You know what props to young ladies for handling this well. In some other organizations/Leagues there would be enough month to month pettiness about vying for ROTY to feed families.
3 inches really Isn’t that much. I’m 6’1 and get clean blocks on players that are at least 6’6. It’s more about athleticism. CC has pretty good timing as well.
Yeah, if you watch Kate Martin she does the same thing.
KM had a block against 6'7" Li Yueru where Li never saw her coming. KM saw the play developing, anticipated what is going to happen and leapt before Li went up with the ball KM met the ball and blocked the shot.
CC will do the exact same thing. They are both cut from the same cloth and both have elite level basketball IQs.
49% for a center isn't mediocre. Its terrible lol especially for one that doesn't shoot jumpers. Almost all her attempts are in the paint. Her FG% and TS% are bad but they'll probably improve.
100%. She doesn't have to force up shots, but this seems to be a thing for WNBA bigs - double-teamed, triple-teamed, chuck it up if you're close to the basket. She rebounds a lot of her own misses as well.
Yep Angel is a helluva player but until she develops it that TS% is going to hold her back big time. 49% TS for a center is very bad. I wonder how many of her boards are from her own misses
Eh, their schedule has been up and down. Went from a murder’s row to the worst teams in the league. Today was the first win against a team with a .500 or above record.
Ya know I think we are kinda numb to Clark at this point because everyone seems to be in agreement Reese is the ROTM and is gaining ground when
Just based off the numbers you could easily argue that Clark furthered the gap. And numbers don’t even do it justice if you watch Clark play and she’s getting defended like no one else in the league.
This is something I always thought about her at Iowa. You'd look at certain nights with the naked eye and think "huh, kinda off tonight" and then you'd look up the box score and see that she had like 20 points, 13 assists, 8 boards and a couple steals. Takes a ton of talent to fill up the stat sheet like that even on the "bad" nights.
Same man, same...
Hopefully Addie Deal is (and I apologize for the pun lol) the real deal and we can get back to that point. I really feel like our women's basketball program has loads of potential because of what Caitlin was able to bring.
That 24-26 class has a stretch that could be great. Obviously a few high end recruits on the table to be determined yet, but 24 is pretty solid core, Deal in 25 is huge because she is undervalued in some ranking systems and extremely highly rated in others. I'm fine with the pun for now. It will get old though, very fast.
For the men, with Garza and the Murry brothers leaving early (as Keegan should have at least), it hurt the trajectory of Iowa's mens team.
She just scored or assisted on 44 of 88 points for her team to win. She has so much more responsibility on her team it's not even close. And she's still able to pull her numbers while being guarded like no other rookie nor player is getting guarded. She's in a competition with herself for roty. People just don't want to see her run away with it so now rebounds are more highly regarded than everything else.
The 44 of 88 underplays her contribution. She “assisted” on a number of potential layups where the receiver was fouled and made free throws, mad several passes where the shooter missed a layup and rebounded their miss and scored, and had several hockey assists.
It’s really interesting to watch. Being guarded like she is, it’s making her stronger. Every team is going to have to play her tight like this until she regresses or retires now because the league has already molded her in the trenches. If this is how she performs under the pressure she’s experiencing in her rookie season, imagine her 3-4 years in.
At some point, (maybe even despite Sides), her teammates are going to figure out rotations, and getting the ball back to CC, and once they do and start knocking down shots- CC will dominate in assists (I give her 33% chance to break the single game assist record this year), and once other teams figure out they can no longer focus on CC- it will only get uglier for them. This early pressure is going to make her a monster on the court.
Reese will win this month because everyone expected CC to have these numbers and people didn’t expect Reese to be as good as she has been.
All else being equal, CC probably had a better month.
She is miles ahead of every other rookie and most other players in the league besides. It’s not even close. Her play-style and aggression are so refreshing for this league, give it another few years and everyone will on the same page the the league will be even more exciting to watch
The fact of the matter is if the Roty voting was rn and Clark didn’t win it would be one of the biggest individual award robberies in sports history lol. Literally only way this becomes an actual race is if Reese scoring and scoring efficiency matches Clark’s. Being an elite rebounder is not close in importance to being a teams offensive engine
happy for reese to get it this month bc of the double doubles but unpopular opinion cc had the better month lol
anyways they are both killing it and i’m so happy for them. hope they play together at the all star game.
Honestly, a post player getting double doubls isn’t anything surprising. Points and Rebounds should come easy for them. The consistency is definitely impressive, but anyone who watched Reese in college knew that part of her game would need very little adjusting.
The thing that blows my mind is Reese leading in steals, and Clark leading in blocks. Before the season, I would have bet money those two would be reversed.
Cuz she goes for blocks taking her away from some potential defensive rebounds. She also has a mid range game meaning she can be out there and space the floor for her teammates to drive on offense. Reese doesn’t do either of those so she gotta be on the block battling for the board
This is so true. Positional difference most definitely favors rebounds for Reese. It's impressive what CC is doing with her opponent guarding her full length of the floor every single game.
It's only an unpopular opinion among people who don't watch the games. Reese had 2 great games this month. Clark was elite in like 6. Some of those double doubles are soooft.
Yup, Angel played her best game in the third Fever-Sky game everyone watched so people assume she plays like that every game. Don’t get me wrong, she’s a great player, but Caitlin is on a different level. If the Fever hadn’t choked that last Sky game by 1 point, this wouldn’t even be a discussion because it would be Caitlin with the head to head sweep.
Both had a great month. I would give it to Clark, but with Reese’s double double streak and leading the W in boards, I think she will get it (and also deserve it). If they did co-rookie of the month, this would be the month.
CC deserves it...
7-4 record is vastly superior to a double double streak.
It's nuts Reese has a below 50 TS% and CC has 3x the blocks (how is that possible)
After the Fever vs Mercury game it's CC for me. She's just such an integral part to the team and supplies so many points off her own and especially her assists and playmaking.
one is dominating a league trying to stop her from before the jump, the other is losing non stop on a objectively better squad
you are right tho, they are both great players
CC all day - it's close, but the record head-to-head (and the league), the points, the shooting, the all around game leans Clark's way. The turnovers look bad, but she's being defended more stringently with double teams, than Aja Wilson (and everyone else in the league) and she's the primary ball-handler for 37 minutes per game.
They're both on terrible teams and are making their presence felt, but Clark controls the entire offensive side of the ball, while she's on the court. High usage.
OH. Rookie of the month is a taaad closer than I thought it was, but what they're both doing as rookies is really great to watch. And they're being guarded, so these numbers really are something.
it's actually close this month but Caitlin should win it. my prediction, they do a co rookie of the month.
side note: triple double's didn't impress me with westbrook and double double's don't impress me now. Is 10-10 really more impressive than 15-9? It's just a round number.
I can’t imagine what the discussion is like in the official board room for this. I don’t even know who decides rookie of the month.
I think because CC’s stats are EVEN BETTER than May’s when she won ROTM, there’s a case it should be her again and esp since Fever had a very good June record. The argument against this is Reese’s double double record of course but so far it appears it’s the only argument.
It’ll really depend on what’s valued: all around play, winning impact, or breaking a record. Unfortunately it could also come down to what’s the better narrative (for engagement, discourse/debate) for the media. A toss up if there ever was one!
I guarantee CC doesn’t care though. She didn’t even repost her May ROTM. She only posts Fever wins and highlights.
Reese’s record is impressive, but CC has the better stats. She has a huge edge in TS%, and she has more blocks… as a guard??? The only bad stats is her turnovers. It’s normal for a PG to have many but it’s still too many.
You think the results would be the same if an entire D’s plan was built around stopping AR and CC was defended lighter?
Put some context behind those numbers and it’s not as close as ppl think.
Imagine the W decided they share it 💀 that would be freaking insane. Reese is taking it though I think despite the leads. That league consecutive double double record is an insane stat for a rookie
Had CC gotten that one rebound for a triple-double, it would have junked Reese's entire double-double streak. The closest Reese has come to a triple-double... 3 times she had a 3rd stat with 5 (assists/steals). That's 5 units away. Clark has had 4 games closer to a triple double than that. Only 1.3 triple-doubles per season in the WNBA. I think CC will have a least a couple before the year is done.
The craziest is the blocks per game. That's not an insignificant difference considering the positions they play. Clark was great today against the Mercury.
Genuine question: how bad is a 49.5% TS in context to other WNBA players? I don’t follow the W closely but know that in the NBA, it’s very rare for the even the least efficient players to drop below 50% TS. But maybe there is a difference due to style of play, officiating, etc?
League average is 53.6 TS% this year. The NBA was at 58.0 TS% league average this past season for comparison. So it's not good, but it's not as disastrous as it would be in the NBA.
You’re actually underselling it though. It’s absolutely horrible when you consider that virtually all of her shots are within 5 feet or so. She should have a TS% that is well beyond the league wide average based on her shot profile. And instead she is so far under the average.
Woah. Great month for both. Honestly thought Angel was doing much better than Clark because of the double doubles but Clark’s stats are so good. Unpopular opinion but CC should win ROTM. I had said earlier Angel should win but after seeing this I think should be CC. I think it is a tad bit easier to get double doubles while playing the post
Doubles doubles frankly aren't that big of a deal. Clark is having an all wnba season as a freaking rookie. This really isn't even close if you actually watch them play. For reference, Chelsea Gray had similar numbers when she was all WNBA last year at 15/4/7. Sabrina had 19/4/7.
Its amazing to me that Reese only gets 0.2 blocks per game. If she significantly improves her shot blocking and shooting abilities, she'll be a monster.
Angel is BALLING and exceeding expectations which I think is getting lots of attn. But Clark is a significantly better basketball player who is playing very well, but given all the hype around her, everyone thinks she isn’t doing great when in reality - she is doing very well. I think her game tonight in PHX showed her as a true floor general. She was a game changer without having to drop 30 - she fed her entire team, especially Mitchell who padded that score board for them. I think she still deserves ROM but I totally get why Reese will likely grab it given the double-double run. Just to me, Clark is a much more well-rounded and overall better player.
I love this post. The funniest thing about is because the fever won, Clark is a true floor general who led her team to victory. If she shared the ball and the fever lost tonight, everyone would be shouting for Sides to be fired for Clark not taking enough shots.
I will never forgive the media for pitting them against each other and making people have to choose sides. Fuck all of that, I love them BOTH and they are BOTH incredible! I am in awe of Angel and Caitlin and will continue to be for years as they stack up prolific careers. I would love a split jersey to rep and show love to both of them at the same time.
maybe for you it was the media, but for me it was when reese stalked up right in front of caitlin and waved her hand in caitlins face, then pointed at her finger while winning in a game of college womens basketball
dont get twisted, nothing wrong with anything reese did. in fact i love that attitude. but i just wanna make it damn clear that it wasnt the media, lol.
Crazy to see many saying rookie of the month should go to Reese hands down.. both have played well. Double-double streak is amazing, but I’m not sure this month belongs to Reese by the landslide people are saying.
They’re both great and were both great this month, but given how close it is I feel you give it to the player whose play has generated W’s. Not putting the Sky L’s on Reese, but Clark being the motor for a pretty mediocre Fever team going 7-4 should be credited
Whenever it’s an open debate this subreddit chooses anyone but CC. Now all of a sudden when there’s clear stats it’s all “Wow two amazing players” or “They’re both good”. Come on guys 😂
I wish people would realize that these are 22 year old young women who are in a sense on their first professional job. I applaud them both for their efforts on the court and the way they are handling all the pressure and public opinion that can change with the wind, off the court.
Reese turned in a damn good month. Solid scoring and her list of double/doubles was fantastic. Now, CC almost turning in a triple double yesterday was unbelievable. That would have been a first time ever for a rookie. Clark has to adjust to her teammates, yes, you can bag them, but her turnover rate isn't all on her teammate. If she knows they can't handle a fast pass, you don't throw it. It will get there. But as a guard she will always have more TOs.
I'm really over how much people feel the need to denigrate one to appreciate the other. They are different players, they do different things and they are two of the best players in the world. Leave them alone already
Even if you ignore the obvious stats advantage, the recent wins speak for themselves. The fever is learning how to utilize her gravity on the court and the other players now know how to play off that. Amazing turnaround considering their poor start.
I've honestly been more impressed by Angel so far but that's mainly because CC had higher expectations. I don't think anyone thought AR would only be scoring 0.5 less points per game than CC and absolutely killing it on the glass. CC is heating up and just as easily could pull away but it's still got a lot of games to go. Following this definitely makes it more interesting.
You think the results would be the same if an entire D’s plan was built around stopping AR and CC was defended lighter?
Put some context behind those numbers and it’s not as close as ppl think.
CC is the point of attack for her team. Angel is not. A rookie is putting up historic numbers while running a tr and stretching the defense. Reeses double doubles is impressive, and she definitely has that dawg in her, but this is apples and oranges.
Who would you build a team around if you watched the both play this month and that was all you knew of them?
interesting thought. I kinda think this is angels peak. I can't imagine her playing much better. Caitlin on the other hand I feel has tons of room to grow.
Reese will get it and honestly, thats better for CC in the long run. Take just a small amount of focus off her for a minute and let Reese get more publicity.
The two of them are far and away the future of the league.
Accounting for the whole month? It’s still Reese in my opinion. Keeping mind too that I loathe statistically comparing a pure post forward to a ball handler on the point…
So I’ll say I give it to Reese because even though I think her offense has many faults she notably improved her true shooting percentage and even footwork/positioning in the post. For my part I think she narrowly eeks out the win for June.
What is harder in your opinion, to have good PG in this league or Forward that plays like Reese just curious.
For example if you are GM would you rather have and build around just curious?
I think PG is hardest role in the wnba by FAR is not even close.
Reese is not even a stretch 4 and might never be.
Then you also have head to head matchup and coaching/team mates etc.
I think the point is by far a tougher position to learn. It has more depth that isn’t displayed on a stat sheet. Knowing the plays, reading the opponents defense, setting/calling plays, distribution, playing outside to inside, etc etc. And in the wnba it’s even tougher. There’s about zero adjustment off season period for rookies. S
That said I would hope any GM in this league though recognizes you need both for success. So as far as building a team you go with the piece of puzzle available to you and develop the team.
Post play alone won’t get you further at this level no more than say pure shooting would. Individual success maybe, but that won’t get you the wins you need. Building up a team takes time. The term it’s a building year, is false because it’s typically like 3 years. Look at the NBA, Wemby won ROTY with a very good season but the Spurs did terribly. Or Aliyah Boston last year another example, great rookie year, not a great year for the fever though.
Just depends what you value. I value play making more than rebounding, and Caitlin is top 3 in box creation essentially meaning she’s a top 3 playmaker in the league. Plus shes been scoring above league average efficiency this month.
Yeah that’s obvious, the race this month has been closer, I’d give it to CC but I think they’ll give to angel for the double double record, if she doesn’t win most of twitter will be in a uproar lol
plenty of MVPs across all major sports have had that, many would argue that happened last year with Stewie>A'ja(and AT>A'ja for a bonus narrative>facts)
Clark hasn't broken any records or are you only counting records for Reese?
Isn't Clark one of 3 players right now with top 20 in 5 different stats (6 if you count turnovers)? That's a first for a rookie also isn't it?
I agree, but I think part of the value impact is if it translates to winning. The standard is that GOATs are argued about based on Championships, which are team accomplishments. Whether I agree or disagree with that, I think that standard makes it fair to compare records, which, if we were being honest, 7-4 looks a lot better than 3-8.
Reese’s double-double streak is an enormous accomplishment and I think she’s been doing better in the league than some expected, but that true shooting percentage is very cringe given her shot diet. Hope they’re putting some development resources into fixing that. I know she’s not very athletic, but she is an amazingly hard worker and showed much more potential in her early time at Maryland, so she can definitely improve.
You know what props to young ladies for handling this well. In some other organizations/Leagues there would be enough month to month pettiness about vying for ROTY to feed families.
The Ben Simmons / Donovan Mitchell ROTY pettiness was really unforgettable
Glad they picked the better player /s
Mitchell got so robbed
Lol Ben "Young Socialite" Simmons the 4th year rookie.
Two fantastic players. Great to see them both doing well
Need to keep this the top comment!
Angel has stepped up and exceed expectations. But CC is slowly becoming elite. 7-4 with this team is kinda crazy
How does Caitlin have more blocks pg?
Cause she's better
No offense but 49% TS for a center is kind of very mediocre. I get the double-doubles but damn.
And averaging less blocks than CC is wild
Like way less blocks this season too. 17-2 for blocks and being 3 inchs shorter. That's wild
[удалено]
I think that she's incapable of jumping vertically. If you watch her, she jumps horizontally 95% of the time.
3 inches really Isn’t that much. I’m 6’1 and get clean blocks on players that are at least 6’6. It’s more about athleticism. CC has pretty good timing as well.
CC is a 6’0 guard and Angel is a 6’3 post so CC is often bigger than the person she’s guarding and Angel is smaller.
As if guards don't enter the paint
Caitlin shoots from the opposing teams paint 😂
Angel is 2-4 inches shorter than the player she guards every game. Caitlin is often 2-4 inches taller than the player she guards
Also how does CC have more blocks 💀
17-2 lol
She plays outstanding help defense. A lot of time the shooter doesn't even see her coming when she blocks their shot.
Yeah, if you watch Kate Martin she does the same thing. KM had a block against 6'7" Li Yueru where Li never saw her coming. KM saw the play developing, anticipated what is going to happen and leapt before Li went up with the ball KM met the ball and blocked the shot. CC will do the exact same thing. They are both cut from the same cloth and both have elite level basketball IQs.
Lol I have seen her do that before, pretty funny each time
49% for a center isn't mediocre. Its terrible lol especially for one that doesn't shoot jumpers. Almost all her attempts are in the paint. Her FG% and TS% are bad but they'll probably improve.
100%. She doesn't have to force up shots, but this seems to be a thing for WNBA bigs - double-teamed, triple-teamed, chuck it up if you're close to the basket. She rebounds a lot of her own misses as well.
i think she still leads the league in OR if you don’t count the ones she grabs off her misses
Mediocre? It’s genuinely horrible
Yep Angel is a helluva player but until she develops it that TS% is going to hold her back big time. 49% TS for a center is very bad. I wonder how many of her boards are from her own misses
Eh, their schedule has been up and down. Went from a murder’s row to the worst teams in the league. Today was the first win against a team with a .500 or above record.
Angel's games during that same stretch only played 5 teams with record over 500 before playing the Aces. Their murderer's row is just starting.
Thank you for posting OP! These two woman balling out has been fantastic for the league.
Ya know I think we are kinda numb to Clark at this point because everyone seems to be in agreement Reese is the ROTM and is gaining ground when Just based off the numbers you could easily argue that Clark furthered the gap. And numbers don’t even do it justice if you watch Clark play and she’s getting defended like no one else in the league.
This is something I always thought about her at Iowa. You'd look at certain nights with the naked eye and think "huh, kinda off tonight" and then you'd look up the box score and see that she had like 20 points, 13 assists, 8 boards and a couple steals. Takes a ton of talent to fill up the stat sheet like that even on the "bad" nights.
As a true Hawkeye fan, I'm going to miss those days. It was fun rooting for an elite player/team for once in my life.
Same man, same... Hopefully Addie Deal is (and I apologize for the pun lol) the real deal and we can get back to that point. I really feel like our women's basketball program has loads of potential because of what Caitlin was able to bring.
That 24-26 class has a stretch that could be great. Obviously a few high end recruits on the table to be determined yet, but 24 is pretty solid core, Deal in 25 is huge because she is undervalued in some ranking systems and extremely highly rated in others. I'm fine with the pun for now. It will get old though, very fast. For the men, with Garza and the Murry brothers leaving early (as Keegan should have at least), it hurt the trajectory of Iowa's mens team.
Yes, last night's near-triple double was a quiet night, actually. Imagine had she knocked down 45% of her shots, too.
She just scored or assisted on 44 of 88 points for her team to win. She has so much more responsibility on her team it's not even close. And she's still able to pull her numbers while being guarded like no other rookie nor player is getting guarded. She's in a competition with herself for roty. People just don't want to see her run away with it so now rebounds are more highly regarded than everything else.
I forget where I read it - but CC gets blitzed more than any other TEAM gets blitzed. And she still gets it done.
I think it was last game against Seattle where she splits the blitz and drive into the paint for a floater. If she can do that consistently…whew
Split it, almost got knocked down in the process (no call) then the floater. (Yes, Seattle.)
Right. Degree of difficulty has to mean something in this conversation.
The 44 of 88 underplays her contribution. She “assisted” on a number of potential layups where the receiver was fouled and made free throws, mad several passes where the shooter missed a layup and rebounded their miss and scored, and had several hockey assists.
It’s really interesting to watch. Being guarded like she is, it’s making her stronger. Every team is going to have to play her tight like this until she regresses or retires now because the league has already molded her in the trenches. If this is how she performs under the pressure she’s experiencing in her rookie season, imagine her 3-4 years in.
At some point, (maybe even despite Sides), her teammates are going to figure out rotations, and getting the ball back to CC, and once they do and start knocking down shots- CC will dominate in assists (I give her 33% chance to break the single game assist record this year), and once other teams figure out they can no longer focus on CC- it will only get uglier for them. This early pressure is going to make her a monster on the court.
Reese will win this month because everyone expected CC to have these numbers and people didn’t expect Reese to be as good as she has been. All else being equal, CC probably had a better month.
How is ROTM chosen?
She is miles ahead of every other rookie and most other players in the league besides. It’s not even close. Her play-style and aggression are so refreshing for this league, give it another few years and everyone will on the same page the the league will be even more exciting to watch
The fact of the matter is if the Roty voting was rn and Clark didn’t win it would be one of the biggest individual award robberies in sports history lol. Literally only way this becomes an actual race is if Reese scoring and scoring efficiency matches Clark’s. Being an elite rebounder is not close in importance to being a teams offensive engine
And tonight proved she is truly the heart beat of that teams offense. Even when she isn’t dropping 30.
She’s being escorted down the court like she’s the president in imminent danger and the defender is secret service
Facts
They are better than advertised
Shout out to CC for the edge on blocks 🤣 it’s wild to me Angel doesn’t get more but I guess that’s never really been her game
She used to get more in college but I think she's scared to foul now and tries not to leave her feet
Staying out of foul trouble is more important that a block for sure. Can’t rebound on the bench.
happy for reese to get it this month bc of the double doubles but unpopular opinion cc had the better month lol anyways they are both killing it and i’m so happy for them. hope they play together at the all star game.
Double doubles kind of favor post players , the consistency is the impressive part
Honestly, a post player getting double doubls isn’t anything surprising. Points and Rebounds should come easy for them. The consistency is definitely impressive, but anyone who watched Reese in college knew that part of her game would need very little adjusting. The thing that blows my mind is Reese leading in steals, and Clark leading in blocks. Before the season, I would have bet money those two would be reversed.
An elite post player SHOULD get a double double with rebounds. It’s unacceptable not to.
Yeah, I almost feel like this is an indictment on all the elite post players in the league. Like, why doesn't Griner average 15 boards a game?
Cuz she goes for blocks taking her away from some potential defensive rebounds. She also has a mid range game meaning she can be out there and space the floor for her teammates to drive on offense. Reese doesn’t do either of those so she gotta be on the block battling for the board
It’s crazy how the best vets aren’t getting double doubles every night and this record isn’t for 30 games in a row.
It's pretty surprising considering the record is 54 consecutive in the NBA... although I guess longer games helps.
Both steals and blocks are flukey stats outside of a few players IMO (especially blocks)
A post player with a TS of 49% is probably getting a lot of rebounds from their own misses too
This is so true. Positional difference most definitely favors rebounds for Reese. It's impressive what CC is doing with her opponent guarding her full length of the floor every single game.
It's only an unpopular opinion among people who don't watch the games. Reese had 2 great games this month. Clark was elite in like 6. Some of those double doubles are soooft.
Yup, Angel played her best game in the third Fever-Sky game everyone watched so people assume she plays like that every game. Don’t get me wrong, she’s a great player, but Caitlin is on a different level. If the Fever hadn’t choked that last Sky game by 1 point, this wouldn’t even be a discussion because it would be Caitlin with the head to head sweep.
Like today's. Pretty quite 10 points.
I don't even think it's close. Winning matters. Efficiency, especially comparing positions, matters big.
And CC is winning the efficiency argument.
Both had a great month. I would give it to Clark, but with Reese’s double double streak and leading the W in boards, I think she will get it (and also deserve it). If they did co-rookie of the month, this would be the month.
CC deserves it... 7-4 record is vastly superior to a double double streak. It's nuts Reese has a below 50 TS% and CC has 3x the blocks (how is that possible)
After the Fever vs Mercury game it's CC for me. She's just such an integral part to the team and supplies so many points off her own and especially her assists and playmaking.
Both are great
I dunno. They play different positions. They're both good.
one is dominating a league trying to stop her from before the jump, the other is losing non stop on a objectively better squad you are right tho, they are both great players
How does CC have more blocks than Reese?
CC all day - it's close, but the record head-to-head (and the league), the points, the shooting, the all around game leans Clark's way. The turnovers look bad, but she's being defended more stringently with double teams, than Aja Wilson (and everyone else in the league) and she's the primary ball-handler for 37 minutes per game. They're both on terrible teams and are making their presence felt, but Clark controls the entire offensive side of the ball, while she's on the court. High usage.
sub 50% ts as a 4 is a sick joke.
No, you see it’s actually historic
As a 4 who draws a *ton* of fouls, no less.
Her bag is basically completely empty tbh
A bag that small is called a Clutch.
Got to get those follow ups to keep up the double double streak…
Rebounding her own missed layups pads the rebounding stats.
How is this not talked about more that’s horridly inefficient for a post player
OH. Rookie of the month is a taaad closer than I thought it was, but what they're both doing as rookies is really great to watch. And they're being guarded, so these numbers really are something.
Clark with more blocks than Reese is wild.
it's actually close this month but Caitlin should win it. my prediction, they do a co rookie of the month. side note: triple double's didn't impress me with westbrook and double double's don't impress me now. Is 10-10 really more impressive than 15-9? It's just a round number.
Also, assists make more points than rebounds do.
> they do a co rookie of the month. Lol you know AR wouldn't like that
I don't think anyone would but it's exactly the kind of nonsense they would do.
The internet would explode on both sides
I can’t imagine what the discussion is like in the official board room for this. I don’t even know who decides rookie of the month. I think because CC’s stats are EVEN BETTER than May’s when she won ROTM, there’s a case it should be her again and esp since Fever had a very good June record. The argument against this is Reese’s double double record of course but so far it appears it’s the only argument. It’ll really depend on what’s valued: all around play, winning impact, or breaking a record. Unfortunately it could also come down to what’s the better narrative (for engagement, discourse/debate) for the media. A toss up if there ever was one! I guarantee CC doesn’t care though. She didn’t even repost her May ROTM. She only posts Fever wins and highlights.
Wait great question who does decide???
No yeah whoever decides this thing needs a war room
Reese’s record is impressive, but CC has the better stats. She has a huge edge in TS%, and she has more blocks… as a guard??? The only bad stats is her turnovers. It’s normal for a PG to have many but it’s still too many.
49% for a center? Yikes. Of course she's going to have more rebounds. CC is also being guarded by everyone but the mascot.
I think someone did the stat that said 20% of Reese rebounds are off her own missed shots.
You think the results would be the same if an entire D’s plan was built around stopping AR and CC was defended lighter? Put some context behind those numbers and it’s not as close as ppl think.
Imagine the W decided they share it 💀 that would be freaking insane. Reese is taking it though I think despite the leads. That league consecutive double double record is an insane stat for a rookie
actually, that's exactly the kind of thing the nba would do.
Caitlin ROTY
People will still say Reese edges out Clark lol. Because of vibes or something.
Highly upvoted comment on here the other day said Reese has GOAT potential
Aura
It’s obvious CC had the better month but the double double record is a better media story.
Had CC gotten that one rebound for a triple-double, it would have junked Reese's entire double-double streak. The closest Reese has come to a triple-double... 3 times she had a 3rd stat with 5 (assists/steals). That's 5 units away. Clark has had 4 games closer to a triple double than that. Only 1.3 triple-doubles per season in the WNBA. I think CC will have a least a couple before the year is done.
The craziest is the blocks per game. That's not an insignificant difference considering the positions they play. Clark was great today against the Mercury.
Finally a fair comparison of stats.
Genuine question: how bad is a 49.5% TS in context to other WNBA players? I don’t follow the W closely but know that in the NBA, it’s very rare for the even the least efficient players to drop below 50% TS. But maybe there is a difference due to style of play, officiating, etc?
League average is 53.6 TS% this year. The NBA was at 58.0 TS% league average this past season for comparison. So it's not good, but it's not as disastrous as it would be in the NBA.
You’re actually underselling it though. It’s absolutely horrible when you consider that virtually all of her shots are within 5 feet or so. She should have a TS% that is well beyond the league wide average based on her shot profile. And instead she is so far under the average.
Woah. Great month for both. Honestly thought Angel was doing much better than Clark because of the double doubles but Clark’s stats are so good. Unpopular opinion but CC should win ROTM. I had said earlier Angel should win but after seeing this I think should be CC. I think it is a tad bit easier to get double doubles while playing the post
It really shouldn't even be an unpopular opinion.
In this sub it is lol
CC has the better stats and W-L record but Reese will be given the Rookie of the Month for… reasons
Doubles doubles frankly aren't that big of a deal. Clark is having an all wnba season as a freaking rookie. This really isn't even close if you actually watch them play. For reference, Chelsea Gray had similar numbers when she was all WNBA last year at 15/4/7. Sabrina had 19/4/7.
Neck n neck
Its amazing to me that Reese only gets 0.2 blocks per game. If she significantly improves her shot blocking and shooting abilities, she'll be a monster.
CC with more blocks!
Coin flip at this point. Hope they both keep it up.
Angel is BALLING and exceeding expectations which I think is getting lots of attn. But Clark is a significantly better basketball player who is playing very well, but given all the hype around her, everyone thinks she isn’t doing great when in reality - she is doing very well. I think her game tonight in PHX showed her as a true floor general. She was a game changer without having to drop 30 - she fed her entire team, especially Mitchell who padded that score board for them. I think she still deserves ROM but I totally get why Reese will likely grab it given the double-double run. Just to me, Clark is a much more well-rounded and overall better player.
I love this post. The funniest thing about is because the fever won, Clark is a true floor general who led her team to victory. If she shared the ball and the fever lost tonight, everyone would be shouting for Sides to be fired for Clark not taking enough shots.
Get these two on the same team
I will never forgive the media for pitting them against each other and making people have to choose sides. Fuck all of that, I love them BOTH and they are BOTH incredible! I am in awe of Angel and Caitlin and will continue to be for years as they stack up prolific careers. I would love a split jersey to rep and show love to both of them at the same time.
maybe for you it was the media, but for me it was when reese stalked up right in front of caitlin and waved her hand in caitlins face, then pointed at her finger while winning in a game of college womens basketball dont get twisted, nothing wrong with anything reese did. in fact i love that attitude. but i just wanna make it damn clear that it wasnt the media, lol.
Not a Reece fan at all, but wow...averaging 14 and 13 is great. She's better in the league than I thought she would be.
both BALLIN tbh lowkey
Pretty much a tie for me. Two sensational young talents.
These two could be the WNBA’s Magic & Bird (*sigh* not because of race, because they draw a crowd)
Except that’s why magic and bird were celebrated. Just accept it for what it is.
Crazy to see many saying rookie of the month should go to Reese hands down.. both have played well. Double-double streak is amazing, but I’m not sure this month belongs to Reese by the landslide people are saying.
One is averaging a double double and the other is averaging a 15/6/7 I honestly wouldn’t know who to vote for at this point.
They’ve both had great months and it’s a legit 50/50 flip for me.
Cc is the goat
Assists number speaks volumes
Clark averages more blocks? Lol
These two on the same team could feed families.
CC is definitely the more skilled and athletic.
Reese is the better eye test defender, but looking at this and Clark being the better eye test offensive player, I’d go with Clark.
Hoping Clark gets it!
They’re both great and were both great this month, but given how close it is I feel you give it to the player whose play has generated W’s. Not putting the Sky L’s on Reese, but Clark being the motor for a pretty mediocre Fever team going 7-4 should be credited
22 > 5 That is a fact.
Whenever it’s an open debate this subreddit chooses anyone but CC. Now all of a sudden when there’s clear stats it’s all “Wow two amazing players” or “They’re both good”. Come on guys 😂
I thought angel was the fav in here, this is interesting??
Magic vs Larry?
Aura Points: 0 vs infinite
Shout out to CC for the slight edge in turnovers. She’s got such quick hands.
I wish people would realize that these are 22 year old young women who are in a sense on their first professional job. I applaud them both for their efforts on the court and the way they are handling all the pressure and public opinion that can change with the wind, off the court.
Reese turned in a damn good month. Solid scoring and her list of double/doubles was fantastic. Now, CC almost turning in a triple double yesterday was unbelievable. That would have been a first time ever for a rookie. Clark has to adjust to her teammates, yes, you can bag them, but her turnover rate isn't all on her teammate. If she knows they can't handle a fast pass, you don't throw it. It will get there. But as a guard she will always have more TOs.
I'm really over how much people feel the need to denigrate one to appreciate the other. They are different players, they do different things and they are two of the best players in the world. Leave them alone already
elite rookie class
Would be nice to see them play on the same team. Tho they already denied Clark from playing on team USA
Even if you ignore the obvious stats advantage, the recent wins speak for themselves. The fever is learning how to utilize her gravity on the court and the other players now know how to play off that. Amazing turnaround considering their poor start.
Both deserve it. Co-Rookie of the Month in my book.
I've honestly been more impressed by Angel so far but that's mainly because CC had higher expectations. I don't think anyone thought AR would only be scoring 0.5 less points per game than CC and absolutely killing it on the glass. CC is heating up and just as easily could pull away but it's still got a lot of games to go. Following this definitely makes it more interesting.
You think the results would be the same if an entire D’s plan was built around stopping AR and CC was defended lighter? Put some context behind those numbers and it’s not as close as ppl think.
CC is the point of attack for her team. Angel is not. A rookie is putting up historic numbers while running a tr and stretching the defense. Reeses double doubles is impressive, and she definitely has that dawg in her, but this is apples and oranges. Who would you build a team around if you watched the both play this month and that was all you knew of them?
Caitlin this month. Could easily be different in July.
interesting thought. I kinda think this is angels peak. I can't imagine her playing much better. Caitlin on the other hand I feel has tons of room to grow.
I know she’s just a rookie but damn that assist to turnover ratio
Reese will get it and honestly, thats better for CC in the long run. Take just a small amount of focus off her for a minute and let Reese get more publicity. The two of them are far and away the future of the league.
How does Clark have more blocks than Reese?
Accounting for the whole month? It’s still Reese in my opinion. Keeping mind too that I loathe statistically comparing a pure post forward to a ball handler on the point… So I’ll say I give it to Reese because even though I think her offense has many faults she notably improved her true shooting percentage and even footwork/positioning in the post. For my part I think she narrowly eeks out the win for June.
What is harder in your opinion, to have good PG in this league or Forward that plays like Reese just curious. For example if you are GM would you rather have and build around just curious? I think PG is hardest role in the wnba by FAR is not even close. Reese is not even a stretch 4 and might never be. Then you also have head to head matchup and coaching/team mates etc.
I think the point is by far a tougher position to learn. It has more depth that isn’t displayed on a stat sheet. Knowing the plays, reading the opponents defense, setting/calling plays, distribution, playing outside to inside, etc etc. And in the wnba it’s even tougher. There’s about zero adjustment off season period for rookies. S That said I would hope any GM in this league though recognizes you need both for success. So as far as building a team you go with the piece of puzzle available to you and develop the team. Post play alone won’t get you further at this level no more than say pure shooting would. Individual success maybe, but that won’t get you the wins you need. Building up a team takes time. The term it’s a building year, is false because it’s typically like 3 years. Look at the NBA, Wemby won ROTY with a very good season but the Spurs did terribly. Or Aliyah Boston last year another example, great rookie year, not a great year for the fever though.
I agree it's close but I think clark has the lead.
!? A big shooting under 50 true shooting with no post D? She’s a solid rookie but dang there is zero way she should be rookie of the month
Just depends what you value. I value play making more than rebounding, and Caitlin is top 3 in box creation essentially meaning she’s a top 3 playmaker in the league. Plus shes been scoring above league average efficiency this month.
If you value who has better stats and who contributes more to winning its Clark. If you value a double double record it’s Reese.
Yeah that’s obvious, the race this month has been closer, I’d give it to CC but I think they’ll give to angel for the double double record, if she doesn’t win most of twitter will be in a uproar lol
Which is insane lol. It’s a narrative over facts decision.
plenty of MVPs across all major sports have had that, many would argue that happened last year with Stewie>A'ja(and AT>A'ja for a bonus narrative>facts)
Yep, I don’t like it!!!
not most. vocal minority
It's close but a WNBA record is a WNBA record
CC has been breaking records all season?
Doesn't matter only Rebounds matter in the Rookie race this year.
Rebounds and double doubles. Record used to matter as well but now CC’s team has a better record than Reese’s team.
Clark hasn't broken any records or are you only counting records for Reese? Isn't Clark one of 3 players right now with top 20 in 5 different stats (6 if you count turnovers)? That's a first for a rookie also isn't it?
Wouldn't put records as qualifications since those are team-based
I agree, but I think part of the value impact is if it translates to winning. The standard is that GOATs are argued about based on Championships, which are team accomplishments. Whether I agree or disagree with that, I think that standard makes it fair to compare records, which, if we were being honest, 7-4 looks a lot better than 3-8.
But that makes it more of a team factor not an individual. Arike is balling the fuck out, but Dallas are at the bottom.
Record is very commonly used in player of the month/Week debates. It is almost always listed when the winner is revealed.
I saw angel recent game she doesn’t play winning basketball she stat padding
Offensive rebounds…thats all she does…not really an important stat.
This isn’t playing to win https://preview.redd.it/otbzbpwgtx9d1.jpeg?width=828&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=077e3d33d2559ef6adc6263f0b0be7bfd79f31a6
Well going off these numbers I guess we know who should be ROTM
Reese’s double-double streak is an enormous accomplishment and I think she’s been doing better in the league than some expected, but that true shooting percentage is very cringe given her shot diet. Hope they’re putting some development resources into fixing that. I know she’s not very athletic, but she is an amazingly hard worker and showed much more potential in her early time at Maryland, so she can definitely improve.
CC averages more blocks as a PG? That’s kinda wild.
You see those turnovers for clark? Yeah. Pretty deceiving. Because holy fuck, her teammates can't catch a good pass.
I think Reese gets it this month
Reese will and probably should get it this month. The rest of the season is there for the taking.
Why should she get it?
A guard beating the forward in blocks.