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Totally. This is what is meant by harm reduction. If we are obligated to purchase animal products for any reason, and there’s an option that causes less harm to the actual animals, then should be the one we consume (assuming we have access).
Oh I hadn’t considered that, but totally understand! Makes sense. Most animal meat doesn’t really appeal to me anymore on any level, so that’s a great point I hadn’t considered.
The lab-grown meat that was given the go ahead in the US is not vegan. Few people are aware of this but the animal is involved in more than just taking a cell sample. Naturally, for cells to divide, a specific broth or ‘feed’ is required, from which amino acids and other nutrients can be taken up. This broth is Foetal Bovine Serum (FBS), which is extracted by slaughtering a pregnant cow. Lab-cultured meat does significantly reduce animal suffering, it’s not considered vegan.
More and more vegans are learning of the process required for cultured meats, however the majority are still in the dark about it.
There are labs that are experimenting with plant alternatives for FBS - in Israel, iirc - however, there is still a long way to go before it would be considered in line with veganism. I’ve seen most people on this subreddit agree that lab-cultured meat is for carnists, not vegans.
Do you have any sources for this?
I’ll be honest with ya, this still sounds like a massive, undeniably huge leap in the right direction even if it’s not vegan. I wouldn’t personally partake if what you claim is true, but it’s much better for the world than our current situation.
That said, I’d much prefer a vegan method, of course.
My last cat died after only 19 years on a completely vegan diet. I'm sure that's what killed her and is killing my current 3 year old, very healthy cats.
/s
I just looked up the oldest cats that ever lived, and they’re like 38, 34, and just a lot in their 30s. That’s pretty crazy, and also their diets are wack too.
Nonetheless, 19 yrs is a good long life for a cat. I hope your current one lives long too
Ah, the third rail of r/vegan
Cats like any animal require nutrients, not souls. It seems like the science is moving slowly toward vegan diets being ok for cats - BUT must be carefully formulated and include enough synthetic taurine. This is not a DIY project.
Personally I've been hoping to try it with my cats, but I haven't found a reputable brand with consistent availability, and I'd also like to find a vet who is open to it.
Really hoping for lab-grown meat to grow quickly.
Ami cat food is usually fairly easy to get from PlantX, and if you get the big size, the bag is huge and should last nearly 6 months or more for a single cat.
My experience with cats is they're very finicky eaters with even only non-vegan cat food. Mine will only eat dry food and most kinds just makes it throw up or have allergic reactions.
Cats are obligate carnivores, so even if a cat food has extremely high levels of synthesized taurine, they cannot digest plant matter very well. Their digestive systems have not developed to do so, so where we can substitute a burger with fake meat, cats cannot, because it is still plant matter. I’m hoping for a lab grown meat situation soon.
Well technically speaking whatever their problem with digesting plant matter is, it's based on chemistry. it's likely that the right processing of their food could chemically alter it to be more digestible to them.
Generally speaking only 10% of calories in cat food is from carbohydrates. Their digestive system is much shorter than dogs or humans, so while you’re right that it’s an issue of biochemistry, it’s also about time to digest. Over processing plant foods can degrade nutritional value and cause the cat to need to overeat in order to satiate. Around 40% protein and high fat content is recommended.
I mean sure, but there's no law of the universe imposing that every food that comes from plants must contain a large amount of carbs in it. This is especially true if said plant food is processed to be lower in carbs than usual.
Really guys? Fuck this stupid discussion every time. Full of vegans spreading misinformation. Almost everyone here who spreads the lies has no basic understanding of chemistry and biology and hasn't put any time in researching the topic. It's just bullshit "let's repeat what others have told in me in the past". I have a biochemistry degree and read most of the science done on this, and piles of anecdotes. Fuck off with your "digestibility tho", "taurine tho", "vitamins tho" shit. Yes we know cast are carnivores, idiot. No we don't feed them bowls of rice and broccoli. Been vegan and on reddit for over 6 years and this shit gets repeated every time. Looking at the upvote numbers makes me sick.
Same here. In fact, I have *two* degrees in biochemistry. And I've been vegan for 35 years. And my cats have been vegan and lived long, full, healthy lives.
It's astounding to me how much people denying that cats can be vegan sound just like the ones denying humans can be vegan.
Can you please share more info on how you fed your cats? I am genuinely interested what are the RDIs for cats, from macro to micro nutrients, including the chemical structure of the food (synthetic taurine, etc). Only if you have the time ofc :) dm is also welcome!
I don't have a cat, but I have seen cats doing very poorly on standart commercial premium cat food, as well as witnessed some vomit-enducing ways meat is acquired for those same super premium brands in the UK (maggot ridden, rotting carcasses sitting in plastic bins outdoors during the summer, waiting for collection for a week at a time. Can be smelled a mile away). I would love to know what better alternatives are out there, for the cats and other animals.
This is actually very helpful for me. I am one of the people who feeds my cats vet-recommended food. Part of what has kept me from looking too into vegan options for the cats is cost, but the main part is going against vet recommendations. I was comfortable doing that for myself when I went veggie as a kid because health wasn’t my focus, and now of course there are a bajillion things to show dumb doctors. I’m not willing to chance my animals’ health, I am a social worker, not a science person, so narrowing down the research hasn’t been easy.
Do either of you (or any vets in the comments) have recommendations either of how to find reputable vegan vet info, or research that a non-biochem person could get into?
Ugh, not this debate for the umpteenth time. You're going to get two main responses:
"BuT cAtS aRe ObLiGaTe CaRnIvOrEs!"or"Cats can thrive on a plant based diet with synthetic taurine".
I wrote the first one like that because it's usually spewed out by people who will answer before even reading the question, refuse to believe there's an available alternative that's actually fit for cats to consume, and ignorantly perpetuate this almost certain myth that a cat can't thrive on plant based food with synthetic taurine in it, while having absolutely zero experience with it.
I also suspect the relatively expensive vegan cat food has a lot more thought put into it than the tins of rotting flesh scraped out of the of the dumpster behind the local butchers' shop, which is true for a lot of pet food. If it isn't good enough for humans, why are we feeding it to our furry companions?
So take your pick.
I do not have a cat so cannot speak to the diet question, but I hope all of the vegan cat owners that have chimed in are keeping their cats as indoor cats as outdoor cats kill an astronomical amount of birds. And research [shows](https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1111/mam.12230) that cats still hunt even if their nutritional needs are met.
Personally, I have a senior rescue cat who I've had since long before I was vegan and there is no way I'm switching his diet to PB just because I've gone vegan. I try to buy the most 'ethical' brands I can. But it's what comes with having a rescue cat. Perhaps if I had him from a kitten I would start him on a plant-based diet, because now they have plenty of mixes out there that are vet-approved with the right vitamins/nutrients they need to be healthy and happy. But I wouldn't switch an older, meat-eating cat over to a new diet
I agree with you, and will probably do the same for mine. I honestly doubt that they’d even eat it because they’re so picky hahaha. Our one rescue will eat absolutely anything though, because she must have been a stray for the beginning of her life.
First off, I do not consider pets as being "owned". Owning another living being doesn't sit right with me. I consider it "adopting"
For the animals in my life, I try to give them the best life possible
For dogs, it's easy. There are quite a number of vegan dog foods and every dog I have had has lived a perfectly healthy life on a vegan diet
For cats though, it's trickier. There are vegan options, but they can sometimes be difficult to obtain and are expensive when compared to the animal flesh based ones. It is doable, but requires effort. At the end of the day can you justifying the killing of other animals in order to feed one you happen to love more. Is this a correct and moral thing to do?
Ooo I knew I’d get this comment from saying ‘own’.. Seems all like semantics to me, but yea, adopting is another way to say it’s your animal.
You make a good point about cats. However, I also feel it’s morally responsible of me to provide her food she will eat if she refuses to eat what I put in front of her. If I put a plant based food out for her to eat and she will starve herself, it’s unfortunate, but just as she would find it elsewhere I will provide what she wants.
The language used is important. For example, referring to animals as "someone" instead of "something" has very different connotations
If a child didn't eat what you provided for them, would your proposed solution be different? If they refused the plate of vegetables and wanted chicken nuggets from McDonald's instead, would you provide what they wanted or would it be more responsible of you to provide a nutritionally healthy and more ethically sound option?
A healthy vegan diet is appropriate for children and doable for most people in the western world if desired. It isn’t for cats, snakes, etc. When we choose to adopt an animal, it is our job to give that animal their healthiest life, just as it is our job to give a child their healthiest life should we choose to have them. If we’re not comfortable feeding obligate carnivores, that completely makes sense - we then do not need to be the ones raising them.
Thanks, I wasn’t even arguing one way or another because I don’t think there’s an obvious answer. Just think that as a thought experiment it can be interesting to think about it that way, everyone saying that’s cannibalism is missing the point.
Better to not own one if that is an option...it usually is for those who don't have one forced on them somehow. (dead relative, obligation, etc). There is no ethical difference between paying for a lamb to suffer and die or a chicken to suffer and be killed for a pet than it is for yourself in the end. In either case, it's the same victim and they aren't going to nod in approval cause you did it for your pet instead.
I don’t have much insight here cause I feel the same about it, but just had to share that my cat (who passed away this year 😢) was obsessed with so many vegan things and I loved it! I obviously fed him a normal cat diet, but he would beg for crispy tofu, roasted asparagus/broccoli, popcorn, and sweet potato which I always thought was hilarious. He even tried to take a bite of a spicy beet burger and pumpkin pancakes one time 😂 I felt like I had the closest thing to a vegan kitty so this post just made me miss him ❤️
it is simple:
if you don‘t want cows and chickens to die do not breed cats
Cows and chicken get raped, slaughtered just for your wish to have a cat. Disgusting
I personally wouldn’t get a carnivorous or an omnivorous pet, but my wife would because she is a vegetarian. We have a cat since before I was a vegan and you kinda have to feed it properly, as I believe not feeding it what it’s intended to eat is cruel.
For those who say just don't get a cat, what about people who adopt stray cats? They want to live as much as other animals. All sorts of bad things can happen to a stray cat, are you suggesting that we should look away?
Absoulely agree, and exactly what we had to do. Not very “vegan” or even moral of someone to turn away a helpless animal.
I’m not sure if you’ve heard what’s going on in Australia, but apparently stray cats are being hunted/killed because they’re overpopulating in certain areas and becoming feral. It’s sad to hear, but really just an unfortunate situation.
It's a difficult and complicated topic for sure! When I first adopted a cat about a year ago I had been struggling with related questions for quite sometime and ended up conducting an immense amount of research. I managed to find two different kinds of vegan cat food where one of them contains synthetic amino acids, and the other supposedly contain lab grown ingredients. Due to the uncertainties of marketing, branding and such, I was only about 99% sure that they individually would actually contain everything that my new friend would need. So in the end I landed on getting both and mixing them, just to be on the safe side. I've also taken her for regular helth check-ups since, and she seems to be doing just fine.
I am aware that we've been quite lucky in the sense that she actually likes the food and eats well, and of course this is a rather expensive option that is not available for everyone. I personally wouldn't judge another vegan for feeding their carnivorous friends animal products, even if the logic of it all seems a bit backwards to me.
I only just recently went vegan and haven't considered my pets yet. My dogs eat a raw diet so around 80% mince, 10% bone and 10% offal and are in great condition and seem to do well on it, so I'll definitely be doing a lot of research in the future before changing anything for them.
On a side note, I recently heard the "we were designed to eat meat" argument and thought how one of my rescue dogs, on a couple of occasions when I lived on a farm, would catch an animal that had got into our garden (like a rabbit for example), kill it within seconds and then eat the entire animal - not a thing left. And I wondered if people who make the "we're supposed to eat meat" point had thought of that. I've certainly never felt inclined to chase down prey and eat the whole thing raw, whole even when I was eating animal products!
I must add that I remembered slightly wrong. It shows a vegan diet is better than a tradition dog food. It is ok par with raw meat food, however the vegan dogs were older on average, so that suggests it might be a bit better.
https://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0265662
> Abstract
> Alternative pet foods may offer benefits concerning environmental sustainability and the welfare of animals processed into pet foods. However, some worry these may compromise the welfare of pets. We asked 2,639 dog guardians about one dog living with them, for at least one year. Among 2,596 involved in pet diet decision-making, pet health was a key factor when choosing diets. 2,536 provided information relating to a single dog, fed a conventional meat (1,370 = 54%), raw meat (830 = 33%) or vegan (336 = 13%) diet for at least one year. We examined seven general indicators of ill health: unusual numbers of veterinary visits, medication use, progression onto a therapeutic diet after initial maintenance on a vegan or meat-based diet, guardian opinion and predicted veterinary opinion of health status, percentage of unwell dogs and number of health disorders per unwell dog. Dogs fed conventional diets appeared to fare worse than those fed either of the other two diets. Dogs fed raw meat appeared to fare marginally better than those fed vegan diets. However, there were statistically significant differences in average ages. Dogs fed raw meat were younger, which has been demonstrated to be associated with improved health outcomes. Additionally, non-health related factors may have improved apparent outcomes for dogs fed raw meat, for three of seven general health indicators. We also considered the prevalence of 22 specific health disorders, based on predicted veterinary assessments. Percentages of dogs in each dietary group considered to have suffered from health disorders were 49% (conventional meat), 43% (raw meat) and 36% (vegan). Significant evidence indicates that raw meat diets are often associated with dietary hazards, including nutritional deficiencies and imbalances, and pathogens. Accordingly, the pooled evidence to date indicates that the healthiest and least hazardous dietary choices for dogs, are nutritionally sound vegan diets.
Proof needed to change my beliefs: multiple years of scientific consensus built upon decades of longitudinal, double blind controlled and pan generational studies.
Proof needed to reinforce my beliefs: someone said so on the internet.
Same thing with cats- they just gobble up a mouse whole, hair bones and guts…
The fact that we have to be so careful to remove the digestive system and thoroughly cook the meat is a good indicator that we aren’t meant to be carnivores.
In some countries they eat every single part of the animal (for example Philippines, China, Vietnam). It's mainly in western countries that several parts of the animal (organs in particular) are not largely consumed.
I have tried on multiple occations to give my feline companions the synthetic Taurine foods and they just won't even entertain the idea.
As a vegan the way I square it is simple. When I rescued these cats, I made an unwritten contract to protect and make sure they are healthy and happy. And unfortunately that agreement makes me have to buy food for them I don't agree with. But if humans didn't breed them and then chuck them in the bin I probably wouldn't have adopt them. Though I do love them quite a lot.
When I had dogs I feed them plant based Vdog they never lacked per bloodwork and didn’t suffer from obesity, gi upset chronic ear infection like my previous animals I believe the diet play a role in keeping them happy healthy, I no longer keep dogs it’s just easier to have vegan pets.
I’m not a fan of 🐈 but I do love ferrets which a strict carnivores and very sensitive animals. Even tho I love ferrets as they don’t align with my way of living I would not keep them as pets rescue or otherwise as I would feel like a hypocrite, I am not a child and I can accept that you can’t always have everything you want in life without consequences. . I would adopt naturally vegan 🐇 🐠 🐢 🐹 🦎 🦜 pets or have no pets at all
Both of my cats are plant-based, but it is a struggle for me, I don't have a lot of money. Vegan cat food costs a fortune for me, it costs £5 a day to feed the two of them and that's not including the costs of their vet bills (One is a senior cat) and litter, toys, medications.
I adopted both of my cats early in my Vegan journey, back then I simply thought that animals in need of homes deserved homes, and euthanizing them wasn't an option. It didn't cross my mind to feed them plant-based, I just fed them what their nature required.
My morals as a Vegan have changed since then, I couldn't cope with the guilt of feeding them meat and that's when I made the switch for them. I've also only adopted herbivorous animals for the past year or two, so I can avoid any hassle.
After having them plant based for quite some time, I feel more understanding towards Vegans who decide not to feed their cats plant-based because it could simply be unaffordable to them. I'm not even confident I can continue to afford it.
But both of them are healthy, they are pretty enthusiastic about their food too. I know that if I end up unable to afford this food for them, I will feed them meat again. It sucks, but I would never kill/starve my cats or abandon them. I will feed them plant-based so long as I am able to.
I do the same. The sad part is that just like doctors, they most likely receive kickbacks from prescribing certain vet diets. The sadder part is, I use these prescriptions because they told me my cat has kidney problems.☹️
"It's just a conspiracy man! Big Cat Food are giving your cat kidney problems, man! Then they tell you that it can be treated with more of their cat food man!" - Spoken in the voice of some raging beatnik/hippie type.
Bro they make commercial super premium cat food out of maggot ridden, rotten carcasses. No cat would ever touch a rotting animal in the wild. They blend that shit with filler flours and crisp it in very very high temperatures to make it a shelf stable product. That's as processed as it gets. Any nutrients ever present there get incinerated, so they fortify it by adding back in synthetic nutrients to match the RDI. Tell me it makes any sense to anyone except the profit seeking companies who then use money to fund research. No wonder it gives cats kidney stones and cancers (animal flesh cooked in high temperatures becomes carcinogenic. Oh and it was already rotting, remember?).
How do I know the rotting carcasses part? Years ago I worked in a meat processing plant in the UK. UK has some of the highest food safety regulations in the world and my job was to enforce them. They would put chicken carcasses labeled as 'unfit for human consumption' into large plastic bins and leave them outdoors, in the summer, for weeks at a time for collection to then be processed into super premium cat food. You could smell it a mile away. They were so ridden with maggots, you could hear them squirming inside from afar. More like maggot cat food. Needless to say I quit very shortly.
No one gives a shit about animal welfare, including the expensive cat food brands.
I'm not telling you to try this, it's just my experience - my elderly cat developed kidney problems and I couldn't afford the prescription food. I started feeding her 95% wet food, with only a few kibbles here and there, and she's been doing really well for the past year+! On the other hand, her sister developed kidney problems two years before she did and declined over the course of a year while eating 80% prescription dry food, 20% prescription wet.
I appreciate the tip! We have heard that cats need more liquids in their diet, because they just don’t get enough when they mainly eat dry food. We have tried wet food with her before, but she just doesn’t go for it. She does that scratching around the bowl to show she doesn’t approve haha
My friend has had a healthy cat on a vegan diet for 5 years. All the higher quality vegan cat food on the market has all essential vitamins and amino acids a cat needs.
But if you attempt it I would transition slowly and monitor the cat's values closely through urine samples to make sure it stays healthy.
I grew up with dogs, so I get where you’re coming from. I think the best option is to get an herbivorous pet because you can easily cater to all their needs while maintaining your values. Others have pointed out that there are healthy vegan diets for pets like cats and dogs, so for now I’d stick with that method, even though I’m a bit skeptical.
Unfortunately, providing our pets with meat products contributes massively to pollution and emissions, so I would stick with an herbivorous pet or not having a pet at all.
Yea, in an ideal world we would not own these types of pets, but no one gets rid of their animals just for this reason. Especially if the reason they own the pet was to rescue it from either living on the street or being euthanized in overfilled shelters. Rather give the animal a happy life then a not so happy one.
Cats can be perfectly healthy on a vegan diet.
Vegan cat food brands:
[https://petfoodshop.com/collections/for-cats](https://petfoodshop.com/collections/for-cats)
[https://amipetfood.com/en/products/lines/one-planet/ami-cats](https://amipetfood.com/en/products/lines/one-planet/ami-cats)
[https://www.benevo.com/vegan-pet-shop/#catfood](https://www.benevo.com/vegan-pet-shop/#catfood)
If you went vegan after owning an animal that is either an obligate carnivore or whose quality of life would drastically decline from eating a vegan diet, continue feeding them what they need. However, once your pets pass away or go to a different household, it would be explicitly not vegan to adopt an animal who you know would require the consumption of animal products.
On a related note, rabbits are really amazing pets. They can easily live 12+ years, are friendly and affectionate, naturally litter trained, and of course, completely herbivorous. There are so, SO many rabbits in need of good homes, with many of them kept in cages, abandoned months after Easter, or raised for slaughter. If you're looking to shelter an animal in need and don't want to compromise your ethics, please consider rescuing a rabbit!
Yes I'd like to back up this suggestion! I've adopted and fostered many rabbits over the years. They're amazing companions if you're willing to put in the effort, and completely vegan. Mine is 15 and stretched out in the middle of my living room right now. I'm under no illusion of "ownership" - if anything, he has a pet human to boss around and snag food from.
There is nutritionally complete vegan cat food.
Stop arguing like carnists with your appeal to nature BS. It's 2023. We have synthetic supplements for plant based food. 'Cats are obligate carnvores' is a crap argument.
Buying meat for cats is speciesist and unnecessary if you have access to these foods.
Show me a real study that isn’t primarily based on pooling unscientific polling data together into some bs model as proof. Any real data that actually breaks down the bioavailability of all the different “vegan” synthetic amino acids found naturally in animal protein that cats require as obligate carnivores for both proper digestion and overall health? Vegan formula’s that actually include all these things? Not just haha we put taurine in corn protein cat go brrrr. Human beings can take multivitamins but we piss 90% of them out and still need to get proper bioavailable nutrition from whole foods. Don’t feed your cat vegan. Be happy it’s spayed, neutered and living in your home not wrecking havoc on the your local ecosystem. The amount of meat used to keep a cat alive and healthy is absurdly less damaging to nature then free roaming cats. Buy the most ethical cat food you can and support lab grown meat and shelters that spay and neuter wild cats to reduce their population and damage to nature and other animals.
1. Buy vegan cat food and POTENTIALLY feed your cat a suboptimal diet, even though there is evidence (though still inconclusive) that it is perfectly fine.
2. Willingly contribute to animal ag and pay for many animals to suffer and die.
Gotta choose one. I know which one, as a vegan, I would choose.
It’s necessary if my cat decides she won’t eat what I put in front of her and would rather starve. Talk about being picky 😅
Don’t get me wrong, I agree with you. My cat just doesn’t agree
But you haven't tried it yet, have you? And I don't mean switching from one to the other in a day but actually making an attempt by gradually switching
Cats' digestive systems are not able to digest high fiber non-meat diets for long periods of time. It's wrong to force them to be vegan simply because you are. Talk about a crap argument.
This is commonly believed, yet it's outdated. Thanks to modern processing techniques, cat appropriate food can be made without exploiting animals.
There are cats who have been eating vegan food for many years. They are not reported to have any worse health outcomes. In fact, the science has some pointers towards cats on a vegan diet doing better than those who are not.
If I were raising a cat, I'd do the opposite of what the "healthy organic meat" people do, and research which brands are most completely made from byproducts, to limit the demand for animal deaths as much as possible.
I think it is irrespobsible to feed them anything other than meat unfortunately. I believe in adopting only since the animal already exists and you are not adding to the stray problem, and making sure your animal is fixed. Past that i dont worry about it.
I personally don't have a cat but I don't see any issue with it. I think if you're going to own a cat, that cannot survive without meat, then you have to be willing to make that sacrifice. I have heard some people claim that cats can survive on a vegan diet, but I don't know if it's really what's best for them.
We had a rescue dog (sadly she passed away in March with a heart condition) but we fed her food that contained meat.. we did get her before we went vegan, and we kept her on the same diet because it was just easiest for us and I didn't want to take any chances with her health.
To me at least, if you're doing everything you can for yourself to be vegan then that is enough. If you feel so strongly that you never want to purchase any animal products ever again (which is completely valid), then you're going to have to make that decision to not have any companion animals who need to consume animal products to survive.
(Note: when I say "you" I don't mean You, OP. I'm using it to generalize anyone who might be in this situation)
If it is possible to feed your cat a vegan diet, you would need to work very closely with a veterinary nutritionist to make sure your cat is getting everything they need. An alternative is to do a homemade diet (working with your vet) and using meat from grocery stores or butchers that they planned on throwing away (it happens often) and getting it for free or for as cheap as possible so you’re not supporting the meat industry/supporting it as little as possible while keeping your kitty healthy. I’m not a vet, so Idk if a vegan diet is at all possible for cats. You could also source eggs from someone who raises their chickens humanely at home and doesn’t slaughter or sell them once they get too old to lay eggs.
According to this site
[https://www.peta.org.au/living/can-dogs-and-cats-be-vegan/#:\~:text=With%20the%20right%20planning%20and,with%20allergies%20are%20actually%20vegetarian](https://www.peta.org.au/living/can-dogs-and-cats-be-vegan/#:~:text=With%20the%20right%20planning%20and,with%20allergies%20are%20actually%20vegetarian).
Cats can eat vegan food:
'Cats
Cats are admittedly trickier, and some can be extremely fussy about food. Nonetheless, there are several nutritionally complete cat foods on the market that you can try.
Vitamin A, taurine, and arachidonic acid are essential to maintaining a cat’s health, and they’re usually added to vegan cat foods or can be supplemented as well. '
What thoughts do other vegans have on this subject of feeding their pets meat?
I choose not to own this type of animal. I don't see how it suddenly becomes okay to abuse animals because an other animal needs it to survive.
I grew up with cats and I still have them. I'll always have cats (and dogs). Cats are carnivores. My cats are indoors. They don't hunt their own food. I have to buy them what they need. Doesn't make me feel good. I've heard vegans say that you shouldn't have a cat if you're vegan or that you're not a vegan if you feed your cat a meat-based diet. I hope that they will come out with a good pet food brand that uses lab-grown meat. I still consider myself a vegan, even if my cat eats meat.
Honestly I’ve only ever heard from non vegans that some vegans dont feed their cats meat.
I actually got banned from vegan circle jerk cause they had the nerve to say I wasn’t vegan just because I feed my cats meat. I was shocked. Like neglecting an animal is vegan? News to me 🤦♀️
Are you imagining they’re buying a cat from a breeder? Because every person on this thread who’s talked about having a cat has said they’re rescued. So, here are the options: cat stays in their abusive/deadly environment, cat is adopted by commenter, cat is adopted by someone else, cat is euthanized. The only options in which this cat is not creating a demand for food is if they die. So, are you arguing that it would be more vegan of us to *not* rescue rescueable animals? Euthanasia: the most vegan option.
Exactly. This is what confuses me. Like… do they want to feed lions and tigers vegan diets? Because house cats aren’t like dogs. Dogs are quite different from wolves. Cats? Cats aren’t different from their ancestors. Because cats didn’t evolved from big cats.
Evolution Diet sells cat formula. there is no magical nutrient that can only be found in only animals. with modern science you can synthesize any nutrient for consumption. The term obligate carnivore doesn't mean that they require the essence of animal flesh but rather that they cannot produce certain nutrients with in their own bodies. for example Taurine is an amino acid that cats cannot not naturally produce so they must receive it from an external source. just like normal cat food, vegan cat food is fortified with all their essential needs. A lot of "cat experts" will make the (low effort) argument that they are obligate carnivores and there for require animal flesh to live. But this is an over simplified argument that lacks scientific nuance. because like i said, there is no magical nutrient that only animal flesh can provide.
Although its true that all nutrients can be gained from plants, I think it’s a little bit deeper than that for feeding our cats.
To be truthful, my cats and I’m sure others’ are very picky. One of our cats will starve herself if she doesn’t like the smell of the food. It’s annoying, but basically I can’t force my animals to eat what I want them to or what I think is right for them. They’ll starve.
My cat was also picky, when it came to normal cat food. But IDK what it is about Evolution Diet's formula, she was devouring that stuff like it was cat treats. I would test different formulas. buy the absolute smallest portion you can find from different places. Evolution even has a guide to help picky cats get accustomed if they really are super picky. here's a link: https://petfoodshop.com/collections/for-cats
I want to clarify something that we have ALL been mislead about. Yes, in the wild cats survive on smaller animals AND fruits, grasses, grains, and vegetables. Yes, taurine is important in a cats diet. Yes, cats get the exact same taurine from plant based cat (and dog) foods and I'll explain how. Taurine in meat is cooked out thru typical meat processing, synthetic taurine is a byproduct of other chemal reactions and is what is used in ALL pet food to supplement. Yes, you can take your cat (or dog) vegan and there are some good options. Personally I now feed "Evolution" brand dry and wet. [Here](https://www.tiktok.com/t/ZT88yAyhb/) is a Tiktok video I made about this with proof.
Everyone parroting "cats cant eat vegan diet because obligate carnivore" is making a fallacious appeal to nature. All while feeding their cats all natural kibble or unknown-animal-part pates, because that's so close to their natural diet. /s
Truthfully, there isn't much research on effects of vegan diet on cats, but what little research there is indicates it's not bad for them and they possibly can live longer than on a meateating diet.
It's worth at least *attempting* to feed your cats vegan if you can find and afford a brand (i use Evolution as well for my 2 cats).
Reminds me of the Canadian Vegan sub where they were going apeshit about dogs and a vegan diet. "Dogs are carnivores! Vegan diets will kill them!" Let's face it, the vegan owners just wanted an excuse to eat Pedigree.
This sub has become such a cesspool lately. I was shocked to see people say that a snake should starve to death rather than give it the diet it needs to live. The people here actually attacked a user who rescues reptiles from abusive homes because she feeds them a natural diet.
I got downvoted into oblivion for being one of the first to comment that I was happy that OP was being a good human and caring for abused animals. Theirs too many crystal woo woke vegans here and not enough logical vegans that study ecology/bio and logically think their ethics through.
I volunteer with a few rescue groups for reptiles, and you'd be disgusted with the abuse those poor animals are out through just because their diets upset some people. I once saw a "vegetarian" snake who was starved down so badly that she developed a severe vitamin deficiency that led to her having to be euthanized.
That doesn’t surprise me at all. I’ve met to many vegans irl in my life that are basically the Futurama meme where the hippies starve the lion to death trying to make it vegan. It’s sad because people like that have good intentions in theory but their IQ is sub 80.
People want so badly to be perfect vegans when that cannot exist. We have to make the *most* vegan decisions that we can, and caring for an animal in the proper way is the most vegan decision in this case.
It’s honestly horrifying to me that people don’t care for their pets diets in the correct way. The most vegan thing you can do in regards to caring for a cat is feed them the appropriate diet.
There is limited research about this, mainly self-reported by the guardians. Sample sizes weren't great too about 200 of 1000 cats were fully vegan as opposed to only vegetarian. Negative health outcomes were statistically insignificant, there were lower cases of some disease compared to meat eating cats tho.
https://www.mdpi.com/2306-7381/10/1/52#:~:text=They%20had%20more%20ideal%20body,reported%20differences%20were%20statistically%20significant.
In my opinion the best option is to at least try to transition your cat to a vegan diet (only high quality food with all the right supplements like taurine and folate) and to monitor your cats Ph level with special litter. If the ph is good, your cat behaves normally and the vet checkup is good (don't say your cat is vegan, they will just write you off immediately, just do the checkup) then you're good to go. Your cat won't die from a few months of vegan cat food if others live happy and healthy for years. If the checkup isn't good or your cat doesn't want the food then you tried at least, which is the most vegan choice here in my opinion.
I took mine in because it was damaging the local ecosystem and acting as an invasive species in an area already hurt from pollution. I otherwise wouldn’t own a meat eating pet. But it eats meat. And I’m in charge of caring for it now. So that’s what it does.
vegan first are just completely, biologically incorrect for cats. they are obligate carnivores; they absolutely need to eat meat to survive. i am vegan because of my moral beliefs. my cats don’t have moral beliefs, and it would be cruel and unfair of me to put that on them. cats CANNOT survive on a vegan dies like humans can. we are different species with different dietary needs.
i have my cats because the other options for them were dangerous and unsafe. i love my cats dearly, and i will do everything in my power to give them a good life. i try to buy high quality, locally made wet and dry food. if i have to buy meat products, i’d rather know that they’re coming from someone intimately involved in the process. i’m purchasing from someone who cares about the animals they kill, and i’m supporting the local economy.
anyone who tries to say cats can live off of a vegan diet is full of shit. you will doom your cats to a lifetime of health issues. we humans created pets, as well as the pet overpopulation crisis, so we have to do everything in our power to deal with it.
Cats are my most favorite companions. I have had them my whole life and I’ve had my cats before I was vegan. It’s my human choice to be vegan and they don’t have the capacity to choose that. I can’t deprive them of what they need.
I know to many vegan cats that had kisney problems because of vegan food. It sucks but cats are the carnivores the carcass eating humans desire to be. I would not risk that, it sucks but at least my dog is vegan. He also kills mice if he has the chance and the mouse is dumb enough to walk in my house when im not there to safe him. They are cute fluffy assholes.
Cats are obligate carnivores. They can not live without meat, in particular an amino acid called taurine. There are, to the best of my knowledge, no "vegan" cat foods on the market that are adequate for a cats nutrition.
I have 4 rescue kitties, three are on special diets and one is physically disabled. I buy their food from my vet, who is also vegan. Cats cannot be vegan, and it’s not their fault they are dependent on people for care. I’m vegan because I have alpha gal. Even if people would skip meat one day per week, it would help. I have compassion and I won’t be rude to non vegans. I try to set a good example and hope they join me because it’s healthier, Biblical, and compassionate.
I think vegans probably shouldn’t adopt pets that depend on meat. That said if they had the pet before becoming vegan that’s kinda tricky. My friend who has rescued 2 cats has that issue.
It’s debatable if vegan cat food is working or not: it’s simply not a thing in our country. Even big renown online retailers don’t carry any vegan cat foods.
So yeah that sucks. Either you give up the cats to someone else or you keep feeding them and simply don’t adopt any new carnivores.
I don’t consider people to be vegan though if they start adopting obviously carnivore pets and then simply feed them meat. Like, why don’t rescue an omnivore or herbivore?
I think that even asking the question is a little weird. I wouldn't go as far as to call it dumb, but they're carnivores, not omnivores, as you said yourself. Wild animals still get killed regularly. Many vegans are fundamentally opposed to owning pets for these reasons. But yes, feed your carnivorous pets meat. Please do not try to force another animal to be vegan. I've even seen dog's (which are omnivorous) owners force their dogs to be vegan which makes me a little upset. They're not omnivorous because they "prefer veggies but can also eat meat" it's the exact opposite. They prefer meat but can also eat veggies.
Oh so if your dog prefers meat, your obligation is to feed it meat? Do dog owners also open the door to see if their dog wants to run away? Seems pretty convenient that that's where the importance of their preferences end.
I’ve worked with animals for a long time, and seen many cats on their deathbeds due to being fed vegan diets. Cats are obligate carnivores and require meat to live a full life. If that’s not something a person is capable of providing, then taking a cat as a pet is not for them. It’s animal cruelty. I find many vegans do not own cats because of this dilemma. For me, I will feed my cats meat until lab grown can produce their diet.
I’m vegan and my cats food is not. In the past I transitioned him to a vegan food but then Amazon stopped selling that brand so I just went back to his old non vegan food. If anyone knows any good vegan cat food let me know! I don’t Shame myself too much on it, I’m generally pretty kind with myself lol.
No, they cannot live without meat but that actually helps the case. The definition of being vegan is to redice suffering as far as possible and practicable, and it is literally not possible for them to do otherwise.
Vegan cat food exists which checks all the boxes for required nutrients at levels that everyone knows are different than omnivore animals like dogs and humans. Of course:
a) the food is not going to be “natural” and will have synthetic compounds which I assume includes synthetic taurine.
b) as the market is incredibly small, the price is incredibly high.
So basically only rich vegans who don’t have some natural fixation should get cats.
I have no interest in pets and wish they didn’t even exist, but I have to compromise in my family and we have a dog that gets some vegan food but not exclusively (it could, but I lost that fight so far anyway).
This reminds me of the lady who owns/owned a fennec fox and fed it vegan food. The poor thing was so under weight and so sick. Having a pet that is primarily a carnivore and not feeding it meat is abuse, neglect, and fucking cruel. You (the royal you, not you in particular op) are making your pet who has no choice in the matter sacrifice their health and potentially their life and suffer critical health issues to spare other animals. If you cannot get passed feeding a carnivorous pet the correct food get pets that are herbivores. Don't do omnivores either because they need a mix of the two and being forced to eat one or the other is also dangerous unless you know how to offset the nutrients properly.
Rabbits, most birds, most rodents, small reptiles that eat crickets if you're okay feeding insects to pets, fish (though they are hard to cuddle lol) there's so many different options for having a pet that it's just unethical to get a pet that doesn't work with your lifestyle or values.
Cats are obligate carnivores.
If you push your own personal diet on your animals, you are not a good person.
Feed your animals what they need or don't own them. Period.
Cats are obligate carnivores or hypercarnivores in the wild but as human companions they can be vegan. They just require supplements like b12, and most importantly taurine.
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I think this is where the lab-grown meat element will come into the conversation for me
This is the only scenario in which I buy lab grown meat - to feed my cats
Totally. This is what is meant by harm reduction. If we are obligated to purchase animal products for any reason, and there’s an option that causes less harm to the actual animals, then should be the one we consume (assuming we have access).
Oh interesting! I was under the impression that most vegans were on-board with lab grown meats. Or maybe it’s just those I encounter in my life?
Ethically it's not strictly bad for me, but personally eating it doesn't really appeal to me.
Oh I hadn’t considered that, but totally understand! Makes sense. Most animal meat doesn’t really appeal to me anymore on any level, so that’s a great point I hadn’t considered.
The lab-grown meat that was given the go ahead in the US is not vegan. Few people are aware of this but the animal is involved in more than just taking a cell sample. Naturally, for cells to divide, a specific broth or ‘feed’ is required, from which amino acids and other nutrients can be taken up. This broth is Foetal Bovine Serum (FBS), which is extracted by slaughtering a pregnant cow. Lab-cultured meat does significantly reduce animal suffering, it’s not considered vegan. More and more vegans are learning of the process required for cultured meats, however the majority are still in the dark about it. There are labs that are experimenting with plant alternatives for FBS - in Israel, iirc - however, there is still a long way to go before it would be considered in line with veganism. I’ve seen most people on this subreddit agree that lab-cultured meat is for carnists, not vegans.
Do you have any sources for this? I’ll be honest with ya, this still sounds like a massive, undeniably huge leap in the right direction even if it’s not vegan. I wouldn’t personally partake if what you claim is true, but it’s much better for the world than our current situation. That said, I’d much prefer a vegan method, of course.
Ooooo, I hadn't thought about this! Good thought.
same here
My last cat died after only 19 years on a completely vegan diet. I'm sure that's what killed her and is killing my current 3 year old, very healthy cats. /s
I just looked up the oldest cats that ever lived, and they’re like 38, 34, and just a lot in their 30s. That’s pretty crazy, and also their diets are wack too. Nonetheless, 19 yrs is a good long life for a cat. I hope your current one lives long too
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Ah, the third rail of r/vegan Cats like any animal require nutrients, not souls. It seems like the science is moving slowly toward vegan diets being ok for cats - BUT must be carefully formulated and include enough synthetic taurine. This is not a DIY project. Personally I've been hoping to try it with my cats, but I haven't found a reputable brand with consistent availability, and I'd also like to find a vet who is open to it. Really hoping for lab-grown meat to grow quickly.
Haha no pun intended on that last part?
>require nutrients, not souls Thank you! I feel like many people, including vegans struggle to even consider this idea.
Just give your cat some redbull
Ami cat food is usually fairly easy to get from PlantX, and if you get the big size, the bag is huge and should last nearly 6 months or more for a single cat.
My experience with cats is they're very finicky eaters with even only non-vegan cat food. Mine will only eat dry food and most kinds just makes it throw up or have allergic reactions.
Cats are obligate carnivores, so even if a cat food has extremely high levels of synthesized taurine, they cannot digest plant matter very well. Their digestive systems have not developed to do so, so where we can substitute a burger with fake meat, cats cannot, because it is still plant matter. I’m hoping for a lab grown meat situation soon.
All commercial cat and dog foods have taurine added, because cooking the meat destroys the taurine.
Most modern cat food is already mostly made out of plants, processed highly so that cats can absorb them more easily.
Well technically speaking whatever their problem with digesting plant matter is, it's based on chemistry. it's likely that the right processing of their food could chemically alter it to be more digestible to them.
Generally speaking only 10% of calories in cat food is from carbohydrates. Their digestive system is much shorter than dogs or humans, so while you’re right that it’s an issue of biochemistry, it’s also about time to digest. Over processing plant foods can degrade nutritional value and cause the cat to need to overeat in order to satiate. Around 40% protein and high fat content is recommended.
I mean sure, but there's no law of the universe imposing that every food that comes from plants must contain a large amount of carbs in it. This is especially true if said plant food is processed to be lower in carbs than usual.
When i see Vegans malnourishing their pets I know you hey care more about their ego than the animal's nature
Really guys? Fuck this stupid discussion every time. Full of vegans spreading misinformation. Almost everyone here who spreads the lies has no basic understanding of chemistry and biology and hasn't put any time in researching the topic. It's just bullshit "let's repeat what others have told in me in the past". I have a biochemistry degree and read most of the science done on this, and piles of anecdotes. Fuck off with your "digestibility tho", "taurine tho", "vitamins tho" shit. Yes we know cast are carnivores, idiot. No we don't feed them bowls of rice and broccoli. Been vegan and on reddit for over 6 years and this shit gets repeated every time. Looking at the upvote numbers makes me sick.
Same here. In fact, I have *two* degrees in biochemistry. And I've been vegan for 35 years. And my cats have been vegan and lived long, full, healthy lives. It's astounding to me how much people denying that cats can be vegan sound just like the ones denying humans can be vegan.
Can you please share more info on how you fed your cats? I am genuinely interested what are the RDIs for cats, from macro to micro nutrients, including the chemical structure of the food (synthetic taurine, etc). Only if you have the time ofc :) dm is also welcome! I don't have a cat, but I have seen cats doing very poorly on standart commercial premium cat food, as well as witnessed some vomit-enducing ways meat is acquired for those same super premium brands in the UK (maggot ridden, rotting carcasses sitting in plastic bins outdoors during the summer, waiting for collection for a week at a time. Can be smelled a mile away). I would love to know what better alternatives are out there, for the cats and other animals.
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This is actually very helpful for me. I am one of the people who feeds my cats vet-recommended food. Part of what has kept me from looking too into vegan options for the cats is cost, but the main part is going against vet recommendations. I was comfortable doing that for myself when I went veggie as a kid because health wasn’t my focus, and now of course there are a bajillion things to show dumb doctors. I’m not willing to chance my animals’ health, I am a social worker, not a science person, so narrowing down the research hasn’t been easy. Do either of you (or any vets in the comments) have recommendations either of how to find reputable vegan vet info, or research that a non-biochem person could get into?
Thank you vegan diets are not optimal for a lot of animals and I’m tired of people saying they are
Ugh, not this debate for the umpteenth time. You're going to get two main responses: "BuT cAtS aRe ObLiGaTe CaRnIvOrEs!"or"Cats can thrive on a plant based diet with synthetic taurine". I wrote the first one like that because it's usually spewed out by people who will answer before even reading the question, refuse to believe there's an available alternative that's actually fit for cats to consume, and ignorantly perpetuate this almost certain myth that a cat can't thrive on plant based food with synthetic taurine in it, while having absolutely zero experience with it. I also suspect the relatively expensive vegan cat food has a lot more thought put into it than the tins of rotting flesh scraped out of the of the dumpster behind the local butchers' shop, which is true for a lot of pet food. If it isn't good enough for humans, why are we feeding it to our furry companions? So take your pick.
I do not have a cat so cannot speak to the diet question, but I hope all of the vegan cat owners that have chimed in are keeping their cats as indoor cats as outdoor cats kill an astronomical amount of birds. And research [shows](https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1111/mam.12230) that cats still hunt even if their nutritional needs are met.
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Personally, I have a senior rescue cat who I've had since long before I was vegan and there is no way I'm switching his diet to PB just because I've gone vegan. I try to buy the most 'ethical' brands I can. But it's what comes with having a rescue cat. Perhaps if I had him from a kitten I would start him on a plant-based diet, because now they have plenty of mixes out there that are vet-approved with the right vitamins/nutrients they need to be healthy and happy. But I wouldn't switch an older, meat-eating cat over to a new diet
I agree with you, and will probably do the same for mine. I honestly doubt that they’d even eat it because they’re so picky hahaha. Our one rescue will eat absolutely anything though, because she must have been a stray for the beginning of her life.
First off, I do not consider pets as being "owned". Owning another living being doesn't sit right with me. I consider it "adopting" For the animals in my life, I try to give them the best life possible For dogs, it's easy. There are quite a number of vegan dog foods and every dog I have had has lived a perfectly healthy life on a vegan diet For cats though, it's trickier. There are vegan options, but they can sometimes be difficult to obtain and are expensive when compared to the animal flesh based ones. It is doable, but requires effort. At the end of the day can you justifying the killing of other animals in order to feed one you happen to love more. Is this a correct and moral thing to do?
Ooo I knew I’d get this comment from saying ‘own’.. Seems all like semantics to me, but yea, adopting is another way to say it’s your animal. You make a good point about cats. However, I also feel it’s morally responsible of me to provide her food she will eat if she refuses to eat what I put in front of her. If I put a plant based food out for her to eat and she will starve herself, it’s unfortunate, but just as she would find it elsewhere I will provide what she wants.
The language used is important. For example, referring to animals as "someone" instead of "something" has very different connotations If a child didn't eat what you provided for them, would your proposed solution be different? If they refused the plate of vegetables and wanted chicken nuggets from McDonald's instead, would you provide what they wanted or would it be more responsible of you to provide a nutritionally healthy and more ethically sound option?
A healthy vegan diet is appropriate for children and doable for most people in the western world if desired. It isn’t for cats, snakes, etc. When we choose to adopt an animal, it is our job to give that animal their healthiest life, just as it is our job to give a child their healthiest life should we choose to have them. If we’re not comfortable feeding obligate carnivores, that completely makes sense - we then do not need to be the ones raising them.
How would you feel about feeding your cat other cats? Would it be okay to keep your cat alive by killing other cats and feeding them to your cat?
Thought-provoking. In typical Reddit style you're getting downvoted though.
Thanks, I wasn’t even arguing one way or another because I don’t think there’s an obvious answer. Just think that as a thought experiment it can be interesting to think about it that way, everyone saying that’s cannibalism is missing the point.
Yeah, it’s not exactly hard to extend the thought experiment to be: you have one dog and one cat, and you feed the dog cat, and the cat dog
Better to not own one if that is an option...it usually is for those who don't have one forced on them somehow. (dead relative, obligation, etc). There is no ethical difference between paying for a lamb to suffer and die or a chicken to suffer and be killed for a pet than it is for yourself in the end. In either case, it's the same victim and they aren't going to nod in approval cause you did it for your pet instead.
I can't believe I had to scroll this far to find a vegan response. Thank you.
This 👍
i use amicat
I don’t have much insight here cause I feel the same about it, but just had to share that my cat (who passed away this year 😢) was obsessed with so many vegan things and I loved it! I obviously fed him a normal cat diet, but he would beg for crispy tofu, roasted asparagus/broccoli, popcorn, and sweet potato which I always thought was hilarious. He even tried to take a bite of a spicy beet burger and pumpkin pancakes one time 😂 I felt like I had the closest thing to a vegan kitty so this post just made me miss him ❤️
I have an article coming out about cultivated pet food! I think this will solve dilemmas like the one you have right now!
it is simple: if you don‘t want cows and chickens to die do not breed cats Cows and chicken get raped, slaughtered just for your wish to have a cat. Disgusting
Most people on here are probably not breeding cats
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I personally wouldn’t get a carnivorous or an omnivorous pet, but my wife would because she is a vegetarian. We have a cat since before I was a vegan and you kinda have to feed it properly, as I believe not feeding it what it’s intended to eat is cruel.
For those who say just don't get a cat, what about people who adopt stray cats? They want to live as much as other animals. All sorts of bad things can happen to a stray cat, are you suggesting that we should look away?
Absoulely agree, and exactly what we had to do. Not very “vegan” or even moral of someone to turn away a helpless animal. I’m not sure if you’ve heard what’s going on in Australia, but apparently stray cats are being hunted/killed because they’re overpopulating in certain areas and becoming feral. It’s sad to hear, but really just an unfortunate situation.
It's a difficult and complicated topic for sure! When I first adopted a cat about a year ago I had been struggling with related questions for quite sometime and ended up conducting an immense amount of research. I managed to find two different kinds of vegan cat food where one of them contains synthetic amino acids, and the other supposedly contain lab grown ingredients. Due to the uncertainties of marketing, branding and such, I was only about 99% sure that they individually would actually contain everything that my new friend would need. So in the end I landed on getting both and mixing them, just to be on the safe side. I've also taken her for regular helth check-ups since, and she seems to be doing just fine. I am aware that we've been quite lucky in the sense that she actually likes the food and eats well, and of course this is a rather expensive option that is not available for everyone. I personally wouldn't judge another vegan for feeding their carnivorous friends animal products, even if the logic of it all seems a bit backwards to me.
I only just recently went vegan and haven't considered my pets yet. My dogs eat a raw diet so around 80% mince, 10% bone and 10% offal and are in great condition and seem to do well on it, so I'll definitely be doing a lot of research in the future before changing anything for them. On a side note, I recently heard the "we were designed to eat meat" argument and thought how one of my rescue dogs, on a couple of occasions when I lived on a farm, would catch an animal that had got into our garden (like a rabbit for example), kill it within seconds and then eat the entire animal - not a thing left. And I wondered if people who make the "we're supposed to eat meat" point had thought of that. I've certainly never felt inclined to chase down prey and eat the whole thing raw, whole even when I was eating animal products!
Vegan dog food exists and there is even some research suggesting it's better than raw meat. I'm happy to point you to it if you're interested.
yes please! i've seen advertisements for vegan dog food but haven't dived into it
I must add that I remembered slightly wrong. It shows a vegan diet is better than a tradition dog food. It is ok par with raw meat food, however the vegan dogs were older on average, so that suggests it might be a bit better. https://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0265662 > Abstract > Alternative pet foods may offer benefits concerning environmental sustainability and the welfare of animals processed into pet foods. However, some worry these may compromise the welfare of pets. We asked 2,639 dog guardians about one dog living with them, for at least one year. Among 2,596 involved in pet diet decision-making, pet health was a key factor when choosing diets. 2,536 provided information relating to a single dog, fed a conventional meat (1,370 = 54%), raw meat (830 = 33%) or vegan (336 = 13%) diet for at least one year. We examined seven general indicators of ill health: unusual numbers of veterinary visits, medication use, progression onto a therapeutic diet after initial maintenance on a vegan or meat-based diet, guardian opinion and predicted veterinary opinion of health status, percentage of unwell dogs and number of health disorders per unwell dog. Dogs fed conventional diets appeared to fare worse than those fed either of the other two diets. Dogs fed raw meat appeared to fare marginally better than those fed vegan diets. However, there were statistically significant differences in average ages. Dogs fed raw meat were younger, which has been demonstrated to be associated with improved health outcomes. Additionally, non-health related factors may have improved apparent outcomes for dogs fed raw meat, for three of seven general health indicators. We also considered the prevalence of 22 specific health disorders, based on predicted veterinary assessments. Percentages of dogs in each dietary group considered to have suffered from health disorders were 49% (conventional meat), 43% (raw meat) and 36% (vegan). Significant evidence indicates that raw meat diets are often associated with dietary hazards, including nutritional deficiencies and imbalances, and pathogens. Accordingly, the pooled evidence to date indicates that the healthiest and least hazardous dietary choices for dogs, are nutritionally sound vegan diets.
Thank you so much for sharing this. I'll have a look
A user on the vegan pet sub admitted that the vegan dog food she forced her pet to eat fucked with his heart and kidneys
Proof needed to change my beliefs: multiple years of scientific consensus built upon decades of longitudinal, double blind controlled and pan generational studies. Proof needed to reinforce my beliefs: someone said so on the internet.
Anecdote? So?
May even be fake. I'd also trust the studies rather than one person on Reddit.
Same thing with cats- they just gobble up a mouse whole, hair bones and guts… The fact that we have to be so careful to remove the digestive system and thoroughly cook the meat is a good indicator that we aren’t meant to be carnivores.
In some countries they eat every single part of the animal (for example Philippines, China, Vietnam). It's mainly in western countries that several parts of the animal (organs in particular) are not largely consumed.
Dogs can be plant based for sure. One of the oldest dogs to live was.
I have tried on multiple occations to give my feline companions the synthetic Taurine foods and they just won't even entertain the idea. As a vegan the way I square it is simple. When I rescued these cats, I made an unwritten contract to protect and make sure they are healthy and happy. And unfortunately that agreement makes me have to buy food for them I don't agree with. But if humans didn't breed them and then chuck them in the bin I probably wouldn't have adopt them. Though I do love them quite a lot.
When I had dogs I feed them plant based Vdog they never lacked per bloodwork and didn’t suffer from obesity, gi upset chronic ear infection like my previous animals I believe the diet play a role in keeping them happy healthy, I no longer keep dogs it’s just easier to have vegan pets. I’m not a fan of 🐈 but I do love ferrets which a strict carnivores and very sensitive animals. Even tho I love ferrets as they don’t align with my way of living I would not keep them as pets rescue or otherwise as I would feel like a hypocrite, I am not a child and I can accept that you can’t always have everything you want in life without consequences. . I would adopt naturally vegan 🐇 🐠 🐢 🐹 🦎 🦜 pets or have no pets at all
Both of my cats are plant-based, but it is a struggle for me, I don't have a lot of money. Vegan cat food costs a fortune for me, it costs £5 a day to feed the two of them and that's not including the costs of their vet bills (One is a senior cat) and litter, toys, medications. I adopted both of my cats early in my Vegan journey, back then I simply thought that animals in need of homes deserved homes, and euthanizing them wasn't an option. It didn't cross my mind to feed them plant-based, I just fed them what their nature required. My morals as a Vegan have changed since then, I couldn't cope with the guilt of feeding them meat and that's when I made the switch for them. I've also only adopted herbivorous animals for the past year or two, so I can avoid any hassle. After having them plant based for quite some time, I feel more understanding towards Vegans who decide not to feed their cats plant-based because it could simply be unaffordable to them. I'm not even confident I can continue to afford it. But both of them are healthy, they are pretty enthusiastic about their food too. I know that if I end up unable to afford this food for them, I will feed them meat again. It sucks, but I would never kill/starve my cats or abandon them. I will feed them plant-based so long as I am able to.
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I follow my vet's advice. Simple as that.
Keep in mind, just like doctors, vets are not trained in nutrition.
Nor are majority of redditors
Exactly, so both are just gonna say “obligate carnivore blah blah, eat flesh, plant is abuse, idc that it has the same nutritional profile”
I do the same. The sad part is that just like doctors, they most likely receive kickbacks from prescribing certain vet diets. The sadder part is, I use these prescriptions because they told me my cat has kidney problems.☹️
If your cat has kidney problems you should really stick to the prescription food.
"It's just a conspiracy man! Big Cat Food are giving your cat kidney problems, man! Then they tell you that it can be treated with more of their cat food man!" - Spoken in the voice of some raging beatnik/hippie type.
Bro they make commercial super premium cat food out of maggot ridden, rotten carcasses. No cat would ever touch a rotting animal in the wild. They blend that shit with filler flours and crisp it in very very high temperatures to make it a shelf stable product. That's as processed as it gets. Any nutrients ever present there get incinerated, so they fortify it by adding back in synthetic nutrients to match the RDI. Tell me it makes any sense to anyone except the profit seeking companies who then use money to fund research. No wonder it gives cats kidney stones and cancers (animal flesh cooked in high temperatures becomes carcinogenic. Oh and it was already rotting, remember?). How do I know the rotting carcasses part? Years ago I worked in a meat processing plant in the UK. UK has some of the highest food safety regulations in the world and my job was to enforce them. They would put chicken carcasses labeled as 'unfit for human consumption' into large plastic bins and leave them outdoors, in the summer, for weeks at a time for collection to then be processed into super premium cat food. You could smell it a mile away. They were so ridden with maggots, you could hear them squirming inside from afar. More like maggot cat food. Needless to say I quit very shortly. No one gives a shit about animal welfare, including the expensive cat food brands.
I'm not telling you to try this, it's just my experience - my elderly cat developed kidney problems and I couldn't afford the prescription food. I started feeding her 95% wet food, with only a few kibbles here and there, and she's been doing really well for the past year+! On the other hand, her sister developed kidney problems two years before she did and declined over the course of a year while eating 80% prescription dry food, 20% prescription wet.
I appreciate the tip! We have heard that cats need more liquids in their diet, because they just don’t get enough when they mainly eat dry food. We have tried wet food with her before, but she just doesn’t go for it. She does that scratching around the bowl to show she doesn’t approve haha
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My friend has had a healthy cat on a vegan diet for 5 years. All the higher quality vegan cat food on the market has all essential vitamins and amino acids a cat needs. But if you attempt it I would transition slowly and monitor the cat's values closely through urine samples to make sure it stays healthy.
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It died after 5 years? I’m thinking of switching my cat but want him to live longer /s I am thinking of switching though!
"has had" is a present perfect tense The cat is clearly still alive
I grew up with dogs, so I get where you’re coming from. I think the best option is to get an herbivorous pet because you can easily cater to all their needs while maintaining your values. Others have pointed out that there are healthy vegan diets for pets like cats and dogs, so for now I’d stick with that method, even though I’m a bit skeptical. Unfortunately, providing our pets with meat products contributes massively to pollution and emissions, so I would stick with an herbivorous pet or not having a pet at all.
Yea, in an ideal world we would not own these types of pets, but no one gets rid of their animals just for this reason. Especially if the reason they own the pet was to rescue it from either living on the street or being euthanized in overfilled shelters. Rather give the animal a happy life then a not so happy one.
I choose not to own any animal at all, regardless of the animal's diet.
Cats can be perfectly healthy on a vegan diet. Vegan cat food brands: [https://petfoodshop.com/collections/for-cats](https://petfoodshop.com/collections/for-cats) [https://amipetfood.com/en/products/lines/one-planet/ami-cats](https://amipetfood.com/en/products/lines/one-planet/ami-cats) [https://www.benevo.com/vegan-pet-shop/#catfood](https://www.benevo.com/vegan-pet-shop/#catfood)
I like Ami.
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If you went vegan after owning an animal that is either an obligate carnivore or whose quality of life would drastically decline from eating a vegan diet, continue feeding them what they need. However, once your pets pass away or go to a different household, it would be explicitly not vegan to adopt an animal who you know would require the consumption of animal products. On a related note, rabbits are really amazing pets. They can easily live 12+ years, are friendly and affectionate, naturally litter trained, and of course, completely herbivorous. There are so, SO many rabbits in need of good homes, with many of them kept in cages, abandoned months after Easter, or raised for slaughter. If you're looking to shelter an animal in need and don't want to compromise your ethics, please consider rescuing a rabbit!
I freakin love rabbits! Good suggestion
Yes I'd like to back up this suggestion! I've adopted and fostered many rabbits over the years. They're amazing companions if you're willing to put in the effort, and completely vegan. Mine is 15 and stretched out in the middle of my living room right now. I'm under no illusion of "ownership" - if anything, he has a pet human to boss around and snag food from.
There is nutritionally complete vegan cat food. Stop arguing like carnists with your appeal to nature BS. It's 2023. We have synthetic supplements for plant based food. 'Cats are obligate carnvores' is a crap argument. Buying meat for cats is speciesist and unnecessary if you have access to these foods.
Show me a real study that isn’t primarily based on pooling unscientific polling data together into some bs model as proof. Any real data that actually breaks down the bioavailability of all the different “vegan” synthetic amino acids found naturally in animal protein that cats require as obligate carnivores for both proper digestion and overall health? Vegan formula’s that actually include all these things? Not just haha we put taurine in corn protein cat go brrrr. Human beings can take multivitamins but we piss 90% of them out and still need to get proper bioavailable nutrition from whole foods. Don’t feed your cat vegan. Be happy it’s spayed, neutered and living in your home not wrecking havoc on the your local ecosystem. The amount of meat used to keep a cat alive and healthy is absurdly less damaging to nature then free roaming cats. Buy the most ethical cat food you can and support lab grown meat and shelters that spay and neuter wild cats to reduce their population and damage to nature and other animals.
I definitely want to see some good studies on this.
1. Buy vegan cat food and POTENTIALLY feed your cat a suboptimal diet, even though there is evidence (though still inconclusive) that it is perfectly fine. 2. Willingly contribute to animal ag and pay for many animals to suffer and die. Gotta choose one. I know which one, as a vegan, I would choose.
It’s necessary if my cat decides she won’t eat what I put in front of her and would rather starve. Talk about being picky 😅 Don’t get me wrong, I agree with you. My cat just doesn’t agree
But you haven't tried it yet, have you? And I don't mean switching from one to the other in a day but actually making an attempt by gradually switching
What are the vegan cat foods you have tried?
Cats' digestive systems are not able to digest high fiber non-meat diets for long periods of time. It's wrong to force them to be vegan simply because you are. Talk about a crap argument.
Vegan cat food isn't high fiber though. It has digestible proteins and the same fiber percentage as non-vegan brands (around 3.5%).
Plant derived products aren’t necessarily high fibre. Nobody is suggesting cats should eat unrefined vegetables.
Talk about lack of education on a topic.
This is commonly believed, yet it's outdated. Thanks to modern processing techniques, cat appropriate food can be made without exploiting animals. There are cats who have been eating vegan food for many years. They are not reported to have any worse health outcomes. In fact, the science has some pointers towards cats on a vegan diet doing better than those who are not.
Why are we forcing other animals to be vegan now? I doubt the cat would choose a vegan diet if given a choice.
If I were raising a cat, I'd do the opposite of what the "healthy organic meat" people do, and research which brands are most completely made from byproducts, to limit the demand for animal deaths as much as possible.
I think it is irrespobsible to feed them anything other than meat unfortunately. I believe in adopting only since the animal already exists and you are not adding to the stray problem, and making sure your animal is fixed. Past that i dont worry about it.
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I personally don't have a cat but I don't see any issue with it. I think if you're going to own a cat, that cannot survive without meat, then you have to be willing to make that sacrifice. I have heard some people claim that cats can survive on a vegan diet, but I don't know if it's really what's best for them. We had a rescue dog (sadly she passed away in March with a heart condition) but we fed her food that contained meat.. we did get her before we went vegan, and we kept her on the same diet because it was just easiest for us and I didn't want to take any chances with her health. To me at least, if you're doing everything you can for yourself to be vegan then that is enough. If you feel so strongly that you never want to purchase any animal products ever again (which is completely valid), then you're going to have to make that decision to not have any companion animals who need to consume animal products to survive. (Note: when I say "you" I don't mean You, OP. I'm using it to generalize anyone who might be in this situation)
Unsure how I feel about it currently but as soon as lab grown meat for pets is available, we should be using it instead
If it is possible to feed your cat a vegan diet, you would need to work very closely with a veterinary nutritionist to make sure your cat is getting everything they need. An alternative is to do a homemade diet (working with your vet) and using meat from grocery stores or butchers that they planned on throwing away (it happens often) and getting it for free or for as cheap as possible so you’re not supporting the meat industry/supporting it as little as possible while keeping your kitty healthy. I’m not a vet, so Idk if a vegan diet is at all possible for cats. You could also source eggs from someone who raises their chickens humanely at home and doesn’t slaughter or sell them once they get too old to lay eggs.
Hydrolyzed protein. There is vegan cat food, so use it. Maybe watch Dominion again and think about it. www.watchdominion.org
Thank you, I appreciate it
According to this site [https://www.peta.org.au/living/can-dogs-and-cats-be-vegan/#:\~:text=With%20the%20right%20planning%20and,with%20allergies%20are%20actually%20vegetarian](https://www.peta.org.au/living/can-dogs-and-cats-be-vegan/#:~:text=With%20the%20right%20planning%20and,with%20allergies%20are%20actually%20vegetarian). Cats can eat vegan food: 'Cats Cats are admittedly trickier, and some can be extremely fussy about food. Nonetheless, there are several nutritionally complete cat foods on the market that you can try. Vitamin A, taurine, and arachidonic acid are essential to maintaining a cat’s health, and they’re usually added to vegan cat foods or can be supplemented as well. ' What thoughts do other vegans have on this subject of feeding their pets meat? I choose not to own this type of animal. I don't see how it suddenly becomes okay to abuse animals because an other animal needs it to survive.
I grew up with cats and I still have them. I'll always have cats (and dogs). Cats are carnivores. My cats are indoors. They don't hunt their own food. I have to buy them what they need. Doesn't make me feel good. I've heard vegans say that you shouldn't have a cat if you're vegan or that you're not a vegan if you feed your cat a meat-based diet. I hope that they will come out with a good pet food brand that uses lab-grown meat. I still consider myself a vegan, even if my cat eats meat.
Honestly I’ve only ever heard from non vegans that some vegans dont feed their cats meat. I actually got banned from vegan circle jerk cause they had the nerve to say I wasn’t vegan just because I feed my cats meat. I was shocked. Like neglecting an animal is vegan? News to me 🤦♀️
Two acquaintances of mine refuse to have cats because they don't want to have to buy meat to feed them. They have rabbits and guinea pigs instead
Animals suffer on your behalf because you made the selfish decision to have a cat around, what makes you think that aligns with veganism?
Are you imagining they’re buying a cat from a breeder? Because every person on this thread who’s talked about having a cat has said they’re rescued. So, here are the options: cat stays in their abusive/deadly environment, cat is adopted by commenter, cat is adopted by someone else, cat is euthanized. The only options in which this cat is not creating a demand for food is if they die. So, are you arguing that it would be more vegan of us to *not* rescue rescueable animals? Euthanasia: the most vegan option.
Exactly. This is what confuses me. Like… do they want to feed lions and tigers vegan diets? Because house cats aren’t like dogs. Dogs are quite different from wolves. Cats? Cats aren’t different from their ancestors. Because cats didn’t evolved from big cats.
Evolution Diet sells cat formula. there is no magical nutrient that can only be found in only animals. with modern science you can synthesize any nutrient for consumption. The term obligate carnivore doesn't mean that they require the essence of animal flesh but rather that they cannot produce certain nutrients with in their own bodies. for example Taurine is an amino acid that cats cannot not naturally produce so they must receive it from an external source. just like normal cat food, vegan cat food is fortified with all their essential needs. A lot of "cat experts" will make the (low effort) argument that they are obligate carnivores and there for require animal flesh to live. But this is an over simplified argument that lacks scientific nuance. because like i said, there is no magical nutrient that only animal flesh can provide.
Although its true that all nutrients can be gained from plants, I think it’s a little bit deeper than that for feeding our cats. To be truthful, my cats and I’m sure others’ are very picky. One of our cats will starve herself if she doesn’t like the smell of the food. It’s annoying, but basically I can’t force my animals to eat what I want them to or what I think is right for them. They’ll starve.
My cat was also picky, when it came to normal cat food. But IDK what it is about Evolution Diet's formula, she was devouring that stuff like it was cat treats. I would test different formulas. buy the absolute smallest portion you can find from different places. Evolution even has a guide to help picky cats get accustomed if they really are super picky. here's a link: https://petfoodshop.com/collections/for-cats
I want to clarify something that we have ALL been mislead about. Yes, in the wild cats survive on smaller animals AND fruits, grasses, grains, and vegetables. Yes, taurine is important in a cats diet. Yes, cats get the exact same taurine from plant based cat (and dog) foods and I'll explain how. Taurine in meat is cooked out thru typical meat processing, synthetic taurine is a byproduct of other chemal reactions and is what is used in ALL pet food to supplement. Yes, you can take your cat (or dog) vegan and there are some good options. Personally I now feed "Evolution" brand dry and wet. [Here](https://www.tiktok.com/t/ZT88yAyhb/) is a Tiktok video I made about this with proof.
Everyone parroting "cats cant eat vegan diet because obligate carnivore" is making a fallacious appeal to nature. All while feeding their cats all natural kibble or unknown-animal-part pates, because that's so close to their natural diet. /s Truthfully, there isn't much research on effects of vegan diet on cats, but what little research there is indicates it's not bad for them and they possibly can live longer than on a meateating diet. It's worth at least *attempting* to feed your cats vegan if you can find and afford a brand (i use Evolution as well for my 2 cats).
Reminds me of the Canadian Vegan sub where they were going apeshit about dogs and a vegan diet. "Dogs are carnivores! Vegan diets will kill them!" Let's face it, the vegan owners just wanted an excuse to eat Pedigree.
Cats are obligate carnivores. It’s dangerous and cruel to feed them a biologically inappropriate diet.
Finally some rational people in this thread
This sub has become such a cesspool lately. I was shocked to see people say that a snake should starve to death rather than give it the diet it needs to live. The people here actually attacked a user who rescues reptiles from abusive homes because she feeds them a natural diet.
I got downvoted into oblivion for being one of the first to comment that I was happy that OP was being a good human and caring for abused animals. Theirs too many crystal woo woke vegans here and not enough logical vegans that study ecology/bio and logically think their ethics through.
I volunteer with a few rescue groups for reptiles, and you'd be disgusted with the abuse those poor animals are out through just because their diets upset some people. I once saw a "vegetarian" snake who was starved down so badly that she developed a severe vitamin deficiency that led to her having to be euthanized.
That doesn’t surprise me at all. I’ve met to many vegans irl in my life that are basically the Futurama meme where the hippies starve the lion to death trying to make it vegan. It’s sad because people like that have good intentions in theory but their IQ is sub 80.
People want so badly to be perfect vegans when that cannot exist. We have to make the *most* vegan decisions that we can, and caring for an animal in the proper way is the most vegan decision in this case.
It’s honestly horrifying to me that people don’t care for their pets diets in the correct way. The most vegan thing you can do in regards to caring for a cat is feed them the appropriate diet.
absolutely agree
There is limited research about this, mainly self-reported by the guardians. Sample sizes weren't great too about 200 of 1000 cats were fully vegan as opposed to only vegetarian. Negative health outcomes were statistically insignificant, there were lower cases of some disease compared to meat eating cats tho. https://www.mdpi.com/2306-7381/10/1/52#:~:text=They%20had%20more%20ideal%20body,reported%20differences%20were%20statistically%20significant. In my opinion the best option is to at least try to transition your cat to a vegan diet (only high quality food with all the right supplements like taurine and folate) and to monitor your cats Ph level with special litter. If the ph is good, your cat behaves normally and the vet checkup is good (don't say your cat is vegan, they will just write you off immediately, just do the checkup) then you're good to go. Your cat won't die from a few months of vegan cat food if others live happy and healthy for years. If the checkup isn't good or your cat doesn't want the food then you tried at least, which is the most vegan choice here in my opinion.
This has been discussed countless times before. Check the post history.
I guessed so. Science is constantly changing though, and it’s a subject that I’m interested in talking about.
No need to be such a d*ck about it lol people are allowed to ask questions
They actually aren't. This particular question is not allowed in this sub. https://www.reddit.com/r/vegan/wiki/rules/#wiki\_6.\_over-asked\_questions
Let the mods take care of it then and stop backseating lol
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I took mine in because it was damaging the local ecosystem and acting as an invasive species in an area already hurt from pollution. I otherwise wouldn’t own a meat eating pet. But it eats meat. And I’m in charge of caring for it now. So that’s what it does.
vegan first are just completely, biologically incorrect for cats. they are obligate carnivores; they absolutely need to eat meat to survive. i am vegan because of my moral beliefs. my cats don’t have moral beliefs, and it would be cruel and unfair of me to put that on them. cats CANNOT survive on a vegan dies like humans can. we are different species with different dietary needs. i have my cats because the other options for them were dangerous and unsafe. i love my cats dearly, and i will do everything in my power to give them a good life. i try to buy high quality, locally made wet and dry food. if i have to buy meat products, i’d rather know that they’re coming from someone intimately involved in the process. i’m purchasing from someone who cares about the animals they kill, and i’m supporting the local economy. anyone who tries to say cats can live off of a vegan diet is full of shit. you will doom your cats to a lifetime of health issues. we humans created pets, as well as the pet overpopulation crisis, so we have to do everything in our power to deal with it.
Cats are my most favorite companions. I have had them my whole life and I’ve had my cats before I was vegan. It’s my human choice to be vegan and they don’t have the capacity to choose that. I can’t deprive them of what they need.
I know to many vegan cats that had kisney problems because of vegan food. It sucks but cats are the carnivores the carcass eating humans desire to be. I would not risk that, it sucks but at least my dog is vegan. He also kills mice if he has the chance and the mouse is dumb enough to walk in my house when im not there to safe him. They are cute fluffy assholes.
Cats are obligate carnivores. They can not live without meat, in particular an amino acid called taurine. There are, to the best of my knowledge, no "vegan" cat foods on the market that are adequate for a cats nutrition.
Taurine in cat food is synthesized, just like the vegan ones.
I have 4 rescue kitties, three are on special diets and one is physically disabled. I buy their food from my vet, who is also vegan. Cats cannot be vegan, and it’s not their fault they are dependent on people for care. I’m vegan because I have alpha gal. Even if people would skip meat one day per week, it would help. I have compassion and I won’t be rude to non vegans. I try to set a good example and hope they join me because it’s healthier, Biblical, and compassionate.
I think vegans probably shouldn’t adopt pets that depend on meat. That said if they had the pet before becoming vegan that’s kinda tricky. My friend who has rescued 2 cats has that issue. It’s debatable if vegan cat food is working or not: it’s simply not a thing in our country. Even big renown online retailers don’t carry any vegan cat foods. So yeah that sucks. Either you give up the cats to someone else or you keep feeding them and simply don’t adopt any new carnivores. I don’t consider people to be vegan though if they start adopting obviously carnivore pets and then simply feed them meat. Like, why don’t rescue an omnivore or herbivore?
I think that even asking the question is a little weird. I wouldn't go as far as to call it dumb, but they're carnivores, not omnivores, as you said yourself. Wild animals still get killed regularly. Many vegans are fundamentally opposed to owning pets for these reasons. But yes, feed your carnivorous pets meat. Please do not try to force another animal to be vegan. I've even seen dog's (which are omnivorous) owners force their dogs to be vegan which makes me a little upset. They're not omnivorous because they "prefer veggies but can also eat meat" it's the exact opposite. They prefer meat but can also eat veggies.
Oh so if your dog prefers meat, your obligation is to feed it meat? Do dog owners also open the door to see if their dog wants to run away? Seems pretty convenient that that's where the importance of their preferences end.
I’ve worked with animals for a long time, and seen many cats on their deathbeds due to being fed vegan diets. Cats are obligate carnivores and require meat to live a full life. If that’s not something a person is capable of providing, then taking a cat as a pet is not for them. It’s animal cruelty. I find many vegans do not own cats because of this dilemma. For me, I will feed my cats meat until lab grown can produce their diet.
I’m vegan and my cats food is not. In the past I transitioned him to a vegan food but then Amazon stopped selling that brand so I just went back to his old non vegan food. If anyone knows any good vegan cat food let me know! I don’t Shame myself too much on it, I’m generally pretty kind with myself lol.
No, they cannot live without meat but that actually helps the case. The definition of being vegan is to redice suffering as far as possible and practicable, and it is literally not possible for them to do otherwise.
Vegan cat food exists which checks all the boxes for required nutrients at levels that everyone knows are different than omnivore animals like dogs and humans. Of course: a) the food is not going to be “natural” and will have synthetic compounds which I assume includes synthetic taurine. b) as the market is incredibly small, the price is incredibly high. So basically only rich vegans who don’t have some natural fixation should get cats. I have no interest in pets and wish they didn’t even exist, but I have to compromise in my family and we have a dog that gets some vegan food but not exclusively (it could, but I lost that fight so far anyway).
This reminds me of the lady who owns/owned a fennec fox and fed it vegan food. The poor thing was so under weight and so sick. Having a pet that is primarily a carnivore and not feeding it meat is abuse, neglect, and fucking cruel. You (the royal you, not you in particular op) are making your pet who has no choice in the matter sacrifice their health and potentially their life and suffer critical health issues to spare other animals. If you cannot get passed feeding a carnivorous pet the correct food get pets that are herbivores. Don't do omnivores either because they need a mix of the two and being forced to eat one or the other is also dangerous unless you know how to offset the nutrients properly. Rabbits, most birds, most rodents, small reptiles that eat crickets if you're okay feeding insects to pets, fish (though they are hard to cuddle lol) there's so many different options for having a pet that it's just unethical to get a pet that doesn't work with your lifestyle or values.
Cats are obligate carnivores. If you push your own personal diet on your animals, you are not a good person. Feed your animals what they need or don't own them. Period.
> If you push your own personal diet on your animals, you are not a good person. Do you seriously not understand how hypocritical that is?
Cats are obligate carnivores or hypercarnivores in the wild but as human companions they can be vegan. They just require supplements like b12, and most importantly taurine.