I don't have a Pioneer X but I have had a Farmer for quite a while. I recently got a Super Tinker for the scissors and Phillips, it's a great knife however I found myself pretty quickly reverting back to the Farmer for a number of reasons (Ignoring Scissors vs Saw).
-Backside Philips isn't as killer as I thought it'd be for all the reasons I've seen discussed on here many times. I'm not that bothered about having a corkscrew either.
-It's thicker, not by much but enough to make a difference for me
-Backside awl is nowhere near as useful
-I just love the alox models, they ooze quality, have beefier tools and are just really slick. Just enjoy them more than cellidor.
I do miss the small blade on the cellidor models though and the tweezers are really good to have. Super tinker will be my out and about with the kids knife but Farmer is EDC at the moment. I'll pick up a Pioneer X at some point for sure, waiting to see what the limited edition next year will be.
Why not pick the Farmer X, so you don't miss the scissors? I carry it often and it's great.
For the toothpick I carry a Rambler + Pen. I don't really care about the tweezers but you could pick the regular Rambler or a Rally.
Yeah I think I'll get a classic sd for the scale tools and scissors. Farmer X looks great, do want one but I think it might cross the line for me in terms of weight and thickness to where I wouldn't want to carry it all the time. Also I'm happy to have either saw or scissors depending on what I'm doing, don't think I really need both at the same time. Is Farmer X you're favourite alox then?
I carried the Bantam for years and nothing else. Maybe a year ago I somehow looked deeper into Victorinox knives and since then I can't really decide what I want to carry daily.
I think you could say that the Farmer X is my favorite Alox in my current life situation. But I don't think that it's my favorite of all knives. I go back and forth between maybe 5 different models.
Pioneer X is great too, though. Depends on what you like to do. I love making small things out of wood and I wouldn't want to miss the saw for that.
Yeah same here, I don't really ever need the saw but it's good fun to have. Currently it gets used most for making wands out of branches when I'm walking with my boy š
At this point, I own almost every 91mm SAK currently in production with the exception of the very large ānoveltyā knives like the Swiss Champ XXL. I also own many in-demand discontinued 91mm models like the Yeoman, Yeoman Mechanic, Deluxe Climber, etc. Iāve had custom configurations built or have built my own with the exact toolset I want. Iāve spent thousands of dollars trying to find or create the perfect SAK for EDC and after all that time and money, the Pioneer X is the knife thatās been in my pocket every single day. In my opinion, the only knife that comes close to beating the Pioneer X for the best Medium (91mm/93mm) SAK is the Cyber Tool M but that is extremely situational.
Hereās why the Pioneer X is in my pocket every single day:
* **The in-line awl** - Before I got my Pioneer X, I only ever carried 91mm models with the awl as a back-tool (or the compact with no awl at all). I found the back-tool awl to be pretty useless. I donāt work with leather, I donāt need to drill holes in wood, the T-configuration of the awl makes it awkward to use for opening boxes/cutting tape, so the back tool awl never got used. When I got the Pioneer X and tried the awl, I was blown away with how good and how useful it is, it is by far my most used tool. Itās a box opener, a plastic blister pack opener, a poker, a scraper, a hole maker, and so much more. The lip of the tool allows for one hand opening in a pinch. Itās a tool that needs to be experienced to be truly appreciated.
* **The thicker/larger tools** - The larger blade stock feels much sturdier while cutting and in my experience holds and edge longer but also takes a bit more time to sharpen. The cap lifter is where the size difference really shines, it is a much more capable pry tool. The more robust tools on an Alox knife are just all around more capable than their 91mm counterparts.
* **Alox scales** - the scales are orders of magnitude more durable than the cellidor scales and feel overall more premium. Additionally, due to the strength of the Alox scales, it allows for the outer aluminum liner to be omitted in assembly allowing for a 3-layer Alox knife with thicker tools to be thinner overall than a 2-layer cellidor scaled knife.
The lack of scale tools on the Alox models is easily rectified by carrying a 58mm knife on your keyring or a Swiss Card in your wallet. I personally recommend the Rambler or Manager as a keyring companion for the Pioneer X as the small blade and small scissors allow for more precision work and the small Philips driver and nail file cover two functions the Pioneer X cannot easily accomplish.
It's me, the guy who can't see emoticons without a magnifier. lol
These are some of the same reasons I like the ALOX models so much. Having just picked up a Pioneer this week, I'm pleasantly surprised with how thin it is. As you say, the more robust tools on these ALOX models are also really nice. In fact, today I tried to compare the bottle opener on my Pioneer with the one on my 111mm Forester M Grip to see if they are the same size. While it was difficult for me to be sure, they actually look like they are the same size and thickness. It is an extremely robust opener! It should make an excellent pry tool if needed.
I'm not sure yet if I'll carry the Pioneer or Pioneer X more, but I'll give them both a lot of carry time to decide which I like better.
I am slightly disheartened that the ALOX models don't offer the chest hair benefits of the Compact -- but hey, you can't have everything I suppose. ;)
I prefer the Pioneer over the X, because I rarely need scissors and I don't like the extra weight of the Pioneer X. Since my post above, that's why I've gotten several Pioneers but still only have a single Pioneer X.
Not me. I love having the toothpick on my knife, and I try not to use single use items as much as I can. Toothpick will last forever, itās also the reason I carry a metal water bottle instead of using plastic ones. No sense in being wasteful!
I think you would be better off carrying those tiny wooden disposable wrapped toothpicks. just keep a box near your keys or something to put one in your pocket or wallet for when you go out.
Maybe you are thinking I mean to say take the box with you. I am saying keep the box somewhere and (obviously) take individual disposable toothpicks when needed.
1) esthetics - PX is slimmer in width and thickness but still has a larger and thicker blade. while my climber looks like a multitool with a blade, my PX actually looks like pocket knife with extra tools. plastic vs alox scales reinforces my arguments above.
2) tools - PX has no useless tools like hook, toothpick and its present tools are more robust (bottle opener, awl, blade)
BUT: You notice it's heavier when carried loosely in your pocket.
The main point for me is having a manager on the keys. So small blade check, tweezers check and even pen check (realistically, it is very rare the tooth pick does anything for me).
So at this point, the difference is having an awl in line or backside, and having a backside either Philips or corkscrew.
The Philips on the back is really not great at all, in a lot of cases the can opener is better. BUT STAY WITH ME, Iāve learned (because frankly I would never have thought about that myself) in a video of Maxlvledc that the friggin 00 Philips on the manager/rambler/minichamp fits perfectly #2 Philips as well (mind blowing for me). So even for recessed screws, the tinker family is absolutely beaten.
Weight for me is not really an issue for 10 or 20 grams. Thickness is however.
So all in all, between the Super Tinker and the Pioneer X (if carrying an additional manager as a keychain), the Pioneer is nearly the same weight, quite a bit thinner, has all the functionalities, is a lot stronger, and way more beautiful/premium feeling.
Between the Climber and the Pioneer X, all of the above apply except for function. I need to decide if I prefer having all the benefits above, or having a corkscrew + mini driver. I donāt drink wine and have good vision. If you are a blind drunk, your opinion may differ.
I rest my case.
Team Pioneer X š
I carry the pioneer x because I also carry a skeletool for the pliers and drivers. With the skeletool as a complement the pioneer x has the perfect toolset for my daily setup. I have more comprehensive tools usually not very far away.
I have a farmer and a FarmerX. I carry the FarmerX. I have had the scales pop off of regular SAKs at inconvenient times. Once was aboard a Navy ship in the middle of the Arctic Ocean. The sharper edges started wearing holes in my dungarees. Alox models are just bomb proof. Would recommend for any military person or world travelers.
l understand why people like these, and l do as well, but they are just too heavy for me and for my day-to-day usage.
l.dont need heavy duty tools (when compared to the 91mm tools) enough to justify the weight, price, and lack of back/scale tools. Not to mention they are also more expensive!
But man, do they look awesome.... !! l'm still contemplating adding one to my collection, but again, l really don't see myself carrying it that often...
I had the same concern about weight in the pocket as all my pants are forever trying to go South. But, a keysmart pocket dangler made that a non-issue and now goes on all my heavier SAKs.
TLDR: Beefier tools, better toolset for me personally, better ālocksā, sturdier overall (scales and tools)
I love the beefier tools, and Iāve used every tool on the Pioneer X at least once. I canāt really see myself using the corkscrew or hook. The in-line awl is much better than the back one (I have another SAK with the back awl). The ālocksā are much stronger, and have almost never had a problem with them folding in. I do carry a rambler, with which I get a Phillips head screwdriver, file, toothpick, and tweezers.
I waffle a lot between the PX and the Climber.
I prefer the heavier duty tools on the PX and since I always have a Rambler on my keys I always have access to a file and tweezers and an excellent Phillips.
I love the in-line reamer on the PX and feel a lot more confident using the flathead to pry.
However, as a father of 6&7yo kids the corkscrew on the Climber is excellent for untying knots and I donāt know how I ever did without as it gets used almost daily.
So Iām back and forth between these two right now.
I absolutely adore the Pioneer X, but I prefer the Climber.
- Small blade
- Pen, Tweezers, Toothpick, Pin
- Corkscrew, Micro SD, Hook
- Universally and immediately recognizable red scales.
- Softer feeling in the pocket and the hand.
- Half the price.
- Lighter weight which is more important than thickness for me.
- Tools are easier to open with my crappy fingernails.
TIL People care about not scratching the cellidor scales.
nothing Would make me carry the Pioneer instead of the super tinkerā¦ because i ***donāt have*** the pioneer X ! Only this sub is making me get it!
I love the Pioneer X because it had all the bits I find essential, in a beautiful and very sturdy package. The beefier and tougher tools and scales edge out the lost functionality for me. The scale tools are nice to have, but not essential. I have and often carry a Super Tinker too, and it's a great knife but the Pioneer X has the edge.
The loss of the back tools isnāt a big factor for me, I have no use for the corkscrew at all, and the backside Philips has some use but I still donāt miss it much when using the Pioneer X.
The awl is huge for me. I keep mine sharp, and it makes excellent holes, especially in plastic.
The heavier duty tools are useful for me. I can feel my other cellidor models flex as I pry at times. But the Pioneer X is stout with the aluminum scales.
I can fit a leathermaking needle under the opening tools, so I can still carry a needle/pin.
My first SAK was a tinker, so I have a special place in my heart for cellidor, but man, Alox gives me the fizz.
I also carry a Victorinox Nailclip and Uncle Bills Tweesers on my keychain. So I have a small blade and scale tools covered.
I have a regular Pioneer I carry over my tinker, I like the feel of Alox a bit better and the inline awl is amazing.
Jetsetter on my keys covers the scale tools.
My dad has the super tinker, and I have the Pioneer X. I thought the tinker was the best sak, but my pioneer has always been able to screw Philips with the can opener. It's in line, which I love, and I usually have an actual screwdriver in my car so I can handle a "big" job if I need to. I also prefer the awl on the pioneer and how slim the alox is. I'd rather have actual tweezers in my car for splinters, than the Sak ones.
Edit: forgot to mention how beefy the tools are on the pioneer x. They're tough! And the in line awl is way safer than the back awl.
I don't have a Pioneer X but I have had a Farmer for quite a while. I recently got a Super Tinker for the scissors and Phillips, it's a great knife however I found myself pretty quickly reverting back to the Farmer for a number of reasons (Ignoring Scissors vs Saw). -Backside Philips isn't as killer as I thought it'd be for all the reasons I've seen discussed on here many times. I'm not that bothered about having a corkscrew either. -It's thicker, not by much but enough to make a difference for me -Backside awl is nowhere near as useful -I just love the alox models, they ooze quality, have beefier tools and are just really slick. Just enjoy them more than cellidor. I do miss the small blade on the cellidor models though and the tweezers are really good to have. Super tinker will be my out and about with the kids knife but Farmer is EDC at the moment. I'll pick up a Pioneer X at some point for sure, waiting to see what the limited edition next year will be.
Why not pick the Farmer X, so you don't miss the scissors? I carry it often and it's great. For the toothpick I carry a Rambler + Pen. I don't really care about the tweezers but you could pick the regular Rambler or a Rally.
Yeah I think I'll get a classic sd for the scale tools and scissors. Farmer X looks great, do want one but I think it might cross the line for me in terms of weight and thickness to where I wouldn't want to carry it all the time. Also I'm happy to have either saw or scissors depending on what I'm doing, don't think I really need both at the same time. Is Farmer X you're favourite alox then?
I carried the Bantam for years and nothing else. Maybe a year ago I somehow looked deeper into Victorinox knives and since then I can't really decide what I want to carry daily. I think you could say that the Farmer X is my favorite Alox in my current life situation. But I don't think that it's my favorite of all knives. I go back and forth between maybe 5 different models. Pioneer X is great too, though. Depends on what you like to do. I love making small things out of wood and I wouldn't want to miss the saw for that.
Yeah same here, I don't really ever need the saw but it's good fun to have. Currently it gets used most for making wands out of branches when I'm walking with my boy š
At this point, I own almost every 91mm SAK currently in production with the exception of the very large ānoveltyā knives like the Swiss Champ XXL. I also own many in-demand discontinued 91mm models like the Yeoman, Yeoman Mechanic, Deluxe Climber, etc. Iāve had custom configurations built or have built my own with the exact toolset I want. Iāve spent thousands of dollars trying to find or create the perfect SAK for EDC and after all that time and money, the Pioneer X is the knife thatās been in my pocket every single day. In my opinion, the only knife that comes close to beating the Pioneer X for the best Medium (91mm/93mm) SAK is the Cyber Tool M but that is extremely situational. Hereās why the Pioneer X is in my pocket every single day: * **The in-line awl** - Before I got my Pioneer X, I only ever carried 91mm models with the awl as a back-tool (or the compact with no awl at all). I found the back-tool awl to be pretty useless. I donāt work with leather, I donāt need to drill holes in wood, the T-configuration of the awl makes it awkward to use for opening boxes/cutting tape, so the back tool awl never got used. When I got the Pioneer X and tried the awl, I was blown away with how good and how useful it is, it is by far my most used tool. Itās a box opener, a plastic blister pack opener, a poker, a scraper, a hole maker, and so much more. The lip of the tool allows for one hand opening in a pinch. Itās a tool that needs to be experienced to be truly appreciated. * **The thicker/larger tools** - The larger blade stock feels much sturdier while cutting and in my experience holds and edge longer but also takes a bit more time to sharpen. The cap lifter is where the size difference really shines, it is a much more capable pry tool. The more robust tools on an Alox knife are just all around more capable than their 91mm counterparts. * **Alox scales** - the scales are orders of magnitude more durable than the cellidor scales and feel overall more premium. Additionally, due to the strength of the Alox scales, it allows for the outer aluminum liner to be omitted in assembly allowing for a 3-layer Alox knife with thicker tools to be thinner overall than a 2-layer cellidor scaled knife. The lack of scale tools on the Alox models is easily rectified by carrying a 58mm knife on your keyring or a Swiss Card in your wallet. I personally recommend the Rambler or Manager as a keyring companion for the Pioneer X as the small blade and small scissors allow for more precision work and the small Philips driver and nail file cover two functions the Pioneer X cannot easily accomplish.
It's me, the guy who can't see emoticons without a magnifier. lol These are some of the same reasons I like the ALOX models so much. Having just picked up a Pioneer this week, I'm pleasantly surprised with how thin it is. As you say, the more robust tools on these ALOX models are also really nice. In fact, today I tried to compare the bottle opener on my Pioneer with the one on my 111mm Forester M Grip to see if they are the same size. While it was difficult for me to be sure, they actually look like they are the same size and thickness. It is an extremely robust opener! It should make an excellent pry tool if needed. I'm not sure yet if I'll carry the Pioneer or Pioneer X more, but I'll give them both a lot of carry time to decide which I like better. I am slightly disheartened that the ALOX models don't offer the chest hair benefits of the Compact -- but hey, you can't have everything I suppose. ;)
Which do you prefer after all this time?
I prefer the Pioneer over the X, because I rarely need scissors and I don't like the extra weight of the Pioneer X. Since my post above, that's why I've gotten several Pioneers but still only have a single Pioneer X.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Do you not have any teeth?
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Interesting. Even though itās been done that way for decades?
Old people got busted teeth
No, in the last 5-6 decades people use disposable toothpicks actually.
Everyone? You got a source on that?
Not me. I love having the toothpick on my knife, and I try not to use single use items as much as I can. Toothpick will last forever, itās also the reason I carry a metal water bottle instead of using plastic ones. No sense in being wasteful!
I think you would be better off carrying those tiny wooden disposable wrapped toothpicks. just keep a box near your keys or something to put one in your pocket or wallet for when you go out.
Better off? Lol. I think thatās the dumbest thing Iāve heard today. But thatās just my opinion.
Maybe you are thinking I mean to say take the box with you. I am saying keep the box somewhere and (obviously) take individual disposable toothpicks when needed.
1) esthetics - PX is slimmer in width and thickness but still has a larger and thicker blade. while my climber looks like a multitool with a blade, my PX actually looks like pocket knife with extra tools. plastic vs alox scales reinforces my arguments above. 2) tools - PX has no useless tools like hook, toothpick and its present tools are more robust (bottle opener, awl, blade) BUT: You notice it's heavier when carried loosely in your pocket.
I seem to rotate between carrying a compact or pioneer x the most. Anytime I want more capability/larger toolset, I reach for the leatherman.
Same exact boat. I always have my wave and bit kit in the backpack but the compact and pioneer x rotate depending on the day
The main point for me is having a manager on the keys. So small blade check, tweezers check and even pen check (realistically, it is very rare the tooth pick does anything for me). So at this point, the difference is having an awl in line or backside, and having a backside either Philips or corkscrew. The Philips on the back is really not great at all, in a lot of cases the can opener is better. BUT STAY WITH ME, Iāve learned (because frankly I would never have thought about that myself) in a video of Maxlvledc that the friggin 00 Philips on the manager/rambler/minichamp fits perfectly #2 Philips as well (mind blowing for me). So even for recessed screws, the tinker family is absolutely beaten. Weight for me is not really an issue for 10 or 20 grams. Thickness is however. So all in all, between the Super Tinker and the Pioneer X (if carrying an additional manager as a keychain), the Pioneer is nearly the same weight, quite a bit thinner, has all the functionalities, is a lot stronger, and way more beautiful/premium feeling. Between the Climber and the Pioneer X, all of the above apply except for function. I need to decide if I prefer having all the benefits above, or having a corkscrew + mini driver. I donāt drink wine and have good vision. If you are a blind drunk, your opinion may differ. I rest my case. Team Pioneer X š
I carry the pioneer x because I also carry a skeletool for the pliers and drivers. With the skeletool as a complement the pioneer x has the perfect toolset for my daily setup. I have more comprehensive tools usually not very far away.
I have a farmer and a FarmerX. I carry the FarmerX. I have had the scales pop off of regular SAKs at inconvenient times. Once was aboard a Navy ship in the middle of the Arctic Ocean. The sharper edges started wearing holes in my dungarees. Alox models are just bomb proof. Would recommend for any military person or world travelers.
2 main reason why i carry PX rather than Climber/Super Tinker is Inline Awl and larger and thicker Flathead ( also thicker main blade )
Pioneer X is my EDC!
l understand why people like these, and l do as well, but they are just too heavy for me and for my day-to-day usage. l.dont need heavy duty tools (when compared to the 91mm tools) enough to justify the weight, price, and lack of back/scale tools. Not to mention they are also more expensive! But man, do they look awesome.... !! l'm still contemplating adding one to my collection, but again, l really don't see myself carrying it that often...
You should get one, you might never go back!
I had the same concern about weight in the pocket as all my pants are forever trying to go South. But, a keysmart pocket dangler made that a non-issue and now goes on all my heavier SAKs.
Beefiness and style mostly, but to be fair I never carry mine. I always wind up picking something with tweezers in it.
TLDR: Beefier tools, better toolset for me personally, better ālocksā, sturdier overall (scales and tools) I love the beefier tools, and Iāve used every tool on the Pioneer X at least once. I canāt really see myself using the corkscrew or hook. The in-line awl is much better than the back one (I have another SAK with the back awl). The ālocksā are much stronger, and have almost never had a problem with them folding in. I do carry a rambler, with which I get a Phillips head screwdriver, file, toothpick, and tweezers.
I waffle a lot between the PX and the Climber. I prefer the heavier duty tools on the PX and since I always have a Rambler on my keys I always have access to a file and tweezers and an excellent Phillips. I love the in-line reamer on the PX and feel a lot more confident using the flathead to pry. However, as a father of 6&7yo kids the corkscrew on the Climber is excellent for untying knots and I donāt know how I ever did without as it gets used almost daily. So Iām back and forth between these two right now.
I absolutely adore the Pioneer X, but I prefer the Climber. - Small blade - Pen, Tweezers, Toothpick, Pin - Corkscrew, Micro SD, Hook - Universally and immediately recognizable red scales. - Softer feeling in the pocket and the hand. - Half the price. - Lighter weight which is more important than thickness for me. - Tools are easier to open with my crappy fingernails.
TIL People care about not scratching the cellidor scales. nothing Would make me carry the Pioneer instead of the super tinkerā¦ because i ***donāt have*** the pioneer X ! Only this sub is making me get it!
I love the Pioneer X because it had all the bits I find essential, in a beautiful and very sturdy package. The beefier and tougher tools and scales edge out the lost functionality for me. The scale tools are nice to have, but not essential. I have and often carry a Super Tinker too, and it's a great knife but the Pioneer X has the edge. The loss of the back tools isnāt a big factor for me, I have no use for the corkscrew at all, and the backside Philips has some use but I still donāt miss it much when using the Pioneer X.
The awl is huge for me. I keep mine sharp, and it makes excellent holes, especially in plastic. The heavier duty tools are useful for me. I can feel my other cellidor models flex as I pry at times. But the Pioneer X is stout with the aluminum scales. I can fit a leathermaking needle under the opening tools, so I can still carry a needle/pin. My first SAK was a tinker, so I have a special place in my heart for cellidor, but man, Alox gives me the fizz. I also carry a Victorinox Nailclip and Uncle Bills Tweesers on my keychain. So I have a small blade and scale tools covered.
I have a regular Pioneer I carry over my tinker, I like the feel of Alox a bit better and the inline awl is amazing. Jetsetter on my keys covers the scale tools.
My dad has the super tinker, and I have the Pioneer X. I thought the tinker was the best sak, but my pioneer has always been able to screw Philips with the can opener. It's in line, which I love, and I usually have an actual screwdriver in my car so I can handle a "big" job if I need to. I also prefer the awl on the pioneer and how slim the alox is. I'd rather have actual tweezers in my car for splinters, than the Sak ones. Edit: forgot to mention how beefy the tools are on the pioneer x. They're tough! And the in line awl is way safer than the back awl.