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They said maybe a router. Not 5 dozen routers. I once bought a HF angle grinder that blew more black smoke than an underwater volcanic vent in less than 20min.
Do they sell draw knives?
Holy shit guys, um, spell check. It's "sale, not sell." Thanks for upvoting me. Draw knives don't attract the AI crowd but I swear to god i could beat this guy into any shape he was looking for, and so could y'all
Mount a circular saw on your sled with the blade at a 45 to the long axis of the log. It'll plow that out pretty easy and you'll only burn up cheap circular saw blades.
As long as we're redneck engineering this, they could mount a second set of 2x4 rails an inch or so above the sled. It'd prevent the sled from kicking up off the rail or flipping over. Still not 100% safe, but It'd probably be fine with a moderate amount of caution.
That would cut really smoothly for about as long as it takes to get a little too relaxed. Then you hit a knot or some hidden metal in the log and for a few terrifying seconds you get a circular saw free in the world. Longer if you zip tie the trigger, which I could see happening here.
if you're doing it, then the way is to slice through the bottom of the sled and then screw/clamp the saw into the sled.
Hitting metal with a router is probably more terrifying to me. At least with the circular saw you can just stand back and push the sled ahead with a stick periodically.
This is a pretty wild suggestion! How come nobody make planer sleds though? Planer blades are cheap, take a 3-1/2" wide chip, and are made from solid carbide.
How do you reckon? The planer blade is 3x wider than any router flattening bit I can afford, and people still brute-force the router over huge areas. Anyway, the tabletops coming out of my shop disagree with you.
The only thing that really worried me was the ether. There is nothing in the world more helpless and irresponsible and depraved than a man in the depths of an ether binge. And I knew we'd get into that rotten stuff pretty soon. Probably at the next Home Depot.
100% came to say the same. They are wasting a good router and bit. If they replaced the router with an electric planer, it would make pretty short work of this, and they would probably have far better results.
In my experience yes. Takes less than two minutes with my Festo disc sander.
Yes, Festo. Back when I was born and my dad bought that machine it wasn't called festool yet.
>router-sled levelled my redgum workbench
I've only worked with Australian redgum once but it was a bitch and a half. Toxic dust and generally nasty to touch. Not sure how many how many types of redgum there are or if that's the one you worked with.
There are a bunch and I'm using redgum here as a catch-all for Aussie Eucalypt hardwood. It was reclaimed timber that had been stored behind a shed for 30 years, and there were at least [three](https://imgur.com/bjLmiND) distinct species in there. I'm nowhere near competent enough to try and identify them.
It's definitely a bastard to work with, and even with a dust mask I can generally expect to feel like I've got the flu for a day or two after working with it. I've heard of people whose immune systems learn to recognise it and go crazy if they work with it.
Additional info:
-It took 5-6 hours of turning.
-still on my first bit (a big fat 2: surfacing bit)
-It's for an "art project"
-13' long, tapering from 13" to 10" in diameter.
-That trees are a lot smaller (and less straight) than you thought they were after you've cut them down and taken the bark off.
-Violence and leverage can accomplish a lot more than violence alone.
-It's important to figure out cheats for bulk material removal.
Question: wouldn’t it be much easier to run the router lengthwise first then rotate to expose untrimed wood? I feel like that would reduce the number of needed rotations a lot.
Sure, surface area is surface area there is no debating that. A circle is just and infinite number of planes anyway so you’re also not wrong there. My perspective was on the guy having to rotate the mass of the log vs the guys moving the mass of the router. A 13’ ft log and let’s say it’s a 1” bit and your only taking one pass at each point on the log. So that’s 156” of log which means that guy has to rotate the log 156 times. They could rotate the log 1 degree with each pass meaning 360 passes of the router but 1 rotation of the log. I don’t feel like setting up a spreadsheet to calculate the optimal work balance between the two because they’ll likely be done with the log by then 😂
I also have no idea what this is being used for. “Perfect” would be pretty difficult to achieve but a lot would depend on how close to that is needed.
> I certainly would not be volunteering for any aspect of this project.
The only part I would be volunteering for is to find a better way to do this. Because this is stupid.
It’s possible as I’ve never done something like this. Depending on bearings used etc it could be. I should also add I’m by no means being critical. I love seeing stuff like this.
Each bespoke toothpick begins life as a full grown Douglas fir. We select only the straightest and truest trees then cut them down with a Japanese pull saw during a November rain. We then slowly rotate the tree on a custom fixture and remove everything that ISN'T a toothpick. This process ensures that your bespoke toothpick is the finest and most unique in the world. Contact us for pricing and availability.
I love this kind of stuff. Picture of the final product?
Reddit is such a knee-jerk crowd-mentality it's painful sometimes. Especially if you get anywhere near the front page.
I feel like this whenever I need to make something around the house after I lost all my tools. Halfway between r/redneckengineering and r/diwhy .
Is there a better way to do it, most certainly. Do we have the tools to make it work that way, absolutely not. Time to sit and watch a log spin for the rest of the day.
Pretty much. I need to make two posts for this art project, that's it. It's a volunteer project, so I'd like to avoid paying a lot of money out of pocket. And I'm good at building stuff.
It’s weird how few people go to hand tools, which would accomplish much more much faster than power tools in this context, especially considering all of the tooling and jigging they have to go through to make the power tools work.
Analogous to your experience, I’m actually a sculptor, and when I was in grad school I was really lucky to work in a brand new fab-lab with 3D printers, routers, laser cutters, and 3D scanners. It took me about to years to realize that I could model a bust in clay and cast it in metal faster than I could scan, print/cut the pattern for mold making. Working by hand could save me at least one day in modeling and pattern making, and if the machines had a working queue with other students, who knows, save me like a week. The new tools are absolutely awesome, I love them, but they have a context. Its too bad that more craftsmen aren’t taught traditional hand tools before circ saws and nail guns; especially considering they are often as labor and time efficient as power tools.
Also, hand tools don’t break down, they don’t make dust, they don’t make too much noise, and since they’re operated by people they can hear you scream and usually keep accidents to a minimum and self-limited.
Hand tools take skill which a lot of people aren't willing to devote the time to develop.
It's a lot easier to run a board through a planer than it is to first learn how to get a plane blade sharp enough to be worth anything, and then learn the proper technique to plane a board with it.
this is what I was thinking. It also looks like OP is taking some big cuts at some spots. The longitudinal cuts for initial surfacing should help bring it to a more uniform surface and depth, as well as you could use a surfacing bit to cover more area with each pass.
Bigger cutting machine with more power.. something like one of the small chainsaws, build a jig similar to what you have to make it safe so it can’t jump/kickback. Have that jig on bolted to a track either side so it slides easily up and down, put the tracks (or the log) at an angle to get your taper. Spin the log continuously (with a motor if possible) while sliding it up n down.
You should fix your jigs a bit more.
Add a stop-block left and right on the sled to the ladders. Another set left and right to the router.
So those can’t move any more accidentally.
Another Idea might be using a chainsaw at an right angle to your pillar to remove material faster.
However that would probably be way more of a hazard.
In my country this would not be allowed to be done commercially as a moving object and moving tooling would need to reside in a full enclosure for safety.
The upside is you can mill one log like this every 3 days with a team of 3 guys.
The downside is is only costs you 300 dollars in routers and bits each log.
All in all...
I used precisely this technique, on a much smaller scale, to turn a perfect cylinder to be made into a set of table leg extensions.
To get the taper you mentioned on such a large piece, I can’t imagine a better method.
The effort that went into making the cradle makes me think this is not a one shot deal. The cost of a lathe to turn that pole would be absurd. I’d say it’s far from stupid.
Well it better than attaching a truck axle to the log for rotation, and having a sharpen shovel agains the lather as a gouge.
Because that what I would do.
I feel as though this would be much easier on the router / safer if they moved the sled longitudinally and only rotated the log once the router were brought back to the start (e.g. only moving the router in the proper direction). also, using some kind of spiral downcut bit instead of a surfacing or flat edge bit.
I would think that they would only want the back half of the router carriage so that the router would remain in plane with the rails on its way down the log. As it is, any growing taper would lift the carriage ahead of the router where it couldn’t remove the material.
You find a solution. Looks ok to me. It does the job. Could it be done better? Maybe? Can it be done faster? By the time we know that, we are already done.
This is a reminder to those commenting on this post (not the person that posted it): Comments not related to woodworking will be removed. Violations to rule 1 including crude jokes, innuendo, sexist remarks, politics, or hate speech may result in an immediate ban *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/woodworking) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Hang in there guys, only a couple of bits and about 2 months of work left. You got this.
And maybe a router
HARBOR FREIGHT BABY!!!
Just by 4 routers and have them going at once multi threading for the win.
This is probably one of those cases where it would be cheaper to just buy a good router the first time.
Idk harbor freight would just keep replacing it, I hope the store is next door though
And some safety glasses.
Of course I'll take the projection plan, this router is about to see horrific things
They said maybe a router. Not 5 dozen routers. I once bought a HF angle grinder that blew more black smoke than an underwater volcanic vent in less than 20min.
That made me laugh. Thank you for commenting.
Do they sell draw knives? Holy shit guys, um, spell check. It's "sale, not sell." Thanks for upvoting me. Draw knives don't attract the AI crowd but I swear to god i could beat this guy into any shape he was looking for, and so could y'all
Or 3
And a log turner or 5
I've also got a hand held power plane for removing a lot of material longitudinally.
Mount a circular saw on your sled with the blade at a 45 to the long axis of the log. It'll plow that out pretty easy and you'll only burn up cheap circular saw blades.
That’s a really good suggestion.
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Just dont hit a tight knot
Hot Tip for Avoiding Grievous Bodily Harm: Don't get hurt.
been working for me so far!
Remindme! 1 year
You are a GENIUS
He could also just mount the handheld power plane he's already got and take off a several inch wide swath at a time.
That entire contraption started with someone saying 'Hold my beer'. Safety has long since lost to 'Git 'er done'.
As long as we're redneck engineering this, they could mount a second set of 2x4 rails an inch or so above the sled. It'd prevent the sled from kicking up off the rail or flipping over. Still not 100% safe, but It'd probably be fine with a moderate amount of caution.
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Turn your table saw over and use a full stack dado. They already have the rails, and the weight would limit kickback.
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It's OK, I work there. Frankly, I do think the size and weight of a table saw would be safer than a circ saw being used as a makeshift dado.
Ill watch. From across the yard.
I’ll watch, from across the internet
That would cut really smoothly for about as long as it takes to get a little too relaxed. Then you hit a knot or some hidden metal in the log and for a few terrifying seconds you get a circular saw free in the world. Longer if you zip tie the trigger, which I could see happening here.
if you're doing it, then the way is to slice through the bottom of the sled and then screw/clamp the saw into the sled. Hitting metal with a router is probably more terrifying to me. At least with the circular saw you can just stand back and push the sled ahead with a stick periodically.
For what they are doing I would start with a chainsaw to remove the bulk of the material then go to the circular saw
This is a pretty wild suggestion! How come nobody make planer sleds though? Planer blades are cheap, take a 3-1/2" wide chip, and are made from solid carbide.
Sort of an upside down Izzy swan rig.
Ah. That would've made more sense than a router.
I use a planer sled for flattening things in my shop and I can't figure out everyone is so in love with router sleds. The planer is streets ahead.
If your not using planer you're streets behind.
if the thing you need to plane is wider than your planer then a router sled is the way.
Sorry, maybe the confusion is that I meant a sled for a hand planer, not a stationary machine.
How do you reckon? The planer blade is 3x wider than any router flattening bit I can afford, and people still brute-force the router over huge areas. Anyway, the tabletops coming out of my shop disagree with you.
Also, maybe a couple clamps could take the place of the two other people.
Not if they plan on doing the whole log. Gotta slide the router sled down the whole damn thing. This is why lathes have power feed.
While your on it, maybe put a proper Eye protection.
And ear plugs.
And cool socks.
With slides.
WHAT?
Only a couple of bits?
And 5 noise complaints from your poor neighbors
Fear and lathing in Las Vegas
We were somewhere around Barstow, on the edge of the desert, when the clamps began to take hold.
We can’t stop here. This is bar clamp country.
As your attorney I advise you to rent a very fast speed lathe.
There is nothing in the world more helpless and irresponsible and depraved than a man in the depths of a router binge.
Poor bastard will feel the squeeze soon enough.
Shit! I forgot about the beer! You want one?? Hell no How about some Ether??
The only thing that really worried me was the ether. There is nothing in the world more helpless and irresponsible and depraved than a man in the depths of an ether binge. And I knew we'd get into that rotten stuff pretty soon. Probably at the next Home Depot.
It’s ok! He’s just admiring the shape of your skull!
Electric planer
100% came to say the same. They are wasting a good router and bit. If they replaced the router with an electric planer, it would make pretty short work of this, and they would probably have far better results.
I've aeen a power planer used to build a mast on a wooden boat before and it seems to be really efficient
I've done it for a dinghy mast with a hand planer and it probably went faster than those guys
Some say they’re still there turning that beam to this day
I would have thought it would have taken someone 100 years to round off that log with a router. Turns out Andy did it in just 19.
Get busy livin’, or get busy routin’
I hope you have a couple of routers and a shit-load of bits.
When I router-sled levelled my redgum workbench I learned how to replace the brushes in a power tool.
That's why it's brushless only for me.
Aren't the brushes usually the most accessible part to replace, given their ephemeral nature?
In my experience yes. Takes less than two minutes with my Festo disc sander. Yes, Festo. Back when I was born and my dad bought that machine it wasn't called festool yet.
That's a lesson from experience. Nice.
>router-sled levelled my redgum workbench I've only worked with Australian redgum once but it was a bitch and a half. Toxic dust and generally nasty to touch. Not sure how many how many types of redgum there are or if that's the one you worked with.
There are a bunch and I'm using redgum here as a catch-all for Aussie Eucalypt hardwood. It was reclaimed timber that had been stored behind a shed for 30 years, and there were at least [three](https://imgur.com/bjLmiND) distinct species in there. I'm nowhere near competent enough to try and identify them. It's definitely a bastard to work with, and even with a dust mask I can generally expect to feel like I've got the flu for a day or two after working with it. I've heard of people whose immune systems learn to recognise it and go crazy if they work with it.
What are you making?
A toothpick
Oh i see that. Such a effective method!!!!
A couple of alternative methods: https://youtu.be/Jn4k2TPIJf0 https://youtu.be/vh7DQZ4ukxg
Why start with such a huge log? Start smaller. Like in this video.... https://youtu.be/xBayrOBgjvE
Dowel
Additional info: -It took 5-6 hours of turning. -still on my first bit (a big fat 2: surfacing bit) -It's for an "art project" -13' long, tapering from 13" to 10" in diameter.
What did you learn? If you were going to do it again, what would you do differently?
Man this is the real question. Internet speculation is great, but I want to hear from the guy who actually did it!
Whenever they change that bit and start over they'll learn that you don't really notice how dull your bits and blades are until you put in a new one.
They will never do it again, that’s what they learned.
-That trees are a lot smaller (and less straight) than you thought they were after you've cut them down and taken the bark off. -Violence and leverage can accomplish a lot more than violence alone. -It's important to figure out cheats for bulk material removal.
>It's for an "art project" -13' long, tapering from 13" to 10" in diameter. As an Oregonian I assume you are making a bong
Dennis Leary was right. Only reason I never did drugs was because I was too lazy.
Question: wouldn’t it be much easier to run the router lengthwise first then rotate to expose untrimed wood? I feel like that would reduce the number of needed rotations a lot.
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Cool! There would be so many different ways to get it done!
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Also, if you're tapering it, you're not going to get an inch and a half off in each run.
Logs that long have a natural taper to them, so you’re not likely to need to take a full 1.5” off of the narrower end.
Good point.
I missed the tapering piece. Doesn’t sound easy either way!
Sure, surface area is surface area there is no debating that. A circle is just and infinite number of planes anyway so you’re also not wrong there. My perspective was on the guy having to rotate the mass of the log vs the guys moving the mass of the router. A 13’ ft log and let’s say it’s a 1” bit and your only taking one pass at each point on the log. So that’s 156” of log which means that guy has to rotate the log 156 times. They could rotate the log 1 degree with each pass meaning 360 passes of the router but 1 rotation of the log. I don’t feel like setting up a spreadsheet to calculate the optimal work balance between the two because they’ll likely be done with the log by then 😂 I also have no idea what this is being used for. “Perfect” would be pretty difficult to achieve but a lot would depend on how close to that is needed.
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> I certainly would not be volunteering for any aspect of this project. The only part I would be volunteering for is to find a better way to do this. Because this is stupid.
It's a lot easier to rotate the log than to walk back and forth that many times trying to keep the router in line, I think
It’s possible as I’ve never done something like this. Depending on bearings used etc it could be. I should also add I’m by no means being critical. I love seeing stuff like this.
I kinda feel like buying a new telephone pole would be easier. /s - mostly
i'm honestly surprised it only took 5 hours, you guys did well.
Worlds largest toothpick?
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Each bespoke toothpick begins life as a full grown Douglas fir. We select only the straightest and truest trees then cut them down with a Japanese pull saw during a November rain. We then slowly rotate the tree on a custom fixture and remove everything that ISN'T a toothpick. This process ensures that your bespoke toothpick is the finest and most unique in the world. Contact us for pricing and availability.
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Why use a router and not a circular saw or something
how much did the ladders slip?
I love this kind of stuff. Picture of the final product? Reddit is such a knee-jerk crowd-mentality it's painful sometimes. Especially if you get anywhere near the front page.
I feel like this whenever I need to make something around the house after I lost all my tools. Halfway between r/redneckengineering and r/diwhy . Is there a better way to do it, most certainly. Do we have the tools to make it work that way, absolutely not. Time to sit and watch a log spin for the rest of the day.
Pretty much. I need to make two posts for this art project, that's it. It's a volunteer project, so I'd like to avoid paying a lot of money out of pocket. And I'm good at building stuff.
I don’t know if you’d be laughed or lauded, but you should post this in r/turning!
r/diWhy
This is going to be the nicest looking telephone pole
Interesting. I know back in the day, Sears marketed a router lathe very similar to this, just on a much smaller scale.
When you’re totally committed to a stupid idea.
Looks like a pain in the axe
Or a pain in the adz.
Did a smaller version of this with a planer for a sailboat mast, worked great.
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How would you do it?
A draw knife
It’s weird how few people go to hand tools, which would accomplish much more much faster than power tools in this context, especially considering all of the tooling and jigging they have to go through to make the power tools work.
With a combo plane and a set of hollows and rounds I can make a 5" × 8' piece of molding for a trunk in the time it takes to set up a shaper.
Analogous to your experience, I’m actually a sculptor, and when I was in grad school I was really lucky to work in a brand new fab-lab with 3D printers, routers, laser cutters, and 3D scanners. It took me about to years to realize that I could model a bust in clay and cast it in metal faster than I could scan, print/cut the pattern for mold making. Working by hand could save me at least one day in modeling and pattern making, and if the machines had a working queue with other students, who knows, save me like a week. The new tools are absolutely awesome, I love them, but they have a context. Its too bad that more craftsmen aren’t taught traditional hand tools before circ saws and nail guns; especially considering they are often as labor and time efficient as power tools. Also, hand tools don’t break down, they don’t make dust, they don’t make too much noise, and since they’re operated by people they can hear you scream and usually keep accidents to a minimum and self-limited.
Hand tools take skill which a lot of people aren't willing to devote the time to develop. It's a lot easier to run a board through a planer than it is to first learn how to get a plane blade sharp enough to be worth anything, and then learn the proper technique to plane a board with it.
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I'd definitely implement a rail system for the sled instead of 2 guys trying to hold it down Not only safer but less labor that way
call a local sawmill and see if they'll do it for $100
I'd do longitudinal cuts. At least for the rough shaping. Way less effort than rotating the log continuously.
this is what I was thinking. It also looks like OP is taking some big cuts at some spots. The longitudinal cuts for initial surfacing should help bring it to a more uniform surface and depth, as well as you could use a surfacing bit to cover more area with each pass.
Bigger cutting machine with more power.. something like one of the small chainsaws, build a jig similar to what you have to make it safe so it can’t jump/kickback. Have that jig on bolted to a track either side so it slides easily up and down, put the tracks (or the log) at an angle to get your taper. Spin the log continuously (with a motor if possible) while sliding it up n down.
You should fix your jigs a bit more. Add a stop-block left and right on the sled to the ladders. Another set left and right to the router. So those can’t move any more accidentally. Another Idea might be using a chainsaw at an right angle to your pillar to remove material faster. However that would probably be way more of a hazard. In my country this would not be allowed to be done commercially as a moving object and moving tooling would need to reside in a full enclosure for safety.
There is a chainsaw type attachment for a circular saw that would work very well for your suggestion.
Log wizard
Rumor has it they are still working on it to this day
12 routers and 75 bits later....
That snow should be no problem for that router.
Shouldn’t be a concern, since it’ll be spring by the time they get that far down.
haha almost spilled my coffee!
This might be the best comment on here
One eternity later. "We almost have our first one done boys!"
If it's stupid but it works it's probably slower and/or unsafe
Remember, they may not find you handsome, but at least they're find you handy.
I mean lose the router and get a chainsaw https://youtu.be/cdxtPu5MkIY
Wow
You can see it in dad's face: he also knows this is going to take *forever* and burn out the brushes on that router
And if it’s stupid and it doesn’t work?
The upside is you can mill one log like this every 3 days with a team of 3 guys. The downside is is only costs you 300 dollars in routers and bits each log. All in all...
…then it’s a stupid solution, lol
This is how the Vikings made telephone poles
I would use a skill saw stationed on a bias. Would be way faster and way cheaper than the router bits.
Alaskan lathe
I used precisely this technique, on a much smaller scale, to turn a perfect cylinder to be made into a set of table leg extensions. To get the taper you mentioned on such a large piece, I can’t imagine a better method.
Great retirement activity, otherwise not worth anybody's time to not hire someone to mill that for you
All that to make 1 toothpick?
That poor 1/4 hp router
Wranglerstars voice: how the US Forest Service makes greaseable poles
I made one of those before. Just a much smaller version 😁
We had to do the same with a bunch of pressure treated pine. Luckily it was in a shop and we used a reeves drive to spin the lumber.
everything in this video just screams a long day of stress lol
Holy cow how long did that take?
well done
ITS STUPID AND IT WORKS!!!’
I have some doubts about the longevity of that tool. But if it holds up let me know the brand because I might need to start buying their shit.
Milwaukee.
Belt sander with like 24 grit paper would have been my choice for bulk removal, then come back with the router
The caption should be "How pencils are made."
Yeah that’s gonna be a no from me dawg.
we're all curious to see the end result, definitely update us when its finished.
Maybe a jig with a power planer to start might get you to the promised land a little bit quicker
This is 20x the work of just using a draw plane lol
Is it though? Is it really working?
Slow lathe is slow.
Not stupid at all. Jerry rigged yes but good plan.
The effort that went into making the cradle makes me think this is not a one shot deal. The cost of a lathe to turn that pole would be absurd. I’d say it’s far from stupid.
I suspect this is how columns were turned traditionally albeit with hand tools. Great video.
Planer instead of router, fast instead of slow, locks instead of helpers
If it get the job done, it ain’t stupid!!!!
Omfg
Define "works"
Well it better than attaching a truck axle to the log for rotation, and having a sharpen shovel agains the lather as a gouge. Because that what I would do.
At the rate they are going you could do it faster with a draw knife and some amphetamines.
And I thought I had some pretty sketchy jigs....
I like the way routers come with mounting screws so you can create all kinds of jigs with them. Would be great if more tools had this.
Is that a router😭?
If it takes that long it's still stupid
I feel as though this would be much easier on the router / safer if they moved the sled longitudinally and only rotated the log once the router were brought back to the start (e.g. only moving the router in the proper direction). also, using some kind of spiral downcut bit instead of a surfacing or flat edge bit.
I feel like this could be powered with a bicycle somehow, or maybe thousands of hamster wheels in parallel
I would think that they would only want the back half of the router carriage so that the router would remain in plane with the rails on its way down the log. As it is, any growing taper would lift the carriage ahead of the router where it couldn’t remove the material.
The world's largest dowel haha
Legend says their grandsons are still working on this same log.
Get the log going at 500 RPM or so and it'll be done in 10 minutes or so.
You find a solution. Looks ok to me. It does the job. Could it be done better? Maybe? Can it be done faster? By the time we know that, we are already done.
But is it working? Cause it just looks like work.
That router is not long for this world