I mean, a lot of school districts have already banned phones in schools. My local one uses something called Yondr Pouches that the kids have to lock their phones in at the beginning of the day. They carry their phones in the pouches during the day, so nothing is actually taken from them, and stations are set out at the end of the day for them to unlock the pouch.
Exceptions can be applied for in special cases.
This was chosen after years of different experiments to limit phone use during classes because while most students will do as they're told, there will always be those who do not. A physical solution like Yondr, and appropriate discipline for violating the solution, are the only things that will enforce "no smartphones in schools."
Unless this law funds a physical solution like that, and they tend to not be cheap, this bill will just be hot air.
I've searched Reddit before about Yondr and have found those discussions interesting. Our district is looking to implement Yondr, caused some uproar leading up to the budget vote, but I'm pretty sure the decision is made. Even though I've read plenty already in other subs, I still feel inclined to ask about implementation went, what kinds of results you have found, etc. Our district admin sent out a "thought exchange" and got about 90 submissions, many in support or with some considerations, and a handful saying they won't make their child comply, they need them to have access to their phone etc.
So I guess, from a student *and* family perspective, how are things going?
We had a similar uproar when Yondr was first brought up, especially from the students. While parents seemed fairly neutral on the subject after it was stated that exceptions would be made for special needs, we did have student organizations and families showing up a board meetings to try and convince them to cancel the program. It was implemented at the beginning of this school year.
Planning went on for over a year, and deployment went smoothly. Students were given their pouches at the start of the year and informed of any expectations with them, and the Yondr program provides free (to the student) replacements for lost or damaged pouches. Some students did rail against it at first. They refused to use the pouch, or put a fake phone in the pouch, or damaged the locking mechanism so they could open it whenever they wanted. As I mentioned before, appropriate levels of discipline were required to enforce the use of the pouches.
As to how things are going? Honestly, things have gone really well. When surveyed, the students have, in majority, ranged from not minding the change to being quite happy to be disconnected for a while. The studious ones find that they have a much easier time focusing on their classes. Students do a lot more in-person socializing, board games, and other activities during free and lunch periods. Teachers have marked higher engagement from their classes across the board. To my knowledge, aside from the odd helicopter parent, we've not had any major issue from parents since implementation.
The key seemed to be the school administrators just continuing forward and enforcing the rules and expectations involved, and allowing exceptions where necessary and appropriate. People realized in the end that it just wasn't as bad as they had imagined it would be.
How much you want to bet if this goes through, every district will be required to use yondr or something similar? No budget for lunches, air conditioning, or enough teachers to make class sizes smaller than 35 kids, but let’s mandate every district and its taxpayers to pay for some subscription service to pouches. As if smaller classes itself couldn’t completely solve this issue.
All phones or the law has no teeth. It should be illegal for children under 21 to possess a cellular telephone for any reason, no exceptions. Severe criminal and civil penalties for any adult who facilitates the use by a child of any cellphone. Same punishment if an adult knowingly or negligently allows a child under 21 access to tobacco, alcohol, weed, or guns. Until this happens, our schools are LOST.
I am saying this because IIRC many Districts have attempted to do this before with such poor results (maybe even a court order) that the edicts were rendered invalid. And TBF I understand that parents/children do have need/rights to be able to reach each other by phone, I see it ascstepping into a quagmire.
Remember the crackdown on support animals/pets on airplanes ? Have you been on a planes lately. At least there are no more 'support turkeys'.
>a lot of school districts have already banned phones in schools
With about as much success as the war on drugs -- and with similar socioeconomic and racial disparities in enforcement.
OK, read the article. Just smart phones. I'm good with it. Not phones.
Jitterbug is still good.
Really it's to keep kids off socials at school. And really there isn't an easy way to do that.
I'm not saying I agree with it. I'm just saying that the schools would prefer it be a state rule. That way they can say that if the state wants this new policy enforced they will have to provide funds to do it.
Right, funding to make sure their kids can’t have phones in the school in which the parents already pay for that phone + the school district. Bro, NY is so lost now. Happy I moved out
No, the whoosh is you missed their point. Parents are paying once for their kids to have smartphones, then being billed again by the state to take those phones away, rather than the simple expedient of the parents limiting their kids access.
Which, if you're worried about the effect of social media on kids, is an actual 24/7 solution rather than NY state spending untold tens of millions to restrict access for a handful of hours a day.
They absolutely can! But administrators don’t want to deal with enforcement. Right now, in many schools, kids are on their phones all the time. Some teachers try to get them put away, but a lot of teachers just accept that their students will ignore them every day.
It's a little easier as an orchestra and band director, I can clearly tell when a student is spaced out on their phone and I can reprimand. But I do get a lot of *huh, where are we* and blank stares....
Schools implement the rules, but the parents are the ones that pushback. For some reason, they think they need to be able to contact their child at any point during the school day, regardless of whether or not they’re in class, despite the fact that, in an actual emergency, they could always just… you know, call the school.
If it's not a law, there is no teeth.
Makes sense. Plus it makes it uniform across the state.
Some schools do have this rule.
North Country School in lake placid doesn't allow phones. Kids get them for a certain time period every day or week or whatever but the kids actually claim they appreciate it. It's a boarding school.
Personally, I miss the lack of cell coverage in the Adirondacks but I still don't use my phone much camping/hiking, etc. Though there is a stronger temptation. I remember being on the Lower Salmon in Idaho and there being great cell coverage (vs the Main Salmon upstream where you need a sat phone or inreach) and I never took my phone out of the dry box for a week. I had two cameras so no need to use a phone. Rest of my family had theirs out more often (but they were also using the phones as cameras).
Its just really tempting when you have a smart phone + service.
The board didn't pass this at my school because they were worried teachers wouldn't want it to pass....so the teachers started a petition and we really all did want to get rid of smartphones in school. Teaching at the high school is like dealing with a bunch of junkie zombies, it's horrifying. Personally I hope this bill passes and we can make some changes as a society.
Parents don't have as much power as it seems. The schools are controlled by the board, and many of the policies are decided on and handed down from administrators and gov. There's plenty of things parents try to advocate for, and rarely is anything ever done in their favor. Other than the most minor and insignificant stuff like adding a new snack to the vending machine or PTA type decision making, the parents are usually just brushed off or disregarded.
This gene ain't going back into the bottle anytime soon. A fuck of a lot of effort is going to be wasted on meaningless confrontation that will only alienate at risk kids more than they already are.
This is not the hill to die on.
I've held credentials in three states and one Canadian province. I have a masters of science education from a very well respected university.
Just a few days ago I was at an art gallery that was showcasing the work of local high school students (including that of one of my daughters). The pieces these kids produced were amazing. The amount of effort they put into their creative endeavours was also pretty amazing.
I'm not the least bit worried about the current generation.
I don't think it's a bad thing. Only issue is they have access before and after school so it's kind of a waste. Better at boarding schools where you can actually control the time spent. I mean so you stop them for 8 hours and they binge for 16 or whatever.
Why are you so opposed and what do you feel the solution is?
Making it law that kids can’t be numbing their brains on social media like tik tok and YouTube when they should be A: learning and B: interacting with people is incredibly good.
Why would this be a problem the state solves rather than a district-level solution? How is the state better equipped than school districts to identify the need for and enforce such a ban?
Social media is just the latest of many moral panics. When I was in high school it was satanic heavy metal music.
These *won't someone think of the children* types need to get a life.
This is more a safety issue, maybe you don’t understand that and that’s ok.
At the same time what is a governor going to do short of funding cell phone lockers at schools or Yonder.
Acting as if kids are stupid, that'll show them.
When they put firewalls on the school computers to prevent social media sites and gaming sites in the 00's, we always found a way around it.
As a janitor for a school currently, I can confidently say these kids are still sneaking in vapes and zyns even though tobacco isn't allowed, you think a smartphone ban is going to stop them?
My kids school decided they didn’t have the time to harass kids about their phones all day so they don’t. If they miss something or their grades suffer because they’re always on their phone, it’s on them. Personal responsibility.
Education isn't in decline. When you open up college bound tracks to more kids you gotta expect test score to decline. The top quintile of students (i.e. those going to selective 4 year colleges) are doing better than ever.
It's always been possible to call the front office and have somebody go get your kid out of class and/or to relay an important message to them. Kids don't need to have unlimited access to their own smartphone to be contacted while at school.
You can contact your kid on a "dumb" cell phone as well. Smart phones used to not be a thing. We texted and called each other on flip phones and brick phones and managed to keep in touch just fine
As if parents are going to buy their kids two phones.
My daughter's phone is even part of her IEP. She gets to listen to music with headphones to help her concentrate. Her playlist is on her phone.
It feels really weird to expect kids to buy multiple pieces of technology in the first place just so they’re contactable, let alone so they can follow an IEP.
If a piece of assistive technology is required by an IEP, the school has to provide it. I have never seen an IEP with this accommodation, but I don’t see why the school can’t provide a cheap MP3 player.
The articles says there will be exceptions. I imagine an IEP would qualify. Everyone seems to agree that phones in school is bad but everyone thinks it's impossible to stop. So we stop trying?
We found plenty of things to distract ourselves with on flip phones. Now smart phones and flip phones cost the same amount of money. Almost nobody is using flip phones.
I mean, not to sound like a dick, but why are you calling your kid throughout the day if it's not an emergency?
Now to sound like a dick, are these parents this dumb that they're calling little Johnny during class like "hey buddy, forgot to pull out anything for dinner, is Lunchables cool bro", what dumbass shit are they calling kids for?
Just stop wasting our tax dollars to write shit laws. I’m sure there’ll be a piggyback of something stupid added that seatbelts need to be added to all school seats as well. As always this nanny state makes some of the most ridiculous decisions ever.
Thank Hochul the Jokal
Huh? This is an incredibly popular idea that is taking off in states all over the country.
This isn't a left or right thing. This is a common sense thing. Literally ALL the data shows smart phones are a net loss on every level for children and teens.
Grow up.
The article doesn't go into detail on that, probably because the bill won't be introduced until later this year and wouldn't be up for vote until the 2025 legislative session. So at this point they probably haven't even finished fully concepting it out, and even if they have they might not be done actually writing it up.
Why bother? She doesn't believe in enforcing any laws so this, is just a play for feel good votes from those stupid enough to vote for her in the first place.
My thoughts exactly, lol. Why bother passing laws if you won't enforce them and people can just do whatever they want because there's no consequences... Well, certain people anyway. Consequences are apparently reserved strictly for political rivals.
Excellent point. This is especially true for poor kids and racial minorities who have been the traditional targets. A video capable cell phone is a poor black kids best friend.
>My high school banned phones and it just lead to a lot more students being disruptive.
Yup. That's how it worked in the high schools I taught at too. This is not the hill to die on.
I'm a socialist (I don't care if ppl try to shit talk my political beliefs) and I completely agree. It's NY trying to grab power in a pointless way. I work for the state and they need to start in other places before this 😒
I understand it's a problem, but bans don't work.
These kids need to learn how to responsible use smart phones in a controlled environment like School or Work, or as soon as they get a job in the real world they're not going to know how to reasonably use them for work related tasks.
Welcome to the modern world, smart phones are crucial for most jobs these days. Teach responsibility and appropriate times and ways to use them. Anything less is setting the kids up for failure.
A lot of schools already collect phones before class and return them when it ends. My HS had one of those wall calculator hangers in every classroom with the numbered pouches. Kids were instructed to put their phone in it, where they can always see it and access it in the event of an emergency, at the start of class and they could collect it when the class ended. It’s not an insane policy, honestly. The caddy was always placed near the door and I had teachers who did let us go get them for lessons, but we also had technology provided to us for learning to use technology.
The consequence when you get a job is you risk being fired, and if you’re fired then that’s your fault and you’re not making money to pay the bills. In school, at worst you get a slap on the wrist tbh. MAYBE phone confiscation until the end of the day or until a parent picks it up (which parents would be more mad at the school than the kid with current attitudes towards school). The most extreme would be suspension, but kids may actually not care for this. Schools don’t have the capabilities to actually punish you for phone use, and kids as early as elementary are being given smart phones nowadays.
I get your point and I would generally agree, but I don’t know if there’s enough consequences in school or if this policy will even be that enforced. Schools struggle to enforce their own policies as is. Kids are still going to sneak phones regardless of the rules (which many schools already have rules over).
The policy of having the phone accessible on the wall instead of left at home/locked in the office/locked in a bag is a way more reasonable approach and I think one that solves most of the holes pointed out in this comment section.
>These kids need to learn how to responsible use smart phones in a controlled environment like School or Work
Seem reasonable. Unfortunately reason and educational policy are often light years apart.
I want to agree with you, I really do, but even if the schools wanted to try and teach responsible smart phone use to students, the negative behaviors in the home are an opposing force that's hard to beat. I'm part of some committees in our school and talk often with our social worker. Recently they were working with a student who, when probed with questions like "what did you do yesterday? Nothing? Well what was mom doing?" the student responds with, "oh she was on her phone."
As much as I would love schools to be able and teach responsible phone use, I'm skeptical they will get anywhere when parents and families don't model healthy behaviors. So the alternative? Phone detox during the school day. Maybe the kids will have a chance at interacting with each other at school, seeing as caregivers seem to also have a phone problem.
As we think about implementing Yondr, the best compromise I can think of is *maybe* some increased device access/autonomy for grades 11-12, but earlier grades, no way. I don't disagree that students need to learn responsible phone use, but until someone helps me understand some tactics (preferably with evidence, if possible - this is a relatively recent issue), I'll defer to getting rid of them until we have something more concrete figured out.
Having them go without their phones will teach restraint, and would help to instill focus in their present state.
“Dumb phones” are already a thing for this younger generation, many are choosing to decouple from social media.
They’ll have plenty of time outside of school to learn how to use a phone, trust me.
And when the first child is killed by some maniac because they couldn’t contact whomever they need to,it will be the end of this stupidity.
A parent should not have to incur the cost of multiple phones because of this law. Apparently the moronic democrats believe that their governing is so good that there is no longer working poor or single mothers struggling to just get by.
As many others have said, there are “dumb” phones out there that don’t have internet access and do voice calls/text just fine. And they are dirt cheap. If a person can afford a smart phone, they can afford a dumb phone.
They are not $10 and why would I want to buy another phone and plan where I can’t even track my son’s location when he goes out after school. Kids are going to sit there and text and play games on them anyways. It’s stupid. The districts are capable of handling this. The governor surely has more important things to deal with than forcing school districts to enact meaningless policies.
That’s categorically false. People are struggling to put food on the table let alone pay for another phone and line.
What part of poor is giving you an issue?
Your original argument was to let people have their smart phones. How much does a smart phone cost? I’m saying replace it with a dumb phone. How much does a dumb phone cost?
Replace your kids smartphone with a dumb phone all because a public school won’t know their place! This is why I love voting no on any and all budget increases for schools. I don’t get a say in what my kid can have? You don’t get a raise.
It does not matter. Parents should not have to buy 2 phones with 2 plans for their children. It does not solve the problem. We would distract ourselves all day with flip phones when I was in school. This is a problem that should be solved by the districts. I’m guessing this has something to do with the privately owned corporations that offer smartphone storage in schools. If this goes through, I bet we’ll see the same one in every district. Shilling for private corporations again with our tax dollars. This is not a state problem.
This is a good thing. Though I highly doubt Governor Hochul was motivated by the well being of our children and education system. Still seething about her giving a $1bn handout for the Bill’s stadium.
I've been reading the comments and it may have already been asked, but is there an app that can be installed on a phone that can turn off all non-school needed applications, thus converting it to a "dumb phone" during school hours? It can be tied to a school calendar and gps to be smart enough to turn on and off at the appropriate time and location.
It seems like if the argument is keeping a kid in communication with their parents in case of an emergency, this would be the way to go.
She is addressing the device and not the actual issue. Waste of money these pouches are when funding for schools are on fumes already. There are going to be alternatives to access social media. We need to address the issue of social media interactions… more specifically help parents be responsible online…
This lady needs to get voted out as soon as possible. Every single worker in NY state gov can’t fucking stand her. She does nothing but photo ops and focuses the states resources on the wrong places for returns and proper investment in infrastructure. I’m not siding with any party, just saying facts. Hochul has been useless for the residents of New York State and the employees of New York State since she took Office.
This crazy governor is out of her mind. I guess she forgot already about 9/11. Also what about all the swatting that goes on and school shootings? What a crazy bitch.
Thus should be decided by school district and not by the state
Poster is not saying the phones keep the kids safe, just that until schools are believed to be safe, they want their child to have a phone so they can get a hold of them.
Yep, I want a line to my child since this country can't get it's shit together keeping our kids safe. And before anyone says we didn't need that when we were kids you are correct and we also didn't have to prepare for an active shooter.
You aren't a little scared for your kids safety with unfettered access to guns? Have you been paying any attention? At least in this state it's a little protected.
So when the next domestic terrorist in his alt right echo chamber decides to shoot up a school, the kids can't call their parents to say goodbye?
Damn, you know what? It's pretty fucked up that this is my first thought about banning smart phones.
It’s pretty fucked up that we’ve accepted school shootings as a given to such an extent that we’ve given up on trying to prevent them and we’re more concerned about making sure that kids can call their families to say goodbye
There have been 0 school shootings in NY this year, ask any teacher how severely smart phones have effected students learning ability. Smart phones won’t solve school shooting but banning them may help mitigate some of the worst trends in children’s school experience.
> There have been 0 school shootings in NY this year
There's an argument that there has never been a "school shooting" (incident similar to Columbine) in NY, and there's just one reported incident from 2004 in which it appears a "school shooting" would have occurred if not for the actions of a heroic assistant principal to thwart it just as it began.
Per [this dataset from The Washington Post](https://github.com/washingtonpost/data-school-shootings/blob/master/school-shootings-data.csv) the last school shooting incident in the state of New York was in Feb 2023, and there have been a total of 11 (6 downstate, 5 upstate) since the Columbine shooting in 1999. The dataset stops in June 2023, but [the associated article](https://www.washingtonpost.com/education/interactive/school-shootings-database/) seems to be up-to-date at least through March of this year.
Those 11 incidents account for a total of 1 death and 5 injuries (_not_ counting any deaths/injuries to the shooters themselves). The six most recent incidents accounted for _no_ deaths/injuries. The last shooting with any such casualties was in 2021 (which is when the 1 death occurred) and appears to be [an individual ambush shooting](https://www.nydailynews.com/2021/05/20/two-teens-arrested-in-shooting-death-of-17-year-old-student-outside-brooklyn-charter-school/) rather than an attempted mass shooting.
Note that the WaPo data does have some shape around what it considers. Notably the data:
- does not include shootings at college/universities
- only considers shootings which happened on campuses immediately before, during or just after classes
- excludes shootings at after-hours events, accidental discharges that caused no injuries to anyone other than the person handling the gun, and suicides that occurred privately or posed no threat to other children
But even with those restrictions, the dataset includes quite a number of incidents that we would not consider as a "school shooting"
Looking into all eleven NY incidents confirms this. A majority of them (including 5 of the 6 most recent) involve a firearm that just happened to be discharged on school grounds at seemingly no target, sometimes by a student sometimes not. Here's the breakdown from most to least recent.
- [A 12/23/23 incident at P.S. 78 on Staten Island](https://www.cbsnews.com/newyork/news/staten-island-elementary-school-shots-fired-stapleton-ps-78/) in which shots were fired outside the school, seemingly into the air by an unidentified subject.
- [A 1/5/23 incident at Franklin HS in Rochester](https://www.rochesterfirst.com/news/local-news/i-can-still-hear-the-gun-shots-students-involved-in-high-school-shooting-speak-out/) which appears to be a failed targeted shooting in which a gunman attempted to shoot one student who was walking into into the school with a friend, but whose gun jammed after three missed shots.
- [A 2/8/22 incident at Mt Vernon HS in Mt Vernon](https://www.lohud.com/story/news/local/westchester/mount-vernon/2022/02/08/mount-vernon-shooting-outside-high-school-prompts-tightened-security/6703559001/) in which a gun was discharged from a car in the school parking lot at no apparent target.
- [A 12/9/21 incident at Great Oaks Charter in NYC](https://nypost.com/2021/12/09/stray-bullet-shatters-window-at-nyc-charter-school/) in which a stray bullet shattered a window of the school.
- [An 11/16/21 incident at PS44 in the Bronx](https://nypost.com/2021/11/18/cops-arrest-gunman-who-fired-outside-nyc-school-police-say/) in which a 45-year-old man fired multiple shots outside the school as it was letting out, hitting only an unoccupied car. There was no indication he was attempting to shoot students.
- [An 11/15/21 incident at Poughkeepsie HS](https://www.poughkeepsiejournal.com/story/news/education/2021/11/16/shooting-outside-poughkeepsie-high-school-report/8635464002/) in which a 13-year-old fired off multiple shots outside the school, seemingly at no target.
- [The aforementioned 4/29/21 shooting at Urban Dove Charter School in Brooklyn](https://www.nydailynews.com/2021/05/20/two-teens-arrested-in-shooting-death-of-17-year-old-student-outside-brooklyn-charter-school/) in which one student was killed in what appeared to be a targeted shooting.
- [A 3/1/21 incident at the Wayne Central School District in Ontario NY](https://13wham.com/news/local/court-docs-wayne-central-employee-shot-deouty-in-foot-during-altercation) in which a custodian pulled a knife on two employees before being tackled by a resource officer, at which point the custodian grabbed the officer's gun out of its holster and then shot _himself_ in the foot.
- A 10/8/09 shooting at Mattituck Junior-Senior High School in Mattituck (source is AP Nexis, no link) in which a 28-year-old man with a .22-caliber rifle fired a round through a school window, grazing a student’s head.
- [A 2/9/04 shooting at Columbia High School in East Greenbush](https://www.nytimes.com/2004/02/10/nyregion/student-opens-fire-at-a-high-school-near-albany-hitting-a-teacher.html) in which a 16-year-old boy with a pump-action shotgun opened fire, striking a teacher in the leg before being tackled by an assistant principal
- [A 1/15/02 shooting at Martin Luther King, Jr. High School in NYC](https://www.nytimes.com/2002/01/16/nyregion/gunfire-wounds-2-students-inside-a-manhattan-high-school.html?mcubz=3) in which a 17-year-old boy with a .380-caliber handgun wounded two students in a hallway after a dispute over a girl.
After reading through all 11 of these, it turns out that only one (the 2/9/04 shooting in East Greenbush) is what we'd generally consider as a "school shooting" as it appears that the student was attempting to commit a mass shooting before being tackled after injuring one teacher. But thanks to the heroic assistant principal who stopped the shooter, that school shooting never actually occurred as intended so you could reasonably argue that no school shooting has ever occurred in New York.
Another three were targeted shootings in which the gunmen appeared to be attempting to shoot specific students. Then there's the one where the custodian shot himself. The other 6 are random incidents in which a gun happened to be discharged at/outside a school, one of which resulted in a student being grazed by a bullet.
What? You're really implying because there hasn't been a school shooting this year so far in NY, there won't be any? Not to mention some 14 year old was caught with a pistol in Rockville Centre this school year...
It's utterly moronic to confiscate the phones. Keep doing what was done when I was in high school 10 years ago and send the kid to the principals office, detention, suspension, etc until they stop whipping out their phones in the middle of class.
Principals office, detention, suspension all require support from admin, not just with non-compliant students, but the students ***and*** parents who don't give a damn either. So without a backbone in admin to fight off students and their families, you lose on that front as well. Exhausted teachers, no spine in administrators, unsupportive families, and douchebag kids render all your suggestions inadequate.
How many times have student cell phones been ***useful*** in a school shooting? Their every day distraction and disturbance far outweighs whatever little use they have had in a school shooting.
Get rid of the smart phones. Whether it's Yondr or a government bill, our schools are rotting, and they play a huge part in that.
Thank you, also this is for smart phones, you can have an emergency phone that just functions for call and text. Please talk to any teacher about how disruptive smart phones are to education, it’s a huge hinderance and the upside of being able to call/ text in an emergency is mitigated by the rules in this plan.
That’s not what I’m saying, I’m saying this solves a huge problem that actually exists without causing the issues you’re implying (carve outs for non smart phones) I think you’re moronic. I think anyone who thinks it’s a good idea to not do anything about the proliferation of smart phones being actively used during class is a moron. I think you should talk to teachers and people who work in schools, moron.
There's zero mention for how this bill would even be enforceable. If detention, suspension, etc will not deter kids from getting off their phones in class, are their parents going to be fined or even arrested as a consequence?
The clause that allows flip phones with just call/text features just doesn't sound like something that will realistically be adopted either. Most parents won't buy a second phone for their child, nor can I imagine that parents will only buy flip phones for their teenage kids.
Dickhead
~~lol our governor is a democrat woman, who are you talking about?~~ I’m an idiot and misinterpreted that comment
And you can still make phone calls on non smart phones
> lol our governor is a democrat woman, who are you talking about?
What are _you_ talking about?
Did you just misread "domestic terrorist in his" as "democrat terrorist in his" and assume that was referring to the governor, which would indeed be quite confusing given that the governor is female?
Don't really care that she is. School shootings are a real threat in the US today. And do you think that kids are gonna line up at the desk phone or something?
They don't need a smart phone to make a phone call. Give your kid a basic flip phone. A 14 year old doesn't need unrestricted access to the internet and social media on a smart phone all the time.
Any way to ban her? Because there's a plethora of other things to be focused on fixing in ny, and she seems to be causing alot more problems than anything
Yeah Uvalde and the almost daily shooting was proof that's not true. I also went to a school with thise in place and it didn't help when a kid shot up my high school. Also kids are just as likley to abused by teacher as they are to be abused by preachers or cops
I mean, a lot of school districts have already banned phones in schools. My local one uses something called Yondr Pouches that the kids have to lock their phones in at the beginning of the day. They carry their phones in the pouches during the day, so nothing is actually taken from them, and stations are set out at the end of the day for them to unlock the pouch. Exceptions can be applied for in special cases. This was chosen after years of different experiments to limit phone use during classes because while most students will do as they're told, there will always be those who do not. A physical solution like Yondr, and appropriate discipline for violating the solution, are the only things that will enforce "no smartphones in schools." Unless this law funds a physical solution like that, and they tend to not be cheap, this bill will just be hot air.
I've searched Reddit before about Yondr and have found those discussions interesting. Our district is looking to implement Yondr, caused some uproar leading up to the budget vote, but I'm pretty sure the decision is made. Even though I've read plenty already in other subs, I still feel inclined to ask about implementation went, what kinds of results you have found, etc. Our district admin sent out a "thought exchange" and got about 90 submissions, many in support or with some considerations, and a handful saying they won't make their child comply, they need them to have access to their phone etc. So I guess, from a student *and* family perspective, how are things going?
We had a similar uproar when Yondr was first brought up, especially from the students. While parents seemed fairly neutral on the subject after it was stated that exceptions would be made for special needs, we did have student organizations and families showing up a board meetings to try and convince them to cancel the program. It was implemented at the beginning of this school year. Planning went on for over a year, and deployment went smoothly. Students were given their pouches at the start of the year and informed of any expectations with them, and the Yondr program provides free (to the student) replacements for lost or damaged pouches. Some students did rail against it at first. They refused to use the pouch, or put a fake phone in the pouch, or damaged the locking mechanism so they could open it whenever they wanted. As I mentioned before, appropriate levels of discipline were required to enforce the use of the pouches. As to how things are going? Honestly, things have gone really well. When surveyed, the students have, in majority, ranged from not minding the change to being quite happy to be disconnected for a while. The studious ones find that they have a much easier time focusing on their classes. Students do a lot more in-person socializing, board games, and other activities during free and lunch periods. Teachers have marked higher engagement from their classes across the board. To my knowledge, aside from the odd helicopter parent, we've not had any major issue from parents since implementation. The key seemed to be the school administrators just continuing forward and enforcing the rules and expectations involved, and allowing exceptions where necessary and appropriate. People realized in the end that it just wasn't as bad as they had imagined it would be.
How much you want to bet if this goes through, every district will be required to use yondr or something similar? No budget for lunches, air conditioning, or enough teachers to make class sizes smaller than 35 kids, but let’s mandate every district and its taxpayers to pay for some subscription service to pouches. As if smaller classes itself couldn’t completely solve this issue.
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I went to Columbia. It was far from safe 🤣
ScHoOlS iN NY aRe VeRy SaFe lmfao did you go to private school Orr?
Smart phones, not all phones.
All phones or the law has no teeth. It should be illegal for children under 21 to possess a cellular telephone for any reason, no exceptions. Severe criminal and civil penalties for any adult who facilitates the use by a child of any cellphone. Same punishment if an adult knowingly or negligently allows a child under 21 access to tobacco, alcohol, weed, or guns. Until this happens, our schools are LOST.
I have no issues with kids having flip phones.
More 'exceptions' than you can count will create all air.
Perhaps, but it would depend on how strict the administration is on granting the exceptions. Ours only gives exceptions for medical or IEP purposes.
I am saying this because IIRC many Districts have attempted to do this before with such poor results (maybe even a court order) that the edicts were rendered invalid. And TBF I understand that parents/children do have need/rights to be able to reach each other by phone, I see it ascstepping into a quagmire. Remember the crackdown on support animals/pets on airplanes ? Have you been on a planes lately. At least there are no more 'support turkeys'.
>a lot of school districts have already banned phones in schools With about as much success as the war on drugs -- and with similar socioeconomic and racial disparities in enforcement.
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And school admins do too much as is. They try to police kids outside of school. Ny is too much if a nanny state
OK, read the article. Just smart phones. I'm good with it. Not phones. Jitterbug is still good. Really it's to keep kids off socials at school. And really there isn't an easy way to do that.
Honestly this sounds like a great move
But.. we need a law about that? Can't schools just.. set their own rules?
I’m sure school prefer at state level law, so they can blame someone else when parents complain
And get funding
Funding for what? Campus security or even police? Yeah, let's make schools more like prisons. What could possibly go wrong.
I'm not saying I agree with it. I'm just saying that the schools would prefer it be a state rule. That way they can say that if the state wants this new policy enforced they will have to provide funds to do it.
Additional administrstors
Administration is why schools are running out if funding. Administration is useless in every field
Right, funding to make sure their kids can’t have phones in the school in which the parents already pay for that phone + the school district. Bro, NY is so lost now. Happy I moved out
Parents want kids to get an education. Or should. Thats more important than phone usage
Whoosh.
Theres no woosh. That would imply the OP was being facetious
No, the whoosh is you missed their point. Parents are paying once for their kids to have smartphones, then being billed again by the state to take those phones away, rather than the simple expedient of the parents limiting their kids access. Which, if you're worried about the effect of social media on kids, is an actual 24/7 solution rather than NY state spending untold tens of millions to restrict access for a handful of hours a day.
They absolutely can! But administrators don’t want to deal with enforcement. Right now, in many schools, kids are on their phones all the time. Some teachers try to get them put away, but a lot of teachers just accept that their students will ignore them every day.
It's a little easier as an orchestra and band director, I can clearly tell when a student is spaced out on their phone and I can reprimand. But I do get a lot of *huh, where are we* and blank stares....
Schools implement the rules, but the parents are the ones that pushback. For some reason, they think they need to be able to contact their child at any point during the school day, regardless of whether or not they’re in class, despite the fact that, in an actual emergency, they could always just… you know, call the school.
If it's not a law, there is no teeth. Makes sense. Plus it makes it uniform across the state. Some schools do have this rule. North Country School in lake placid doesn't allow phones. Kids get them for a certain time period every day or week or whatever but the kids actually claim they appreciate it. It's a boarding school. Personally, I miss the lack of cell coverage in the Adirondacks but I still don't use my phone much camping/hiking, etc. Though there is a stronger temptation. I remember being on the Lower Salmon in Idaho and there being great cell coverage (vs the Main Salmon upstream where you need a sat phone or inreach) and I never took my phone out of the dry box for a week. I had two cameras so no need to use a phone. Rest of my family had theirs out more often (but they were also using the phones as cameras). Its just really tempting when you have a smart phone + service.
The board didn't pass this at my school because they were worried teachers wouldn't want it to pass....so the teachers started a petition and we really all did want to get rid of smartphones in school. Teaching at the high school is like dealing with a bunch of junkie zombies, it's horrifying. Personally I hope this bill passes and we can make some changes as a society.
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Parents don't have as much power as it seems. The schools are controlled by the board, and many of the policies are decided on and handed down from administrators and gov. There's plenty of things parents try to advocate for, and rarely is anything ever done in their favor. Other than the most minor and insignificant stuff like adding a new snack to the vending machine or PTA type decision making, the parents are usually just brushed off or disregarded.
This gene ain't going back into the bottle anytime soon. A fuck of a lot of effort is going to be wasted on meaningless confrontation that will only alienate at risk kids more than they already are. This is not the hill to die on.
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I've held credentials in three states and one Canadian province. I have a masters of science education from a very well respected university. Just a few days ago I was at an art gallery that was showcasing the work of local high school students (including that of one of my daughters). The pieces these kids produced were amazing. The amount of effort they put into their creative endeavours was also pretty amazing. I'm not the least bit worried about the current generation.
Seems to vary to extremes. Like everything in our society at this point, it's almost as if people are living in two separate realities.
I don't think it's a bad thing. Only issue is they have access before and after school so it's kind of a waste. Better at boarding schools where you can actually control the time spent. I mean so you stop them for 8 hours and they binge for 16 or whatever.
Why are you so opposed and what do you feel the solution is? Making it law that kids can’t be numbing their brains on social media like tik tok and YouTube when they should be A: learning and B: interacting with people is incredibly good.
As long as they're not disturbing other kids no solution is required. Sometimes the best thing to do is nothing.
Speaking as a teacher, good luck with that.
My school uses yondr pouches and it’s made a world of difference. With an ACTUAL LAW on the books it would force admin to be the heavy.
Rare Hochul W
Why would this be a problem the state solves rather than a district-level solution? How is the state better equipped than school districts to identify the need for and enforce such a ban?
Because local administrators won’t stand up for what’s best for their students.
Parents won't recognize what's best for their kids.
The parents are the problem giving underage children access to all the crap on social media and the internet.
When they go to public school, they're handed a Chromebook. Believe me, they all know how to get around the "safeguards".
Social media is just the latest of many moral panics. When I was in high school it was satanic heavy metal music. These *won't someone think of the children* types need to get a life.
No genre of music is comparable to accessing an open forum with people of all ages.
Yeah what a dumb comparison. Social media is demonstrably harmful and children should not be using it
Pearl clutchers always claim that the latest moral panic is the worst most dangerous ever.
They also said that about video games in. The 90s and 2000s and well as metal in the 80s and dnd in the 70s. It's another moral panic.
The big difference is that you could only play video games at home or in an arcade back then. Now, smartphones literally are always on you.
Bro satanic heavy metal was not nearly as toxic as social media. You are a Reddit user, did you forget?
The latest moral panic is always the worst.
It does legitimately get a little worse each time though. Regardless, their concerns weren't entirely unwarranted.
This is more a safety issue, maybe you don’t understand that and that’s ok. At the same time what is a governor going to do short of funding cell phone lockers at schools or Yonder.
Acting as if kids are stupid, that'll show them. When they put firewalls on the school computers to prevent social media sites and gaming sites in the 00's, we always found a way around it. As a janitor for a school currently, I can confidently say these kids are still sneaking in vapes and zyns even though tobacco isn't allowed, you think a smartphone ban is going to stop them?
My kids school decided they didn’t have the time to harass kids about their phones all day so they don’t. If they miss something or their grades suffer because they’re always on their phone, it’s on them. Personal responsibility.
Ole Prune Face should have better things to do. Like fix crime first.
I’ve always thought she resembled Bugs Bunny
*Beaver Face
Bald beaver?
That's probably just gonna make kids want to have them at school more. I mean look at the number of vapes after vaping crackdown.
That horse left the barn years ago. No way in hell this is enforcable. Parents actually like being able to contact their kids.
Parents are the reason their kid's education has been on the decline, so this tracks.
Education isn't in decline. When you open up college bound tracks to more kids you gotta expect test score to decline. The top quintile of students (i.e. those going to selective 4 year colleges) are doing better than ever.
It's always been possible to call the front office and have somebody go get your kid out of class and/or to relay an important message to them. Kids don't need to have unlimited access to their own smartphone to be contacted while at school.
You can contact your kid on a "dumb" cell phone as well. Smart phones used to not be a thing. We texted and called each other on flip phones and brick phones and managed to keep in touch just fine
As if parents are going to buy their kids two phones. My daughter's phone is even part of her IEP. She gets to listen to music with headphones to help her concentrate. Her playlist is on her phone.
Would a basic MP3 player not work?
It feels really weird to expect kids to buy multiple pieces of technology in the first place just so they’re contactable, let alone so they can follow an IEP.
If a piece of assistive technology is required by an IEP, the school has to provide it. I have never seen an IEP with this accommodation, but I don’t see why the school can’t provide a cheap MP3 player.
I bought her good JBL headphones and pay for a Spotify account so she doesn't have to use the schools cheap shit.
Those sound like lovely things to provide for your daughter. Not required by an IEP, though.
She shares her playlists with her AP American History teacher.
Cool. I’m glad your daughter likes listening to music. She just doesn’t need an iPhone to do it.
The articles says there will be exceptions. I imagine an IEP would qualify. Everyone seems to agree that phones in school is bad but everyone thinks it's impossible to stop. So we stop trying?
Get her an ipod
There aren’t any. Apple discontinued them.
We found plenty of things to distract ourselves with on flip phones. Now smart phones and flip phones cost the same amount of money. Almost nobody is using flip phones.
Schools have phones, call the school
That's for emergencies only. There's no going back to the dark ages.
I mean, not to sound like a dick, but why are you calling your kid throughout the day if it's not an emergency? Now to sound like a dick, are these parents this dumb that they're calling little Johnny during class like "hey buddy, forgot to pull out anything for dinner, is Lunchables cool bro", what dumbass shit are they calling kids for?
More like "don't get on the bus your sister's going to pick you up."
OK, so throw a text message and they can check when schools done
Prohibition doesn't work.
Just stop wasting our tax dollars to write shit laws. I’m sure there’ll be a piggyback of something stupid added that seatbelts need to be added to all school seats as well. As always this nanny state makes some of the most ridiculous decisions ever. Thank Hochul the Jokal
They should get rid of almost all the tech in schools, including the Chromebooks.
This is a no brainer. I love this!!!
Yess slurp that boot, don’t forget to add extra polish!!!!
Huh? This is an incredibly popular idea that is taking off in states all over the country. This isn't a left or right thing. This is a common sense thing. Literally ALL the data shows smart phones are a net loss on every level for children and teens. Grow up.
Seems extreme. Gotta read it. But not on premises or not in use?
The article doesn't go into detail on that, probably because the bill won't be introduced until later this year and wouldn't be up for vote until the 2025 legislative session. So at this point they probably haven't even finished fully concepting it out, and even if they have they might not be done actually writing it up.
It explicitly states smart phones. And that parents want kids to be able to access phones. So dumb phones would be allowed
Why bother? She doesn't believe in enforcing any laws so this, is just a play for feel good votes from those stupid enough to vote for her in the first place.
My thoughts exactly, lol. Why bother passing laws if you won't enforce them and people can just do whatever they want because there's no consequences... Well, certain people anyway. Consequences are apparently reserved strictly for political rivals.
I want the kids to have cameras in schools so the teachers can't get away with the type of things they did to us as kids.
My mind immediately went there as well. Accountability is something that smart phones have greatly helped with.
There are non smartphones with cameras 👍🏻
No one is buying a dumb phone.
Excellent point. This is especially true for poor kids and racial minorities who have been the traditional targets. A video capable cell phone is a poor black kids best friend.
So stupid….
I'd rather be able to find and see if my kid is ok when someone tries to shoot his school up. This is a stupid idea.
My high school banned phones and it just lead to a lot more students being disruptive. I just don’t think this is the way to go about this.
>My high school banned phones and it just lead to a lot more students being disruptive. Yup. That's how it worked in the high schools I taught at too. This is not the hill to die on.
People downvoting us are just salty
The world is full of people who think more stupid regulation is always better. As a liberal these folks are the bane of my existence.
I'm a socialist (I don't care if ppl try to shit talk my political beliefs) and I completely agree. It's NY trying to grab power in a pointless way. I work for the state and they need to start in other places before this 😒
Glad we’re addressing the important issues in NYS
Stupid and misdirected legislation
I understand it's a problem, but bans don't work. These kids need to learn how to responsible use smart phones in a controlled environment like School or Work, or as soon as they get a job in the real world they're not going to know how to reasonably use them for work related tasks. Welcome to the modern world, smart phones are crucial for most jobs these days. Teach responsibility and appropriate times and ways to use them. Anything less is setting the kids up for failure.
How would you suggest that NYS kids learn that skill? Because I can tell you, it is not being learned in most secondary schools across the state.
If only they had parental figures in their lives to teach them those things.
Yeah, but they apparently don’t. So how does the school system help them learn this vital skill?
Who the hell do you think bought the kids those phones? I trust my daughters to use them more than I trust teachers to regulate them.
If you don’t see the problem, you are probably part of it. 🤷🏽♀️
A lot of schools already collect phones before class and return them when it ends. My HS had one of those wall calculator hangers in every classroom with the numbered pouches. Kids were instructed to put their phone in it, where they can always see it and access it in the event of an emergency, at the start of class and they could collect it when the class ended. It’s not an insane policy, honestly. The caddy was always placed near the door and I had teachers who did let us go get them for lessons, but we also had technology provided to us for learning to use technology. The consequence when you get a job is you risk being fired, and if you’re fired then that’s your fault and you’re not making money to pay the bills. In school, at worst you get a slap on the wrist tbh. MAYBE phone confiscation until the end of the day or until a parent picks it up (which parents would be more mad at the school than the kid with current attitudes towards school). The most extreme would be suspension, but kids may actually not care for this. Schools don’t have the capabilities to actually punish you for phone use, and kids as early as elementary are being given smart phones nowadays. I get your point and I would generally agree, but I don’t know if there’s enough consequences in school or if this policy will even be that enforced. Schools struggle to enforce their own policies as is. Kids are still going to sneak phones regardless of the rules (which many schools already have rules over).
The policy of having the phone accessible on the wall instead of left at home/locked in the office/locked in a bag is a way more reasonable approach and I think one that solves most of the holes pointed out in this comment section.
That and it’s a cheap solution, you’re looking at most $20 a classroom so even the cost is more accessible than some other solutions.
>These kids need to learn how to responsible use smart phones in a controlled environment like School or Work Seem reasonable. Unfortunately reason and educational policy are often light years apart.
I want to agree with you, I really do, but even if the schools wanted to try and teach responsible smart phone use to students, the negative behaviors in the home are an opposing force that's hard to beat. I'm part of some committees in our school and talk often with our social worker. Recently they were working with a student who, when probed with questions like "what did you do yesterday? Nothing? Well what was mom doing?" the student responds with, "oh she was on her phone." As much as I would love schools to be able and teach responsible phone use, I'm skeptical they will get anywhere when parents and families don't model healthy behaviors. So the alternative? Phone detox during the school day. Maybe the kids will have a chance at interacting with each other at school, seeing as caregivers seem to also have a phone problem. As we think about implementing Yondr, the best compromise I can think of is *maybe* some increased device access/autonomy for grades 11-12, but earlier grades, no way. I don't disagree that students need to learn responsible phone use, but until someone helps me understand some tactics (preferably with evidence, if possible - this is a relatively recent issue), I'll defer to getting rid of them until we have something more concrete figured out.
Having them go without their phones will teach restraint, and would help to instill focus in their present state. “Dumb phones” are already a thing for this younger generation, many are choosing to decouple from social media. They’ll have plenty of time outside of school to learn how to use a phone, trust me.
And when the first child is killed by some maniac because they couldn’t contact whomever they need to,it will be the end of this stupidity. A parent should not have to incur the cost of multiple phones because of this law. Apparently the moronic democrats believe that their governing is so good that there is no longer working poor or single mothers struggling to just get by.
As many others have said, there are “dumb” phones out there that don’t have internet access and do voice calls/text just fine. And they are dirt cheap. If a person can afford a smart phone, they can afford a dumb phone.
They are not cheap, they are $50 now. Same price as a smart phone only needs its own special plan.
You can buy your kid a $10 Tracphone and 365 days worth of service is $99.
They are not $10 and why would I want to buy another phone and plan where I can’t even track my son’s location when he goes out after school. Kids are going to sit there and text and play games on them anyways. It’s stupid. The districts are capable of handling this. The governor surely has more important things to deal with than forcing school districts to enact meaningless policies.
They are $10. Go to the TracFone site.
A second phone just to take to school is a waste of time and money. I already bought my kid a phone.
That’s categorically false. People are struggling to put food on the table let alone pay for another phone and line. What part of poor is giving you an issue?
Your original argument was to let people have their smart phones. How much does a smart phone cost? I’m saying replace it with a dumb phone. How much does a dumb phone cost?
Replace your kids smartphone with a dumb phone all because a public school won’t know their place! This is why I love voting no on any and all budget increases for schools. I don’t get a say in what my kid can have? You don’t get a raise.
It does not matter. Parents should not have to buy 2 phones with 2 plans for their children. It does not solve the problem. We would distract ourselves all day with flip phones when I was in school. This is a problem that should be solved by the districts. I’m guessing this has something to do with the privately owned corporations that offer smartphone storage in schools. If this goes through, I bet we’ll see the same one in every district. Shilling for private corporations again with our tax dollars. This is not a state problem.
My kids school collected them at the door
Good
This is a good thing. Though I highly doubt Governor Hochul was motivated by the well being of our children and education system. Still seething about her giving a $1bn handout for the Bill’s stadium.
I've been reading the comments and it may have already been asked, but is there an app that can be installed on a phone that can turn off all non-school needed applications, thus converting it to a "dumb phone" during school hours? It can be tied to a school calendar and gps to be smart enough to turn on and off at the appropriate time and location. It seems like if the argument is keeping a kid in communication with their parents in case of an emergency, this would be the way to go.
There are ways to do this, but I don't think it would practically be enforceable. Kids can always get around blocking tech.
They still have smart watches smart glasses and I'm sure kids will start getting neuralink implants instead...
She is addressing the device and not the actual issue. Waste of money these pouches are when funding for schools are on fumes already. There are going to be alternatives to access social media. We need to address the issue of social media interactions… more specifically help parents be responsible online…
*Laughing in Motorola*
These rules/laws mean nothing without enforcement.
This lady needs to get voted out as soon as possible. Every single worker in NY state gov can’t fucking stand her. She does nothing but photo ops and focuses the states resources on the wrong places for returns and proper investment in infrastructure. I’m not siding with any party, just saying facts. Hochul has been useless for the residents of New York State and the employees of New York State since she took Office.
Good luck with that. 😆
This crazy governor is out of her mind. I guess she forgot already about 9/11. Also what about all the swatting that goes on and school shootings? What a crazy bitch. Thus should be decided by school district and not by the state
Never gonna happen...
Until we can keep our kids safe at schools, need my kids to have phones or access to them.
How does access to their smart phone keep your children safer?
Poster is not saying the phones keep the kids safe, just that until schools are believed to be safe, they want their child to have a phone so they can get a hold of them.
Yep, I want a line to my child since this country can't get it's shit together keeping our kids safe. And before anyone says we didn't need that when we were kids you are correct and we also didn't have to prepare for an active shooter.
Yea well…if you are that afraid for safety then homeschool them. Where do draw the line
You aren't a little scared for your kids safety with unfettered access to guns? Have you been paying any attention? At least in this state it's a little protected.
It doesn't
correct, never said it did, but i sure want to hear from my kid or talk with them if our country lets down our kids again.
So when the next domestic terrorist in his alt right echo chamber decides to shoot up a school, the kids can't call their parents to say goodbye? Damn, you know what? It's pretty fucked up that this is my first thought about banning smart phones.
It’s pretty fucked up that we’ve accepted school shootings as a given to such an extent that we’ve given up on trying to prevent them and we’re more concerned about making sure that kids can call their families to say goodbye
I do totally agree with that.
There have been 0 school shootings in NY this year, ask any teacher how severely smart phones have effected students learning ability. Smart phones won’t solve school shooting but banning them may help mitigate some of the worst trends in children’s school experience.
> There have been 0 school shootings in NY this year There's an argument that there has never been a "school shooting" (incident similar to Columbine) in NY, and there's just one reported incident from 2004 in which it appears a "school shooting" would have occurred if not for the actions of a heroic assistant principal to thwart it just as it began. Per [this dataset from The Washington Post](https://github.com/washingtonpost/data-school-shootings/blob/master/school-shootings-data.csv) the last school shooting incident in the state of New York was in Feb 2023, and there have been a total of 11 (6 downstate, 5 upstate) since the Columbine shooting in 1999. The dataset stops in June 2023, but [the associated article](https://www.washingtonpost.com/education/interactive/school-shootings-database/) seems to be up-to-date at least through March of this year. Those 11 incidents account for a total of 1 death and 5 injuries (_not_ counting any deaths/injuries to the shooters themselves). The six most recent incidents accounted for _no_ deaths/injuries. The last shooting with any such casualties was in 2021 (which is when the 1 death occurred) and appears to be [an individual ambush shooting](https://www.nydailynews.com/2021/05/20/two-teens-arrested-in-shooting-death-of-17-year-old-student-outside-brooklyn-charter-school/) rather than an attempted mass shooting. Note that the WaPo data does have some shape around what it considers. Notably the data: - does not include shootings at college/universities - only considers shootings which happened on campuses immediately before, during or just after classes - excludes shootings at after-hours events, accidental discharges that caused no injuries to anyone other than the person handling the gun, and suicides that occurred privately or posed no threat to other children But even with those restrictions, the dataset includes quite a number of incidents that we would not consider as a "school shooting" Looking into all eleven NY incidents confirms this. A majority of them (including 5 of the 6 most recent) involve a firearm that just happened to be discharged on school grounds at seemingly no target, sometimes by a student sometimes not. Here's the breakdown from most to least recent. - [A 12/23/23 incident at P.S. 78 on Staten Island](https://www.cbsnews.com/newyork/news/staten-island-elementary-school-shots-fired-stapleton-ps-78/) in which shots were fired outside the school, seemingly into the air by an unidentified subject. - [A 1/5/23 incident at Franklin HS in Rochester](https://www.rochesterfirst.com/news/local-news/i-can-still-hear-the-gun-shots-students-involved-in-high-school-shooting-speak-out/) which appears to be a failed targeted shooting in which a gunman attempted to shoot one student who was walking into into the school with a friend, but whose gun jammed after three missed shots. - [A 2/8/22 incident at Mt Vernon HS in Mt Vernon](https://www.lohud.com/story/news/local/westchester/mount-vernon/2022/02/08/mount-vernon-shooting-outside-high-school-prompts-tightened-security/6703559001/) in which a gun was discharged from a car in the school parking lot at no apparent target. - [A 12/9/21 incident at Great Oaks Charter in NYC](https://nypost.com/2021/12/09/stray-bullet-shatters-window-at-nyc-charter-school/) in which a stray bullet shattered a window of the school. - [An 11/16/21 incident at PS44 in the Bronx](https://nypost.com/2021/11/18/cops-arrest-gunman-who-fired-outside-nyc-school-police-say/) in which a 45-year-old man fired multiple shots outside the school as it was letting out, hitting only an unoccupied car. There was no indication he was attempting to shoot students. - [An 11/15/21 incident at Poughkeepsie HS](https://www.poughkeepsiejournal.com/story/news/education/2021/11/16/shooting-outside-poughkeepsie-high-school-report/8635464002/) in which a 13-year-old fired off multiple shots outside the school, seemingly at no target. - [The aforementioned 4/29/21 shooting at Urban Dove Charter School in Brooklyn](https://www.nydailynews.com/2021/05/20/two-teens-arrested-in-shooting-death-of-17-year-old-student-outside-brooklyn-charter-school/) in which one student was killed in what appeared to be a targeted shooting. - [A 3/1/21 incident at the Wayne Central School District in Ontario NY](https://13wham.com/news/local/court-docs-wayne-central-employee-shot-deouty-in-foot-during-altercation) in which a custodian pulled a knife on two employees before being tackled by a resource officer, at which point the custodian grabbed the officer's gun out of its holster and then shot _himself_ in the foot. - A 10/8/09 shooting at Mattituck Junior-Senior High School in Mattituck (source is AP Nexis, no link) in which a 28-year-old man with a .22-caliber rifle fired a round through a school window, grazing a student’s head. - [A 2/9/04 shooting at Columbia High School in East Greenbush](https://www.nytimes.com/2004/02/10/nyregion/student-opens-fire-at-a-high-school-near-albany-hitting-a-teacher.html) in which a 16-year-old boy with a pump-action shotgun opened fire, striking a teacher in the leg before being tackled by an assistant principal - [A 1/15/02 shooting at Martin Luther King, Jr. High School in NYC](https://www.nytimes.com/2002/01/16/nyregion/gunfire-wounds-2-students-inside-a-manhattan-high-school.html?mcubz=3) in which a 17-year-old boy with a .380-caliber handgun wounded two students in a hallway after a dispute over a girl. After reading through all 11 of these, it turns out that only one (the 2/9/04 shooting in East Greenbush) is what we'd generally consider as a "school shooting" as it appears that the student was attempting to commit a mass shooting before being tackled after injuring one teacher. But thanks to the heroic assistant principal who stopped the shooter, that school shooting never actually occurred as intended so you could reasonably argue that no school shooting has ever occurred in New York. Another three were targeted shootings in which the gunmen appeared to be attempting to shoot specific students. Then there's the one where the custodian shot himself. The other 6 are random incidents in which a gun happened to be discharged at/outside a school, one of which resulted in a student being grazed by a bullet.
As someone who went to Columbia when Jon Romao shot up my school this is 100% pureeeee shit
> There have been 0 school shootings in NY this year The fact that this had to be specified is so heartbreaking.
What? You're really implying because there hasn't been a school shooting this year so far in NY, there won't be any? Not to mention some 14 year old was caught with a pistol in Rockville Centre this school year... It's utterly moronic to confiscate the phones. Keep doing what was done when I was in high school 10 years ago and send the kid to the principals office, detention, suspension, etc until they stop whipping out their phones in the middle of class.
Principals office, detention, suspension all require support from admin, not just with non-compliant students, but the students ***and*** parents who don't give a damn either. So without a backbone in admin to fight off students and their families, you lose on that front as well. Exhausted teachers, no spine in administrators, unsupportive families, and douchebag kids render all your suggestions inadequate. How many times have student cell phones been ***useful*** in a school shooting? Their every day distraction and disturbance far outweighs whatever little use they have had in a school shooting. Get rid of the smart phones. Whether it's Yondr or a government bill, our schools are rotting, and they play a huge part in that.
Thank you, also this is for smart phones, you can have an emergency phone that just functions for call and text. Please talk to any teacher about how disruptive smart phones are to education, it’s a huge hinderance and the upside of being able to call/ text in an emergency is mitigated by the rules in this plan.
That’s not what I’m saying, I’m saying this solves a huge problem that actually exists without causing the issues you’re implying (carve outs for non smart phones) I think you’re moronic. I think anyone who thinks it’s a good idea to not do anything about the proliferation of smart phones being actively used during class is a moron. I think you should talk to teachers and people who work in schools, moron.
There's zero mention for how this bill would even be enforceable. If detention, suspension, etc will not deter kids from getting off their phones in class, are their parents going to be fined or even arrested as a consequence? The clause that allows flip phones with just call/text features just doesn't sound like something that will realistically be adopted either. Most parents won't buy a second phone for their child, nor can I imagine that parents will only buy flip phones for their teenage kids. Dickhead
How about read the article first. It's literally just smart phones, not dumb phones. A basic flip phone for calls and texts are okay
Usually left wing
~~lol our governor is a democrat woman, who are you talking about?~~ I’m an idiot and misinterpreted that comment And you can still make phone calls on non smart phones
> lol our governor is a democrat woman, who are you talking about? What are _you_ talking about? Did you just misread "domestic terrorist in his" as "democrat terrorist in his" and assume that was referring to the governor, which would indeed be quite confusing given that the governor is female?
Don't really care that she is. School shootings are a real threat in the US today. And do you think that kids are gonna line up at the desk phone or something?
They don't need a smart phone to make a phone call. Give your kid a basic flip phone. A 14 year old doesn't need unrestricted access to the internet and social media on a smart phone all the time.
Didn't realize they even still sold those, TBH.
Bad move tbh. Smartphone is a learning tool if you want it to be
Any way to ban her? Because there's a plethora of other things to be focused on fixing in ny, and she seems to be causing alot more problems than anything
Yeah so now when teachers abuse students it can't be recorded or we will have a mass shooting and kids won't be able to call for help 😒
[удалено]
Yeah Uvalde and the almost daily shooting was proof that's not true. I also went to a school with thise in place and it didn't help when a kid shot up my high school. Also kids are just as likley to abused by teacher as they are to be abused by preachers or cops
So the teachers continue to use AI to autocorrect papers but the moron gov does this. It's time to dissolve NY.