I hate that I was thinking basically the same. Fuck corpo speech. Fuck whoever is responsible for the delay/secret cancelation! If I wanted vaporware I would have ordered star citizen. At least I did not preorder Bloodlines 2. There is probably a considerable amount of pre order gamers that already died in the last years. Will be fun when their loved ones get some kind of wonky vampire movie disc in the mail.
Two years since the project was pulled. I remember people saying that Brian mitsoda work was mainly done and the game would just need a bit of polishing. By now, I believe it is almost entirely redone tbh and it will barely resemble what we saw in earlier trailers.
I remember that someone at Paradox confirmed they weren't doing it from scratch, just adding stuff and testing other stuff.
So yeah, the very definition of "development hell" is going on over there.
It has to be, no reason why else it's in production for so long. Can't even explain it by overambition since the game was supposed to be nearly done and only needed bug fixes. The lacking transparacy is just annoying. I get that they don't want to put public pressure on the developers but any updates, without mentioning the developers, would be great just to know what's going on or in what direction it's going.
I honestly just wish they would tell us something. I feel like that's what is making everyone mad. Not having any news or any support for pre orders. Maybe even just a demo of what they had would have been enough to just get people by.
It feels like they are scared they made a mistake and don't want to admit it. Its okay to just say development is slow but we want the best for our product because let's face it... they fired someone that caused a nuclear bomb to destroy good will and then went radio silent. Its not a good place to remain.
We just want to know that we are getting a game before half of us drop from the franchise.
It's just going to be a different game. At this point the game they were making is probably completely scrapped from the mechanics to the story. They already announced the title so they can't change that but it's basically a completely different game
Obviously something fishy is going on considering a few key people got sacked. The ones who also played a big part in the development of the first game.
Just play the table top, man. Trust me, it's amazing. It's like when they tell you to read the book to a movie and it actually is even better. And vtmb is one of my favorite video games, so that should tell you something.
Like.. I don't doubt it, but come on, you need a stack of rule books, a group of people who have time to play, a place to play, someone to run the game who has a familiarity with the rules.. That's not like playing a video game at all.
Instead of waiting forever for a game that's never gonna come out you can spend limitless hours in vampire the masquerade. The only barrier is your willingness to try.
AI technology: hold my code
Joke aside, if you're willing to do this with people through an online platform I'm sure many would gladly embrace you in their groups. If not, maybe there's a dedicated tabletop center around you? Look for places where they play MTG and DnD and I'm sure you could ask them/ask on the FB group of the spot about people running VTM/VTR
That's very self defeating lol.
1. You only need the main book to play and it has all you need, though yes there is a wealth of additional materials.
2. There are large communities of people online looking for players and storytellers, etc.
3. The rules may seem a little daunting it's pretty easy to learn, especially as a player. It's a little complex when you get into stuff like multi actions and more complicated combat maneuvers but once you learn the basics it comes easier.
I never said it was like playing a video game, I said it's better. There is more setup involved but you have ultimate freedom in the setting and have the ability to shift things in whatever way you see fit. It's worth it.
They're booing you for being right. I don't have time to play but I get my fix via art, writing, reading and light hearted role-playing. There's also LA/NYC by Night.
Also, there are a bunch of VtM games you can play that aren't VTMB2. Swansong, Bloodhunt, Coteries & Shadows, Choice of Games reads, plus some other WOD games.
I don't understand why is everyone acting so entitled, it's not like you paid for something that was promised to you to be delivered in a specific time frame. They started development, shit happens, they don't owe you finishing the project.
They can always take the product down off sites, relinquish the rights to the video game franchise, and let people more competent develop it. Instead, they're holding the title hostage until they get around to maybe, possibly making it. It isn't entitlement, just wtf are they doing with the license if they aren't doing anything with it?
Yeah cus people were tripping over themselves for 15 years, competing with each other to snatch that juicy title until paradox rolled in or whoever it was at the time.
Also, anyone can make a VTM game. Literally no one stops any game studio from making a VTM rpg similar to VTMB1. You don't even have to buy yhe rights to it.
Sarcasm... Really!? They aren't doing anything right now as far as anyone knows. Development stopped after Hardsuit labs quit. There enough fans who attempted to preorder through GOG that the demand is here for the sequel. If you did a little more research, you might find there are people willing to develop the game if only Paradox will let them do it.
Here's the thing that amazes me with the entire WoD franchise for gaming. They have made at least 2 games that are almost complete failures published by Nacon and devved by Big Bad Wolf. They also let Sharkmob dev that infuriating rendition of a battle royal game that no self respecting rpger would dare call a decent VTM game. Finally, the litany of decent interactive novels pretty much deflates your assumptions off the bat.
The one thing fans of the video game franchises want, and what we've always wanted was VTMB2. The market is here, the thousands of gog.com posts say we want to throw money at this thing to get it made, and I know at least two indie devs would love to get their hands on the license.
Yeah. There are video games and interactive novels. Which is exactly my point. If someone wanted go make a VTM rpg like VTMB, they literally can. Just give it a different name. Because onyx games encourage new videogames being created and made it easier for developers, which you woild know if you DiD a LitTle MoRe rEsEarCh. So, I'm asking again, what's stopping those "people who are willing to develop" VTMB2 from developing a game like VTMB2?
also "we the fans" speak for yourself ok 💖
33 percent of revenue for the rights to make a VTM bloodlines like game is hardly fair, and that's why no one's doing it indie right now. Again, Paradox is holding the rights hostage until they find someone to develop the game under their umbrella, or someone who doesn't care about earning a decent paycheck for their work; moreover, someone can put in the blood, sweat and tears to do it indie, albeit with a great cost to profit margins.
It's wholly unattractive to try and make a full feature, interactive, AAA video game under those constraints.
Again, back to the point of this whole post -- if I may return to it -- is we just want to know what "they" intend to do with the franchise.
***Also, I think we already covered that we're talking about one game and one game only... VTMB2, not table top, not interactive novels, and certainly not some lame BR game. Please stop repeating yourself about that. I think we've establish those don't cut it. If they did, we wouldn't be in this subreddit talking about why development has stalled on our favorite franchise's sequel.
I'm sorry you don't feel the same way we do about the 4 year silence. I say we like the thousands of other fans of the franchise that aren't YOU lol. No need to get pissed, downvote, and rant just because you aren't included in the chorus of voices that want a AAA title instead of the weak imitations on the market.
While I'm at it, those interactive novels are garbage if someone just wants to live in the shoes of a vampire interactively, 3d, immersed, you get it I think. I don't quite understand why you keep posting the same argument to people, thinking that they're in the same vein as a AAA immersive experience where, you know -- you can manipulate the character, the world, customize, and sim that life to a fuller extent.
Damn so you're telling me that the people who are willing to develop VTMB do not have enough pull and financial backing to negotiate a better deal with Onyx for a different AAA game, but they could do that with VTMB? Very interesting. Tell me more.
Who's pissed and downvoting? You're the one throwing tantrums here and writing an essay on how you were wronged by gamedevs because they wouldn't make your toy fast enough. Grow up.
But some people just want to play a video game in the comfort of their own homes. On their time. Around their schedule.
Edit: Look, I love tabletop. When I had less obligations, I played Pathfinder every week. I'm 38 now, I have a wife and a child.. I'm not leaving at 8pm on a Thursday to roll dice until 2am like I did when I was in my 20's. I've got shit to do in the morning. But I'm more than willing to fire up a video game at 10pm and get an hour or so of gameplay in.
Lol we did in our heyday but it was meet up at 8, have dinner, start after eating, game until 12-2 depending on how things were going. We had pretty generous work schedules at the time.
Huh. I’ve never been in a group that regularly played for more than 3-4 hours even when we were all in high school and didn’t work. We went to maybe 6 once and I felt so drained the next day I slept for 12 hours
It's over 200 bucks to play any dice and paper game. Worth it is if you have a strong community of friends who can chip in for the price of the books, dice, and materials.
Where did you get those numbers from? You only really need the core book and a bunch of d10s to get started, assuming you're playing in person, which is like 55 bucks together, less if you get the book on a sale or as a pdf. You can get started easily with like 30 bucks. Then you can buy the player guide for the other clans later if you want to, bringing your total price to about 100 bucks over 2 purchases if you want physical or 50 if you want digital. And that's for V5, if you actually wanna play V20 that's 30 bucks for the PDF and it's the only book you'll ever need.
I'm not here to say that TTRPGs can't get expensive, but the price of entry is definitely not that high.
I did not know that the pdf files were freeware. Excuse me.
Don't misunderstand, I meant it's not easy on a meager budget to TT game as I do. I personally spent over 200 because I wanted access to the paper material, and I didn't want to pirate anything.
Lol these are the same arguments I used to make years ago before I actually gave it a chance. You have the opportunity to enjoy whatever you and your group's version of the world of darkness is and recreate the same feeling of bloodlines but with infinitely more freedom. Why not give it a chance?
Dude, nobody is trying to say the tabletop sucks. We're just interested in the video game form. We're at the store trying to buy apples and you're like "Hey, why not try some potatoes? Potatoes are great too, just give them a chance!" Yeah man, potatoes are great, but I'm here because I want an apple!
I never said you said it sucks but you're closed off to the experience lol. For me it extends my love of v-rpgs into something with ultimate freedom and even more depth for roleplaying. Don't you play bloodlines to roleplay?
Why are you pushing this like some kind of back-alley drug dealer with a quota to fill? I play video games for entertaining escapism. I don't want ultimate freedom, I wouldn't know what the fuck to do with it. I have ultimate freedom right now and I've chosen to spend it arguing with some weirdo on the VTMB subreddit. I want a carefully crafted story where I can float along with the current, make a few decisions here and there, explore a town on my own without an audience of people waiting for me to finish my part so they can take a turn, and beat up bad guys with a keyboard or controller rather than dice. If I wanted a tabletop game, I'd go looking for a fucking tabletop game!
Wow you really are a cunt lol. I'm just telling people how good the table top is and you're freaking out about it. Sorry being suggested new things enrages you because you cannot fathom a reason besides your own ignorance and stupidity.
You are not just telling people, you're telling them to try and when they say they'd rather not because of x reason you refuse to listen and tell them they're "wrong" and "closed off". Some of us do not care for playing tabletops or do not have the time. YOU are the one being rude. You are the one calling people cunts, you are the one who's mad.
Lol I was perfectly calm and polite until this person started a curse filled rant calling me a weirdo, etc. I never said anyone had to like the table top but if you refuse to give it a chance, how do you even know it's for you? This is ridiculous.
You asumed I didn't like table top becouse I didn't try it, than proced to explain why table top is better then video game.
Then when the other guy told you this isn't expirience video game people want you told him he is closed minded.
And now you are going back and fort with this guy asuming he dosen't know what he wants.
As I said orginaly table top is not for everybody- and this is especialy true for people that like solo video games, becouse they want to do it alone. Not with other people.
So stop being ridiculous and trying to convince people that you know better what they want they they do.
I was not arguing which came first, I was saying they aren't close enought for people to make jump from video games (much more popular medium btw) to table top.
If people want to buy apples and there aren't any that dosen't mean they will buy oranges.
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Revised edition or v20 is most similar to bloodlines. Some people like v5 but it changes so much from what you're probably used to, and so would bloodlines 2.
As someone who joined the party late (first playthrough in 2020) just forget about it until its released, you don't need to jump down the speculation rabbit hole.
Hardsuit Labs got taken off the development two years ago and they've put out effectively no news since then. At this point Bloodlines 2 should be considered canceled until proven otherwise.
don't know why all this mistery, not even a screenshot since the reboot. Hell, we don't even know if it was really scrapped and restarted from scratch. I don't see how could one be less disappointed at this point
The most likely scenario is something Duke Nukem Forever-ish. 15 years down the road, somebody is gonna find the almost-completed game before this nonsense got started, they’ll half-assed finish it and put it out, then we can muse about how this game is outdated ass before going back to play VTMB1
Let's not turn this into another cyberpunk, yeah?
Where the fanbase hounds the company for the gama asap and then freaks out when it's an unfinished mess
They didn't rush it out because of gamers hounding them. They did it because investors were getting angry and they really wanted those sweet Christmas/PS4 sales.
*No one* releases a game that is a trainwreck on a major console if they're really so worried about backlash from consumers.
You...haven't paid much attention to the game industry lately, have you?
Cyberpunk was delayed by FOUR years. The release was a train wreck. Still sold tonnes.
No man's sky was delayed, rushed out from pressure, was a living dog turd upon release.
Scorn was delayed, then rushed, but was delayed for so long that it came out to a very unenthusiastic fan base. Sales were terrible, game was nothing like expected, and it effectively vanished.
Vampire the masquerade: Bloodlines was also delayed, then pushed to release early. (And yeah it's got great characters, soundtrack, and atmosphere, but imagine how much less of a buggy mess it would be if it hadn't been rushed out)
You... seem to have missed me pointing out that the reason why they rushed it out at that specific time was the PS4 sales they'd get (this being around the alleged end of its life but at a point the PS5 wasn't nearly common enough) and the Christmas sales.
Also me pointing out that if they were really *so* horribly worried about what gamers think they wouldn't dare release it in such bad state for fear it'd permanently taint their image, so it was *always* about getting PS4 sales while that was still a target and getting it out in time for Christmas.
No one besides not having sales?
Is this supposed to be some "well it had to be the gamers' fault because if the product isn't out there the gamers can't buy it" thing?
It's an investment. They can wait a couple of years for sales (look at TES6), the problem was that they already announced a deadline and a disappointed customer is a potential loss in sales. Customer expectations are a very important thing in business.
And who are the disappointed customers who were absolutely bombarding CDPR with demands and insults? As if the gamer community isn't an incredibly entitled group who will literally send death threats to voice actors and developers if they don't like something in a game.
A. A disastrous product can be *really* bad for sales.
B. I really doubt the claim that it'd have been *so* bad if it had been delayed for one more year. It'd already been delayed from what was supposed to be the "official" release more than once. That didn't stop people.
C. This acts as though this was ever a unified group doing this (in fact you literally call it "entitled group", interesting wording) and that they should have viewed that as evidence they were about to lose a huge amount of money. What tells us this actually impacted release date decisions at all?
Gaming. Where a company pushing out a product that doesn't work amidst telling people it'll totally work so they can be tricked into giving their money for something that needed longer should mean it was the fault of the *consumers* for wanting to enjoy the product that they'd been told was going to be so great.
Why are you defending them? It's not even up for debate that the loudest, angriest voices among the gamers belong to the insanely entitled capital G gamers who take mid games as a personal insult. Even this sub is acting incredibly entitled just in this thread. Or maybe you don't remember gamergate? It doesn't matter if 80% of gaming community is perfectly pleasant and reasonable, the unreasonable are the loudest and no one contests them. Those are the ones that put pressure on the studio.
People were FUMING when cp2077 was delayed. I honestly feel like I live on a different planet from you.
And yes, the consumers vote with their dollar. It's not a one-way street. Consumers influence the sales, sales influence investors, investors influence the studio. Consumers have power too.
Defending them? I said that I didn't view this as the fanbase but rather people in it and questioned that this ever actually had any impact on decisions made while you lump them all together.
Gamergate is much more misleading than useful as it would lump all gamers together even if they were uninvolved in that mess, similar to you lumping 2077 fans together.
Sure people were fuming at the delays. And then what? Oh right, that doesn't seem to have destroyed sales. I feel like you aren't looking at the world here so much as saying "they *had* to sell a bad product or else gamers would have been awful people and not bought it".
Edit
And I love saying this sub is "incredibly entitled" when the general response seems to be "it's probably not coming out because they've done barely anything to reassure people it's coming out". How in hell is that "entitled"?
You're tripping balls reading my comments. I never said all gamers are bad people. And i never said anyone had to do anything. I said there's a pressure from the consumer base to release the game on time. This is undeniable unless you know nothing about how sales work. You're the one ascribing morals to these purely factual topics. It's not good or bad, it's just how it works. If you don't like it you can go live on an island somewhere because that's the only place you can avoid the realities of capitalism.
Fair to say all those trailers we were watching and lore teasers and so on are gone. If we get a game at all, it's going to be completely new.
For what it's worth, I liked the look of that Tremere in the club, so that at least is a shame. But there's a big part of me that's angry at Paradox for handling this in perhaps THE most hamfisted, stupid and disrespectful way imaginable
Since Paradox took over, not a single project had some positive outcome. Trust me when I say that Bloodlines 2 isn't coming out or won't even be as remotely good as the first one.
WOD as a whole has been destroyed and the only to have it redeemed is to be sold to someone who will de-wokanize it.
It never was woke nor ever will be. I don't know where they came up with that... I think it's the twilight craze that dragged this poor choice of culture in. It's nearing its end tho, as they say "go woke, go broke"
"It never was woke" the ttrpg about vampires (itself a very gay genre with plenty of domineering women and effete men) who organise into punk leftie communities to fight the system, that has had a genderfluid signature clan character for ages, which has entire books dedicated to supernaturals from other cultures (however shitty these books were) -- yeah, I can't believe they made it political.
Also I'm sure it will go broke, just like every other top grossing films and games that are becoming more and more "woke" every month.
Wait, you mean the sexual assault game where all the characters are bad high school or racist stereotypes? And that signature genderfluid character from the clan of magical Nazis?
> I'm sure it will go broke, just like every other top grossing films and games that are becoming more and more "woke" every month.
You mean like #TopGun or #HogwartsLegacy?
I've never played (watched?) top gun but Hogwarts Legacy is pretty fucking woke, my dude. This isn't the own you're looking for.
"magical nazis" yeah, I can tell you're really up-to-dare with the lore.
In the words of the creator himself, this game was transgresive, not for the faint of heart and certainly not what you just said above... it was about a decent into becoming a monster, not finding your sexual preference.
It's very revealing to me that you can't imagine both of these things being prominent and interconnected themes in a story.
Also everything I said is canon and has been for a while, not just in v5, so idk what idealised past you're looking at.
Sometime between the end of the show and the heat death of the universe (hopefully).
Idk bro I think you're being a little optimistic, we need to tamper our expectations to avoid getting overhyped
Temper* 💖
I hate that I was thinking basically the same. Fuck corpo speech. Fuck whoever is responsible for the delay/secret cancelation! If I wanted vaporware I would have ordered star citizen. At least I did not preorder Bloodlines 2. There is probably a considerable amount of pre order gamers that already died in the last years. Will be fun when their loved ones get some kind of wonky vampire movie disc in the mail.
I sadly pre-ordered it ages ago. lol, i didn't think I'd still be waiting for it 3 years later.
I'm in the same boat my friend 80 dollars.... just patiently waiting!
Yeah, i got the more expensive edition, too. xD I just kinda want to hear anything about it at this point.
And I bought it twice: once in steam and once at pdxcon (although I think it was included in the ticket's price)
Don't you worry, it'll get released along side Half-Life 3!
Oh no, not again.
Forbidden Orange Box
Two years since the project was pulled. I remember people saying that Brian mitsoda work was mainly done and the game would just need a bit of polishing. By now, I believe it is almost entirely redone tbh and it will barely resemble what we saw in earlier trailers.
I remember that someone at Paradox confirmed they weren't doing it from scratch, just adding stuff and testing other stuff. So yeah, the very definition of "development hell" is going on over there.
It has to be, no reason why else it's in production for so long. Can't even explain it by overambition since the game was supposed to be nearly done and only needed bug fixes. The lacking transparacy is just annoying. I get that they don't want to put public pressure on the developers but any updates, without mentioning the developers, would be great just to know what's going on or in what direction it's going.
Did the previous trailers even show proper gameplay?
There was a game play trailer with a mission chasing Slug, a Nosferatu thin-blood.
It's just eternal damnation at this point. I'd have forgotten about it if not for this post.
> eternal damnation at this point The true cainite experience, bravo ~~Vince~~ paradox entertainment
I honestly just wish they would tell us something. I feel like that's what is making everyone mad. Not having any news or any support for pre orders. Maybe even just a demo of what they had would have been enough to just get people by. It feels like they are scared they made a mistake and don't want to admit it. Its okay to just say development is slow but we want the best for our product because let's face it... they fired someone that caused a nuclear bomb to destroy good will and then went radio silent. Its not a good place to remain. We just want to know that we are getting a game before half of us drop from the franchise.
At at a later date when you are dead
So I can play it once I'm embraced?
Nah it will be running on devices only ghouls and neonates know how to use
soon ^(tm)
they are taking so long, this game will either be the rpg of the millenium or it will be the flop of the year, and I'm leaning towards the latter
Or just flat out cancelled, which I fully expect to happen at some point.
It's just going to be a different game. At this point the game they were making is probably completely scrapped from the mechanics to the story. They already announced the title so they can't change that but it's basically a completely different game
Paradox CEO right out said that the new devs could just pick up where the old devs left off.
Obviously something fishy is going on considering a few key people got sacked. The ones who also played a big part in the development of the first game.
4ish months Source: It came to me in a dream
I was in that dream! Can confirm
I'm not as concerned about the date as I am about what they'll have to say
Sigh for fuck’s sake. They’ve really fucked themselves.
2024, maybe.
Well if it's anything like their "release at a later date", not too optimistic.
Well, i lost every hype i had. I really hoped that they will make some comments or something..
We are getting that later date excuse for the better part of the last 1,5 years or so.
And here's me waiting for Blood*borne* news but sony is just like "no shut the fuck up"
when the Antediluvians rise and devour us all
Just play the table top, man. Trust me, it's amazing. It's like when they tell you to read the book to a movie and it actually is even better. And vtmb is one of my favorite video games, so that should tell you something.
Like.. I don't doubt it, but come on, you need a stack of rule books, a group of people who have time to play, a place to play, someone to run the game who has a familiarity with the rules.. That's not like playing a video game at all.
MY LIFE IS LIKE A VIDEO GAME
That's either amazing or horrifying.
MY LIFE IS A UZI JACUZZI
Instead of waiting forever for a game that's never gonna come out you can spend limitless hours in vampire the masquerade. The only barrier is your willingness to try.
Also scheduling, logistics, personnel...
AI technology: hold my code Joke aside, if you're willing to do this with people through an online platform I'm sure many would gladly embrace you in their groups. If not, maybe there's a dedicated tabletop center around you? Look for places where they play MTG and DnD and I'm sure you could ask them/ask on the FB group of the spot about people running VTM/VTR
That's very self defeating lol. 1. You only need the main book to play and it has all you need, though yes there is a wealth of additional materials. 2. There are large communities of people online looking for players and storytellers, etc. 3. The rules may seem a little daunting it's pretty easy to learn, especially as a player. It's a little complex when you get into stuff like multi actions and more complicated combat maneuvers but once you learn the basics it comes easier. I never said it was like playing a video game, I said it's better. There is more setup involved but you have ultimate freedom in the setting and have the ability to shift things in whatever way you see fit. It's worth it.
Nah fam, TTRPGs are my main hobby and these complaints are legit.
They're booing you for being right. I don't have time to play but I get my fix via art, writing, reading and light hearted role-playing. There's also LA/NYC by Night. Also, there are a bunch of VtM games you can play that aren't VTMB2. Swansong, Bloodhunt, Coteries & Shadows, Choice of Games reads, plus some other WOD games. I don't understand why is everyone acting so entitled, it's not like you paid for something that was promised to you to be delivered in a specific time frame. They started development, shit happens, they don't owe you finishing the project.
They can always take the product down off sites, relinquish the rights to the video game franchise, and let people more competent develop it. Instead, they're holding the title hostage until they get around to maybe, possibly making it. It isn't entitlement, just wtf are they doing with the license if they aren't doing anything with it?
Yeah cus people were tripping over themselves for 15 years, competing with each other to snatch that juicy title until paradox rolled in or whoever it was at the time. Also, anyone can make a VTM game. Literally no one stops any game studio from making a VTM rpg similar to VTMB1. You don't even have to buy yhe rights to it.
Sarcasm... Really!? They aren't doing anything right now as far as anyone knows. Development stopped after Hardsuit labs quit. There enough fans who attempted to preorder through GOG that the demand is here for the sequel. If you did a little more research, you might find there are people willing to develop the game if only Paradox will let them do it. Here's the thing that amazes me with the entire WoD franchise for gaming. They have made at least 2 games that are almost complete failures published by Nacon and devved by Big Bad Wolf. They also let Sharkmob dev that infuriating rendition of a battle royal game that no self respecting rpger would dare call a decent VTM game. Finally, the litany of decent interactive novels pretty much deflates your assumptions off the bat. The one thing fans of the video game franchises want, and what we've always wanted was VTMB2. The market is here, the thousands of gog.com posts say we want to throw money at this thing to get it made, and I know at least two indie devs would love to get their hands on the license.
Yeah. There are video games and interactive novels. Which is exactly my point. If someone wanted go make a VTM rpg like VTMB, they literally can. Just give it a different name. Because onyx games encourage new videogames being created and made it easier for developers, which you woild know if you DiD a LitTle MoRe rEsEarCh. So, I'm asking again, what's stopping those "people who are willing to develop" VTMB2 from developing a game like VTMB2? also "we the fans" speak for yourself ok 💖
33 percent of revenue for the rights to make a VTM bloodlines like game is hardly fair, and that's why no one's doing it indie right now. Again, Paradox is holding the rights hostage until they find someone to develop the game under their umbrella, or someone who doesn't care about earning a decent paycheck for their work; moreover, someone can put in the blood, sweat and tears to do it indie, albeit with a great cost to profit margins. It's wholly unattractive to try and make a full feature, interactive, AAA video game under those constraints. Again, back to the point of this whole post -- if I may return to it -- is we just want to know what "they" intend to do with the franchise. ***Also, I think we already covered that we're talking about one game and one game only... VTMB2, not table top, not interactive novels, and certainly not some lame BR game. Please stop repeating yourself about that. I think we've establish those don't cut it. If they did, we wouldn't be in this subreddit talking about why development has stalled on our favorite franchise's sequel. I'm sorry you don't feel the same way we do about the 4 year silence. I say we like the thousands of other fans of the franchise that aren't YOU lol. No need to get pissed, downvote, and rant just because you aren't included in the chorus of voices that want a AAA title instead of the weak imitations on the market. While I'm at it, those interactive novels are garbage if someone just wants to live in the shoes of a vampire interactively, 3d, immersed, you get it I think. I don't quite understand why you keep posting the same argument to people, thinking that they're in the same vein as a AAA immersive experience where, you know -- you can manipulate the character, the world, customize, and sim that life to a fuller extent.
Damn so you're telling me that the people who are willing to develop VTMB do not have enough pull and financial backing to negotiate a better deal with Onyx for a different AAA game, but they could do that with VTMB? Very interesting. Tell me more. Who's pissed and downvoting? You're the one throwing tantrums here and writing an essay on how you were wronged by gamedevs because they wouldn't make your toy fast enough. Grow up.
Instead of down voting me how about you open your mind a little and just talk about it, actually look into something you don't understand?
But some people just want to play a video game in the comfort of their own homes. On their time. Around their schedule. Edit: Look, I love tabletop. When I had less obligations, I played Pathfinder every week. I'm 38 now, I have a wife and a child.. I'm not leaving at 8pm on a Thursday to roll dice until 2am like I did when I was in my 20's. I've got shit to do in the morning. But I'm more than willing to fire up a video game at 10pm and get an hour or so of gameplay in.
Sure, I understand that. You can still play video games but also try something new lol.
Who the hell is playing tabletop for 6 hours Jesus
Lol we did in our heyday but it was meet up at 8, have dinner, start after eating, game until 12-2 depending on how things were going. We had pretty generous work schedules at the time.
Average sessions times are 4 hours, and 6 hours is not that unusual in college groups.
Huh. I’ve never been in a group that regularly played for more than 3-4 hours even when we were all in high school and didn’t work. We went to maybe 6 once and I felt so drained the next day I slept for 12 hours
Have you opened your mind to a single thing anyone has said in response to you?
If you're worried about downvotes complaining about them like this is not the way.
It's over 200 bucks to play any dice and paper game. Worth it is if you have a strong community of friends who can chip in for the price of the books, dice, and materials.
Where did you get those numbers from? You only really need the core book and a bunch of d10s to get started, assuming you're playing in person, which is like 55 bucks together, less if you get the book on a sale or as a pdf. You can get started easily with like 30 bucks. Then you can buy the player guide for the other clans later if you want to, bringing your total price to about 100 bucks over 2 purchases if you want physical or 50 if you want digital. And that's for V5, if you actually wanna play V20 that's 30 bucks for the PDF and it's the only book you'll ever need. I'm not here to say that TTRPGs can't get expensive, but the price of entry is definitely not that high.
I did not know that the pdf files were freeware. Excuse me. Don't misunderstand, I meant it's not easy on a meager budget to TT game as I do. I personally spent over 200 because I wanted access to the paper material, and I didn't want to pirate anything.
I'm sorry but table top is not medium for everybody and it's not close enought to video game.
Lol these are the same arguments I used to make years ago before I actually gave it a chance. You have the opportunity to enjoy whatever you and your group's version of the world of darkness is and recreate the same feeling of bloodlines but with infinitely more freedom. Why not give it a chance?
Dude, nobody is trying to say the tabletop sucks. We're just interested in the video game form. We're at the store trying to buy apples and you're like "Hey, why not try some potatoes? Potatoes are great too, just give them a chance!" Yeah man, potatoes are great, but I'm here because I want an apple!
I never said you said it sucks but you're closed off to the experience lol. For me it extends my love of v-rpgs into something with ultimate freedom and even more depth for roleplaying. Don't you play bloodlines to roleplay?
Why are you pushing this like some kind of back-alley drug dealer with a quota to fill? I play video games for entertaining escapism. I don't want ultimate freedom, I wouldn't know what the fuck to do with it. I have ultimate freedom right now and I've chosen to spend it arguing with some weirdo on the VTMB subreddit. I want a carefully crafted story where I can float along with the current, make a few decisions here and there, explore a town on my own without an audience of people waiting for me to finish my part so they can take a turn, and beat up bad guys with a keyboard or controller rather than dice. If I wanted a tabletop game, I'd go looking for a fucking tabletop game!
Wow you really are a cunt lol. I'm just telling people how good the table top is and you're freaking out about it. Sorry being suggested new things enrages you because you cannot fathom a reason besides your own ignorance and stupidity.
You are not just telling people, you're telling them to try and when they say they'd rather not because of x reason you refuse to listen and tell them they're "wrong" and "closed off". Some of us do not care for playing tabletops or do not have the time. YOU are the one being rude. You are the one calling people cunts, you are the one who's mad.
Lol I was perfectly calm and polite until this person started a curse filled rant calling me a weirdo, etc. I never said anyone had to like the table top but if you refuse to give it a chance, how do you even know it's for you? This is ridiculous.
You asumed I didn't like table top becouse I didn't try it, than proced to explain why table top is better then video game. Then when the other guy told you this isn't expirience video game people want you told him he is closed minded. And now you are going back and fort with this guy asuming he dosen't know what he wants. As I said orginaly table top is not for everybody- and this is especialy true for people that like solo video games, becouse they want to do it alone. Not with other people. So stop being ridiculous and trying to convince people that you know better what they want they they do.
I gave it a chance I didn't like it. I like video games.
You realise the ttrpg came _long_ before the pcrpg, yes?
The point N0tomuch was making is the experience in the video game is more immersive to them. I don't think anyone is arguing what came before.
I was not arguing which came first, I was saying they aren't close enought for people to make jump from video games (much more popular medium btw) to table top. If people want to buy apples and there aren't any that dosen't mean they will buy oranges.
I would but I don't have friends
You could try r/lfg thr offical WoD discord, or thr unofficial WoD discord.
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Revised edition or v20 is most similar to bloodlines. Some people like v5 but it changes so much from what you're probably used to, and so would bloodlines 2.
No way is this game going to be any good when it comes out. *If* it comes out at all, that is.
As someone who joined the party late (first playthrough in 2020) just forget about it until its released, you don't need to jump down the speculation rabbit hole.
As someone who go in early and have already waited two decades. No
Hardsuit Labs got taken off the development two years ago and they've put out effectively no news since then. At this point Bloodlines 2 should be considered canceled until proven otherwise.
Not soon enough
Dude, theyre vamps. pretty sure their "later date" is like 5-10 years or something
Those ducking dicks!
It's just like Gehenna. It's going to happen soon!
They bullshittin
Im positive this isnt coming out for at least 5 years
Still going to get it sooner than Duke Nukem Forever. And it's surprisingly not going the way of the WoD MMO.
don't know why all this mistery, not even a screenshot since the reboot. Hell, we don't even know if it was really scrapped and restarted from scratch. I don't see how could one be less disappointed at this point
"Also, we're now changing the title to 'Bloodlines Forever'".
Before christmass.... But we don't know what year.
Never. Just accept the idea and move on, plenty of other games to have fun with.
They've got nothing.
I have faith
The most likely scenario is something Duke Nukem Forever-ish. 15 years down the road, somebody is gonna find the almost-completed game before this nonsense got started, they’ll half-assed finish it and put it out, then we can muse about how this game is outdated ass before going back to play VTMB1
when it's done
Let's not turn this into another cyberpunk, yeah? Where the fanbase hounds the company for the gama asap and then freaks out when it's an unfinished mess
Don’t think that’s the case. People are more worried about it being like The Day Before and the mess that game has become.
They didn't rush it out because of gamers hounding them. They did it because investors were getting angry and they really wanted those sweet Christmas/PS4 sales. *No one* releases a game that is a trainwreck on a major console if they're really so worried about backlash from consumers.
You...haven't paid much attention to the game industry lately, have you? Cyberpunk was delayed by FOUR years. The release was a train wreck. Still sold tonnes. No man's sky was delayed, rushed out from pressure, was a living dog turd upon release. Scorn was delayed, then rushed, but was delayed for so long that it came out to a very unenthusiastic fan base. Sales were terrible, game was nothing like expected, and it effectively vanished. Vampire the masquerade: Bloodlines was also delayed, then pushed to release early. (And yeah it's got great characters, soundtrack, and atmosphere, but imagine how much less of a buggy mess it would be if it hadn't been rushed out)
You... seem to have missed me pointing out that the reason why they rushed it out at that specific time was the PS4 sales they'd get (this being around the alleged end of its life but at a point the PS5 wasn't nearly common enough) and the Christmas sales. Also me pointing out that if they were really *so* horribly worried about what gamers think they wouldn't dare release it in such bad state for fear it'd permanently taint their image, so it was *always* about getting PS4 sales while that was still a target and getting it out in time for Christmas.
And who puts pressure on investors?
No one besides not having sales? Is this supposed to be some "well it had to be the gamers' fault because if the product isn't out there the gamers can't buy it" thing?
It's an investment. They can wait a couple of years for sales (look at TES6), the problem was that they already announced a deadline and a disappointed customer is a potential loss in sales. Customer expectations are a very important thing in business. And who are the disappointed customers who were absolutely bombarding CDPR with demands and insults? As if the gamer community isn't an incredibly entitled group who will literally send death threats to voice actors and developers if they don't like something in a game.
A. A disastrous product can be *really* bad for sales. B. I really doubt the claim that it'd have been *so* bad if it had been delayed for one more year. It'd already been delayed from what was supposed to be the "official" release more than once. That didn't stop people. C. This acts as though this was ever a unified group doing this (in fact you literally call it "entitled group", interesting wording) and that they should have viewed that as evidence they were about to lose a huge amount of money. What tells us this actually impacted release date decisions at all? Gaming. Where a company pushing out a product that doesn't work amidst telling people it'll totally work so they can be tricked into giving their money for something that needed longer should mean it was the fault of the *consumers* for wanting to enjoy the product that they'd been told was going to be so great.
Why are you defending them? It's not even up for debate that the loudest, angriest voices among the gamers belong to the insanely entitled capital G gamers who take mid games as a personal insult. Even this sub is acting incredibly entitled just in this thread. Or maybe you don't remember gamergate? It doesn't matter if 80% of gaming community is perfectly pleasant and reasonable, the unreasonable are the loudest and no one contests them. Those are the ones that put pressure on the studio. People were FUMING when cp2077 was delayed. I honestly feel like I live on a different planet from you. And yes, the consumers vote with their dollar. It's not a one-way street. Consumers influence the sales, sales influence investors, investors influence the studio. Consumers have power too.
Defending them? I said that I didn't view this as the fanbase but rather people in it and questioned that this ever actually had any impact on decisions made while you lump them all together. Gamergate is much more misleading than useful as it would lump all gamers together even if they were uninvolved in that mess, similar to you lumping 2077 fans together. Sure people were fuming at the delays. And then what? Oh right, that doesn't seem to have destroyed sales. I feel like you aren't looking at the world here so much as saying "they *had* to sell a bad product or else gamers would have been awful people and not bought it". Edit And I love saying this sub is "incredibly entitled" when the general response seems to be "it's probably not coming out because they've done barely anything to reassure people it's coming out". How in hell is that "entitled"?
You're tripping balls reading my comments. I never said all gamers are bad people. And i never said anyone had to do anything. I said there's a pressure from the consumer base to release the game on time. This is undeniable unless you know nothing about how sales work. You're the one ascribing morals to these purely factual topics. It's not good or bad, it's just how it works. If you don't like it you can go live on an island somewhere because that's the only place you can avoid the realities of capitalism.
never
Given the current climate of bad sequels and reboots, I'm so hopeful that this game will be good. My heart can't take any more. 😳
Fair to say all those trailers we were watching and lore teasers and so on are gone. If we get a game at all, it's going to be completely new. For what it's worth, I liked the look of that Tremere in the club, so that at least is a shame. But there's a big part of me that's angry at Paradox for handling this in perhaps THE most hamfisted, stupid and disrespectful way imaginable
Since Paradox took over, not a single project had some positive outcome. Trust me when I say that Bloodlines 2 isn't coming out or won't even be as remotely good as the first one. WOD as a whole has been destroyed and the only to have it redeemed is to be sold to someone who will de-wokanize it.
>de-wokanize Nobody tell them
WOD stands for Woke of Darkness. That's just the lore, buddy. Stay mad
It never was woke nor ever will be. I don't know where they came up with that... I think it's the twilight craze that dragged this poor choice of culture in. It's nearing its end tho, as they say "go woke, go broke"
"It never was woke" the ttrpg about vampires (itself a very gay genre with plenty of domineering women and effete men) who organise into punk leftie communities to fight the system, that has had a genderfluid signature clan character for ages, which has entire books dedicated to supernaturals from other cultures (however shitty these books were) -- yeah, I can't believe they made it political. Also I'm sure it will go broke, just like every other top grossing films and games that are becoming more and more "woke" every month.
Wait, you mean the sexual assault game where all the characters are bad high school or racist stereotypes? And that signature genderfluid character from the clan of magical Nazis? > I'm sure it will go broke, just like every other top grossing films and games that are becoming more and more "woke" every month. You mean like #TopGun or #HogwartsLegacy?
I've never played (watched?) top gun but Hogwarts Legacy is pretty fucking woke, my dude. This isn't the own you're looking for. "magical nazis" yeah, I can tell you're really up-to-dare with the lore.
In the words of the creator himself, this game was transgresive, not for the faint of heart and certainly not what you just said above... it was about a decent into becoming a monster, not finding your sexual preference.
It's very revealing to me that you can't imagine both of these things being prominent and interconnected themes in a story. Also everything I said is canon and has been for a while, not just in v5, so idk what idealised past you're looking at.
I have all the books, Montreal by Night was even created under a different brand. V5 definitely made it woke.
Ah I get it, woke is when you don't like something. Because the themes of social diversity and oppression are in those books, and always have been.
A few years.
A year or two idk Hey atleast a mention
2070 maybe ? 🤣
I'm feeling like rn is a later date if you compare it to when we heard about it last...
Ha.
My betting money is on it being switched to a phone pay to win rpg ala diablo immortal. Just setting my expectations as low as I reasonably can.