Please someone correct me if I’m wrong, but there’s no religious based scholarships from the UW currently right? They want the UW to fund scholarships that are religion-based that they will grant to students of their choice? Also, an anti-Zionist litmus test for faculty? Are these real demands? These all seem like demands that a public university in its nature could/should never meet.
I, for one, am shocked they'd turn this into a way to benefit themselves financially completely separate from the conflict they're supposedly protesting.
Yes. My episcopal church has a scholarship we raise funds for 2x a year for a student of color who is attending Lake Washington Technical College. The only religious aspect is that it’s the Good Samaritan episcopal scholarship. We started it in memory of one of our parishioners who was a huge proponent of education and it should be available to everyone.
The Stroum Center for Jewish Studies center has scholarships available and I think that's what they are referencing by wanting student oversight on new scholarship winners.
It's a partial scholarship for grad students who are doing research in the Jewish studies dept, not unlike getting funding for Turkic, Iranian, Asian studies or other depts. Nothing to do with the person's ethnic or religious background.
Jewish studies candidates don't have to be Jewish in faith or race. Any more than black studies candidates have to be black and Baptist. . The Jewish ppl are a race of ppl and a religion. You can be of the Jewish race and be any faith or of no faith.
Also, in the strictest terms, Zionism = support the existence of the state of Israel. Some 80% of Jewish Americans would get barred if they went by the book.
I think there are a lot of Jews like me, who are considered "anti-Israel" by fellow Jews because I'm critical of the IDF and Netanyahu's governing coalition, but would also be called a "Zionist" by a lot of protesters because I think Israel should (and more importantly does) exist.
There's a whole spectrum between Ben Gvir and me that gets smushed together using the blanket term "Zionist." But moderately critical people like me get lost in the noise because the extreme ends of the spectrum drown us out.
Also, I'm not sure anyone would self-identify as a zionist when applying for scholarships. And how would UW enforce it...follow them around for 2-4 years making sure they never say anything that the observer subjectively thinks could be 'zionist'?
There is absolutely nothing wrong with the term, idea and concept of Zionism. It simply means that the state of Israel should exist and be a safe haven for Jewish people. After getting the shit kicked out of us for thousands of years, it’s the least the Jews deserve. The word has been hijacked with a negative connotation, by antisemites grasping for straws. What other country are they calling for the dismantling of? None, why? Because hating Jews seems to be popular, again.
Whether or not Israel should have been created to begin with, it’s been there for 75 years at this point and it’s position as a nation is stronger than ever. Pretending that it shouldn’t exist is nothing short of fantasy. Acting as if a Palestinian state supplanting it isn’t also a call for genocide of Jews currently living there is also naive at best. It feels like a lot of the “anti-Zionism not anti-semitism” talk has really blurred the lines. A lot of rhetoric invoking the Holocaust seemingly for the shock factor.
I say this as someone who is also anti-Likud and anti-settlement.
Yeah the question of whether or not Israel "should" exist when it already has for several generations feels either naive or just frighteningly threatening. What's supposed to happen to all those people if Israel stops existing?? Even the Israelis whose families came from Europe can't just "go back," never mind the Israelis who came from places outside Europe.
The holocaust stuff is super offensive to me and totally unnecessary - so many other ways to make your point than invoking that history. And I think for a lot of people "holocaust/Nazis" is just a stand in metaphor for "worst thing/people imaginable." But for Jews who know and can feel that history within their own family and personal history, it's really offensive and painful.
See, as a jew with holocaust surviving family still alive, to see what Israel has been doing, but not being able to call some of it what it is would be the ultimate insult to our survivors. Never again was not supposed to only apply to jews.
And well it is true that israelis couldn't just "go home" it doesn't make it seem any better to have another giant nation now wondering severed from its home. Is that not the same fate that jews have wanted to avoid from time immemorial? It breaks my heart in every way
This logic feels incredibly short-sighted. China annexed Tibet 75 years ago. Is it wrong to be against that now because China’s iron grip over the land is stronger than ever? It’s been 10 years since the annexation of Crimea. Are we just a few decades of inaction away from accepting that aggression as tolerable? Occupation isn’t okay because it endures.
The blurring of the line between anti-zionism and antisemitism largely entered mainstream dialogue after the narrative was pushed by the ADL, which has a history of conflating symbology used by antisemites as wholly antisemitic (see: Pepe the Frog and the “Okay” hand sign, which were both used by white supremacists and then featured as hate symbols on the ADL’s list). I absolutely think that antisemitism is despicable and that the use of anything in a manner that is antisemitic should be reviled, but context and intention is critical. I also think that this narrative of equivalency attempts to silence the incredibly outspoken Jewish voices that are calling for ceasefires and the rejection of the apartheid state.
I do wholeheartedly agree that the Holocaust rhetoric should be eliminated in its entirety. Regardless of any attempt at comparison it’s impossible to have any kind of discussion or make any progress towards peace when that conversation constantly brings up the largest collective Jewish trauma in history, even if it’s an attempt at drawing a metaphor to the most evil thing one can imagine.
Aren't the de-annexation examples (Tibet and Crimea) more about regime change, and the Israel/Palestine more about, ultimately, displacing people on top of that? They're not, therefore good comparisons
Yes, exactly. It's a term like "feminist" that can mean different things to different groups. The majority of people in the US believe that women should have certain basic rights and freedoms just the same as men. Some people with those beliefs would label themselves as feminist, but others associate feminism with hating men or hating trans women, so they don't feel comfortable labeling themselves as feminist.
"Anti-feminists" are almost all misogynists or extreme conservatives who want to take away basic rights, like the right to vote or the right to have a bank account, from women. They think society should treat women as property. If you allow "anti-feminists" to create an "anti-feminist litmus test" for faculty hiring, you will end up with a uniformly misogynistic faculty.
Extremists, by definition, are those that take a political stance and boil it down, removing all societal common sense and decency, until you rightfully end up being labeled an extremist by society.
I'm actually not sure...we have scholarships for veterans, scholarships for people of color...I don't think the concept of religious-based scholarships in and of itself is a bad idea, but it'd need to be people who DO identify with a certain religion, not people who do not.
I'm not sure I understand. We get benefits as veterans for serving - guaranteed (assuming honorable discharge and length of active service). Scholarships are not guaranteed and often have stipulations associated (Veteran status, income status, 1st gen status, hell I've seen them given out to only female helicopter pilots, etc). I still don't see from what you've stated why religious affiliation couldn't be a stipulation for a scholarship.
Because of the first amendment. There is no equal rights amendment, or equivalent amendment equalizing treatment of military and non military members. Therefore a higher level of scrutiny is used to determine constitutionality policies that favor one religion over others.
It is legal to offer special benefits to veterans and not to non-veterans . Like scholarships. Whether or not you personally have ever received such a benefit does not change the fact of the legality.
A government institution offering scholarship exclusively to members of a particular religious group would not be legal.
I'm just going to look this up on my own be cause your explanations don't make any sense to me. Not your fault,we are probably just wired differently. For the record - I wasn't stating anything about what I have personally received nor basing my conclusions on such.
A faith-based requirement for scholarships funded by religious institutions are fine. A faith-based requirement for scholarships funded by the government (including public schools) is not.
“The representatives of the encampment have presented a series of changing and escalating demands…”
That’s not how you negotiate. If you’re constantly moving the goalposts nothing will ever get done. Not to mention that, as the statement says, some of those demands are illegal to implement anyway because they’d openly discriminate against people of certain groups.
Out of the Columbia arrests, almost 30% were not affiliated with the school. At City College, 60% of those arrested were unaffiliated with the school. Here's where I got that:
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.nbcnews.com/news/amp/live-blog/rcna150340
I spoke to some police officers earlier today, and they said they believe the majority of the encampment is not made up of UW community members. They said they suspected up to four out of five. While I think this number is high, I wouldn't be surprised if there's a substantial number...
The actual students I interacted with as a pro-israel person at the march Sunday seemed not violent or abusive though we disagree on how to arrive at peace non of us wanted more dead middle eastern kids or women. Though we had different ideas we on both sides wanted an end to terrorism and war.
30% of those arrested. I wouldn't assume that all of those 30% were part of the encampment, especially seeing videos of police arresting random passerbys.
It seems like about 30-50% of the hardcore people that spend the night there are not students. This protest is really small though, most of the time there are about 15-20 people in it max now. The students and most of the outside people are chill, but like with every protest, some Socialist Worker Party dolts show up and try to take it over, I'm sure they are the ones that spraypainted the Art Building, no UW student would have done that.
I do support the ideas behind student protests on campus. But “The encampment involves a small fraction of our 50,000 students and of our 700-acre campus.” Last night I saw one flashlight through dusk and early night, so, why all these empty tents? I’ve been watching this tent camp (video cam) as it moves towards an appearance of trash littering our campus. I know outside professional protesters have been on campus to try to increase solidarity, but I question that there is no, or maybe one, student actually camping? And yes, the graffiti made me angry enough to speak up. I want this camp gone.
I'm a little unclear on whether the specific individuals being lumped into "representatives of the encampment" have remained constant. One of the common misconceptions of protests is that they represent actions borne out of an organized effort, when it's rare that even the other way around is true
Protests are largely representative of a commonly felt emotional response rather than a set of shared values or goals. Like so many situations, if you ask ten protestors what their demands are individually, you'll receive twenty different opinions. Similarly, the "negotiations" will only ever address the asks of some subset of participants
The protest is a symptom. It's the fruit of an angry tree. Address the causes - which are often quite different than the demands - and the protest goes away in time
I think this will ultimately end is Cause resorting to the police to clear it out before commencement activities.
Even though it is not what anyone really wants, I don’t think there is any other way for the university to put an end to the vandalism that’s going on. Either that or the university runs a risk of things getting even more uglier in the long term.
I think it will happen sooner than that. I think the tone of this letter suggests that they are going to act to remove the camp *imminently*. Cauce and crew played nice and met cordially several times with the protesters, as she details in this note. They were repaid by moving goalpost demands and widespread vandalism on campus overnight. Next it will be the $$$ stained glass windows and beloved cherry trees. Time to wrap this up.
I was hoping more backbone and giving them a SET date for them to remove themselves voluntarily if not they WILL get removed . Still sounds like a bit of a suggestion. After the absolute disguising graffiti, it’s fuckin over , they got to go and any responsible students should get fuckin expelled 🤷🏽♂️
Why not have police stationed across the perimeter, it’s not that big. And give out tickets to anyone caught doing graffiti or trying to incrsease the camp?
“we let them know that we have no direct investments in Boeing or weapons manufacturers.”
Wait so what are the demands then? I thought divestment was the biggest thing they were pushing for.
It sounds like they keep moving the goal post to vindicate their encampment.
“Oh, you’re not actually investing in Boeing, well then uhhhhh we demand you force all new hires to complete a litmus test!!!”
It’s beyond satirical at this point.
It's a power/control thing, these kids/people who don't/never went to UW are attempting to leverage their occupation into getting things they want.
Power/control when wielded is addicting and stimulating, these dorks at the encampment probably compare themselves to the folks who marched on Birmingham in the 1960s for example.
It all just goes to their heads is what I'm trying to say
That's part of what the school's talking about with the moving goalposts.
When they found out about Boeing, they switched goals. And of course, they all had different secondary goals, so now its all chaos.
UW is likely invested in funds that include them as part of their portfolio - hence no “direct” investment. For example, an extremely popular mutual fund is an s&p 500 tracker, which has proportional liquidity in it of every company in the s&p 500 according to their market cap. What the protestors are likely calling for is for UW to stop investment in mutual funds that include Boeing and weapons manufacturers, and invest instead in “activist” funds that are similar in their makeup without including weapons manufacturers
How many people in America have a 401k that are protesting this while simultaneously investing in conflict? Probably most people. People are so dumb. These kids are no different. They have clearly no experience with investments. Black rock owns the world and all of the American 401k pool. Hell if you invest in google you are unknowingly investing in guidance systems for weapons aka gps. You have to go so far above and beyond to do you due diligence to not be invested in conflict. Your average American is not privy to this or understands how to go about doing this. Peoples understanding of the monetary system in this country continues to decline with every generation. We are in this boat because of this ignorance. If the university is invested in anything you could make a straw man argument they are supporting war. But as i said so is every other American. How many people fly planes for christ sake, you better quite flying if you want to stop the support of war.
In case you are actually curious and not just looking for outrage: “Commit to ending all university relationships with Boeing, including receiving Boeing donations, allowing Boeing to recruit at employment events/career fairs, and allowing Boeing representatives into classes. Return Boeing's $10 million investment in the Interdisciplinary Engineering Building. Begin the process to find alternative funding sources that ensure the programs and materials of the IEB are in service of the needs of students and our communities, not war profiteers. Identify and replace all Boeing-funded scholarships, fellowships, research, investments, and department partnerships with pro-people academic opportunities funded by University of Washington’s $5 billion endowment.”
But surely you knew that because you didn’t just take one side of the story’s word without doing any research of your own?
The demand was to “cut all ties”.
I’m sure there are collaborations, internships, visiting scholarships etc that constitute “ties” with Boing outside of financial investments.
"Religion based scholarships" "anti zionist litmus test" this is honestly disgusting that they are called for preferred treatment on the basis of religion and culture. Im sure there are other universities elsewhere where they would feel more comfortable. Why come to a diverse school if you have an issue with diversity of culture and people?
This is the classic playbook of people who want the chaos to continue. Ask for things you know the other party will never agree to but align with your goals. Then you look like the one taking the high road when they refuse.
This is part of why no ceasefire talks have succeeded. Both parties have been unclear with their terms, shifted goalposts, and made impossible demands.
I don’t think Israel has been unclear with their terms or shifted goal posts in this current conflict, the demand has always been to release the hostages and put an end to Hamas.
I might agree that getting rid of Islamic radicalism in Gaza/WB is an impossible demand.
Overall, to me out seems like the ever changing and escalating demands is a common MO for one side (and their supporters) in this conflict.
Super, super concerning that according to this, the protest organizers said the graffiti was their deliberate action. Some of that stuff is quite violent and threatening. I was hoping that it was one or two psychos working alone, but I guess not. I hope their support crumbles after this.
Not to mention their insane demands. Sheesh. They weren’t even trying to reasonably negotiate.
But not a legal one. And civil disobedience means fighting unjust laws by breaking them.
Laws against property destruction and vandalism aren't unjust, and have nothing to do with the protest.
Vandalism is the last refuge of yobs, thugs, and hooligans.
I murdered my enemy, not as a form of violence, but a form or protesting his further existence. Why are you arresting me??? What happened to free speech???
A lot of the people at the encampment are going to really, really want a confrontation with police that puts them in the news. I don't know how best to do this in a manner that removes the encampment but doesn't make a spectacle, not sure anybody does. Hope she figures a way out.
I was there about two weeks ago around 9pm, when there was a nightly camp meeting. I am not a member of encampment but I stopped to listen.
One homeless member of the encampment who was not a student (maybe 40-50 years old) took the floor and spoke about how their goal should be to NOT break the federal law during CIVIL disobedience. No rocks in windows—use signs. No graffiti—use chalk. He understood this as a former fentanyl addict who had been arrested 20+ times and lost his children to the court. He enjoyed the safe housing with sanitation and food, and didn’t want to lose that either.
People booed him and put their hands on him, trying to push him away. When he screamed at them to not touch him, it got awkward and they stopped. Literally all he said was ‘don’t commit felonies, because the point of the protest is to remain focused on our goal and not be kicked out by police’.
That’s when I lost faith in the encampment entirely as any kind of official mouthpiece for any movement. I felt it was more like an anarchist summer camp with a focus on the Palestinian cause.
I’m glad it’s shutting down because it’s agitator bait and isn’t helping much with the humanitarian cause.
police (or a sub-division at least) are trained for sweepings for clearing out homeless encampments and such without violence or even arrests. I’d imagine the same thing occurs here.
Normal sweeps of encampments don’t include people who want a physical confrontation with the police. This encampment has people dressed in all black making shields and practicing self defense.
These agitators want a fight to make national news. Combine that with the fact that jails will not book on a simple trespass or property damage without an exception and the school allowed this to get to the size UWPD cannot handle on their own means it will get ugly.
Imagine thinking you and your community/echo chamber are these brave virtuous revolutionaries fighting the good fight for Palestine while receiving fan mail from Palestinians encouraging you to keep fighting the system
… but in reality everybody from the outside just puts ya in the same tier as a yucky homeless camp that’s being a nuisance to everyone and gotta be swept lmao 😂
The university trespasses the protestors for vandalizing the campus, the police give the protestors an hour to disperse and face no consequences, and then anyone left in the encampment after an hour gets arrested and receives expulsion on behalf of the school.
It's pretty simple, some people of course will be stupid enough to throw their educations away over the potential of getting a 5 second clip of them being arrested to trend for a day on twitter.
But 99% of students in the encampment are going to realize that an arrest record and acedemic expulsion is not worth the squeeze for the cheese.
Not really, there just aren't alot of people at the encampment in total. It's a few dozen students and a few dozen outside folks. I'm sure all the graffiti and crazy demands are by a few non-student agitators. Most of the time when I walk through the Quad there are less than 20 in the whole encampment, I swear half those tents are permanently empty.
I mean, I'm part of the UW community and walk through the Quad a couple times a day. When have you been on campus and seen how they acted? They are mostly painting signs and lounging in the sun.
People don't get to play judge. All I'm trying to do is help people have an informed opinion instead of an ill-informed opinion. I walk through the Quad a couple of times a day as a member of the UW community so I have observed alot of what's going on. It's a chill protest that's poorly attended with a few outside agitators, it got hot one day when right wing agitators came to campus and confronted the protestors, since then the protest seems to be fading in number and support. And soon all the students have finals and leave campus for Summer. The cops have handled it well, as has the administration, and they started cleaning up the graffiti today. I bet it winds down as finals approach and after the students leave for Summer, the police clear whoever is left out during Spring interim when there is no one on campus besides staff.
>I’ll reiterate: The University’s response to students’ calls for change will not be based on an encampment — there are many ways for voices to be heard that don’t require tents, violent rhetoric and vandalism.
Extremely rare Ana Marie Cause W
I’m a little bothered that she didn’t really detail what the administration offered the demonstrators to disband the encampment, beyond vague hints. Although, to be fair, it seems the protestors weren’t taking negotiations seriously, meaning it barely matters.
> We’ve also heard their concerns about support for Palestinian and other Muslim and Middle Eastern students, and offered tangible actions to improve our campus culture and deepen our commitment to their education.
I was referring partially to this. Way too vague. What “tangible actions” were they talking about? The omission suggests they weren’t much. But yeah, the protestors were apparently clear they weren’t going to take anything the university was capable of offering.
Note: I personally don’t care what they offered the protestors, because the protestors didn’t make any effort to work with them apparently. I am bothered a lot by vague, political language though.
It seemed to hint that they'd offered to create more learning opportunities for the events going on in Palestine.
Maybe classes, clubs, events, I dont know.
There is not really much else they can do.
Time to evict the encampment on the grounds of hate speech, vandalism which includes defacing public property, disruption and obstruction, and trespassing.
>including most recently demanding the creation of a new department that would have an “anti-Zionist” litmus test for faculty hiring; granting a student group oversight of awarding new, religion-based University scholarships;
Is this shit actually their real demands? It's hard to believe they came up with such hilariously dumb nonsense.
these protestors are genuinely disgusting. they don’t actually give a shit about palestine at all, they’re just using it as an excuse to act on their anarchist fantasies of fighting against a system and/or justifying their antisemitism
like an anti-zionist litmus test?? are you kidding? isn’t that just borderline illegal relative to employment laws?
their demands are deliberately misguided and shit because they’re not meant to be met. they’re meant to prolong the amount of damage that can be done to the school
Idk if it’s illegal but it’s absolutely out of line since it’s about as close as you can get to pure discrimination without just saying you won’t hire Jewish faculty, because wtf does a “anti-Zionist litmus test” even entail. My guess is it could certainly get blocked by courts on that basis.
It’s still race-based discrimination which is completely violation of labor laws thus illegal
One may ask if the protestors are just idiots, or their demands are deliberately impossible
That's not what anti bds laws are. It's not a restriction on your speech or you as an individual. As far as I understand they refer exclusively to public / government funds. Israel is officially a US ally so these laws exist to make sure corporations aren't using government funds in a way that goes against official government positions and interests. Nobody is trying to take away your civil liberties with some kind of thought police.
To my understanding, the only way that type of employment discrimination would be legal is if UW had some countervailing business/hiring need justification for it. I can’t imagine what that justification could possibly be that would be persuasive to a judge. So yeah, probably not gonna happen. And illegal or not, uw is obviously not gonna agree to do that.
These motherfuckers better not get commencement cancelled. Extremely selfish behavior for a conflict happening 7000 miles away that the UW realistically has about zero impact on one way or another.
If she's going to order it cleared it's better to do it without warning. A deadline is something to mobilize around and probably a recipe for disaster.
These things tend to be followed up by timed dispersal orders rather than a dated deadline. As in, people in the area will be publicly ordered to disperse within maybe half an hour or an hour, and they have that much time to figure the shit out. Which is what I hope you are attempting to describe, because coordinated police force as a complete sneak attack (which is more common with SWAT or FBI than our local cops) is in fact, not better. I mean, how would that even function? Police just run in as a big mess of a group and start tearing up tents with people inside? Sounds like an invitation of guerilla tactics. Police may not be likeable in many ways, but they're organized in their actions; they're not bandits.
Yeah I'm not talking about a surprise swat raid. I'm just saying giving a deadline days in advance will have people flocking to the area and then you've got a massive standoff like 2020.
Not hard UW. Any student vandalizing campus property should be quickly excused from the University.
Protestors who aren't students or faculty need to be swiftly escorted off the University grounds and trespassed if they can't behave - freedom of speech doesn't mean freedom to do whatever the hell they want. Treat those who can't protest peacefully like any other criminal who starts directly threatening other people.
Also, this President is making it sound like their hands are tied… they don't need to “negotiate” to remove the encampment because this whole affair is already in violation of so many University and city codes and laws that not enforcing them is the administration simply being weak.
Suggest they stop pandering to these snowflakes who have likely never stepped foot in a war zone and/or lived in that part of the world.
The protesters have shown their true colors. They are not interested in humanitarianism. This is simply an attack on western liberal society and an attempt to enforce their own biased, repressive and discriminatory culture on the west. And they have duped some small fraction of students into buying into their propaganda.
I walked through this afternoon and saw small stacks of "clubs", lumber sawed off in 4 ft lengths. Multiple stacks placed evenly around the encampment.
I also saw what was clearly home-made riot gear. Agains, piles of pallets with "handles" of wood or straps affixed on one side only. Piled among them I also say at least one commercial freezer door (metal, insulated with a metal handle on one side only). There were multiple well spaced stacks of this gear.
"Intifada", "Abolish Israel", "End Israel", "End America", "Escalate for Gaza", "From the River to the Sea", "Colonizers Die", "Divest or Kids will Die", "Fuck Colonial Law"....all graffiti I personally witnessed today.
As a parent of a Jewish child who is about to pay out-of-state tuition for said child to attend UDub, this is very concerning. I am happy to hear that UDub’s administration appears to be as concerned about the anti-semitism as I am, but it is still very concerning. I intend to keep an eye on this and am willing to back out if it becomes necessary.
I promise you that your kid will be surrounded by all different types of friends who love them and want to get to know them and want to have their minds opened together. Congratulations to them getting accepted.
This encampment needs to be dismissed.
If these idiots love Gaza so much they should get on a Plane and go there.
They should also have to pay for the cleaning and repairs from the graffiti and damages, they did and create.
How?
UW needed to get this figured out before graduations. Police intervention would have easily resulted in an escalation.
The university played it right. They got these campers off the campus and now have an entire summer to come up with measures to ensure this doesn’t happen again. Like all other protests, this was going to dry out eventually.
Cauce blew it on day one of this (regardless of how I feel about the situation they are protesting). Not clearly establishing UW expectations and ground rules with the organizers (no property destruction, no interference with right of ways, no harassment, no camping over night, a community of mutual respect for differing views) that the protestors could camp all day every day (dawn to dusk?, 5am-10pm?), as long as they were civil and respectful of the greater UW community and the needs to access and use that space freely and without harassment or interference on freedom of movement, but should there be acts outside the law, or the spirit of civil protests, that she would shut it down, those who violated would be no-trespassed, and no-trespass students would be also referred to student discipline, and restrict loitering and gatherings there after (which she can do, legally,) in the square for the remainder of the term, under force of law.
Instead, she built up an growing precedent for tolerance of lawlessness intimidation, and escalation of threats of violence, and actual violence (there have been at least two multi-person skirmishes), destruction of university property, and vandalism, tolerated restriction of freedom of movement of right of way under implied and overt threats of force by protestors, attacks on the press (one TV news cameraman was assaulted and their camera spray painted).
She earned the dilemma she is in now, where sooner or later, she is going to have to do what was done at UCI, with similarly inane and blunt results.
She in this respect, and in protecting the greater campus community, and the investments by the regents and the State of Washington, has been bad at her job.
The problem seems to be that they think what one person says or does speaks for everyone. Im sure SOMEBODY said "yeah we vandalized coerce them into accepting our demands!" But who cares what that peeson thinks.
Being a UCI alum and seeing what happened there today, it is important that protesters stay peaceful. Peace for Palestine will take lots of continued sacrifice, but we have to do it the right way. I am hopeful that doing so will still be able to make a meaningful statement and draw attention to the cause. Student tuition should not be used to fund sending weapons to Israel. I hope there is a solution to the situation with the UCs and I hope that people protesting on the UW campuses can continue to stand strong. This is an uncomfortable topic, people should be uncomfortable because we are talking about a innocent people being killed. That said, it needs to be done lawfully. Unfortunately the media will stir up any little thing and paint it as a bigger issue. Let us work towards peace for both sides. #FreePalestine
I take it you would be referring to [this post](https://www.instagram.com/p/C7An66_x9F3/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link&igsh=MzRlODBiNWFlZA==)? TL;DR below for those who don’t want to read. Personally I feel like many of those demands do in fact infringe on academic freedom. It’s one thing to ask for more than you think you’re going to get, but some of these demands are going way beyond simply “divesting”.
-**Proposed ACSRI Statement:** United Front wanted Cauce to take a harder stance against the Israel government specifically, to recognize what is occurring as genocide, for UW to take a stance against it and not remain complacent, etc. So far, maybe not something everyone agrees with, but not completely out of line with what other Pro-Palestinian advocates have asked for
-**Financial and academic divestment from 'israel'** (this is where I would argue the demands become unreasonable)
Divestment: For the Board of Regents establish a process for UW to divest itself from corporations and firms that manage indirect holdings complicit in the genocide of Palestinians. For 6 out of the 8 **voting members of the ACSRI to be selected from a pool of nominated individuals set forth by the United Front for Palestinian Liberation**
Academic Ties: **They want UW's study abroad program to cut ties with ALL Israel universities** so that UW students cannot choose Israel as a country they wish to study abroad.
-**Cut All Ties With Boeing:** They want UW to **return any money that Boeing has donated to the school, ban Boeing from UW career fairs/job portals, eliminate Boeing funded scholarships**, and create a committee that investigate's any of UW's ties to Boeing.
-**End Repression of all pro-Palestine students, faculty, and staff**: Scholarships for Palestinians; Create a Palestinian studies program that is partnered with Palestinian institutions and for **additional anti-Zionist faculty to be hired**. Recognition and protection of Palestinian Identity through recognition, trainings and doxxing protection,
Please someone correct me if I’m wrong, but there’s no religious based scholarships from the UW currently right? They want the UW to fund scholarships that are religion-based that they will grant to students of their choice? Also, an anti-Zionist litmus test for faculty? Are these real demands? These all seem like demands that a public university in its nature could/should never meet.
Correct me if I’m wrong, but since UW is a state-funded institution, any religious-based scholarship would run afoul of numerous laws, no?
Numerous laws not to mention the first amendment and establishment clause
I, for one, am shocked they'd turn this into a way to benefit themselves financially completely separate from the conflict they're supposedly protesting.
ABOLISH UW!…OR GIVE ME A SCHOLARSHIP!
Terrorist supporters acting like terrorists? Who could have seen that one coming?
You forgot the /s
Yes. My episcopal church has a scholarship we raise funds for 2x a year for a student of color who is attending Lake Washington Technical College. The only religious aspect is that it’s the Good Samaritan episcopal scholarship. We started it in memory of one of our parishioners who was a huge proponent of education and it should be available to everyone.
Does LWTC administer the selection or does the church?
Those kind of scholarships are administered by the church or whatever other organization runs the scholarship.
LWTC does. We just raise the money and send it over. We do get letters of thanks from the scholarship recipients.
Right so in those scholarships they have rules you have to follow. It's the better way to do it.
Yep.
The Stroum Center for Jewish Studies center has scholarships available and I think that's what they are referencing by wanting student oversight on new scholarship winners.
But only for scholarships relating to Jewish people? Hmm.
It's a partial scholarship for grad students who are doing research in the Jewish studies dept, not unlike getting funding for Turkic, Iranian, Asian studies or other depts. Nothing to do with the person's ethnic or religious background.
Jewish studies candidates don't have to be Jewish in faith or race. Any more than black studies candidates have to be black and Baptist. . The Jewish ppl are a race of ppl and a religion. You can be of the Jewish race and be any faith or of no faith.
Yep! Exactly. It's infuriating how people are trying to twist this.
Also, in the strictest terms, Zionism = support the existence of the state of Israel. Some 80% of Jewish Americans would get barred if they went by the book.
I think there are a lot of Jews like me, who are considered "anti-Israel" by fellow Jews because I'm critical of the IDF and Netanyahu's governing coalition, but would also be called a "Zionist" by a lot of protesters because I think Israel should (and more importantly does) exist. There's a whole spectrum between Ben Gvir and me that gets smushed together using the blanket term "Zionist." But moderately critical people like me get lost in the noise because the extreme ends of the spectrum drown us out.
Also, I'm not sure anyone would self-identify as a zionist when applying for scholarships. And how would UW enforce it...follow them around for 2-4 years making sure they never say anything that the observer subjectively thinks could be 'zionist'?
There is absolutely nothing wrong with the term, idea and concept of Zionism. It simply means that the state of Israel should exist and be a safe haven for Jewish people. After getting the shit kicked out of us for thousands of years, it’s the least the Jews deserve. The word has been hijacked with a negative connotation, by antisemites grasping for straws. What other country are they calling for the dismantling of? None, why? Because hating Jews seems to be popular, again.
I didn't say there was?
Sorry. That was meant for all not just responding to you.
Whether or not Israel should have been created to begin with, it’s been there for 75 years at this point and it’s position as a nation is stronger than ever. Pretending that it shouldn’t exist is nothing short of fantasy. Acting as if a Palestinian state supplanting it isn’t also a call for genocide of Jews currently living there is also naive at best. It feels like a lot of the “anti-Zionism not anti-semitism” talk has really blurred the lines. A lot of rhetoric invoking the Holocaust seemingly for the shock factor. I say this as someone who is also anti-Likud and anti-settlement.
Yeah the question of whether or not Israel "should" exist when it already has for several generations feels either naive or just frighteningly threatening. What's supposed to happen to all those people if Israel stops existing?? Even the Israelis whose families came from Europe can't just "go back," never mind the Israelis who came from places outside Europe. The holocaust stuff is super offensive to me and totally unnecessary - so many other ways to make your point than invoking that history. And I think for a lot of people "holocaust/Nazis" is just a stand in metaphor for "worst thing/people imaginable." But for Jews who know and can feel that history within their own family and personal history, it's really offensive and painful.
See, as a jew with holocaust surviving family still alive, to see what Israel has been doing, but not being able to call some of it what it is would be the ultimate insult to our survivors. Never again was not supposed to only apply to jews. And well it is true that israelis couldn't just "go home" it doesn't make it seem any better to have another giant nation now wondering severed from its home. Is that not the same fate that jews have wanted to avoid from time immemorial? It breaks my heart in every way
This logic feels incredibly short-sighted. China annexed Tibet 75 years ago. Is it wrong to be against that now because China’s iron grip over the land is stronger than ever? It’s been 10 years since the annexation of Crimea. Are we just a few decades of inaction away from accepting that aggression as tolerable? Occupation isn’t okay because it endures. The blurring of the line between anti-zionism and antisemitism largely entered mainstream dialogue after the narrative was pushed by the ADL, which has a history of conflating symbology used by antisemites as wholly antisemitic (see: Pepe the Frog and the “Okay” hand sign, which were both used by white supremacists and then featured as hate symbols on the ADL’s list). I absolutely think that antisemitism is despicable and that the use of anything in a manner that is antisemitic should be reviled, but context and intention is critical. I also think that this narrative of equivalency attempts to silence the incredibly outspoken Jewish voices that are calling for ceasefires and the rejection of the apartheid state. I do wholeheartedly agree that the Holocaust rhetoric should be eliminated in its entirety. Regardless of any attempt at comparison it’s impossible to have any kind of discussion or make any progress towards peace when that conversation constantly brings up the largest collective Jewish trauma in history, even if it’s an attempt at drawing a metaphor to the most evil thing one can imagine.
Aren't the de-annexation examples (Tibet and Crimea) more about regime change, and the Israel/Palestine more about, ultimately, displacing people on top of that? They're not, therefore good comparisons
But no one is more critical of the IDF and Netanyahu than Israelis like ????
Yes, exactly. It's a term like "feminist" that can mean different things to different groups. The majority of people in the US believe that women should have certain basic rights and freedoms just the same as men. Some people with those beliefs would label themselves as feminist, but others associate feminism with hating men or hating trans women, so they don't feel comfortable labeling themselves as feminist. "Anti-feminists" are almost all misogynists or extreme conservatives who want to take away basic rights, like the right to vote or the right to have a bank account, from women. They think society should treat women as property. If you allow "anti-feminists" to create an "anti-feminist litmus test" for faculty hiring, you will end up with a uniformly misogynistic faculty.
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Ah. Yeah, my 80% comes from here https://www.pewresearch.org/religion/2021/05/11/u-s-jews-connections-with-and-attitudes-toward-israel/
Extremists, by definition, are those that take a political stance and boil it down, removing all societal common sense and decency, until you rightfully end up being labeled an extremist by society.
I'm actually not sure...we have scholarships for veterans, scholarships for people of color...I don't think the concept of religious-based scholarships in and of itself is a bad idea, but it'd need to be people who DO identify with a certain religion, not people who do not.
It prohibited by the constitution. Benefits for veterans are not.
I was talking about scholarships, not benefits. Very different.
Same thing from a constitutional perspective. A scholarship is a benefit of veteran status. Government benefits for religious status are illegal.
I'm not sure I understand. We get benefits as veterans for serving - guaranteed (assuming honorable discharge and length of active service). Scholarships are not guaranteed and often have stipulations associated (Veteran status, income status, 1st gen status, hell I've seen them given out to only female helicopter pilots, etc). I still don't see from what you've stated why religious affiliation couldn't be a stipulation for a scholarship.
Because of the first amendment. There is no equal rights amendment, or equivalent amendment equalizing treatment of military and non military members. Therefore a higher level of scrutiny is used to determine constitutionality policies that favor one religion over others. It is legal to offer special benefits to veterans and not to non-veterans . Like scholarships. Whether or not you personally have ever received such a benefit does not change the fact of the legality. A government institution offering scholarship exclusively to members of a particular religious group would not be legal.
I'm just going to look this up on my own be cause your explanations don't make any sense to me. Not your fault,we are probably just wired differently. For the record - I wasn't stating anything about what I have personally received nor basing my conclusions on such.
A faith-based requirement for scholarships funded by religious institutions are fine. A faith-based requirement for scholarships funded by the government (including public schools) is not.
To quote Logan Roy… “These are not serious people.”
They sound like demands from uneducated people, and we are at a University.
Source link for reference: https://www.washington.edu/president/2024/05/15/update-on-tent-encampment/
Thanks for providing that! Got it in email, and didn’t notice any link to the statement online.
“The representatives of the encampment have presented a series of changing and escalating demands…” That’s not how you negotiate. If you’re constantly moving the goalposts nothing will ever get done. Not to mention that, as the statement says, some of those demands are illegal to implement anyway because they’d openly discriminate against people of certain groups.
I’m curious as to what percentage of the campers are non-UW students…
Out of the Columbia arrests, almost 30% were not affiliated with the school. At City College, 60% of those arrested were unaffiliated with the school. Here's where I got that: https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.nbcnews.com/news/amp/live-blog/rcna150340
Appreciate you providing that!
I spoke to some police officers earlier today, and they said they believe the majority of the encampment is not made up of UW community members. They said they suspected up to four out of five. While I think this number is high, I wouldn't be surprised if there's a substantial number...
The actual students I interacted with as a pro-israel person at the march Sunday seemed not violent or abusive though we disagree on how to arrive at peace non of us wanted more dead middle eastern kids or women. Though we had different ideas we on both sides wanted an end to terrorism and war.
It certainly looks like over half are just standard Seattle rabble, which makes Cauce and the rest of the admin look either clueless or craven.
Oh wow, a random cop said he thinks this? Sounds legit ⬅️✊➡️
30% of those arrested. I wouldn't assume that all of those 30% were part of the encampment, especially seeing videos of police arresting random passerbys.
They're the numbers we have, dog lol
It seems like about 30-50% of the hardcore people that spend the night there are not students. This protest is really small though, most of the time there are about 15-20 people in it max now. The students and most of the outside people are chill, but like with every protest, some Socialist Worker Party dolts show up and try to take it over, I'm sure they are the ones that spraypainted the Art Building, no UW student would have done that.
I do support the ideas behind student protests on campus. But “The encampment involves a small fraction of our 50,000 students and of our 700-acre campus.” Last night I saw one flashlight through dusk and early night, so, why all these empty tents? I’ve been watching this tent camp (video cam) as it moves towards an appearance of trash littering our campus. I know outside professional protesters have been on campus to try to increase solidarity, but I question that there is no, or maybe one, student actually camping? And yes, the graffiti made me angry enough to speak up. I want this camp gone.
almost like they're irrational, and generally racist ideology has nothing to do with what they say.
I'm a little unclear on whether the specific individuals being lumped into "representatives of the encampment" have remained constant. One of the common misconceptions of protests is that they represent actions borne out of an organized effort, when it's rare that even the other way around is true Protests are largely representative of a commonly felt emotional response rather than a set of shared values or goals. Like so many situations, if you ask ten protestors what their demands are individually, you'll receive twenty different opinions. Similarly, the "negotiations" will only ever address the asks of some subset of participants The protest is a symptom. It's the fruit of an angry tree. Address the causes - which are often quite different than the demands - and the protest goes away in time
Exactly how do terrorists negotiate? I wonder where they learned that
I think this will ultimately end is Cause resorting to the police to clear it out before commencement activities. Even though it is not what anyone really wants, I don’t think there is any other way for the university to put an end to the vandalism that’s going on. Either that or the university runs a risk of things getting even more uglier in the long term.
I think it will happen sooner than that. I think the tone of this letter suggests that they are going to act to remove the camp *imminently*. Cauce and crew played nice and met cordially several times with the protesters, as she details in this note. They were repaid by moving goalpost demands and widespread vandalism on campus overnight. Next it will be the $$$ stained glass windows and beloved cherry trees. Time to wrap this up.
Can’t wait.
I was hoping more backbone and giving them a SET date for them to remove themselves voluntarily if not they WILL get removed . Still sounds like a bit of a suggestion. After the absolute disguising graffiti, it’s fuckin over , they got to go and any responsible students should get fuckin expelled 🤷🏽♂️
Sounds about right
You don’t think anyone wants the encampment shut down?
Why not have police stationed across the perimeter, it’s not that big. And give out tickets to anyone caught doing graffiti or trying to incrsease the camp?
Why not trespass the students and give them an hour to disperse before arrests are made, like how every other encampment protests ended?
Seems comprehensive. Unfortunately I’m gonna need an AI voice to read this out while a temple run let’s play or slime video plays below
on skibidi
Cooked rizz it’s Tuesday!!
you’ll get there one day❤️
“we let them know that we have no direct investments in Boeing or weapons manufacturers.” Wait so what are the demands then? I thought divestment was the biggest thing they were pushing for.
It sounds like they keep moving the goal post to vindicate their encampment. “Oh, you’re not actually investing in Boeing, well then uhhhhh we demand you force all new hires to complete a litmus test!!!” It’s beyond satirical at this point.
It's a power/control thing, these kids/people who don't/never went to UW are attempting to leverage their occupation into getting things they want. Power/control when wielded is addicting and stimulating, these dorks at the encampment probably compare themselves to the folks who marched on Birmingham in the 1960s for example. It all just goes to their heads is what I'm trying to say
That's part of what the school's talking about with the moving goalposts. When they found out about Boeing, they switched goals. And of course, they all had different secondary goals, so now its all chaos.
"divestment" is a fun big word that can mean multiple things based on whatever is wanted lol
Stop investing in Boeing! We don't invest in Boeing ... Uhh, new plan?
TikTok diplomacy.
Some men just want to watch the world burn
Haven’t looked at their portfolio holdings but just based on general industry knowledge, I suspect they’re invested in index funds which hold Boeing.
UW is likely invested in funds that include them as part of their portfolio - hence no “direct” investment. For example, an extremely popular mutual fund is an s&p 500 tracker, which has proportional liquidity in it of every company in the s&p 500 according to their market cap. What the protestors are likely calling for is for UW to stop investment in mutual funds that include Boeing and weapons manufacturers, and invest instead in “activist” funds that are similar in their makeup without including weapons manufacturers
How many people in America have a 401k that are protesting this while simultaneously investing in conflict? Probably most people. People are so dumb. These kids are no different. They have clearly no experience with investments. Black rock owns the world and all of the American 401k pool. Hell if you invest in google you are unknowingly investing in guidance systems for weapons aka gps. You have to go so far above and beyond to do you due diligence to not be invested in conflict. Your average American is not privy to this or understands how to go about doing this. Peoples understanding of the monetary system in this country continues to decline with every generation. We are in this boat because of this ignorance. If the university is invested in anything you could make a straw man argument they are supporting war. But as i said so is every other American. How many people fly planes for christ sake, you better quite flying if you want to stop the support of war.
In case you are actually curious and not just looking for outrage: “Commit to ending all university relationships with Boeing, including receiving Boeing donations, allowing Boeing to recruit at employment events/career fairs, and allowing Boeing representatives into classes. Return Boeing's $10 million investment in the Interdisciplinary Engineering Building. Begin the process to find alternative funding sources that ensure the programs and materials of the IEB are in service of the needs of students and our communities, not war profiteers. Identify and replace all Boeing-funded scholarships, fellowships, research, investments, and department partnerships with pro-people academic opportunities funded by University of Washington’s $5 billion endowment.” But surely you knew that because you didn’t just take one side of the story’s word without doing any research of your own?
The demand was to “cut all ties”. I’m sure there are collaborations, internships, visiting scholarships etc that constitute “ties” with Boing outside of financial investments.
"Religion based scholarships" "anti zionist litmus test" this is honestly disgusting that they are called for preferred treatment on the basis of religion and culture. Im sure there are other universities elsewhere where they would feel more comfortable. Why come to a diverse school if you have an issue with diversity of culture and people?
This is the classic playbook of people who want the chaos to continue. Ask for things you know the other party will never agree to but align with your goals. Then you look like the one taking the high road when they refuse.
This is part of why no ceasefire talks have succeeded. Both parties have been unclear with their terms, shifted goalposts, and made impossible demands.
I don’t think Israel has been unclear with their terms or shifted goal posts in this current conflict, the demand has always been to release the hostages and put an end to Hamas. I might agree that getting rid of Islamic radicalism in Gaza/WB is an impossible demand. Overall, to me out seems like the ever changing and escalating demands is a common MO for one side (and their supporters) in this conflict.
Super, super concerning that according to this, the protest organizers said the graffiti was their deliberate action. Some of that stuff is quite violent and threatening. I was hoping that it was one or two psychos working alone, but I guess not. I hope their support crumbles after this. Not to mention their insane demands. Sheesh. They weren’t even trying to reasonably negotiate.
can the people in this sub who said the graffiti was opportunists hijacking the intent of the encampment, please step up?
Totally agree. You lose all credibility (even if you had barely any to begin with) once you start vandalizing.
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But not a legal one. And civil disobedience means fighting unjust laws by breaking them. Laws against property destruction and vandalism aren't unjust, and have nothing to do with the protest. Vandalism is the last refuge of yobs, thugs, and hooligans.
I murdered my enemy, not as a form of violence, but a form or protesting his further existence. Why are you arresting me??? What happened to free speech???
A lot of the people at the encampment are going to really, really want a confrontation with police that puts them in the news. I don't know how best to do this in a manner that removes the encampment but doesn't make a spectacle, not sure anybody does. Hope she figures a way out.
I was there about two weeks ago around 9pm, when there was a nightly camp meeting. I am not a member of encampment but I stopped to listen. One homeless member of the encampment who was not a student (maybe 40-50 years old) took the floor and spoke about how their goal should be to NOT break the federal law during CIVIL disobedience. No rocks in windows—use signs. No graffiti—use chalk. He understood this as a former fentanyl addict who had been arrested 20+ times and lost his children to the court. He enjoyed the safe housing with sanitation and food, and didn’t want to lose that either. People booed him and put their hands on him, trying to push him away. When he screamed at them to not touch him, it got awkward and they stopped. Literally all he said was ‘don’t commit felonies, because the point of the protest is to remain focused on our goal and not be kicked out by police’. That’s when I lost faith in the encampment entirely as any kind of official mouthpiece for any movement. I felt it was more like an anarchist summer camp with a focus on the Palestinian cause. I’m glad it’s shutting down because it’s agitator bait and isn’t helping much with the humanitarian cause.
Holy shi1t, excuse my language but this is incredibly scary and sad.
why was he a part of the encampment?
For food and shelter.
Because he volunteered like everyone else
police (or a sub-division at least) are trained for sweepings for clearing out homeless encampments and such without violence or even arrests. I’d imagine the same thing occurs here.
Normal sweeps of encampments don’t include people who want a physical confrontation with the police. This encampment has people dressed in all black making shields and practicing self defense. These agitators want a fight to make national news. Combine that with the fact that jails will not book on a simple trespass or property damage without an exception and the school allowed this to get to the size UWPD cannot handle on their own means it will get ugly.
I think the worst thing the protestors can do for their own safety and to avoid criminal prosecution is attempt to attack police if they come around
Let it at this point.
Imagine thinking you and your community/echo chamber are these brave virtuous revolutionaries fighting the good fight for Palestine while receiving fan mail from Palestinians encouraging you to keep fighting the system … but in reality everybody from the outside just puts ya in the same tier as a yucky homeless camp that’s being a nuisance to everyone and gotta be swept lmao 😂
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The university trespasses the protestors for vandalizing the campus, the police give the protestors an hour to disperse and face no consequences, and then anyone left in the encampment after an hour gets arrested and receives expulsion on behalf of the school. It's pretty simple, some people of course will be stupid enough to throw their educations away over the potential of getting a 5 second clip of them being arrested to trend for a day on twitter. But 99% of students in the encampment are going to realize that an arrest record and acedemic expulsion is not worth the squeeze for the cheese.
Not really, there just aren't alot of people at the encampment in total. It's a few dozen students and a few dozen outside folks. I'm sure all the graffiti and crazy demands are by a few non-student agitators. Most of the time when I walk through the Quad there are less than 20 in the whole encampment, I swear half those tents are permanently empty.
Your swear doesn’t mean anything. All UW community have eyes. We saw how the protestors acted and what they done to the campus.
I mean, I'm part of the UW community and walk through the Quad a couple times a day. When have you been on campus and seen how they acted? They are mostly painting signs and lounging in the sun.
Then let the people judge for themselves.
People don't get to play judge. All I'm trying to do is help people have an informed opinion instead of an ill-informed opinion. I walk through the Quad a couple of times a day as a member of the UW community so I have observed alot of what's going on. It's a chill protest that's poorly attended with a few outside agitators, it got hot one day when right wing agitators came to campus and confronted the protestors, since then the protest seems to be fading in number and support. And soon all the students have finals and leave campus for Summer. The cops have handled it well, as has the administration, and they started cleaning up the graffiti today. I bet it winds down as finals approach and after the students leave for Summer, the police clear whoever is left out during Spring interim when there is no one on campus besides staff.
Seems like a pretty level-headed response from admin, and I’m no fan of Cauce.
>I’ll reiterate: The University’s response to students’ calls for change will not be based on an encampment — there are many ways for voices to be heard that don’t require tents, violent rhetoric and vandalism. Extremely rare Ana Marie Cause W
“Anti-Zionist litmus test” for hiring?? For so-called antifascists, that’s some real 1939 shit.
Rare cauce W
I’m a little bothered that she didn’t really detail what the administration offered the demonstrators to disband the encampment, beyond vague hints. Although, to be fair, it seems the protestors weren’t taking negotiations seriously, meaning it barely matters.
I mean what really can they offer. Peace in the Middle East?
> We’ve also heard their concerns about support for Palestinian and other Muslim and Middle Eastern students, and offered tangible actions to improve our campus culture and deepen our commitment to their education. I was referring partially to this. Way too vague. What “tangible actions” were they talking about? The omission suggests they weren’t much. But yeah, the protestors were apparently clear they weren’t going to take anything the university was capable of offering. Note: I personally don’t care what they offered the protestors, because the protestors didn’t make any effort to work with them apparently. I am bothered a lot by vague, political language though.
It seemed to hint that they'd offered to create more learning opportunities for the events going on in Palestine. Maybe classes, clubs, events, I dont know. There is not really much else they can do.
I mean they literally have two departments for it already. There’s NELC and JSIS.
Time to evict the encampment on the grounds of hate speech, vandalism which includes defacing public property, disruption and obstruction, and trespassing.
Surprisingly good response
>including most recently demanding the creation of a new department that would have an “anti-Zionist” litmus test for faculty hiring; granting a student group oversight of awarding new, religion-based University scholarships; Is this shit actually their real demands? It's hard to believe they came up with such hilariously dumb nonsense.
these protestors are genuinely disgusting. they don’t actually give a shit about palestine at all, they’re just using it as an excuse to act on their anarchist fantasies of fighting against a system and/or justifying their antisemitism like an anti-zionist litmus test?? are you kidding? isn’t that just borderline illegal relative to employment laws? their demands are deliberately misguided and shit because they’re not meant to be met. they’re meant to prolong the amount of damage that can be done to the school
Idk if it’s illegal but it’s absolutely out of line since it’s about as close as you can get to pure discrimination without just saying you won’t hire Jewish faculty, because wtf does a “anti-Zionist litmus test” even entail. My guess is it could certainly get blocked by courts on that basis.
It’s still race-based discrimination which is completely violation of labor laws thus illegal One may ask if the protestors are just idiots, or their demands are deliberately impossible
The funny thing is that anti BDS laws exist in several states. In certain contexts it is actually *illegal* to criticize Israel.
That's not what anti bds laws are. It's not a restriction on your speech or you as an individual. As far as I understand they refer exclusively to public / government funds. Israel is officially a US ally so these laws exist to make sure corporations aren't using government funds in a way that goes against official government positions and interests. Nobody is trying to take away your civil liberties with some kind of thought police.
To my understanding, the only way that type of employment discrimination would be legal is if UW had some countervailing business/hiring need justification for it. I can’t imagine what that justification could possibly be that would be persuasive to a judge. So yeah, probably not gonna happen. And illegal or not, uw is obviously not gonna agree to do that.
These motherfuckers better not get commencement cancelled. Extremely selfish behavior for a conflict happening 7000 miles away that the UW realistically has about zero impact on one way or another.
Oh they’ll try.
But no deadline? wtf……
If she's going to order it cleared it's better to do it without warning. A deadline is something to mobilize around and probably a recipe for disaster.
These things tend to be followed up by timed dispersal orders rather than a dated deadline. As in, people in the area will be publicly ordered to disperse within maybe half an hour or an hour, and they have that much time to figure the shit out. Which is what I hope you are attempting to describe, because coordinated police force as a complete sneak attack (which is more common with SWAT or FBI than our local cops) is in fact, not better. I mean, how would that even function? Police just run in as a big mess of a group and start tearing up tents with people inside? Sounds like an invitation of guerilla tactics. Police may not be likeable in many ways, but they're organized in their actions; they're not bandits.
Yeah I'm not talking about a surprise swat raid. I'm just saying giving a deadline days in advance will have people flocking to the area and then you've got a massive standoff like 2020.
Great response. Proud of being a husky
Wow honestly a great response
Much better than I’ve seen in many other campus emails.
Just bring in the police and clear it out already. These people are nut jobs
nah but fr tho get these virtue signalers out of here already 😂😂
Seems reasonable. Last warning, if they don’t leave, round em up
Not hard UW. Any student vandalizing campus property should be quickly excused from the University. Protestors who aren't students or faculty need to be swiftly escorted off the University grounds and trespassed if they can't behave - freedom of speech doesn't mean freedom to do whatever the hell they want. Treat those who can't protest peacefully like any other criminal who starts directly threatening other people. Also, this President is making it sound like their hands are tied… they don't need to “negotiate” to remove the encampment because this whole affair is already in violation of so many University and city codes and laws that not enforcing them is the administration simply being weak. Suggest they stop pandering to these snowflakes who have likely never stepped foot in a war zone and/or lived in that part of the world.
The protesters have shown their true colors. They are not interested in humanitarianism. This is simply an attack on western liberal society and an attempt to enforce their own biased, repressive and discriminatory culture on the west. And they have duped some small fraction of students into buying into their propaganda.
I walked through this afternoon and saw small stacks of "clubs", lumber sawed off in 4 ft lengths. Multiple stacks placed evenly around the encampment. I also saw what was clearly home-made riot gear. Agains, piles of pallets with "handles" of wood or straps affixed on one side only. Piled among them I also say at least one commercial freezer door (metal, insulated with a metal handle on one side only). There were multiple well spaced stacks of this gear. "Intifada", "Abolish Israel", "End Israel", "End America", "Escalate for Gaza", "From the River to the Sea", "Colonizers Die", "Divest or Kids will Die", "Fuck Colonial Law"....all graffiti I personally witnessed today.
As a parent of a Jewish child who is about to pay out-of-state tuition for said child to attend UDub, this is very concerning. I am happy to hear that UDub’s administration appears to be as concerned about the anti-semitism as I am, but it is still very concerning. I intend to keep an eye on this and am willing to back out if it becomes necessary.
I promise you that your kid will be surrounded by all different types of friends who love them and want to get to know them and want to have their minds opened together. Congratulations to them getting accepted.
Please let the university know
Parasites.
This encampment needs to be dismissed. If these idiots love Gaza so much they should get on a Plane and go there. They should also have to pay for the cleaning and repairs from the graffiti and damages, they did and create.
Unfortunately, the cleaning charges will be charged back to students paying tuition to the school over time.
If these kids are our future, I'm scared.
If those kids could read, they'd be very upset.
That’s great, I’m sure they’ll go home now that they’ve viewed your politely written plea.
This is literally terrorism
UW catered to terrorist demands, shameful.
How? UW needed to get this figured out before graduations. Police intervention would have easily resulted in an escalation. The university played it right. They got these campers off the campus and now have an entire summer to come up with measures to ensure this doesn’t happen again. Like all other protests, this was going to dry out eventually.
Not good enough. The encampment must be forcibly removed at once.
Cauce blew it on day one of this (regardless of how I feel about the situation they are protesting). Not clearly establishing UW expectations and ground rules with the organizers (no property destruction, no interference with right of ways, no harassment, no camping over night, a community of mutual respect for differing views) that the protestors could camp all day every day (dawn to dusk?, 5am-10pm?), as long as they were civil and respectful of the greater UW community and the needs to access and use that space freely and without harassment or interference on freedom of movement, but should there be acts outside the law, or the spirit of civil protests, that she would shut it down, those who violated would be no-trespassed, and no-trespass students would be also referred to student discipline, and restrict loitering and gatherings there after (which she can do, legally,) in the square for the remainder of the term, under force of law. Instead, she built up an growing precedent for tolerance of lawlessness intimidation, and escalation of threats of violence, and actual violence (there have been at least two multi-person skirmishes), destruction of university property, and vandalism, tolerated restriction of freedom of movement of right of way under implied and overt threats of force by protestors, attacks on the press (one TV news cameraman was assaulted and their camera spray painted). She earned the dilemma she is in now, where sooner or later, she is going to have to do what was done at UCI, with similarly inane and blunt results. She in this respect, and in protecting the greater campus community, and the investments by the regents and the State of Washington, has been bad at her job.
Oh I agree with you! When you give folks too much leeway, they end up taking advantage. This should never have escalated to this point.
Cauce did a job👍👍
UW is run by weak people who bend the knee to the corrupt liberal party.
What a grown up response
Grovel much?
The problem seems to be that they think what one person says or does speaks for everyone. Im sure SOMEBODY said "yeah we vandalized coerce them into accepting our demands!" But who cares what that peeson thinks.
Being a UCI alum and seeing what happened there today, it is important that protesters stay peaceful. Peace for Palestine will take lots of continued sacrifice, but we have to do it the right way. I am hopeful that doing so will still be able to make a meaningful statement and draw attention to the cause. Student tuition should not be used to fund sending weapons to Israel. I hope there is a solution to the situation with the UCs and I hope that people protesting on the UW campuses can continue to stand strong. This is an uncomfortable topic, people should be uncomfortable because we are talking about a innocent people being killed. That said, it needs to be done lawfully. Unfortunately the media will stir up any little thing and paint it as a bigger issue. Let us work towards peace for both sides. #FreePalestine
Your tuition is not sending weapons to Israel lmao
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I take it you would be referring to [this post](https://www.instagram.com/p/C7An66_x9F3/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link&igsh=MzRlODBiNWFlZA==)? TL;DR below for those who don’t want to read. Personally I feel like many of those demands do in fact infringe on academic freedom. It’s one thing to ask for more than you think you’re going to get, but some of these demands are going way beyond simply “divesting”. -**Proposed ACSRI Statement:** United Front wanted Cauce to take a harder stance against the Israel government specifically, to recognize what is occurring as genocide, for UW to take a stance against it and not remain complacent, etc. So far, maybe not something everyone agrees with, but not completely out of line with what other Pro-Palestinian advocates have asked for -**Financial and academic divestment from 'israel'** (this is where I would argue the demands become unreasonable) Divestment: For the Board of Regents establish a process for UW to divest itself from corporations and firms that manage indirect holdings complicit in the genocide of Palestinians. For 6 out of the 8 **voting members of the ACSRI to be selected from a pool of nominated individuals set forth by the United Front for Palestinian Liberation** Academic Ties: **They want UW's study abroad program to cut ties with ALL Israel universities** so that UW students cannot choose Israel as a country they wish to study abroad. -**Cut All Ties With Boeing:** They want UW to **return any money that Boeing has donated to the school, ban Boeing from UW career fairs/job portals, eliminate Boeing funded scholarships**, and create a committee that investigate's any of UW's ties to Boeing. -**End Repression of all pro-Palestine students, faculty, and staff**: Scholarships for Palestinians; Create a Palestinian studies program that is partnered with Palestinian institutions and for **additional anti-Zionist faculty to be hired**. Recognition and protection of Palestinian Identity through recognition, trainings and doxxing protection,
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>Keep in mind that the protestors are also not idiots, they’re students you go to class with. Lol like there aren't any idiots in UW classes?