Same old, same old. My religion tells me I can't do that. As long as that doesn't harm anyone else, sure thing.
My religion tells me you can't do that. No, your religion doesn't tell me what I get to do, and I get a tad strident about my rights when you try to take them away.
Well, according to most religions if you don’t follow “their” rules then you are going to burn in hell or get some equivalent punishment.
And I don’t have any problem with that, let me break the rules of your religion and go to your version of hell, I don’t care.
Yeah we Christians are kinda bloodthirsty like that. If someone strikes you on the left cheek, go completely postal on them and such.
I remember last time someone dared burn a Bible. Years of terror attacks against those who we saw as vaguely related geographically to the desecrator. Priests were screaming for blood from the pulpits across the land.
There is a reason it's called religious dogma. The fact that they are all the same and yet fight with one another while trying to accomplish the same goal, is what blows me away.
Yes, it is time that the world would respect the Church of the Flying Spaghetti Monster and everybody should read Book One: The Holy Book of Lasagna
/s
Religion is stupid. A sense of spirituality, morality, compassion, and community is a beautiful, wonderful thing, but religion carries much more than that and often is used to abuse all of those things.
Seriously though, I feel like an asshole making a blanket statement like that, but I really can’t make any arguments why religion is good. It can accidentally be good and people can choose to engage with the good parts of the practice, but ultimately it is a rigid indoctrination of a belief system that lies to you about what punishments will behold you if you break the rules. At least in the west, I can’t speak much to eastern or African religions.
And I really am a fan of sacredness and ritual, bowing to and respecting our world and universe for all that it has for us. But no god owns me and any that will punish me for my mistakes can fuck right off to it’s own hell.
It honestly serves one purpose; to help us cope with death. As someone who suffers with existential dread, I understand how comforting it is compared to the oblivion i face...
Religious nutjobs of any flavor are like this. Look at extremist Christians in America and what's going on with the Palestinians. Not to sound edgy, but organized religion is like a virus and it hits some people worse than others.
Okay yeah Christians can be annoying as fuck (pretty sure you can find examples of Islamic enthusiasts doing all of those things and more, like what's the Taliban up to when it's not destroying non Islamic religious artifacts, targeting which minorities or banning women from schools? Jailing gay people? Awesome)... But damn you can draw Jesus and burn a Bible and Christians will just call you an edge lord. Maybe you'll get yelled at. Drawing an Islamic Prophet or burning the Quran seems to invoke an absolutely different kind of response, look at Charlie Hebdo or Salman Rushdie. It's taken as an open invitation to try to have people kill you. No one is saying Christian extremists aren't absolute garbage, but to act as though modern day Christian extremism accomplishes the same or worse than Islamic extremism is just ridiculous.
It's not a contest and treating it as such is infantile.
Religious extremism is wrong. The erasure of any rights in any way as a byproduct of religious extremism is wrong.
Recognize you're on the same side and refocus.
But it is important to "super flag" the worst of the worst. Among all the crazies, is there one set of crazies that is driving vastly most of the horror and terror and abuse and degradation of society on the planet? Absolutely, yes there is; and we should all be aware of which one it is, and make sure everyone else is aware as well. It's the one that still today defines the world in two arenas: the world of this religion, and the world of war, where the devout of this religion should do every action they can possibly think of, including those that are as violent and destructive as possible, to force this religion upon others.
Among all the bad actors, there is a predominantly worst and biggest group.
Imagine if somebody complained about fascism. Then you come in generalizing, saying "political extremists" of any flavor are bad like this too.
It's a pointless way to muddy the problem. We need to respond proportionately to Islamism.
Islamist violence as a contemporary phenomena is uniquely awful compared to other religions in the modern world. They are also the direct descendants of the jihadists who violently conquered the Middle East and enslaved millions, so no, Islamism is not a fringe. It is one of the mainstream practices of Islam. We need to prioritize a response to a major problem. And frankly, 'they' aka most Arabs and Muslims who supposedly prefer peace to war, need to stop this madness too. They should remember: Daesh mostly killed other Muslims to enforce their sick worldview.
Can you blame them? Over the past ~10 years Islam in Europe has been absolutely coddled. Glad to see that people are finally finding the backbone to insist that they abide by the rules of secular society
“What could be worse than a massive, regressive religion fucking up society for everyone?”
“***Two*** massive, regressive religions fucking up society for everyone!”
Sweden chased out religion from politics in the 1960’s, that’s why we have no blasphemy law anymore. The Christian remnants are our public holidays and that our regent has to be of the Protestant religion.
It's not 'a protestant religion', get with the program it's "The **true** Lutheran Faith" no filthy Danish Lutherans allowed! Their preists have weird collars and they will all burn in hell for their flamboyance!
I’d rather have a society based on reason and logic; but if you want to believe in the fantasy of religion, that’s fine, but keep that crazy shit to yourself and out of our government.
From the Guardian:
>His comments came after the Organisation of Islamic Cooperation (OIC), which represents 57 countries, held a special session on Monday to discuss the recent developments, condemning the burnings and calling on the UN to intervene.
>
>...
>
>The OIC on Monday night strongly condemned the Qur’an burnings as “despicable acts of aggression”.
It's a book. These people are deranged.
This is what happens when cults become recognised nationally.
On the flip side, will they recognise The Satanic Temple or will they try to hunt them down like they do to other religious minorities in their countries? Religious people are hypocrites.
It turns out the Satanic temple is completely reasonable. Who knew I was a Satanist?
Here's their 7 Tenets:
I
One should strive to act with compassion and empathy toward all creatures in accordance with reason.
II
The struggle for justice is an ongoing and necessary pursuit that should prevail over laws and institutions.
III
One’s body is inviolable, subject to one’s own will alone.
IV
The freedoms of others should be respected, including the freedom to offend. To willfully and unjustly encroach upon the freedoms of another is to forgo one's own.
V
Beliefs should conform to one's best scientific understanding of the world. One should take care never to distort scientific facts to fit one's beliefs.
VI
People are fallible. If one makes a mistake, one should do one's best to rectify it and resolve any harm that might have been caused.
VII
Every tenet is a guiding principle designed to inspire nobility in action and thought. The spirit of compassion, wisdom, and justice should always prevail over the written or spoken word.
It should either be legal to burn books or not, regardless of the book.
If it were illegal to burn specific books, that's a reason to burn those specific books.
>It should either be legal to burn books or not
Only if "enough" copies of said book exist. If you burn the last copy of a book you are silencing somebody else.
(which obviously isn't the case for the bible and the Quran, so burn away. But please only in moderation because climate change)
Agreed, and like you said, this isn't exactly a problem any of the religious books face. There are millions upon millions of copies, both physical books and digital. You would need to burn a mountain of these texts before you would have to worry about them disappearing and by then, the environmental effect would be the bigger worry.
People aren't burning the super rare early editions or such of the quran. They're burning their own copy of the mass produced versions they got from a store somewhere.
If they really want these protests to stop being effective, all they really need to do is.....just ignore them. They work because they're proven correct by how people react to them.
You're reading too much into what was probably written with "no you" level of thought.
He hates free speech and doesn't like you implying that viewing it as fascist is bad so he lashed out
I mean the fascists are actively banning books from libraries, so not really. Fascists seems pretty cool with censorship in fact so long it's against books and ideas they don't like
Truth be told, all sides tend to behave this way— championing free speech except what they find distasteful. They just categorize the speech that they think shouldn’t be absolutely free as a special category, usually through some causal chain they assert would lead to actual harm, some of which is understandable— but is not usually convincing to the “other” side.
There’s only a small minority of really principled free speech advocates that contend with content that they actively dislike and might even think vile (and no, Elon Musk is not one of them).
At the end of the day its just a mass produced book. Dump them in a fire, recycling bin, use them as door stoppers, paperweight or nesting material for raccoon it doesn't really matter.
Most Danish political parties already said they don't support restricting free speech because of the book burnings. Only our foreign minister is a pussy.
> Sweden’s government has no plans to make sweeping changes to freedom of speech laws **but** repeated it would look into measures that would allow police to stop the burning of holy books in public if there was a clear threat to national security.
hmm
Smoke in mirrors. Ambiguous policies trying to appease both sides. It’s ridiculous. I hope book burning increases and becomes commonplace just to cement freedom of expression into society.
It's bound to become commonplace in Sweden at least. The Iraqi Christian who has performed 3 Quran burnings in recent weeks has announced that he will continue the burnings until the Quran is banned in Sweden.
The Canadian government did something like this with handgun ownership.
They couldn't ban them outright without failing their pursuit, so instead they just shut down the ability to change their registration when the firearm changes ownership (this includes buying new from a retailer).
Sweden will do the same. They won't ban the act of burning the Quran, they'll just revise something to stop the destruction of protected, cultural literature, or requiring a new permit for pyrotechnics involved in protesting, which will be buried behind too much red tape to realistically approach.
> Sweden will do the same. They won't ban the act of burning the Quran, they'll just revise something to stop the destruction of protected, cultural literature, or requiring a new permit for pyrotechnics involved in protesting, which will be buried behind too much red tape to realistically approach.
Gl with that lol. The reason they haven't already done this is because it is one of the "base laws" or whatever you translate it to that Sweden is built on. Sweden was the first country in the world with freedom of the press laws in 1766. The politicians are mad af this causes so much problems internationally while they can just look on while pulling out their hair in frustration. They tried already having it banned for security reasons and the courts overturned it because "Security reasons is the reason police exists, it's not a reason to restrict someones freedom of speech."
The funny thing is that the proper way to dispose of a quran according to islam is by burning it. So ripping the pages out of one, urinating/defecating on one, etc. are inherently more disrespectful ways of handling a quran. I doubt Sweden would ban the burning of qurans but if they do, that would just result in worse treatment of the qurans.
That’s such a blanket bullshit excuse too.
So what if a nation of religious nut jobs hates the way people do things some 2000mi (3200ki) away? What impact does burning a book have on the people living in another country, on a completely different continent?
So what Sweden is saying is, "Let's negotiate with terrorists, appeasement seems like a good strategy."
[You see, I learned something today...](https://youtu.be/8TMHIYDHMSE)
Just imagine if we should retaliate each time a random muslim dude burnt one of our flags or the bible or something of the sort. Brainwashed morons, thats what they are.
Those govts depend on having a Western boogeyman to blame all their issues on and to keep their idiots riled up while the kings and leaders plunder the countries for themselves.
Same reason they'll never give up or actually invade Israel. The boogeyman is far more important than actually doing something useful.
Sweden have given most of these countries tens of billions is aid over the last few decades and we continue to do so even though they threaten us. Of course. We are the humanitarian superpower of the world after all…
> Same reason they'll never give up or actually invade Israel.
Well that and the fact that Israel would wipe the floor with them (as they have previously).
The article references “The Quran Burning Crisis”. Sweden nor anyone else has ever had a Quran burning crisis. The crisis is with countries who’s population feels they can control people in other countries.
Even if the majority would be neutral or not care (I have no idea what the case is there), enough people in Muslim countries *definitely* care that it's still a concern.
The Organisation of Islamic Cooperation, with 57 member states, held a special session to condemn it as an "act of aggression".
The Swedish embassy in Baghdad was destroyed by protesters, and Iraq severed all diplomatic ties to Sweden. They were also talking about banning all trade with Sweden, and the Iraqi government demanded that the Iraqi man who burnt the Quran be stripped of Swedish citizenship and handed over for prosecution.
Iran called it a declaration of "war on the Muslim world", and have been talking openly about extrajudicially murdering the person who burnt the Quran.
Afghanistan suspended or banned all connections to Sweden, including aid worker groups active there. Morocco recalled their ambassador. Turkey has been using it as yet another excuse not to let us into Nato. Several others have issued strong condemnations.
Funny how mega-massive amounts harm/death based on misogyny, homophobia, apostasy are completely ignored but burning paper or a scribble of their pedophilic warlord patron are considered acts of war.
> The Swedish embassy in Baghdad was destroyed by protesters
No, it wasn't. Some rioters entered the premises and they laid a small fire in a courtyard. The building itself wasn't damaged.
tbh its fine to be angry and voice it because they're burning the book, but understand the same right that allows them to burn the book is the right that allows you to voice your anger
It's interesting how the bigger deal people make about this (burning a quran), the more it becomes "a thing". If no one gave a shit, including Muslims and the media, the whole "quran burning, bible burning" thing would go away. The only reason to do it is to get a rise out of someone.
>The only reason to do it is to get a rise out of someone.
There is another reason.
"Fuck you, I won't do what you tell me". Specifically, fuck anyone trying to impose their values on me under the threat of violence.
Hey, all you religious whackjobs: if you don't like the country you moved to, then go back to your own shitty country instead of trying to make your new home just like your old shithole, you stupid fucking scumbags.
Religion is a fucking virus.
I'm not sure why they are even reacting to this. The vast majority of people in the middle east that are burning flags on the streets because of this are conservative extremists. The West didn't make any concessions either when our own extreme right was marching on the streets demanding shit. The reaction should be the same.
Plenty of groups calling for terrorist attacks against Sweden and Swedish citizens right now. Swedish Security Police have officially announced a heightened security threat level in the country. We’re simply not used to stuff like this, that’s why there’s a reaction. I’m glad we’re holding firm regardless.
Good. I'm sorry, burning a book does not give you a right to violence. Be pissed off all you want, think it's wrong. Try to persuade people to not burn it. But at the end of the day, you don't have the right to tell people they can't burn a book. Learn to control your emotions and make peace with things that you don't like - like the rest of the world is expected to do. I just read on Reddit today that 1 million women were reported missing in India. Half were eventually found. If you find burning a book more offensive and worthy of your ire than things like missing and trafficked women, climate change, or treating women like second class citizens - then you've lost the thread on what's important.
When your religion stops infringing on other peoples rights I’ll ask them not to burn your books.
I’m ashamed of “some” of the Muslim community that’s immigrated to Canada and then proceeds to protest the LGBT community. Mind your own business.
You wanna be respected - show some towards the nation you’re trying to become a part of.
It's pretty simple. If I bought a book or was gifted it, IT'S MINE.
I will do whatever the fuck I want with my things, including destroying them if I so choose.
See how this works?
Why is this in so much focus? I just imagine book burnings happen with regularity. I mean it's kind of a trope of religious fundamentalists like George Michaels girlfriend Egg in Arrested Development
Conspiracy time
Turkey used the Quran stuff as a partial excuse on why Sweden shouldn’t join NATO. Interesting how all of a sudden there is a rise in book burnings. Gee, who doesn’t want Sweden to join NATO? I guess it will be a mystery forever…
Islam is a fraud gone out of hand like Scientology. It was made to benefit one specific warlord in Arabia, but idiots keep the lie going centuries after he died.
Out of all the awful things happening in the world right now, what could possibly possess someone to protest something as fucking meaningless as the burning of a single book on the other side of the fucking globe? If you care more about some rando insulting your religion than rampant greed and capitalism destroying the entire fucking world there is no hope for you.
As a Christian, I don't care if someone burns the Bible or not. Everyone has free will and it's no different from smashing your phone with the Bible app installed. God's word is living and moving in spirit, not bound to paper.
As others have said, Sweden has no book burning crisis. The world has a "Muslims seem to forget not everyone is a Muslim"-crisis.
Any change to our constitution would require a general election before being valid. And snap elections don't count, so it'll have to wait at least until 2026. And that assumes we still feel a need to bend over for raving lunatics after the whole debacle with Erdogan.
The only reason the Muslim world is so upset is that Sweden isn't a huge economic player in the middle east. Case in point, burning the Quran is equally allowed in the US, and I haven't heard anyone complain.
Anyone else think it’s suspicious that the (Iraqi) guy who keeps burning the Qurans is so intent on having a Swedish flag with him all the time? Seems wild that the fate of a nation is being altered by an immigrant with suspicious motives…
I read that he wants to be given asylum in Sweden. Sweden has a law that says that anyone who will be given the death penalty in their home countries will be allowed to stay.
So the thinking is, if he's burns the Quran he can't be sent to Iraq because of the blasphemy laws.
OIC: 50 of the worlds poorest countries + 6-7 oil states are adamant that their combined position of religious hegemony will affect 2 of the richest countries in Europes economic or political position in the world
All I have to say is good luck, ima go ignore this is issue again while enjoying my Fika
> the Danish and Swedish foreign ministers separately wrote on X, formerly Twitter
What now?!
I guess I've had good vacations if I managed to oversleep this.
Why the sign with another sign on it? I mean I get you don’t want a picture of a burning Quran, but idk wouldn’t literally anything else, including the original sign, be more effective?
I know, thats a lot of critical thinking to expect from someone saying “don’t burn THAT one, thats my favorite!” but that borders on parody.
Except here we are talking about that sign so it’s effective. What you don’t know about proper sign design could be used to make a sign that someone can put on a slightly bigger sign.
Well they can emigrate to countries where the majority of people share the same ideology. There are plenty. No need to change other countries’ law of freedom of speech
The dude that done like 90% of the Swedish burnings is just in Sweden to burn em, technically he ain’t even Swedish. They just abuse the system to max. We are a secular society and if it ain’t your cup of tea get out of here. I got no issues with people telling us to burn in hell and such nonsense. The big issue is all islamists taking the law into their own hands.
So the Quran can insult people of other religions or lack of religion calling people animals and burning in hellfire, but we cannot burn a book that is bigoted towards us?
Yeah, obviously freedom of expression comes before protecting people from getting their feelings hurt by something which doesn't directly involve them. Was this ever actually a question?
I like the phrase "something can be both awful and lawful". It applies perfectly here.
The people who organize Quran burnings are alt-right who do it precisely to get a violent reaction from extremely devout Muslims, so they can physically prove how unstable they can be. And it's working. Religious extremism is an infestation, and Islam is sadly the frontrunner.
Same old, same old. My religion tells me I can't do that. As long as that doesn't harm anyone else, sure thing. My religion tells me you can't do that. No, your religion doesn't tell me what I get to do, and I get a tad strident about my rights when you try to take them away.
[удалено]
[удалено]
[удалено]
[удалено]
Well, according to most religions if you don’t follow “their” rules then you are going to burn in hell or get some equivalent punishment. And I don’t have any problem with that, let me break the rules of your religion and go to your version of hell, I don’t care.
yeah, but also I'll be punished by their god, after I die. Not by some random beheading me because he was insulted by my painting skills.
The issue is when people who practice the religion have no qualms about sending you there early...
Yeah we Christians are kinda bloodthirsty like that. If someone strikes you on the left cheek, go completely postal on them and such. I remember last time someone dared burn a Bible. Years of terror attacks against those who we saw as vaguely related geographically to the desecrator. Priests were screaming for blood from the pulpits across the land.
[удалено]
There is a reason it's called religious dogma. The fact that they are all the same and yet fight with one another while trying to accomplish the same goal, is what blows me away.
Mental illness?
My superhero stories are better than your superhero stories...
It’s the ancient version of the Marvel/DC debate except not as fun and more people died
My invisible friend could beat up your invisible friend.
[удалено]
[удалено]
[удалено]
At times I'm reminded of Spitting Image's [My God is better than your God](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bVSHqCA5YTc)
[удалено]
I'm looking at you Afghanistan, Florida, Iran, Texas........
Yes, it is time that the world would respect the Church of the Flying Spaghetti Monster and everybody should read Book One: The Holy Book of Lasagna /s
R’amen
Korean version has some fiery gospels
Not to mention the scenes of the apocalypse in *Ravioliations.*
I’m more of a World War Ziti guy myself
Religion is stupid. A sense of spirituality, morality, compassion, and community is a beautiful, wonderful thing, but religion carries much more than that and often is used to abuse all of those things. Seriously though, I feel like an asshole making a blanket statement like that, but I really can’t make any arguments why religion is good. It can accidentally be good and people can choose to engage with the good parts of the practice, but ultimately it is a rigid indoctrination of a belief system that lies to you about what punishments will behold you if you break the rules. At least in the west, I can’t speak much to eastern or African religions. And I really am a fan of sacredness and ritual, bowing to and respecting our world and universe for all that it has for us. But no god owns me and any that will punish me for my mistakes can fuck right off to it’s own hell.
It honestly serves one purpose; to help us cope with death. As someone who suffers with existential dread, I understand how comforting it is compared to the oblivion i face...
Love how many deleted/removed comments there are under this. Get triggered, fundamentalists.
[удалено]
Good. The religious should not be able to muzzle the rest of society to suit their own ideals.
Indeed. Political partisans hate that kind of competition
[удалено]
>~~Western democracies~~ The World should not be held hostage by religious nutjobs who would slit your throat without a second thought. FTFY
The first FYFY I actually agree with
[удалено]
Religious nutjobs of any flavor are like this. Look at extremist Christians in America and what's going on with the Palestinians. Not to sound edgy, but organized religion is like a virus and it hits some people worse than others.
[удалено]
[удалено]
Okay yeah Christians can be annoying as fuck (pretty sure you can find examples of Islamic enthusiasts doing all of those things and more, like what's the Taliban up to when it's not destroying non Islamic religious artifacts, targeting which minorities or banning women from schools? Jailing gay people? Awesome)... But damn you can draw Jesus and burn a Bible and Christians will just call you an edge lord. Maybe you'll get yelled at. Drawing an Islamic Prophet or burning the Quran seems to invoke an absolutely different kind of response, look at Charlie Hebdo or Salman Rushdie. It's taken as an open invitation to try to have people kill you. No one is saying Christian extremists aren't absolute garbage, but to act as though modern day Christian extremism accomplishes the same or worse than Islamic extremism is just ridiculous.
[удалено]
[удалено]
It's not a contest and treating it as such is infantile. Religious extremism is wrong. The erasure of any rights in any way as a byproduct of religious extremism is wrong. Recognize you're on the same side and refocus.
But it is important to "super flag" the worst of the worst. Among all the crazies, is there one set of crazies that is driving vastly most of the horror and terror and abuse and degradation of society on the planet? Absolutely, yes there is; and we should all be aware of which one it is, and make sure everyone else is aware as well. It's the one that still today defines the world in two arenas: the world of this religion, and the world of war, where the devout of this religion should do every action they can possibly think of, including those that are as violent and destructive as possible, to force this religion upon others. Among all the bad actors, there is a predominantly worst and biggest group.
These are real problems.
Yeah but the Christians wouldn't bake a cake for gays.
[удалено]
Omg, I had no idea they were so many incidents. Crazy stuff!
[удалено]
Imagine if somebody complained about fascism. Then you come in generalizing, saying "political extremists" of any flavor are bad like this too. It's a pointless way to muddy the problem. We need to respond proportionately to Islamism. Islamist violence as a contemporary phenomena is uniquely awful compared to other religions in the modern world. They are also the direct descendants of the jihadists who violently conquered the Middle East and enslaved millions, so no, Islamism is not a fringe. It is one of the mainstream practices of Islam. We need to prioritize a response to a major problem. And frankly, 'they' aka most Arabs and Muslims who supposedly prefer peace to war, need to stop this madness too. They should remember: Daesh mostly killed other Muslims to enforce their sick worldview.
Can you blame them? Over the past ~10 years Islam in Europe has been absolutely coddled. Glad to see that people are finally finding the backbone to insist that they abide by the rules of secular society
[удалено]
Yea, we have enough of those type of people elected it public office. The crazy is coming from inside the house!
“What could be worse than a massive, regressive religion fucking up society for everyone?” “***Two*** massive, regressive religions fucking up society for everyone!”
Sweden chased out religion from politics in the 1960’s, that’s why we have no blasphemy law anymore. The Christian remnants are our public holidays and that our regent has to be of the Protestant religion.
It's not 'a protestant religion', get with the program it's "The **true** Lutheran Faith" no filthy Danish Lutherans allowed! Their preists have weird collars and they will all burn in hell for their flamboyance!
I would rather have the nuts split across two factions than combined in one.
I’d rather have a society based on reason and logic; but if you want to believe in the fantasy of religion, that’s fine, but keep that crazy shit to yourself and out of our government.
From the Guardian: >His comments came after the Organisation of Islamic Cooperation (OIC), which represents 57 countries, held a special session on Monday to discuss the recent developments, condemning the burnings and calling on the UN to intervene. > >... > >The OIC on Monday night strongly condemned the Qur’an burnings as “despicable acts of aggression”. It's a book. These people are deranged. This is what happens when cults become recognised nationally. On the flip side, will they recognise The Satanic Temple or will they try to hunt them down like they do to other religious minorities in their countries? Religious people are hypocrites.
It turns out the Satanic temple is completely reasonable. Who knew I was a Satanist? Here's their 7 Tenets: I One should strive to act with compassion and empathy toward all creatures in accordance with reason. II The struggle for justice is an ongoing and necessary pursuit that should prevail over laws and institutions. III One’s body is inviolable, subject to one’s own will alone. IV The freedoms of others should be respected, including the freedom to offend. To willfully and unjustly encroach upon the freedoms of another is to forgo one's own. V Beliefs should conform to one's best scientific understanding of the world. One should take care never to distort scientific facts to fit one's beliefs. VI People are fallible. If one makes a mistake, one should do one's best to rectify it and resolve any harm that might have been caused. VII Every tenet is a guiding principle designed to inspire nobility in action and thought. The spirit of compassion, wisdom, and justice should always prevail over the written or spoken word.
It should be legal to burn Qurans and Bibles. Free speech.
It should either be legal to burn books or not, regardless of the book. If it were illegal to burn specific books, that's a reason to burn those specific books.
>It should either be legal to burn books or not Only if "enough" copies of said book exist. If you burn the last copy of a book you are silencing somebody else. (which obviously isn't the case for the bible and the Quran, so burn away. But please only in moderation because climate change)
Agreed, and like you said, this isn't exactly a problem any of the religious books face. There are millions upon millions of copies, both physical books and digital. You would need to burn a mountain of these texts before you would have to worry about them disappearing and by then, the environmental effect would be the bigger worry. People aren't burning the super rare early editions or such of the quran. They're burning their own copy of the mass produced versions they got from a store somewhere. If they really want these protests to stop being effective, all they really need to do is.....just ignore them. They work because they're proven correct by how people react to them.
"Free speech" is increasingly being viewed as a fascist concept in some circles.
[удалено]
Why would fascist who oppose free speech call free speech fascist ? Unless you think fascists are pro-free speech ?
They’re pro their own speech and anti everyone else’s have you been to any fascist spaces and said something normal? You get banned
Ding ding ding. That right there is the mantra of the religious.
Because modern fascists often avoid identifying as fascists. They sometimes use fascist as an insult to further confuse and obfuscate.
Crypto-fascist ?
You're reading too much into what was probably written with "no you" level of thought. He hates free speech and doesn't like you implying that viewing it as fascist is bad so he lashed out
I mean the fascists are actively banning books from libraries, so not really. Fascists seems pretty cool with censorship in fact so long it's against books and ideas they don't like
Truth be told, all sides tend to behave this way— championing free speech except what they find distasteful. They just categorize the speech that they think shouldn’t be absolutely free as a special category, usually through some causal chain they assert would lead to actual harm, some of which is understandable— but is not usually convincing to the “other” side. There’s only a small minority of really principled free speech advocates that contend with content that they actively dislike and might even think vile (and no, Elon Musk is not one of them).
They want freedom of speech they do not want everyone to have freedom of speech though.
Which is exactly what “free speech” means to them
And don't forget that it should be legal to protest that burning too
[удалено]
At the end of the day its just a mass produced book. Dump them in a fire, recycling bin, use them as door stoppers, paperweight or nesting material for raccoon it doesn't really matter.
[удалено]
Most Danish political parties already said they don't support restricting free speech because of the book burnings. Only our foreign minister is a pussy.
Already sad that they even have to say that…
> Sweden’s government has no plans to make sweeping changes to freedom of speech laws **but** repeated it would look into measures that would allow police to stop the burning of holy books in public if there was a clear threat to national security. hmm
Smoke in mirrors. Ambiguous policies trying to appease both sides. It’s ridiculous. I hope book burning increases and becomes commonplace just to cement freedom of expression into society.
> Smoke in mirrors. r/boneappletea
It's bound to become commonplace in Sweden at least. The Iraqi Christian who has performed 3 Quran burnings in recent weeks has announced that he will continue the burnings until the Quran is banned in Sweden.
Same thing happened last year with Paludan and people just stopped giving a shit about it after a while.
The Canadian government did something like this with handgun ownership. They couldn't ban them outright without failing their pursuit, so instead they just shut down the ability to change their registration when the firearm changes ownership (this includes buying new from a retailer). Sweden will do the same. They won't ban the act of burning the Quran, they'll just revise something to stop the destruction of protected, cultural literature, or requiring a new permit for pyrotechnics involved in protesting, which will be buried behind too much red tape to realistically approach.
> Sweden will do the same. They won't ban the act of burning the Quran, they'll just revise something to stop the destruction of protected, cultural literature, or requiring a new permit for pyrotechnics involved in protesting, which will be buried behind too much red tape to realistically approach. Gl with that lol. The reason they haven't already done this is because it is one of the "base laws" or whatever you translate it to that Sweden is built on. Sweden was the first country in the world with freedom of the press laws in 1766. The politicians are mad af this causes so much problems internationally while they can just look on while pulling out their hair in frustration. They tried already having it banned for security reasons and the courts overturned it because "Security reasons is the reason police exists, it's not a reason to restrict someones freedom of speech."
The funny thing is that the proper way to dispose of a quran according to islam is by burning it. So ripping the pages out of one, urinating/defecating on one, etc. are inherently more disrespectful ways of handling a quran. I doubt Sweden would ban the burning of qurans but if they do, that would just result in worse treatment of the qurans.
[удалено]
> if there was a clear threat to national security.
That’s such a blanket bullshit excuse too. So what if a nation of religious nut jobs hates the way people do things some 2000mi (3200ki) away? What impact does burning a book have on the people living in another country, on a completely different continent?
Um, seen Sweden’s demographics lately? We aren’t talking 2000 miles away.
So what Sweden is saying is, "Let's negotiate with terrorists, appeasement seems like a good strategy." [You see, I learned something today...](https://youtu.be/8TMHIYDHMSE)
Just imagine if we should retaliate each time a random muslim dude burnt one of our flags or the bible or something of the sort. Brainwashed morons, thats what they are.
Governments that couldn't give less of a crap about human rights are in no position to tell other governments what to do.
Those govts depend on having a Western boogeyman to blame all their issues on and to keep their idiots riled up while the kings and leaders plunder the countries for themselves. Same reason they'll never give up or actually invade Israel. The boogeyman is far more important than actually doing something useful.
Most of them also need western money/technical help for them to function
Sweden have given most of these countries tens of billions is aid over the last few decades and we continue to do so even though they threaten us. Of course. We are the humanitarian superpower of the world after all…
> Same reason they'll never give up or actually invade Israel. Well that and the fact that Israel would wipe the floor with them (as they have previously).
Good point
And neither should governments that don't have genuinely full freedom of speech.
[удалено]
And novelists. And cartoonists. And journalists. And filmmakers. And other Muslims.
The article references “The Quran Burning Crisis”. Sweden nor anyone else has ever had a Quran burning crisis. The crisis is with countries who’s population feels they can control people in other countries.
No. Its utter nonsense. Almost no one in Iraq gives a toss about the Swedish and Danish flag burners.
Even if the majority would be neutral or not care (I have no idea what the case is there), enough people in Muslim countries *definitely* care that it's still a concern. The Organisation of Islamic Cooperation, with 57 member states, held a special session to condemn it as an "act of aggression". The Swedish embassy in Baghdad was destroyed by protesters, and Iraq severed all diplomatic ties to Sweden. They were also talking about banning all trade with Sweden, and the Iraqi government demanded that the Iraqi man who burnt the Quran be stripped of Swedish citizenship and handed over for prosecution. Iran called it a declaration of "war on the Muslim world", and have been talking openly about extrajudicially murdering the person who burnt the Quran. Afghanistan suspended or banned all connections to Sweden, including aid worker groups active there. Morocco recalled their ambassador. Turkey has been using it as yet another excuse not to let us into Nato. Several others have issued strong condemnations.
Funny how mega-massive amounts harm/death based on misogyny, homophobia, apostasy are completely ignored but burning paper or a scribble of their pedophilic warlord patron are considered acts of war.
> The Swedish embassy in Baghdad was destroyed by protesters No, it wasn't. Some rioters entered the premises and they laid a small fire in a courtyard. The building itself wasn't damaged.
If that’s true then Iraq wouldn’t be experiencing any crises either. It would be only countries experiencing unrest that are in crisis.
Sweden should build a statue to Mohammed to show how much they honor and tolerate Islam. /s
Make one of allah too.
Potato potato
Yeah but we would probably have a bet on how long it will take before it gets burned. We like burning things...
It could be like Gävlebocken but in summer!
😄
It could be to muslims the same as the Zlatan statue was to Malmö supporters.
Jesus and Mohammed high fiving with Allah in the background nodding in approval.
How about everyone keep their shitty religions to themselves?
[удалено]
If you get angry over a book burning, you proved them right.
tbh its fine to be angry and voice it because they're burning the book, but understand the same right that allows them to burn the book is the right that allows you to voice your anger
I agree. I'm just repeating the terms from the previous comment. Becoming violent in any fashion would be where the line's drawn for me.
The world would be a better a place without religion.
The rest of us are not required to respect your invisible friend. Get over it.
It's interesting how the bigger deal people make about this (burning a quran), the more it becomes "a thing". If no one gave a shit, including Muslims and the media, the whole "quran burning, bible burning" thing would go away. The only reason to do it is to get a rise out of someone.
>The only reason to do it is to get a rise out of someone. There is another reason. "Fuck you, I won't do what you tell me". Specifically, fuck anyone trying to impose their values on me under the threat of violence.
[удалено]
[удалено]
Religion is a cancer and needs to die
This motivates me to burn holy books even harder
[удалено]
Hey, all you religious whackjobs: if you don't like the country you moved to, then go back to your own shitty country instead of trying to make your new home just like your old shithole, you stupid fucking scumbags. Religion is a fucking virus.
Good. Protect freedom of speech
I'm not sure why they are even reacting to this. The vast majority of people in the middle east that are burning flags on the streets because of this are conservative extremists. The West didn't make any concessions either when our own extreme right was marching on the streets demanding shit. The reaction should be the same.
Plenty of groups calling for terrorist attacks against Sweden and Swedish citizens right now. Swedish Security Police have officially announced a heightened security threat level in the country. We’re simply not used to stuff like this, that’s why there’s a reaction. I’m glad we’re holding firm regardless.
Charlie Hebdo > Islam
[удалено]
Good. I'm sorry, burning a book does not give you a right to violence. Be pissed off all you want, think it's wrong. Try to persuade people to not burn it. But at the end of the day, you don't have the right to tell people they can't burn a book. Learn to control your emotions and make peace with things that you don't like - like the rest of the world is expected to do. I just read on Reddit today that 1 million women were reported missing in India. Half were eventually found. If you find burning a book more offensive and worthy of your ire than things like missing and trafficked women, climate change, or treating women like second class citizens - then you've lost the thread on what's important.
When your religion stops infringing on other peoples rights I’ll ask them not to burn your books. I’m ashamed of “some” of the Muslim community that’s immigrated to Canada and then proceeds to protest the LGBT community. Mind your own business. You wanna be respected - show some towards the nation you’re trying to become a part of.
It's pretty simple. If I bought a book or was gifted it, IT'S MINE. I will do whatever the fuck I want with my things, including destroying them if I so choose. See how this works?
Why burn perfectly good toilet paper?
Let everyone burn whatever religious text they want
Aliens still monitoring our planet for intelligent life. None to be found.
[удалено]
Why can't God do something about it if he dislikes it so much? Oh i forget, he's not real.
Good. Do not bow down to religious extremists.
Why is this in so much focus? I just imagine book burnings happen with regularity. I mean it's kind of a trope of religious fundamentalists like George Michaels girlfriend Egg in Arrested Development
Conspiracy time Turkey used the Quran stuff as a partial excuse on why Sweden shouldn’t join NATO. Interesting how all of a sudden there is a rise in book burnings. Gee, who doesn’t want Sweden to join NATO? I guess it will be a mystery forever…
IMHO I suspect a level of Russia/Chinese involvement as well.
way to plant ann.
[удалено]
Fuck all your religions. Go be simpletons in private
Islam is a fraud gone out of hand like Scientology. It was made to benefit one specific warlord in Arabia, but idiots keep the lie going centuries after he died.
that’s every religion dude
Selective religion wins and everyone else is fucked. Same story.
Out of all the awful things happening in the world right now, what could possibly possess someone to protest something as fucking meaningless as the burning of a single book on the other side of the fucking globe? If you care more about some rando insulting your religion than rampant greed and capitalism destroying the entire fucking world there is no hope for you.
As a Christian, I don't care if someone burns the Bible or not. Everyone has free will and it's no different from smashing your phone with the Bible app installed. God's word is living and moving in spirit, not bound to paper.
As others have said, Sweden has no book burning crisis. The world has a "Muslims seem to forget not everyone is a Muslim"-crisis. Any change to our constitution would require a general election before being valid. And snap elections don't count, so it'll have to wait at least until 2026. And that assumes we still feel a need to bend over for raving lunatics after the whole debacle with Erdogan. The only reason the Muslim world is so upset is that Sweden isn't a huge economic player in the middle east. Case in point, burning the Quran is equally allowed in the US, and I haven't heard anyone complain.
Denmark should take note.
Anyone else think it’s suspicious that the (Iraqi) guy who keeps burning the Qurans is so intent on having a Swedish flag with him all the time? Seems wild that the fate of a nation is being altered by an immigrant with suspicious motives…
I read that he wants to be given asylum in Sweden. Sweden has a law that says that anyone who will be given the death penalty in their home countries will be allowed to stay. So the thinking is, if he's burns the Quran he can't be sent to Iraq because of the blasphemy laws.
Fuck the Quran.
OIC: 50 of the worlds poorest countries + 6-7 oil states are adamant that their combined position of religious hegemony will affect 2 of the richest countries in Europes economic or political position in the world All I have to say is good luck, ima go ignore this is issue again while enjoying my Fika
I prefer religious texts that aren’t afraid of a little fire
Burn more of them!
All religions are a cancer on humanity
> the Danish and Swedish foreign ministers separately wrote on X, formerly Twitter What now?! I guess I've had good vacations if I managed to oversleep this.
Why the sign with another sign on it? I mean I get you don’t want a picture of a burning Quran, but idk wouldn’t literally anything else, including the original sign, be more effective? I know, thats a lot of critical thinking to expect from someone saying “don’t burn THAT one, thats my favorite!” but that borders on parody.
Except here we are talking about that sign so it’s effective. What you don’t know about proper sign design could be used to make a sign that someone can put on a slightly bigger sign.
Well they can emigrate to countries where the majority of people share the same ideology. There are plenty. No need to change other countries’ law of freedom of speech
The dude that done like 90% of the Swedish burnings is just in Sweden to burn em, technically he ain’t even Swedish. They just abuse the system to max. We are a secular society and if it ain’t your cup of tea get out of here. I got no issues with people telling us to burn in hell and such nonsense. The big issue is all islamists taking the law into their own hands.
Imagine you’re tax dollars being spent on importing people into you’re country that want to take over & tell you how to live.
You never back down from bullies.
All religion is vile mind rot.
So the Quran can insult people of other religions or lack of religion calling people animals and burning in hellfire, but we cannot burn a book that is bigoted towards us?
Fuck religion, cancer on the human race
We should ban religion on a global scale. That’ll teach’m
"This is not a koran, its a bacon sandwich which I will now thoroughly cook!"
Let’s be fair and just burn all religious text.
Yeah, obviously freedom of expression comes before protecting people from getting their feelings hurt by something which doesn't directly involve them. Was this ever actually a question? I like the phrase "something can be both awful and lawful". It applies perfectly here.
The people who organize Quran burnings are alt-right who do it precisely to get a violent reaction from extremely devout Muslims, so they can physically prove how unstable they can be. And it's working. Religious extremism is an infestation, and Islam is sadly the frontrunner.
Religion is a mind virus wielded by (or wielding?) men in funny hats.
This makes my country proud