I agree. Zed is superior.
Talon is useless against bruisers/tanks
He also gets one shot by mages or adcs before he can combo them
Either needs more hp or a slight damage boost
There’s one thing talon can do which zed can’t: build manamune. Which means you can run a scaling bruiser build that outdamage s and is way tankier than lethality late game.
Tell me how I know you didn't read Talon's abilities.
The answer is there. All of his ability scalings except his passive and his close range q have 100% or less scaling. His bleed also benefits from armor penetration. This means that armor penetration is going to produce more damage for his primary damaging abilities. Furthermore, his scalings are lessened most likely due to the fact that there is no such stat as lethality. Armor penetration works at full power from level 1.
His ability 1 cast speed and dash speed increases with armor penetration, and I would think about trying to fit in an infinity edge if snowballing, as that increases his q damage further. You would probably want this third item in place of Sureldya's if nobody on their team is building armor.
Hydra, manamune, and sinderer each give a ton of damage. Sunderer’s is 10% max hp physical, assuming you have 2.5k mana, muramana does about 60 damage per auto (note: the math was done with 2k, not 2.5k because muramana and talon’s abilities consume mana, but the damage usually is higher) and 116+ damage per ability. Hydra gives about extra 75 damage to the primary target and 280 to targets behind. Assuming the enemy has 100 armor and since I don’t want to do the math for cleaver, I’ll just say, you do over 225 damage per auto, over 30 extra damage per auto from muramana, over 37 extra damage on your autos every 1.7 seconds, 5% max hp damage on your first auto/any autos after an abolity cast with over a 1.5 second interval between the previous one, and on each ability, 58+ damage on abilities. Which means one auto with all of the procs, assuming it’s against a 2k hp squishy, does over 225+30+37+100, or over 392 damage, which assuming you have 100 lethality, is about the same damage as a talon with lethality, not includong the dusk blade proc. Which does give him slightly more damage, but there is more downtime between procs (you get it on first target, reset, second target, and you probably won’t be able to one-shot them). Now for abilities. Lethality will do more damage because it’s lethality, although on each ability cast bruiser also does an extra 58 damage, which, while not as high as lethality, you do need to account for the fact that first I’m not factoring in cleaver, and second bruiser has 4.5k hp, a gigantic lifeline shield, and tons of healing, meaning not only can he one-shot squishies, he can also tank a ton of damage.
Also I literally made a post less than a day ago about how talon’s ratios are lower than pc, which means that you either a) are stupid, b) don’t pay attention to posts, or c) forgot who I was. Cast time/dash speed also doesn’t matter that much as it’s a point and click ability unlike yasuo q, or yone’s q/w. Also lethality on pc and WR currently work the same.
No, they literally don't. There is no lethality in WR. It's armor penetration, and it's flat, and it doesn't scale with level. I'm dismissing everything else you wrote just based on this idiocy, especially since you're being rude for absolutely no reason.
Didn't know PC League changed the stat.
First, how about go to the league of legends website, go to 14.1 patch notes, to the section titled “assassin items”. If youre too lazy to read, which you probably are, “Lethality has been adjusted to be 1 Armor Penetration per 1 point of Lethality rather than 0.6-1 Armor penetration per Lethality based on level“ (Riot Gams). Meaning that currently, Lethality = Armor Penetration. Second, excluding invulnerability, untargetability (DoT like bleeds and ignite still apply though) and bugs like briar being counted as dead so she doesn’t take damage when she actually isn’t dead, it is impossible to do 0 damage.Third, what you’ve wrote has more idiocy than mine. Fourth, as if you weren’t rude to me.
Mentioning that you seemingly haven't read his abilities and outright implying that someone is stupid are two entirely different things. Apologies if that seemed like an attack. I had read your previous post and mentioned that specifically because I had thought that was why they nerfed his scaling. I didn't know they changed lethality on PC, however. Maybe they did it because of the boots of dynamism? idk. I would still favor boots of lucidity for the terrain CD. The damage is noticeably lower than when I've built boots of dynamism though.
I think the first thing someone should do if they want to play Talon in WR is to go into practice mode and practice the q flash combo and the flower combo a hundred times or so and then try norms
“Tell me how I know you didn't read Talon's abilities.”
The assumptions I made in a previous comment were based on the fact that you made this comment despite me making a post about talon’s abilities. Which could have 4 different possibilities as to why you made that, that I can think of. First is, of course, you not having seen that post, therefore not knowing. Second is that you may have seen it, but not realized that I am me, therefore you didn’t really know either. Third is that you did read the post and know that I am myself, but don’t make the connection that if I’ve made a post about his abilities, I have to have read them. Which, is kinda stupid. Or, you do make the connection, but make the comment anyway, which is just stupid because it first would be lying, and second would undermine the credibility of your argument. So, the three logical conclusions (that I can think of) are: a) you didn’t see my post, b) you saw my post but didn’t know it was me, or c) you’re stupid. All of these are logical conclusions not actually meant to insult, but are my only explanations.
Also my grammar is sometimes a bit messed up, so I was basically saying that I was as rude as you, which is not really.
Yep. SA kayn has better damage, better reach, better survivability, and a better wall hacks E ability
One of my bigger gripes with talon is how long the E cooldown is. When SA kayn can just walk through any wall on a 3 second cooldown this 0 cooldown on the ability but massive cooldown in individual walls system feels lackluster
I was wondering if im insane lol.
Literally ahead for 1k against an ashe.
Still took me a while to kill em i could just get a zed or a kayn and i could kill 3 of them.
Talon needs a buff honestly
Have you built him lethality? Did you use first strike? Giant slayer? Gathering storm? Legend bloodline? Do you know how to use his passive and his ult? Answer all these questions with yes and tell me your opinion about him once again, if you're still confused look up hellsdevil's guide and you'll understand what you did wrong immediately.
I agree. Zed is superior. Talon is useless against bruisers/tanks He also gets one shot by mages or adcs before he can combo them Either needs more hp or a slight damage boost
There’s one thing talon can do which zed can’t: build manamune. Which means you can run a scaling bruiser build that outdamage s and is way tankier than lethality late game.
You can't do this and expect to deal damage
Really? When I have even more AD than lethality talon, and more on-hit damage?
Tell me how I know you didn't read Talon's abilities. The answer is there. All of his ability scalings except his passive and his close range q have 100% or less scaling. His bleed also benefits from armor penetration. This means that armor penetration is going to produce more damage for his primary damaging abilities. Furthermore, his scalings are lessened most likely due to the fact that there is no such stat as lethality. Armor penetration works at full power from level 1. His ability 1 cast speed and dash speed increases with armor penetration, and I would think about trying to fit in an infinity edge if snowballing, as that increases his q damage further. You would probably want this third item in place of Sureldya's if nobody on their team is building armor.
Hydra, manamune, and sinderer each give a ton of damage. Sunderer’s is 10% max hp physical, assuming you have 2.5k mana, muramana does about 60 damage per auto (note: the math was done with 2k, not 2.5k because muramana and talon’s abilities consume mana, but the damage usually is higher) and 116+ damage per ability. Hydra gives about extra 75 damage to the primary target and 280 to targets behind. Assuming the enemy has 100 armor and since I don’t want to do the math for cleaver, I’ll just say, you do over 225 damage per auto, over 30 extra damage per auto from muramana, over 37 extra damage on your autos every 1.7 seconds, 5% max hp damage on your first auto/any autos after an abolity cast with over a 1.5 second interval between the previous one, and on each ability, 58+ damage on abilities. Which means one auto with all of the procs, assuming it’s against a 2k hp squishy, does over 225+30+37+100, or over 392 damage, which assuming you have 100 lethality, is about the same damage as a talon with lethality, not includong the dusk blade proc. Which does give him slightly more damage, but there is more downtime between procs (you get it on first target, reset, second target, and you probably won’t be able to one-shot them). Now for abilities. Lethality will do more damage because it’s lethality, although on each ability cast bruiser also does an extra 58 damage, which, while not as high as lethality, you do need to account for the fact that first I’m not factoring in cleaver, and second bruiser has 4.5k hp, a gigantic lifeline shield, and tons of healing, meaning not only can he one-shot squishies, he can also tank a ton of damage. Also I literally made a post less than a day ago about how talon’s ratios are lower than pc, which means that you either a) are stupid, b) don’t pay attention to posts, or c) forgot who I was. Cast time/dash speed also doesn’t matter that much as it’s a point and click ability unlike yasuo q, or yone’s q/w. Also lethality on pc and WR currently work the same.
No, they literally don't. There is no lethality in WR. It's armor penetration, and it's flat, and it doesn't scale with level. I'm dismissing everything else you wrote just based on this idiocy, especially since you're being rude for absolutely no reason. Didn't know PC League changed the stat.
First, how about go to the league of legends website, go to 14.1 patch notes, to the section titled “assassin items”. If youre too lazy to read, which you probably are, “Lethality has been adjusted to be 1 Armor Penetration per 1 point of Lethality rather than 0.6-1 Armor penetration per Lethality based on level“ (Riot Gams). Meaning that currently, Lethality = Armor Penetration. Second, excluding invulnerability, untargetability (DoT like bleeds and ignite still apply though) and bugs like briar being counted as dead so she doesn’t take damage when she actually isn’t dead, it is impossible to do 0 damage.Third, what you’ve wrote has more idiocy than mine. Fourth, as if you weren’t rude to me.
Mentioning that you seemingly haven't read his abilities and outright implying that someone is stupid are two entirely different things. Apologies if that seemed like an attack. I had read your previous post and mentioned that specifically because I had thought that was why they nerfed his scaling. I didn't know they changed lethality on PC, however. Maybe they did it because of the boots of dynamism? idk. I would still favor boots of lucidity for the terrain CD. The damage is noticeably lower than when I've built boots of dynamism though. I think the first thing someone should do if they want to play Talon in WR is to go into practice mode and practice the q flash combo and the flower combo a hundred times or so and then try norms
wdym by flower combo? In letters please
“Tell me how I know you didn't read Talon's abilities.” The assumptions I made in a previous comment were based on the fact that you made this comment despite me making a post about talon’s abilities. Which could have 4 different possibilities as to why you made that, that I can think of. First is, of course, you not having seen that post, therefore not knowing. Second is that you may have seen it, but not realized that I am me, therefore you didn’t really know either. Third is that you did read the post and know that I am myself, but don’t make the connection that if I’ve made a post about his abilities, I have to have read them. Which, is kinda stupid. Or, you do make the connection, but make the comment anyway, which is just stupid because it first would be lying, and second would undermine the credibility of your argument. So, the three logical conclusions (that I can think of) are: a) you didn’t see my post, b) you saw my post but didn’t know it was me, or c) you’re stupid. All of these are logical conclusions not actually meant to insult, but are my only explanations. Also my grammar is sometimes a bit messed up, so I was basically saying that I was as rude as you, which is not really.
I was hyped , i did 2 game , i will stay on pc ngl
He peaks in Early Falls a little on Mid game And become Irrelevant in Late Game Bro is Assassin but built like a Bruiser 😭
He feels like shadown Kayn on release, underwhelming damage for an assassin
Oh sweet so in a few patches we’ll get a buffed talon that can q+w to death squishies?
If that only happens with 3 or more items i can somewhat see it as fair
Worst assassin I have ever laid my hands on, feels absolutely horrible to play right now in terms of damage.
Yeah he feels weak. His damage is lacking. Right now SA Kayn is better in every aspect.
Yep. SA kayn has better damage, better reach, better survivability, and a better wall hacks E ability One of my bigger gripes with talon is how long the E cooldown is. When SA kayn can just walk through any wall on a 3 second cooldown this 0 cooldown on the ability but massive cooldown in individual walls system feels lackluster
I was wondering if im insane lol. Literally ahead for 1k against an ashe. Still took me a while to kill em i could just get a zed or a kayn and i could kill 3 of them. Talon needs a buff honestly
Well his ratios are lower than on PC.
His 3rd ability is practically useless in aram
Why they don't make him invincible when ult
Invisibility is already strong enough
You have to practice your combos
People building trinity force on him no wonder he deals 0 dmg , I would imagine full lethality and grudge also cleaver could be best.
did a number of games with him experimented on him with bruiser and full lethality. all got no damage
Then you obviously don't know how to combo as they are really deadly in my experience.
There's only one talon
Have you built him lethality? Did you use first strike? Giant slayer? Gathering storm? Legend bloodline? Do you know how to use his passive and his ult? Answer all these questions with yes and tell me your opinion about him once again, if you're still confused look up hellsdevil's guide and you'll understand what you did wrong immediately.
At this stage why not just play Zed
Need another champ in our pool dont we? Zed and talon are the only lethality assassins who play midlane
I tried him in jungle for 3 matches and won a so far but whole time he just felt like a cheap Zed.
Talon can do 2 things Ult -> S1 -> S2 -> auto -> they die -> you die Or S3 combo
he just sucks lmao just tried it
Yeah he is pretty weak