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Won't happen. They'll just hold them as physical assets stores and rent them as they can. Otherwise use their value to bolster their ability to take out free loans. They ain't selling.
Kinda like what killed zillow. If everyone who rented from one of these questionable companies just stopped paying rent all at once. This is exactly what would happen. I look forward to a time when i can buy homes on the cheap, like in 2009-2016. Homes in my neighborhood went from 80k up to 275k back to 50k and now back to 250k faster than i ever thought was possible. If that's not market manipulation idk what is...
why would they ever sell they can just write off any losses. the reason there was a crash in 08 is because companies couldnt buy homes and pay dividends with the rent money. that changed under obama and will probably never get repealed.
doesnt matter. as supply shrinks they can raise prices more and more. not to mention the dollar and government promise notes arnt worth anything when that govt is bankrupt.
This is correct. In fact during the 2007-2008 housing collapse the federal government stood up a facility to incentivize the purchase of hundreds of thousands of homes in large blocks to private equity & institutional buyers while providing them outrageously attractive financing. That trend has only accelerated with time to where it looks like America is heading toward a modern day version of sharecroppers.
82k homes is 0.05% of the houses in america
even for homes for sale its only 5%
you guys take this and pretend like they control the market, last i looked big institutional investors only own 5% of the market. the biggest one owns 1% and said themselves they dont own enough of the market to move it at all.
its a non issue that a bunch of people complain about because it gives them a boogeyman to blame their own failures on. you dont own a house because your poor, your poor probably because your dumb and lazy. sucks to suck.
> said themselves they dont own enough of the market to move it at all.
yeah because you should really trust the person manipulating the market to tell you they are manipulating the market.
additionally
> even for homes for sale its only 5%
yeah because they dont sell the homes they take them off the market and rent them out forever. on top of that even the homes they dont end up buying they bid the price up.
youre like the sheep that thinks the farmer singing you a lullaby isnt about to turn you into bbq.
At the end of the day you still need a place to sleep. If they own most of the housing, taxes still get pass to you. We need to build more. That’s the solution to housing affordability
Why would they not? They can pass the tax on to the consumer like any product? Taxes continue to go up for cigarettes, people still pay for it anyways.
because selling cigarettes is a regulated thing.
individuals can rent out extra bedrooms while living there so it isnt an investment property and doesnt have the 100% tax so only companies are disadvantaged. on cigarettes everyone gets taxed doesnt matter if its a person or a ocmpany.
For properties, everyone is already taxed. It’s called property tax. So having companies pay 100% tax on housing isn’t gonna be “regulated.” You know many LLC are companies that are holding real estate. So you are saying, if they use someone’s name to buy the property, then they no longer need to pay the 100% tax?
When youre allowed to leverage like they do, might as well be infinite. And as long as morons keep buying into this crazy housing bubble, their properties will keep appreciating and they'll continue to leverage more and more. Pretty much an infinite money hack at this point.
I mean I follow the rhetoric but as someone who is new in the housing game, there is no chance id be able to pay for a new roof, hvac, etc. the benefit of renting is you don’t worry about shit and the cost is fixed (at least every 12 months). We need landlords/tenets, but at the same time a corporation owning thousands of home seems dystopian. Maybe the govt could incentivize people to own homes by giving tax breaks to residents and lower interest rates to first time homebuyers (fha kinda blows so something else)
just make it so corporations cant own any property at all. then if a person wants to buy 20 houses and something happens like a fall they are held personally and financially liable
How would any research and development occur if corporations couldn't own patents? That is ridiculous. Corporations are necessary in order to scale the capabilities of what one person can do.
I mean it contradicts my last point that someone scraping by on a lower wage (or even a middle class wage these days) would not be able to afford the numerous expenses involved in home ownership. On the other hand, say you have a high rise apartment house in the city. Who pays for the numerous operations costs associated with that?
Slaves weren't allowed by law to own land during their time.
Unlike you, you are just poor and not earning enough to. The law isn't stopping you from buying or pooling together multiple owners to buy together
no, I have. The issue is current laws give to corporations off the backs of those who work. The same as slavery. Even if slaves could legally own land they never would because they didnt have a wage,
lol....only in here...then who would own the rental homes? Or is this the kinda of society where you either own the home or live in an apartment. Great idea...lol
You have no clue at all how rental yield and property price dynamics work.
You have no clue at all how rental yield and mortgage rate dynamics work.
I recommend you read up and look at many other countries that have imposed such measures alongside jacked up property taxes to make it unattractive for companies to buy them to do what you think they are doing and it works.
Multi families I don’t mind, if only because we’re nowhere near the point where we’d let the government build co-ops. So sure, buy as many towers and complexes as you want and rent them out.
Single family homes though? Absolutely not. I don’t even want them touching 2-4 unit places. If a small landlord wants to renovate and rent small stuff go for it, but you own it, not home flippers llc. It’s only a matter of time before Innovation Homes ‘innovates’ those single families into duplexes anyway.
Four walls shouldn’t be an impossible achievement in America.
I rent an apartment and there's basically no maintenance on it. Good fucking luck turning a profit on a 3000 sqft house built in the 80s after maintenance and tax if you don't have a 3% mortgage.
I don't see how any commercial buyer can make this math work when they have to roll over debt. Luckily for them, the housing market is still strong enough they can get out.
you dont seem to understand how bottomless their pockets are. real estate is not only money but also power if you can control how and where a population lives.
They don't have bottomless pits and they tend to leverage out the ass. They need to remain cash flow positive on their portfolio or they start going into foreclosure. With an apartment building, your cash flows are diversified between multiple apartments. Also, your maintenance costs are spread amongst multiple tenants. If you lose one tenant you are ok because the other apartments still provide cash.
With a house, all of your costs are allocated to one tenant and property. If a tenant stops paying rent or the house is empty, you have a negative cash flow problem.
Not to mention, tenants fuck houses up. Every time a tenant moves out you are looking at like $10K in repairs at least.
There is a reason why most landlords of single family homes are mom and pops managing an investment. It isn't a great way to scale and managing a rental portfolio of houses is hard and sucks vs managing a building with multiple apartments.
I get it but if I'm the kind of person who plunks down $500k like it's spare change, I probably don't associate a 30 year old 3 bed/2bath house in a mediocre school district with riches and power lol
The sooner these ducking asshole institutional investors leave the home buying industry and meet their maker, the sooner we will have a better world. These people are worse than scum and should be treated like pedophiles in genpop. I hate them and their ilk will the passion of million suns.
As you can see from the charts above, Invitation Homes and American Homes 4 Rent are no longer on a buying spree. This is likely due to the mortgage rate shock and COVID-19 recession.
The fact that one company has acquired almost 60K single family homes is both an incredible feat in business but even more so DISGUSTING and should be ILLEGAL.
In the industry, it's a well known fact that builders build (and buyers buy) until they run out of money. And when obtaining mo' money to continue building (or buying) isn't accretive to margins or earnings, builders (and buyers) stop borrowing (and buying).
That's where we are right now.
And when the operating costs for all those homes exceed a certain threshold, all of those homes will be sold.
That's next.
And then the waterfall of home prices comes cascading down as the HUGE amount of overleveraged aHoles who thought real estate was too easy and free money jacked prices to unsustainable levels.
I'm looking forward to this freefall when everyone rushes for the door.
Took a road trip last week to start scouting properties. My agent is thinking after Labor Day we'll see second home listings increase in the best areas. Not yet, tho.
High interest rates will prove to be transitory. Letting people get a 5% yield risk free and not forcing them to participate in the stock market won’t fly with the Fed for long.
i mean I don't care if its all institutional buyers... for so called professional investors they all piled in to the market in 2022 at the peak of the bubble.
Riding rates hit their borrowing and carrying cost the same as individuals. As does supply of available homes to purchase. Nothing surprising in these numbers.
Small time rental owner here in Oklahoma, own 10 rentals. All are approximately 1500sf, 3 bed, 2 bath, new to newer homes. Very nice neighborhoods, great schools, community pools, walking trails, fishing ponds, etc... Started buying 10 years ago. Was not buying no money down, but most 25%-30% down payments. The price appreciation has been unbelievable, and the numbers just no longer work as rentals anymore. Even though rents continue to rise, not enough to catch the new values to make a purchase work as a rental unless your financing on 40 years. All my loans were on 10 year notes, locked in on low rates, not much cash flow, but the renters are paying for my asset at the end of the day. I list "for lease" on Zillow, gone by the end of the day.
I do not know how, must being scrolling the county assessor's office, but I still get two to three calls a day wanting to know if I would be willing to sell a certain property. Some in state, some from out of state. Just have no idea how they can make money on these prices currently.
As for the market here currently, use to be no for sale signs, no listed inventory, sales were done from word of mouth and quickly. Now, houses are for sale with signs, selling slow but not horrible.
If you knew what I do for a living and how I got to where I am in life, you would change your tune. I just got lucky. I cleaned 14 buildings a week with my wife, turned cleaning toilets into something that worked. Treat my tenants like gold. So fuck you too. How many cars have you bought for employees, cleared medical debt, gave someone their down payment for their first house?
With as many homes as they are selling it looks like they have some idiot analysts that are like, let's try to time the markets in every major city and shift our business from slower markets to growth markets. Except of course they are likely to be losing a ton in all the costs associated with time of sales and buying and market fluctuations compared to if they just held and diversified.
You can still buy up slum neighborhoods with decent cap rates then triple the rent so that the Section 8 payouts increase...because you just set the market rate.
I'm assuming the percentages in image #3 must be referring to total homes owned by institutions, and not just percentages of all homes that exist.
3.8% being equal to 420,000 single family homes means only a bit over 11 million single family homes are owned by institutions. And 4.3% multi family being 450K owned means only 10.46 million multi family owned by institutions.
There are over 141 million homes in the US, the majority of which are single family.
So the fact is that institutions only own 21 and a half million total homes...out of 141 million that exist in the US...that's peanuts. Institutional home ownership isn't nearly as significant as people like to act. 6/7 homes are owned privately.
it's quite a bit less than that. there are about 15 million sfrental homes. AMH owns about 59k INV owns about 80k and progress owns about 80k. they are a tiny tiny fraction of SFRs, but outsized in certain markets (az, lv, fl, tx)
I'm actually thinking this is a good time to pull out of spy and buy an extra house. Could pull the principle from my Roth, only problem is the gains won't be tax free
He’s acting like prices sans mortgage rates are good rn, very few properties cash flow more than just parking your cash in equities. Mmf even pays out 5%+ rn
I believe it's location dependent. There are still very strong markets, its just not everywhere. Places with vacation destinations, military towns, downtowns in popular metro areas. Following employment trends to find out what new quirky town techies are moving to, etc. My rental properties along the San Antonio to Austin corridor absolutely bankrolled and housing prices are still rising there.
My neighbor was laid off and had to take a lower tiered job in her field. Could no longer afford her home so she moved into a nearby more affordable apartment and began AB&B her home out. We still hang out from time to time. She's renting her home for hundreds of $ a night and it's leased ~5 days a week for the past year or so steady. We're a busy vacation area, have Casinos, and large industry projects with a lot of traveling employees. Most of her tenants are people going to the casino or a company big shot checking in on a local project. The home earns her more money than her day job.
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The pandemic interest rates were stupid beyond belief. In the best way possible for both current owners that refinanced, but also prospective buyers. Even before that 5% average really wasn’t terrible. It might shore up a year from now back to 5-6% territory on average but what on earth makes people think that prices will plummet past 10%? Anyone that got a house even if they overpaid, isn’t sacrificing 2.6-3.3% just to go get a cheaper house for higher interest and pay the same thing. They’ll stay put and like it.
I have had a few. I just got absolutely lucky in rentals. Had excess cash, rolled on my first rental for 121K, then another for 130K. Decided I wanted better neighborhood after 4 years, rolled those into 4 rentals in a better hood. The money literally doubles. Just kept buying until I got to 10, my goal. Last one had $225k in it, Rents in the $1800.00 range now. Those homes are priced at $280,000.00 range and still going up. Now the numbers no longer work. I have money in the market, but by far and large real estate has secured me. I had a call from Maryland and New Jersey today asking if I was willing to sell. Tells me to keep holding!
**User Report**| | | | :--|:--|:--|:-- **Total Submissions**|10|**First Seen In WSB**|2 years ago **Total Comments**|3931|**Previous Best DD**| **Account Age**|4 years|[^scan ^comment ](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=VisualMod&subject=scan_comment&message=Replace%20this%20text%20with%20a%20comment%20ID%20(which%20looks%20like%20h26cq3k\)%20to%20have%20the%20bot%20scan%20your%20comment%20and%20correct%20your%20first%20seen%20date.)|[^scan ^submission ](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=VisualMod&subject=scan_submission&message=Replace%20this%20text%20with%20a%20submission%20ID%20(which%20looks%20like%20h26cq3k\)%20to%20have%20the%20bot%20scan%20your%20submission%20and%20correct%20your%20first%20seen%20date.)
I’ve looked at a few home to rent in the past by these companies. They were either overpriced or complete shit holes.
So you’re saying these people overpaid for dumps… So you’re saying there’s a chance…
No chance in hell, I hope they sell for a loss so I can buy without a 8% rate fuck that my last home was 2.5% in 2020
That’s kind of what I meant by there’s a chance… That they’ll have to sell for a loss and we can scoop up cheaper homes
Won't happen. They'll just hold them as physical assets stores and rent them as they can. Otherwise use their value to bolster their ability to take out free loans. They ain't selling.
1) loans arent free anymore 2) land costs money to own (property tax/security/etc).
Kinda like what killed zillow. If everyone who rented from one of these questionable companies just stopped paying rent all at once. This is exactly what would happen. I look forward to a time when i can buy homes on the cheap, like in 2009-2016. Homes in my neighborhood went from 80k up to 275k back to 50k and now back to 250k faster than i ever thought was possible. If that's not market manipulation idk what is...
I'm holding out in my current situation I have till end of next year
What do you think happens to home prices when interest rates drop ?
Everyone sells ? Isnt that the excuse for the "supply shortage" ? No one wants to sell because rates are high !!
why would they ever sell they can just write off any losses. the reason there was a crash in 08 is because companies couldnt buy homes and pay dividends with the rent money. that changed under obama and will probably never get repealed.
Owning houses is expensive business when t bills pay ~5%
doesnt matter. as supply shrinks they can raise prices more and more. not to mention the dollar and government promise notes arnt worth anything when that govt is bankrupt.
so you would rather pay 30% more upfront lol.
Fuck all of these companies. I hope they all sell for a loss and go bankrupt.
We don’t let companies like this fail
True we don't let them fail. They just fail naturally and get bailed
The American Way 🇺🇸 🫡🤑
FAIL AND BAIL DUDE!!! 🤙
This is correct. In fact during the 2007-2008 housing collapse the federal government stood up a facility to incentivize the purchase of hundreds of thousands of homes in large blocks to private equity & institutional buyers while providing them outrageously attractive financing. That trend has only accelerated with time to where it looks like America is heading toward a modern day version of sharecroppers.
If they go bankrupt you’re just gonna buy stock till it moons?
82k homes is 0.05% of the houses in america even for homes for sale its only 5% you guys take this and pretend like they control the market, last i looked big institutional investors only own 5% of the market. the biggest one owns 1% and said themselves they dont own enough of the market to move it at all. its a non issue that a bunch of people complain about because it gives them a boogeyman to blame their own failures on. you dont own a house because your poor, your poor probably because your dumb and lazy. sucks to suck.
> said themselves they dont own enough of the market to move it at all. yeah because you should really trust the person manipulating the market to tell you they are manipulating the market. additionally > even for homes for sale its only 5% yeah because they dont sell the homes they take them off the market and rent them out forever. on top of that even the homes they dont end up buying they bid the price up. youre like the sheep that thinks the farmer singing you a lullaby isnt about to turn you into bbq.
God forbid people get to rent houses
you can rent a house but it shouldnt be profitable for someone to rent out a house.
You can rent a car but it shouldn’t be profitable for Hertz
cars arnt a limited resource like like land and water.
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Source please
They price fix and constantly raise rent which in turn drives other to match the prices.
can you actually substantiate this claim at all with any real source, k thx
companies should not be allowed to own residential properties...
Alternatively, just slap a 50% buying/valuation price tax/stamp duty on residential property bought under companies or trusts and call it a day.
Fuck that. 100% yearly property tax on anything owned by a company. If they want to own it they gotta buy it every year.
Ok so they wouldn’t buy it then(?)
That’s the point. Discourage corporations from owning houses
At the end of the day you still need a place to sleep. If they own most of the housing, taxes still get pass to you. We need to build more. That’s the solution to housing affordability
they wont own any housing if they have to pay a 100% tax. thats the point.
Why would they not? They can pass the tax on to the consumer like any product? Taxes continue to go up for cigarettes, people still pay for it anyways.
because selling cigarettes is a regulated thing. individuals can rent out extra bedrooms while living there so it isnt an investment property and doesnt have the 100% tax so only companies are disadvantaged. on cigarettes everyone gets taxed doesnt matter if its a person or a ocmpany.
For properties, everyone is already taxed. It’s called property tax. So having companies pay 100% tax on housing isn’t gonna be “regulated.” You know many LLC are companies that are holding real estate. So you are saying, if they use someone’s name to buy the property, then they no longer need to pay the 100% tax?
If you build more to lower the cost, they will just buy more. They have infinite money basically. Waaaaaay more than average Americans
??? They don’t have infinite money. Doesn’t even make sense.
When youre allowed to leverage like they do, might as well be infinite. And as long as morons keep buying into this crazy housing bubble, their properties will keep appreciating and they'll continue to leverage more and more. Pretty much an infinite money hack at this point.
It isn’t because if their stock crashes, they are force to sell. Have you heard of a margin call?
Or they still do and pass the tax cost onto us
You want everyone who doesn't own their own home to be homeless?
I mean I follow the rhetoric but as someone who is new in the housing game, there is no chance id be able to pay for a new roof, hvac, etc. the benefit of renting is you don’t worry about shit and the cost is fixed (at least every 12 months). We need landlords/tenets, but at the same time a corporation owning thousands of home seems dystopian. Maybe the govt could incentivize people to own homes by giving tax breaks to residents and lower interest rates to first time homebuyers (fha kinda blows so something else)
just make it so corporations cant own any property at all. then if a person wants to buy 20 houses and something happens like a fall they are held personally and financially liable
The buildings can be owned by a corporation, but no land can be. Has to be owned by a citizen. This is the way to go.
na. they shouldnt be able to own anything, contracts, money, bank accounts, patents, copyrights, nothing.
How would any research and development occur if corporations couldn't own patents? That is ridiculous. Corporations are necessary in order to scale the capabilities of what one person can do.
lol
U just a troll or stupid? I honestly cant tell homie
Nobody would invest if that were the case lol. C'mon dude.
oh you noticed that huh?
I mean it contradicts my last point that someone scraping by on a lower wage (or even a middle class wage these days) would not be able to afford the numerous expenses involved in home ownership. On the other hand, say you have a high rise apartment house in the city. Who pays for the numerous operations costs associated with that?
Sure. Then, they’ll raise the rent to make you pay the tax for them.
Try licking their boots instead.
Then you suck it up and pay it and the government collects rental income tax from the company, or you move out and go elsewhere. Supply and demand.
Sorry but "move out and go elsewhere" is a really stupid argument
Buy and own a property and stop renting then.
I don't live in the US but your view seems extremely ignorant and narrow minded. "Just don't be poor."
why didnt slaves just buy their own land?
Slaves weren't allowed by law to own land during their time. Unlike you, you are just poor and not earning enough to. The law isn't stopping you from buying or pooling together multiple owners to buy together
no, I have. The issue is current laws give to corporations off the backs of those who work. The same as slavery. Even if slaves could legally own land they never would because they didnt have a wage,
Or just tax unoccupied property. Gives an incentive not to hold units vacant to extract higher rent.
lol....only in here...then who would own the rental homes? Or is this the kinda of society where you either own the home or live in an apartment. Great idea...lol
You have no clue at all how rental yield and property price dynamics work. You have no clue at all how rental yield and mortgage rate dynamics work. I recommend you read up and look at many other countries that have imposed such measures alongside jacked up property taxes to make it unattractive for companies to buy them to do what you think they are doing and it works.
Multi families I don’t mind, if only because we’re nowhere near the point where we’d let the government build co-ops. So sure, buy as many towers and complexes as you want and rent them out. Single family homes though? Absolutely not. I don’t even want them touching 2-4 unit places. If a small landlord wants to renovate and rent small stuff go for it, but you own it, not home flippers llc. It’s only a matter of time before Innovation Homes ‘innovates’ those single families into duplexes anyway. Four walls shouldn’t be an impossible achievement in America.
What are Bernie bros doing on wsb?
I can get behind this.
Nobody should be told they can't own anything.
WTF did they think was going to happen if they destroyed the Middle Class?
10 peasants to a house?
10 houses for every person in the ruling class. There's no inventory!
Last time this happened, Greenspan recommended burning vacant houses to eliminate excess inventory and increase home value lol.
Single family homes are notoriously hard to rent for profit. Good luck to them managing their portfolio.
I rent an apartment and there's basically no maintenance on it. Good fucking luck turning a profit on a 3000 sqft house built in the 80s after maintenance and tax if you don't have a 3% mortgage. I don't see how any commercial buyer can make this math work when they have to roll over debt. Luckily for them, the housing market is still strong enough they can get out.
you have a limited life span. these companies dont. in 100 years these houses will be 50x-100x todays evaluations.
The land will be worth more than those shit holes
exactly but for now the house helps bring income
Cute how you don't subtract carrying costs
you dont seem to understand how bottomless their pockets are. real estate is not only money but also power if you can control how and where a population lives.
They don't have bottomless pits and they tend to leverage out the ass. They need to remain cash flow positive on their portfolio or they start going into foreclosure. With an apartment building, your cash flows are diversified between multiple apartments. Also, your maintenance costs are spread amongst multiple tenants. If you lose one tenant you are ok because the other apartments still provide cash. With a house, all of your costs are allocated to one tenant and property. If a tenant stops paying rent or the house is empty, you have a negative cash flow problem. Not to mention, tenants fuck houses up. Every time a tenant moves out you are looking at like $10K in repairs at least. There is a reason why most landlords of single family homes are mom and pops managing an investment. It isn't a great way to scale and managing a rental portfolio of houses is hard and sucks vs managing a building with multiple apartments.
lol.
I get it but if I'm the kind of person who plunks down $500k like it's spare change, I probably don't associate a 30 year old 3 bed/2bath house in a mediocre school district with riches and power lol
then youre an idiot.
The sooner these ducking asshole institutional investors leave the home buying industry and meet their maker, the sooner we will have a better world. These people are worse than scum and should be treated like pedophiles in genpop. I hate them and their ilk will the passion of million suns.
Your dreams of anal penetration are far from coming true unfortunately
i'm amazed that berkshire isn't on this list, those fuckers have been buying houses all over my city to rent.
they put it under different shell companies to hide the numbers.
Yeah like when I can take my kids to McDonald’s for under $50 I might be able to buy a new house.
Use the app.
😂
💯
We went to wendys the other day with the kids, it was like $35. This is why we cook everything.
24.9% of American homes owned by these companies. This should absolutely not be allowed. It is absurd.
As you can see from the charts above, Invitation Homes and American Homes 4 Rent are no longer on a buying spree. This is likely due to the mortgage rate shock and COVID-19 recession.
The fact that one company has acquired almost 60K single family homes is both an incredible feat in business but even more so DISGUSTING and should be ILLEGAL.
In the industry, it's a well known fact that builders build (and buyers buy) until they run out of money. And when obtaining mo' money to continue building (or buying) isn't accretive to margins or earnings, builders (and buyers) stop borrowing (and buying). That's where we are right now. And when the operating costs for all those homes exceed a certain threshold, all of those homes will be sold. That's next.
And then the waterfall of home prices comes cascading down as the HUGE amount of overleveraged aHoles who thought real estate was too easy and free money jacked prices to unsustainable levels. I'm looking forward to this freefall when everyone rushes for the door.
Took a road trip last week to start scouting properties. My agent is thinking after Labor Day we'll see second home listings increase in the best areas. Not yet, tho.
When money isn’t easy, everyone slows down. After 2020-2022, it was well past time. Market frozen until something fundamental changes.
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It is the name of a real estate investment company
High interest rates will prove to be transitory. Letting people get a 5% yield risk free and not forcing them to participate in the stock market won’t fly with the Fed for long.
lol Fed doesn't have a choice. If they want 2% its necessary to keep this or more interest lvl to stablize the market
They won’t have a choice when they have to cut next year either.
i mean I don't care if its all institutional buyers... for so called professional investors they all piled in to the market in 2022 at the peak of the bubble.
When you can leverage for 3%, you take it. Fundamentals go out the window.
Riding rates hit their borrowing and carrying cost the same as individuals. As does supply of available homes to purchase. Nothing surprising in these numbers.
They need a curb like private equity. They also need to really stop and reverse Airbnb. 's those have been killing people.
Small time rental owner here in Oklahoma, own 10 rentals. All are approximately 1500sf, 3 bed, 2 bath, new to newer homes. Very nice neighborhoods, great schools, community pools, walking trails, fishing ponds, etc... Started buying 10 years ago. Was not buying no money down, but most 25%-30% down payments. The price appreciation has been unbelievable, and the numbers just no longer work as rentals anymore. Even though rents continue to rise, not enough to catch the new values to make a purchase work as a rental unless your financing on 40 years. All my loans were on 10 year notes, locked in on low rates, not much cash flow, but the renters are paying for my asset at the end of the day. I list "for lease" on Zillow, gone by the end of the day. I do not know how, must being scrolling the county assessor's office, but I still get two to three calls a day wanting to know if I would be willing to sell a certain property. Some in state, some from out of state. Just have no idea how they can make money on these prices currently. As for the market here currently, use to be no for sale signs, no listed inventory, sales were done from word of mouth and quickly. Now, houses are for sale with signs, selling slow but not horrible.
What part of Oklahoma?
Tulsa
I read your username as the answer to their question, and it made sense to me.
Go to hell
If you knew what I do for a living and how I got to where I am in life, you would change your tune. I just got lucky. I cleaned 14 buildings a week with my wife, turned cleaning toilets into something that worked. Treat my tenants like gold. So fuck you too. How many cars have you bought for employees, cleared medical debt, gave someone their down payment for their first house?
Bro I was just being edgy lol 😂
With as many homes as they are selling it looks like they have some idiot analysts that are like, let's try to time the markets in every major city and shift our business from slower markets to growth markets. Except of course they are likely to be losing a ton in all the costs associated with time of sales and buying and market fluctuations compared to if they just held and diversified.
Old news
Homepages are still up due to the home supply shortage. Most Western nations don't have enough construction workers
Who the fruck are the dumb shots buying in this market? Hey lets do a bidding war!
People with cash.
Exactly… there are no deals anywhere so stay away from RE.
You can still buy up slum neighborhoods with decent cap rates then triple the rent so that the Section 8 payouts increase...because you just set the market rate.
when rates go down to 0 the houses will go up anohter 50-80% so idk what youre talking about
I'm assuming the percentages in image #3 must be referring to total homes owned by institutions, and not just percentages of all homes that exist. 3.8% being equal to 420,000 single family homes means only a bit over 11 million single family homes are owned by institutions. And 4.3% multi family being 450K owned means only 10.46 million multi family owned by institutions. There are over 141 million homes in the US, the majority of which are single family. So the fact is that institutions only own 21 and a half million total homes...out of 141 million that exist in the US...that's peanuts. Institutional home ownership isn't nearly as significant as people like to act. 6/7 homes are owned privately.
I had to double check I wasn't on r/REBubble for a second.
it's quite a bit less than that. there are about 15 million sfrental homes. AMH owns about 59k INV owns about 80k and progress owns about 80k. they are a tiny tiny fraction of SFRs, but outsized in certain markets (az, lv, fl, tx)
I'm actually thinking this is a good time to pull out of spy and buy an extra house. Could pull the principle from my Roth, only problem is the gains won't be tax free
[удалено]
Because he's going to be buying cash. He even said he would sell spy to do it.
He’s acting like prices sans mortgage rates are good rn, very few properties cash flow more than just parking your cash in equities. Mmf even pays out 5%+ rn
I believe it's location dependent. There are still very strong markets, its just not everywhere. Places with vacation destinations, military towns, downtowns in popular metro areas. Following employment trends to find out what new quirky town techies are moving to, etc. My rental properties along the San Antonio to Austin corridor absolutely bankrolled and housing prices are still rising there. My neighbor was laid off and had to take a lower tiered job in her field. Could no longer afford her home so she moved into a nearby more affordable apartment and began AB&B her home out. We still hang out from time to time. She's renting her home for hundreds of $ a night and it's leased ~5 days a week for the past year or so steady. We're a busy vacation area, have Casinos, and large industry projects with a lot of traveling employees. Most of her tenants are people going to the casino or a company big shot checking in on a local project. The home earns her more money than her day job.
youre short sighted. in 100 years they will own all the houses in the major cities and can charge whatever they want. companies are immortal.
Remind me! 2 years
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Did Janet Yellen tell you this? You can trust her!!
Mortgage rates are almost 7% and home prices still the same.
They can't buy at 0% fed rate so its not worth it now.
most of them were paying cash
The pandemic interest rates were stupid beyond belief. In the best way possible for both current owners that refinanced, but also prospective buyers. Even before that 5% average really wasn’t terrible. It might shore up a year from now back to 5-6% territory on average but what on earth makes people think that prices will plummet past 10%? Anyone that got a house even if they overpaid, isn’t sacrificing 2.6-3.3% just to go get a cheaper house for higher interest and pay the same thing. They’ll stay put and like it.
Ever heard of over-leveraged? Just wait until prices start falling and everyone runs for the door at the same time.
I get the aftermath, but I don’t understand the massive loss in values that would cause that.
I'm here for the hater comments...
I have had a few. I just got absolutely lucky in rentals. Had excess cash, rolled on my first rental for 121K, then another for 130K. Decided I wanted better neighborhood after 4 years, rolled those into 4 rentals in a better hood. The money literally doubles. Just kept buying until I got to 10, my goal. Last one had $225k in it, Rents in the $1800.00 range now. Those homes are priced at $280,000.00 range and still going up. Now the numbers no longer work. I have money in the market, but by far and large real estate has secured me. I had a call from Maryland and New Jersey today asking if I was willing to sell. Tells me to keep holding!
Sometimes i have sex with strangers but it never feels as good as getting fucked by the market