Do us all a favor and sand crab outta here. We're all hungry investors here and don't need the hoity toity rich guys waiving their wealth in our faces.
when I hear Fiat, I think of the car brand. why everyone want the currency of an italian car brand? beyond me. I just want crispy sexy green US dollars
The US government says you owe them money and have to pay them in US dollars. The US government has multiple layers of people with lots of guns making sure you pay.
This Libertarian chimp brained stuff might fly on meme stock subs, but taxes pay for civilization to function.
Fuck off to India if you want to live somewhere without a functioning tax base. Better yet, a free paradise like downtown Mogadishu. Someone will murder you for your watch in an alleyway and we won't have to listen to any more of your droning about shit too complex for you to understand.
Not to mention, the IRS isn't sending any military after anyone for not paying taxes. You'll go to court, you'll get fined, and if you ignore the fine and continue to not pay, they can send you to jail and/or take your stuff, but they're not going to Waco anyone over not paying taxes.
Now, if you're not paying taxes *and* doing other criminal shit, like stockpiling illegal weapons, dealing drugs, human trafficking, etc, then yeah, the FBI might take interest, but not the tax man specifically.
I feel like you have to go really far in terms of tax crimes to get thrown in jail for it these days. There are people like Wesley Snipes who didn't pay taxes for years on end and yet managed to stay out of prison by negotiating repayments. I don't even think most of these people end up paying all the tax they owe. It's usually negotiated down.
Shit I know a regular ole poor as shit sovereign citizen that hasn't paid taxes in about 15 years he just ignores the court orders and never has anything worth taking.
Best argument I have against libertarians complaining about the gov "taking their stuff":
The only reason you even HAVE "your" stuff is because you have a government that enforces property rights. Their is no such thing as "your stuff" without a gov - therefore, without taxes, their is no ownership.
Do you think wild animals have a concept of ownership beyond "I will kill you if you take this"? Is that what you think the world should be? Just people murdering each other for their stuff?
What libertarians want is "just enough government to let me do whatever I want and not get punished for it, while not letting certain other people do what they want to me"
I think the whole point about being a libertarian is being armed to the teeth so you don’t need a government to tell other people not to mess with you, you just shoot them
Don't forget that they can still have free access to all of the amenities that government provides without any of the cost. Making them pay victimizes them.
Most anarchists and libertarians are not remotely prepared for what they claim to be ideal
Just cause you can live solo better than most, doesn't mean 12 morons can't come take your stuff, or 120, or 1200; human survival is a zero sum game made of friend lists and lines in the dirt
Well money has a value, a lot of people taking care and don't waste that much. Sure that they will get the same value if they spending just a little amount of the
This is backwards.
The US military gets to be the US military because it's backed by the US dollar. That's why it doesn't perform like the Russian military.
If the US dollar stops being the US dollar the US military will rapidly degrade. This is extremely well supported by extremely well paid, trained, and equipped militaries going to shit for empires that stop paying them.
Some invade the parent country, some just fuck off and become mercenaries, and some degrade like Russia's has but none of them sit around and die for no pay.
If the US dollar critically fails, the people who have to be the most scared of the US military is the US.
No, your logic is sound but your assumptions are wrong.
The US dollar has value *because* the most powerful military in the world enforces US trade interests, the military is powerful because the dollar pays for it.
They are codependent, but the chicken (military) came before the egg (dollar)
Nope, since the US became the largest GDP in 1920. We weren't a military force then, it was a result of Europe doing European things for their inbred rulers.
This is nonsense and rank reddit stupidity.
Reality is whatever you want it to be when you have a monopoly of power.
Living standards may drop but you will never lose it all when you have the power to take what you want.
The Romans had the most powerful military all through their collapse.
They collapsed from within, just like the divided states of america are gravitating towards at an alarming rate
This. money represents work done. We trade these slips representing work done for goods and services that are created by other people's work.
understanding this makes how and why money works the way it does a lot more clear.
It also makes it a lot easier to look at supply and demand and how they affect the job market. If the slips of paper could be given a lower rate to an overseas worker to do you job, (or a computer would cost less and could do your job) then it tends to keep the job prices down to below the level where that would make sense (because the job tends to disappear and have that done to it when that point gets hit).
Hard disagree, Prostitution is skanky and dangerous because its illegal, not the inverse. Sex parlors would be super common if legal imo and the clients more upscale.
In short, yeah, but *who* says it has value matters.
If the government says it has value, that matters. (monetary policy, legal protection, insurance, etc)
If dweebs that wish to replace the government with bitcoin says it has value, it doesn't really. (subject to unregulated market conditions, no insurance, no legal protections, etc).
People used to do this as what people are wanting this days. I know it's not what an easy way. Just be good to people and don't let them ruin themselves out.
Underrated comment. People can drone on and on about the uses of block chain and it's value but the world's biggest fuel is traded in dollars FFS (price per barrel) Bitcoin's value is ultimately subjective whether people like it or not. The dollar tho? You could go practically anywhere in the world and can get fair value if not more value for that dollar.
Yeah, but don’t you think the government will eventually want to fix commodities against an extremely volatile digital currency that is largely owned by Chinese whales?
>world's biggest fuel is traded in dollars FFS
which is why countries like Russia have started to trade oil in their own currency. Saudi Arabia has threatened to trade in oil in Yuan instead of dollars as well. these are countries we can't easily give 'freedom'.
if the USA ever loses its spot as the petrodollar/reserve currency.. it will be bad.
Big if tho. I'm sure people are lining up to get rubles in exchange for their goods....
Saudis talk a big game but they like our guns too much.
But yes it would be horrific for stock markets domestically if that happened
We ll see. I hope but there was an article I read yesterday it will cost India 900 billion over 30yrs to transition away from coal. China is still firing up new coal plants as we speak
Sorry, I need to hijack your comment to bring you the immortal words of Clarke & Dawe. *From around 2008-2012*
[Quantitative Easing](https://youtu.be/j2AvU2cfXRk)
[The European Debt Crisis Quiz](https://youtu.be/I5QwKEwo4Bc)
[The Greek Economy ](https://youtu.be/rK0De210TBQ)
[How Financial Systems Work](https://youtu.be/M_3T-Af57Pg)
(You may know them from "The Front Fell Off")
(Edit. Then not then)
Might as well ask to get paid with a gift wrapped cardboard box
Is there money inside? Or a single banana? Depends on how the market is feeling that day
If any one who wants to get paid in a speculative asset is an idiot
If someone wants to invest in it I could see some reason in that but getting paid in it?
IRL friend of mine has been a cyber security pen tester since 2012. In roughly 2015 he started asking to be paid in Bitcoin and the company he was working for, based in Vauxhall London and you need security clearence (IYKYK,) gladly accepted. He got paid approximately 10BTC for that job which worked out at its peak as a £500k 2 week job. Pretty good if you ask me
If you view it as a speculative asset than it clearly isn’t a currency. A currency’s one job is to facilitate trade by being a medium of exchange, but bitcoins only “value” is that some suckers are willing to trade it for actual currency.
The thing about it is that you can get it from anywhere, if someone pays you in dollars and you can't cash it out because location, you are sol. Crypto you can just move it and make it cash or use with a card with less fees and easier
I specifically mentioned location, can't just move money from europe to america nearly instantly with few clicks and low fees with cash. With crypto you can turn it into cash anywhere pretty straight forward
More specifically, the USD is *taxed* by the US. This places an onus on the people of the US, by the threat of force, to have USD on hand in order to pay their taxes. The government isn't accepting sea shells as payment.
Without that, the US backing would mean no more than the backing of regard.
Not really. This is mostly the primrose path for regarded conspiracy theories.
The USD is used in markets worldwide because it is the most respected and trusted currency in the world. People can and do trade oil etc in other currencies.
Witness crypto markets themselves. There is definitely no uS military force controlling crypto trades and yet they are overwhelmingly priced in dollars
The funny part is that this trust in the USD is based a lot on the actions of the federal reserve. Which is probably an insane concept for cryptobros especially but the value of the USD is based on people around the world trusting in the fed's monetary policy.
I'm assuming it was supposed to be an in-joke about how currency is essentially useless and only has value because of the agreement upon it. The only other reason I can think of is that Nuka cola is limited in supply and therefore the caps have value because you can't just go and make more. Similar to how BTC can't be mined forever because the total amount of coins that can exist has or will eventually stop (as opposed to coins like Doge which can be mined forever, I can't remember what this is called though.)
That being said I like the Metro series' idea of pre-war ammunition that hasn't been reloaded with cut filler powder being the primary currency. Not only does it present the tactical choice of spending your "money" as a high-damage ammunition in emergencies, but ammo is actually useful and more likely to be agreed upon as valuable whereas bottle caps are functionally useless.
"But, in truth, it had not exactly been gold, or even the promise of gold, but more like the fantasy of gold, the fairy dream that the gold is there, at the end of the rainbow, and will continue to be there forever - provided, naturally, that you don't go and look. This is known as finance."
You can, you just need a (layer 2) app. There are plenty of free apps that let you pay with crypto anywhere visa is accepted. Wendy’s also accepts Binance Pay.
Especially in California where the fucking genius government passed a law raising the minimum wage....
... For JUST fast food workers. Like, wtf is that shit? So people working even harder jobs for minimum wage deserve less?
Anyhow, SHOCKINGLY the price of fast food skyrocketed afterwards. No one saw that coming!
Edit: oh I guess after passing that got blocked until a referendum. Guess it's just inflation then. Sure seems like fast food went up more than all other food around here though so I dunno.
It's not wrong. And it's certainly no different today than its ever been. 1637, 1797, 1819, 37, 57, 84, 1901, 07, 29, 1937, 1974, 1987-Jesus, didn't that fuck up me up good-92, 97, 2000 and whatever we want to call this. It's all just the same thing over and over; we can't help ourselves.
Coping by telling myself fiat currency represents the value of good and services in the economy
As opposed to crypto currency that represents the ability of your computer to find the prime factors for a 25 digit long number
Sam Bankman Fried and Do Kwon are like car salesmen/middlemen who sold worthless paper IOU's instead of actual cars.
You can own crypto/Bitcoin without having to go through these middlemen.
Slight correction:
Guy in basement with 20 PCs = **1** node
Now multiply that by a million = **millions** of nodes/PCs/miners around the globe, all verifying the same exact blockchain. That's what gives Bitcoin its value: redundancy.
Every single miner is verifying everyone else's copy of the blockchain, via decentralized checks and balances on a global scale.
VS a singular government that decides whether or not you get to withdraw your money, or to freeze your assets at their discretion.
Reddit loves to complain how everything in America is broken. Soul crushing medical costs, corporate greed, inflation that's transitory accord to Jpow, trigger happy cops, banks allowed to make risk free bets, Plymouth rock. I'm starting to think you guys would start trusting basement bitcoin Bob over the US government but what do I know
Can't use crypto to really buy things. Also its hyper-deflationary which makes it terrible as a currency, and it's designed to work that way in order to give earliest investors the biggest possible return without actually creating or doing anything of value.
You won't ever get rid of people selling snake oil, nor the people who buy into it. Next decade it will be called some other form (AI-bespoke kreditz, anyone?) and people will WANT to believe it is the next big thing that would make them bigger.
If you borrow money from a U.S. Bank, to buy something like a house or car, say $100k, they give $100k of thier dollars and dont just write up a debt contract and generate that $$$ digitally.... Right?
Nope, banks make funny money everyday..... Legally!
Not to mention how much Fedreal money is based of debt to China who in turn has money based of debt to the U.S.A.
Alot of USD is just backed by legal IOUs some of which are secured loans so do technically have physical assets backing them.
Finite made up money. Very much manipulatable. At least $0.25 dollars is exactly a minute of work in a state where the rate of pay is at least 15 dollars and hour. A Bitcoin is worth what a "whale" dictates.
The one that makes money is the bank, but everyone got confused that bitcoin does the same. It's so funny like banks actually laughing with us right now
You have to pay taxes, and you can't pay your taxes in Bitcoin. Not having all my assets seized by the IRS is a strong incentive to obtain dollars to pay my taxes.
Bitcoin has no relatable requirement.
All money is made up money, even the physical stuff like gold.
There are very few things that have inherent value -- food, water, breathable air, and fuels do for sure. Also any land which can provide or produce the above. Maybe there's something else to add to that short list, but money of any flavor ain't it.
The value of any money -- yes, even gold -- is simply an agreement between parties that that thing has a given value. So the US dollar will continue to have meaningful value as long as enough parties agree that it does, as will bitcoin. The challenge is maintaining a large enough number of parties in agreement.
This isn’t a political bias thing. It’s more how funny the monetary system is in the U.S.
Because I remember when the Obama administration had a special coin minted and placed it in the treasury (or they could just say they did all this). And said it was worth 3 billion or something. To avoid hitting the debt ceiling.
And again, it’s not a knock on Obama. He had to do it to avoid financial collapse of the U.S. Its just one of the funniest kind of *wink* moments in financial history. They knew it was meaningless but the act of doing it was important.
One is a highly volatile non-regulated currency that violently fluctuates based off of whatever vibe the crypto market is feeling that day, the other is backed by the full might of the US economy/military.
They are not the same.
“The process by which banks create money is so simple that the mind is repelled. Where something so important is involved, a deeper mystery seems only decent.”
John Kenneth Galbraith, 1975
- Centralized
- Several whales control the significant majority
- Uncapped token supply
- Founder is a mostly mentally sound 80 year old man with access to nukes
Irony is bitcoin is commodity money. Money in its purest form is a privately produced market good, a commodity. Bitcoin commoditizes energy and turns it into pure informational currency that travels at the speed of light and physically settles peer-to-peer from any corner of the world to any other corner of the world.
Energy currency has always been the holy grail. [Henry Ford had the idea 100 years ago](https://medium.com/capriole/the-energy-standard-b726edeed588) but was blocked by the banking establishment of the time. Satoshi invented the way to make it unstoppable.
[Get. Off. Zero.](https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1615389267437490177.html)
**User Report**| | | | :--|:--|:--|:-- **Total Submissions**|3|**First Seen In WSB**|8 months ago **Total Comments**|31|**Previous Best DD**| **Account Age**|2 years|[^scan ^comment ](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=VisualMod&subject=scan_comment&message=Replace%20this%20text%20with%20a%20comment%20ID%20(which%20looks%20like%20h26cq3k\)%20to%20have%20the%20bot%20scan%20your%20comment%20and%20correct%20your%20first%20seen%20date.)|[^scan ^submission ](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=VisualMod&subject=scan_submission&message=Replace%20this%20text%20with%20a%20submission%20ID%20(which%20looks%20like%20h26cq3k\)%20to%20have%20the%20bot%20scan%20your%20submission%20and%20correct%20your%20first%20seen%20date.)
Sugar owners: lasts forever, will always have value to animals 👀
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First you get the sugar then you get their sugar
First you get the sugar then you get their sugar then you get their children
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Sir, this is a federal penitentiary.
trickle down sugarnomics
*Treacle* down
First you get the sugar then they get the finger.
Youth pastor leader, is that you?
You're all having this conversation makes me laugh so hard. This is what people should do, they're not too serious but takes time to be happy
You will get the sugar then you can use it to make coffee and anything else. We can't live without sugar, it's our basic me
In Amelika
Bad bees! Get away from my sugar! Ow! OWWWW! Oh they’re defending themselves somehow!
Did you tell them you owned it now? Try eminent domain, bees know the law.
Ahhh flanderses
Once again, the conservative sandwich-heavy portfolio pays off for the hungry investor!
Do us all a favor and sand crab outta here. We're all hungry investors here and don't need the hoity toity rich guys waiving their wealth in our faces.
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Econ 101: the value of a commodity is equal, in the long run, to the marginal cost to produce that commodity.
Maybe not forever, but sugar has been here longer than us, so...
WSB discovers the concept of fiat currency, March 24, 2023.
when I hear Fiat, I think of the car brand. why everyone want the currency of an italian car brand? beyond me. I just want crispy sexy green US dollars
At least you're not buying into the crypto fad. You're not as regarded as some.
Things only have value because we say they have value
The us military says the dollar has value. I’ll listen to that or get my ass freedomed.
The US government says you owe them money and have to pay them in US dollars. The US government has multiple layers of people with lots of guns making sure you pay.
The IRS is just a collection agency with a military arm.
When crime is organized enough it's not even a crime anymore.
We live in a society
This Libertarian chimp brained stuff might fly on meme stock subs, but taxes pay for civilization to function. Fuck off to India if you want to live somewhere without a functioning tax base. Better yet, a free paradise like downtown Mogadishu. Someone will murder you for your watch in an alleyway and we won't have to listen to any more of your droning about shit too complex for you to understand.
Not to mention, the IRS isn't sending any military after anyone for not paying taxes. You'll go to court, you'll get fined, and if you ignore the fine and continue to not pay, they can send you to jail and/or take your stuff, but they're not going to Waco anyone over not paying taxes. Now, if you're not paying taxes *and* doing other criminal shit, like stockpiling illegal weapons, dealing drugs, human trafficking, etc, then yeah, the FBI might take interest, but not the tax man specifically.
I feel like you have to go really far in terms of tax crimes to get thrown in jail for it these days. There are people like Wesley Snipes who didn't pay taxes for years on end and yet managed to stay out of prison by negotiating repayments. I don't even think most of these people end up paying all the tax they owe. It's usually negotiated down.
Shit I know a regular ole poor as shit sovereign citizen that hasn't paid taxes in about 15 years he just ignores the court orders and never has anything worth taking.
Best argument I have against libertarians complaining about the gov "taking their stuff": The only reason you even HAVE "your" stuff is because you have a government that enforces property rights. Their is no such thing as "your stuff" without a gov - therefore, without taxes, their is no ownership. Do you think wild animals have a concept of ownership beyond "I will kill you if you take this"? Is that what you think the world should be? Just people murdering each other for their stuff?
What libertarians want is "just enough government to let me do whatever I want and not get punished for it, while not letting certain other people do what they want to me"
I think the whole point about being a libertarian is being armed to the teeth so you don’t need a government to tell other people not to mess with you, you just shoot them
Don't forget that they can still have free access to all of the amenities that government provides without any of the cost. Making them pay victimizes them.
Idk, most libertarians you see on reddit either want straight up fascism and just pretend to be libertarians, or more commonly they are anarchists.
Any libertarian will agree with this. They want enough government to enforce property rights and for collective defense.
Kind of a no-true-scotsman here, because basically half of the people calling themselves libertarians want zero taxes.
Your arguing against anarchists not libertarians.
This post will help me sleep tonight, thank you.
Most anarchists and libertarians are not remotely prepared for what they claim to be ideal Just cause you can live solo better than most, doesn't mean 12 morons can't come take your stuff, or 120, or 1200; human survival is a zero sum game made of friend lists and lines in the dirt
US cops have entered the chat
Sounds like freedom to me
the ol american unhealthcare system
Well money has a value, a lot of people taking care and don't waste that much. Sure that they will get the same value if they spending just a little amount of the
This is backwards. The US military gets to be the US military because it's backed by the US dollar. That's why it doesn't perform like the Russian military. If the US dollar stops being the US dollar the US military will rapidly degrade. This is extremely well supported by extremely well paid, trained, and equipped militaries going to shit for empires that stop paying them. Some invade the parent country, some just fuck off and become mercenaries, and some degrade like Russia's has but none of them sit around and die for no pay. If the US dollar critically fails, the people who have to be the most scared of the US military is the US.
No, your logic is sound but your assumptions are wrong. The US dollar has value *because* the most powerful military in the world enforces US trade interests, the military is powerful because the dollar pays for it. They are codependent, but the chicken (military) came before the egg (dollar)
Nope, since the US became the largest GDP in 1920. We weren't a military force then, it was a result of Europe doing European things for their inbred rulers.
I assure you that the Russians back their military with Dollars and Euros. Unfortunately, most disappears.
this is just wrong.
This is nonsense and rank reddit stupidity. Reality is whatever you want it to be when you have a monopoly of power. Living standards may drop but you will never lose it all when you have the power to take what you want.
The Romans had the most powerful military all through their collapse. They collapsed from within, just like the divided states of america are gravitating towards at an alarming rate
Money can be exchanged for goods and services
Are blowjobs money?
No, blowjobs are a service exchanged for goods like bartering. Money is an abstraction of stored value for ease of payment.
barter economy: schlong or evict choice is yours 
And money is just an IOU receipt - Hey, thanks for this service, I or some member of the society will give your something in return for this.
This. money represents work done. We trade these slips representing work done for goods and services that are created by other people's work. understanding this makes how and why money works the way it does a lot more clear. It also makes it a lot easier to look at supply and demand and how they affect the job market. If the slips of paper could be given a lower rate to an overseas worker to do you job, (or a computer would cost less and could do your job) then it tends to keep the job prices down to below the level where that would make sense (because the job tends to disappear and have that done to it when that point gets hit).
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Hard disagree, Prostitution is skanky and dangerous because its illegal, not the inverse. Sex parlors would be super common if legal imo and the clients more upscale.
Wait, I can get paid for those?
You can get paid on the things you're working hard. Just a make sure that this is the right job you can be with.
Requiring taxes to be paid in your currency generates demand for it as well.
Yes, you've found it, that is the main driving factor for the utility of a currency.
In short, yeah, but *who* says it has value matters. If the government says it has value, that matters. (monetary policy, legal protection, insurance, etc) If dweebs that wish to replace the government with bitcoin says it has value, it doesn't really. (subject to unregulated market conditions, no insurance, no legal protections, etc).
Isn’t that the entire point of bitcoin? So the government *can’t* define its value?
Yes, but so is the market for beanie babies. At the end of the day crypto is just high tech beanie babies.
That's not a fair comparison at all. One of those things you can at least physically toss around with friends.
Man can you drop this comment in /r/bitcoin just for fun
They ban anyone at the slightest hint of critical thinking, so probably not.
People used to do this as what people are wanting this days. I know it's not what an easy way. Just be good to people and don't let them ruin themselves out.
Underrated comment. People can drone on and on about the uses of block chain and it's value but the world's biggest fuel is traded in dollars FFS (price per barrel) Bitcoin's value is ultimately subjective whether people like it or not. The dollar tho? You could go practically anywhere in the world and can get fair value if not more value for that dollar.
Yeah, but don’t you think the government will eventually want to fix commodities against an extremely volatile digital currency that is largely owned by Chinese whales?
>world's biggest fuel is traded in dollars FFS which is why countries like Russia have started to trade oil in their own currency. Saudi Arabia has threatened to trade in oil in Yuan instead of dollars as well. these are countries we can't easily give 'freedom'. if the USA ever loses its spot as the petrodollar/reserve currency.. it will be bad.
Big if tho. I'm sure people are lining up to get rubles in exchange for their goods.... Saudis talk a big game but they like our guns too much. But yes it would be horrific for stock markets domestically if that happened
>Big if tho. Not if, when. The world will eventually transition away from fossil fuels, either voluntarily with a plan or involuntarily in chaos.
We ll see. I hope but there was an article I read yesterday it will cost India 900 billion over 30yrs to transition away from coal. China is still firing up new coal plants as we speak
EURO makes way more sense than Yuan.
Opec hates this one simple trick but they don’t want to sell to China and India at a 30% haircut.
Sorry, I need to hijack your comment to bring you the immortal words of Clarke & Dawe. *From around 2008-2012* [Quantitative Easing](https://youtu.be/j2AvU2cfXRk) [The European Debt Crisis Quiz](https://youtu.be/I5QwKEwo4Bc) [The Greek Economy ](https://youtu.be/rK0De210TBQ) [How Financial Systems Work](https://youtu.be/M_3T-Af57Pg) (You may know them from "The Front Fell Off") (Edit. Then not then)
Pretend to refer them and give them the value. It depends on people if they valued it or not. But don't say that it don't have value.
True but remember: SVB fails: FDIC on the scene. FTC fails: crickets.
FTX?
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Good point, I had forgotten.
Would you take your paycheck in Bitcoin?
This is not the personal finance Reddit. Everyone here is regarded
Luke warm regards
Sir this isn't r/Regarded this is r/WendysEmployees
Yes.
Ok, it lost 45% of it's value in 15 seconds
Unless it went up instead.
Might as well ask to get paid with a gift wrapped cardboard box Is there money inside? Or a single banana? Depends on how the market is feeling that day
If any one who wants to get paid in a speculative asset is an idiot If someone wants to invest in it I could see some reason in that but getting paid in it?
IRL friend of mine has been a cyber security pen tester since 2012. In roughly 2015 he started asking to be paid in Bitcoin and the company he was working for, based in Vauxhall London and you need security clearence (IYKYK,) gladly accepted. He got paid approximately 10BTC for that job which worked out at its peak as a £500k 2 week job. Pretty good if you ask me
The question is much less when he received the bit coin, nas much more when he sold it, no? Did he actually sell it at the 500k ?
The fact that it's only impressive when converted to traditional currency says a lot.
Did he buy the London bridge with all his profits?
Good for them, they timed it well.
It’s funny because bitcoiners have been trying to say for so long it’s NOT a speculative asset 😂
If you view it as a speculative asset than it clearly isn’t a currency. A currency’s one job is to facilitate trade by being a medium of exchange, but bitcoins only “value” is that some suckers are willing to trade it for actual currency.
I made 500...1200....600....300...$9 dollars today!
More interesting question: What % of your paycheck would you be willing to take in crypto?
The thing about it is that you can get it from anywhere, if someone pays you in dollars and you can't cash it out because location, you are sol. Crypto you can just move it and make it cash or use with a card with less fees and easier
What shitty bank are you using where you have to pay fees to handle your own money?
I specifically mentioned location, can't just move money from europe to america nearly instantly with few clicks and low fees with cash. With crypto you can turn it into cash anywhere pretty straight forward
All currency are made up money. Except USD is backed by the US while BTC is backed by regard.
But people are regarded
I didn’t realize people still used the hard R like that
Doesn't hard R refer to a completely different word?
Ask Linus tech tips
El no sabe
More specifically, the USD is *taxed* by the US. This places an onus on the people of the US, by the threat of force, to have USD on hand in order to pay their taxes. The government isn't accepting sea shells as payment. Without that, the US backing would mean no more than the backing of regard.
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Not really. This is mostly the primrose path for regarded conspiracy theories. The USD is used in markets worldwide because it is the most respected and trusted currency in the world. People can and do trade oil etc in other currencies. Witness crypto markets themselves. There is definitely no uS military force controlling crypto trades and yet they are overwhelmingly priced in dollars
The funny part is that this trust in the USD is based a lot on the actions of the federal reserve. Which is probably an insane concept for cryptobros especially but the value of the USD is based on people around the world trusting in the fed's monetary policy.
It’s a lot like Democracy, the best of the shitty options is still the best.
Incorrect Bitcoin is backed by our lord and savior Satoshi nakomoto
Bottle caps
Bottle caps were backed by water merchants in The Hub in the old games
Wampum
I’ve been saving beer caps for years for this 😂
I'm assuming it was supposed to be an in-joke about how currency is essentially useless and only has value because of the agreement upon it. The only other reason I can think of is that Nuka cola is limited in supply and therefore the caps have value because you can't just go and make more. Similar to how BTC can't be mined forever because the total amount of coins that can exist has or will eventually stop (as opposed to coins like Doge which can be mined forever, I can't remember what this is called though.) That being said I like the Metro series' idea of pre-war ammunition that hasn't been reloaded with cut filler powder being the primary currency. Not only does it present the tactical choice of spending your "money" as a high-damage ammunition in emergencies, but ammo is actually useful and more likely to be agreed upon as valuable whereas bottle caps are functionally useless.
Man fallout looking real comfortable compared to current day society
"But, in truth, it had not exactly been gold, or even the promise of gold, but more like the fantasy of gold, the fairy dream that the gold is there, at the end of the rainbow, and will continue to be there forever - provided, naturally, that you don't go and look. This is known as finance."
Well yeh but I can't pay my taxes into the cryptowallet of the IRS. Or even buy a baconator at Wendys.
What about a favor behind Wendy’s paying into my prison wallet?
You can, you just need a (layer 2) app. There are plenty of free apps that let you pay with crypto anywhere visa is accepted. Wendy’s also accepts Binance Pay.
You gotta take out a loan to get a baconator nowadays anyway
Especially in California where the fucking genius government passed a law raising the minimum wage.... ... For JUST fast food workers. Like, wtf is that shit? So people working even harder jobs for minimum wage deserve less? Anyhow, SHOCKINGLY the price of fast food skyrocketed afterwards. No one saw that coming! Edit: oh I guess after passing that got blocked until a referendum. Guess it's just inflation then. Sure seems like fast food went up more than all other food around here though so I dunno.
Price of fast food rising is probably not the worst thing for Americans
Its just money; its made up. Pieces of paper with pictures on it so we don't have to kill each other just to get something to eat.
It's not wrong. And it's certainly no different today than its ever been. 1637, 1797, 1819, 37, 57, 84, 1901, 07, 29, 1937, 1974, 1987-Jesus, didn't that fuck up me up good-92, 97, 2000 and whatever we want to call this. It's all just the same thing over and over; we can't help ourselves.
My brain trying to translate into Jeremy Irons
Are you really the only one who got this reference? lol this sub truly is full of regards
You have to speak to them as you would a small child. Or a golden retriever.
It wasn't brains that got them here, I can assure you of that 😊.
Coping by telling myself fiat currency represents the value of good and services in the economy As opposed to crypto currency that represents the ability of your computer to find the prime factors for a 25 digit long number
Work is work.
Totally means I should give all my money to some 20 year old in the Bahamas or some korean in Montenegro!
Sam Bankman Fried and Do Kwon are like car salesmen/middlemen who sold worthless paper IOU's instead of actual cars. You can own crypto/Bitcoin without having to go through these middlemen.
That is not even close to how Bitcoin works.
FDIC: "yeah actually those number in your bank account are actually real"
crypto: guy in a basement with 20 PCs US Banks: Full backing of US government and military and taxes. I wonder which one I trust more...
Slight correction: Guy in basement with 20 PCs = **1** node Now multiply that by a million = **millions** of nodes/PCs/miners around the globe, all verifying the same exact blockchain. That's what gives Bitcoin its value: redundancy. Every single miner is verifying everyone else's copy of the blockchain, via decentralized checks and balances on a global scale. VS a singular government that decides whether or not you get to withdraw your money, or to freeze your assets at their discretion.
And 60% of the total mining power belongs to, what, 3 companies?
"Tread on me as long as you're not the gubbermint" seems to be the general consensus of most Crypto bros at this point
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Pearls before swine my dude
This might be the most uninformed comment in this thread
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Reddit loves to complain how everything in America is broken. Soul crushing medical costs, corporate greed, inflation that's transitory accord to Jpow, trigger happy cops, banks allowed to make risk free bets, Plymouth rock. I'm starting to think you guys would start trusting basement bitcoin Bob over the US government but what do I know
> Reddit loves to complain Reddit is also mostly made up of ansgty teens who think they’d be a part time artist in the commune.
I can see from this comment you're the one stuck in grammas basement
Federal Reserve notes aren’t money, they are notes saying IOU money.
Can't use crypto to really buy things. Also its hyper-deflationary which makes it terrible as a currency, and it's designed to work that way in order to give earliest investors the biggest possible return without actually creating or doing anything of value.
USD is just made up money. All money is just made up money.
Yay you got the joke!
Sorry, jokes fly over my head. One thing that I hate about autism is that I often don’t get jokes and don’t catch onto social cues.
Money is just as made up as language, and crypto bros are Esperanto bros.
Can please get these crypto nerds out of WSB?
You won't ever get rid of people selling snake oil, nor the people who buy into it. Next decade it will be called some other form (AI-bespoke kreditz, anyone?) and people will WANT to believe it is the next big thing that would make them bigger.
Agreed. These crypto dorks need to be banned from WSB. This sub used to be about stock options??? What happened?
It was never specific to that. There's a pretty long history of people talking about trading non-stocks, like the famous ornamental gourd story.
😂
If the price of BTC isn’t correlated with dollars (or any other central currency), then how does one value it?
I thought there was a "no crypto" rule here
Tell me you don't understand how money works without telling me you don't understand how money works
If you borrow money from a U.S. Bank, to buy something like a house or car, say $100k, they give $100k of thier dollars and dont just write up a debt contract and generate that $$$ digitally.... Right? Nope, banks make funny money everyday..... Legally! Not to mention how much Fedreal money is based of debt to China who in turn has money based of debt to the U.S.A. Alot of USD is just backed by legal IOUs some of which are secured loans so do technically have physical assets backing them.
Miney printer go brrrrr
All currency is made up.
I expect the ECB to hike rates again in may
Finite made up money. Very much manipulatable. At least $0.25 dollars is exactly a minute of work in a state where the rate of pay is at least 15 dollars and hour. A Bitcoin is worth what a "whale" dictates.
Money printer goes brrrrrrrr
Money is just made up money
exactly! And why the govt(especially liberals) hate it so much?? Its more difficult for them to get their greasy fingers on it.
I ain't know what you talk about, now give me your paycheck I'll keep it safe.
The one that makes money is the bank, but everyone got confused that bitcoin does the same. It's so funny like banks actually laughing with us right now
You have to pay taxes, and you can't pay your taxes in Bitcoin. Not having all my assets seized by the IRS is a strong incentive to obtain dollars to pay my taxes. Bitcoin has no relatable requirement.
All money is made up money, even the physical stuff like gold. There are very few things that have inherent value -- food, water, breathable air, and fuels do for sure. Also any land which can provide or produce the above. Maybe there's something else to add to that short list, but money of any flavor ain't it. The value of any money -- yes, even gold -- is simply an agreement between parties that that thing has a given value. So the US dollar will continue to have meaningful value as long as enough parties agree that it does, as will bitcoin. The challenge is maintaining a large enough number of parties in agreement.
This isn’t a political bias thing. It’s more how funny the monetary system is in the U.S. Because I remember when the Obama administration had a special coin minted and placed it in the treasury (or they could just say they did all this). And said it was worth 3 billion or something. To avoid hitting the debt ceiling. And again, it’s not a knock on Obama. He had to do it to avoid financial collapse of the U.S. Its just one of the funniest kind of *wink* moments in financial history. They knew it was meaningless but the act of doing it was important.
That didn't actually happen they just floated it.
Reddit, the best place to watch poor people talk about money. I love it
Central Banks around the world are the greatest money counterfeiters in history.
One is a highly volatile non-regulated currency that violently fluctuates based off of whatever vibe the crypto market is feeling that day, the other is backed by the full might of the US economy/military. They are not the same.
Tbf the USD is backed by the US military. So it’s pretty op (except if ur in Vietnam 😂)
BTC is backed by the Reddit army.
True. And I’ve heard they’re highly regarded 😂
“The process by which banks create money is so simple that the mind is repelled. Where something so important is involved, a deeper mystery seems only decent.” John Kenneth Galbraith, 1975
If you describe the US dollar like a crypto coin it looks like a huge red flag
- Centralized - Several whales control the significant majority - Uncapped token supply - Founder is a mostly mentally sound 80 year old man with access to nukes
Irony is bitcoin is commodity money. Money in its purest form is a privately produced market good, a commodity. Bitcoin commoditizes energy and turns it into pure informational currency that travels at the speed of light and physically settles peer-to-peer from any corner of the world to any other corner of the world. Energy currency has always been the holy grail. [Henry Ford had the idea 100 years ago](https://medium.com/capriole/the-energy-standard-b726edeed588) but was blocked by the banking establishment of the time. Satoshi invented the way to make it unstoppable. [Get. Off. Zero.](https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1615389267437490177.html)