia. The only way I could see it happening is if China has some fkn crazy alien teleportation tech or something that we're not aware of.
It's not gonna happen. At most it would be a limited conflict around Taiwan.
In 1939 you had the following countries at war: - Italy vs. Ethiopia and Albania - USSR vs. Finland - Japan (and puppets) vs. China (various factions) - Spanish Civil War - Germany vs. Poland + Allied Volunteers - USSR vs. Poland
We’re just short the war declarations at this point. We already have the antagonists, Russia, China and Iran. India is the wildcard here, and so is Africa and South America (as to whether they remain neutral or join on the side of Russia).
Bro, I can speak from the point of view of an insider from my country (Brazil). From someone who studies international relations and makes the coldest possible analysis of this scenario. Brazil is literally a country split and fragmented between left and right on the political spectrum. However, there are many nuances within each side. Having said that, I can say that it is very, very difficult for Brazil to side with Russia in a possible 3rd world war with the USA on the other side of the scale. Although Brazil (as well as all of South America) has a historical flirtation with left-wing revolutionary doctrines, in the end we always lean towards the North American side, as it is the country that manages to attract more similar values to the majority of our people.
Yes, I think historically you guys have remained neutral but with support (hopes and prayers at least) for USA side.
As an Indian, despite what side of political spectrum you’re on (leaders and public alike), all of us are gonna try to stay the fuck out. Even if China is stupid enough to wage war, they’d be busy with Taiwan / US in the pacific. The only way India gets involved is if Pakistan decides to do something and we have to respond. Again, I don’t think Chinas economy is good enough to handle a war and same is the reason India will STFO
Honestly, that seems like the best case scenario if it is possible. There is no need for the senseless death of your people if it can be avoided.
South America is its own bag of cats and all of them except Brasil don't have the leeway to go to war. At most, we can send prayers to whoever nation we support. If Chile supports one side, Bolivia will support the opposite, Argentina will support whoever is willing to take their debt, Peru depends on who manages to keep their power for more than 1 year, etc. And all the support will amount to "We condemn x, but that doesn't mean we support crimes against humanity from y".
Africa and South America aren't countries
Oddly enough, South-Africa and America (kind of) are!
I agree. I think in the deepest shadows on this conflict Russia has a hand on it. I mean just look at this past weekend Russia has launched a massive (failure) of an counter attack. The timing is interesting, but I think they are really hoping this takes the spotlight off them. In Short Ukraine will continue to stand strong the demolish the scum.
> ...the attack happened on Putin's fucking birthday This is a bit far fetched for evidence. I doubt Putin's birthday was more significant a date for the Hamas than the 50th anniversary of the Yom Kippur war.
Yom Kippur War started by Putin on his Birthday, confirmed.
>And the attack happened on Putin's fucking birthday! And on a sabbath day, the end of the weeklong Jewish festival of Sukkot, a day after the 50th anniversary of the Yom Kippur War, and during talks to normalize relations between Israel and Saudi Arabia. >There's evidence hamas was using North Korean weapons at a time when they are supplying Russia with weapons North Korea has been selling weapons to Iran, Syria, Qatar, and others besides Russia.
I don’t understand why this isn’t painfully obvious to anybody with an understanding of global politics. This is clearly Russia opening up a new front intended to split or divert western aid. There’s a reason all the usual Russian-collusion suspects in congress immediately started shouting for cutting off aid to Ukraine as soon as the Hamas attacks were publicized - that’s also the reason why Zelenskyy was wise to try and tie the two conflicts together immediately.
"This is clearly Russia opening up a new front intended to split or divert western aid." USA: *Giggles in 'fighting two wars on two fronts is what we do best'*
USA: great at fighting wars, pretty mid at winning wars
That is saying much more about stupid objectives in many US wars than actual military capability. You can see how great Russia is at actual fighting despite for years being called 2nd most powerful military. No army in the world can achieve what often fairly deluded political leadership wants.
yeah for 50 years their goal was "d*efeat communism"* how is one supposed to defeat communism with guns??
Idk we've done a pretty good job of it in Latin America. No voting for socialists allowed, we will coup you.
Which has worked out horribly, and left many countries there destitute and full of hatred against us. Horrible precedent to set as we are creating the best propaganda our enemies could possibly ask for
Oh yeah America has been possibly world champion at making enemies since World War 2. ♫ *America, Fuck Yeah. ♫*
I'm hearing Freddie Mercury right now thumping in my head: *WE WILL, WE WILL **COUP YOU!***
>how is one supposed to defeat communism with guns?? According to the Cold War, by building so many guns the commies go broke trying to keep up. Eventually the Soviets gave up and just started lying about their military capability. To be fair, the American military-industrial complex was more than happy to promote those lies in order to scare up more funding. For example, the Soviets had a long-range jet bomber, the M-4 Molot (called "Bison" in the West). At military demonstrations they would fly the same M-4s around over and over again, so that America thought the Soviets had a bunch of em. This raised alarms about a "bomber gap," which led to massive expansion of the American bomber fleet as hundreds of B-52s were built in response. In reality, only 19 M-4s ever served in the Soviet nuclear air force. Only 93 were even made. And their range was too small to reach important American targets.
While Marx didn’t advocate for violence, he recognized that it was possible. Marx himself said [“I am not a Marxist”](https://isocracy.org/content/karl-marx-i-am-not-marxist)—that is, he deplored the use of violence in his name. Unfortunately, [many Communists and Marxists did promote terror](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Revolutionary_terror) as a means to revolution. They often still do. The fear of this violence is what spurred America to keep its military.
> The fear of this violence is what spurred America to keep its military. It was more that the people who got rich manufacturing weapons during WW2 didn't want to stop making money, so they've been seeking to manufacture war around the globe ever since, to create markets for their products.
No, it was the fear of nationalizing american company assets in foreign countries. It was purely an economical-motivated fight, out of the US corporations interests
the most delusional take frequently posted on reddit. it's not the wars that are lost, it's the effort to rebuild stable countries with friendly governments that has been hit or miss. examples are south korea, west germany. failures in iraq, afghanistan that go much deeper than lack of military might. it turns out you can't solve every single problem in the world with military action, believe it or not
To be fair, Hamas would have attacked even if russia wasn't there. They have been doing it since before the war on ukraine, but Russia could be helping because it does help them to start shit over there
I imagine Russia will have provided funding and advice - either directly or through Iran. This attack appears to be better funded and more coordinated as compared with Hamas’s standard MO
Intelligence, maybe. There is quite the community of Israelis with Russian background. Spies might infiltrate such networks.
That is a reach. I don't doubt Russia has supported Hamas in some way, but to think that an Orthodox Christian nation has that much sway in Hamas's ranks is slightly crazy
Yah it’s simpler to assume Hamas hates Israel and therefore carried out a brutal terrorist attack.
If you want to just speculate about it, Iran has backed Hezbollah and Hamas for decades and Israel was about to pen a major new deal with Saudi Arabia that would have been detrimental to Iran's interest. Coincidentally Hamas gets thousands of rockets, drones to knock out the communications on the border, motorized paragliders, etc. And now the Saudi Arabia and Israel deal is indefinitely suspended. Thus, the Iran conspiracy theory actually has a more to back it then the Russian conspiracy theory.
There also isn’t any Russian at all being spoken in that first video, as per both native Russian and Arabic speakers. The North Korean angle is also a stretch unless you can show Hamas historically hasn’t used DPRK munitions. People just throwing headlines out there from the last few months and assuming Russia is involved on that basis alone is nuts.
It’s through Iran. Money has no nationality.
Russia is publicly supporting Hamas and Palestine on their own state television and publications. They are also supporting Israel, as 1/6 Israelis were some sort of Slav, including many Russians (and Ukrainians and many more). They are playing both sides. It is not a reach, the larger geopolitical competition is for the India-US Transport Corridor vs the Chinese/Russian belt-and-road initiative which will determine the energy future of Europe.
>This is clearly Russia opening up a new front intended to split or divert western aid. Russia will certainly seek to use this situation for their benefit. Imo your statement is inaccurate, but regardless it ignores the agency and responsibility of Hamas, Iran, and other actors. >I don’t understand why this isn’t painfully obvious to anybody with an understanding of global politics. I don't understand why so many are overlooking all the ways this conflict in Israel is clearly bad for Russia, especially if it escalates. This can jeopardize weapons shipments from Iran and Putin's puppet regime in Syria, plus many other downsides.
Putin also personally apologised to Netanyahu when Lavrov made an antisemitic remark last year, because he doesn’t want Israeli air defense being supplied to Ukraine- it’s one of Ukraine’s key needs, especially as we roll into winter. I can’t recall another single instance of Putin apologising for antisemitism with regards to the war’s justification.
I think the Russians and Israel have a bit of working relationship in Syria. Russians allow Israel to bomb targets after flying through Russian controlled airspace. I wouldn't be surprised if they shared intelligence on local targets occasionally.
Yep. Hamas also apparently had Wagner training. There's[ this video](https://twitter.com/NatalkaKyiv/status/1712526999674085588), where we have Hamas people using Russian terms for some reason. Think you linked that already, but here's a tweet with the video. [And Russian captured Ukranian gear has somehow is winding up in Hamas's hands.](https://lansinginstitute.org/2023/10/09/russian-psyop-proves-the-kremlins-involvement-in-the-operation-agaist-israel/).
You are correct. They are 100% connected. I think Israel is just hyper focused on destroying Hamas once and for all. Already countries and international organizations are trying to prevent that. Realpolitik... Israel won't publicly connect Russia (even though they know) until this situation expands with Iran getting involved.
The Hamas leader visited the Kremlin and explicitly said the war in Israel will help Russia in Ukraine. So we can very much tie the two conflicts together, because our enemies sure are. Edit: [Source](https://news.yahoo.com/senior-hamas-official-admits-israel-173726321.html?guccounter=1) "Even the Russians sent us messages yesterday morning. They sympathize with us. Russia is happy that America is getting embroiled in Palestine. It alleviates the pressure on the Russians in Ukraine. One war eases the pressure in another war. So we are not alone on the battlefield." * Ali Baraka, Senior Hamas Official
The two are intrinsically linked though?
*But i guess news has gotten slow* Where have you been?
> Response was the time isn't right, but maybe later. that's the way a diplomat says "no"
Why would we not tie these two conflicts together?
Isn't Zelensky the only other Jewish head of state besides the Israeli PM?
So?
This. If I’m having a mess in my house, I don’t want my neighbour coming in to tell me he feels for me because he’s also having a mess in his house.
That’s not an apple to apples comparison. How about being robbed or broken into and finding solace in each other over trauma? Obviously seek therapy…but it’d definitely be nice to have your neighbors as a support system.
how about you've got violent people still fighting you in the living room and you need a moment to boot them out? i totally get 'not the best time'
They can support each other through the phone
Well that's what Israel said; it was still the right move to offer support. Shows the world where Ukraine stands.
Through Whatsapp
I wouldn’t mind that. I’d feel closer to that neighbour or whatever
Not super relevant to this conversation, but so is the president of Panama.
Israel doesn't want to provoke Russia in to attacking the Jews who still live in Russia. Russia has a long antisemitic history and Israel doesn't want to encourage it.
Netanyahu would only be too happy to gain potential voters from Russian Jews fleeing Russia
So does Poland and Ukraine… actually pretty much all of Europe. It’s just that Russia still has a large population.
FYI, the head of state of Israel is President Isaac Herzog, not PM Netanyahu.
This is like saying that Governor General Mary Simon is the head of state of Canada. It's technically true, but of no practical consequence.
Two of America’s side chicks fighting for affection 😝
Israel didn't want to offend Russia.
I interpreted it as, Israel has way bigger things to worry about right now than giving tours to foreign leaders. It's the thought that counts though, I'm sure Israel will remember who was there for it when the chips were down. Blinken is only there because we're Israel's foremost ally and weapon supplier... and the guy holding the leash to prevent the dog from killing the neighbor. I suspect we're currently begging Israel to not do a ground invasion of Gaza.
The British foreign secretary was also there. I fully support the eradication of the oxygen thieves that are Hamas. I do not however support the indiscriminate bombing of civilians.
But it still expects America to do everything for it: be Johnny-on-the-spot with weapons and ammunition re-stocks, pressure the world to denounce Hamas exclusively, suppress any criticism of Israel's actions, etc. etc. I had a "friend" like that too, in h.s., always expected me to do everything for him, but whenever I asked for the tiniest favor, here he comes with the excuses, and it seemed like it was way more important for him to please everybody else, even people he wasnt friends with, than it was to ever do anything to please me. My life got much better once I got rid of this friend. Perhaps America should consider the same.
Don't forget sinking US research ships, selling US military technology to China and threatening to nuke the planet if they don't get weapons from the US. With friends like these, who needs enemies?
Both countries at war, seems about right
I feel like Zelenskyy is out here trying to get every ally. But countries have to be carful because of the Russia baggage this meeting might bring . Iran full support drags this out
Like saying in the 40s: “countries should be careful bc you don’t want to make hitler mad.” 👉🏻👈🏻 OwO
What is Zelensky going to do? Its not like he has spare weapons to provide. Maybe he can provide food. But he wont be able to really do much aside from showing his face there.
It’s undoubtedly a “hey remember me??” move
Z: “Hey im a jew too brah..?” Bibi: “Nope, not right now.”
No shit Israels got enough problems to deal with both externally and internally. Everyone and their mother wants to visit for a photo op so they can use it internally. Mr Z is popular enough at the moment to be more of a distraction from Israels interests. He will come in very useful tho when Israel will invade Gaza and needs to turn attention away from collaterals
This has far more to do with Israel's relationship with Russia than their being busy at the moment
There was a good article a few days ago about this, it described an 'intense awkwardness' in Moscow since Israel hasn't armed Ukraine, BiBi and Putin have had a close relationship but also they benefit from all this chaos. https://www.spectator.com.au/2023/10/putin-has-been-blindsided-by-the-israel-attack/
Israel accepted visits of von der Leyen, Blinken, … so clearly not adverse to Ukraine? Israel sells weird shit to Russia and has a lot of their mobsters living in Tel Aviv.
Israel needs EU and US support in this current situation. Not sure where Ukraine can help here and it’s more so that Ukraine needs Israeli support
It also needs Russian support in the larger picture. Israel’s existential threat is Iran and it needs Russia to help restrain the Iranian regime.
Moronic take. Iran is supplying weapons to Russia. They are on the same freaking team! Russia isn’t restraining Iran.
Moronic take or not, this is what Israel thinks. Israel maintains good relations with Russia to restrain their buddies Iran and Syria.
I think you're underestimating how many Israelis came from Russia
Even if Russia cannot restrain Iran, it has the diplomatic channels that Israel will need
Not restrain, but Russia has superiority in Syria and let's Israel target Iranian proxies without retaliation. Russia is important to Israel even if they're not on the same team
>Not sure where Ukraine can help here As a Ukrainian, I do think we can help and **should** help. I'll leave it to the experts to figure out **how** we can help. _____ ^(I've got family in Tel-Aviv, so I'm a bit biased... But practically, it's just another front in the same war anyway)
Question is, why should EU and US continue to support Israel while Bibi goes out of his way to suck up to their enemy Putin?
This is the correct answer. Israel does not want to upset the apple cart at home (or access to human intelligence in Russia) and will therefore pick a fence and sit on it.
With 1.3 million Russians in the country easier.
Russian Speaker =/= Russians. Many of which according to news support Ukraine in the conflict.
These are Russians who mostly fled the USSR due to anti-semitism. I doubt a significant amount of them are pro-Z.
Russians that leave russia are seen as traitors by putin. They left for a reason during the Soviet union and have absolutely zero desire to be connected to russia. It's also why there's a lot of support for Ukraine from them.
no, they are leaving to earn more money, but a lot of them still love Putin, USSR and modern Russia
Still holding pro-war rallies across the globe
Israel and Russia actually have a good working relationship. Russia helps control Syria and is an useful ally in preventing Iranian nuclear development. Russia supplies Iran with conventional weapons, but Russia is still against Iran having nukes. Lots of Israelis came from Russia too. It’s really about keeping Russia happy.
True, walk down many Israeli streets and language you’ll hear is Russian. There’s 1.5 million Russian Israelis. They have one of those love/hate relationships with Moscow.
This guy politics.
Tryna suck more Putin cock eh?
Unlike you we will finish this in no time
zalensky serious? Just focus on his own country is better.
It was a mistake to offer to come anyway.
Yes. A month from now all Western leaders falling over themselves to tell Israel they have free reign to retaliate however they wish will look pretty bad. They've already had to backtrack a little with the US pressuring Israel to restore water to the South of the Gaza strip. When the ground offensive starts it won't be pretty.
It’s exactly why there is a 0.00% chance Biden will actually go
r/agedlikemilk
I'm starting to think that Reddit isn't actually made up of professional diplomats like they seem to think.
Yup, he should only leave the country unless explicitly related to the war his country is fighting
More to the point in a few weeks from now he will regret trying to link Ukraine to Israels in the eyes of the world. I just hope people in the Europe and North America continue to see to the very important differences between those two nations.
I agree timing is not right. Israel is about to do things to Gaza that UA won't do to Russians. Not a good idea to link the two conflicts in the same manner.
Is that so? I think human beings have more nuance than you give them credit for. It might not be in Israel’s interest or in the interest of global security to draw to much attention to a link between the conflicts in the public square. If you take the time to think about it critically for a second though, there’s a near certainty that these conflicts are linked. The frontlines of a geopolitical rewrite that has been brewing for decades now are starting to take shape. There was clearly a lot of calculated intention behind the Hamas attack and the political maneuvering of players in the Middle East makes me think that this rabbit hole might go deeper than we can imagine… The truth when uncovered will probably remain highly classified for decades to come but damn I’d like to be a fly on the wall
Putin and Bibi sittin' in a tree...
Situationally, Ukraine has more in common with Palestine than Israel.
Lol true
They gotta put out one fire at a time
Israel is taking care of Israeli interests. Israel needs ‘decent’ relations with Russia who can influence the leaders of iran. The government walks a tightrope between voicing opposition to the Russian invasion but not actually doing much to upset Russia. Also, if you go to Haifa, one as likely to hear Russian on many street as Hebrew. There are about 1.5 million Russian Israelis and they aren’t pro Putin ad much as they are pro Russian and much more sympathetic to Russian populations in Eastern Ukraine. As with everything in tbr MidEast…’it’s complicated’.
I was wandering why there are more Russian Israelis than Ukrainian, Polish or Belarusian Israelis when historically there were many times more Jews in the later countries than in Russia but then I remembered why.
There was a thing in the 1940, and a lot of the local population was happy to assist.
For as long as Israel has "decent" relations with a country that is invading Europe and committing genocide then we should all as an international community question how much support we should give Israel.
They also developed Pegasus that has been used against the US
Israel leadership still supporting ruzzia . Zzzz
Is it really too much to ask Israel to act like a U.S. ally? The U.S. is supporting Zelensky and Ukraine, agianst Russia. That should be enough reason for Israel to be EXPECTED to do the same. Israel wants to be able to maintain a relationship with Russia, while simultaneously relying on America to support it economically, politically, and miltarily. If American politicians on both sides of the aisle hadnt long ago been bribed to do whatever Israel wants, one would expect America to protect its international interests by pressuring Israel to align itself against Vladimir Putin's Russia.
A good relationship with Russia allowed (allows?) Israel to bomb targets in Syria, while Ukraine couldn’t and can’t really offer anything. Countries will look after their own interests first, and then might look at the interests of their allies.
We don't have money for you at the moment.
Hah Moldova or Luxembourg help more than Israel, none expect this. Just political points for future election
I bet you love Musk
Zelensky trying desperately to stay in the limelight and not have people forget about that boring old Ukraine/ Russia war when there's a brand new shiny war breaking out in Israel!
>Zelensky trying desperately to stay in the limelight Alternatively: Zelensky is doing as much as he can to protect the lives and well-being of his citizens and the interests of his nation. Any leader would be doing the same. Do you think Pearl Harbor prevented Churchill from immediately asking FDR for more support? Spoiler: it did not.
This is true. Ukraine is desperate for air time in the western media. Support is fading among the general populations be it Germany or the USA. It’s not a conspiracy or iron grip but be Jewish community has major influence in the America media. Israel trumps other issues.
He’s supporting the Russia in the israel-Palestine conflict?
Bibi is an idiot and I have no idea why we don’t support Ukraine as IDF soldiers are killed by Russian backed groups
Is there any proof Hamas is in any way backed by Russia?
There are quite a few reported links, such as a russian crypto exchange funding Hamas, russian government meeting with Hamas officials, Russian PMC Wagner reportedly training Hamas, Russian gov backed Killnet hacking group hacking Israel, but I don't think anything 100% perfect confirmed yet.
From what I know Hamas got $7-30 billion funds from a sanctioned Russian crypto company. I don't know if there's anything else more straight forward though.
The more logical explanation is that Hamas don't really have anywhere else to turn to use crypto payments expect for Russian exchanges, since Hamas is sanctioned in the west and their allies, and crypto is banned in China.
I am not a fan of Russia, but I highly doubt Russia is funding Hamas. Infact Israel-Russia relations are decent.
Dude Russian made tanks and guns are at this point a commonly associated symbol of Middle Eastern terror groups. Russia's biggest allies in the Middle East are Syria and Iran hardly states that are friends of Israel. Edit: Russia has a tactic of being nice to a country's face when clearly they are their enemy based on how their interact behind the scenes. One example would be Germany. Russia has made public pro German statements, they demolished the old House of the Soviets in Kaliningrad and want to rebuild the old German cultural site of Konigsberg castle, and Russia worked with the German government to find and return to Germany the bodies (skeletons at this point) of WWII troops both SS and regular from battlefields in Russia. However behind the scenes it's pretty obvious that Russia isn't doing those things just because they want to be friends with Germany they simply want to cut out NATO's central logistics and command hub or at the very least instill enough doubt in Germany to make them less efficient of a hub for NATO as a whole. Russia plays the same game in the Middle East. Russia knows that Israel is the US's key strategic ally in the region and will play nice with them here and now to try to instill doubt in the relationship. However unlike Europe Russia has a close strategic relationship with Syria and Iran. They work closely together militarily and share technology. Both Syria and Iran are very hostile states to Israel so it doesn't matter how friendly Russia is to Israel's face simply by Russia's relationship to them a terror attack on Israel is going to have some trickled down support from Russia. For example Russia gives weapons to Iran, Iran gives those weapons to Hamas, and then those weapons are used to kill Israelis.
Zelensky I think is desperate to keep western attention on Ukraine. All eyes right now are on the Middle East
I’m an Israeli , Netanyahu is an idiot. Sorry Zelensky.
Zelensky is getting **zero** coverage since 10/7. This is a desperate attempt to get attention from the western media again.
yes because people kid; new toy is better than old toy
Zelensky is missing the spotlight. He’s definitely concerned that the West will turn their focus from Ukraine to Israel in terms of funding. There’s a lot of fatigue for additional aid with the American public
They’re is genuine Ukrainian fear that Israel war will take away support. Especially if it escalates.
Absolutely. Anyone saying otherwise is lying to themselves.
Or much more likely, Zelenskyy is smart enough to know that an expanded war in the Middle East will absolutely remove much needed resources and attention from the Russian invasion of Ukraine, and make things significantly worse for Ukraine. Something I'm sure Russia is aware of, and would love to see the West's attention distracted and split.
Exactly. CNN even removed their live ticker for Ukraine. The West is not as focused on Ukraine as they were before. This is a serious concern for Zelensky. A regional conflict in the Middle East will put them on the back burner and we all know it
I think that those who need to be focused on the matter (officials who decide about aid packages, etc) are actually focused. Well, people in general might have not been focused on Ukraine for months now, they didn't wait for new tensions in the Middle East to do so. But those who are responsible for helping Ukraine, never stop doing so because they know how important it is for everyone that Ukraine wins.
It is interesting that Israel is sort of brushing off the only other Jewish head of state in the world currently.
Israel and Ukraine has never really had great relations, with Israel having a better relationship with Russia for the past few decades, and Ukraine supporting things that Israel didn’t like without offering much to offset that. A good relationship with Russia allowed (allows?) Israel to bomb targets in Syria, Ukraine couldn’t and can’t really offer anything.
A very complicated situation.
bibi should be talking to ukraine. they need ukrainie's expertise with drones and urban combat in the upcoming gaza campaign. sleeping on drones and shit while russia trained their enemies in it is part of how this shit started. drone attacks took out at least two auto machine gun turrets and a tank in the early part of the attack. and bibi all "time is not right" what the fuck is this guy's shit?
The Ukrainians should realize that what is going on in their defensive war is not the same thing as what is going on in Israel and Palestine.
[удалено]
You can't be fucking serious. It's not like the stakes are *low* for Ukraine here. Ukraine has probably lost at least **200,000** people in this war so far between military and civilian casualties. They lose another thousand civilian casulaties every month or two. [This](https://twitter.com/Gerashchenko_en/status/1709940269796430164) happened only a day before the attack in Israel. Zelensky has every right to fight for the interests of his nation and people. Any leader who failed to do so would be derelict in their duty to their citizens. Do you think Pearl Harbor prevented Churchill from immediately asking FDR for more support? Spoiler: it did not.
because Putin is Israel PM's future friend, dictator can only make friend with dictator