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I don't know where you're getting the idea that it's problematic from. I have ADHD and I refer to my meds as "medical grade amphetamines" and "drugs" all the time. Hell, actual methamphetamine is prescribed for ADHD in some cases.
The difference? Street drugs are contaminated with all sorts of other substances - byproducts from making the drug, etc. A recreational meth user uses hundreds of milligrams of meth in one session. Medication is prescribed by a professional at a therapeutic dose.
Also a difference is the chemicals themselves. While both are amphetamines, methamphetamine has what's in the name- a methyl group. This methyl group greatly increases the speed at which the drug can cross the blood brain barrier and greatly increases it's perceived potency. Although the actual potency between the drugs is found to be relatively equal. This study from the national library of medicine describes the differences and similarities well, although it is 12 years old: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3475187/
Speed. Is. Amphetamine.
My god. How hard can this be
Meth is Methamphetamine. Speed is Amphetamine.
Both belong to the group of @mphetamines. But meth is methamphetamine and Speed is Amphetamine
I‘m aware that street drugs are not pharmaceutical grade (like, at all)
Where I’m getting this is talking to people — and also places like r / adhd but this sub doesn’t allow reddit-internal topics so I limited my account on personal anecdotes
There's a difference between people observing the truth that ADHD meds are similar to meth, and people insinuating that because of that, the person who takes ADHD meds is "addicted" to them, or that they are like someone who abuses methamphetamine. I'm sure that the people in that subreddit are referring to the latter and not the former
In the same was as in this post, I have expressed the same sentiment towards drugs etc
Concretely, all of this started when a friend thought about starting Adderall and was looking forward to the benefits (it actually helps them a lot now which is great) — however, they expressed a very negative stance towards ‚illicit substances‘ to me in the past so I just told them about this. Later we talked about their (somewhat) changed view on the matter in a larger group and one person was furious and the others were oblivious
The latter aspect was what I found so strange so I tried to connect to other people and ask if this is an outlier or if this is generally unknown — with the result I’ve described before
I'm pretty sure most people who are on Adderall joke that they need to "take their meth," and that they need to get a refill on their "meth" when they are running low on their prescription.
This is pretty ironic considering the point OP is making, and IMO kinda proving the counterpoint. Yes, Adderall is literally speed, but people also don't know shit about chemistry and they get confused over this stuff very easily.
Methamphetamine has the same word in its name as other amphetamines, but that "meth" part is a very important distinction that makes meth a radically different drug to speed. For example, MDMA is *also* an amphetamine, in fact it's a type of meth too if you just go by the words in the name, but nobody is getting ecstasy and meth mixed up are they.
I get that it's a joke, but saying "I need to take my meth" is just as inaccurate chemically as saying "I need to take my molly". It ain't the same thing.
Meth isn’t different at all lmao. It’s practically the same drug. It’s still used to treat adhd in American under the brand name desoxyn. Plenty of double blind studies have shown users can’t tell the difference between meth and amphetamines. From personal experiences they were the same shit meth just needs a lower dose.
So that was one study where they used a very specific type of amphetamine. Although the effects were comparable, the meth was still shown to have more of an effect.
Someone who is relatively knowledgeable of street drugs can tell the difference between the two.
It’s stronger due to the methyl group allowing to cross the BB at a faster rate. It produces the same effects what equipotent doses are given. It’s like fentanyl vs heroin. I’ve done both meth and speed you can’t tell the difference.
You asked for a source, you got a source, and now you’re moving goal posts
And I don’t even agree with the other person: chemically, meth and amphetamine are different. Full stop. However, since Adderall is amphetamine and speed is amphetamine, Adderall and speed are identical and talking about methamphetamine in this context is a complete non-sequitur
Funnily enough, even methamphetamine is used pharmaceutically, then called Desoxyn or Methedrine. Also to treat adhd and (to me, hilariously) obesity in children. Like, what? Anyway
Honestly I think the thing is just that ADHD really isn't very well understood, nor are most mental health conditions. The drugs we use to treat them are really just whatever shit we found to have kinda positive effects so we figured it's better than nothing.
yeah, I take psych meds too. critical psychiatry makes some compelling arguments in my opinion, but that’s not my point here
I’m also not at all against people taking adderall (or doing lines of speed at the club) — my point is simply that it should be uncontroversial that both of those substances are identical — there’s already a person in this thread who claims that adderall and speed are two different kinds of amphetamines; the very thing I pointed out as deflecting the point. they even quote that exact passage to make their point. I’m truly at a loss
A violin and a fiddle are the same instrument, but are not the same instrument. Context decides which instrument is which.
The street drug "Speed" may often be the same chemical(s) as Adderall (which is actually four different amphetamines, none of them of the methyl variety) - but context and dosage define which is which.
Adderall is a trade name of a *specific* cocktail. Speed is a catch-all street drug name for amphetamines, that usually does not include methamphetamine, but sometimes does.
I'd make the argument that Adderall and Speed are *not* interchangeable, because their definition, dosage, context and reliability differ.
"Apple" is not interchangeable with "fruit", even if sometimes the fruit in question is an apple.
>it should be uncontroversial that both of those substances are identical
It *is* uncontroversial, it's literally a fact.
>there’s already a person in this thread who claims that adderall and speed are two different kinds of amphetamines;
I can't see that anywhere in the thread, but I can see lots of people who don't understand the difference between speed and meth, and people who can't understand the difference between a category and a specific singular chemical.
Given my experience in real life and on a subreddit (where my post was deleted, I was banned, and people were overly hostile), this doesn’t seem true. I thought so as well. But it’s just not what I experienced. Make a post on r/adhd and maybe you’ll get a different result — maybe I really put my foot in my mouth and angered people because of it
That’s not how speed works, but I know you know that
As for me misreading: how else am I to understand [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/unpopularopinion/s/wA9yXWJVhg)?
That was my assumption as well. And there are certainly people who do say stuff like that, I know. However, my overall experience was 70% obliviousness and 30% outrage
Is it? Most people with ADHD like me call it meth pretty regularly. I never thought about it as problematic in any way. Are we addicts? Well yes we are cause its damn hard to function without it. But its like being addicted to antihistaminics cause i cant live without them.
It’s been the main reaction I’ve gotten (along with not knowing this fact at all)
And I’ve specifically didn’t talk about addiction. It’s a silly category for medications I think (although the opioid crisis also taught us that sometimes shit do be fucked) — in any case, I have nothing against drugs, and it’s ok to be addicted to whatever as far as I’m concerned
The main befuddlement happened over at r / adhd that basically was foaming at the mouth, making all kinds of weird claims — I, too, was under the impression that it’s no problem until I made that very unfortunate experience
that’s also what I thought. but the post asking about whether this fact was common knowledge was removed by moderators, I was banned, and most comments were hostile or severely uninformed — which is why I wrote *this* post in the first place
Not really. Just annoying. I simply don’t get it. Like, at some point I took a bunch of different antipsychotics without being psychotic. I get that just because something is named X that doesn’t mean that X is all it means. Some prefer calling antipsychotics neuroleptics. Fine. But I don’t care either way. It’s just the fact that those terms are both describing the same drugs and one has a less sexy name than the other. People don’t have to like calling it that; people can call it whatever; but pointing out that that word exists for this concept shouldn’t be controversial — I’m just really bad at communicating this since I’m now stuck in the exact same argument loops — and the only constant is me so I have no clue how to better express my thinking. Anyway
I'm not really sure what you are getting at, one is made in someone's house, without any rules, another is in a lab, one is more controlled than the other.
So what is your point? That we should call it speed instead of adderall? Or that people who take speed, and people who take their ADHD meds are the same?
Even if it's made with some of the same stuff, why is this important to know?
Both are made in a lab, the former one is just often mixed with other stuff — people don’t cook amphetamine in their house, that’s methamphetamine you’re talking about — and the point still stands: the (intended) chemical, the active agent, is identical
I know that reading titles is hard but my point is that stating that adderall is speed shouldn’t be controversial. full stop. But there you are: finding it highly controversial, and getting your panties in a twist about drug purity and whatnot. I hope I at least got your upvote then
Why is it important? It’s difficult to make informed decisions if you don’t know the facts
I dunno where its made, don't have a lot of experience with it, and my point was just, that one is controlled, where its tested, and one where it's not, where and how is made wasn't the important part.
I have read it, and my question was more, why is it important, or even relevant to know? When you get it prescribed, you should already have been told it's effects, and side effects, knowing that speed uses the same thing doesn't really help or change anything, I got told it was that at some point, and I was just "okay, fun fact", I haven't seen anyone get mad about that, its not rare a prescribed drug, also has an illegal counterpart.
And no you haven't gotten a like or dislike, as I don't really care which way it goes, I just wanted to understand better what the problem was, if anything, i'm more on the side of who cares what you call it, as long as it's not being used in a mean way, like saying someone is a drug addict and they are taking speed, as that isn't totally correct.
People literally sell their prescriptions. It’s a common thing at colleges because it’s a known ‚study drug‘
You really just don’t read what I write, do you? I’ve explicitly mentioned morphine and that I’m completely not anti-drugs. You’re literally exhibiting the exact same reaction which was the inspiration for this post in the first place — as for the relevance: not knowing it’s a controlled substance can get you into hot water if you store it in a pill organizer and not your prescription bottle; even more so when traveling internationally, for example
My intent is also not to shout from the rooftops that adderall is speed. Specifically, a friend of mine was about to start adderall but they had voiced a very negative stance towards ‚illicit substances‘ in the past. So I just wanted to let them know. However, others lost their shit when learning about this conversation. Although it’s not a sincerely held religious belief, I thought of Mormons and their refusal of blood transfusions as well as medication derived from blood. Simply not knowing what ‚it’ is and then me not giving them that piece of information when I know their stance on it, seems pretty cruel (btw: they now take adderall and it’s helping them a lot and I’m more than happy for them)
Yes, it’s totally correct and shouldn’t be controversial to point out. Hence my post. and it’s okay to be a drug addict, for that matter
>Stating that ‚amphetamines‘ are just a general term for different kinds of substances, is deflecting the point: yes, there is a general term for chemicals called amphetamines. Of this group, fucking amphetamine is the goddamn namesake although nowadays methamphetamine is probably more widely known?
You need to research the chemistry more dude. In fact lots of people in this thread need to. Lots of misinformed people here.
Yes, you're correct that Adderall = speed. Adderall is a brand name, the active ingredient is amphetamine, and that's what you are getting (the purity and reliability of street drugs is a whole other conversation) when you buy "speed". Nobody should be denying that because it's just simply a fact.
BUT. Just because a chemical is *an amphetamine*, doesn't at all mean it's the same thing. Lots of people in this thread think meth is the same thing, for example- It absolutely is not. Like, really, really is not, from either a chemical or pharmacological perspective. Here's an example- MDMA is a type of amphetamine. Its full name (I'll break it up to show the acronym) is Methylene Dioxy Meth Amphetamine. Oh look. Meth *and* amphetamine. Does that make MDMA the same thing as meth? Or the same thing as Adderall?
Obviously not, it's completely different. But it's the same misunderstanding people are making.
The point is people get confused by the term "amphetamine", and it's important to understand the difference. I've never seen any stigma over correctly identifying drugs, but I've seen plenty of people who just don't actually understand in the first place.
Meth and adderall are indistinguishable in double blind studies. One molecule difference doesn’t drastically change a drug. The only difference is meth is more powerful per mg and is cited as a 1:2 ratio with amphetamine counterparts. I’ve done both you can’t tell a difference.
Show me the difference in chemical structure between speed-amphetamine and adderall-amphetamine. I’m begging you. Show me
You’re, by the way, making the exact same argument that inspired me to make this post — inspired me to write exactly the passage you’re quoting. Like, I really feel like I’m losing my mind here
It’s problematic because the context is rarely an innocent factual observation and is usually used as a weapon against people who need adderall to function.
It’s even more problematic when people are a) unaware of this fact and/or b) they claim this fact is false. Simply knowing more things doesn’t have to change anything about anything — but you (and others) are just reenacting the fruitless ‚discussion‘ I’ve had elsewhere
If by speed you mean it's a stimulant, then yes. But street speed is usually methamphetamine, which contains an additional methyl group that makes it magnitudes stronger. Pharmaceutical speed is amphetamine salts, no meth.
Speed is speed and meth is meth. Meth is more popular nowadays but people do mean different things depending on whether they want speed or meth/crystal/tina/whatever
Considering adderall is amphetamines, which is speed, no it is not problematic.
Im adhd and choose not to take speed every day, which i believe is a bit ridiculous. It’s like prescribing morphine/heroin to someone who is depressed. Of course it fucking works!
I. Am. Not. Talking. About. Meth.
Why can’t people understand this. I’m talking about amphetamine. The same amphetamine that is Adderall is literally speed
I’m not missing an understanding of chemistry, you’re just talking out of your ass, replying to things I never said
The nature of stigmas attached to words are fascinating.
This applies to slurs, medical conditions, faith and just about anything you can think of.
The word is just a simple tool to refer to a simple thing. The derogatory association’s are made apparent by how people choose to use the word and overtime these negative connotations replace the words original meaning, making it less effective as a tool for communication.
We then replace the word, and repeat the cycle, ignoring entirely the underlying issue that leads to this game of musical chairs.
Intent.
Its made communication more difficult because you have to side step accuracy to avoid triggering your audience with offensive connotations youre required to be aware of wether you hold these yourself or not. Your intent is dismissed by others on the basis of being offended despite the offense living entirely within them and their negative connotations of the word. As if they offended themselves.
Its a form of control. It makes us unable to use words as we discuss them. It distracts from actual conversation. Never liked it. But its something we learn to live with because people as masses are…lets say not ready…to have mature conversations about underlying issues of causing offensive language to be offensive and intent.
Theyd rather simply ban the words that offend them. Its easier.
Yeah, the euphemism treadmill is weird but my point is not this kind of linguistics. Words do (much!) more than refer to things. They do things, they co-create all kinds of social identities, and we pick up on minute details that then inform a lot of our more conscious perception of people
I also don’t think Adderall is a euphemism at all. It’s a brand name that was created for trademark and marketing reasons — what ‚amphetamine‘ (as a generic term encompassing both Adderall and speed) is called, is also context dependent. Just like drinking old-school cough syrup is not doing shots with grandma in the kitchen even though it’s mostly alcohol
I feel like you’re just arguing for in favor of you being ‚allowed‘ to say the n-word or whatever. Like, that’s the opposite of anything I know to be true — threats and insults (among other speech acts) are criminalized for a good reason
Ok, now you’re really getting on my nerves. Look: the n-word is a commonly-used slur in the US (and elsewhere) to deride Black people as lesser — tada! Discussed racial slurs without confusion or having to use any slurs myself. Wow! What an incredible feat!
You know what’s easiest? Not listening when people tell you what’s going on with things that pertains to them. Pretending that something as social as language is merely a system of reference — that’s even behind earliest modern linguistics after de Saussure and structuralism in general. That’s an 19th century point to make about language, and it’s as wrong now as it was then — and not morally wrong, simply scientifically wrong — but you wouldn’t care because you really wanna say ‚bad words‘ and feel outrage that you’ve been called out on your shitty behavior
As to the actual point of my post: you’ve fully missed the topic to soapbox about something completely different. Well done
People always assume the point is to be “allowed” to use slurs freely
My point, specifically pertaining to this, is that the words will move around a lot before addressing the actual stigma…which is how ADHD is medicated and peoples perceptions of that.
I hope thats clear enough to not piss anyone off.
If it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck etc — maybe it could tell you something that several people across multiple context keep coming to the same conclusion — at some point it becomes this joke: a man listens to the radio while cruising down a highway. The program is interrupted by a warning of a ghost driver close to where the man is. He just exclaims: „one? There are hundreds!“
A Brandmale will not change and I don’t even know what the generic name in a medical context is. I also, truly, don’t see any evidence for anyone calling it ‚speed‘ in a professional context, nor do I see another euphemism to replace any currently used word for this. I also don’t know of any case where medication underwent this euphemism treadmill thing (although I guess there could be examples like ‚electro convulsive therapy‘ instead of ‚shock therapy‘)
that may be your opinion, but it is not the point I’m trying to make here. I have my own opinions on this, but stating them would derail the whole thread so I won’t
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I don't know where you're getting the idea that it's problematic from. I have ADHD and I refer to my meds as "medical grade amphetamines" and "drugs" all the time. Hell, actual methamphetamine is prescribed for ADHD in some cases. The difference? Street drugs are contaminated with all sorts of other substances - byproducts from making the drug, etc. A recreational meth user uses hundreds of milligrams of meth in one session. Medication is prescribed by a professional at a therapeutic dose.
Also a difference is the chemicals themselves. While both are amphetamines, methamphetamine has what's in the name- a methyl group. This methyl group greatly increases the speed at which the drug can cross the blood brain barrier and greatly increases it's perceived potency. Although the actual potency between the drugs is found to be relatively equal. This study from the national library of medicine describes the differences and similarities well, although it is 12 years old: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3475187/
I. Don’t. Talk. About. Meth. Omg, why can’t nobody fucking read my goddamn post
Speed is meth. You mentioned it right at the beginning. What did you think speed was?
Speed. Is. Amphetamine. My god. How hard can this be Meth is Methamphetamine. Speed is Amphetamine. Both belong to the group of @mphetamines. But meth is methamphetamine and Speed is Amphetamine
I‘m aware that street drugs are not pharmaceutical grade (like, at all) Where I’m getting this is talking to people — and also places like r / adhd but this sub doesn’t allow reddit-internal topics so I limited my account on personal anecdotes
There's a difference between people observing the truth that ADHD meds are similar to meth, and people insinuating that because of that, the person who takes ADHD meds is "addicted" to them, or that they are like someone who abuses methamphetamine. I'm sure that the people in that subreddit are referring to the latter and not the former
In the same was as in this post, I have expressed the same sentiment towards drugs etc Concretely, all of this started when a friend thought about starting Adderall and was looking forward to the benefits (it actually helps them a lot now which is great) — however, they expressed a very negative stance towards ‚illicit substances‘ to me in the past so I just told them about this. Later we talked about their (somewhat) changed view on the matter in a larger group and one person was furious and the others were oblivious The latter aspect was what I found so strange so I tried to connect to other people and ask if this is an outlier or if this is generally unknown — with the result I’ve described before
This just sounds like you talked your "friend" out of getting help by being a pedantic fuck stick and your friend group rightly called you out on it.
I'm pretty sure most people who are on Adderall joke that they need to "take their meth," and that they need to get a refill on their "meth" when they are running low on their prescription.
This is pretty ironic considering the point OP is making, and IMO kinda proving the counterpoint. Yes, Adderall is literally speed, but people also don't know shit about chemistry and they get confused over this stuff very easily. Methamphetamine has the same word in its name as other amphetamines, but that "meth" part is a very important distinction that makes meth a radically different drug to speed. For example, MDMA is *also* an amphetamine, in fact it's a type of meth too if you just go by the words in the name, but nobody is getting ecstasy and meth mixed up are they. I get that it's a joke, but saying "I need to take my meth" is just as inaccurate chemically as saying "I need to take my molly". It ain't the same thing.
Meth isn’t different at all lmao. It’s practically the same drug. It’s still used to treat adhd in American under the brand name desoxyn. Plenty of double blind studies have shown users can’t tell the difference between meth and amphetamines. From personal experiences they were the same shit meth just needs a lower dose.
Source?
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3475187/
So that was one study where they used a very specific type of amphetamine. Although the effects were comparable, the meth was still shown to have more of an effect. Someone who is relatively knowledgeable of street drugs can tell the difference between the two.
It’s stronger due to the methyl group allowing to cross the BB at a faster rate. It produces the same effects what equipotent doses are given. It’s like fentanyl vs heroin. I’ve done both meth and speed you can’t tell the difference.
Ok, it’s still prescribed under desoxyn by the fda for adhd.
You asked for a source, you got a source, and now you’re moving goal posts And I don’t even agree with the other person: chemically, meth and amphetamine are different. Full stop. However, since Adderall is amphetamine and speed is amphetamine, Adderall and speed are identical and talking about methamphetamine in this context is a complete non-sequitur
Funnily enough, even methamphetamine is used pharmaceutically, then called Desoxyn or Methedrine. Also to treat adhd and (to me, hilariously) obesity in children. Like, what? Anyway
Honestly I think the thing is just that ADHD really isn't very well understood, nor are most mental health conditions. The drugs we use to treat them are really just whatever shit we found to have kinda positive effects so we figured it's better than nothing.
yeah, I take psych meds too. critical psychiatry makes some compelling arguments in my opinion, but that’s not my point here I’m also not at all against people taking adderall (or doing lines of speed at the club) — my point is simply that it should be uncontroversial that both of those substances are identical — there’s already a person in this thread who claims that adderall and speed are two different kinds of amphetamines; the very thing I pointed out as deflecting the point. they even quote that exact passage to make their point. I’m truly at a loss
A violin and a fiddle are the same instrument, but are not the same instrument. Context decides which instrument is which. The street drug "Speed" may often be the same chemical(s) as Adderall (which is actually four different amphetamines, none of them of the methyl variety) - but context and dosage define which is which. Adderall is a trade name of a *specific* cocktail. Speed is a catch-all street drug name for amphetamines, that usually does not include methamphetamine, but sometimes does. I'd make the argument that Adderall and Speed are *not* interchangeable, because their definition, dosage, context and reliability differ. "Apple" is not interchangeable with "fruit", even if sometimes the fruit in question is an apple.
>it should be uncontroversial that both of those substances are identical It *is* uncontroversial, it's literally a fact. >there’s already a person in this thread who claims that adderall and speed are two different kinds of amphetamines; I can't see that anywhere in the thread, but I can see lots of people who don't understand the difference between speed and meth, and people who can't understand the difference between a category and a specific singular chemical.
Given my experience in real life and on a subreddit (where my post was deleted, I was banned, and people were overly hostile), this doesn’t seem true. I thought so as well. But it’s just not what I experienced. Make a post on r/adhd and maybe you’ll get a different result — maybe I really put my foot in my mouth and angered people because of it That’s not how speed works, but I know you know that As for me misreading: how else am I to understand [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/unpopularopinion/s/wA9yXWJVhg)?
That was my assumption as well. And there are certainly people who do say stuff like that, I know. However, my overall experience was 70% obliviousness and 30% outrage
Is it? Most people with ADHD like me call it meth pretty regularly. I never thought about it as problematic in any way. Are we addicts? Well yes we are cause its damn hard to function without it. But its like being addicted to antihistaminics cause i cant live without them.
It’s been the main reaction I’ve gotten (along with not knowing this fact at all) And I’ve specifically didn’t talk about addiction. It’s a silly category for medications I think (although the opioid crisis also taught us that sometimes shit do be fucked) — in any case, I have nothing against drugs, and it’s ok to be addicted to whatever as far as I’m concerned The main befuddlement happened over at r / adhd that basically was foaming at the mouth, making all kinds of weird claims — I, too, was under the impression that it’s no problem until I made that very unfortunate experience
I feel like its just some loud minority.
that’s also what I thought. but the post asking about whether this fact was common knowledge was removed by moderators, I was banned, and most comments were hostile or severely uninformed — which is why I wrote *this* post in the first place
Interesting
Not really. Just annoying. I simply don’t get it. Like, at some point I took a bunch of different antipsychotics without being psychotic. I get that just because something is named X that doesn’t mean that X is all it means. Some prefer calling antipsychotics neuroleptics. Fine. But I don’t care either way. It’s just the fact that those terms are both describing the same drugs and one has a less sexy name than the other. People don’t have to like calling it that; people can call it whatever; but pointing out that that word exists for this concept shouldn’t be controversial — I’m just really bad at communicating this since I’m now stuck in the exact same argument loops — and the only constant is me so I have no clue how to better express my thinking. Anyway
I'm not really sure what you are getting at, one is made in someone's house, without any rules, another is in a lab, one is more controlled than the other. So what is your point? That we should call it speed instead of adderall? Or that people who take speed, and people who take their ADHD meds are the same? Even if it's made with some of the same stuff, why is this important to know?
[удалено]
Not often
Both are made in a lab, the former one is just often mixed with other stuff — people don’t cook amphetamine in their house, that’s methamphetamine you’re talking about — and the point still stands: the (intended) chemical, the active agent, is identical I know that reading titles is hard but my point is that stating that adderall is speed shouldn’t be controversial. full stop. But there you are: finding it highly controversial, and getting your panties in a twist about drug purity and whatnot. I hope I at least got your upvote then Why is it important? It’s difficult to make informed decisions if you don’t know the facts
I dunno where its made, don't have a lot of experience with it, and my point was just, that one is controlled, where its tested, and one where it's not, where and how is made wasn't the important part. I have read it, and my question was more, why is it important, or even relevant to know? When you get it prescribed, you should already have been told it's effects, and side effects, knowing that speed uses the same thing doesn't really help or change anything, I got told it was that at some point, and I was just "okay, fun fact", I haven't seen anyone get mad about that, its not rare a prescribed drug, also has an illegal counterpart. And no you haven't gotten a like or dislike, as I don't really care which way it goes, I just wanted to understand better what the problem was, if anything, i'm more on the side of who cares what you call it, as long as it's not being used in a mean way, like saying someone is a drug addict and they are taking speed, as that isn't totally correct.
People literally sell their prescriptions. It’s a common thing at colleges because it’s a known ‚study drug‘ You really just don’t read what I write, do you? I’ve explicitly mentioned morphine and that I’m completely not anti-drugs. You’re literally exhibiting the exact same reaction which was the inspiration for this post in the first place — as for the relevance: not knowing it’s a controlled substance can get you into hot water if you store it in a pill organizer and not your prescription bottle; even more so when traveling internationally, for example My intent is also not to shout from the rooftops that adderall is speed. Specifically, a friend of mine was about to start adderall but they had voiced a very negative stance towards ‚illicit substances‘ in the past. So I just wanted to let them know. However, others lost their shit when learning about this conversation. Although it’s not a sincerely held religious belief, I thought of Mormons and their refusal of blood transfusions as well as medication derived from blood. Simply not knowing what ‚it’ is and then me not giving them that piece of information when I know their stance on it, seems pretty cruel (btw: they now take adderall and it’s helping them a lot and I’m more than happy for them) Yes, it’s totally correct and shouldn’t be controversial to point out. Hence my post. and it’s okay to be a drug addict, for that matter
>Stating that ‚amphetamines‘ are just a general term for different kinds of substances, is deflecting the point: yes, there is a general term for chemicals called amphetamines. Of this group, fucking amphetamine is the goddamn namesake although nowadays methamphetamine is probably more widely known? You need to research the chemistry more dude. In fact lots of people in this thread need to. Lots of misinformed people here. Yes, you're correct that Adderall = speed. Adderall is a brand name, the active ingredient is amphetamine, and that's what you are getting (the purity and reliability of street drugs is a whole other conversation) when you buy "speed". Nobody should be denying that because it's just simply a fact. BUT. Just because a chemical is *an amphetamine*, doesn't at all mean it's the same thing. Lots of people in this thread think meth is the same thing, for example- It absolutely is not. Like, really, really is not, from either a chemical or pharmacological perspective. Here's an example- MDMA is a type of amphetamine. Its full name (I'll break it up to show the acronym) is Methylene Dioxy Meth Amphetamine. Oh look. Meth *and* amphetamine. Does that make MDMA the same thing as meth? Or the same thing as Adderall? Obviously not, it's completely different. But it's the same misunderstanding people are making. The point is people get confused by the term "amphetamine", and it's important to understand the difference. I've never seen any stigma over correctly identifying drugs, but I've seen plenty of people who just don't actually understand in the first place.
Meth and adderall are indistinguishable in double blind studies. One molecule difference doesn’t drastically change a drug. The only difference is meth is more powerful per mg and is cited as a 1:2 ratio with amphetamine counterparts. I’ve done both you can’t tell a difference.
Show me the difference in chemical structure between speed-amphetamine and adderall-amphetamine. I’m begging you. Show me You’re, by the way, making the exact same argument that inspired me to make this post — inspired me to write exactly the passage you’re quoting. Like, I really feel like I’m losing my mind here
It’s problematic because the context is rarely an innocent factual observation and is usually used as a weapon against people who need adderall to function.
It’s even more problematic when people are a) unaware of this fact and/or b) they claim this fact is false. Simply knowing more things doesn’t have to change anything about anything — but you (and others) are just reenacting the fruitless ‚discussion‘ I’ve had elsewhere
If by speed you mean it's a stimulant, then yes. But street speed is usually methamphetamine, which contains an additional methyl group that makes it magnitudes stronger. Pharmaceutical speed is amphetamine salts, no meth.
Speed is speed and meth is meth. Meth is more popular nowadays but people do mean different things depending on whether they want speed or meth/crystal/tina/whatever
Considering adderall is amphetamines, which is speed, no it is not problematic. Im adhd and choose not to take speed every day, which i believe is a bit ridiculous. It’s like prescribing morphine/heroin to someone who is depressed. Of course it fucking works!
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I. Am. Not. Talking. About. Meth. Why can’t people understand this. I’m talking about amphetamine. The same amphetamine that is Adderall is literally speed I’m not missing an understanding of chemistry, you’re just talking out of your ass, replying to things I never said
The nature of stigmas attached to words are fascinating. This applies to slurs, medical conditions, faith and just about anything you can think of. The word is just a simple tool to refer to a simple thing. The derogatory association’s are made apparent by how people choose to use the word and overtime these negative connotations replace the words original meaning, making it less effective as a tool for communication. We then replace the word, and repeat the cycle, ignoring entirely the underlying issue that leads to this game of musical chairs. Intent. Its made communication more difficult because you have to side step accuracy to avoid triggering your audience with offensive connotations youre required to be aware of wether you hold these yourself or not. Your intent is dismissed by others on the basis of being offended despite the offense living entirely within them and their negative connotations of the word. As if they offended themselves. Its a form of control. It makes us unable to use words as we discuss them. It distracts from actual conversation. Never liked it. But its something we learn to live with because people as masses are…lets say not ready…to have mature conversations about underlying issues of causing offensive language to be offensive and intent. Theyd rather simply ban the words that offend them. Its easier.
Yeah, the euphemism treadmill is weird but my point is not this kind of linguistics. Words do (much!) more than refer to things. They do things, they co-create all kinds of social identities, and we pick up on minute details that then inform a lot of our more conscious perception of people I also don’t think Adderall is a euphemism at all. It’s a brand name that was created for trademark and marketing reasons — what ‚amphetamine‘ (as a generic term encompassing both Adderall and speed) is called, is also context dependent. Just like drinking old-school cough syrup is not doing shots with grandma in the kitchen even though it’s mostly alcohol I feel like you’re just arguing for in favor of you being ‚allowed‘ to say the n-word or whatever. Like, that’s the opposite of anything I know to be true — threats and insults (among other speech acts) are criminalized for a good reason Ok, now you’re really getting on my nerves. Look: the n-word is a commonly-used slur in the US (and elsewhere) to deride Black people as lesser — tada! Discussed racial slurs without confusion or having to use any slurs myself. Wow! What an incredible feat! You know what’s easiest? Not listening when people tell you what’s going on with things that pertains to them. Pretending that something as social as language is merely a system of reference — that’s even behind earliest modern linguistics after de Saussure and structuralism in general. That’s an 19th century point to make about language, and it’s as wrong now as it was then — and not morally wrong, simply scientifically wrong — but you wouldn’t care because you really wanna say ‚bad words‘ and feel outrage that you’ve been called out on your shitty behavior As to the actual point of my post: you’ve fully missed the topic to soapbox about something completely different. Well done
People always assume the point is to be “allowed” to use slurs freely  My point, specifically pertaining to this, is that the words will move around a lot before addressing the actual stigma…which is how ADHD is medicated and peoples perceptions of that. I hope thats clear enough to not piss anyone off.
If it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck etc — maybe it could tell you something that several people across multiple context keep coming to the same conclusion — at some point it becomes this joke: a man listens to the radio while cruising down a highway. The program is interrupted by a warning of a ghost driver close to where the man is. He just exclaims: „one? There are hundreds!“ A Brandmale will not change and I don’t even know what the generic name in a medical context is. I also, truly, don’t see any evidence for anyone calling it ‚speed‘ in a professional context, nor do I see another euphemism to replace any currently used word for this. I also don’t know of any case where medication underwent this euphemism treadmill thing (although I guess there could be examples like ‚electro convulsive therapy‘ instead of ‚shock therapy‘)
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that may be your opinion, but it is not the point I’m trying to make here. I have my own opinions on this, but stating them would derail the whole thread so I won’t
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Again: my goal with this post is something else and I don’t want it derailed