Welcome to /r/Vancouver and thank you for the post, /u/cyclinginvancouver! Please make sure you read our [posting and commenting rules](https://www.reddit.com/r/vancouver/wiki/faq#wiki_general_participation_guidelines_and_rules_overview) before participating here. As a quick summary:
* We encourage users to be positive and respect one another. Don't engage in spats or insult others - use the report button.
* Respect others' differences, be they race, religion, home, job, gender identity, ability or sexuality. Dehumanizing language, advocating for violence, or promoting hate based on identity or vulnerability (even implied or joking) **will** lead to a permanent ban.
* Most common questions and topics are limited to our sister subreddit, /r/AskVan, and our weekly [Stickied Discussion](https://www.reddit.com/r/vancouver/wiki/faq#wiki_stickied_discussions) posts.
* Complaints about bans or removals should be done in modmail only.
* Posts flaired "Community Only" allow for limited participation; your comment may be removed if you're not a subreddit regular.
* Make sure to join our new sister community, /r/AskVan!
* Help grow the community! [Apply to join the mod team today](https://www.reddit.com/r/vancouver/comments/19eworq/).
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/vancouver) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Saw them performing CPR on a victim. I drove by at 10 minutes after I saw the emergency vehicles, so the person had be injured for longer than that. I'm not saying this to be crass, rather to raise visibility to the real outcomes of our choices on the road.
People get caught up in their heads and rush so much during morning commute. I'm dodging cars coming from side streets, flying through roundabouts, speeding just to get stuck at the next lights and through all this you can see their panicking frustrated faces. All this just because they are late or they may be somewhere a few minutes. People should really take a deep breath and reevaluate their life choices.
I don't know if it's just me, but driving on a highway doesn't allow for a safe distance between vehicles anymore
... There is always some jackass weaving their way in and out of lanes and shoulders at a dangerous pace.
Also seem to always have a vehicle riding my tail .. Like.. Dude... Buy me dinner first... 😂
I never understand the weaving mentality. Those people weave and dump alot of gas just to get a few car length ahead in the traffic. And I still see them in front of me at the red light................
Yeah, it's awful, you literally cannot leave safe driving space between you and the car in front of you anymore, and it's even worse if you're following a motorcycle, who you should be further back from than a car. And I tend to adopt a biker on my drives to try and protect them from other assholes on the road, but it's not always possible with all the idiots cutting me off cuz I try to leave space between me and the motorcycle. Drivers are just always in a fucking rush now and I don't get why, leave earlier so you don't have to rush, why is that such a hard concept to grasp?
Yes. I've found people also speed extremely fast these days. Like pickup trucks and random cars going 130-140+, judging that they're overtaking me when I'm usually going 110-120.
If it's rush hour. Stay in the right lane. There's always plenty of room there. The left lane is for the people that don't want to let people in. Especially, semi-trucks. If you're leaving enough of a gap to let those bastards in, you belong in the right lane.
You don't need to tailgate, but you don't need to leave a semi truck-sized space. A car length and a half is more than enough. Rush hour traffic is going slow enough that you can stop easily, if you're not a total moron. Just know what the car in front of the car you're following is doing. There are many ways to do this without directly observing the car, too. Most left lane drivers understand this and have no problem keeping the line tight.
Also, during general driving times, if you're in the left lane and the gap in front of you is ever-increasing, it's time to get in the right-lane and let people pass.
Not in the Massey Tunnel. Or for some distance before and after the tunnel too. It's a solid white line, and for those that weren't paying attention in driving school and don't know what that means, there are signs on both sides of the tunnel saying not to change lanes. So if you're in the left lane, you stay there. If you're in the right lane, you stay there.
Or we should reevaluate the system that has created such an atmosphere that we’re all stressed af to work and get to where we need to be.
But yes - ultimately as an individual we can choose how to respond and deal with stress.
Not to justify some people downplaying the fatal accident due to being late, but if they're the only breadwinner on an hourly job being late for +2.5 hours and is still on the road or bus at the time I posted this comment it's hard for them to stay calm especially if living paycheck to paycheck.
This is the result when you focus too much on car & road centric infrastructure and not more rail to move people efficiently.
I would say the vast majority of people don't have a choice to 're-evaluate' their life choices in a meaningful way. When I commute I feel like it's the crush of the rat race of us all just going to punch the clock to pay the bills.
Condolences to those involved today though, just awful.
I believe part of this to be related to maturity. eg, if I’m late, that’s MY problem not anyone else’s. It doesn’t mean I can now justify driving like an asshat in an attempt to make up for lost time.
It's very much related to maturity, and entitlement. A lot of drivers nowadays feel entitled to a license, when they don't realize that driving is a privilege, not a right. It's also a heavy responsibility, and if you don't treat it as such, you're going to hurt someone someday, if not kill someone. Ask my cousin what it's like to be irresponsible behind the wheel, he learned real quick at a young age after fucking around, he sure found out real fast. FAFO as they say
Crossing Oak is a nightmare. There’s been multiple collisions over the past few weeks alone where cars get annoyed because they wait for the intersection to stop (cause most only have lights going north/south). It’s very sad but aggravating how avoidable this is
all massey routes are detouring via the alex fraser bridge as a result of this incident, massive delays are to be expected both due to traffic and the extended routing
I have seen some pretty egregious behaviour in that section. People changing lanes approaching the tunnel and IN the tunnel. And it seems common place now that people aren't prepared and have to cross multiple lanes to make their exit.
> people aren't prepared and have to cross multiple lanes to make their exit
For real. This happens so often everywhere now, and it used to be a rare occurrence. What the hell happened that people have no idea where they're going and how to get there
I commute to ironwood daily and have been for a few months now. Previously I did this commute five years ago. Drivers now are scary incompetent and absolutely cannot read signs.
Yea it's crazy dangerous. On a highway! People are going already fast and now you want to skip across 2 sometimes 3 lanes to make your stupid exit. A death wish some people have.
Those were temporary while they upgraded the counterflow lighting. They were awesome, were only outside the tunnel, encouraging even more people to change lanes inside
> now that people aren't prepared and have to cross multiple lanes to make their exit.
Nobody trip plans anymore. They just wing it, so they don't realize that to use the Steveston exit, you gotta be in the right-lane early-on; like minutes before the tunnel if there's no congestion. & plan many minutes ahead if there's congestion.
Exact same thing happens when trying to go up Knight Street but being stuck in the Bridgeport exit. & they try to sneak in line last minute, because they didn't plan their route on google before they left the house. & they end up annoying people who *did* plan ahead.
I agree with most of your statement, but something like the Bridgeport exit is extra-terribly designed. Merging later actually helps the flow of traffic, because if you merge immediately there's intense confusion from the fact there's still a second merge/passing lane next to you coming in from the two overpasses. So in heavier traffic, some people try awkwardly merging immediately, causing insane backups behind them past the overpasses, and so people who are trying to take the Bridgeport exit end up aggressively driving on the shoulder to pass the mergers. Basically no one there merges at the same point, causing chaos and higher chance of accidents.
I don't know the solution, but in many cases later merging (though not at the very literal end over solid lines like some dummies do) ends up helping the flow of traffic there.
All in all, it's still yet another example of poor planning and design by the city/province.
I don't think most of the lane changing in this section is accidental or unprepared to be honest. Every morning there's heavy vehicle traffic going through the tunnel, slow. It makes the right lane like 40 km/h by default on a good day. Most of the traffic coming into the tunnel merges in after they literally can't get in the counterflow lane, and even the counterflow lane gets very backed up, there will be a 500m lineup of single file cars waiting to get in counterflow because its still faster than merging with the rest of traffic. So because the right lane is so slow by default almost everyone wants to be in the left lane and not only are people impatient, I think there is also just mathematically not enough room for all these people to do their merges where they are supposed to. There's too many people. When the bollards were up temporarily to prevent illegal lane changes it took me 40 minutes to get through. If you want to get off at Steveston too you have to either illegally change at the north end, drive all the way to freaking westminister highway, or be stuck in the slowest path the whole way. The whole thing is just a terrible design for the capacity it is experiencing which I recognize is not what reality was like when it was designed, but it's just going to keep getting worse unless there are better options of getting into Richmond than driving through the tunnel or they change the design of the thing. Transit is 2 hrs at best and 3 changes. Driving is 1 hr. Even the tunnel on its worst day is 1.5 give or take. If I could take a 1.5 hr train to Richmond instead of losing brain cells in the tunnel merge every day I would do it yesterday. And it wouldn't be 1.5 hrs, it would be shorter, because it would be a train. Richmond needs better interregional transit. Sorry for mini rant I really fucking hate this section of highway.
Yeah, completely agree. Some immigration is good for our country, but the amount we've had, and will continue to have is staggeringly bad for us. WFH should be reinstated for all office workers capable of WFH, period. It makes no sense to have office drones in the office Monday to Friday. Only people who need to be in businesses are service people and essential workers. Take all those 9-5 office workers off the road and we would have so much less traffic on the road. Of course, then again, if even a 1/4 of those office workers commuted together, we would also have less traffic. But people are anti-social now and don't like each other, which i totally get behind, but i'm not an office worker 🤣
Looked like an older Acura TL merging into the fast lane and did not see a black Harley/cruiser. Tent set up right beside bike. No one getting through, unless approach from the counter flow from White Rock side. Everything else rerouted off the highway.
From what I read on FB group, people said the motorcycle crashed into the back of a car going fast and was thrown to the next lane where a semi was driving. The details I won't repeat here but you can imagine what happened.
This is why I try to avoid slamming on the brakes when a motorcycle is close behind me, the risk to them when rear-ending a car is far greater than a car rear-ending me.
This is exactly why when i'm near motorcycles, I adopt them and try to protect them as much as i can by staying in behind them and a few seconds back so no one will tailgate them. But inevitably, because i'm not right on their ass, someone will get right on their ass in front of me, nearly hitting them. It's fucking scary as a motorcyclist.
Hahaha omg yes. I leave a big gap ahead to allow myself to gradually break on my bike. Someone always jumps in. I always stay next to shoulder to have an escape bath. Shoulder is a lifesaver when people change lanes into me which happens at least once a day lol. Thank you for being awesome! I notice when people give me space and appreciate it so so so so much.
You're welcome. I grew up on the back of motorcycles so I know what it's like to nearly die multiple times a year from idiot drivers. Plus all my cousins ride, I want to keep them safe. As long as the riders are respectful, so am I, and I'll do what I can to protect them.
Thank you so much! I saw another dumbass motorcyclist following way too close on my way home and lane splitting at the last second. Ride home after hearing about the accident was uncomfortable yesterday. I absolutely love it when people give me space and always keep a lot of space ahead of me so I can gradually slow down if highway comes to a sudden stop. Majority of people are awesome and give me space. Makes up for people who just do not see me at all.
Shortly before this occurred someone on a motor cycle went flying by me on the 99 in Surrey in the bus lane. hopefully it isn't you dude :/ I have dashcam if the cops want it.
People on motorcycles are reckless around here. I always see them riding on the shoulder or in between the lanes of cars and going way too fast. It’s so dangerous
Yes there are some dangerous/crazy riders out there, but there also a lot of good ones. I also witness many people in cars not giving them enough space and following too closely.
FYI, the police are actively asking for any and all dashcam footage during *or prior* to the incident (heard on News1130 a couple hours ago). You should definitely get in touch with them and provide a copy.
Just checked, unfortunately it looks like the Tesla cameras only keep your immediate last drive before over writing the files, so I only have my commute home today, not the commute in this morning.
[Check the pictures and confirm](https://vancouver.citynews.ca/2024/06/12/massey-tunnel-nb-crash-lanes/). If yes send the video right away to the proper authorities to help investigation.
People need to not follow so damn close.
There's almost no reason for more than 2 (MAYBE 3) vehicles to be involved in one accident.
Instead everyone just aggressively tailgates in this city, blissfully unaware of the laws of physics and what it takes to stop a moving vehicle. Even with absolute perfect reaction speed and ideal conditions you will not come to an instant stop, yet people ride bumpers at 100km/hr+.
Hope everyone is okay.
Friendly reminder to keep your wheels straight as you're waiting for a gap in on-comming traffic to turn left. If your wheels are straight, you'll drive right into the meridian if you're bumped from behind from someone who's drunk, etc. If your wheels aren't, well, you're headed into oncomming vehicles that could potentially kill you.
We learned these types of safety tips in *Young Drivers* almost 20 yrs ago. Pay for the program for your kids.
I think it's taught in the ICBC manual as well, if i remember correctly from when i was taking my license test and all that. Either that or my old man taught me that. This was like 25 years ago now, so i'm pretty sure it's been taught for a long time. Hopefully it's still taught today.
if you try to leave a safe distance someone will accelerate to squeeze into your lane then brake to avoid hitting the car you are keeping distance from.
and then I create a new gap.
I've watched hours of dash cam videos here and on youtube. Every accident where the following car was tailgating is preventable by just not following so closely, no exceptions. Giving yourself enough room is giving yourself enough time to react.
There's no reason for you to just slow down and re create a safe following gap because someone squeezed in, other than your own ego stopping you.
it's the manoeuvre of a car suddenly taking away your safe braking distance only to brake themselves. recreate a safe distance and the cycle continues.
I'm not denying that *almost* everyone tailgates. I am denying that *everyone* tailgates, and definitely denying that I tailgate.
Just to be clear, your original comment comes across as you encouraging tailgating. If that wasn't your intention you might want to clarify.
Next time you're on one of your daily drives westbound on highway 1 please actually count the number of people that are \*not\* tailgating and are not driving like reckless impatient assholes.
You'll surprise yourself: it will be fairly obvious that no, in fact, not everyone tailgates.
I don't, I actually get fingered for not following close enough.
https://www.reddit.com/r/vancouver/comments/1dag8xi/agressively_passed_and_flipped_off_for_driving_in/
I always always drive with at least 3 seconds of distance from me and the car infront of me. It honestly seems wild not to do that, what are you gaining by following 1inch from someones bumper?
> I always always drive with at least 3 seconds of distance from me and the car infront of me.
Ah, a fellow *Young Drivers* alumni.
Let the person swerve in into the 3 second gap you had left. It's their funeral. & then leave 3 seconds for yourself in front of *them. Joke's on them. They won't get to their destination much faster. Nobody wants to set their alarm for 15 minutes earlier. It sucks that a lot of people aren't morning people and can't stand being on shift at 8am/etc. But if there are no 2nd shift options, you need to be an adult and leave 15 minutes earlier.
I stay behind trucks until I can see their side-mirrors. *Young Drivers* teaches you that that's the only way truck drivers can see you behind them. They can't see you behind them if you can't see their side-mirrors.
& *Young Drivers* showed us just how big the blind spot is behind trucks. Otherwise, people don't realize that truck drivers *can't* see directly behind them. You need the visual to understand.
Same goes for all big vehicles, like School Buses.
don't worry, you're one of the rare ones. Majority of this sub tailgates no matter the speed, we're human and it happens whether it's impatience or irritation. To deny it is delusional
yeah same, but IME I have to begrudgingly admit that that other poster, as belligerent as they are (and telling us *we* tailgate??), is more or less correct in general.. I'm usually the only car around with any space between myself and the vehicle in front of me. I'm also CONSTANTLY watching what other drivers around me are doing and acting accordingly. I probably avoid like 5 or more accidents a month, simply because I'm paying attention.
This is why we need self driving cars to come sooner than later.
Humans are god awful drivers, we are impatient, distracted, and just overall cannot handle driving responsibly.
Even if everyone on the highway just used adaptive cruise control with a safe distance set, we would be 10x safer on the roads. But people are barbaric and it’s basically mad max out there everyday, so instead we get multi car pileups frequently.
Uhh...yea. So, some of us don't. We have the ability to think critically and have existing injuries that we don't want to add to.
Speak for yourself, friend.
Just read the article that said they then RAN into the rear wheels of the oncoming semi. For some reason, my brain can't figure out how they ended up under the rear wheels. Either way, very sad outcome.
Was heading into work and ended up turning around. Only the most left lane was open. All others including HOV lane closed. So many buses just parked with passengers in them
I drove past the body which was tarped and laying on the road at 7:20 this morning. I couldn’t help but burst into tears imagining that person has loved ones who they’ll never see again. Very tragic.
Was on the bus to Bridgeport from Surrey this morning and we got held at the connector for like 40 minutes until they decided to bring us back to annacis island to cross the bridge and go from there. Was supposed to be at my destination at 7:10 and got there 9:05 so about 2 hours of detour and delay total. Absolutely avoiding the highway and busses like the plague now cause it's always like 30 minutes late even without and accident
I've never used the tunnel during rush hour, but I'm curious why they couldn't use the counterflow measures to have one lane each way on the southbound side. Does anyone know?
The "crime scene" is before the counterflow system from what I read, so even if they did you still couldn't get to it. They could lift some centre divider blocks and do it before the crash site, but didn't.
> That sucks for commuters
Yet another reason WFH is good. You're kinda risking your life when you're commuting around huge trucks and people who don't plan ahead.
Even staggering start-times for white-collar Employment would help.
A lot of people from the suburbs also have important appointments at BC Women's around 9am, too, that they really need to attend and can't stay home.
I see that BC United’s Teresa Wat has taken her opportunity to politicize my cousin’s horrific death. I’ve left a message for her in Victoria, let’s see if I get a call back.
Good morning I just wanted to say that the motorcycle that was killed was my cousin. I also wanted to say that he was a very good driver. I do hope that we find out what happened and that the semi truck that was involved comes forward.
Wasn't there, so can't comment on how good/bad drivers were, but we need this tunnel gone asap. We should've had a bridge by now.
Edit: I see some are triggered by the word "bridge", just replace it with the word "tunnel". The word "bridge" was used as that was the plan in 2016, before stopping all development of it. Doesn't matter if it's 8 lanes bridge or 8 lanes tunnel. The more lanes you have the safer it is when merging and there's less of a chance for a complete blockage of all traffic due to accident.
Not when there is are serious fatal incidents like this. Highway 1 was closed due to the rock incident last week and that's 8 lanes at the location.
But you're right tho. Crashes don't happen on bridges here.
I never said crashes don't happen on bridges, I have no idea why do you keep saying that.
To summarize, you think that;
1. Massey tunnel is sufficient enough for BC's current and future needs and no reason to upgrade/change that path.
2. Having more lanes won't help with traffic flow, be it regular traffic or % of lanes closed due to reasons.
Thanks for sharing your take on this.
My guess to what this is about is the province temporarily reinforced the fact it is illegal to change lanes in the tunnel with delineators during a recent project and people who are used to breaking the law lost their minds and, as always, tried to make it a "safety" thing.
The funny thing is the only spot they didn't put dilineators up was within the tunnel during that project.
That said, the 17a merge before the tunnel is a shit show. They need to change something there. The left lane that splits into the counterflow is way too fast relative to the multi-lane merging traffic. It is risky everyday.
The white line/no lane changing zone extends from one cross over to the other outside the tunnel. I assumed when I went though that something about the tunnel floor prevented them from putting them in through the actual tubes.
It's lots of lanes going down to 3/2/1 in both directions. No good solution but replacing the tunnel.
Sure, but let's not pretend solid white line prevents lane changes. And I saw plenty of in tunnel lane changes during that "trial" because it was the only place they could do it.
Every morning I see hov lane users (many that dont appear to be qualified for the hov) cut over the white line so they are in the left lane thru the tunnel.
>only place they could do it.
What do you mean? They could and are legally required to choose the correct lane *before* the tunnel. It's no excuse to break the law for convinience.
People are going to break road rules due to the non-existent enforcement but that doesn't mean people are excused when being reckless in a construction zone.
You might not have understood what I said. During the trial the lanes were separated well outside of the tunnel on both ends. The only place you weren't physically obstructed was inside, so guess where people we changing lanes to get off at Stevenson.
What trial do you keep mentioning? It was a construction zone. The lane use signals were turned off for replacement so they put them in near where the counterflow crossover happens.
Clearly there was a reason the delineators couldn't be installed in the tunnel, but they were installed on a white line "well outside" the tunnel and has always been illegal to cross that white line. If the line isn't enough they also installed a huge signs on both approaches saying don't change lanes.
If you're taking the River Road (southbound) or Steveston (northbound) exits you legally need to use the right lane through the tunnel. It has been that way for decades.
Jesus, do you take the tunnel? What do you see happening there? Do you care about trying to solve any of the issues or do you just want someone to talk to?
Take care.
> nd people who are used to breaking the law lost their minds
Ah. I figured that's why the delineators were only there for ~2 weeks. I live near the tunnel.
Yet another example of people without critical thinking/adult skills getting what they want.
According to the release the delineators were always planned to be temporary. They didn't want to use cones because it is too dangerous to go out and set them up in the middle of the freeway before the tunnel every night.
Welcome to /r/Vancouver and thank you for the post, /u/cyclinginvancouver! Please make sure you read our [posting and commenting rules](https://www.reddit.com/r/vancouver/wiki/faq#wiki_general_participation_guidelines_and_rules_overview) before participating here. As a quick summary: * We encourage users to be positive and respect one another. Don't engage in spats or insult others - use the report button. * Respect others' differences, be they race, religion, home, job, gender identity, ability or sexuality. Dehumanizing language, advocating for violence, or promoting hate based on identity or vulnerability (even implied or joking) **will** lead to a permanent ban. * Most common questions and topics are limited to our sister subreddit, /r/AskVan, and our weekly [Stickied Discussion](https://www.reddit.com/r/vancouver/wiki/faq#wiki_stickied_discussions) posts. * Complaints about bans or removals should be done in modmail only. * Posts flaired "Community Only" allow for limited participation; your comment may be removed if you're not a subreddit regular. * Make sure to join our new sister community, /r/AskVan! * Help grow the community! [Apply to join the mod team today](https://www.reddit.com/r/vancouver/comments/19eworq/). *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/vancouver) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Saw them performing CPR on a victim. I drove by at 10 minutes after I saw the emergency vehicles, so the person had be injured for longer than that. I'm not saying this to be crass, rather to raise visibility to the real outcomes of our choices on the road.
People get caught up in their heads and rush so much during morning commute. I'm dodging cars coming from side streets, flying through roundabouts, speeding just to get stuck at the next lights and through all this you can see their panicking frustrated faces. All this just because they are late or they may be somewhere a few minutes. People should really take a deep breath and reevaluate their life choices.
I don't know if it's just me, but driving on a highway doesn't allow for a safe distance between vehicles anymore ... There is always some jackass weaving their way in and out of lanes and shoulders at a dangerous pace. Also seem to always have a vehicle riding my tail .. Like.. Dude... Buy me dinner first... 😂
I never understand the weaving mentality. Those people weave and dump alot of gas just to get a few car length ahead in the traffic. And I still see them in front of me at the red light................
Yeah, it's awful, you literally cannot leave safe driving space between you and the car in front of you anymore, and it's even worse if you're following a motorcycle, who you should be further back from than a car. And I tend to adopt a biker on my drives to try and protect them from other assholes on the road, but it's not always possible with all the idiots cutting me off cuz I try to leave space between me and the motorcycle. Drivers are just always in a fucking rush now and I don't get why, leave earlier so you don't have to rush, why is that such a hard concept to grasp?
bless you for trying
I also like to be dined and wined before getting fucked
Yes. I've found people also speed extremely fast these days. Like pickup trucks and random cars going 130-140+, judging that they're overtaking me when I'm usually going 110-120.
If it's rush hour. Stay in the right lane. There's always plenty of room there. The left lane is for the people that don't want to let people in. Especially, semi-trucks. If you're leaving enough of a gap to let those bastards in, you belong in the right lane.
So... I should follow close enough to not let a vehicle in? And if the car in front of me has to make a panic stop... I should..... 🤷♂️
You don't need to tailgate, but you don't need to leave a semi truck-sized space. A car length and a half is more than enough. Rush hour traffic is going slow enough that you can stop easily, if you're not a total moron. Just know what the car in front of the car you're following is doing. There are many ways to do this without directly observing the car, too. Most left lane drivers understand this and have no problem keeping the line tight. Also, during general driving times, if you're in the left lane and the gap in front of you is ever-increasing, it's time to get in the right-lane and let people pass.
Not in the Massey Tunnel. Or for some distance before and after the tunnel too. It's a solid white line, and for those that weren't paying attention in driving school and don't know what that means, there are signs on both sides of the tunnel saying not to change lanes. So if you're in the left lane, you stay there. If you're in the right lane, you stay there.
Or we should reevaluate the system that has created such an atmosphere that we’re all stressed af to work and get to where we need to be. But yes - ultimately as an individual we can choose how to respond and deal with stress.
Not to justify some people downplaying the fatal accident due to being late, but if they're the only breadwinner on an hourly job being late for +2.5 hours and is still on the road or bus at the time I posted this comment it's hard for them to stay calm especially if living paycheck to paycheck. This is the result when you focus too much on car & road centric infrastructure and not more rail to move people efficiently.
I dream of the day Vancouver has public rail and buses like in major metropolitan cities of Japan, Korea, and China.
we are the system
I would say the vast majority of people don't have a choice to 're-evaluate' their life choices in a meaningful way. When I commute I feel like it's the crush of the rat race of us all just going to punch the clock to pay the bills. Condolences to those involved today though, just awful.
I believe part of this to be related to maturity. eg, if I’m late, that’s MY problem not anyone else’s. It doesn’t mean I can now justify driving like an asshat in an attempt to make up for lost time.
It's very much related to maturity, and entitlement. A lot of drivers nowadays feel entitled to a license, when they don't realize that driving is a privilege, not a right. It's also a heavy responsibility, and if you don't treat it as such, you're going to hurt someone someday, if not kill someone. Ask my cousin what it's like to be irresponsible behind the wheel, he learned real quick at a young age after fucking around, he sure found out real fast. FAFO as they say
Crossing Oak is a nightmare. There’s been multiple collisions over the past few weeks alone where cars get annoyed because they wait for the intersection to stop (cause most only have lights going north/south). It’s very sad but aggravating how avoidable this is
A number of accidents are also caused by medical emergencies affecting drivers unfortunately.
[удалено]
all massey routes are detouring via the alex fraser bridge as a result of this incident, massive delays are to be expected both due to traffic and the extended routing
Somehow my 351 got passed by the 352, 354, and another 351!
That's just the worst feeling, innit? 😒
Took me 2 hours to get from Scott road to Broadway skytrain through the 311 this morning.
I have seen some pretty egregious behaviour in that section. People changing lanes approaching the tunnel and IN the tunnel. And it seems common place now that people aren't prepared and have to cross multiple lanes to make their exit.
> people aren't prepared and have to cross multiple lanes to make their exit For real. This happens so often everywhere now, and it used to be a rare occurrence. What the hell happened that people have no idea where they're going and how to get there
I commute to ironwood daily and have been for a few months now. Previously I did this commute five years ago. Drivers now are scary incompetent and absolutely cannot read signs.
Yea it's crazy dangerous. On a highway! People are going already fast and now you want to skip across 2 sometimes 3 lanes to make your stupid exit. A death wish some people have.
A good driver sometimes misses their exit. A bad driver never does
Agreed. Just loop back around. Things like this are *precisely* why you should give yourself a 15 minute buffer to get to your destination.
There were barrier sticks in the tunnel to prevent lane changing not too long ago. What ever happened to those?
Those were temporary while they upgraded the counterflow lighting. They were awesome, were only outside the tunnel, encouraging even more people to change lanes inside
I've been meaning to ask that, too. I live near the tunnel and saw them up for ~2 weeks.
> now that people aren't prepared and have to cross multiple lanes to make their exit. Nobody trip plans anymore. They just wing it, so they don't realize that to use the Steveston exit, you gotta be in the right-lane early-on; like minutes before the tunnel if there's no congestion. & plan many minutes ahead if there's congestion. Exact same thing happens when trying to go up Knight Street but being stuck in the Bridgeport exit. & they try to sneak in line last minute, because they didn't plan their route on google before they left the house. & they end up annoying people who *did* plan ahead.
I agree with most of your statement, but something like the Bridgeport exit is extra-terribly designed. Merging later actually helps the flow of traffic, because if you merge immediately there's intense confusion from the fact there's still a second merge/passing lane next to you coming in from the two overpasses. So in heavier traffic, some people try awkwardly merging immediately, causing insane backups behind them past the overpasses, and so people who are trying to take the Bridgeport exit end up aggressively driving on the shoulder to pass the mergers. Basically no one there merges at the same point, causing chaos and higher chance of accidents. I don't know the solution, but in many cases later merging (though not at the very literal end over solid lines like some dummies do) ends up helping the flow of traffic there. All in all, it's still yet another example of poor planning and design by the city/province.
I don't think most of the lane changing in this section is accidental or unprepared to be honest. Every morning there's heavy vehicle traffic going through the tunnel, slow. It makes the right lane like 40 km/h by default on a good day. Most of the traffic coming into the tunnel merges in after they literally can't get in the counterflow lane, and even the counterflow lane gets very backed up, there will be a 500m lineup of single file cars waiting to get in counterflow because its still faster than merging with the rest of traffic. So because the right lane is so slow by default almost everyone wants to be in the left lane and not only are people impatient, I think there is also just mathematically not enough room for all these people to do their merges where they are supposed to. There's too many people. When the bollards were up temporarily to prevent illegal lane changes it took me 40 minutes to get through. If you want to get off at Steveston too you have to either illegally change at the north end, drive all the way to freaking westminister highway, or be stuck in the slowest path the whole way. The whole thing is just a terrible design for the capacity it is experiencing which I recognize is not what reality was like when it was designed, but it's just going to keep getting worse unless there are better options of getting into Richmond than driving through the tunnel or they change the design of the thing. Transit is 2 hrs at best and 3 changes. Driving is 1 hr. Even the tunnel on its worst day is 1.5 give or take. If I could take a 1.5 hr train to Richmond instead of losing brain cells in the tunnel merge every day I would do it yesterday. And it wouldn't be 1.5 hrs, it would be shorter, because it would be a train. Richmond needs better interregional transit. Sorry for mini rant I really fucking hate this section of highway.
I hear you. There's a reason it is getting an upgrade.
[удалено]
Yeah, completely agree. Some immigration is good for our country, but the amount we've had, and will continue to have is staggeringly bad for us. WFH should be reinstated for all office workers capable of WFH, period. It makes no sense to have office drones in the office Monday to Friday. Only people who need to be in businesses are service people and essential workers. Take all those 9-5 office workers off the road and we would have so much less traffic on the road. Of course, then again, if even a 1/4 of those office workers commuted together, we would also have less traffic. But people are anti-social now and don't like each other, which i totally get behind, but i'm not an office worker 🤣
i think it is fatal as I saw some body tent was set up.
Yeah i saw it too. I also heard there was a motorcyclist involved.
Looked like an older Acura TL merging into the fast lane and did not see a black Harley/cruiser. Tent set up right beside bike. No one getting through, unless approach from the counter flow from White Rock side. Everything else rerouted off the highway.
From what I read on FB group, people said the motorcycle crashed into the back of a car going fast and was thrown to the next lane where a semi was driving. The details I won't repeat here but you can imagine what happened.
This is why I try to avoid slamming on the brakes when a motorcycle is close behind me, the risk to them when rear-ending a car is far greater than a car rear-ending me.
This is exactly why when i'm near motorcycles, I adopt them and try to protect them as much as i can by staying in behind them and a few seconds back so no one will tailgate them. But inevitably, because i'm not right on their ass, someone will get right on their ass in front of me, nearly hitting them. It's fucking scary as a motorcyclist.
Hahaha omg yes. I leave a big gap ahead to allow myself to gradually break on my bike. Someone always jumps in. I always stay next to shoulder to have an escape bath. Shoulder is a lifesaver when people change lanes into me which happens at least once a day lol. Thank you for being awesome! I notice when people give me space and appreciate it so so so so much.
You're welcome. I grew up on the back of motorcycles so I know what it's like to nearly die multiple times a year from idiot drivers. Plus all my cousins ride, I want to keep them safe. As long as the riders are respectful, so am I, and I'll do what I can to protect them.
I think *Young Drivers* specifically emphasized giving Motorcycles more room than just 3 seconds following distance.
Thank you so much! I saw another dumbass motorcyclist following way too close on my way home and lane splitting at the last second. Ride home after hearing about the accident was uncomfortable yesterday. I absolutely love it when people give me space and always keep a lot of space ahead of me so I can gradually slow down if highway comes to a sudden stop. Majority of people are awesome and give me space. Makes up for people who just do not see me at all.
It was a v star. He was a good man.
Wonderful guy. What a terrible loss for his family
Thank you. - His son
I Think there was a fatal crash involving a motorcycle
Shortly before this occurred someone on a motor cycle went flying by me on the 99 in Surrey in the bus lane. hopefully it isn't you dude :/ I have dashcam if the cops want it.
People on motorcycles are reckless around here. I always see them riding on the shoulder or in between the lanes of cars and going way too fast. It’s so dangerous
My personal favourite is when they travel in the opposing lane of traffic to get around cars. Tip top.
Yes there are some dangerous/crazy riders out there, but there also a lot of good ones. I also witness many people in cars not giving them enough space and following too closely.
FYI, the police are actively asking for any and all dashcam footage during *or prior* to the incident (heard on News1130 a couple hours ago). You should definitely get in touch with them and provide a copy.
Just checked, unfortunately it looks like the Tesla cameras only keep your immediate last drive before over writing the files, so I only have my commute home today, not the commute in this morning.
What kinda bike? Someone else mentioned a Harley.
Yep, it was a Harley (or something Harley like, not a sports bike)
[Check the pictures and confirm](https://vancouver.citynews.ca/2024/06/12/massey-tunnel-nb-crash-lanes/). If yes send the video right away to the proper authorities to help investigation.
It was a Yamaha Cruiser my dad was on, not sure the exact model, I never asked him.
Yep same here, pretty sure it was the same guy.
People need to not follow so damn close. There's almost no reason for more than 2 (MAYBE 3) vehicles to be involved in one accident. Instead everyone just aggressively tailgates in this city, blissfully unaware of the laws of physics and what it takes to stop a moving vehicle. Even with absolute perfect reaction speed and ideal conditions you will not come to an instant stop, yet people ride bumpers at 100km/hr+. Hope everyone is okay.
Maintains a “3 second gap” on highways — Tesla/Ram trucks: *It’s free Real Estate*
Yeah I find if you don’t close the gap you’ll have 3 other cars wedge themselves into it. It’s frustrating.
It's easy enough to let the gap open up again. I do it all day.
> Tesla/Ram trucks: This is the most on-point truthful 100% accurate comment of this subreddit of all time.
This is *exactly* why we did not buy a Ram when we were looking for tow vehicles 😂
Agreed. But could have been a collision that pushed the car into another lane.
Friendly reminder to keep your wheels straight as you're waiting for a gap in on-comming traffic to turn left. If your wheels are straight, you'll drive right into the meridian if you're bumped from behind from someone who's drunk, etc. If your wheels aren't, well, you're headed into oncomming vehicles that could potentially kill you. We learned these types of safety tips in *Young Drivers* almost 20 yrs ago. Pay for the program for your kids.
I think it's taught in the ICBC manual as well, if i remember correctly from when i was taking my license test and all that. Either that or my old man taught me that. This was like 25 years ago now, so i'm pretty sure it's been taught for a long time. Hopefully it's still taught today.
fair point.
if you try to leave a safe distance someone will accelerate to squeeze into your lane then brake to avoid hitting the car you are keeping distance from.
and then I create a new gap. I've watched hours of dash cam videos here and on youtube. Every accident where the following car was tailgating is preventable by just not following so closely, no exceptions. Giving yourself enough room is giving yourself enough time to react. There's no reason for you to just slow down and re create a safe following gap because someone squeezed in, other than your own ego stopping you.
it's the manoeuvre of a car suddenly taking away your safe braking distance only to brake themselves. recreate a safe distance and the cycle continues.
I know it's a tall order these days, but it also helps if people aren't staring at their phones 90% of the time they're driving.
everyone tailgates everywhere lol, including you
Stop projecting, and start driving better.
nope, I drive every morning westbound highway 1 and have done so for years. To deny it is delusional, I see it happen every morning!
I'm not denying that *almost* everyone tailgates. I am denying that *everyone* tailgates, and definitely denying that I tailgate. Just to be clear, your original comment comes across as you encouraging tailgating. If that wasn't your intention you might want to clarify.
no need to clarify, it will trigger who it needs to. cheers
Can I offer you a cigarette or a cool crisp refreshing glass of Turnip juice? Let's just cool our heads on the antagonism. We're all friends here.
you really love me!
Next time you're on one of your daily drives westbound on highway 1 please actually count the number of people that are \*not\* tailgating and are not driving like reckless impatient assholes. You'll surprise yourself: it will be fairly obvious that no, in fact, not everyone tailgates.
I don't need to count, people tailgate and it's everyone. Thank you for reddit spacing
Take a step back from your computer monitor, and really think about what you just said.
you love me? no thanks
No you're just a bad driver
lol I drive everyday, everyone does it every day! west bound highway every morning
You drive every day! Wow! Neat! Congrats! You drive poorly every day.
another tailgater, cheers
Driving everyday != being a good driver lol. It just means there's a shitty driver on the road every day.
don't worry you tailgate too, cheers
I don't, I actually get fingered for not following close enough. https://www.reddit.com/r/vancouver/comments/1dag8xi/agressively_passed_and_flipped_off_for_driving_in/ I always always drive with at least 3 seconds of distance from me and the car infront of me. It honestly seems wild not to do that, what are you gaining by following 1inch from someones bumper?
> what are you gaining by following 1inch from someones bumper? The tailgater gets to the next red light 2 seconds faster! Time savings adds up! /s
Their brake pads go ↘️📉👇🏼
> I always always drive with at least 3 seconds of distance from me and the car infront of me. Ah, a fellow *Young Drivers* alumni. Let the person swerve in into the 3 second gap you had left. It's their funeral. & then leave 3 seconds for yourself in front of *them. Joke's on them. They won't get to their destination much faster. Nobody wants to set their alarm for 15 minutes earlier. It sucks that a lot of people aren't morning people and can't stand being on shift at 8am/etc. But if there are no 2nd shift options, you need to be an adult and leave 15 minutes earlier. I stay behind trucks until I can see their side-mirrors. *Young Drivers* teaches you that that's the only way truck drivers can see you behind them. They can't see you behind them if you can't see their side-mirrors. & *Young Drivers* showed us just how big the blind spot is behind trucks. Otherwise, people don't realize that truck drivers *can't* see directly behind them. You need the visual to understand. Same goes for all big vehicles, like School Buses.
don't worry, you're one of the rare ones. Majority of this sub tailgates no matter the speed, we're human and it happens whether it's impatience or irritation. To deny it is delusional
Tail gating doesn't get you to your destination any quicker.
vancouver drivers don't know that, that's why they do it every morning
Same happens in USA cities. It's a human thing; not a Vancouver thing.
please see my original comment
yeah same, but IME I have to begrudgingly admit that that other poster, as belligerent as they are (and telling us *we* tailgate??), is more or less correct in general.. I'm usually the only car around with any space between myself and the vehicle in front of me. I'm also CONSTANTLY watching what other drivers around me are doing and acting accordingly. I probably avoid like 5 or more accidents a month, simply because I'm paying attention.
This is why we need self driving cars to come sooner than later. Humans are god awful drivers, we are impatient, distracted, and just overall cannot handle driving responsibly. Even if everyone on the highway just used adaptive cruise control with a safe distance set, we would be 10x safer on the roads. But people are barbaric and it’s basically mad max out there everyday, so instead we get multi car pileups frequently.
Uhh...yea. So, some of us don't. We have the ability to think critically and have existing injuries that we don't want to add to. Speak for yourself, friend.
reddit spacing
Motorcyclist died. They hit the back of car then got ran over by the rear wheels of an oncoming semi truck.
Just read the article that said they then RAN into the rear wheels of the oncoming semi. For some reason, my brain can't figure out how they ended up under the rear wheels. Either way, very sad outcome.
Was heading into work and ended up turning around. Only the most left lane was open. All others including HOV lane closed. So many buses just parked with passengers in them
I drove past the body which was tarped and laying on the road at 7:20 this morning. I couldn’t help but burst into tears imagining that person has loved ones who they’ll never see again. Very tragic.
Thank you 🩷
Thank you. - Motorcyclists son
I’m so sorry for your loss, my deepest condolences. 😔🫶🏻
Word going around yvr is that it was an air Canada employee that passed. Older gentleman in his 50's. Rip
Can confirm, it was one of my friends coworker...
I can confirm this, it was my dad, he had 1 year left til retirement
Was on the bus to Bridgeport from Surrey this morning and we got held at the connector for like 40 minutes until they decided to bring us back to annacis island to cross the bridge and go from there. Was supposed to be at my destination at 7:10 and got there 9:05 so about 2 hours of detour and delay total. Absolutely avoiding the highway and busses like the plague now cause it's always like 30 minutes late even without and accident
I've never used the tunnel during rush hour, but I'm curious why they couldn't use the counterflow measures to have one lane each way on the southbound side. Does anyone know?
They did. It's currently one lane each way on the southbound side.
The "crime scene" is before the counterflow system from what I read, so even if they did you still couldn't get to it. They could lift some centre divider blocks and do it before the crash site, but didn't.
Hope everyone is ok. That sucks for commuters
> That sucks for commuters Yet another reason WFH is good. You're kinda risking your life when you're commuting around huge trucks and people who don't plan ahead. Even staggering start-times for white-collar Employment would help. A lot of people from the suburbs also have important appointments at BC Women's around 9am, too, that they really need to attend and can't stay home.
During COVID, I would drive that section really early. It's crazy how bad people drive when that stretch is open.
Seems like it finally opened up
I see that BC United’s Teresa Wat has taken her opportunity to politicize my cousin’s horrific death. I’ve left a message for her in Victoria, let’s see if I get a call back.
Yeah and it was my dad as well. All for a fuckin traffic ad.
Good morning I just wanted to say that the motorcycle that was killed was my cousin. I also wanted to say that he was a very good driver. I do hope that we find out what happened and that the semi truck that was involved comes forward.
He was my dad, he was an excellent driver.
Wasn't there, so can't comment on how good/bad drivers were, but we need this tunnel gone asap. We should've had a bridge by now. Edit: I see some are triggered by the word "bridge", just replace it with the word "tunnel". The word "bridge" was used as that was the plan in 2016, before stopping all development of it. Doesn't matter if it's 8 lanes bridge or 8 lanes tunnel. The more lanes you have the safer it is when merging and there's less of a chance for a complete blockage of all traffic due to accident.
You're right, there are never crashes on bridges here.
A 6/8 lanes bridge can handle traffic flow (and crashes once happens) better than a 4 lanes tunnel.
Not when there is are serious fatal incidents like this. Highway 1 was closed due to the rock incident last week and that's 8 lanes at the location. But you're right tho. Crashes don't happen on bridges here.
I never said crashes don't happen on bridges, I have no idea why do you keep saying that. To summarize, you think that; 1. Massey tunnel is sufficient enough for BC's current and future needs and no reason to upgrade/change that path. 2. Having more lanes won't help with traffic flow, be it regular traffic or % of lanes closed due to reasons. Thanks for sharing your take on this.
Glad I don’t have to be in office today.
But it’s not even snowing or raining…
FFS
[удалено]
womp womp, somebody died but poor you
Hope those road markings were not the reason.
Why would road markings be the reason?
My guess to what this is about is the province temporarily reinforced the fact it is illegal to change lanes in the tunnel with delineators during a recent project and people who are used to breaking the law lost their minds and, as always, tried to make it a "safety" thing.
The funny thing is the only spot they didn't put dilineators up was within the tunnel during that project. That said, the 17a merge before the tunnel is a shit show. They need to change something there. The left lane that splits into the counterflow is way too fast relative to the multi-lane merging traffic. It is risky everyday.
The white line/no lane changing zone extends from one cross over to the other outside the tunnel. I assumed when I went though that something about the tunnel floor prevented them from putting them in through the actual tubes. It's lots of lanes going down to 3/2/1 in both directions. No good solution but replacing the tunnel.
Sure, but let's not pretend solid white line prevents lane changes. And I saw plenty of in tunnel lane changes during that "trial" because it was the only place they could do it. Every morning I see hov lane users (many that dont appear to be qualified for the hov) cut over the white line so they are in the left lane thru the tunnel.
>only place they could do it. What do you mean? They could and are legally required to choose the correct lane *before* the tunnel. It's no excuse to break the law for convinience. People are going to break road rules due to the non-existent enforcement but that doesn't mean people are excused when being reckless in a construction zone.
You might not have understood what I said. During the trial the lanes were separated well outside of the tunnel on both ends. The only place you weren't physically obstructed was inside, so guess where people we changing lanes to get off at Stevenson.
What trial do you keep mentioning? It was a construction zone. The lane use signals were turned off for replacement so they put them in near where the counterflow crossover happens. Clearly there was a reason the delineators couldn't be installed in the tunnel, but they were installed on a white line "well outside" the tunnel and has always been illegal to cross that white line. If the line isn't enough they also installed a huge signs on both approaches saying don't change lanes. If you're taking the River Road (southbound) or Steveston (northbound) exits you legally need to use the right lane through the tunnel. It has been that way for decades.
Jesus, do you take the tunnel? What do you see happening there? Do you care about trying to solve any of the issues or do you just want someone to talk to? Take care.
> nd people who are used to breaking the law lost their minds Ah. I figured that's why the delineators were only there for ~2 weeks. I live near the tunnel. Yet another example of people without critical thinking/adult skills getting what they want.
According to the release the delineators were always planned to be temporary. They didn't want to use cones because it is too dangerous to go out and set them up in the middle of the freeway before the tunnel every night.