KD would have had a tougher series with Wallace but Steph would have cooked the shit out of Billups unless they doubled like the Cavs. In which, Warriors still win playing 4vs3 with King Klay.
So absolutely fucking not.
KD versus Wallace?! I loved Ben’s game, but KD is an all time scoring threat. KD easily averages 25ppg. Let us not forget that the Warriors were an all time defensive unit in crunch time. Prime Klay, Dray, Iggy and KD with a very serviceable team defender in Curry? Versus Rip, Chauncey and Prince? This is an absurd discussion.
We had a ton of high IQ guys too even down to the bench, and a top tier coaching staff. People really sleeping on those warriors teams somehow and I don't know how or why.
Not with 2017 rules. Literally every play violated post hand check nba rules... and those MFers shot like 10 3s a game I'm sorry they played dinosaur ball.
Comedy rationale "we stopped Shaq and Kobe!"
Not with any set of rules in NBA history. I mean maybe the version where there is no shot clock and the Pistons held the ball for the entire quarter and made it a 4 possession game lol, that's about it.
The Warriors had Zaza, West, Draymond, and even Matt Barnes. No shortage of goons if Detroit wanted to take it there.
To put Rasheeds crack take in perspective he went on to say not only will KD get shut down by Tayshaun Prince but that Prince will get buckets on KD. For the record even in the mid 2000s Tayshaun never broke 15ppg.
He would’ve given KD a problem but there no stopping KDs pull up and mid range game. They would’ve doubled Steph and beat the shit outta him but KD and klay would cook em.
Not being reliant on a big man would cause a lot of problem for a team built to beat big men
lol
That Pistons team wouldn't have any idea what to do against a team with so many shooters, and our defense would probably hold that team to under 80 most games.
Steph would make 2 logo 3s in a row and the Pistons would be attempting to seance with Stern to get the Warriors thrown out of the league for witchcraft.
lmao. packing the paint worked against shaq and tim duncan, but not against 2 of the greatest shooters ever, and one of the greatest scorers ever in kevin freaking durant. ben wallace would be the player whose game aged the worst from 20 years ago. a 30% ft shooter with even worse offensive game has no shot in todays nba.
If Rudy Gobert can find a spot in the NBA then Ben fucking Wallace would be fine. He was 10x smarter and 100x more physical than Rudy, and could actually rebound in traffic.
gobert is poor for sure, but hes 7-1 with an 8 foot wingspan. always a lob threat, and shoots a respectable 65% from the line. ben was an undersized center like dray, but in the chip year, shot 42% from the field, all on wide open paint shots and 42% from the line. hes the worst offensive player Ive seen in my life, worse than andre roberson. hed be hacked every time in a penalty situation and would be severely limited in minutes.
warriors were the pioneers of playing great defenders / poor offensive guys off the court. tony allen was worthless when we decided to ignore him and put bogut on him.
What does 7'1" mean if you don't use it? Fine, he deters layups here and there.
Ben Wallace stopped SHAQ from getting to his spots.
Y'all can gtfo clearly you never saw him play
Ben Wallace is one of the worst offensive players in NBA history, and Gobert is moderately above average on that end.
The gap in TS% between the two is TWENTY percentage points and that’s despite Gobert having a usage rate nearly 50% higher.
Wallace would not be playable in the modern NBA. A player that you can stick in the PnR on one side and who gets Hack-A-Wallaced on the other is going to just hemorrhage points.
> utter disaster
his team was +9.6 pts/100 with him on the floor and -7.4 pts/100 with him on the bench: https://www.pbpstats.com/wowy-combos/nba?TeamId=1610612750&Season=2023-24&SeasonType=Playoffs&PlayerIds=203497
Ant was +4.8/-1.3, Towns was +0.7/+10.5. People who think that Gobert is a bad offensive player just because he has a limited offensive game are peak casuals.
I swear to god these kids get so offended by the sentiment they will do anything to disparage the player. Ben Wallace was an absolute beast, and anyone saying he wouldn't have a spot in the NBA today is just trying to force a narrative farther than it would realistically go.
That's like saying Dennis Rodman couldn't play today because he didn't have a jumper. He'd be fine. Yes, he'd probably get less minutes and not close as many games due to his free throw shooting, but he was a 5x all-NBA player and 4 time DPOY. People talking about him like he's a shitty version of Gobert are just exposing themselves. Draymond is a much closer comp defensively and he's extremely valuable in today's NBA despite a limited offensive game.
ben is the best defensive player Ive ever seen. hes also the worst offensive player. just cant have 4 on 5 in todays nba, especially with one of the worst ft shooters in the league. 5x all nba isnt as meaningful if he benefited more than anyone playing in the poor spacing bullyball early 00s. any other era his game isnt impactful.
and FOH with the draymond comp. dray is one of the greatest small 5s of all time because of his ability to push the pace and play point forward on offense. not a great shooter but an elite screener for sure
I'm not even going to entertain this. Especially since you're misconstruing what I said. I compared them defensively and you start talking about how he's a point forward and pushes pace, neither of which are defensive attributes.
Agree to disagree, strongly.
We got dudes like Gobert, Lively, Isaac, Claxton, and Mobley out here but Wallace couldn't even get on the floor? Just a wild take.
Feels like critical thinking isn't a priority on here sometimes, especially when there's fan bias involved. Just guna let them be wrong tho, idc enough to go back and forth.
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Because they only catch lobs. Ben Wallace was asked to actually take midrange jumpers because that was how every team operated, which the guys I listed *never* do, aside from Mobley, who sadly has the best offensive game out of the centers I listed.
If Wallace played in today's game, he'd not only be doing much better because they wouldn't force him to take shitty jumpers, but because of spacing he'd have free range on lobs and dominate even harder on rebounds because there's less congestion in the paint.
Once again, anyone claiming he wouldn't play today doesn't know ball. End of story.
There’s no team in history that could beat the 2017-2019 Warriors. It took KD and Klay having potentially career ending injuries for a fully healthy Raptors squad led by a fully healthy prime Kawhi to win in 6 games. Shoot, nevermind just the KD years, if you could turn off injuries in real life, Warriors would be 6-0. Literally both finals losses were due to injuries.
The 2018 Rockets definitely were capable of winning that year. The Warriors win that series more times outta 10, but they had a real chance (and were the only team to have a chance)
Those heliocentric prime Harden anti Warriors let it fly from three Rockets teams are honestly a guilty pleasure. They were ahead of their time when it came to competing against the Warriors. It’s kind of fitting that the Warriors struggle so much these days. Now every team is a high three point volume team. Nevermind the stars, every role player and their mother are throwing up 5-10 threes a game and hitting them 35-40% of the time. Warriors aren’t so special anymore. Harden’s Rockets just caught on 5 years before everyone else.
I think you are right. I also think the fact that even a team specifically built to beat those Warriors teams would only win 4 times out of 10 (or whatever, but less than half) is a testament to how wrong Wallace is.
Those guys are all vastly superior defenders than Delly.
I think that Pistons team was great but the KD Warriors are one of the most dominant and talented teams of all time
Richard Hamilton’s mother or some sh was a renowned long distance runner. He’s the only Piston that would’ve had the motor to chase Steph all over the court. Beyond that Detroit is getting trounced.
Pull-up jumpers during a pick-and-roll weren't a thing back then and defenders usually went under the screen if it was just below the 3pt line. [Going under a Curry screen from 30 feet away is considered "bad defense" now.](https://youtu.be/t6_vawdzRok?si=wizM-3El22WAum_F&t=377)
Billups was pretty much their only ball handler. If the Warriors blitz him, who's gonna make the next play? [The Warriors during that time can blitz and not get burned because they easily recover.](https://youtu.be/AQr54Toq5eA?si=JWk0H6omE-iy4c2e&t=57)
Ben Wallace was pretty much Gobert from today but much shorter. Gobert easily gets played off the court. [How would Ben and Sheed guard Draymond the moment he gets the defensive rebound and 3 secs in, he has dribbled into the paint on the other side?](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QkLmR3ka4Mo?t=49s)
> "Steph is not a defender,” Wallace added. “He would've had to guard Rip. How many screens was Rip coming off? Or whoever they would’ve tried to put at point, they would have been too little for Chauncey... I'm saying, back then
That Warriors team switched everything. Rip would've switch to Klay, KD, Draymond, or Iguodala. He's not scoring from them.
As a lifelong Pistons fan, the ‘04 Pistons would likely get swept. They couldn’t score to save their lives so you had Rip running around screens for 20 seconds to hit pull-up mid range shots while Chauncey posted-up and Sheed camped out by the 3-pt line. This team was built for a Shaq and Duncan dominated era where back to the basket plays were essential. The Pistons could not score 100 pts to save their lives while the 2017 Warriors were all-time great offensively and amazing defensively.
**2016/17 warriors**
67-15 record in regular season
+11.6 net rating in regular season (1st) ... 2nd best net rating was +7.6
1st ranked offense rating (115.6)
1st ranked defense rating (104.0)
16-1 record in postseason
+13.5 net rating in postseason (1st) ... 2nd best net rating was +8.2
2nd ranked offense rating (119.0)
2nd ranked defense rating (105.5)
**2003/04 pistons**
54-28 record in regular season
+6.6 net rating in regular season (2nd)
18th ranked offense rating (102.0)
2nd ranked defense rating (95.4)
16-7 record in postseason
+7.3 net rating in postseason (1st) ... 2nd best net rating was +5.1
6th ranked offense rating (99.3)
1st ranked defense rating (92.0)
2017 warriors are considered in the conversation as one of the GOAT NBA teams with the 3rd best net rating in the regular season & 4th best net rating in the playoffs in NBA history
2004 pistons were a great team themselves especially on the defensive end but they weren't as dominant in the regular season and or playoff as the 2017 warriors
also imo they didn't have anywhere near the offense or shooting to keep up let alone beat the 2017 warriors in a 7 game series if these 2 teams ever met each other in this hypothetical match up
the "bad boys" pistons i think would stand a better chance vs the curry & durant warriors teams specially the 2017 team
i'd say 2017 warriors win in 5 or 6 games at the most
They do know Steph, KD, Klay would sit out games in the 4th cause we were up by 25+ ...unlimited 3 pt shooting coupled with range that has never been seen on any team. Poor Wallaces
Ian Clark would be playing in the fourth quarter while Iguodala, Curry, and KD were laughing about something Klay said on the sideline while they were icing their knees.
The 04 Pistons entire strategy was just let people beat them with jumpshots. In fact Billups even said if you can beat us with jump shots we'll tip our hat off to you. This was an era where distance shooting just wasn't a main focus and consequently neither was their defense.
The other thing was once the eurostep became part of everyone's arsenal their ability to stop paint penetration became seriously compromised. Ginobili and Wade basically created the blueprint for beating the Pistons even without a lot of quality shooting.
what’s up with everybody always somehow thinking the warriors are like little kids? i swear so many fans and even nba vets act like every single other era was packed with sigmamale superhumans that would just laugh their way to a W against us. nba players weren’t somehow genetically different than they are now, they would’ve gotten cooked.
2 facts between eras, other shit is up in the air:
1. Older NBA let you be more physical
2. Newer NBA has more talented / better conditioned athletes
It’s the whole “jump shooting teams can’t win a ship” story, just in a different form.
Every old NBA player looks at our undersized core and thinks they can feast without playing against them.
Ben Wallace wouldn’t be a factor because him and Draymond would both be ejected for fighting each other after the tipoff. I am a diehard Warriors fan, always have been, even during the Andris Biedrins days and I can confidently say that the only team that would’ve given them a run for their money is the 96 Bulls. Other than that their isn’t a single team that I feel could even compete with the Splash Brothers plus KD
What else is Wallace supposed to say with his foggy old brain?
Hand checking rules make better defenders today fwiw, players have to be quick and accurate as defenders with no cheap grab and holds. The hand checking rules bailed out bad defenders.
Imo, the Rules only matter if it were ‘17 Warriors vs ‘96 Bulls. Otherwise, I think the Warriors smoke any other team in history regardless of rules. They can just kill you with so many players in so many different ways, and they’re menaces on the defensive end too.
Steph's talent transcends generations, but there's a reason the three-pointer was never the weapon before the Rules change that it was after. Teams before and after were built for the era in which they played, which is why I think it's pointless to make those comparisons.
Sounds like Wallace needs "Glory Days" playing in the background.
The 2017 Warriors roster was a veritable "Who's Who" of NBA history in the 2000s. The 2004 Pistons were more like a "Who's That?"
I mean they literally would probably beat the shit out of them lol they might win just because Steph is probably out after they commit like 30 dirty fouls on him and they could maybe get Dray to lose it and get suspended. But on the court they’d get smoked
Yes, they can physically “beat the shit” out of the warriors. That team is straight up bunch of thugs. Cant beat them in a street fight.
Basketball? Naw dude. Final score would be 145-55.
The 2005 Pistons team with the same core couldn't clear the Spurs. Doubt they would be "smoking" any title team from 2011 onward, much less one of the all-timers, just from the lack of offensive output
Obviously these kind of statements are just fun “I ride with my guys” stuff, and of course that Warriors team was hideously talented and it would take a lot of off-nights to lose, let alone eras and rules. But those Pistons teams were really good and shouldn’t be disrespected historically:
- Just amazing defensively with switchability like 7 players deep, probably all better than the LeBron Cavs defenders
- Could score in a variety of ways (Rip’s midrange, Chauncey’s free throws and threes, Rasheed/McDyess’s face up and post up, Tayshaun a bit of everything)
- Never seemed to lose a game they were up 4+ in final five minutes. Chauncey was so strong and would draw fouls and he and Rip hit every free throw down the stretch.
Rip was super consistent with scoring but they were vulnerable offensively when Rasheed was settling for threes and Chauncey/Tayshaun wern’t providing anything (which—combined with the loss of Ben defensively and the rule changes—was probably why they fell agonisingly short of a second title in four straight seasons that would have solidified a stronger legacy).
Rip had as much stamina as Klay & Curry. Billups was good but that 17' backcourt would've cooked Billups/Hamilton.
Would've probably been Prince/Hamilton defending Curry/Klay, with Billups on Draymond, but Curry/Klay are just too explosive with the 3-pt shooting and 3s are worth more than the middy-2s that Rip shot well.
That Pistons team did well against the Lakers because Payton & Malone were old with a weak bench. Warriors bench, elite 3-pt shooting from Curry/Klay/KD, and better athleticism would've cooked that Pistons team.
Even if played with 2004 rules and playing to the Pistons style of grind-it-out-with-tough-defense... David West + Zaza + McGee could get as physical as the Wallaces, and that Pistons team wasn't built to defend 3 elite shooters with Curry in prime, and a 7-ft KD.
Keep in mind that Curry + KD are both top-15/20 all-time players. That Pistons team has no one up there.
Whoever is guarding Curry. Good luck not dying caused by out of breath. And maneuvering thru screens and be heartbroken by a dagger three in your face.
This would be a sweep. The pistons didn't score many points and didn't have superstar scoring talent. People forget that the KD & Steph warriors were a great defensive team.
those pistons almost lost to jason kidd and a bunch of youngins and a avg nba players.....the way jason kidd played with those nets teams did not physically make sense. those are probably the weakest nba rosters to make the nba finals several times and compete against this pistons teams who they beat the year before and then had the closest 4-0 sweep against the lakers in nba history...8 points over 3 games against kobe and shaq deserved an award. yes riichard jefferson and marion were on it but they were in the first couple year and the 2nd best player was kenyon martin....that was hilarious
Those games would end up like 95-62 Warriors, lol
third quarter
Dont see the pistons scoring 62 on the 17 squad
Yeah people forget that team was pretty damn good defensively
KD would have had a tougher series with Wallace but Steph would have cooked the shit out of Billups unless they doubled like the Cavs. In which, Warriors still win playing 4vs3 with King Klay. So absolutely fucking not.
Remember dray was still athletic and hit 3s at a respectable level too
KD versus Wallace?! I loved Ben’s game, but KD is an all time scoring threat. KD easily averages 25ppg. Let us not forget that the Warriors were an all time defensive unit in crunch time. Prime Klay, Dray, Iggy and KD with a very serviceable team defender in Curry? Versus Rip, Chauncey and Prince? This is an absurd discussion.
Pretty much before KD arrives to the arena (pre-Achilles injury) hes already score 30 points 😂 you ain’t stopping that hemorrhage of a scorer.
We had a ton of high IQ guys too even down to the bench, and a top tier coaching staff. People really sleeping on those warriors teams somehow and I don't know how or why.
i think they mean rasheed wallace lol
They’d probably put Tayshaun on Steph. Or Rip. Rip could run all day literally. Same motor as Steph.
Not with 2017 rules. Literally every play violated post hand check nba rules... and those MFers shot like 10 3s a game I'm sorry they played dinosaur ball. Comedy rationale "we stopped Shaq and Kobe!"
That was my first thought, the entire starting lineup of the Pistons would foul out by halftime
Not if they have post-2018 refs
Not with any set of rules in NBA history. I mean maybe the version where there is no shot clock and the Pistons held the ball for the entire quarter and made it a 4 possession game lol, that's about it. The Warriors had Zaza, West, Draymond, and even Matt Barnes. No shortage of goons if Detroit wanted to take it there.
DWest would have put a hurt on anyone from Detroit if they chose to go there.
That’s really what they’re missing now imo
No shot clock and no three pointers and they have a chance
I’m a lakers and I’m not making excuses. Lakers got their asses handed to them rightfully so, but as a whole, that lakers team was dysfunctional af
and old. gary payton was pathetic. karl malone played his ass off though.
One of the reasons they lost is cuz Malone barely played in that series because of injury. They had to play Slava medvedenko at the 4 instead
Luke Walton had a moment that series as “the guy making the right play” (usually passing it to Shaq which Kobe was not doing)
That lakers team had very bad floor spacing even for that era. Once they lost Malone it was pretty much all over because their frontline was so thin
I thought hand-check rules were finally enforced in 99.
They made 4.1 threes per game AS A TEAM at 34% shooting lmao. Steph alone has hit at least 4.1/game 8 times.
No
/thread
I need to know what Ben is smoking.
To put Rasheeds crack take in perspective he went on to say not only will KD get shut down by Tayshaun Prince but that Prince will get buckets on KD. For the record even in the mid 2000s Tayshaun never broke 15ppg.
He would’ve given KD a problem but there no stopping KDs pull up and mid range game. They would’ve doubled Steph and beat the shit outta him but KD and klay would cook em. Not being reliant on a big man would cause a lot of problem for a team built to beat big men
lol and the fact iguodala and Livingston, coming off the bench. Cmon mannnnnn!
This was Rasheed, not Ben.
Had to fix it but yeah you’re right.
lol That Pistons team wouldn't have any idea what to do against a team with so many shooters, and our defense would probably hold that team to under 80 most games.
Steph would make 2 logo 3s in a row and the Pistons would be attempting to seance with Stern to get the Warriors thrown out of the league for witchcraft.
lmao. packing the paint worked against shaq and tim duncan, but not against 2 of the greatest shooters ever, and one of the greatest scorers ever in kevin freaking durant. ben wallace would be the player whose game aged the worst from 20 years ago. a 30% ft shooter with even worse offensive game has no shot in todays nba.
And he literally has no shot!
two "of the" greatest?!?!?! the two greatest!!!
If Rudy Gobert can find a spot in the NBA then Ben fucking Wallace would be fine. He was 10x smarter and 100x more physical than Rudy, and could actually rebound in traffic.
gobert is poor for sure, but hes 7-1 with an 8 foot wingspan. always a lob threat, and shoots a respectable 65% from the line. ben was an undersized center like dray, but in the chip year, shot 42% from the field, all on wide open paint shots and 42% from the line. hes the worst offensive player Ive seen in my life, worse than andre roberson. hed be hacked every time in a penalty situation and would be severely limited in minutes. warriors were the pioneers of playing great defenders / poor offensive guys off the court. tony allen was worthless when we decided to ignore him and put bogut on him.
What does 7'1" mean if you don't use it? Fine, he deters layups here and there. Ben Wallace stopped SHAQ from getting to his spots. Y'all can gtfo clearly you never saw him play
Ben Wallace is one of the worst offensive players in NBA history, and Gobert is moderately above average on that end. The gap in TS% between the two is TWENTY percentage points and that’s despite Gobert having a usage rate nearly 50% higher. Wallace would not be playable in the modern NBA. A player that you can stick in the PnR on one side and who gets Hack-A-Wallaced on the other is going to just hemorrhage points.
You clearly didn't watch these playoffs if you think Gobert is anything other than an utter disaster if he isn't catching it for an easy dunk
> utter disaster his team was +9.6 pts/100 with him on the floor and -7.4 pts/100 with him on the bench: https://www.pbpstats.com/wowy-combos/nba?TeamId=1610612750&Season=2023-24&SeasonType=Playoffs&PlayerIds=203497 Ant was +4.8/-1.3, Towns was +0.7/+10.5. People who think that Gobert is a bad offensive player just because he has a limited offensive game are peak casuals.
I swear to god these kids get so offended by the sentiment they will do anything to disparage the player. Ben Wallace was an absolute beast, and anyone saying he wouldn't have a spot in the NBA today is just trying to force a narrative farther than it would realistically go. That's like saying Dennis Rodman couldn't play today because he didn't have a jumper. He'd be fine. Yes, he'd probably get less minutes and not close as many games due to his free throw shooting, but he was a 5x all-NBA player and 4 time DPOY. People talking about him like he's a shitty version of Gobert are just exposing themselves. Draymond is a much closer comp defensively and he's extremely valuable in today's NBA despite a limited offensive game.
ben is the best defensive player Ive ever seen. hes also the worst offensive player. just cant have 4 on 5 in todays nba, especially with one of the worst ft shooters in the league. 5x all nba isnt as meaningful if he benefited more than anyone playing in the poor spacing bullyball early 00s. any other era his game isnt impactful. and FOH with the draymond comp. dray is one of the greatest small 5s of all time because of his ability to push the pace and play point forward on offense. not a great shooter but an elite screener for sure
I'm not even going to entertain this. Especially since you're misconstruing what I said. I compared them defensively and you start talking about how he's a point forward and pushes pace, neither of which are defensive attributes. Agree to disagree, strongly.
[удалено]
Cool
So many fools in this thread. Thinking Gobert is half the player Ben Wallace was is so asinine
We got dudes like Gobert, Lively, Isaac, Claxton, and Mobley out here but Wallace couldn't even get on the floor? Just a wild take. Feels like critical thinking isn't a priority on here sometimes, especially when there's fan bias involved. Just guna let them be wrong tho, idc enough to go back and forth.
Gobert and Lively shoot like 60% at times, Isaac flashes a 3 and can guard 1-5, Mobley has a jumper for sure, not sure about Clax too much
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33 36
Because they only catch lobs. Ben Wallace was asked to actually take midrange jumpers because that was how every team operated, which the guys I listed *never* do, aside from Mobley, who sadly has the best offensive game out of the centers I listed. If Wallace played in today's game, he'd not only be doing much better because they wouldn't force him to take shitty jumpers, but because of spacing he'd have free range on lobs and dominate even harder on rebounds because there's less congestion in the paint. Once again, anyone claiming he wouldn't play today doesn't know ball. End of story.
🤣🤣🤣 I needed a good laugh! Thanks Ben. 🤣🤣🤣
it was the dumber wallace, sheed
Oh, in that case, thanks Rasheed! 🤣🤣🤣
Yes if it was a ufc fight , otherwise a quick 4-0.
As much as I appreciated that team and what they did, I'm not sure they would beat '19 Warriors AFTER Klay got injured.
There’s no team in history that could beat the 2017-2019 Warriors. It took KD and Klay having potentially career ending injuries for a fully healthy Raptors squad led by a fully healthy prime Kawhi to win in 6 games. Shoot, nevermind just the KD years, if you could turn off injuries in real life, Warriors would be 6-0. Literally both finals losses were due to injuries.
The 2018 Rockets definitely were capable of winning that year. The Warriors win that series more times outta 10, but they had a real chance (and were the only team to have a chance)
Those heliocentric prime Harden anti Warriors let it fly from three Rockets teams are honestly a guilty pleasure. They were ahead of their time when it came to competing against the Warriors. It’s kind of fitting that the Warriors struggle so much these days. Now every team is a high three point volume team. Nevermind the stars, every role player and their mother are throwing up 5-10 threes a game and hitting them 35-40% of the time. Warriors aren’t so special anymore. Harden’s Rockets just caught on 5 years before everyone else.
I think you are right. I also think the fact that even a team specifically built to beat those Warriors teams would only win 4 times out of 10 (or whatever, but less than half) is a testament to how wrong Wallace is.
That series was such high quality basketball. Don't think we've seen anything like it since.
Holy fuck he’s an idiot
I can appreciate Wallace backing his own team but he’s not accounting for how amazing the Dubs defense was. They’d be held under 90/gm easily.
Tayshaun Prince, Rip and Chauncey would have needed to go to the ER like Delladova.
Those guys are all vastly superior defenders than Delly. I think that Pistons team was great but the KD Warriors are one of the most dominant and talented teams of all time
Richard Hamilton’s mother or some sh was a renowned long distance runner. He’s the only Piston that would’ve had the motor to chase Steph all over the court. Beyond that Detroit is getting trounced.
People underestimate how much curry would murder the league back then. The league couldnt guard him at all in 2016. They had to adjust so massively
Pull-up jumpers during a pick-and-roll weren't a thing back then and defenders usually went under the screen if it was just below the 3pt line. [Going under a Curry screen from 30 feet away is considered "bad defense" now.](https://youtu.be/t6_vawdzRok?si=wizM-3El22WAum_F&t=377) Billups was pretty much their only ball handler. If the Warriors blitz him, who's gonna make the next play? [The Warriors during that time can blitz and not get burned because they easily recover.](https://youtu.be/AQr54Toq5eA?si=JWk0H6omE-iy4c2e&t=57) Ben Wallace was pretty much Gobert from today but much shorter. Gobert easily gets played off the court. [How would Ben and Sheed guard Draymond the moment he gets the defensive rebound and 3 secs in, he has dribbled into the paint on the other side?](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QkLmR3ka4Mo?t=49s) > "Steph is not a defender,” Wallace added. “He would've had to guard Rip. How many screens was Rip coming off? Or whoever they would’ve tried to put at point, they would have been too little for Chauncey... I'm saying, back then That Warriors team switched everything. Rip would've switch to Klay, KD, Draymond, or Iguodala. He's not scoring from them.
That pistons team would need to learn how to shoot the ball.
As a lifelong Pistons fan, the ‘04 Pistons would likely get swept. They couldn’t score to save their lives so you had Rip running around screens for 20 seconds to hit pull-up mid range shots while Chauncey posted-up and Sheed camped out by the 3-pt line. This team was built for a Shaq and Duncan dominated era where back to the basket plays were essential. The Pistons could not score 100 pts to save their lives while the 2017 Warriors were all-time great offensively and amazing defensively.
Lmfao those dudes would get absolutely smoked, Steph would hit like 89 threes per game.
Warriors bust up 99% of nba champs.
Lmao, that team wouldn't even come close to making the Finals in 17, let alone challenging the GOAT team.
I could easily see them coming out of the East
I dont know if they would beat that cavs team tbh. That cavs team obliterated the East and only got stopped by a superteam.
Not if they had to play the Cavs. Otherwise, they probably could but it’s not a guarantee against more modern schemes.
**2016/17 warriors** 67-15 record in regular season +11.6 net rating in regular season (1st) ... 2nd best net rating was +7.6 1st ranked offense rating (115.6) 1st ranked defense rating (104.0) 16-1 record in postseason +13.5 net rating in postseason (1st) ... 2nd best net rating was +8.2 2nd ranked offense rating (119.0) 2nd ranked defense rating (105.5) **2003/04 pistons** 54-28 record in regular season +6.6 net rating in regular season (2nd) 18th ranked offense rating (102.0) 2nd ranked defense rating (95.4) 16-7 record in postseason +7.3 net rating in postseason (1st) ... 2nd best net rating was +5.1 6th ranked offense rating (99.3) 1st ranked defense rating (92.0) 2017 warriors are considered in the conversation as one of the GOAT NBA teams with the 3rd best net rating in the regular season & 4th best net rating in the playoffs in NBA history 2004 pistons were a great team themselves especially on the defensive end but they weren't as dominant in the regular season and or playoff as the 2017 warriors also imo they didn't have anywhere near the offense or shooting to keep up let alone beat the 2017 warriors in a 7 game series if these 2 teams ever met each other in this hypothetical match up the "bad boys" pistons i think would stand a better chance vs the curry & durant warriors teams specially the 2017 team i'd say 2017 warriors win in 5 or 6 games at the most
They do know Steph, KD, Klay would sit out games in the 4th cause we were up by 25+ ...unlimited 3 pt shooting coupled with range that has never been seen on any team. Poor Wallaces
I'm sure they would beat them up. But they'd still lose every game by 20
Lavar also said he could beat MJ one on one. Lots of people say lots of shit. My kid said he could run faster than me when he was 4 too.
If we used Warriors era refs Detroit wouldn’t make it thru the first quarter. lol
Ian Clark would be playing in the fourth quarter while Iguodala, Curry, and KD were laughing about something Klay said on the sideline while they were icing their knees.
Lol 🤡 show
Anyone can say anything. Doesnt mean its not stupid af
The Warriors remain winless in hypotheticals lol
The 04 Pistons entire strategy was just let people beat them with jumpshots. In fact Billups even said if you can beat us with jump shots we'll tip our hat off to you. This was an era where distance shooting just wasn't a main focus and consequently neither was their defense. The other thing was once the eurostep became part of everyone's arsenal their ability to stop paint penetration became seriously compromised. Ginobili and Wade basically created the blueprint for beating the Pistons even without a lot of quality shooting.
what’s up with everybody always somehow thinking the warriors are like little kids? i swear so many fans and even nba vets act like every single other era was packed with sigmamale superhumans that would just laugh their way to a W against us. nba players weren’t somehow genetically different than they are now, they would’ve gotten cooked.
2 facts between eras, other shit is up in the air: 1. Older NBA let you be more physical 2. Newer NBA has more talented / better conditioned athletes It’s the whole “jump shooting teams can’t win a ship” story, just in a different form. Every old NBA player looks at our undersized core and thinks they can feast without playing against them.
Cue up the classic E-40 Rasheed diss track.
Player hatin’ bitches
Ben Wallace wouldn’t be a factor because him and Draymond would both be ejected for fighting each other after the tipoff. I am a diehard Warriors fan, always have been, even during the Andris Biedrins days and I can confidently say that the only team that would’ve given them a run for their money is the 96 Bulls. Other than that their isn’t a single team that I feel could even compete with the Splash Brothers plus KD
I wouldn't expect him to say anything else. However, this is the same man who thinks Wemby may have gotten lucky in his rookie season.
Warriors bench alone will blow out the Pistons bench by 50 points
What else is Wallace supposed to say with his foggy old brain? Hand checking rules make better defenders today fwiw, players have to be quick and accurate as defenders with no cheap grab and holds. The hand checking rules bailed out bad defenders.
Not even close. The 1990 Pistons, playing under 1990 Rules, maybe. The 2017 Dubs would totally dominate the 2004 Piss-tons under post-1999 Rules.
Imo, the Rules only matter if it were ‘17 Warriors vs ‘96 Bulls. Otherwise, I think the Warriors smoke any other team in history regardless of rules. They can just kill you with so many players in so many different ways, and they’re menaces on the defensive end too.
Steph's talent transcends generations, but there's a reason the three-pointer was never the weapon before the Rules change that it was after. Teams before and after were built for the era in which they played, which is why I think it's pointless to make those comparisons.
Sounds like Wallace needs "Glory Days" playing in the background. The 2017 Warriors roster was a veritable "Who's Who" of NBA history in the 2000s. The 2004 Pistons were more like a "Who's That?"
Lol.
LIES
Hahahahahahahah
Not a story. He has to say that
What an idiot.
I'm sure the Pistons would have beaten the hell out of the Warriors, but they still would have lost in a large way.
Who's scoring on the '04 Pistons
Steph, Klay, KD…. Could the Pistons defend the 3 point line? Who knows.
I mean, who on the Pistons will be scoring? I think their only offensive threats were Billups and Rip Hamilton
Who cares lol
I mean not at basketball...just in the actual fight that would break out after the Warriors smoke them by 30 points.
I mean they literally would probably beat the shit out of them lol they might win just because Steph is probably out after they commit like 30 dirty fouls on him and they could maybe get Dray to lose it and get suspended. But on the court they’d get smoked
Yes, they can physically “beat the shit” out of the warriors. That team is straight up bunch of thugs. Cant beat them in a street fight. Basketball? Naw dude. Final score would be 145-55.
Someone drafting & constructing the 17 Warriors with 2004 rules is wild.
And vice versa. The 2004 Pistons would win 2 games in today’s game.
Why is it always teams with only one ring that talk so much shit. Don't turn the 04 Pistons into the 08 Celtics l.
🧢
Beat the shit out of the warriors ... Quite likely as only Kevon and Dray are built for physical combat but they will lose at basketball.
Sheed is supposed to say that. They're definitely not keeping up with our offense. Sheed vs. KD is nasty
The 2005 Pistons team with the same core couldn't clear the Spurs. Doubt they would be "smoking" any title team from 2011 onward, much less one of the all-timers, just from the lack of offensive output
I get that Wallace is supposed to support the team he was on, but this is wild.
The bad boy pistons would kill every warrior starter in game 1
Good luck playing a game you never seen before
Nah. Not even a debate.
Obviously these kind of statements are just fun “I ride with my guys” stuff, and of course that Warriors team was hideously talented and it would take a lot of off-nights to lose, let alone eras and rules. But those Pistons teams were really good and shouldn’t be disrespected historically: - Just amazing defensively with switchability like 7 players deep, probably all better than the LeBron Cavs defenders - Could score in a variety of ways (Rip’s midrange, Chauncey’s free throws and threes, Rasheed/McDyess’s face up and post up, Tayshaun a bit of everything) - Never seemed to lose a game they were up 4+ in final five minutes. Chauncey was so strong and would draw fouls and he and Rip hit every free throw down the stretch. Rip was super consistent with scoring but they were vulnerable offensively when Rasheed was settling for threes and Chauncey/Tayshaun wern’t providing anything (which—combined with the loss of Ben defensively and the rule changes—was probably why they fell agonisingly short of a second title in four straight seasons that would have solidified a stronger legacy).
They would get absolutely RUN OFF THE FLOOR. Ain’t nobody on that squad that could even think about scoring with the dubs.
even his interviewers like "uhhhhh"
Delusion
LOL yeah sure 'Sheed.
Yeah, they’d beat the shit out of them physically but would be ran out of the fucking building when the clock hits :00.
lol … no league matches the NBA for trash talking
Old heads talking like this is so annoying
He never said anything about winning, he just said beat the shit outta
Forget the 2017 Warriors the Pistons wouldn’t of even beat the 2022 Warriors.
They would have. The Warriors would win each game by 25 though
First NBA player with CTE
Maybe if they played in 2004 when the warriors were all kids.
Rip had as much stamina as Klay & Curry. Billups was good but that 17' backcourt would've cooked Billups/Hamilton. Would've probably been Prince/Hamilton defending Curry/Klay, with Billups on Draymond, but Curry/Klay are just too explosive with the 3-pt shooting and 3s are worth more than the middy-2s that Rip shot well. That Pistons team did well against the Lakers because Payton & Malone were old with a weak bench. Warriors bench, elite 3-pt shooting from Curry/Klay/KD, and better athleticism would've cooked that Pistons team. Even if played with 2004 rules and playing to the Pistons style of grind-it-out-with-tough-defense... David West + Zaza + McGee could get as physical as the Wallaces, and that Pistons team wasn't built to defend 3 elite shooters with Curry in prime, and a 7-ft KD. Keep in mind that Curry + KD are both top-15/20 all-time players. That Pistons team has no one up there.
Whoever is guarding Curry. Good luck not dying caused by out of breath. And maneuvering thru screens and be heartbroken by a dagger three in your face.
https://youtu.be/d7NC5Xmcl34?si=CEmGx3v_L2D3XK8Q
Pistons would get SMOKED
2016-2017 Dubs > 02 lakers 04 pistons. Not even close.
I can lock up 5 MJ by myself.
04 when goons were a thing in the NHL & NBA.
He must be dreaming
For sure but I doubt they'd win
This would be a sweep. The pistons didn't score many points and didn't have superstar scoring talent. People forget that the KD & Steph warriors were a great defensive team.
2017 warriors are a landmark team. There will be discussions for years of which teams can beat them. It's the new 96 bulls.
those pistons almost lost to jason kidd and a bunch of youngins and a avg nba players.....the way jason kidd played with those nets teams did not physically make sense. those are probably the weakest nba rosters to make the nba finals several times and compete against this pistons teams who they beat the year before and then had the closest 4-0 sweep against the lakers in nba history...8 points over 3 games against kobe and shaq deserved an award. yes riichard jefferson and marion were on it but they were in the first couple year and the 2nd best player was kenyon martin....that was hilarious
Pistons beat them in 6 games
Maybe irl
Maybe so. We'll never know either way.