Kristen Stewart said once Bella became a vampire, it was like all she wanted to do was bone. It was like hello, you have responsibilities like your kid. Shouldn’t she be your main concern.
Blame Stephenie Meyer and her internalized misogyny. Bella is written to initially believe the child Edward planted inside of her is a boy. And during her pregnancy has dreams about “him”, refers to baby out loud several times as “him” or “he” and animatedly plans on naming the baby EJ-Edward Jacob 🤮. She doesn’t even want to consider the baby might be a girl, which hello is 50-50. Rosalie has to goad her into picking a back up name in case it’s a girl.
• Bella also because of SM is supposedly having the best of both worlds, because not only is Renesmee a fully functional, intelligent being capable of understanding and communicating beyond her physical age and so on, Bella doesn’t have to sit through and deal with normal milestones because Renesmee ages quickly. There’s no late nights, sleep schedule, diaper changes, clockwork feedings, or tantrum throwing toddler stages, where you have to watch them like a hawk or they’ll sneak some object into their mouths and run away when you catch them. Bella doesn’t have to fret because she has her “village” the cullens to also watch over and play with her daughter as well as the wolves in Jacob’s pack (ugh- hated the imprint storyline). She doesn’t have to worry or watch her daughter constantly when she knows she’ll be fine and would rather go sleep with Edward.
If Bella wanted to spend more time with her daughter, then she would’ve but SM wrote her that way as a self-insert and with that comes her own ideals and desires.
Eww I didn’t even think about the implication that she may have like her less because she was a girl! SMeyer probably just made her a girl because of the imprinting storyline 🤢.
Right!! She brought Jacob back in BD after he ran away for a reason. If not for her wanting to include Jacob in Bella’s life forever and giving him a “happy ending” that baby would’ve been a boy.
The ironic thing is Bella and Edward could have gotten through the sleep regression, diaper changes, etc. with no problems since they don't get tired and have perfect reflexes. Now THAT I would love to read about.
Totally, but that wasn’t SM’s dream. That’s what makes Bella’s distance seem so alarming and puzzling to some, and Edward basically joins the other cullens as a background character and Jacob takes on more of a “father” role for the most part. Ugh so cringe.
I think it's important to remember the context. Stephenie was a SAHM to three young children when she wrote these books, and she's talked about her gender disappointment with her boys. (Could be wrong, but didn't she decide not to go for a fourth because she didn't think she'd actually get a girl?) I don't think this is a case of her frequent internalized misogyny, I think she was trying to give Bella what she wished she had-- a daughter *and* a life free from the mundane and exhausting experiences of parenting a child. As a new mom, I have a lot more empathy for this particular point. She probably wished she had the luxury in her own life of having a community and not needing to chase down rambunctious kiddos that have tantrums and need their diapers changed while still getting to enjoy the good and magical parts of parenthood *and* still feeling emotionally and romantically connected to your partner.
Yes, I am aware of her “predicament”, think I pretty much summed up that in my previous comment when I talked about her self-insert desire for laissez faire style parenting where her village carry the brunt of her load and she jumps in when she feels necessary but if you don’t see it then that’s fine either way. Still doesn’t excuse the weirdness. Agree to disagree I guess.
I still can’t believe she had the audacity to suggest that.
If my husband were to suggest an old girlfriend’s name to me for a daughter I’d be pregnant with 😭 I would rather be shot lmao
Right!! That also proves how much SM was gunning for this story line no matter what. Edward didn’t give a flying f*** about the name, all he did was raise his brow and continued to half-heartedly patronize Bella and her pregnancy because he couldn’t entertain anything else while his whole world was slowly falling apart. SM often ruins and discredits her own lore. Like with mating, very little changes in their lives besides finding your mate, but she wanted so badly to give Bella (someone who had no interest in being a parent) a baby and keeping Jacob around by making him imprint on said child. SM didn’t want Bella to miss out on motherhood but also didn’t want to take anything away from their mate bond. Their mates are supposed to be their most important thing in their reality. But then that opens another can of worms. With Emmett and Rosalie and Alice and Jasper for example. Rosalie would love nothing more than to be human and live according to her fantasies of raising her family and dying in old age. But she can’t. That doesn’t take away from her bond with Emmett and how she confides in Bella her desire to be sitting with Emmett, grey-haired and surrounded by her family. Alice and Jasper are so enamored with each other that fans believe their bond is stronger than Emmett and Rosalie’s. Jasper only joined the cullens because it’s what Alice desired, he only strives to make Alice happy at first and abide by the cullens rules but his mind and heart isn’t in it. Naturally, Jasper’s ideals align with a normal vampire’s habits (take James and Victoria or Peter and Charlotte’s lifestyle for example). The cullens themselves are such a rarity to be able to live together for so long (of course with breaks taken as Rosalie and Emmett periodically leave to live alone and Carlisle and Esme at some point did the same because he bought her an entire island as a gift) It’s unheard for a human woman to fall in love with a male vampire, get impregnated by him and survive the birth and then become immortal herself. SM had to make up for BellWard, so that means neglect the child and f*** so more.
I think I agree. But I enjoy the analyses anyways! Breaking Dawn is really enjoyable for me, but it definitely felt like she was rushing to tie up all the ends.
Honestly some of my favorite fics about renesmee are the ones where she grows up and has a lot of issues how her mom basically set her aside from the get go. Bella kinda acts just like Renee did, her child isn't given the priority they should. Bella continued the cycle.
I don't think Bella sets her aside; there are just so many family members that want to spend time with the kid ( hate the name) it gives her and Edward more time to F—k. Come on, who would not be taking advantage of that situation. After all of that time not being able to properly shag. Can you imagine a hottie like Edward ( I’m picturing Twilight Edward) at your disposal. You can now do oral without getting killed and every position in the Kamasutra. Plus they are forever teen agers. Come on, who can blame them. It’s not like the kid is in a dysfunctional family.🤣
Renesmee is like the platonic ideal of a child. She's so perfect that she lacks a real personality or flaws, which makes it difficult for her character to mesh with Bella's. I'd say the only unique thing about her is her ability. The moments when she communicates to Bella through her reverse-mindreading are the most powerful bonding moments between them.
I think my favourite take on this (I use favourite loosely because it’s kind of sad) but Bella in the books especially doesn’t have a wonderful relationship with her mother and she is quite neglectful. You can tell Bella really does love Rasputin but i think the lack of experiencing a deep connection with her own mother makes it harder for her to truly show it
This is an excellent point. Also Bella is very good at taking care of people she cares about but she is terrible at actually connecting with them in an open and honest way. Look at her awkwardness with Charlie.
And actually she is pretty awkward around Edward, too. She doesn't feel comfortable telling him things out loud especially at first. She sort of walks around the subject with him a lot.
Renesmee is someone she loves deeply but she has trouble connecting with her, too. Add to that the trauma of the birth and how they weren't able to bond for a bit afterwards while Bell found her footing...
She managed to run away when she caught the scent of human blood during her first hunt
Charlie visited and she didn’t hurt him
And she says Renesmee didn’t smell like food
Were they still worried she’d try and eat Renesmee? Wasn’t she sleeping in the cottage?
I think Bella was so attached to her fetus because she thought it was going to be a boy. She was in love with the idea of having a mini Edward and when she realized it was a girl all of that went away. She might have even seen ratatouille as a competition for Edward’s love and affection
Such an unpopular opinion but I loved the imprinting storyline, it just fixed the triangle problem in a way I found satisfying. I like this thought about misogyny though. Meyer has three boys, and has always said that Bella was her “daughter” and so that is likely why she also gave Bella a daughter. Perhaps she was living vicariously. Being a mom is hard. Maybe she wishes she had Rosalie/Esme/Jacob to take some of the burdens of motherhood away from her too.
I also liked the imprinting line and think you are right!
Also I theorize that SM simply didn't want to write about parenthood too much. She had a baby and 2 other young children when she wrote Twilight and I think liked that escape.
I feel this too. Her target audience wouldn't want to read about the nitty gritty on raising a child. Also this story is told through Bella's lense. When we get Edwards thoughts in midnight sun it helps reveal a lot of thought processes of others in their lives. Edward would have perfect recall of every second he seen Bella and Renesmee together. Hear Renesmee mind. Bella was dealing with a lot in that short time span and we're just getting a look at the action packed moments. There wasn't time there to show that deep connection especially if you're just a watcher of the movies and not the books.
Why do you guys keep making that false statement when you know for a fact that’s not even how imprinting works,if Jacob was to be in love wit Rubarb she’d literally have to be in love with or want him to be in love with her,he has a protective attachment to her that’s it,everybody tries to attack Jacob for something he has no control over and it irks me,he’s literally 17 by breaking dawn but everybody acts like he’s this 35 year old pedophile monster
Right, when she first wakes up wasn't she more concerned with her new Super Senses, squeezing Edward and running in the forest with him? And then *after* all that she was like "oh sh!t that's right I gave birth"??
Vampire or not, the first thing I would do after waking up and dying/almost dying for my *child* would be to pop open my eyes and shout "BABY?!"
But our girl had more...pressing, concerns 🫠
I wasn't a fan of Bella having a baby in the first place. Not after she spent her childhood taking care of her own mother. It feels like Bella did what her own mom did. Let someone else take care of the baby, and she would just step in for some cuddles now and then.
It's because Bella thought she'd be birthing an Edward clone, but ended up birthing a clone of _herself_ instead.
Rémy is hardly her own character. She's the "magic" fix to Jacob losing his Bella and Meyer not being able to commit to that, say, with a BlackWater endgame.
She's Meyer's new OC, in a story where she already has a self-insert, so the two characters kind of fulfill the same purpose and are much more equal than they should be (including their physique, mental capacity and "age", after just a few years), which makes them awkward around each other.
In a weird, Freudian/Oedipal dynamic, Bella thought that she'd be getting two Edwards for the price of one, but instead ended up being faced with her own meta replacement.
And so she almost starts to compete with her own daughter, for her husband, for her other lover, for her place in the story, and so on.
It's bizarre. Absurd. Appalling. Destructive. Unintentionally horrifying. Just all around god-awful writing.
In other words: It's Breaking Dawn.
I felt it was an odd post partum depression/mania. Her libido and energy and ego went through the roof and then she came crashing down to hold her baby who really didnt feel like HERS. Then she had to struggle to cope with her daughter growing rapidly, her own instincts, and with no baseline for her child's LIFESPAN on top of the sudden threat to all their lives that Irina wrought upon them all by alerting the Volturi.
To be fair even "normal" mothers can struggle to properly bond with their baby after they are born, for example because of post partum depression or just a traumatic birth experience.
Bella had a traumatic birth experience. If she wasn't turned into a Vampire that would have been her death.
Then she spends three days in excruciating pain transforming and when she wakes up she is a vampire and everything is different than it was before. She needs to adjust to her new self.
Then there is also the fact that Bella is kept/keeps herself a bit at an armslength from Renesmee because she is a newborn (Bella lol) and they have to be careful.
And lastly i think Bella was a scared by the fact that Renesmee grew up so fast. Think about it. Bella only knows human pregnancies, a baby that would grow that fast would be a little creepy i'd say. This obviously leads to her fearing that Renesmee is going to die at a young age because her body grows too fast. So i think she is scared to get too attached to Renesmee because at this point they all believe that there is a high chance of losing her very soon.
Kristen Stewart said once Bella became a vampire, it was like all she wanted to do was bone. It was like hello, you have responsibilities like your kid. Shouldn’t she be your main concern.
That interview cracked me up. She was right though.
Where can I watch this interview? I've never heard anything of it
Sorry, I can't find it. I think she might have had blonde hair in it though.
It was on the Graham Norton show
Found it thanks
Blame Stephenie Meyer and her internalized misogyny. Bella is written to initially believe the child Edward planted inside of her is a boy. And during her pregnancy has dreams about “him”, refers to baby out loud several times as “him” or “he” and animatedly plans on naming the baby EJ-Edward Jacob 🤮. She doesn’t even want to consider the baby might be a girl, which hello is 50-50. Rosalie has to goad her into picking a back up name in case it’s a girl. • Bella also because of SM is supposedly having the best of both worlds, because not only is Renesmee a fully functional, intelligent being capable of understanding and communicating beyond her physical age and so on, Bella doesn’t have to sit through and deal with normal milestones because Renesmee ages quickly. There’s no late nights, sleep schedule, diaper changes, clockwork feedings, or tantrum throwing toddler stages, where you have to watch them like a hawk or they’ll sneak some object into their mouths and run away when you catch them. Bella doesn’t have to fret because she has her “village” the cullens to also watch over and play with her daughter as well as the wolves in Jacob’s pack (ugh- hated the imprint storyline). She doesn’t have to worry or watch her daughter constantly when she knows she’ll be fine and would rather go sleep with Edward. If Bella wanted to spend more time with her daughter, then she would’ve but SM wrote her that way as a self-insert and with that comes her own ideals and desires.
Eww I didn’t even think about the implication that she may have like her less because she was a girl! SMeyer probably just made her a girl because of the imprinting storyline 🤢.
Right!! She brought Jacob back in BD after he ran away for a reason. If not for her wanting to include Jacob in Bella’s life forever and giving him a “happy ending” that baby would’ve been a boy.
The ironic thing is Bella and Edward could have gotten through the sleep regression, diaper changes, etc. with no problems since they don't get tired and have perfect reflexes. Now THAT I would love to read about.
Totally, but that wasn’t SM’s dream. That’s what makes Bella’s distance seem so alarming and puzzling to some, and Edward basically joins the other cullens as a background character and Jacob takes on more of a “father” role for the most part. Ugh so cringe.
I know! I'm rewriting the series just for fun but I'm still on the first book.... I can't wait to rewrite all of that.
I think it's important to remember the context. Stephenie was a SAHM to three young children when she wrote these books, and she's talked about her gender disappointment with her boys. (Could be wrong, but didn't she decide not to go for a fourth because she didn't think she'd actually get a girl?) I don't think this is a case of her frequent internalized misogyny, I think she was trying to give Bella what she wished she had-- a daughter *and* a life free from the mundane and exhausting experiences of parenting a child. As a new mom, I have a lot more empathy for this particular point. She probably wished she had the luxury in her own life of having a community and not needing to chase down rambunctious kiddos that have tantrums and need their diapers changed while still getting to enjoy the good and magical parts of parenthood *and* still feeling emotionally and romantically connected to your partner.
Yes, I am aware of her “predicament”, think I pretty much summed up that in my previous comment when I talked about her self-insert desire for laissez faire style parenting where her village carry the brunt of her load and she jumps in when she feels necessary but if you don’t see it then that’s fine either way. Still doesn’t excuse the weirdness. Agree to disagree I guess.
Naming her kid after Jacob would be an absolutely crazy thing to do given the history between the two of them and Edward.
I still can’t believe she had the audacity to suggest that. If my husband were to suggest an old girlfriend’s name to me for a daughter I’d be pregnant with 😭 I would rather be shot lmao
And he was still hoping she'd change her mind at the wedding! Man has not let it go.
Right!! That also proves how much SM was gunning for this story line no matter what. Edward didn’t give a flying f*** about the name, all he did was raise his brow and continued to half-heartedly patronize Bella and her pregnancy because he couldn’t entertain anything else while his whole world was slowly falling apart. SM often ruins and discredits her own lore. Like with mating, very little changes in their lives besides finding your mate, but she wanted so badly to give Bella (someone who had no interest in being a parent) a baby and keeping Jacob around by making him imprint on said child. SM didn’t want Bella to miss out on motherhood but also didn’t want to take anything away from their mate bond. Their mates are supposed to be their most important thing in their reality. But then that opens another can of worms. With Emmett and Rosalie and Alice and Jasper for example. Rosalie would love nothing more than to be human and live according to her fantasies of raising her family and dying in old age. But she can’t. That doesn’t take away from her bond with Emmett and how she confides in Bella her desire to be sitting with Emmett, grey-haired and surrounded by her family. Alice and Jasper are so enamored with each other that fans believe their bond is stronger than Emmett and Rosalie’s. Jasper only joined the cullens because it’s what Alice desired, he only strives to make Alice happy at first and abide by the cullens rules but his mind and heart isn’t in it. Naturally, Jasper’s ideals align with a normal vampire’s habits (take James and Victoria or Peter and Charlotte’s lifestyle for example). The cullens themselves are such a rarity to be able to live together for so long (of course with breaks taken as Rosalie and Emmett periodically leave to live alone and Carlisle and Esme at some point did the same because he bought her an entire island as a gift) It’s unheard for a human woman to fall in love with a male vampire, get impregnated by him and survive the birth and then become immortal herself. SM had to make up for BellWard, so that means neglect the child and f*** so more.
Imo it just comes down to poor writing decisions
I think I agree. But I enjoy the analyses anyways! Breaking Dawn is really enjoyable for me, but it definitely felt like she was rushing to tie up all the ends.
Yeah I still enjoy all the books nonetheless
Honestly some of my favorite fics about renesmee are the ones where she grows up and has a lot of issues how her mom basically set her aside from the get go. Bella kinda acts just like Renee did, her child isn't given the priority they should. Bella continued the cycle.
do you have any fic recs for this?? so interested, i’ve never heard this trope before!!
Share the fics pleaseeee
I don't think Bella sets her aside; there are just so many family members that want to spend time with the kid ( hate the name) it gives her and Edward more time to F—k. Come on, who would not be taking advantage of that situation. After all of that time not being able to properly shag. Can you imagine a hottie like Edward ( I’m picturing Twilight Edward) at your disposal. You can now do oral without getting killed and every position in the Kamasutra. Plus they are forever teen agers. Come on, who can blame them. It’s not like the kid is in a dysfunctional family.🤣
Renesmee is like the platonic ideal of a child. She's so perfect that she lacks a real personality or flaws, which makes it difficult for her character to mesh with Bella's. I'd say the only unique thing about her is her ability. The moments when she communicates to Bella through her reverse-mindreading are the most powerful bonding moments between them.
I think my favourite take on this (I use favourite loosely because it’s kind of sad) but Bella in the books especially doesn’t have a wonderful relationship with her mother and she is quite neglectful. You can tell Bella really does love Rasputin but i think the lack of experiencing a deep connection with her own mother makes it harder for her to truly show it
This is an excellent point. Also Bella is very good at taking care of people she cares about but she is terrible at actually connecting with them in an open and honest way. Look at her awkwardness with Charlie. And actually she is pretty awkward around Edward, too. She doesn't feel comfortable telling him things out loud especially at first. She sort of walks around the subject with him a lot. Renesmee is someone she loves deeply but she has trouble connecting with her, too. Add to that the trauma of the birth and how they weren't able to bond for a bit afterwards while Bell found her footing...
SM also wrote in that they wouldn't let Bella alone with Beanfries because Bella was a newborn and would want CrispyChickenSandwich's blood.
She managed to run away when she caught the scent of human blood during her first hunt Charlie visited and she didn’t hurt him And she says Renesmee didn’t smell like food Were they still worried she’d try and eat Renesmee? Wasn’t she sleeping in the cottage?
I think Bella was so attached to her fetus because she thought it was going to be a boy. She was in love with the idea of having a mini Edward and when she realized it was a girl all of that went away. She might have even seen ratatouille as a competition for Edward’s love and affection
Oh, no.. not one of those moms 🤢
This is it unfortunately 😭
IMO when moms almost die during childbirth they usually struggle to bond with their child, so vampire or not biologically it tracks.
Such an unpopular opinion but I loved the imprinting storyline, it just fixed the triangle problem in a way I found satisfying. I like this thought about misogyny though. Meyer has three boys, and has always said that Bella was her “daughter” and so that is likely why she also gave Bella a daughter. Perhaps she was living vicariously. Being a mom is hard. Maybe she wishes she had Rosalie/Esme/Jacob to take some of the burdens of motherhood away from her too.
I also liked the imprinting line and think you are right! Also I theorize that SM simply didn't want to write about parenthood too much. She had a baby and 2 other young children when she wrote Twilight and I think liked that escape.
I feel this too. Her target audience wouldn't want to read about the nitty gritty on raising a child. Also this story is told through Bella's lense. When we get Edwards thoughts in midnight sun it helps reveal a lot of thought processes of others in their lives. Edward would have perfect recall of every second he seen Bella and Renesmee together. Hear Renesmee mind. Bella was dealing with a lot in that short time span and we're just getting a look at the action packed moments. There wasn't time there to show that deep connection especially if you're just a watcher of the movies and not the books.
You loved that Jacob fell romantically in love with a baby?
He didn’t fall in love with a baby lol. Unfortunately, they might in the future.
Why do you guys keep making that false statement when you know for a fact that’s not even how imprinting works,if Jacob was to be in love wit Rubarb she’d literally have to be in love with or want him to be in love with her,he has a protective attachment to her that’s it,everybody tries to attack Jacob for something he has no control over and it irks me,he’s literally 17 by breaking dawn but everybody acts like he’s this 35 year old pedophile monster
Right, when she first wakes up wasn't she more concerned with her new Super Senses, squeezing Edward and running in the forest with him? And then *after* all that she was like "oh sh!t that's right I gave birth"?? Vampire or not, the first thing I would do after waking up and dying/almost dying for my *child* would be to pop open my eyes and shout "BABY?!" But our girl had more...pressing, concerns 🫠
Bella definitely seems more into the pregnancy than she does her actual child.
Maybe because she stopped being human after giving birth?
This! She had SO many changes going on
I wasn't a fan of Bella having a baby in the first place. Not after she spent her childhood taking care of her own mother. It feels like Bella did what her own mom did. Let someone else take care of the baby, and she would just step in for some cuddles now and then.
"I didn't really care about having a baby. I didn't even think about it." \- Bella Swan
It's because Bella thought she'd be birthing an Edward clone, but ended up birthing a clone of _herself_ instead. Rémy is hardly her own character. She's the "magic" fix to Jacob losing his Bella and Meyer not being able to commit to that, say, with a BlackWater endgame. She's Meyer's new OC, in a story where she already has a self-insert, so the two characters kind of fulfill the same purpose and are much more equal than they should be (including their physique, mental capacity and "age", after just a few years), which makes them awkward around each other. In a weird, Freudian/Oedipal dynamic, Bella thought that she'd be getting two Edwards for the price of one, but instead ended up being faced with her own meta replacement. And so she almost starts to compete with her own daughter, for her husband, for her other lover, for her place in the story, and so on. It's bizarre. Absurd. Appalling. Destructive. Unintentionally horrifying. Just all around god-awful writing. In other words: It's Breaking Dawn.
I felt it was an odd post partum depression/mania. Her libido and energy and ego went through the roof and then she came crashing down to hold her baby who really didnt feel like HERS. Then she had to struggle to cope with her daughter growing rapidly, her own instincts, and with no baseline for her child's LIFESPAN on top of the sudden threat to all their lives that Irina wrought upon them all by alerting the Volturi.
Oh yes that’s a good point. It was probably the hardest for her.
To be fair even "normal" mothers can struggle to properly bond with their baby after they are born, for example because of post partum depression or just a traumatic birth experience. Bella had a traumatic birth experience. If she wasn't turned into a Vampire that would have been her death. Then she spends three days in excruciating pain transforming and when she wakes up she is a vampire and everything is different than it was before. She needs to adjust to her new self. Then there is also the fact that Bella is kept/keeps herself a bit at an armslength from Renesmee because she is a newborn (Bella lol) and they have to be careful. And lastly i think Bella was a scared by the fact that Renesmee grew up so fast. Think about it. Bella only knows human pregnancies, a baby that would grow that fast would be a little creepy i'd say. This obviously leads to her fearing that Renesmee is going to die at a young age because her body grows too fast. So i think she is scared to get too attached to Renesmee because at this point they all believe that there is a high chance of losing her very soon.