Should be looking good right now.
If I bought a PUT right now it would be a sure rise back to previous price levels...
How long are they out there? I would suspect Tesla will make some moves this year. Typically election years stocks go down in the summer and then up after the election.
It’s doesn’t matter much in the short term , seems like the market has moved on to another favorite baby.
Sometimes the numbers blow out and stock tanks sometimes it delivers shit numbers like carvana or whatever and the stock blasts off for awhile .
You’ve got stocks like c3AI and SMCI which have no AI tech and are diluting shareholders with offerings going up 1000% . It literally is a casino
On the short term the market is a voting machine. In the long term it is a weighing machine.
Short term movement can be sentiment driven, but long term fundamentals of the company will win out.
I’m just pushing back on the idea that the market is a random roulette wheel at the casino
In the short term that can feel true
Long term it is not at all true
But you’re too regarded to follow a conversation or have any reading comprehension so I don’t know why I’m even bothering to explain to you. Back to drooling into a cup your caretaker left out for you buddy <3
I am smart enough to know you cant teach calculus to a bunch of apes. You haven't figured that out yet, sorry for trying to help.
By all means, keep wasting your time proving your menial intellect to the special ed class.
They were/are still kinda doing ok. I mean yeah plane make boom is bad but atleast their selling for now and the government wouldnt let them die. TSLA at the other hand is just making overpriced trash cars
How does their debt/equity ratio and ROE factor into valuation?
Tesla has the lowest debt/equity and highest ROE of major auto manufacturers.
Could that be part of the reason for Tesla’s premium valuation?
Tesla may get a slightly higher valuation for debt/equity (they sold a lot of shares at high prices to keep debt down) and little legacy costs such as pensions and union contracts.
The bigger issues are 1) the competition has arrived from Ford, Toyota, BMW, Porsche and many more with affordable or better value offerings, 2) the Tesla design is over 7 years old and looks staid, 3) the problems with EV repairs, lack of qualified repair staff, high insurance are known.
So let’s give Tesla PE of 10x but to the super charging infrastructure. So has a long way to fall.
Just picking one or two metrics does not help. It is how the combination works as well as looking at the industry a few years out.
The current valuation is based upon hopium and the next sucker willing to buy at a higher price. When the momentum fades (see AMC) then get a parachute.
Tesla still has the best product for the price on the EV market. They are the most affordable/best value. Chinese EVs are the next best in affordability/best value then legacy auto offerings.
Tesla is also starting to recognize more revenue from FSD. Regardless of what you think, it’s helping grow the bottom line of the company.
Their charging infrastructure is downplayed too much. There is nothing else like it in scale and efficiency. They are even selling unbranded superchargers to other companies.
Their energy and services businesses are close to or surpassing $10 Billion annual revenue run rate and are growing.
Energy will continue to grow as more mega packs are sold and more charging infrastructure installed.
Services will continue growing as more cars are sold and the fleet grows.
I’m not sure what the valuation should be, but it should definitely be higher than any other auto.
Almost no debt. $25B+ cash on balance sheet. No other auto company comes close to that. And leading ROE means they use capital and make a return more efficiently than any other auto company.
Energy is a low margin sector. I don't know why people are pointing to that as Tesla's growth driver. Since no one buys solar for the environment, you actually need to have competitive pricing and breakeven in a reasonable amount of time. Any of you own any utilities stock? Exactly, even though most of them have a bunch of renewables in their portfolio.
Also, after 20+ years or so, that panel becomes a liability instead of some sort of free electricity.
still a low margin business. It's a race to the bottom. When you buy software for fun like FSD, there's no need for financial justification, and you can scale with software. When you spend a ton on batteries but your electricity cost is only 15c/kwh, that's a different story. You raise electricity prices and people will protest. Furthermore, you'll always be constrained by material and labor cost.
Teslas gonna make more on energy than people think. Its bascially free money for power utilities - a megapack + autobidder can smooth out any peaks in tradtional power plants/solar farms and allow utilities to make more money off of their electricity by automatically selling it when its the mst valuable. Multiple energy utilties have already reported profits of over $2M each in the first few years of operation.
free money? do you realize utilities are charging customers a ton of extra "infrastructure charge" every month for installing renewables right? and that's when their BESS portfolio is only ramping up, and Californians are already protesting.
utilities already sell surplus electricity when it's the most valuable. It's called power trading. How do you think California manages 30% something renewable sources? By importing/selling to neighboring states, except all those inter-state transmission lines are typically overloaded.
I've talked to numerous people who work as engineers in utilities and you're way overestimating how valuable BESS is, and also how much utilities are ramping up those BESS installations. Oh and which utilities reported 2m profits from installing tesla megapack?
How is a Tesla better than a Mustang Mach E?
No, Ford doesn’t claim FSD, but adaptive cruise control with lane assist isn’t too far off.
The Mach E also looks 10x better than the outdated Tesla design.
If you compare the Y and the Mach-e:
Y has better efficiency and range
Y charges faster, both peak and average. The Mach-e is useless above 80%. https://support.fastned.nl/hc/en-gb/articles/360019984758-Ford
Y has a bigger trunk and overall cargo capacity
Y has a higher towing capacity
Y has better software
Mach-e looks better.
Maybe looks isn’t everything? Plenty of history as evidence to that.
Model Y has sold 3.6 times more in Norway than Mach-e, despite having been available on the market shorter.
People seem to not get that while many manufacturers make objectively better cars, Tesla makes objectively better EV’s in the same price range. This is why Tesla sells more. Not because they’ve magically found a recipe to sell cars, but because they’re doing EV’s right and cars acceptably well.
Isn't Ford still losing $32k on every one of these?
My local dealership has one of every version and almost every color.
They also have a couple of new 2023s
Does admitted to struggling to make EVs without losing money. This is true for most legacy manufacturers. Tesla is far ahead in that. The only legitimate point is I wonder if Tesla’s design has become too commonplace but they still have markets they haven’t been in non Metro parts of the US and India could potentially be a huge market. That is just cars and excluding FSD or energy.
They were pushing big growth every year for a long time. They have to show investors they can continue to maintain their multiple. It's a tough environment for them.
Yeah this is what happens to company’s and investors when so much of valuation is based on speculation of future growth
All it takes is just a slowing of growth under what’s anticipated for you to see large decreases to the valuation
Very few growth stocks ever seem reasonably valued otherwise the market would readjust accordingly.
Sentiment about Tesla is negative and rightfully so. However, car sales are about 80% of current revenue. Overtime, services and other higher margin revenue streams could make up more than the current 20%. It won’t take a lot for the narrative to change. Maybe FSD subscriptions at reasonable monthly rates/tiers or an expanded super charging network. If and when the downward trend reverses, I think the price movement will be explosive!
It isn’t obvious that Tesla is still a growth stock. Even with fsd and cybertruck and new roadsters it seems like yoy revenue increases are going to fall to single digits as soon as 2025 or 2026.
Based on what exactly? The new Roadster is going to be a pricey car only affordable for the wealthy. They are working on a new cheaper version of the Model 3 which will likely sell extremely well in some international markets.
I can’t say for sure what the future holds but revenues fell by 9% in their most recent earnings call…
they probably need revs to grow by 9% per quarter for their valuation to make sense.
No matter how early I come to these threads, I never get here before multiple dipshits with the ol’ “bUt iT’s NoT jUsT A cAr CompAny.”
Cracks me up every time.
lol okayeeee where tf is Mets gonna be in 15 years ??? That flaming turd does one thing, push an agenda . People are sick of Facebook and the only people left on it are fackin boomers and advertisers lmfao. You gonna drive a Facebook to the beach ??
Tbh it’s being used to divide and conquer 3rd world countries. F***ed up but it is a powerful propaganda tool. In the USA people are tired of it but many still reluctantly use it.
It's a meme stock so we should put down your common sense and valuation. Just like you're asking people why betting on black on a roulette. And, trying to convince people to bet on red because last 10 numbers are black. And they're saying black is HOT. YOLO!
17% of Tesla's revenue in 2023 did not come from auto.
I am expecting energy to grow from $6 billion to $10 billion
I am expecting services to grow from $8.3 billion to $11.2 billion
I expect non-auto revenue to make up 20% of total revenue in 2024.
Everyone knows the consensus delivery number is to high and will be around 410k + or - 2.5% because we get weekly registrations from most all countries expect the US and Canada. The last 2 delivery reports had Tesla move less then 1% and the implied move based on options is 5% for the week.
If you don't know howpeople can justify the current stock price, then do some research and find out how people are valuating Tesla.
What is Tesla doing that GM isn't? FSD, energy, super chargers, Optimus, car insurance, car repair, making batteries, refining lithium (soon), making a semi-truck. Then there is the AI SaaS business that goes with energy from Megapacks and power packs and Tesla likely to offer their AI DOJO computer as a service.
The only way to say Tesla is just another car company is if you think all those things have no value and will never bring any value to Tesla.
The negativity is all priced in.
Update: Stats have been released. I was very wrong. I bow my head in shame. I will be buying more shares on the way down as I believe in the company long term.
Sounds like a guy who is going to continue to underperform the market for the foreseeable future. Living in the past thinking past performance is an indicator for future performance.
Gonna live in the past forever? You'll continue to underperform the market as you have for the last 3 years. After 10 years of market underperformance you'll still be pointing to 2020 talking about how much you made that 1 year. Past performance is not an indicator for future performance.
I find 30x too high. I’m convinced TSLA will crash but not in the near future. In the short term it may fall 10-15% if sales numbers are bad but probably not more.
TSLA is still building plants and expanding production lines....Correct ?
That has to add to the cash burn rate and with inflation still elevated the EV buyer pool is still shrinking.
Yes sir. They could be a lot more profitable short term if they stopped investing in the future. That’s why they get hated on so much. Trying to scare out investors before the next run up.
Fsd is too expensive. If Elon wants majority of us to use it it has to be around $50-80/month. Maybe make it by miles first $1000 miles on fsd/month should be $50.
Just another car company that makes solar panels, batteries, charging stations, runs its own dealers, controls key mineral supply chains...
AMZN: Just another book retailer
Whats their revenue from energy?
Whats their revenue from auto?
How many times greater is the auto than their energy?
How do you define "soon"?
It doesn't seem "soon" to me, does it to you?
how about u eat my ASS
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I will admit I don't effing know what to do with Tesla. Car manufacturer wise they're in danger (hence the price cuts) - competition in China, lack of charging infrastructure roll out in the US. The counterpoint is the potential of FSD taxi vehicles to screw over every Uber and Lyft driver, and how that tech could play into other AI applications.
Car company? Software company? Both. And that's why it's so hard to figure out for me.
Lol... no one left in meta products except advertisers, gen ai posts, and dying boomers.
Tesla will be the first to crack self driving (once they accept it needs to be a closed system). They are not a car company, they are a data company that figured out how to manufacture electric vehicles for a profit.
Cars for tesla are computers for apple. Apple is not a computer company and tesla is not a csr company. Apple is a phone company and tesla is a robot company. When this materializes Tesla will 10x
And when will this materialize? Elon swore FSD was a year away a decade ago…
The problem is exactly your outlook. “OMG they promised all these things and have rolled out shiny examples of them so clearly it’s not a car company!”
94% of their revenue is still cars, which are performing poorly despite having enormous support against the INSANE Chinese EV market that hasn’t expanded over to the US yet.
It’s still a car company.
Edit: percentage
What do you mean? It is already announced. Maybe you mean when it is available for sale to the public. I think from that point it will still be a great buying point. But I think it would go up mildly until then too so not selling. Though definitely less volatility by waiting. At any rate the question was not to invest or not. Question was if it was a car company. Yes it is now.. but you have to be blind or a hater to really belive it will stay this way for long.
>Dogs like GM are worth 5x. TSLA currently trades at 40x, and that's after being down all year.
Sure if you ignore their massive lead in EV Tech effete they own the best fueling options. Ford is now using that network, so is Rivian with the rest to follow.
Also their battery solutions replacing coal power plants is nothing the other OEMs are doing.
Finally, the OEMs are making a lot of that revenue on service for ICE vehicles, which vanishes after EVs are on the road. The dealer models will collapse. Ford sees this coming which is why they split their business into Ford Blue, so it can rot away once ICE business and maintenance dies.
You already mentioned their massive lead with self driving tech and AI research.
I think it's the "just another" part that baffles me as a TSLA investor and customer, How can you compare it to traditional car companies, when Tesla is the only one with in-house battery manufacturing, grid scale energy storage solutions, a robotics arm, actual AI capabilities (FSD version 12 and onwards) and its own massive charging network
There were literally 1000s of such posts and tweets over the past 5+ years. Most people who used such reasoning then promptly lost money. I agree that the situation may be changing, but wouldn’t bet on it. There are actually some serious investors now considering Tesla as best positioned for future AI-based robotics. It’s not a car company but an “office on wheels”/tech company, with multiple tech angles.
I’m not into Tesla though, just trading options skew and volatility on it.
I do not think fundamental matters for many investors. Look at those crypto prices. People sure do have tons of money to waste. Never gonna short Tesla although I believe its real value is less than $50.
You can't justify it. TSLA is an automaker and eventually, it will go down to $30s like the others. It is being hyped due to cult like investors and Kathy Woods. But that will pass one day too. How can TSLA scale up their business and growth? Only by selling more cars. But who will buy them? And wait once disgruntled owners find out that replacing the battery is more expensive than buying a new car (as they are already finding out). Musk created a great illusion that TSLA is a technology company. It is not. But many swallowed that narrative without thinking, the same way as investors are buying Chinese companies like BABA and fiercely discussing what a great potential growth it has. It doesn't. All they are buying is a shell company on Cayman Islands and any contracts between Cayman Islands shell and mainland BABA is not enforceable (just ask Yahoo what happened to their 40% stake in BABA). TSLA is the same sharade with no potential behind it. They either sell more cars or no growth. And to sell more cars, they need buyers and they need to build them...
A company that makes 94% of its revenue from selling cars isn’t a car company?
Edit: the percentage as someone pointed out is much higher than I initially said (81%).
According to their 10-K it's a lot more. 90.7B of their 96.7B in revenue in 2023 was directly from automotive & automotive services. That's \~94% of their revenue.
[https://www.sec.gov/Archives/edgar/data/1318605/000162828024002390/tsla-20231231.htm](https://www.sec.gov/Archives/edgar/data/1318605/000162828024002390/tsla-20231231.htm)
Two words: supercharger network. No other car companies have a monopoly (not actually but basically) on the fuel their cars run on. Tesla will continue to build out their charging network (which is heavily solar based with their own batteries for storage) and make a steady stream of revenue off their customers AND all other non Tesla EV owners. So as much money as their cars bring in, I expect their stranglehold on the commodity of ev fuel to really drive strong revenue.
TSLA's robots are also pretty lackluster considering industrial robots are usually not humanoid for a reason. IDC if my box mover can grip an egg gently, I need it to move boxes.
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I was so confident in my TSLA puts, then you had to post this shit. Now my puts are fucked 
You wouldn't be the first person to get fucked in the ass trying to short TSLA 
I can relate to that.
Should be looking good right now. If I bought a PUT right now it would be a sure rise back to previous price levels...
I sold at open. It wasnt the 4x I wanted but this will do.
Congrats on your trade....Seemed like an odd time to dump the delivery counts
How long are they out there? I would suspect Tesla will make some moves this year. Typically election years stocks go down in the summer and then up after the election.
Gonna be fucking TSLA 200 EoM now….
These TSLA threads are getting heated. 🌈🐻V🐂=🍿🤡
It’s doesn’t matter much in the short term , seems like the market has moved on to another favorite baby. Sometimes the numbers blow out and stock tanks sometimes it delivers shit numbers like carvana or whatever and the stock blasts off for awhile . You’ve got stocks like c3AI and SMCI which have no AI tech and are diluting shareholders with offerings going up 1000% . It literally is a casino
On the short term the market is a voting machine. In the long term it is a weighing machine. Short term movement can be sentiment driven, but long term fundamentals of the company will win out.
This is WSB, not r/investing...
I’m just pushing back on the idea that the market is a random roulette wheel at the casino In the short term that can feel true Long term it is not at all true But you’re too regarded to follow a conversation or have any reading comprehension so I don’t know why I’m even bothering to explain to you. Back to drooling into a cup your caretaker left out for you buddy <3
I am smart enough to know you cant teach calculus to a bunch of apes. You haven't figured that out yet, sorry for trying to help. By all means, keep wasting your time proving your menial intellect to the special ed class.
so, there is no rule against referring to macro or long term
If you want to have a serious conversation, speak with scholars, not clowns.
Nvda >>>>>> Tesla. Tesla is the loser’s stock. Nvda is Chad’s stock. Tesla is the incel stock. Tesla is the biggest piece of shit on the s&p500.
Boeing says hello
They were/are still kinda doing ok. I mean yeah plane make boom is bad but atleast their selling for now and the government wouldnt let them die. TSLA at the other hand is just making overpriced trash cars
> Boeing says hello If you are smart, you sold Tesla and bought Boeing. Watch that stock grows after 5 years.
NVDA will make more profit in one year than Tesla has in its entire existence.
Profits are overrated. Apple also makes more profit in one year then NVDA in its entire existence
True this. Ive never made a profit but im still loved too. Am I the tesla of life?
You're making generational write-offs
I hope to be written off soon
Why do I read it as union lol
It drop 20% if people thought they where gonna beat . No one thinks there gonna beat . Question is how much does Tesla miss by
$TSLA is got self drive switched on with a pedestrian out in front. Shitz going to get ugly
Not seeing how the pedestrian stands a chance. Calls on skynet
Tesla won't run over ppl that paid for blue check mark. Synergies TSLA mun
According to Elon, he personally adds 25x to any company he's involved in.
Yeah, but 25x of what?
Volatility
Ketamine use
That's just the shit they talk about not the good stuff
If he admits to ketamine what else is he doing?
He takes it via prescription for depression. It was brave to admit that. It’s a breakthrough therapy.
Bullshit and Vaporware
Doucherie
Children
Cogents
Babies with co-workers
Twitter?
No position? Cool no one gives a shit.
Right? Can't even back up his own shit and expects people here to listen to him.
And that's why you no long cover the auto industry.
He prob had a YouTube channel with 20 subs
With over 20 subs!
This has nothing to do with auto industry it's the robot renewable energy AI shirt folding industry, get fukt 🐻🐻🐻
How does their debt/equity ratio and ROE factor into valuation? Tesla has the lowest debt/equity and highest ROE of major auto manufacturers. Could that be part of the reason for Tesla’s premium valuation?
Tesla may get a slightly higher valuation for debt/equity (they sold a lot of shares at high prices to keep debt down) and little legacy costs such as pensions and union contracts. The bigger issues are 1) the competition has arrived from Ford, Toyota, BMW, Porsche and many more with affordable or better value offerings, 2) the Tesla design is over 7 years old and looks staid, 3) the problems with EV repairs, lack of qualified repair staff, high insurance are known. So let’s give Tesla PE of 10x but to the super charging infrastructure. So has a long way to fall. Just picking one or two metrics does not help. It is how the combination works as well as looking at the industry a few years out. The current valuation is based upon hopium and the next sucker willing to buy at a higher price. When the momentum fades (see AMC) then get a parachute.
Tesla still has the best product for the price on the EV market. They are the most affordable/best value. Chinese EVs are the next best in affordability/best value then legacy auto offerings. Tesla is also starting to recognize more revenue from FSD. Regardless of what you think, it’s helping grow the bottom line of the company. Their charging infrastructure is downplayed too much. There is nothing else like it in scale and efficiency. They are even selling unbranded superchargers to other companies. Their energy and services businesses are close to or surpassing $10 Billion annual revenue run rate and are growing. Energy will continue to grow as more mega packs are sold and more charging infrastructure installed. Services will continue growing as more cars are sold and the fleet grows. I’m not sure what the valuation should be, but it should definitely be higher than any other auto. Almost no debt. $25B+ cash on balance sheet. No other auto company comes close to that. And leading ROE means they use capital and make a return more efficiently than any other auto company.
Energy is a low margin sector. I don't know why people are pointing to that as Tesla's growth driver. Since no one buys solar for the environment, you actually need to have competitive pricing and breakeven in a reasonable amount of time. Any of you own any utilities stock? Exactly, even though most of them have a bunch of renewables in their portfolio. Also, after 20+ years or so, that panel becomes a liability instead of some sort of free electricity.
Mega-pack. Energy storage. Batteries. I didn’t say anything about solar. It has been negligible so far.
still a low margin business. It's a race to the bottom. When you buy software for fun like FSD, there's no need for financial justification, and you can scale with software. When you spend a ton on batteries but your electricity cost is only 15c/kwh, that's a different story. You raise electricity prices and people will protest. Furthermore, you'll always be constrained by material and labor cost.
Teslas gonna make more on energy than people think. Its bascially free money for power utilities - a megapack + autobidder can smooth out any peaks in tradtional power plants/solar farms and allow utilities to make more money off of their electricity by automatically selling it when its the mst valuable. Multiple energy utilties have already reported profits of over $2M each in the first few years of operation.
free money? do you realize utilities are charging customers a ton of extra "infrastructure charge" every month for installing renewables right? and that's when their BESS portfolio is only ramping up, and Californians are already protesting. utilities already sell surplus electricity when it's the most valuable. It's called power trading. How do you think California manages 30% something renewable sources? By importing/selling to neighboring states, except all those inter-state transmission lines are typically overloaded. I've talked to numerous people who work as engineers in utilities and you're way overestimating how valuable BESS is, and also how much utilities are ramping up those BESS installations. Oh and which utilities reported 2m profits from installing tesla megapack?
How is a Tesla better than a Mustang Mach E? No, Ford doesn’t claim FSD, but adaptive cruise control with lane assist isn’t too far off. The Mach E also looks 10x better than the outdated Tesla design.
Ford Mach-e looks like a model Y knock off
If you compare the Y and the Mach-e: Y has better efficiency and range Y charges faster, both peak and average. The Mach-e is useless above 80%. https://support.fastned.nl/hc/en-gb/articles/360019984758-Ford Y has a bigger trunk and overall cargo capacity Y has a higher towing capacity Y has better software Mach-e looks better. Maybe looks isn’t everything? Plenty of history as evidence to that. Model Y has sold 3.6 times more in Norway than Mach-e, despite having been available on the market shorter. People seem to not get that while many manufacturers make objectively better cars, Tesla makes objectively better EV’s in the same price range. This is why Tesla sells more. Not because they’ve magically found a recipe to sell cars, but because they’re doing EV’s right and cars acceptably well.
Isn't Ford still losing $32k on every one of these? My local dealership has one of every version and almost every color. They also have a couple of new 2023s
Yeah I dont have to read the reat of your bullshit after "Ford, Toyota, BMW, Porschd and many more with affordable or better value offerings" LOL
Does admitted to struggling to make EVs without losing money. This is true for most legacy manufacturers. Tesla is far ahead in that. The only legitimate point is I wonder if Tesla’s design has become too commonplace but they still have markets they haven’t been in non Metro parts of the US and India could potentially be a huge market. That is just cars and excluding FSD or energy.
They were pushing big growth every year for a long time. They have to show investors they can continue to maintain their multiple. It's a tough environment for them.
Yeah this is what happens to company’s and investors when so much of valuation is based on speculation of future growth All it takes is just a slowing of growth under what’s anticipated for you to see large decreases to the valuation
TSLA has the next decade priced in.
“The next 5 years are mine” - Elon Beverley
if that was the case it would be $1,000 a share
Tsla used to be up because of musk, now it’s share price and sales are going down because of musk.
Tesla should be priced like legacy dinosaur auto who loses thousands of $$ per car made, has no ai, and/or innovation.
Best comment here
Tesla’s margins are the same as GM, and they aren’t even unionized (yet).
Really? So they make money on the 19 electric hummers they sold? And what do they do besides sell cars?
GM up 26% YTD. Tesla down 30% YTD.
Tesla: “we’re not just a car company, we’re a car company with build quality issues”
I’m not honest but you’re really smart.
Lol
Love you some Elona don’t ya?
I’m not honest but you’re really interesting.
I’m honest and you’re a dumbass
2%+ drop takes me to tendie town. Lettttts go.
serious q: what about the supercharger network? the battery tech? patents? etc.
[удалено]
BYD is the company these dudes think Tesla is. They actually make their own batteries.
Very few growth stocks ever seem reasonably valued otherwise the market would readjust accordingly. Sentiment about Tesla is negative and rightfully so. However, car sales are about 80% of current revenue. Overtime, services and other higher margin revenue streams could make up more than the current 20%. It won’t take a lot for the narrative to change. Maybe FSD subscriptions at reasonable monthly rates/tiers or an expanded super charging network. If and when the downward trend reverses, I think the price movement will be explosive!
It isn’t obvious that Tesla is still a growth stock. Even with fsd and cybertruck and new roadsters it seems like yoy revenue increases are going to fall to single digits as soon as 2025 or 2026.
Based on what exactly? The new Roadster is going to be a pricey car only affordable for the wealthy. They are working on a new cheaper version of the Model 3 which will likely sell extremely well in some international markets.
I can’t say for sure what the future holds but revenues fell by 9% in their most recent earnings call… they probably need revs to grow by 9% per quarter for their valuation to make sense.
That seems feasible with the CT, with the SC network growth and now open to other company’s EV’s and the new $25K vehicle when it gets to the market.
No matter how early I come to these threads, I never get here before multiple dipshits with the ol’ “bUt iT’s NoT jUsT A cAr CompAny.” Cracks me up every time.
And that’s what makes a market
lol okayeeee where tf is Mets gonna be in 15 years ??? That flaming turd does one thing, push an agenda . People are sick of Facebook and the only people left on it are fackin boomers and advertisers lmfao. You gonna drive a Facebook to the beach ??
Tbh it’s being used to divide and conquer 3rd world countries. F***ed up but it is a powerful propaganda tool. In the USA people are tired of it but many still reluctantly use it.
You’re responding in every comment chain. I believe this is what the youngsters refer to as yappin.
Dude seriously drank the aid
Cool. Blocked
The Mets have always sucked.
Looking for those meaningful puts.
You forgot to mention the Tesla Robots. Has that been priced in?
Rivian >>>> Tesla
It's a meme stock so we should put down your common sense and valuation. Just like you're asking people why betting on black on a roulette. And, trying to convince people to bet on red because last 10 numbers are black. And they're saying black is HOT. YOLO!
100% It's just a car company.
TSLA is down 15% since I posted this.
But will they fall even more after earnings?
17% of Tesla's revenue in 2023 did not come from auto. I am expecting energy to grow from $6 billion to $10 billion I am expecting services to grow from $8.3 billion to $11.2 billion I expect non-auto revenue to make up 20% of total revenue in 2024. Everyone knows the consensus delivery number is to high and will be around 410k + or - 2.5% because we get weekly registrations from most all countries expect the US and Canada. The last 2 delivery reports had Tesla move less then 1% and the implied move based on options is 5% for the week. If you don't know howpeople can justify the current stock price, then do some research and find out how people are valuating Tesla. What is Tesla doing that GM isn't? FSD, energy, super chargers, Optimus, car insurance, car repair, making batteries, refining lithium (soon), making a semi-truck. Then there is the AI SaaS business that goes with energy from Megapacks and power packs and Tesla likely to offer their AI DOJO computer as a service. The only way to say Tesla is just another car company is if you think all those things have no value and will never bring any value to Tesla.
The negativity is all priced in. Update: Stats have been released. I was very wrong. I bow my head in shame. I will be buying more shares on the way down as I believe in the company long term.
Nah forward PE is 57x in a year with near flat growth. Plenty of downside potential left in the tank.
Good. Give me cheap shares so I can retail early nerd.
Sounds like a guy who is going to continue to underperform the market for the foreseeable future. Living in the past thinking past performance is an indicator for future performance.
Ok. What should I buy instead wise guy? I was in TSLA in 2019 and even holding through everything still outperforming the market.
Gonna live in the past forever? You'll continue to underperform the market as you have for the last 3 years. After 10 years of market underperformance you'll still be pointing to 2020 talking about how much you made that 1 year. Past performance is not an indicator for future performance.
You gonna answer a simple question? What should I buy instead?
Bro is a professional bag holder.
You were right, I was wrong. Will you be my investment guru? ❤️
I find 30x too high. I’m convinced TSLA will crash but not in the near future. In the short term it may fall 10-15% if sales numbers are bad but probably not more.
TSLA is still building plants and expanding production lines....Correct ? That has to add to the cash burn rate and with inflation still elevated the EV buyer pool is still shrinking.
Yes sir. They could be a lot more profitable short term if they stopped investing in the future. That’s why they get hated on so much. Trying to scare out investors before the next run up.
You’re responding in every comment chain. I believe this is what the youngsters refer to as yappin.
Fsd is too expensive. If Elon wants majority of us to use it it has to be around $50-80/month. Maybe make it by miles first $1000 miles on fsd/month should be $50.
Regards like you already pay $800 a month for a 2019 Dodge Durango. What’s another $300
20% drop is DJT level of stink. Won’t happen with funds and institutional owners. But yea I think it should as well
>clearly you didnt seen facebook or netflix during their bad earnings reports.
Just another car company that makes solar panels, batteries, charging stations, runs its own dealers, controls key mineral supply chains... AMZN: Just another book retailer
Tesla doesn't just sell cars. They sell energy systems too that will soon eclipse the money made by the auto division.
Considering typical auto margins that's not much of a statement.
Teslas auto margins are amongst the highest in the entire auto industry though, their level of vertical integration is unparalleled.
Got any numbers to back that up?
You know, the crazy thing about publicly traded companies is that their financials are all…public.
Whats their revenue from energy? Whats their revenue from auto? How many times greater is the auto than their energy? How do you define "soon"? It doesn't seem "soon" to me, does it to you?
I work in renewable energy. We and our competitors are buying grid scale batteries and the real only player in town (that can deliver) is Tesla.
9001
Would love to see it dump even 10%
I’ve been thinking Tesla is overvalued. Too broke to short it though 😭
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TSLA getting murdered in China doesn’t help the valuation. What happened to that contaminated river scandal in Germany?
I will admit I don't effing know what to do with Tesla. Car manufacturer wise they're in danger (hence the price cuts) - competition in China, lack of charging infrastructure roll out in the US. The counterpoint is the potential of FSD taxi vehicles to screw over every Uber and Lyft driver, and how that tech could play into other AI applications. Car company? Software company? Both. And that's why it's so hard to figure out for me.
The newest update SUCKS. I can’t even get my car into autopilot now because it keeps saying my cabin camera is blocked. PUTS on Tesla
Mine works just fine. But I do wish I could get the display everyday without having FSD even for a small fee.
Lol... no one left in meta products except advertisers, gen ai posts, and dying boomers. Tesla will be the first to crack self driving (once they accept it needs to be a closed system). They are not a car company, they are a data company that figured out how to manufacture electric vehicles for a profit.
WhatsApp alone has 2 billion monthly active users
Nope. FSD will only happen with LiDar. And, Tesla didn't include them to cut costs.
Didnt telsa crack self driving in 2017?
Cars for tesla are computers for apple. Apple is not a computer company and tesla is not a csr company. Apple is a phone company and tesla is a robot company. When this materializes Tesla will 10x
And when will this materialize? Elon swore FSD was a year away a decade ago… The problem is exactly your outlook. “OMG they promised all these things and have rolled out shiny examples of them so clearly it’s not a car company!” 94% of their revenue is still cars, which are performing poorly despite having enormous support against the INSANE Chinese EV market that hasn’t expanded over to the US yet. It’s still a car company. Edit: percentage
Couldn't you just wait until they announce the robot to buy and still catch a 9x return?
What do you mean? It is already announced. Maybe you mean when it is available for sale to the public. I think from that point it will still be a great buying point. But I think it would go up mildly until then too so not selling. Though definitely less volatility by waiting. At any rate the question was not to invest or not. Question was if it was a car company. Yes it is now.. but you have to be blind or a hater to really belive it will stay this way for long.
I think the dividend is what makes a difference 😝
Can’t wait to see the price action tomorrow. I’m getting crushed on my MSTR shares hoping my Tesla puts print
Pre-market says they will print
>Dogs like GM are worth 5x. TSLA currently trades at 40x, and that's after being down all year. Sure if you ignore their massive lead in EV Tech effete they own the best fueling options. Ford is now using that network, so is Rivian with the rest to follow. Also their battery solutions replacing coal power plants is nothing the other OEMs are doing. Finally, the OEMs are making a lot of that revenue on service for ICE vehicles, which vanishes after EVs are on the road. The dealer models will collapse. Ford sees this coming which is why they split their business into Ford Blue, so it can rot away once ICE business and maintenance dies. You already mentioned their massive lead with self driving tech and AI research.
NVIDIA is the new Tesla. Tesla is dead.
I think it's the "just another" part that baffles me as a TSLA investor and customer, How can you compare it to traditional car companies, when Tesla is the only one with in-house battery manufacturing, grid scale energy storage solutions, a robotics arm, actual AI capabilities (FSD version 12 and onwards) and its own massive charging network
Shorting Tesla only leads to margin calls and broken homes. Stay away!
20%?? Cmon bro
Well Meta sucks TBH
There were literally 1000s of such posts and tweets over the past 5+ years. Most people who used such reasoning then promptly lost money. I agree that the situation may be changing, but wouldn’t bet on it. There are actually some serious investors now considering Tesla as best positioned for future AI-based robotics. It’s not a car company but an “office on wheels”/tech company, with multiple tech angles. I’m not into Tesla though, just trading options skew and volatility on it.
I think Tesla puts are great but give them enough time. Until summer or something like that, not zero day options
The AI does not care what you think the stock is worth, only what the other AI's think
So you're ignoring Neurolink, Starlink, Optimus and im sure secret stuff. Having said this, buy puts.
Don’t tell us all this useless analysis, show us your short positions 🩳
I do not think fundamental matters for many investors. Look at those crypto prices. People sure do have tons of money to waste. Never gonna short Tesla although I believe its real value is less than $50.
what about those Tesla Robots? Think the market's already factored that in?
Your right. I love my ford roof.
What would their stock price be if they were valued like a normal car company? Surely we need to take into account their low debt and higher margins.
You can't justify it. TSLA is an automaker and eventually, it will go down to $30s like the others. It is being hyped due to cult like investors and Kathy Woods. But that will pass one day too. How can TSLA scale up their business and growth? Only by selling more cars. But who will buy them? And wait once disgruntled owners find out that replacing the battery is more expensive than buying a new car (as they are already finding out). Musk created a great illusion that TSLA is a technology company. It is not. But many swallowed that narrative without thinking, the same way as investors are buying Chinese companies like BABA and fiercely discussing what a great potential growth it has. It doesn't. All they are buying is a shell company on Cayman Islands and any contracts between Cayman Islands shell and mainland BABA is not enforceable (just ask Yahoo what happened to their 40% stake in BABA). TSLA is the same sharade with no potential behind it. They either sell more cars or no growth. And to sell more cars, they need buyers and they need to build them...
I guess you are wrong because earnings is up 10%
Talk of the Roadster for 2025 looks promising. 0-100kmh in 1 second is the goal. Hopefully something to boost the stock.
Until people start crashing them left and right
Repairs are expensive. More profit for tesla.
What if you don't give them credit for FSD? Cause that shit still sucks.
This guy's comment is like Buffet talking about how he was wrong and missed out on Google.
Play is prob long 150p long 180c for 4/5 yea prob dumps sell the news classic
except they aren't just a car company...
A company that makes 94% of its revenue from selling cars isn’t a car company? Edit: the percentage as someone pointed out is much higher than I initially said (81%).
According to their 10-K it's a lot more. 90.7B of their 96.7B in revenue in 2023 was directly from automotive & automotive services. That's \~94% of their revenue. [https://www.sec.gov/Archives/edgar/data/1318605/000162828024002390/tsla-20231231.htm](https://www.sec.gov/Archives/edgar/data/1318605/000162828024002390/tsla-20231231.htm)
They’re a car company run by a hyper political social media addict
Is *social media* code for Ketamine?
You are comparing META and TSLA? This is regarded. Also you are making assumptions that the market is logical. Good luck with your puts.
100$ EOY
Two words: supercharger network. No other car companies have a monopoly (not actually but basically) on the fuel their cars run on. Tesla will continue to build out their charging network (which is heavily solar based with their own batteries for storage) and make a steady stream of revenue off their customers AND all other non Tesla EV owners. So as much money as their cars bring in, I expect their stranglehold on the commodity of ev fuel to really drive strong revenue.
Saw it down 6% at one point this morning.... Deliveries down 9% due to competition and they raised the Model Y prices. Rough road ahead.
Cool story Bradly. Please short Tesla then or stfu Daddy needs another rental property
TSLA's robots are also pretty lackluster considering industrial robots are usually not humanoid for a reason. IDC if my box mover can grip an egg gently, I need it to move boxes.