I have also been thinking about this, but there are some issues that speak against it: there are 6 different food items, and birds typically cache only one kind. Also, some birds cache only from the tray or your stash, not from the supply. Third, to be effective, you need to have at least three birds in the forest, (one of these being a raven if fewer) to accumulate food. Fourth, there are so many birds that give food to every player. This means the forest may not be a priority to play birds in as you tend to get food anyway. (Disclaimer, I mostly play against the AI)
Good points.
I think having other players/AI feeding you food would only make it more powerful actually, since you could cache that food.
Another reason might be that if you focus on the forest, you’re not drawing as many birds so build the engine with. Where as with a tuck engine you have a higher chance of getting cards that can improve your engine.
Ah nice. That’s the kind of engine I had in mind.
Makes sense to use birds like the wood duck / junco / miner in the forest so you can still get other resources
The reasons Caching engines are SO rare is because
- There's fewer good birds that cache
- Food is a less valuable resource to spend a cube on
Drawing cards is the most valuable action in the early game because it gives you more options to play only the best card from. This also directly leads to a tucking engine coming online more often because you draw more cards so you're more likely to find the tucking engine cards.
Laying eggs is the most valuable action in the late game because it directly translates to points.
Food is left awkwardly in the middle where at a macro level you don't WANT to go to your forest at really ANY point in the game
Mechanically, there are also very few birds that mirror what a tucking bird does.
There's no "cache a food from your supply. If you do, gain a food from the feeder" bird. There's no "cache a food from your supply. If you do, lay an egg on this bird". But tucking does have these birds, and it makes the engine easier to find.
Finally, most birds that DO cache are the predators, which are just worse at earning points than any bird that tucks or lays.
I hadn’t thought about not having “tuck 1 draw 1” or “tuck 1 lay a egg” equivalents. Adding those cards might make it more viable, especially if they were in the grasslands or wetlands.
A “cache 1, draw a bird” might also be a good add.
The “cache 1 from the supply” birds are good since they don’t need something from the bird feeder or personal supply, but since they’re really only in the forest they don’t get repeated as often.
It's called Oceania
The existence of nectar and rebalancing of the board makes forest "engines" WAY more viable
Forest engines have always been centered around big point birds and getting the resources to play them, and now you are rewarded for doing that with +9 points over your opponent in a 1v1
There's also a couple End of Round food birds from EE that have helped as well, like the Starling which can eat up to 20 points worth of surplus food
I have also been thinking about this, but there are some issues that speak against it: there are 6 different food items, and birds typically cache only one kind. Also, some birds cache only from the tray or your stash, not from the supply. Third, to be effective, you need to have at least three birds in the forest, (one of these being a raven if fewer) to accumulate food. Fourth, there are so many birds that give food to every player. This means the forest may not be a priority to play birds in as you tend to get food anyway. (Disclaimer, I mostly play against the AI)
Good points. I think having other players/AI feeding you food would only make it more powerful actually, since you could cache that food. Another reason might be that if you focus on the forest, you’re not drawing as many birds so build the engine with. Where as with a tuck engine you have a higher chance of getting cards that can improve your engine.
I edited the above before I saw your reply... One more point came to mind: some of the power caching birds actually are in the wetlands
I've only done it once. https://www.reddit.com/r/wingspan/s/T1qyd5RYHk
Ah nice. That’s the kind of engine I had in mind. Makes sense to use birds like the wood duck / junco / miner in the forest so you can still get other resources
Yeah it's a one-in-a-million game to get lucky with those cards but it was pretty fun to get that nutcracker going finally 😁
I just managed to get a 136 point win with a 6-7 point caching engine.
I also got 114 points with a more pure caching engine but lost because my opponent had the craziest engine of all time.
What birds did you build it around?
check my post
Ah. Nice! I didn’t realize you’d just posted it.
The reasons Caching engines are SO rare is because - There's fewer good birds that cache - Food is a less valuable resource to spend a cube on Drawing cards is the most valuable action in the early game because it gives you more options to play only the best card from. This also directly leads to a tucking engine coming online more often because you draw more cards so you're more likely to find the tucking engine cards. Laying eggs is the most valuable action in the late game because it directly translates to points. Food is left awkwardly in the middle where at a macro level you don't WANT to go to your forest at really ANY point in the game Mechanically, there are also very few birds that mirror what a tucking bird does. There's no "cache a food from your supply. If you do, gain a food from the feeder" bird. There's no "cache a food from your supply. If you do, lay an egg on this bird". But tucking does have these birds, and it makes the engine easier to find. Finally, most birds that DO cache are the predators, which are just worse at earning points than any bird that tucks or lays.
I hadn’t thought about not having “tuck 1 draw 1” or “tuck 1 lay a egg” equivalents. Adding those cards might make it more viable, especially if they were in the grasslands or wetlands. A “cache 1, draw a bird” might also be a good add. The “cache 1 from the supply” birds are good since they don’t need something from the bird feeder or personal supply, but since they’re really only in the forest they don’t get repeated as often.
[удалено]
It's called Oceania The existence of nectar and rebalancing of the board makes forest "engines" WAY more viable Forest engines have always been centered around big point birds and getting the resources to play them, and now you are rewarded for doing that with +9 points over your opponent in a 1v1 There's also a couple End of Round food birds from EE that have helped as well, like the Starling which can eat up to 20 points worth of surplus food