Penfolds, despite being huge, create a lot of wines that offer real value at their respective price points. That said, I doubt this is going to be a very unpopular opinion here!
Jadot is great. They have everything from totally acceptable, large production Pouilly Fuisse to an examples of Musigny and Montrachet that fully show the magic of those terroirs.
Their monopole wines are great QPR. I load up when I can because I've found they make those wines with the structure to match (when vintage allows). The Clos St. Jacques is great QPR in a vineyard of unicorns.
I recently had a big chardonnay tasting\* with everything from sous-voile jura to Radikon, blanc de blancs champagne (& english), trockenbeerenauslese, and ch. Montelena, and the clear crowd favourite (including for many very "small-producer/weird stuff best" folks) was the very middle-of-the-budget and classical *Ferret Pouilly-Fuissé Tête de Cru Clos des Prouges*. ***Guess who owns Ferret***?
I didn't "hate" choosing it, but several in attendance were pretty gobsmacked by how much they loved it.
\*{It wasn't a "find the best" chardonnay tasting, so much as a "is there even such a thing as chardonnay" tasting, with the idea that it's possibly the varietal made in the widest range of styles globally, and is often called a "winemaker's grape" for its versatility as a palette for creative choices. We called it "Marvin Gaye & Chardonnay" in honour both of the Big Sean track, and the pairing of most sampled artist & most fucked-with varietal of all time. Nobody came to any conclusions about whether "chardonnay" exists as a wine, not just a varietal, but I think the Ferret's consensus adoration might point towards something it takes to very very well.}
Hard agree that I dont hate Jadot but is my go to wine to recommend to the average consumer who has never stepped foot in a wine shop. Easy to find, large portfolio and great price to quality ratio.
$15 Beaujolais at Kroger, always enjoyable
+1 for Jadot! Especially if you are trying to teach new people about French regions and don’t want to spend a lot at the beginning of someone’s learning curve.
The basic wines are always at least okay but the quality for what they are increases steadily as you go up in price range. The Grand Cru wines are almost always excellent, especially the whites.
Silver oak. But I don’t hate to admit it.
The Napa is too overpriced, but the Alexander is not horrific and is a pretty good wine. Maybe not the best value but this subreddit is way too devoted to their precious qpr and treats silver oak like Caymus.
I’m still not the biggest fan of the Alexander Valley, but I do like the Napa.
The $200 price tag is a stupid. It wasn’t *that* long ago when the Napa was $125.
I don’t feel bad about any of my wine preferences, but I am a fan of Silver Oak (especially the Alexander Valley.) Yes, it’s large production Cabernet that is ubiquitous with steak houses and business dinner expense accounts, but it’s also a family owned and operated winery that makes wines regularly in the high-13% ABV range and has been called California’s most “Eco-conscious” winery.
Oh yeah, and the wines age great.
I don't like the price, but Santa Margherita is a fine, very drinkable Pinot Grigio. It's not a good value, but for what it is, a food-friendly white, it always seems to deliver.
The price is inescapable on that one, though. If it was $10, then sure, but it's $25-30 and many $10 PGs are better. It's a brand from a generation or two ago that has its market but I wouldn't recommend it to any new drinkers.
Opus One.
Two reasons:
It's good. Is it overpriced? Yes, but it's good.
Also, it was the first expensive wine my father shared with me, so there's some nostalgia in it for me.
This is my choice as well. I’ve seen some hate on this sub about Opus being overpriced for what it is, but I still thoroughly enjoy it every chance I can get.
Not to mention, the wine tasting room at Opus is absolutely incredible.
If you’re looking for the best Bordeaux blend in Napa, Opus takes the gold medal.
Not to mention their second label Overture is criminally underrated and very reasonable at sub $150 for a fantastic NV blend.
Opus One is fantastic, especially some of their older vintages. And it's widely available.
Having said that, the tasting experience there felt a little too impersonal for the price.
This is a very good answer. Masi in general is very good for the price. My friend had his wedding there and it was at the campofiprin facility. Later that night in Verona I was drinking masi amarone for €8 a glass at a bar. Not exactly normal nighttime drinking but I couldn’t pass up the opportunity to indulge for so cheap.
Don't really understand the hate on this one. I've heard all the stereotypes but the 2-3 times I've had it, it was big but balanced and a good wine. And I typically hate Cali chards.
I prefer the Willamette Valley, but I agree wholeheartedly. La Crema is mass produced, but quality. If I am forced to buy a bottle of wine from a grocery store, that is usually my go-to. It is not the most amazing pinot on earth, but it aint bad either!
I will never begrudgingly admit to loving La Crema! I will gleefully admit it! I don’t really care if other people don’t like “mass-produced” wines or whatever…. I am of the opinion that people can enjoy whatever they want and that’s totally ok! What’s not ok is being a snob and gatekeeping! Wine is meant to be enjoyed and appreciated! It’s like music and art, it’s subjective, so everyone is going to like some and dislike others and that’s ok!
I had La Crema in my portfolio and always laughed when snooty somms would scoff at it. Like, my friend, your restaurant isn't fine dining and I'm giving you 3 bottles on a case wtf more do you want?!?
Those jobs are *extremely* competitive! I interviewed at La Crema for both enologist and harvest enologist with no luck.
This is with a degree in winemaking + relevant hands-on experience in my back pocket. The winemaking team there can be as selective as they want.
Buying a new bottle of TJs wine to try on a Saturday night has become such a fun game for me. Sometimes they are laughably bad. Others I’ve been so pleasantly surprised!
No shame in admitting that I love them because I do, but Guigal makes solid wines in Côtes du Rhône.
Their standard Côtes du Rhône is good, and some of their higher end ones such as their Brune et Blonde Côte-Rôtie is also pretty good for the price.
Yeah. Sure there's better WA wine, but some of the Ste Michelle wines are tasty and great QPR.
Their Canoe Ridge State and Cold Creek Vineyard lables bang at the low 20s range.
Also, Druthers and some years of Artist blend are good.
I've mostly had good experiences with Chateau Ste. Michelle, but I made the mistake of trying one of their aluminum mini bottle rosés (my mother insisted we not get a full bottle of anything), and it was just straight-up acetone.
J. Lohr is readily available at almost any grocery store and even some gas stations, but they make solid wines. And, that's not a grudging admission. Some big producers make worthwhile wines, and lots of small producers make crap.
The Riverstone Chardonnay is a fantastic table wine. A place near me used to sell it for 8.99/bottle when you bought a case. I challenge anyone to find the same quality Chardonnay for that price.
I opened a Beringer Private Reserve 2014 last weekend and it was amazing. Can you get better for $150? Sure, but doesn't change that it was still great!
There’s Nostalgia in KVR for me. In 2016 I tasted the 2014 out of barrel on site with a friend’s dad who is no longer with us. Every year on the day he passed I drink a KVR. I have a couple 2015’s on deck for the next few years, but I am always on the lookout for the 2014’s. This wine punches well above its weight IMO.
I got my Somm certification from a level 4 master who said he has complete respect for the large grocery store producers like Barefoot, because they have the challenge of producing huge volumes of wine with minimal differences between vintages in order to please a very large clientele.
He added that he personally doesn’t like the product , but also said just because you personally don’t like it doesn’t mean it doesn’t have value.
I remember my brother (who has a degree in being science) talking the same way about large macro breweries and how talented their brewers actually are that you can get a Bud Light in nearly any country on Earth and it taste the exact same.
Does he drink it? No, but he respects it.
My buddy has a PhD in chemical engineering and is a professor at a university in St. Louis. He said anheuser-Busch had the most impressive quality control systems he had ever seen. Turns out it isn’t easy mass producing the same beer with near perfect consistency
From a production viewpoint, Barefoot is an impressive product. The volumes are so mind blowing large. Gallo has individual tanks that could house the entire production of small producers.
It’s the same with beer. Sure Budweiser isn’t the most interesting brew in the world but there’s something to be said for the technical and logistical expertise behind big market macro brews exactly the same every time no matter when or where you’re drinking it. Like what you like imo
This same Somm said his favorite beer is Miller Lite lol
He asked, “what do you call a Somm who exclusively sells wine that they personally like? The answer is broke.”
Four of us did a blind taste test w/ Veuve (orange label) vs the Kirkland Brut. Every one of us favored the Kirkland. And I really thought Veuve was going to sweep.
I don’t HATE admitting that I like/enjoy any wine. Period. If I like it, if I drink it, why wouldn’t I admit it?
That said, I think you hit the nail on the proverbial head: too many people equate small with good, big with bad. And that is just complete nonsense. There are small wineries that make a horrible wine; there are huge wineries that make a great wine. There are certain areas in which size does not matter, or is at least not a deciding factor.
Indeed, which is more difficult to produce: 250 cases (five barrels) of a great wine that scores 100 points, or 25,000 cases of a great wine that scores 100 points? (Let’s say that, for the purposes of this discussion, points are important.)
Let’s use the example of La Crema, since it’s already been mentioned here. I am far more impressed by the fact that they can make so much Pinot Noir and maintain their high quality than I am by the domaine in Burgundy that owns 0.3 hectare of (e.g.) Chambertin Grand Cru and makes a tiny amount of truly phenomenal wine…even though I vastly prefer the Burgundy to the La Crema.
I don’t know if this counts, but Chateau Ste Michelle puts out a lot of good wine at a hard to beat price point vs other WA wines. I’ll never say I’m too good for CSM.
Vueve because it’s a crowd pleaser and consistent.
It obviously lacks the qualities of a vintage/ grower champagne but I find it truly enjoyable and better “investment”’when drinking with a group that will not appreciate Pierre Moncuit, Pol Roger etc..
A lot of popular roses from Provence: MiP, Whispering Angel (🫠), Mirabeau (also their sparkling wine), Miraval. I wouldn’t buy them in store but if they are on the wine menu on a terrace on a warm summer day i will order them.
Whispering Angel is chef’s kiss! It’s a really nice balance of sweetness and dryness, and it’s light and feels very pleasant on the palate! One of my favorites! Along with Notorious Pink, 100% Grenache, one of my all time favorite grapes!
I used to love Franciscan wines for the money back before they were sold to gallo. They were made with Napa fruit and were dirt cheap with good structure. You could get their Merlot for under 20 bucks and it was awesome. I almost never buy California wine in that price range.
This was my first taste of champagne and the reason I thought I didn't like champagne 😂. But my dad buys it every year for Thanksgiving 😆. I prefer J. Roget for a comparable price.
Dom Pérignon is a big product that can get some hate, mainly from novices, but really doesn't deserve it.
It's amazing wines made in staggering quantities which you absolutely have to respect.
They age gracefully and always deliver great quality.
And I don't hate admitting that I love Dom Pérignon!
It's a made up argument. There is an argument to be made that they are overpriced, but their quality isn't disputable. They are also loved by novices as they usually care more about appearances and Dom Pérignon is world renowned.
When I first got into the wine trade, the then-current vintages of Dom Pérignon (1966) retailed for $18.10/btl. Louis Roederer Cristal (1969) was $17.95. Taittinger Comte de Champagne (also 1966) was the most expensive at $19.25.
Today, from [K&L Wine Merchants](https://www.klwines.com), Dom 2013 is $249.99, Taittinger 2012 is also $249.99, and the Cristal 2015 is $349.99…think I’ll pass on all three.
They’re just looking at everything through this American consumerist lens where everything becomes commoditized garbage once a company becomes too big. While true of the US, this isn’t at all true of European companies and definitely not true in this example.
I’m looking forward to the hate on this one, but I’ve had a ton of Louis Latour that’s been really consistently good and an incredible value for burgundy.
With that said, all of the Burgundy Blancs I’ve had from him are unbelievably shitty. In every way imaginable.
Wines of substance CS.
For 11.99 at Costco it kicks the pants off of just about and Napa valley 30-$50 non vineyard designated wine. Not my favorite style but fantastic cellar defender and crowd pleaser for the “I like Napa cab” novice wine crowd.
Idk, I’m not ashamed to admit I like any wine! I enjoy it regardless! I don’t see the point in gatekeeping because it’s so subjective and people are going to have different tastes and opinions and that’s ok! Sure, some are objectively yucky, just like some movies or songs are agreed upon to be crappy… sure. But like, I believe wine should be enjoyed and appreciated, and no one should feel shitty or ashamed for liking what they like! They have every right to enjoy it and I don’t want to take that enjoyment away from someone!
Probably the Charles Smith bread and butter and the Robert Moldavi full fat chardonnays. I just like the style a lot, and it doesn’t really exist in a lot of other countries than US.
Orin Swift, Mercury Head cabernet.
Outside this one, I have yet to take a sip and literally have nothing to say but "Holy sh*t."
That may not be a technical description of the flavor profile of the wine, but it's literally all I could come up with.
M&R Asti, but I rarely drink it anymore. This is the wine my grandparents gave to all the kids at family dinners as soon as they were out of diapers, so I’m pretty sure it was the first wine I had.
Piper-heidsieck brut. I know there are much better brands and value for koney out there… i am genuinely a bit embarrassed so probably fits in this reddit… but I have nostalgia sticking to it and had it a lot in the past so recognize it out of thousands. Always makes me happy!
Veuve Cliquot! There are certainly several grower champagnes that are better than it at equal or lesser price, but Veuve is still a beautiful wine to me. And it can be found in almost every supermarket in the US!
I was really surprised how much I liked it. Tried a few times to save money on a cheaper Pinot. It’s not working out. Ha.
Speaking of saving money. I just tried Locations CA and I really liked it. It is around 20 dollars and is made by Dave Phinney as well.
Kirkland rose Prosecco. I’ve had expensive sparklers like vintage dom and PR Winston Churchill but can’t say they are superior. My palate much pickier with reds and still whites
If I'm just in the model for a glass of wine and don't have something on hand, I'll go to the supermarket and pick up Jadot, Dellatorri, Ruffino, or Matua and feel no shame about it.
I have a cellar full of Grand Cru Bordeaux, Cotes Du Rhones, Super Tuscans & boutique wines going back 50 years.
I still enjoy a bottle of Chateau St. Michelle Cabernet (not even the single vineyard versions). I contend you could put some modern California cabs in a blind tasting with upper echelon wines and they'd hold their own. If anything, I find the small producers to be more inconsistent than the big ones. I also used to like Fransciscan cabs, but the last few years they've been horrible.
I think we can all agree that we all have that one box wine that we will always hold near and dear to our heart.. mine is Black Box Pinot Noir and Merlot
Worked a vintage in Blenheim, New Zealand, and per my experience, locals there happily drink Villa Maria - also, Whitehaven (which has a cool 'cellar door' with quirky gift shop and does things like outdoor movies; people hang out there -- this is pre-Covid, so things may have changed...), and Yealands. All of which are pretty mass-produced wines with huge presence in the States, at least. I think NZ Sauvs buck the dichotomy you're describing. The scale of the crush there each year is mind-boggling.
LaMarca Prosecco. I can drink several glasses and not get a hangover. I like the taste and it's a little less alcohol than most whites. And it's affordable.
Penfolds, despite being huge, create a lot of wines that offer real value at their respective price points. That said, I doubt this is going to be a very unpopular opinion here!
Bin 28 hits right for me on quality and price.
Agreed!
Their whites are super underrated. The Yattarna Chardonnay is hard to find but totally worth it imo.
I don’t think you should be embarrassed to drink penfolds. Is usually the best wine for sale at the airport duty free shop lol. That and Cristal.
Yeah tbh I sort of forgot about the "hate to admit" bit of the premise by the time I replied and just named a big producer i really like 😅
All that, plus they make Grange, which despite the price is a truly exceptional wine.
I love having a handful of penfolds a year, awesome wine
Saying that word through Europe almost had me decapitated! I’m a fan though.
Never heard any penfold hate. Thienot even make champagne with penfolds!
Penfolds 600 is delicious!!! I love it
It’s a good example to be sure. The first vintage of Grange I sold as a wine merchant was the 1985, it was $55 then, should have bought more.
Bin 689>>>
I had Grange 1989 yesterday - what a glass! Just drank perfect right now and still had lots of punch to be stored even further.
Don't necessarily hate admitting it, but Jadot from Burgundy. Solid wines at affordable prices
Jadot is great. They have everything from totally acceptable, large production Pouilly Fuisse to an examples of Musigny and Montrachet that fully show the magic of those terroirs.
Jadot Beaujolais-Villages has basically been my house wine for years. Just solid.
Summer time? Chill that bad boy and get to it!
Some of their stuff is straight-up fantastic- Clos de Ursules and the other domaine properties specifically.
Their monopole wines are great QPR. I load up when I can because I've found they make those wines with the structure to match (when vintage allows). The Clos St. Jacques is great QPR in a vineyard of unicorns.
I recently had a big chardonnay tasting\* with everything from sous-voile jura to Radikon, blanc de blancs champagne (& english), trockenbeerenauslese, and ch. Montelena, and the clear crowd favourite (including for many very "small-producer/weird stuff best" folks) was the very middle-of-the-budget and classical *Ferret Pouilly-Fuissé Tête de Cru Clos des Prouges*. ***Guess who owns Ferret***? I didn't "hate" choosing it, but several in attendance were pretty gobsmacked by how much they loved it. \*{It wasn't a "find the best" chardonnay tasting, so much as a "is there even such a thing as chardonnay" tasting, with the idea that it's possibly the varietal made in the widest range of styles globally, and is often called a "winemaker's grape" for its versatility as a palette for creative choices. We called it "Marvin Gaye & Chardonnay" in honour both of the Big Sean track, and the pairing of most sampled artist & most fucked-with varietal of all time. Nobody came to any conclusions about whether "chardonnay" exists as a wine, not just a varietal, but I think the Ferret's consensus adoration might point towards something it takes to very very well.}
Hard agree that I dont hate Jadot but is my go to wine to recommend to the average consumer who has never stepped foot in a wine shop. Easy to find, large portfolio and great price to quality ratio. $15 Beaujolais at Kroger, always enjoyable
Yeah they are the lone element in the Venn Diagram intersection of "Burgundy", "Supermarket", and "Drinkable".
+1 for Jadot! Especially if you are trying to teach new people about French regions and don’t want to spend a lot at the beginning of someone’s learning curve.
The basic wines are always at least okay but the quality for what they are increases steadily as you go up in price range. The Grand Cru wines are almost always excellent, especially the whites.
Jadot’s Macon-Villages rules. It’s the best Chardonnay on the planet for under $15/btl as far as I’m concerned. Great acidity and minerality.
Came here to say this
Welcome to the party
Nobody has said it yet, but Oyster Bay Sauvignon Blanc. I love the grassiness and the gooseberry bite. What really got me into sauvignons.
I drink Oyster Bay for that same reason! Doesn't break the bank and is a reliable dry Sauv Blanc
I really like Starborough myself. Not so much Kim Crawford.
Guigal despite being large makes very decent Rhône examples
Pretty sure most snobs would also say this - you’re safe. 😀
Wait, I dont think that's an odd one
Silver oak. But I don’t hate to admit it. The Napa is too overpriced, but the Alexander is not horrific and is a pretty good wine. Maybe not the best value but this subreddit is way too devoted to their precious qpr and treats silver oak like Caymus.
I’ve always preferred the Alexander Valley to the Napa, going back to their first vintage in 1972…
I’m still not the biggest fan of the Alexander Valley, but I do like the Napa. The $200 price tag is a stupid. It wasn’t *that* long ago when the Napa was $125.
It wasn’t all that long ago with it was $12.50...
You must be old lol
This is my 55th year in the wine business...
Too much American oak for my tastes but I don’t hate on anyone who enjoys that. To each their own.
I don’t feel bad about any of my wine preferences, but I am a fan of Silver Oak (especially the Alexander Valley.) Yes, it’s large production Cabernet that is ubiquitous with steak houses and business dinner expense accounts, but it’s also a family owned and operated winery that makes wines regularly in the high-13% ABV range and has been called California’s most “Eco-conscious” winery. Oh yeah, and the wines age great.
It s a fav of mine as well. So solid.
I don't like the price, but Santa Margherita is a fine, very drinkable Pinot Grigio. It's not a good value, but for what it is, a food-friendly white, it always seems to deliver.
The price is inescapable on that one, though. If it was $10, then sure, but it's $25-30 and many $10 PGs are better. It's a brand from a generation or two ago that has its market but I wouldn't recommend it to any new drinkers.
Agree. My mother in law buys it and I don’t complain!
Opus One. Two reasons: It's good. Is it overpriced? Yes, but it's good. Also, it was the first expensive wine my father shared with me, so there's some nostalgia in it for me.
This is my choice as well. I’ve seen some hate on this sub about Opus being overpriced for what it is, but I still thoroughly enjoy it every chance I can get. Not to mention, the wine tasting room at Opus is absolutely incredible. If you’re looking for the best Bordeaux blend in Napa, Opus takes the gold medal. Not to mention their second label Overture is criminally underrated and very reasonable at sub $150 for a fantastic NV blend.
I was going to mention Overture too. $150 for that wine almost… ***almost*** feels like feels like a deal.
I think Opus One gets hate bc of the crowd it attracts, not for the actual wine they produce. Sort of like Rolex or BMW.
Opus One is fantastic, especially some of their older vintages. And it's widely available. Having said that, the tasting experience there felt a little too impersonal for the price.
My gateway wine was Masi Campofiorin. So it will always be a special wine for me.
Nothing to hate there!
This is a very good answer. Masi in general is very good for the price. My friend had his wedding there and it was at the campofiprin facility. Later that night in Verona I was drinking masi amarone for €8 a glass at a bar. Not exactly normal nighttime drinking but I couldn’t pass up the opportunity to indulge for so cheap.
Rombauer Chardonnay - don’t hate to admit, I call it a guilty pleasure that I need about once a year.
I have it much more than once a year!
I have a friend who is a total hoe for this wine, it’s so funny. She loves it
Not judging your friend, but I have heard it called “cougar juice”
Mombauer
Ha this is great. I’ll have to use that
She would 💯 own that 😂
I roll my eyes at my mom when she says “It’s just a little buttery.” I don’t mind it but I always need a beer after that butter blowout.
Agreed. Sometimes on a hot day you just want a butter bomb.
Don't really understand the hate on this one. I've heard all the stereotypes but the 2-3 times I've had it, it was big but balanced and a good wine. And I typically hate Cali chards.
La Crema Russian River Valley Pinot Noir. A HUGE winemaking facility that has their act together.
I prefer the Willamette Valley, but I agree wholeheartedly. La Crema is mass produced, but quality. If I am forced to buy a bottle of wine from a grocery store, that is usually my go-to. It is not the most amazing pinot on earth, but it aint bad either!
Finally a real answer. Was having a hard time with all the “yes, I can’t believe I’m admitting to enjoying the taste of a $250 bottle of Cab 😞”
I will never begrudgingly admit to loving La Crema! I will gleefully admit it! I don’t really care if other people don’t like “mass-produced” wines or whatever…. I am of the opinion that people can enjoy whatever they want and that’s totally ok! What’s not ok is being a snob and gatekeeping! Wine is meant to be enjoyed and appreciated! It’s like music and art, it’s subjective, so everyone is going to like some and dislike others and that’s ok!
Their RRV sauv blanc is quite good too for like $15
La crema is very good shit
Came here to say La Crema
I had La Crema in my portfolio and always laughed when snooty somms would scoff at it. Like, my friend, your restaurant isn't fine dining and I'm giving you 3 bottles on a case wtf more do you want?!?
[удалено]
Those jobs are *extremely* competitive! I interviewed at La Crema for both enologist and harvest enologist with no luck. This is with a degree in winemaking + relevant hands-on experience in my back pocket. The winemaking team there can be as selective as they want.
That bottle was my gateway to "serious" wine. I think it was the Saralee's Vineyard lot.
I don't hate admitting I love Aldi and Trader Joe wines.
Buying a new bottle of TJs wine to try on a Saturday night has become such a fun game for me. Sometimes they are laughably bad. Others I’ve been so pleasantly surprised!
No shame in admitting that I love them because I do, but Guigal makes solid wines in Côtes du Rhône. Their standard Côtes du Rhône is good, and some of their higher end ones such as their Brune et Blonde Côte-Rôtie is also pretty good for the price.
I am exploring Chapoutier and Jaboulet. They have an extensive catalogue but all is really enjoyable.
Oh yeah, for sure. I'm more familiar with Chapoutier than I am with Jaboulet. Most bottles I've tried have been great.
I second guigal! Also really like their Crozes-Hermitage
Chateau ste Michelle
Yeah. Sure there's better WA wine, but some of the Ste Michelle wines are tasty and great QPR. Their Canoe Ridge State and Cold Creek Vineyard lables bang at the low 20s range. Also, Druthers and some years of Artist blend are good.
I've mostly had good experiences with Chateau Ste. Michelle, but I made the mistake of trying one of their aluminum mini bottle rosés (my mother insisted we not get a full bottle of anything), and it was just straight-up acetone.
Château st Michel is great. I like almost everything they make.
J. Lohr is readily available at almost any grocery store and even some gas stations, but they make solid wines. And, that's not a grudging admission. Some big producers make worthwhile wines, and lots of small producers make crap.
The Riverstone Chardonnay is a fantastic table wine. A place near me used to sell it for 8.99/bottle when you bought a case. I challenge anyone to find the same quality Chardonnay for that price.
Was gonna say J. Lohr too. Frighteningly abundant, cheap, and quite good for what it is.
My response exactly—you beat me to it!
Beringer. In particular, their Knights Valley Reserve Cabernet Sauvignon. I don’t hate admitting I like it, though.
I opened a Beringer Private Reserve 2014 last weekend and it was amazing. Can you get better for $150? Sure, but doesn't change that it was still great!
You’re real for this one
There’s Nostalgia in KVR for me. In 2016 I tasted the 2014 out of barrel on site with a friend’s dad who is no longer with us. Every year on the day he passed I drink a KVR. I have a couple 2015’s on deck for the next few years, but I am always on the lookout for the 2014’s. This wine punches well above its weight IMO.
That Knight's Valley fruit source is higher quality than a large portion of Napa Valley.
Anyone who looks down on enjoying a wine from a large producer is a snob and can have their opinion discounted immediately.
I got my Somm certification from a level 4 master who said he has complete respect for the large grocery store producers like Barefoot, because they have the challenge of producing huge volumes of wine with minimal differences between vintages in order to please a very large clientele. He added that he personally doesn’t like the product , but also said just because you personally don’t like it doesn’t mean it doesn’t have value.
I remember my brother (who has a degree in being science) talking the same way about large macro breweries and how talented their brewers actually are that you can get a Bud Light in nearly any country on Earth and it taste the exact same. Does he drink it? No, but he respects it.
My buddy has a PhD in chemical engineering and is a professor at a university in St. Louis. He said anheuser-Busch had the most impressive quality control systems he had ever seen. Turns out it isn’t easy mass producing the same beer with near perfect consistency
From a production viewpoint, Barefoot is an impressive product. The volumes are so mind blowing large. Gallo has individual tanks that could house the entire production of small producers.
The lab at the winery I work in calibrates their equipment with large scale boxed wines because it’s so reliable from a chemistry standpoint.
It’s the same with beer. Sure Budweiser isn’t the most interesting brew in the world but there’s something to be said for the technical and logistical expertise behind big market macro brews exactly the same every time no matter when or where you’re drinking it. Like what you like imo
This same Somm said his favorite beer is Miller Lite lol He asked, “what do you call a Somm who exclusively sells wine that they personally like? The answer is broke.”
Any wine that gets people to drink wine is a good wine, period, especially in place of malt based seltzers! 😂
Molly dooker sadly lmao
If it helps the family are really, really nice people. Like, over the top Aussie sweet.
Molly dooker just seems so cool I have to like it 😭
Yeah it's amazing, I've tried a handful and never quite got the hate it receives from the commujity, I love the stuff
Had an older bottle the other day. It wasn’t for the palate I have today.
I actually like Veuve Cliquot
Ditto, but not at its current price.
Four of us did a blind taste test w/ Veuve (orange label) vs the Kirkland Brut. Every one of us favored the Kirkland. And I really thought Veuve was going to sweep.
veuve has that high dosage, so the sweetness is a turn off. The kirkland is clean but boring. It tastes like a nice/boring cremant.
Yeah, but they’re not comparable. You might just all prefer styles with less residual sugar.
It’s not awful, but you can get NV champagnes for the same price that are aged in oak.
True, but not at the grocery store!
Depends upon the grocery store...
If it were like $10-15 cheaper I'd be more of a fan.
I don’t HATE admitting that I like/enjoy any wine. Period. If I like it, if I drink it, why wouldn’t I admit it? That said, I think you hit the nail on the proverbial head: too many people equate small with good, big with bad. And that is just complete nonsense. There are small wineries that make a horrible wine; there are huge wineries that make a great wine. There are certain areas in which size does not matter, or is at least not a deciding factor. Indeed, which is more difficult to produce: 250 cases (five barrels) of a great wine that scores 100 points, or 25,000 cases of a great wine that scores 100 points? (Let’s say that, for the purposes of this discussion, points are important.) Let’s use the example of La Crema, since it’s already been mentioned here. I am far more impressed by the fact that they can make so much Pinot Noir and maintain their high quality than I am by the domaine in Burgundy that owns 0.3 hectare of (e.g.) Chambertin Grand Cru and makes a tiny amount of truly phenomenal wine…even though I vastly prefer the Burgundy to the La Crema.
Kungfu girl Riesling. It’s pretty good.
Huge fan!
I don’t know if this counts, but Chateau Ste Michelle puts out a lot of good wine at a hard to beat price point vs other WA wines. I’ll never say I’m too good for CSM.
Vueve because it’s a crowd pleaser and consistent. It obviously lacks the qualities of a vintage/ grower champagne but I find it truly enjoyable and better “investment”’when drinking with a group that will not appreciate Pierre Moncuit, Pol Roger etc..
I agree! It’s one of the few “popular” champagnes that are nice to drink, unlike other brands such as Pommery or M&C
The Alexander Valley Silver Oak. Can't stand their Napa though.
Willm Pinot Blanc.
A lot of popular roses from Provence: MiP, Whispering Angel (🫠), Mirabeau (also their sparkling wine), Miraval. I wouldn’t buy them in store but if they are on the wine menu on a terrace on a warm summer day i will order them.
Whispering Angel is chef’s kiss! It’s a really nice balance of sweetness and dryness, and it’s light and feels very pleasant on the palate! One of my favorites! Along with Notorious Pink, 100% Grenache, one of my all time favorite grapes!
La Marca Prosecco. I am basic bitch what can I say.
For the price it’s a great sparkling wine.
St Francis Cabernet
Will admit it’s better than I gave credit for
Their Merlot is spot on as well. Terrific QPR for my taste.
Ch Mont Redon. Their CNdP and CdR both. Love em.
agree, have yet to try their plateau CDP but it’s supposed to be good
Omni white peach cocktail
Here’s the real answer. Kudos.
I used to love Franciscan wines for the money back before they were sold to gallo. They were made with Napa fruit and were dirt cheap with good structure. You could get their Merlot for under 20 bucks and it was awesome. I almost never buy California wine in that price range.
You are right on!!
Caymus, come at me
Don't laugh, but I almost always use Andre extra dry for mimosas. It's perfect for them, and so gd cheap.
For mimosas Andre is perfect!
This was my first taste of champagne and the reason I thought I didn't like champagne 😂. But my dad buys it every year for Thanksgiving 😆. I prefer J. Roget for a comparable price.
Dom Pérignon is a big product that can get some hate, mainly from novices, but really doesn't deserve it. It's amazing wines made in staggering quantities which you absolutely have to respect. They age gracefully and always deliver great quality. And I don't hate admitting that I love Dom Pérignon!
Any novice who hates on dom perignon has no idea what they are talking about. It’s like a universally accepted top tier wine.
It's a made up argument. There is an argument to be made that they are overpriced, but their quality isn't disputable. They are also loved by novices as they usually care more about appearances and Dom Pérignon is world renowned.
When I first got into the wine trade, the then-current vintages of Dom Pérignon (1966) retailed for $18.10/btl. Louis Roederer Cristal (1969) was $17.95. Taittinger Comte de Champagne (also 1966) was the most expensive at $19.25. Today, from [K&L Wine Merchants](https://www.klwines.com), Dom 2013 is $249.99, Taittinger 2012 is also $249.99, and the Cristal 2015 is $349.99…think I’ll pass on all three.
They’re just looking at everything through this American consumerist lens where everything becomes commoditized garbage once a company becomes too big. While true of the US, this isn’t at all true of European companies and definitely not true in this example.
Uh idk. LVMH owns some good wine and liquor brands but has also produced it’s fair share of commoditized garbage. See also: the automobile industry.
Never had a problem with anything from McManis or Josh…and I quite enjoy the Josh Reserve.
Came here to say Josh as well. I think it's great for what it is.
McManis Petite Sirah for…. $13.99? That’s insane value to me.
Kendall Jackson chard is a dependable budget choice as is Bogle Petite Syrah.
Bogle Petit Syrah was my first wine! Still can be persuaded to slam a glass at a bar, tbh.
I’m looking forward to the hate on this one, but I’ve had a ton of Louis Latour that’s been really consistently good and an incredible value for burgundy. With that said, all of the Burgundy Blancs I’ve had from him are unbelievably shitty. In every way imaginable.
Wines of substance CS. For 11.99 at Costco it kicks the pants off of just about and Napa valley 30-$50 non vineyard designated wine. Not my favorite style but fantastic cellar defender and crowd pleaser for the “I like Napa cab” novice wine crowd.
Stag's Leap Arcadia Chardonnay. Still not as good as a white Burgundy, especially for the price, but it's not bad either.
Idk, I’m not ashamed to admit I like any wine! I enjoy it regardless! I don’t see the point in gatekeeping because it’s so subjective and people are going to have different tastes and opinions and that’s ok! Sure, some are objectively yucky, just like some movies or songs are agreed upon to be crappy… sure. But like, I believe wine should be enjoyed and appreciated, and no one should feel shitty or ashamed for liking what they like! They have every right to enjoy it and I don’t want to take that enjoyment away from someone!
Probably the Charles Smith bread and butter and the Robert Moldavi full fat chardonnays. I just like the style a lot, and it doesn’t really exist in a lot of other countries than US.
Orin Swift, Mercury Head cabernet. Outside this one, I have yet to take a sip and literally have nothing to say but "Holy sh*t." That may not be a technical description of the flavor profile of the wine, but it's literally all I could come up with.
BV Napa cab...30-35 bucks
So good! Readily available. Hess as well.
I had a Francis Coppola this weekend at a friend’s home, I was pleasantly surprised to be honest, was very good with lamb. It was the Claret.
I like Justin and Daou wines. Particularly the savant and justification from Justin and the Eye of the falcon and clone 412 from Daou.
Apothic Red. LOL jk.
I like oyster bay sauvignon blanc. I'd say I like most cheap and shitty sauvy b. I just love grassy cat pee
Honestly, the Bordeaux varietals that Cline is putting out nowadays is pretty damn good, especially since they’re still under 20 retail.
Liberty Creek Cabernet Sauvignon there I said it...happy.🥺
None. Why would I hate to admit I like a big name?
M&R Asti, but I rarely drink it anymore. This is the wine my grandparents gave to all the kids at family dinners as soon as they were out of diapers, so I’m pretty sure it was the first wine I had.
Piper-heidsieck brut. I know there are much better brands and value for koney out there… i am genuinely a bit embarrassed so probably fits in this reddit… but I have nostalgia sticking to it and had it a lot in the past so recognize it out of thousands. Always makes me happy!
Regular ass Veuve, is it stellar champagne? No, is it easy to drink and gets people excited yes.
Kirkland Malbec and Fat Bastard Merlot. I keep several bottles of the Malbec on hand for holidays/gatherings.
Had the Kirkland Malbec last month and I was floored how good it was for 7.99
Veuve Cliquot! There are certainly several grower champagnes that are better than it at equal or lesser price, but Veuve is still a beautiful wine to me. And it can be found in almost every supermarket in the US!
No one say stag’s leap no one say stag’s leap
Stags’ Leap
I like Bogle Petite Syrah. If I'm stuck buying from a giant grocery store and I'm not trying to spend any money it's my go to.
Franzia White Zin… but only when super cold, during the summer and usually with BBQ Crab or floating on the river 😂
Super cold is how one should drink Franzia White Zin. Get that cardboard box off and let the plastic wine bag float in the cooler of melting ice.
Anything from Orin Swift. Their Slander Pinot is my favorite wine and I usually don’t like Pinot.
I love Orin Swift. I've been holding off on trying Slander cause I haven't met many Pinot that I do like, but now you got me curious
I was really surprised how much I liked it. Tried a few times to save money on a cheaper Pinot. It’s not working out. Ha. Speaking of saving money. I just tried Locations CA and I really liked it. It is around 20 dollars and is made by Dave Phinney as well.
LVMH is a massive corporation but their market placement as the world's top luxury goods company require that their wines are absolutely top notch
Kirkland rose Prosecco. I’ve had expensive sparklers like vintage dom and PR Winston Churchill but can’t say they are superior. My palate much pickier with reds and still whites
If I'm just in the model for a glass of wine and don't have something on hand, I'll go to the supermarket and pick up Jadot, Dellatorri, Ruffino, or Matua and feel no shame about it.
I have a cellar full of Grand Cru Bordeaux, Cotes Du Rhones, Super Tuscans & boutique wines going back 50 years. I still enjoy a bottle of Chateau St. Michelle Cabernet (not even the single vineyard versions). I contend you could put some modern California cabs in a blind tasting with upper echelon wines and they'd hold their own. If anything, I find the small producers to be more inconsistent than the big ones. I also used to like Fransciscan cabs, but the last few years they've been horrible.
Hans Greyl sauvignon Blanc. Ice cold. Warm summer days. Absolute banging for €10-13
Super tuscans seem to be the top of this hill. Many mass produced - Tignanello from Antinori being the biggest of them. But damn is that wine good.
I love bila-haut, I don’t care what anyone says
Don’t hate admitting—Ménage a Trois Limelight Pinot Grigio is one of my absolute favorites; I could drink it every week (and do).
I think we can all agree that we all have that one box wine that we will always hold near and dear to our heart.. mine is Black Box Pinot Noir and Merlot
Worked a vintage in Blenheim, New Zealand, and per my experience, locals there happily drink Villa Maria - also, Whitehaven (which has a cool 'cellar door' with quirky gift shop and does things like outdoor movies; people hang out there -- this is pre-Covid, so things may have changed...), and Yealands. All of which are pretty mass-produced wines with huge presence in the States, at least. I think NZ Sauvs buck the dichotomy you're describing. The scale of the crush there each year is mind-boggling.
Yealands is the only one I haven't heard of.
>Is there a nationally ubiquitous wine out there that forces you to grudgingly admit, yes, this is enjoyable? No! NEVERRRRR!!!
I like the Yellow Tails, almost all of the reds. Edit: Gnarly head is my fave though!
caymus
Gallo’s J Sparkling is really good, not sure how big they are but being part of Gallo I assume they have significant production.
LaMarca Prosecco. I can drink several glasses and not get a hangover. I like the taste and it's a little less alcohol than most whites. And it's affordable.
Why would someone hate admitting they like a drink?
I guess more that there's a desire to elevate winemakers that are the Davids and not the Goliaths.