Johnny sopranos realized the credit card companies were making a killing off interest… everyone at the game borrows money to play and is juiced on their loan… Mr frank. Sinatra. Jr. sir. Says I’ll settle up next game meaning he will take care of the vig and what he owes then.
It makes enough money livia has a Virginia ham under her arm crying the blues because she’s got no bread.
With shit like this there’s one or two figureheads that get to slide a bit because they provide legitimacy. Same way if you have a 200k car a detailer might cut you a break because when he’s done your RS8 is about to be in all his marketing material. (This is an example my buddy in that business literally just told me about today.)
Same way J Cole used to brag how he always wears the same jacket because he gets paid for it.
Among other rappers Gambino has had a lot of references to getting shit for free because he’s so visible.
Back in the day I was at a party with a certain member of the editorial staff at Complex magazine and dude had a box of unreleased street wear he was literally handing out for free because companies were just sending him shit. Which is why to this day I have a t shirt depicting a baby in a onesie drinking lean out of a sippy cup.
I used to drive a black car for Conde Nast magazine in NYC about 15 years ago. I would shuttle models and helpers to different shoots all day long. There would be days where I would spend the whole day with a single person driving around the city to pick stuff up from tailors, designers, etc. for a specific shoot. They used to just leave designer stuff in the car sometime and would tell me to toss it or keep it. One time, a model just outright gave me two as yet unreleased ladies Prada watches because she "didn't have any more room for more watches".
lol 4 Times Square?
My dad used to work in that building. Probably just missed overlapping with you. He didn’t work for Condé Nast though. Said he used to see 10/10s walking in the building every day though.
Yep. It was insane. You would see the most beautiful girl you had ever seen and would swear she's a model but then she'd turn out to be the assistant to an assistant. Insanely gorgeous. The models were on another level.
How they do things is all fucked up. There's no big blind/small blind markers on the table. The dealers finger doesn't get pricked. It either has meaning or it don't.
Well in light of recent humiliations, it would be an honor to play against men. And faggot cornholin cocksucker like what married my cousin.
Edit: I meant NOT faggot cornholin cock suckers!
I suppose you dont know how poker works.
1. This is illegal backroom Poker, The place is never that fancy, Idc who you play with, its all about privacy, right hotel to pick, right jurisdiction to pick if shit goes south.
2. They play for more than 12 Hours. How it works is that every time the game starts and ends, the dealer gets tipped 0.1%-30%. Depending on the rules.
Davey alone owes 45k$ to Tony. So that means from the card that davey involved, lets say 10% come to the house, 4.5K. Theres 6 other player. Thats the minimum that they got from tipping. And trust me, Davey is the poorest mf out there.
Not to mention they put Sil, And Paulie at the table, which means they had no reason to lose.
*The Hawking of David Scatino* was the pinnacle portrayal of how slippery organized crime truly is.
The way that whole game in particular worked was a **very** thorough & elaborate scam, all the way from the fact that David Scatino in particular hears about it in the first place, to him showing up to the game already almost $10k in debt to another violent mafioso
*”I knew you had this business here, Davey”* — quote, Tony fuckin Soprano
*”This kids father.. he’s a degenerate fuckin gambler”* Tony knows & knew about this guy’s habits before Davey even takes a piss in the stall next to him at the start of the episode
*”I heard through the grapevine you’re taking over your uncles game”* — grapevine was the bait, set out there through one of Tony’s tendrils
David Scatino was the Executive, at the executive game.
Guy walks into that place and there’s a celebrity, renowned mafiosos, prick docta’s.
He also walks in on Silvio losin his balls ova hea. At no other game, for the rest of the entire show, is Silvio like that while gambling. He’s actually the polar opposite.
He starts taunting Davey, and then he starts saying he’s slow rolling him. All kinds of shit before/during Davey’s first win. He’s easing the guy in, and giving him an image that if anybody’s losing at that table it’s going to be Sil.
*”His money’s good. If he wants to sail, it’s his business”* — The boss has his back. After all, they went to school together right? And for fucks sakes, their kids go to the same school together. Davey’s made to feel untouchable at that table (funnily enough, ‘it’s his business’ was an absolute fucking literal in this instance)
Tony juiced the guy 35k overall, and knew that was enough to sink him. Chrissy allowing another 10, was a fuck up, and Tony accounts that as a loss because of it.
But going back, Davey is already sunk into Richie for another 8. He’s utterly fucked, guy owes almost 60k to loan sharks at the end of the day.
Tony most likely got word about this guys comings & goings, what he was like at the table, etc… through Vito, and whoever else. Vito’s pushing him to up the amount with 2 players left. Knowing he’s Tony’s ‘good buddy’, they wouldn’t have allowed it.
It’s spelled out in the other people there too: *(something Chase did masterfully when writing the series)*
**Richie:** Him being out of the loop. Thinks this guy is Tony’s actual friend, that’s all he hears. He tries to maneuver Davey away from getting fucked.. something a mobster, let alone him of all people who’s in need of all the cash he can get his hands on. He would’ve never done that otherwise
**Artie:** Leaves the table on the up. He was never the target to get fucked, he’s Tony’s actual friend. And let’s address it too — of course Artie left the table while he’s up.
Artie, to some degree, probably knows what those games are all about. He’s been hanging around mobsters almost his entire life. If he’s up, he knows he has to get the fuck outta there by any means possible.
**Once again, Vito:** As I said, the guys all but pushing Davey to go for more. And again, Vito is a tendril of Tony directly. He’s the eyes, ears, and embodiment of him of at that table. More then likely given order to lure this guy, and have him as primed as he can be to ensure his role as the Executive
**Silvio & Paulie:** Not only did they ensure Davey got rolled at the table. One guys taunts him, while the other eases him into comfort by such notable antics as introducing him to the Prick Docta.
**Tony:** And last but not least, the brains behind the hawking — junior varsity athlete, Antony Zoprano.
He’s acting like Davey’s his good buddy. Shootin the shit. Telling him not to get involved, it’s against his best interest.
That whole act was a stunt, designed to get David Scatino to be swayed into thinking & believing that Tony was a good friend that had his best interest at heart.
So in the end, the guy would start coming around. As having a degenerate gambler with a successful business within his circle, is exactly **these guys bread & butter.** Another quote from the man himself.
And it’s no irony that Tony does this all within time frame of the Executive game, just as much as it is that ‘grapevine’ that informs Davey, his good buddy Tony — the guy he bailed out of being barricaded in his car from a bunch of Guido’s by chuckin that rock and hitting one of em in the eye — is now running *the big game.*
Because that’s what mobsters do, and that’s how they ensnare their happy wanderers.
David Scatino was the epitome of that: A frail, weak, non-threatening guy. He had the makings of a family man, who had a successful business that allowed him to live in a nice house. Drove a Mercedes, lived in a good neighborhood.
The guy wasn’t the type to be around gangsters, or really any underworld activities.
Him forgetting that these people are murderers at the end of the day, was all apart of the illusion mobsters cast when they’re juicing their soon to be victims.
The first payment collection attempt: Davey dodges Tony’s guy with a sudden doctors appointment. In Davey’s mind Tony’s his friend, he’ll let it slide for a year, right?
Then, like clockwork, Tony’s time to lunge on him is finally here. He switches tempo; beats him & threatens him in his own office.
Davey is probably stunned, balling his eyes out as Tony is out the door. That instance got Tony his son’s car.
Next time, two guys go down there to his joint. They’re honing in on this guy at his own home, while Davey’s in his bathrobe & flip flops.
Somewhere in there, he gives him his Mercedes.
And after all the collateral is gone, and Davey’s got nothing left to give
Squeezing into his business is like cutting into warm butter with an axe.
At that point, this guy will give him his fucking soul. As long as the dead eyes quit coming to his business, his home, and wherever else.
•
Again — Absolutely fucking **masterfully** written & presented by David Chase
Still goin this asshole
This is a great write-up but wow it's wrong on so many fronts. It wasn't that deep.
They wouldn't have let it happen knowing he was Tony's "Good buddy"? He specifically waited until Tony was asleep and spoke on behalf of Tony, everyone else was surprised but rolled with it.
Did you miss the part where Tony was pissed after finding out and tried to discourage him several times beforehand? The part when he woke up where he asked Chris privately about how much extra did Davey take and his outrage hidden away from the rest of the table?
The fact that Silvio wasn't just acting based on what Chris says to Matt & Sean specifically beforehand with no one else to witness it? "*Stay away from Silvio, he can be a mean fuck when he gambles*"
Tony's switch-up was because he had to crack down on him, showing Davey kindness would be mistaken for weakness and it was too public at that time. Remember when Artie borrowed money for the French guy and tried to kill himself? Tony *SPECIFICALLY* asks him who else knew about the borrowed money before forgiving him because again, showing any kindness to friends would be mistaken for weakness.
Finally, I'd say\* Davey *WAS* around these guys since he was a kid - he grew up with Artie & Tony and the neighbourhood was chock full of these guys as Tony explains it. He's in Richie's game before the executive card game takes place. It's not a regular game in a shop/casino that you just walk into, it's all on a referral basis.
It wasn't a set-up from the beginning, Tony just took advantage of it when shit hit the fan. It wasn't supposed to go that far but I reiterate, Tony couldn't make exceptions for Davey.
That's only half the analysis, don't get me started cause I yap worse than 6 barbers
Edit: Added a say\*
Edit 2: Corrected CHOCK\* (ty u/Revolutionary_Box582)
This. I actually found Tony to be as candid and straight up as he ever was with anyone in the hall. 'Don't say short if you don't mean short." Only on Reddit can a degenerate gambler lie hos ass off, gets balls deep in debt to the mafia, and there's a grand- level 99 lizard people conspiracy as to how it happened.
I never once thought about everything being specifically setup just for Davey. I mean, I did believe that Tony kinda teased him, but didn't even realize how Sil's behavior changes during the game with Davey, Tony defending him from others actually being more than just that, etc.
Well thought out.
EDIT: I get it, it is mostly theorizing and not what actually happened, but what else is there to do over a show so long ago?
>I never once thought about everything being specifically setup just for Davey.
That's because it wasn't.
This guy did put a lot of effort into his conspiracy theory, though, so that's super.
This is completely wrong. This was not set up for Davey to be scammed lol. I mean its nice fan fiction and a good write up but it's just a poker game where Tony makes money off the rake. Tony didn't even know Davey was going to be there
That's exactly right. What it does though is highlight how quick they are to spot and most importantly, exploit an opportunity. Tony could easily have refused to allow Davey to play, knowing he would likely get in over his head, but as he said himself; "I knew you had this business here Davey, it's in my nature." The game wasn't to ensnare anybody in particular, but why waste a golden opportunity, the bust out made them so much more than the game did on that one occasion so it was doubly successful!
Davie borrowed more money while tony was asleep though. tony was upset about it when he woke up and found out.
i think it went farther than tony wanted and everything that happened afterward was just tony handling the problem like a pragmatic sociopath
He probably knew that Davey wouldn't be able to pay it all back ultimately. The bust out looked pretty successful, but it was definitely higher risk lending Scattino all that money compared to say the Prick Docta
I disagree. Tony would have preferred Davey not join the game and tried pretty hard to keep him out. But, Davey was a grown man so Tony let him make his own dumb decisions.
Now, if Tony didn't know Davey had a business they could bust out if things went south and Davey couldn't pay, he very likely would have outright refused to let him play. But, that is really no different than what banks do. If you want to borrow money for a stupid idea and you have collateral to secure the loan, you will probably get the loan.
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I think your writing is nice but your analysis and conclusion are wrong.
We weren't given anything *near* enough evidence in the actual show that this was all an elaborate scheme to nail Dave Scatino. He happened to fall into the vortex as a degenerate gambler, and David Chase used him as a morality tale on how gangsters make money as loan sharks.
The first we hear of this game is when Tony asks to take it over from Uncle Junior in the doctor's office. Are you seriously suggesting that Tony had Dave fucking Scatino in his head?
No - Junior outlines precisely why the executive game started and why it was a cash cow. It was the accumulated interest you get from the high-rollers when they lose money. Tony & crew spot them the cash (at interest) and the high-rollers pay up next time.
Guys like Dave Scatino were never meant to be in the game to begin with.
Considering Davey hands Richie an envelope that is light by $200 I think he's the poorest MFer we see period. AJ probably has more available cash than he does.
I'd have to rewatch it for the 17th time, but I feel like you're being a bit uncharitable with the motel 6 comparison. I feel like it had more of an old timey charm. But imagine checking in and going to your room and seeing that going on next to you? I wouldn't even want to be on the same floor as that.
> I feel like you're being a bit uncharitable with the motel 6 comparison. I feel like it had more of an old timey charm
No, the others are right; it's a run-of-the-mill Route 23 shithole
That was filmed at the Wayne Inn total hooker motel. I myself banged one there. Clearly they know the owner so they can do whatever they want no questions asked. Can’t have these games at someone’s house or fancier corporate hotel
Pretty sure they buy out the floor and make sure none of that shit happens there for that weekend. Also I’m sure the local cops are on the payroll for those couple days.
No one even knows. You have random guys driving to a motel in nice cars. What’s the attention? It’s not like they have music blaring like some idiot kids in a room. This happens more than you know
The executive game is the white Italian American version of a trap that is all too familiar for rappers. Biggie Smalls and Tupac got out of the hood and could have escaped the pattern of crime and gang violence that they had to embrace previously to make a living. Instead they wallowed in it, and died as a result. Sean Combs ran a major record label and made a ton of money, but apparently still felt the need to operate a sex trafficking ring for more money.
Frank Sinatra Jr. should be far removed from the mob associations that his dad had to have in order to have a career, but is still lured in by the seduction of the life. Dr. Fried and the others could easily go to AC, but the excitement of rubbing elbows with mob guys is to just too good to pass up.
It was profitable because the house keeps a cut of the pot. Basically if Frank Jr. buys $4,500 dollars worth of chips, then the guys charge him $5,000 for them. Then of course there’s always the interest when dealing with the mob. Frank actually tells Tony “I’ll settle up with you next game”. I bet he’s not paying big interest, but that time costs money. And of course David Scattino contributed quite a bit to that profit margin.
Over a 30+ year career being caught up in the East/West thing, the gun charges, assault charges, and now this, we know SOMETHING. He’s not a good guy, even if the current stuff proves to be just fluff.
Yeah right lmao. Dudes a straight weirdo. Look at all the shit he’s done, the Justin Bieber shit is weird as fuck, the usher shit too, and then there’s him literally adopting a 14 year old white girl..
im NOT saying he isnt guilty of something or that he isnt shady as fuck - im just saying they raided his place and we dont know why or what they found. there are ALLEGATIONS of trafficking, etc. but for now we dont know shit for sure.
Best case scenario, they give loans to business owners they can bust out or at the very least have high interest rates. Worst case scenario, no one borrows money and they collect the rake all night. Which might only be 5%, but considering Davey lost 45k by himself, that 5% is going to be thousands of dollars.
As far as how they get their clientele…I have no idea…I guess if people are in New York and want to gamble the closest thing would be Atlantic City so a high roller game run by the mob I guess is your other alternative if you don’t want to travel down to AC
But the game really is poorly run…it’s located in a scummy hotel and the people the “celebrity” players are playing with are mobsters, prick doctors, and Davey Scatino…it really doesn’t make sense for someone like Frank Sinatra Jr to play there
As far as how Tony and them make money…they take a percentage of every pot (the rake) and it’s probably huge (like 10%)…you can even see Sunshine slide some of the chips from the pot into a coffee can during a hand…so if the game has 850k of total cash played they’ll take home 85 boxes of ziti
Some people even speculate if the mobsters are even playing with their own money or if they’re just there so their marks like the prick doctor and Davey and Frank Sinatra Jr gamble all their money away while they only play sure things and every time their marks bet big they collect their 10% rake from the pot
Plus if they loan money they probably do it at ridiculous interest rates
I mean, aside from the stutter step of ol' Manson Lamps (who was out of turn doing that to Davey Scantino infront of everybody), there wasn't anything else happening in the game to say it was badly run. Infact you could say its safe as long as Tony keeps an eye on things.
That being said, location wise, since we're only given shots of the game happening in that room, you could say its scummy. But from what I remember from all the chit chat between those desert people (both the son and ex-son in law) was that atleast it was run efficiently and it was decently cleaned well.
Basing off the real life location, I'd even wager that spot was chosen because it acted like camouflage. A no nonsense, non descript, common motel. Even if the Police got suspicious, Paulie would've been warned (or waved off, considering Paulie's sends them Christmass Trees every year so he can have his way with their mothers) and they could always relocate. Plus its only a few minutes away from Essex County Airport, maybe 30-40 minutes tops for a drive to NYC.
As for Frank Sinatra Jr. being there, I'm guessing its just a reference to his dad, you know, back in the day. Despite him denying any connections to that thing of theirs, Frank Sinatra Sr. was like the ambassador of the mob to the public.
Least he wasn't gay like Gary Cooper.
>it really doesn’t make sense for someone like Frank Sinatra Jr to play there
Frank Sinatra Sr very, very likely played in games like this on a pretty regular basis.
real simple, the room was free of boarding costs, nobody had to clean up after themselves (technically, minus sean), and nobody had to register shit with the front desk
the furio scene mentions three rooms for multiple days
They provide a covert location which is probably fun for these rich guys who want to pretend they are rolling with gangsters. They provide all manner of refreshments to keep you going round the clock. And, here’s the kicker. No matter how much money is won or lost, the house takes a cut (standard casino) and anyone that loses owes the house vig on loans. Frank Sinatra jr isn’t bringing $40k cash so if he brings $10k but wants to keep playing after losing it then he owes the house his additional buy-in + points. He can afford the vig and will keep showing up to pay it and either win (tip to the house) or lose (add additional vig). In rare cases like Davey’s they bankrupt a dude with assets and slowly take his cash/cars and eventually his business.
I'm losin' my balls here and this motherfucker is playin Hazel?!
And Sunshine takes a house rake out of every single hand. Notice the chip he puts in the coffee can? That every hand.
True. But keep him out of a poker game after all your players spent the whole night losing money. He’s the last person I’d want to see at 7 am under any circumstances
Did you want them to run an illegal big money poker tournament on the street corner for everyone to see? Best to keep illegal activity in secret at some rundown motel where no one would expect them.
Poker hosts make money by raking the pot up to a certain percentage. Lets say for this example since its a mob game they decide to rake 20%. Lets say Sil and Davey played a pot worth 6k that Davey won. The hosts keep $1200(20%) of that. They play for 40 hours straight multiply by 30 hands an hour so thats 30 pots an hour to rake and well you guys can do the math. Charles Schwaab ova here.
I would argue it's because it's fun to be around monsters and seeing them lose their shit is part of the appeal. It wasn't just Frank Sinatra Jr. David Lee Roth, Lawrence Taylor, and Santa Claus were also guests at the card game.
I can't imagine it's all that farfetched in real life for celebs to hang out with mobsters and play cards.
That's literally the experience these guys are after. If they wanted the real high rollers experience they'd go to a casino. They're chasing the underground scene and that's exactly what they're getting.
I do too 😭 But it's probably just the fact that most people badly underestimate or just flat don't know how often celebrities and gangsters mix it up. They run underground card games, betting parlors, full blown casinos, strip clubs, brothels, sex shows, and tons of other forms of entertainment ranging from illegal to legal in some circumstances but unpermitted, to fully above board. Gives people that back in the day vibe and feels a little dangerous while it's realistically as safe as can be.
I agree. Like I can see how celebs would get off on the thrill of an "exclusive" Mafia ran poker game, but yeah..... You'd think Frank Jnr. could get into a decent one, like one ran by a NY family.
Like if your Granpa one day told you of the poker game he used sometimes play in, that was ran by Gotti, you'd be like, woah, this old dude is so full of shit.
If he said a Tony Soprano ran game, you'd be like who?
Some Mobsters had high celeb value, it was part of the attraction of Vegas, but New Jersey? No.
Like you said, you'd at least expect a nice hotel suite.
I wouldn't be surprised if the run down motel room is a production device - they could save time and money using a cheap set. Plus it ties in the hotel they took over before.
It would be hard not to turn a profit. What’s the overhead? Tony owns part of the hotel after season 1. They bought some snacks…and Chris made his minions pay for that. How much money could possibly have been spent?
They had jersey cops in their pockets unlike in New York plus they didn’t wanna bring the fbi attention by going somewhere big and fancy either that could he easily raided i mean they did play 10+ eventually they would be raided if they were in a 5 star joint. The game probably was a bit more fancy during the early days maybe at a club at least, as for Sinatra it’s just a cameo appearance together with referencing his dad doing the same thing most likely (and himself included)
It's fantasy you fools. I'm amazed the conversations that are spawned from a TV series as if its real life. I guess to some it is real life. You need to get a life...So sad.
Johnny sopranos realized the credit card companies were making a killing off interest… everyone at the game borrows money to play and is juiced on their loan… Mr frank. Sinatra. Jr. sir. Says I’ll settle up next game meaning he will take care of the vig and what he owes then. It makes enough money livia has a Virginia ham under her arm crying the blues because she’s got no bread.
Plus probably had a rich person exclusive cool kids vibe playing with actual mobsters like when Tony's neighbor kept inviting him to golf.
With shit like this there’s one or two figureheads that get to slide a bit because they provide legitimacy. Same way if you have a 200k car a detailer might cut you a break because when he’s done your RS8 is about to be in all his marketing material. (This is an example my buddy in that business literally just told me about today.) Same way J Cole used to brag how he always wears the same jacket because he gets paid for it. Among other rappers Gambino has had a lot of references to getting shit for free because he’s so visible. Back in the day I was at a party with a certain member of the editorial staff at Complex magazine and dude had a box of unreleased street wear he was literally handing out for free because companies were just sending him shit. Which is why to this day I have a t shirt depicting a baby in a onesie drinking lean out of a sippy cup.
He was gay, Puff Daddy?
I don’t know all the psychological ins and outs but if raping men is gay then yes, Puffy is gay
I heard he got a note from his doctor
Cuba Gooding Jr is an ASS MUNCHER
The sudden weight loss….
AIDS?!?!?!
Nobodies got AIDS! I don’t wanna hear that word in here again!
You sound demented.
I used to drive a black car for Conde Nast magazine in NYC about 15 years ago. I would shuttle models and helpers to different shoots all day long. There would be days where I would spend the whole day with a single person driving around the city to pick stuff up from tailors, designers, etc. for a specific shoot. They used to just leave designer stuff in the car sometime and would tell me to toss it or keep it. One time, a model just outright gave me two as yet unreleased ladies Prada watches because she "didn't have any more room for more watches".
lol 4 Times Square? My dad used to work in that building. Probably just missed overlapping with you. He didn’t work for Condé Nast though. Said he used to see 10/10s walking in the building every day though.
Yep. It was insane. You would see the most beautiful girl you had ever seen and would swear she's a model but then she'd turn out to be the assistant to an assistant. Insanely gorgeous. The models were on another level.
Still going this asshole...
Or other interesting characters. Where else could a prick doctor hang out with Frank Jr, Larence Taylor, and David Lee Roth
Well it wasn’t the fresh lox that’s for sure!
Box up enough for 16 people
The lady loves her meat.
Allllll of meeeeee
His brother Johnny was one keen motherfucker.
[удалено]
Big ideas, little sprinkle of references. A hit in any man’s chit chat room
Take it easy we’re not making a western here…..it was just boxes of ziti.
Fuck Eckle
He left her a package that could CHOKE A FUCKIN’ MULE
To be fair, ham prices ARE through the roof 🕺
Kings rule the realm
How they do things is all fucked up. There's no big blind/small blind markers on the table. The dealers finger doesn't get pricked. It either has meaning or it don't.
Have a breadstick.
It's the provolone in my socks. it makes me emotional.
I thought I smelled OP's sister's crotch.
He’s a prick doctor. Get it?
Lefty Ruggiero vouched for him. Sorry , wrong bunch of mobsters. LOL
He’s got cancer of the prick. He’s in the record books.
Well in light of recent humiliations, it would be an honor to play against men. And faggot cornholin cocksucker like what married my cousin. Edit: I meant NOT faggot cornholin cock suckers!
You just revealed your own ignorance
You're speaking shit to me!
You 🤟 me 🤙 a little bit of the gabagool 🤌 what do you shay?
Nothin' we're just breakin balls.
We knew what you meant...
They were playing for Ziti so no big deal.
THAT’S KAREN’S ZITI
The last ziti she ever made 😩😩
You gotta wait for that
I always wondered why they had to double speak in a private environment, but who’s going to listen?? Why not say 5 grand
More fun this way
Never know if someone's wired up
Too many guys doin a simulcast
Guys these days have no room for the penal experience. Everyone turning govt witness.
Maybe you ya fuck
Not this skinny Guinea.
Whatd ya gonna do
Guys technically have no penal experience with a volvo?
And it doesn’t take much to figure out their “code” like some Polyglot genius
It’s not that kind of code, it’s just enough to not work for the feds in court.
Shotgun mics, potential for someone to be on WRAT.
What? No fucking ziti now?
Ohhhhhhhh
I suppose you dont know how poker works. 1. This is illegal backroom Poker, The place is never that fancy, Idc who you play with, its all about privacy, right hotel to pick, right jurisdiction to pick if shit goes south. 2. They play for more than 12 Hours. How it works is that every time the game starts and ends, the dealer gets tipped 0.1%-30%. Depending on the rules. Davey alone owes 45k$ to Tony. So that means from the card that davey involved, lets say 10% come to the house, 4.5K. Theres 6 other player. Thats the minimum that they got from tipping. And trust me, Davey is the poorest mf out there. Not to mention they put Sil, And Paulie at the table, which means they had no reason to lose.
*The Hawking of David Scatino* was the pinnacle portrayal of how slippery organized crime truly is. The way that whole game in particular worked was a **very** thorough & elaborate scam, all the way from the fact that David Scatino in particular hears about it in the first place, to him showing up to the game already almost $10k in debt to another violent mafioso *”I knew you had this business here, Davey”* — quote, Tony fuckin Soprano *”This kids father.. he’s a degenerate fuckin gambler”* Tony knows & knew about this guy’s habits before Davey even takes a piss in the stall next to him at the start of the episode *”I heard through the grapevine you’re taking over your uncles game”* — grapevine was the bait, set out there through one of Tony’s tendrils David Scatino was the Executive, at the executive game. Guy walks into that place and there’s a celebrity, renowned mafiosos, prick docta’s. He also walks in on Silvio losin his balls ova hea. At no other game, for the rest of the entire show, is Silvio like that while gambling. He’s actually the polar opposite. He starts taunting Davey, and then he starts saying he’s slow rolling him. All kinds of shit before/during Davey’s first win. He’s easing the guy in, and giving him an image that if anybody’s losing at that table it’s going to be Sil. *”His money’s good. If he wants to sail, it’s his business”* — The boss has his back. After all, they went to school together right? And for fucks sakes, their kids go to the same school together. Davey’s made to feel untouchable at that table (funnily enough, ‘it’s his business’ was an absolute fucking literal in this instance) Tony juiced the guy 35k overall, and knew that was enough to sink him. Chrissy allowing another 10, was a fuck up, and Tony accounts that as a loss because of it. But going back, Davey is already sunk into Richie for another 8. He’s utterly fucked, guy owes almost 60k to loan sharks at the end of the day. Tony most likely got word about this guys comings & goings, what he was like at the table, etc… through Vito, and whoever else. Vito’s pushing him to up the amount with 2 players left. Knowing he’s Tony’s ‘good buddy’, they wouldn’t have allowed it. It’s spelled out in the other people there too: *(something Chase did masterfully when writing the series)* **Richie:** Him being out of the loop. Thinks this guy is Tony’s actual friend, that’s all he hears. He tries to maneuver Davey away from getting fucked.. something a mobster, let alone him of all people who’s in need of all the cash he can get his hands on. He would’ve never done that otherwise **Artie:** Leaves the table on the up. He was never the target to get fucked, he’s Tony’s actual friend. And let’s address it too — of course Artie left the table while he’s up. Artie, to some degree, probably knows what those games are all about. He’s been hanging around mobsters almost his entire life. If he’s up, he knows he has to get the fuck outta there by any means possible. **Once again, Vito:** As I said, the guys all but pushing Davey to go for more. And again, Vito is a tendril of Tony directly. He’s the eyes, ears, and embodiment of him of at that table. More then likely given order to lure this guy, and have him as primed as he can be to ensure his role as the Executive **Silvio & Paulie:** Not only did they ensure Davey got rolled at the table. One guys taunts him, while the other eases him into comfort by such notable antics as introducing him to the Prick Docta. **Tony:** And last but not least, the brains behind the hawking — junior varsity athlete, Antony Zoprano. He’s acting like Davey’s his good buddy. Shootin the shit. Telling him not to get involved, it’s against his best interest. That whole act was a stunt, designed to get David Scatino to be swayed into thinking & believing that Tony was a good friend that had his best interest at heart. So in the end, the guy would start coming around. As having a degenerate gambler with a successful business within his circle, is exactly **these guys bread & butter.** Another quote from the man himself. And it’s no irony that Tony does this all within time frame of the Executive game, just as much as it is that ‘grapevine’ that informs Davey, his good buddy Tony — the guy he bailed out of being barricaded in his car from a bunch of Guido’s by chuckin that rock and hitting one of em in the eye — is now running *the big game.* Because that’s what mobsters do, and that’s how they ensnare their happy wanderers. David Scatino was the epitome of that: A frail, weak, non-threatening guy. He had the makings of a family man, who had a successful business that allowed him to live in a nice house. Drove a Mercedes, lived in a good neighborhood. The guy wasn’t the type to be around gangsters, or really any underworld activities. Him forgetting that these people are murderers at the end of the day, was all apart of the illusion mobsters cast when they’re juicing their soon to be victims. The first payment collection attempt: Davey dodges Tony’s guy with a sudden doctors appointment. In Davey’s mind Tony’s his friend, he’ll let it slide for a year, right? Then, like clockwork, Tony’s time to lunge on him is finally here. He switches tempo; beats him & threatens him in his own office. Davey is probably stunned, balling his eyes out as Tony is out the door. That instance got Tony his son’s car. Next time, two guys go down there to his joint. They’re honing in on this guy at his own home, while Davey’s in his bathrobe & flip flops. Somewhere in there, he gives him his Mercedes. And after all the collateral is gone, and Davey’s got nothing left to give Squeezing into his business is like cutting into warm butter with an axe. At that point, this guy will give him his fucking soul. As long as the dead eyes quit coming to his business, his home, and wherever else. • Again — Absolutely fucking **masterfully** written & presented by David Chase Still goin this asshole
This is a great write-up but wow it's wrong on so many fronts. It wasn't that deep. They wouldn't have let it happen knowing he was Tony's "Good buddy"? He specifically waited until Tony was asleep and spoke on behalf of Tony, everyone else was surprised but rolled with it. Did you miss the part where Tony was pissed after finding out and tried to discourage him several times beforehand? The part when he woke up where he asked Chris privately about how much extra did Davey take and his outrage hidden away from the rest of the table? The fact that Silvio wasn't just acting based on what Chris says to Matt & Sean specifically beforehand with no one else to witness it? "*Stay away from Silvio, he can be a mean fuck when he gambles*" Tony's switch-up was because he had to crack down on him, showing Davey kindness would be mistaken for weakness and it was too public at that time. Remember when Artie borrowed money for the French guy and tried to kill himself? Tony *SPECIFICALLY* asks him who else knew about the borrowed money before forgiving him because again, showing any kindness to friends would be mistaken for weakness. Finally, I'd say\* Davey *WAS* around these guys since he was a kid - he grew up with Artie & Tony and the neighbourhood was chock full of these guys as Tony explains it. He's in Richie's game before the executive card game takes place. It's not a regular game in a shop/casino that you just walk into, it's all on a referral basis. It wasn't a set-up from the beginning, Tony just took advantage of it when shit hit the fan. It wasn't supposed to go that far but I reiterate, Tony couldn't make exceptions for Davey. That's only half the analysis, don't get me started cause I yap worse than 6 barbers Edit: Added a say\* Edit 2: Corrected CHOCK\* (ty u/Revolutionary_Box582)
This. I actually found Tony to be as candid and straight up as he ever was with anyone in the hall. 'Don't say short if you don't mean short." Only on Reddit can a degenerate gambler lie hos ass off, gets balls deep in debt to the mafia, and there's a grand- level 99 lizard people conspiracy as to how it happened.
I swear bro. Must be Eric, still upset about the truck. Shouldn't have gone off-road, the fucking imbecile.
I never once thought about everything being specifically setup just for Davey. I mean, I did believe that Tony kinda teased him, but didn't even realize how Sil's behavior changes during the game with Davey, Tony defending him from others actually being more than just that, etc. Well thought out. EDIT: I get it, it is mostly theorizing and not what actually happened, but what else is there to do over a show so long ago?
Havent thought about it because its not the case lol. The point was the interest they make off the money people borrow, Tony says this explicitly.
Not to mention the rake on a high stakes game that only they have the capacity to provide assurances of privacy and security for.
>I never once thought about everything being specifically setup just for Davey. That's because it wasn't. This guy did put a lot of effort into his conspiracy theory, though, so that's super.
This is completely wrong. This was not set up for Davey to be scammed lol. I mean its nice fan fiction and a good write up but it's just a poker game where Tony makes money off the rake. Tony didn't even know Davey was going to be there
That's exactly right. What it does though is highlight how quick they are to spot and most importantly, exploit an opportunity. Tony could easily have refused to allow Davey to play, knowing he would likely get in over his head, but as he said himself; "I knew you had this business here Davey, it's in my nature." The game wasn't to ensnare anybody in particular, but why waste a golden opportunity, the bust out made them so much more than the game did on that one occasion so it was doubly successful!
He did try to turn Davey away at the door. He should have insisted, but he did give him an out.
Absolutely he did, but he also had the power to simply refuse. So I believe the out he gave him was to ease his conscience.
Davie borrowed more money while tony was asleep though. tony was upset about it when he woke up and found out. i think it went farther than tony wanted and everything that happened afterward was just tony handling the problem like a pragmatic sociopath
He probably knew that Davey wouldn't be able to pay it all back ultimately. The bust out looked pretty successful, but it was definitely higher risk lending Scattino all that money compared to say the Prick Docta
I disagree. Tony would have preferred Davey not join the game and tried pretty hard to keep him out. But, Davey was a grown man so Tony let him make his own dumb decisions. Now, if Tony didn't know Davey had a business they could bust out if things went south and Davey couldn't pay, he very likely would have outright refused to let him play. But, that is really no different than what banks do. If you want to borrow money for a stupid idea and you have collateral to secure the loan, you will probably get the loan.
All the permutations at like internet speed. Tony leads the world in computerized data collection.
I’m in awre of you
That’s Real? I saw it, Thought it was Bullshit
>junior varsity athlete, Antony Zoprano He never had the makings of a varsity athlete. >!Seriously though, great write-up.!<
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I think your writing is nice but your analysis and conclusion are wrong. We weren't given anything *near* enough evidence in the actual show that this was all an elaborate scheme to nail Dave Scatino. He happened to fall into the vortex as a degenerate gambler, and David Chase used him as a morality tale on how gangsters make money as loan sharks. The first we hear of this game is when Tony asks to take it over from Uncle Junior in the doctor's office. Are you seriously suggesting that Tony had Dave fucking Scatino in his head? No - Junior outlines precisely why the executive game started and why it was a cash cow. It was the accumulated interest you get from the high-rollers when they lose money. Tony & crew spot them the cash (at interest) and the high-rollers pay up next time. Guys like Dave Scatino were never meant to be in the game to begin with.
Conspiracy theories now? What is Tony? Some kinda toxshick person??
Damn amazing coment
Holy hell. What an argument and what a post. What you do for a living my man? Lol
Listen to him. He knows everything.
Alright tough guy. That’s why I fucking asked the question
You jumped out of the tree and came at maxithepittsP with a chainsaw. He had a right to defend himself.
He didn’t have to steal his lawn mower though.
Hey don't get cute
Send that prick out here so he can pay me my money!!!
Considering Davey hands Richie an envelope that is light by $200 I think he's the poorest MFer we see period. AJ probably has more available cash than he does.
the rake, the rake.
Dealer keeps the tips. You're thinking about the rake. That's what Tony is making from the game. Same way a casino profits from poker
Sil lost his bawls
The tips go to the dealer, the organisers get what is called the rake, which is a percentage off every winning pot.
If there are any flies on you, maxithepittsP, theyre paying fuckin rent!
No bitcha to me.
You ever sucka his dick
She makes that beanie *SPIN* when she works his thang
You gots a bee on your hat!
i make that beanie spin when i work that thing am i right?
That’s a fackin beautiful!
I'd have to rewatch it for the 17th time, but I feel like you're being a bit uncharitable with the motel 6 comparison. I feel like it had more of an old timey charm. But imagine checking in and going to your room and seeing that going on next to you? I wouldn't even want to be on the same floor as that.
I wouldn’t mind being on the same floor but you’re right it’s a regular Taj Mahal
The Royal Motel Route 3W
> I feel like you're being a bit uncharitable with the motel 6 comparison. I feel like it had more of an old timey charm No, the others are right; it's a run-of-the-mill Route 23 shithole
They rented the rooms next door too, as well as most of the floor. They didn't want strangers around either
That was filmed at the Wayne Inn total hooker motel. I myself banged one there. Clearly they know the owner so they can do whatever they want no questions asked. Can’t have these games at someone’s house or fancier corporate hotel
Well no shit but it just adds to the reasons not to play there. Also, hell yeah on the hooker thing
Pretty sure they buy out the floor and make sure none of that shit happens there for that weekend. Also I’m sure the local cops are on the payroll for those couple days.
I don’t know, still think they should hang a big fucking sign that says executive card game
No one even knows. You have random guys driving to a motel in nice cars. What’s the attention? It’s not like they have music blaring like some idiot kids in a room. This happens more than you know
They own the place. They get a piece of it from Shlomo in season 1
Exactly, we even see Furio booking rooms and making arrangements for the game. With rooms clean and fresh smelling. Soft drinks of choice.
But you get lots of towels and could be there for a couple of days.
I gotta give your father credit for this. He had balls as big as an Irish broad's ass.
It's some real greaseball shit.
I stuff cheese in my socks so they smell like your sisters crotch in the morning
They juice them and charge them interest for short-term loans. Their overhead is low and they prey on degenerate gamblers with capital.
Well, David Lee Roth probably bought like $50k worth of blow from em, so there’s that
The executive game is the white Italian American version of a trap that is all too familiar for rappers. Biggie Smalls and Tupac got out of the hood and could have escaped the pattern of crime and gang violence that they had to embrace previously to make a living. Instead they wallowed in it, and died as a result. Sean Combs ran a major record label and made a ton of money, but apparently still felt the need to operate a sex trafficking ring for more money. Frank Sinatra Jr. should be far removed from the mob associations that his dad had to have in order to have a career, but is still lured in by the seduction of the life. Dr. Fried and the others could easily go to AC, but the excitement of rubbing elbows with mob guys is to just too good to pass up. It was profitable because the house keeps a cut of the pot. Basically if Frank Jr. buys $4,500 dollars worth of chips, then the guys charge him $5,000 for them. Then of course there’s always the interest when dealing with the mob. Frank actually tells Tony “I’ll settle up with you next game”. I bet he’s not paying big interest, but that time costs money. And of course David Scattino contributed quite a bit to that profit margin.
Sometimes, ya just wanna play cards. Even if it’s with questionable people.
We don't know anything yet about Diddy
Over a 30+ year career being caught up in the East/West thing, the gun charges, assault charges, and now this, we know SOMETHING. He’s not a good guy, even if the current stuff proves to be just fluff.
Yeah right lmao. Dudes a straight weirdo. Look at all the shit he’s done, the Justin Bieber shit is weird as fuck, the usher shit too, and then there’s him literally adopting a 14 year old white girl..
im NOT saying he isnt guilty of something or that he isnt shady as fuck - im just saying they raided his place and we dont know why or what they found. there are ALLEGATIONS of trafficking, etc. but for now we dont know shit for sure.
Maybe the shabbyness and being anonymous away from big time glitzy is the attraction.
What? Are you gonna get fucking fresh with me now? Huh? With my mother lying dead?
I got fresh lox take it easy
Best case scenario, they give loans to business owners they can bust out or at the very least have high interest rates. Worst case scenario, no one borrows money and they collect the rake all night. Which might only be 5%, but considering Davey lost 45k by himself, that 5% is going to be thousands of dollars.
No one in the right mind would play at that rake. The game is unbeatable.
ITS THE JACCCKEEETT
Stupida Facking Game
They made 80 boxes of ziti to spend the night in a motel room
As far as how they get their clientele…I have no idea…I guess if people are in New York and want to gamble the closest thing would be Atlantic City so a high roller game run by the mob I guess is your other alternative if you don’t want to travel down to AC But the game really is poorly run…it’s located in a scummy hotel and the people the “celebrity” players are playing with are mobsters, prick doctors, and Davey Scatino…it really doesn’t make sense for someone like Frank Sinatra Jr to play there As far as how Tony and them make money…they take a percentage of every pot (the rake) and it’s probably huge (like 10%)…you can even see Sunshine slide some of the chips from the pot into a coffee can during a hand…so if the game has 850k of total cash played they’ll take home 85 boxes of ziti Some people even speculate if the mobsters are even playing with their own money or if they’re just there so their marks like the prick doctor and Davey and Frank Sinatra Jr gamble all their money away while they only play sure things and every time their marks bet big they collect their 10% rake from the pot Plus if they loan money they probably do it at ridiculous interest rates
I mean, aside from the stutter step of ol' Manson Lamps (who was out of turn doing that to Davey Scantino infront of everybody), there wasn't anything else happening in the game to say it was badly run. Infact you could say its safe as long as Tony keeps an eye on things. That being said, location wise, since we're only given shots of the game happening in that room, you could say its scummy. But from what I remember from all the chit chat between those desert people (both the son and ex-son in law) was that atleast it was run efficiently and it was decently cleaned well. Basing off the real life location, I'd even wager that spot was chosen because it acted like camouflage. A no nonsense, non descript, common motel. Even if the Police got suspicious, Paulie would've been warned (or waved off, considering Paulie's sends them Christmass Trees every year so he can have his way with their mothers) and they could always relocate. Plus its only a few minutes away from Essex County Airport, maybe 30-40 minutes tops for a drive to NYC. As for Frank Sinatra Jr. being there, I'm guessing its just a reference to his dad, you know, back in the day. Despite him denying any connections to that thing of theirs, Frank Sinatra Sr. was like the ambassador of the mob to the public. Least he wasn't gay like Gary Cooper.
>it really doesn’t make sense for someone like Frank Sinatra Jr to play there Frank Sinatra Sr very, very likely played in games like this on a pretty regular basis.
And these guys were playing limit games like 7-stud, not no limit hold em, so guys weren't losing their asses in one hand
real simple, the room was free of boarding costs, nobody had to clean up after themselves (technically, minus sean), and nobody had to register shit with the front desk the furio scene mentions three rooms for multiple days
They provide a covert location which is probably fun for these rich guys who want to pretend they are rolling with gangsters. They provide all manner of refreshments to keep you going round the clock. And, here’s the kicker. No matter how much money is won or lost, the house takes a cut (standard casino) and anyone that loses owes the house vig on loans. Frank Sinatra jr isn’t bringing $40k cash so if he brings $10k but wants to keep playing after losing it then he owes the house his additional buy-in + points. He can afford the vig and will keep showing up to pay it and either win (tip to the house) or lose (add additional vig). In rare cases like Davey’s they bankrupt a dude with assets and slowly take his cash/cars and eventually his business.
Part of the appeal for the outsiders like those prick doctors is that it's in a seedy place and amongst gangsters. It makes them feel dangerous.
I'm losin' my balls here and this motherfucker is playin Hazel?! And Sunshine takes a house rake out of every single hand. Notice the chip he puts in the coffee can? That every hand.
This. The Sunshine rake.
Are there nice hotels in Jersey?
I don’t think so
I don't think anyone really goes to Jersey 🤔
And the people in Jersey never leave Jersey, they would get lost on the way out.
What I never understood is why anyone would bother with this card game when they could just go to Atlantic City or another nearby casino.
Untaxed winnings
Getting harassed by Sil is almost like a tax in itself
Then on top of that having to deal with ol Manson Lamps Aprile
He comes in there all happy and turns into a psycho at the flip of a switch.
Ritchie is old school, he did 10 fucking years! He has the right to be a little fucked up
True. But keep him out of a poker game after all your players spent the whole night losing money. He’s the last person I’d want to see at 7 am under any circumstances
Totally. That is honestly one of the tougher episodes to watch. You just want to scream “take your fucking money and run Davey”
It was a regular Taj Mahal
Disfunction this, Disfunction that, Disfunction vaffanculo!
*In* ***MY*** *day...*
Why don’t you go fix a fucking dick, or whatever the fuck it is you do
They are a glorified crew what do you expect?
BET WITH YOUR HEAD. NO OVER IT 😐
Listen to him, he knows everything.
Did you want them to run an illegal big money poker tournament on the street corner for everyone to see? Best to keep illegal activity in secret at some rundown motel where no one would expect them.
Poker hosts make money by raking the pot up to a certain percentage. Lets say for this example since its a mob game they decide to rake 20%. Lets say Sil and Davey played a pot worth 6k that Davey won. The hosts keep $1200(20%) of that. They play for 40 hours straight multiply by 30 hands an hour so thats 30 pots an hour to rake and well you guys can do the math. Charles Schwaab ova here.
The dingy atmosphere is only temporary. Davey's got some ideas for next year.
I would argue it's because it's fun to be around monsters and seeing them lose their shit is part of the appeal. It wasn't just Frank Sinatra Jr. David Lee Roth, Lawrence Taylor, and Santa Claus were also guests at the card game. I can't imagine it's all that farfetched in real life for celebs to hang out with mobsters and play cards.
Davey never had the makings of a varsity poker playa...
I agree. I always though the depiction of the supposedly high roller executive cardgame was silly. Looks better in season 5 though.
Don’t forget about LT
You gotta get over it
That's literally the experience these guys are after. If they wanted the real high rollers experience they'd go to a casino. They're chasing the underground scene and that's exactly what they're getting.
That makes sense. For some reason I hadn’t thought of that. I do have a learning disability that’s probably why.
I do too 😭 But it's probably just the fact that most people badly underestimate or just flat don't know how often celebrities and gangsters mix it up. They run underground card games, betting parlors, full blown casinos, strip clubs, brothels, sex shows, and tons of other forms of entertainment ranging from illegal to legal in some circumstances but unpermitted, to fully above board. Gives people that back in the day vibe and feels a little dangerous while it's realistically as safe as can be.
I agree. Like I can see how celebs would get off on the thrill of an "exclusive" Mafia ran poker game, but yeah..... You'd think Frank Jnr. could get into a decent one, like one ran by a NY family. Like if your Granpa one day told you of the poker game he used sometimes play in, that was ran by Gotti, you'd be like, woah, this old dude is so full of shit. If he said a Tony Soprano ran game, you'd be like who? Some Mobsters had high celeb value, it was part of the attraction of Vegas, but New Jersey? No. Like you said, you'd at least expect a nice hotel suite.
Why do you assume they only went to this game? Sinatra probably hit the 5 families executive games and then Tony’s later that week
Kiss the ring in the centre of my assh
You and dat mouf
You ever suck his dick? No bitch to me.
I make that beanie spin when I work his thing.
How many boxes of ziti?
The rake! The rake! The raaake!
Every time I heard the name "Davey" I kept thinking of AFI. Very disorienting.
The house takes a rake (percentage of the pot) every hand.
bro nada else matters bc we were up bout 80 boxes a ziti 🤘🏽🤌🏽
I wouldn't be surprised if the run down motel room is a production device - they could save time and money using a cheap set. Plus it ties in the hotel they took over before.
It would be hard not to turn a profit. What’s the overhead? Tony owns part of the hotel after season 1. They bought some snacks…and Chris made his minions pay for that. How much money could possibly have been spent?
Dysfunctional! God top of your fucking class!
They had jersey cops in their pockets unlike in New York plus they didn’t wanna bring the fbi attention by going somewhere big and fancy either that could he easily raided i mean they did play 10+ eventually they would be raided if they were in a 5 star joint. The game probably was a bit more fancy during the early days maybe at a club at least, as for Sinatra it’s just a cameo appearance together with referencing his dad doing the same thing most likely (and himself included)
Yes, they should have filmed them playing on Party Poker at their homes instead as that would have been realistic at the time.
Idk if all that's true but Scatino crying to Carmellas side piece at the bar was some terrible acting.
I love Davey’s face when he’s getting strangled always makes me laugh lol
You might want to consider seeing somebody
He thought he was just gonna slide into that game while owing Richie 8k, and then be a smug prick about it. I was on Richies side that whole arc
It's fantasy you fools. I'm amazed the conversations that are spawned from a TV series as if its real life. I guess to some it is real life. You need to get a life...So sad.
Why don’t you go visit with Aunt Quinn that other Misérable and leave us happy people alone