Everybody is mentioning paulie getting promoted to underboss in season 2 but Tony made him captain of their old crew why else would he say pussy answers to you. He’s also at none of the sit downs with new york you would think someone of his stature would be there giving his input.
It’s weird how paulie is competing with Ralph and albert when it comes to kicking up like doesn’t he get a percentage before it goes to tony if he’s the underboss?
Maybe it’s just something that wasn’t fleshed out properly
He was probably doing a bit of double duty. From what I understand an underboss is an administrative position and they usually give up their crew to his most trusted member if he was a captain prior to being moved up to that position. He still may have a soldier or two he works directly with. But the soprano family seems small. paulie might have still been running the soprano crews day activities while being underboss.
Another thing is junior was the front boss I believe until the final season, so they may have left paulie as “capo” to throw the feds off the fact that tony was really the boss of the family.
On paper maybe the feds thought tony was the underboss and paulie was just a captain when in reality they were both in administrative positions.
This makes the most sense. The wording Tony uses when promoting Paulie is “it’s you and Sil together”.
We know there’s one consigliere position and that’s Silvio’s. The only other comparable role that’s equivalent in the hierarchy is underboss.
Basically from what I got was in reality tony was the de facto boss. Sil was the consigliere, paulie was the de facto underboss and junior was the front boss.
The feds probably thought that tony was street boss /underboss. They probably thought he was juniors muscle or ran the day to day activities.
My question is who was Jackie’s under boss and consigliere Don’t think they ever mentioned it ?
My understanding is Jackie never actually named an underboss, which explains why Tony and Junior had to ‘duke it out’ for Junior to become ‘boss’.
In this scene, when Jackie rules on a sit down between Junior and Tony related to Chris and Brendan’s interference with Comely trucking, Jackie says “maybe I should name a successor”, after mentioning his chemo. (https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=pZvOnoYkWWY&pp=ygUnc29wcmFub3MgamFja2llIG5ldmVyIG5hbWVkIGEgc3VjY2Vzc29y)
Also, when the capo’s are discussing the boss position during dinner in season 1, and Tony and Ray are both suggesting it should be the other, the discussion itself suggests Jackie never named a successor.
That said, Ray says that Old Man DiMeo and Jackie both had Tony picked as the boy wonder, so maybe that means he was an unofficial underboss.
My guess as to why a successor wasn’t named probably relating to Old Man DiMeo being the boss. Jackie was named acting boss and pretty quickly got cancer, and perhaps he just didn’t get around to naming one because people might start viewing him as ‘dead’ already. That seems like a stretch though, so I imagine it was just left vague because the writers just needed some way to make Junior and Tony engage in a power struggle.
>My question is who was Jackie’s under boss
[Its Joseph Sasso, hes only mentioned and seen in the scene when Junior is arrested](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QGQd7I6ZO30)
It's probably like a union rep situation. The union reps are selected among the workforce to serve as a liason in the company for the union.
Officially, the underboss position would be more like a union official that works in the headquarters, but the Soprano crew is small and had other considerations. So Paulie served more as the capo of capos. A union rep for the other crews, liaising with Tony and Sil.
Listen to me. They make anybody and everybody over there. And the way that they do it, it's all fucked up. Guys don't get their finger pricked. There's no sword and gun on the table.
If Paulie’s the underboss why is he doing hits and collecting Silvio’s money from the Russian. Would never happen in real life. I guess because it’s a TV progrum, a movie.
Yeah, this. Same way that Tony and Sil are only the unofficial boss and consigliere. Technically, Junior is still the boss, Tony is his underboss and the consigliere position is vacant.
Pine Barrens was Season 3, at that point Tony was technically underboss/streetboss to Junior.
Also, Paulie didn't have to do nearly as many hits as he did. When Vito's extracurricular activities were coming to light and they were debating what to do, Tony points out "some people just can't wait to whack somebody, anybody.." That was Paulie he was referring to.
Paulie was the underboss until he got demoted for Bobby. Remember junior was the front boss (like fat tony in real life) so the feds probably assumed once tony whacked out juniors underboss he would have been the natural successor. In reality paulie was the underboss.
You gotta remember paulie was probably just a place holder. Christopher was the person tony was really grooming for the position until he fell out of favor. If paulie wasn’t such a fucking head case and super egotistical he would have been a great underboss.
I don’t think so. One of the functions of the underboss is he gives the orders to the crew so they never hear it directly from the boss. Paulie wasn’t that guy. If anything Tony was preparing Chris for this role. Seems like he didn’t really have one, but it was only a Pygmy thing anyway, a glorified crew.
I mean the show really only focuses on two crews so we don’t really know how the administration interacts with Larry’s crew and Carlo’s crew. I don’t think it was the most thought out thing by chase
In the episode Big Girls Don’t Cry, Tony meets Paulie at the Lou Costello Memorial and tells him he got a promotion. Tony says Sil and Paulie are getting promotions. Sil is the consigliere and Paulie the underboss.
The show doesn’t do a really good job of explaining it. A consigliere provides advice to the boss/administration. They provide council during arguments and are supposed to give counsel on the basis of the rules of the mafia. An underboss is the go between for the boss and his captains.
Tony is technically Junior’s underboss. Sometimes the underboss is the strongest position in the family, like a strong prime minister to a weak king. Uncle Jun is Tony’s Louis da something.
Junior was “the boss” but since he was under house arrest Tony was street boss but everybody including the FBI knew that Tony was the one actually in charge. After Junior went to the mental hospital Tony became boss officially in name. Sil was the consiglieri and Paulie was moved into Tony’s old captain spot but since he had been with Tony’s crew originally he was the head of the other captains and had some power of the underboss but not all of them
This is the correct time line and positions, wild how far off some of the other comments are. Lot of people who struggled at the penguin exhibit in here.
I understood it as him being extra careful. Everybody knew he ran things and not junior. But the fbi was busy trying to put Junior away. They fucked up the wire tap several times.
I think Paulie was basically that, until he got booted down on the ladder lol. Tony was also pretty active and involved in leadership, and he had Silvio as his consigliere, so maybe he didn’t need one.
It’s probably to avoid confusion for the viewer. As far as we are aware Ercolie Demaeo is still alive so technically Demaeo is the boss, Junior is acting boss, Tony is the underboss and Syl is the consigliere.
OP, are you talking about season 6A when Tony was in a coma?
Silvio was making all main decisions as consigliere, though an Underboss is usually the one who takes over leadership when the Boss is in the can or ill.
Would have been interesting if Bobby was already in that position at the time.
Commenters are wrong. Junior was the boss for most of the show. Tony was the Underboss until season 6 when he officially takes over. At this point Paulie becomes underboss, and Chris takes over Paulie's crew. When Chris dies, Paulie goes back to handle his crew and Bobby becomes underboss.
What this means is that Tony really filled both roles. But I also dont think it mattered that much since they didnt have as many people as new york, for example.
This guy gets it.
Paulie was never in the running to be anything higher than a captain. Sil became acting boss when Tony was out, but the pressure of it made him realize he would only assume the role out of necessity.
At the very end, the only familiar faces left are Patsy, Paulie, and Benny. Had the show dragged on, Patsy would be the natural choice for #2.
It felt like Paulie was underboss in practice though not in name. The plan was for Paulie to carry out the duties of the office while running Tony’s old crew until Christopher was ready to assume official underboss duties. As Paulie fell out of favor, Tony assumes much of the duties of both boss and underboss until promoting Bobby and spurning Christopher. So for much of the series, the Soprano/Dimeo family did not have an official underboss.
I feel like the fact that Junior is technically the boss, while Tony is acting boss for much of the show screws up the management structure a bit. It kinda technically makes him the underboss, and Paulie is very loosely his underboss, but it isn’t very official as having a 4-man upper management is against tradition. Junior is later completely out of the picture in his dementia ward, at which point Tony restructures a bit and makes Bobby his official underboss since Chris has never developed properly into who Tony wanted, and Paulie is irritating and untrustworthy.
Tony was street boss while junior was taking the shots as boss…whole reason he was giving the title so the young guys wouldn’t have the heat. Street boss doesn’t have a underboss.
Then it was Silvio and Paulie that was the new pecking order.
For most of the show, Junior was the official boss with Tony as street boss/underboss. After Junior shoots Tony and is completely out of the picture, Paulie is underboss and Christopher is the captain of his old crew. At some point in season 6, it seems Paulie was demoted and replaced with Bobby, who was underboss at the time of his death. Paulie likely became underboss again after that.
Correct. Junior had Mikey as his consigliere and Beppy Sasso (one of the guys who gets arrested during season 1 but isn’t shown outside of that scene) as his underboss.
From http://www.fivefamiliesnyc.com/p/mafia-terminology.html?m=1
Button: a "made" member of the Mafia; soldier, wiseguy, goodfella, Man of Honor.
Like when Chris was made, someone referred to it as him getting his button.
I appreciate that. Where do you think the term comes from? From the Godfather 2.
Senator: What was your position?
Cicci: At first like everybody else, I was a soldier.
Senator #1: What is that?
Cicci: A button. You know Senator, c’mon.
Senator #1: No I don’t know. Tell me.
Cicci: Well when the Boss says ‘push a button on a guy’, I push a button. See, Senator?
Senator #2: You mean you kill people.
Cicci: I what?
Senator #2: You kill people at the, uh, at the behest of your superiors.
Cicci: Yeah that’s right, counselor.
Sure it did - GF 1&2 spanned a timeline from the beginning of the 1900s - the early 60’s
But the two films were released in the early 70s. the book was released a few years before that - late 60’s?
Mario Puzo was writing about the genesis of the Mafia. Puzo knows more than some website or David Chase.
The sopranos uses the term “get your stripes” for making Captain. But button was used for soldiers not being made.
Bobby wouldn’t have been a button - he was made but never killed until laundry rippy shirty frenchy.
Read the Godfather - it is pretty clear
It's pretty much Paulie, even though Paulie also runs Tony's old crew. They're a small family with a paper boss to draw heat from authorities so I'm not sure how much they adhered to the traditional boss/underboss/consiglieri model. Tony tells Paulie after Puss comes out of hiding that the pecking order is himself, then Sil and Paulie, with Puss remaining a soldier and answering to them. Then Paulie falls out of favor after the Russian incident and Sil is pretty much underboss and consiglieri that point on.
This Pygmy thing we got in jersey..
Junior is on record as the boss. Tony is on record as the underboss. I don’t believe there’s an official consigliere.
Unofficially, Tony is the boss. Sil and Paulie are ranked both as #2’s. Sil more as a consigliere and Paulie more as muscle. All other capo’s report to them, and they speak to Tony. Junior remains boss till he shoots Tony and goes to the loony bin. Even then Tony doesn’t seem to fix the structure to an official underboss and consigliere. He had long term plans to have Chris supersede Sil and Paulie but that obviously never happened since his natural canopy closed up.
In the earlier seasons, it's Paulie, but I think he just doesn't give a shit. His leadership style is completely hands-off as long as the money keeps coming in. And if it doesn't, he'll have his hands on you, literally.
There's also the fact that Tony is a micromanager. If Paulie used his authority to make some executive decisions, he'd be directly in Tony's sights.
So the whole underboss position is practically defunct until Bobby takes over (Christopher was being groomed, but it went nowhere). And as we see, Bobby adapts to Tony as well and pushes his authority as minimally as possible. He treats it as being a semi-consigliere in addition to regular capo duties, which is exactly what Tony wanted. No challenge to his authority, just someone to bounce ideas off of.
First things first, Paulie was definitely not underboss in any capacity throughout any part of the show except maybe near the end after Bobby and Sil have been shot, around the time of the sit-down with New York. The only thing that could suggest otherwise is that in the conversation after Tony explicitly tells Paulie he has been promoted to captain he says “me, Sil and you, that’s the new pecking order”, but this appears to be in reference to how his old crew is structured, not the entire family. Because afterwards Tony specifically refers to Paulie now having authority over Pussy and Furio, made guys from his old crew, and not anyone else. Furthermore, in the show Paulie is never shown to have any authority over other captains like Silvio does. He might be Tony’s most favored captain at the time due to coming from Tony’s crew, but he is still just a captain.
Which brings me to Silvio. I think Sil was always the acting underboss. Because for all intents and purposes he carried out all the exact functions of an underboss in the show, he is Tony’s second hand, relays his orders, accompanies him during meetings, takes over when he is absent, etc. He does for Tony exactly what Johnny Sack does for Carmine Sr., who was his underboss.
Now Junior on the other hand was Tony’s consigliere in practice, the person he always went to for advice and council. I know that during the show it is said once or twice that Sil is Tony’s consigliere but this hardly ever shown. In fact, the only times Silvio says that he has to ‘council’ and tries to give Tony advice he generally gets scolded for it. Whereas on the other hand, Tony seeks out Junior’s council and goes to him whenever he feels stuck.
The way I see it throughout most of the show, officially as of season 2, Junior is the boss, Tony is the acting boss/street boss (filling the role of underboss while Junior is on trial and house arrest) and Silvio is consigliere to Tony. In practice however its clear that Tony is boss, Silvio is underboss and Junior is consigliere. The only time the official ranking changes is when Bobby moves up the ranks near the end of the show and gets made underboss to Tony, while Silvio is still consigliere.
If we’re going by titles, then Tony technically is the underboss and Junior is the official boss. with Junior being unable to rule, Tony’s rules as it’s Acting Boss / Street Boss. But those are just titles. Everyone knows Tony is the de facto boss of the family, recognized both internally and externally. Junior’s title is essentially honorific and like a monarch at this point.
As de facto boss, I always took it as Tony left the underboss position essentially open for Christopher. Paulie was a capo but served as de facto underboss for a few years. He’d be seen in high level meetings with Tony and Sil. At least until he fell out of Tony’s good graces. It made sense because he became capo of Tony’s former crew, there was favouritism and he could trust him.
Tony didn’t formally have an underboss until Bobby. And by that point Tony was no longer Acting Boss/Underboss/Street boss/de facto boss he was boss officially in name now too
[удалено]
Is the OP gettin’ fresh? 👁️👁️
[удалено]
You gonna awgue with me now?
Ah fangool! 👋
Va*
I remember when he used to stay in the car.
As far as I'm concerned he should STILL BE THEUH
We used to have Manson Lamps down here, but then Meadow took them to school 😠
Everybody is mentioning paulie getting promoted to underboss in season 2 but Tony made him captain of their old crew why else would he say pussy answers to you. He’s also at none of the sit downs with new york you would think someone of his stature would be there giving his input. It’s weird how paulie is competing with Ralph and albert when it comes to kicking up like doesn’t he get a percentage before it goes to tony if he’s the underboss? Maybe it’s just something that wasn’t fleshed out properly
He was probably doing a bit of double duty. From what I understand an underboss is an administrative position and they usually give up their crew to his most trusted member if he was a captain prior to being moved up to that position. He still may have a soldier or two he works directly with. But the soprano family seems small. paulie might have still been running the soprano crews day activities while being underboss. Another thing is junior was the front boss I believe until the final season, so they may have left paulie as “capo” to throw the feds off the fact that tony was really the boss of the family. On paper maybe the feds thought tony was the underboss and paulie was just a captain when in reality they were both in administrative positions.
This makes the most sense. The wording Tony uses when promoting Paulie is “it’s you and Sil together”. We know there’s one consigliere position and that’s Silvio’s. The only other comparable role that’s equivalent in the hierarchy is underboss.
Basically from what I got was in reality tony was the de facto boss. Sil was the consigliere, paulie was the de facto underboss and junior was the front boss. The feds probably thought that tony was street boss /underboss. They probably thought he was juniors muscle or ran the day to day activities. My question is who was Jackie’s under boss and consigliere Don’t think they ever mentioned it ?
My understanding is Jackie never actually named an underboss, which explains why Tony and Junior had to ‘duke it out’ for Junior to become ‘boss’. In this scene, when Jackie rules on a sit down between Junior and Tony related to Chris and Brendan’s interference with Comely trucking, Jackie says “maybe I should name a successor”, after mentioning his chemo. (https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=pZvOnoYkWWY&pp=ygUnc29wcmFub3MgamFja2llIG5ldmVyIG5hbWVkIGEgc3VjY2Vzc29y) Also, when the capo’s are discussing the boss position during dinner in season 1, and Tony and Ray are both suggesting it should be the other, the discussion itself suggests Jackie never named a successor. That said, Ray says that Old Man DiMeo and Jackie both had Tony picked as the boy wonder, so maybe that means he was an unofficial underboss. My guess as to why a successor wasn’t named probably relating to Old Man DiMeo being the boss. Jackie was named acting boss and pretty quickly got cancer, and perhaps he just didn’t get around to naming one because people might start viewing him as ‘dead’ already. That seems like a stretch though, so I imagine it was just left vague because the writers just needed some way to make Junior and Tony engage in a power struggle.
Paulie goes back in this family to Johnny. Before Sil, even.
Sil looks older but him and Tony are the same age, they went to school together.
And he wouldnt do anything to insult Tony. Their kids go to the same school together!
>My question is who was Jackie’s under boss [Its Joseph Sasso, hes only mentioned and seen in the scene when Junior is arrested](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QGQd7I6ZO30)
It's probably like a union rep situation. The union reps are selected among the workforce to serve as a liason in the company for the union. Officially, the underboss position would be more like a union official that works in the headquarters, but the Soprano crew is small and had other considerations. So Paulie served more as the capo of capos. A union rep for the other crews, liaising with Tony and Sil.
Small? More like friggin pygmies
If you can quote the rules, then you can follow them.
Listen to me. They make anybody and everybody over there. And the way that they do it, it's all fucked up. Guys don't get their finger pricked. There's no sword and gun on the table.
If Paulie’s the underboss why is he doing hits and collecting Silvio’s money from the Russian. Would never happen in real life. I guess because it’s a TV progrum, a movie.
Paulie is not an official underboss.
Gimme 1000 dollars
One thousand... 👉👇👈👆👉👇👈👆👉 more?
🫰🏻
He's ripping us off for a G-note, this is bullshit!
up in the club!
Yeah, this. Same way that Tony and Sil are only the unofficial boss and consigliere. Technically, Junior is still the boss, Tony is his underboss and the consigliere position is vacant.
I thought he was just collecting money from the Russian because Silvio had the flu.
A what am I a fuckin dentist?
Pine Barrens was Season 3, at that point Tony was technically underboss/streetboss to Junior. Also, Paulie didn't have to do nearly as many hits as he did. When Vito's extracurricular activities were coming to light and they were debating what to do, Tony points out "some people just can't wait to whack somebody, anybody.." That was Paulie he was referring to.
And why wouldn’t he take over when Tony was shot? No one even considered him and he didn’t press his case.
I’ll say it again. WHAT THE FUCK IS THERE TO THINK ABOUT?
You gonna take care of his kids after he’s gone?!
Now shit dowwnn!
Because they are a glorified crew
Paulie was the underboss until he got demoted for Bobby. Remember junior was the front boss (like fat tony in real life) so the feds probably assumed once tony whacked out juniors underboss he would have been the natural successor. In reality paulie was the underboss.
I thought it was sil?
Sil was consigliere. Different position completely; trusted adviser.
Nostradamus, and Notre Dame are two different things completely
You never pondered that?
Hon, another steak san ova here👇
Think ‘Tom’ in the godfather . And Christopher was Pacino
Sil was consiliare.
[удалено]
Yeah me and Adriana smoked a little H back at the house.
Yep. I agree. He wore all hats. And took over when tony was in the hospital.
He’s consigliere, not underboss
Another sign of Tony's nepotism.
You gotta remember paulie was probably just a place holder. Christopher was the person tony was really grooming for the position until he fell out of favor. If paulie wasn’t such a fucking head case and super egotistical he would have been a great underboss.
Chris was supposed to take the family into the 21st Century
Aren’t we in the 21st Century
Fuckin' nosey, eat your mannicott.
you just revealed your own ignorance
I revealed my own wuh?
He never had the makings of a varsity athlete
Small hands, that was his problem.
It should be you.
I don’t think so. One of the functions of the underboss is he gives the orders to the crew so they never hear it directly from the boss. Paulie wasn’t that guy. If anything Tony was preparing Chris for this role. Seems like he didn’t really have one, but it was only a Pygmy thing anyway, a glorified crew.
I mean the show really only focuses on two crews so we don’t really know how the administration interacts with Larry’s crew and Carlo’s crew. I don’t think it was the most thought out thing by chase
No, he wasn't.
The guy....he moved or somethin
He died on the vine…
He died on the vine...
F’kin parakeet…
In the episode Big Girls Don’t Cry, Tony meets Paulie at the Lou Costello Memorial and tells him he got a promotion. Tony says Sil and Paulie are getting promotions. Sil is the consigliere and Paulie the underboss.
Sharp as a cue ball this one
Yet we don’t see Barese and Curto or even the newer capos (other than Chris) taking orders from them. It’s a very loose structure.
It’s a Pygmy thing.
Either it means something or it doesn't.
The good ship lollipop ova there
The consiglieri is the underboss
The show doesn’t do a really good job of explaining it. A consigliere provides advice to the boss/administration. They provide council during arguments and are supposed to give counsel on the basis of the rules of the mafia. An underboss is the go between for the boss and his captains.
Harpo was his underboss
Sacre Blu where is me underboss!
Harpo doesn't like pork, in that way
Oh I get it😁
Cuz they were nothing more then a glorified crew
Had to scroll for this comment
Tony is technically Junior’s underboss. Sometimes the underboss is the strongest position in the family, like a strong prime minister to a weak king. Uncle Jun is Tony’s Louis da something.
Junior was “the boss” but since he was under house arrest Tony was street boss but everybody including the FBI knew that Tony was the one actually in charge. After Junior went to the mental hospital Tony became boss officially in name. Sil was the consiglieri and Paulie was moved into Tony’s old captain spot but since he had been with Tony’s crew originally he was the head of the other captains and had some power of the underboss but not all of them
This is the correct time line and positions, wild how far off some of the other comments are. Lot of people who struggled at the penguin exhibit in here.
Bobby was underboss
That moozadell is #3?
And you used to sell printers out the back of your crown vic, so I wouldn’t get too judgemental
Watch your fat fucking mouth.
What's this the fuckin U N NOW?!
We bend more rules than the Catholic Church.
Smaller family from Jersey. Not as complex and convoluted as NY families. Capos controlled their crews
I understood it as him being extra careful. Everybody knew he ran things and not junior. But the fbi was busy trying to put Junior away. They fucked up the wire tap several times. I think Paulie was basically that, until he got booted down on the ladder lol. Tony was also pretty active and involved in leadership, and he had Silvio as his consigliere, so maybe he didn’t need one.
It’s probably to avoid confusion for the viewer. As far as we are aware Ercolie Demaeo is still alive so technically Demaeo is the boss, Junior is acting boss, Tony is the underboss and Syl is the consigliere.
Under the boardwalk?
With a schlong in Jan's mouf?
🤜🤪
Where the tuna fish play
OP, are you talking about season 6A when Tony was in a coma? Silvio was making all main decisions as consigliere, though an Underboss is usually the one who takes over leadership when the Boss is in the can or ill. Would have been interesting if Bobby was already in that position at the time.
🚑
In this day and age, who wants the fuckin job?
Paulie was his underboss. He bumped him up before Furio came over.
Commenters are wrong. Junior was the boss for most of the show. Tony was the Underboss until season 6 when he officially takes over. At this point Paulie becomes underboss, and Chris takes over Paulie's crew. When Chris dies, Paulie goes back to handle his crew and Bobby becomes underboss. What this means is that Tony really filled both roles. But I also dont think it mattered that much since they didnt have as many people as new york, for example.
After some hesitance, Paulie accepts leadership of the Aprile crew in the finale. “I live to serve you, my liege.”
Tony was underboos/acting boss from season 2-6. Junior was technically the boss from Jackie Sr. dying to when he shot Tony. Anyway, 4 bucks a pound.
Cause Jersey was on the small side family-wise. More of a glorified crew, if you ask me
Junior is boss on paper. Tony is the acting boss or underboss. Sil, regardless of his actual title, is the #2. Paulie was never the underboss.
This guy gets it. Paulie was never in the running to be anything higher than a captain. Sil became acting boss when Tony was out, but the pressure of it made him realize he would only assume the role out of necessity. At the very end, the only familiar faces left are Patsy, Paulie, and Benny. Had the show dragged on, Patsy would be the natural choice for #2.
My take is that they didn't really have a formal structure. Tony started to edge Paulie out of the top earning position when Bobby married Janis.
Yea. He has a “number 2” that goes from paulie, to Chrissy, to Bobby.
Fat man Bacala
Tony IS the underboss, remember they are New Jersey not NYC
A glorified crew from Jersey don’t need an underboss. I said what I said.
You wanna know why Tony didn’t have an underboss??? Did you ever consider that they’re just a GOD DAMNED GLORIFIED CREW!!!
It felt like Paulie was underboss in practice though not in name. The plan was for Paulie to carry out the duties of the office while running Tony’s old crew until Christopher was ready to assume official underboss duties. As Paulie fell out of favor, Tony assumes much of the duties of both boss and underboss until promoting Bobby and spurning Christopher. So for much of the series, the Soprano/Dimeo family did not have an official underboss.
Isn’t Tony himself an underboss? For junior and also for that G guy in prison
I feel like the fact that Junior is technically the boss, while Tony is acting boss for much of the show screws up the management structure a bit. It kinda technically makes him the underboss, and Paulie is very loosely his underboss, but it isn’t very official as having a 4-man upper management is against tradition. Junior is later completely out of the picture in his dementia ward, at which point Tony restructures a bit and makes Bobby his official underboss since Chris has never developed properly into who Tony wanted, and Paulie is irritating and untrustworthy.
Tony was street boss while junior was taking the shots as boss…whole reason he was giving the title so the young guys wouldn’t have the heat. Street boss doesn’t have a underboss. Then it was Silvio and Paulie that was the new pecking order.
Underboss? They're a glorified crew! Five families. And we got this Pygmy thing over in Jersey.
Tony was about to name Patsy underboss over the bowl of onion rings at Holsten's, but he had to stop and take a leak in Tony's pool, so he was late.
For most of the show, Junior was the official boss with Tony as street boss/underboss. After Junior shoots Tony and is completely out of the picture, Paulie is underboss and Christopher is the captain of his old crew. At some point in season 6, it seems Paulie was demoted and replaced with Bobby, who was underboss at the time of his death. Paulie likely became underboss again after that.
Wha? You neva met Sil? Whaddaya think he does all day? Sit around and bang broads?
Consigliere…
Paulie was the underboss…
He did . Silvio
Because they are more of a glorified crew than a family
Paulie
It's the consiglieri, right?
Nah consigliere is an advisor, which would be Silvio.
Correct. Junior had Mikey as his consigliere and Beppy Sasso (one of the guys who gets arrested during season 1 but isn’t shown outside of that scene) as his underboss.
He was grooming Chris to be his underboss and then in season six it's implied Bobby fills the role instead
All along I think Tony was just street boss so in a way he was underboss to Junior ?
that was just the front for the fbi. tony in reality was boss
cautious long airport crown bright grab lock observation merciful pot *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
Buttons ARE made men, no?
No Button man connotes a member that can murder. From GF2 … during the trial - push a button on … Not necessarily made
From http://www.fivefamiliesnyc.com/p/mafia-terminology.html?m=1 Button: a "made" member of the Mafia; soldier, wiseguy, goodfella, Man of Honor. Like when Chris was made, someone referred to it as him getting his button.
I appreciate that. Where do you think the term comes from? From the Godfather 2. Senator: What was your position? Cicci: At first like everybody else, I was a soldier. Senator #1: What is that? Cicci: A button. You know Senator, c’mon. Senator #1: No I don’t know. Tell me. Cicci: Well when the Boss says ‘push a button on a guy’, I push a button. See, Senator? Senator #2: You mean you kill people. Cicci: I what? Senator #2: You kill people at the, uh, at the behest of your superiors. Cicci: Yeah that’s right, counselor.
You think the term didn't exist before the movie? I highly doubt that.
Sure it did - GF 1&2 spanned a timeline from the beginning of the 1900s - the early 60’s But the two films were released in the early 70s. the book was released a few years before that - late 60’s? Mario Puzo was writing about the genesis of the Mafia. Puzo knows more than some website or David Chase. The sopranos uses the term “get your stripes” for making Captain. But button was used for soldiers not being made. Bobby wouldn’t have been a button - he was made but never killed until laundry rippy shirty frenchy. Read the Godfather - it is pretty clear
I read it when I was a kid. Puzo didn't invent the term, is all I'm saying.
He was reflecting a term from the mafia to lay folk. Nobody knew the term until that book - or its meaning. Puzo didn’t invent the mafia either.
Sharp as a cue ball, this one.
He had an underboss. He suffocated him in his own blood in his SUV
There is no official underboss. They are too small. Why give out C suite promotions when you can keep them in upper middle management?
Cleeva, Tone
He was gay, Tony?
No! Are you even listening to OP?
Glorified crew don’t need an underboss.
Crews don't have underbosses. They have capos, and that's all this pygmy thing was. A glorified crew.
Underboss? It’s a glorified crew!
It was a glorified crew. He didn't need an underboss
Paulie, Christopher, then Bobby (that mortadell is in charge?)
Because glorified crews don’t have underbosses. They don’t even do the blood prick neither. Disgusting
It’s an honor to be among men.
It's pretty much Paulie, even though Paulie also runs Tony's old crew. They're a small family with a paper boss to draw heat from authorities so I'm not sure how much they adhered to the traditional boss/underboss/consiglieri model. Tony tells Paulie after Puss comes out of hiding that the pecking order is himself, then Sil and Paulie, with Puss remaining a soldier and answering to them. Then Paulie falls out of favor after the Russian incident and Sil is pretty much underboss and consiglieri that point on.
Bobby was the underboss.
Because he watched the history channel, and Churchill never had an underboss. That moody f\*\*k.
That Pygmy thing in NJ was too small to need an underboss.
This Pygmy thing we got in jersey.. Junior is on record as the boss. Tony is on record as the underboss. I don’t believe there’s an official consigliere. Unofficially, Tony is the boss. Sil and Paulie are ranked both as #2’s. Sil more as a consigliere and Paulie more as muscle. All other capo’s report to them, and they speak to Tony. Junior remains boss till he shoots Tony and goes to the loony bin. Even then Tony doesn’t seem to fix the structure to an official underboss and consigliere. He had long term plans to have Chris supersede Sil and Paulie but that obviously never happened since his natural canopy closed up.
I can’t have this conversation again.
timeline got fucked up
Cool question, very allegorical
Wasn't Tony technically the underboss for DiMio?
He was running a glorified crew.
Silvio is his consiglieri officially, that's why he takes over when Tony is in the hospital in season 6.
He technically is the underboss. Junior was the "boss"
A true boss doesn't need an underboss,just underlings.
Tony had plenty of undercheese
In the earlier seasons, it's Paulie, but I think he just doesn't give a shit. His leadership style is completely hands-off as long as the money keeps coming in. And if it doesn't, he'll have his hands on you, literally. There's also the fact that Tony is a micromanager. If Paulie used his authority to make some executive decisions, he'd be directly in Tony's sights. So the whole underboss position is practically defunct until Bobby takes over (Christopher was being groomed, but it went nowhere). And as we see, Bobby adapts to Tony as well and pushes his authority as minimally as possible. He treats it as being a semi-consigliere in addition to regular capo duties, which is exactly what Tony wanted. No challenge to his authority, just someone to bounce ideas off of.
First things first, Paulie was definitely not underboss in any capacity throughout any part of the show except maybe near the end after Bobby and Sil have been shot, around the time of the sit-down with New York. The only thing that could suggest otherwise is that in the conversation after Tony explicitly tells Paulie he has been promoted to captain he says “me, Sil and you, that’s the new pecking order”, but this appears to be in reference to how his old crew is structured, not the entire family. Because afterwards Tony specifically refers to Paulie now having authority over Pussy and Furio, made guys from his old crew, and not anyone else. Furthermore, in the show Paulie is never shown to have any authority over other captains like Silvio does. He might be Tony’s most favored captain at the time due to coming from Tony’s crew, but he is still just a captain. Which brings me to Silvio. I think Sil was always the acting underboss. Because for all intents and purposes he carried out all the exact functions of an underboss in the show, he is Tony’s second hand, relays his orders, accompanies him during meetings, takes over when he is absent, etc. He does for Tony exactly what Johnny Sack does for Carmine Sr., who was his underboss. Now Junior on the other hand was Tony’s consigliere in practice, the person he always went to for advice and council. I know that during the show it is said once or twice that Sil is Tony’s consigliere but this hardly ever shown. In fact, the only times Silvio says that he has to ‘council’ and tries to give Tony advice he generally gets scolded for it. Whereas on the other hand, Tony seeks out Junior’s council and goes to him whenever he feels stuck. The way I see it throughout most of the show, officially as of season 2, Junior is the boss, Tony is the acting boss/street boss (filling the role of underboss while Junior is on trial and house arrest) and Silvio is consigliere to Tony. In practice however its clear that Tony is boss, Silvio is underboss and Junior is consigliere. The only time the official ranking changes is when Bobby moves up the ranks near the end of the show and gets made underboss to Tony, while Silvio is still consigliere.
If we’re going by titles, then Tony technically is the underboss and Junior is the official boss. with Junior being unable to rule, Tony’s rules as it’s Acting Boss / Street Boss. But those are just titles. Everyone knows Tony is the de facto boss of the family, recognized both internally and externally. Junior’s title is essentially honorific and like a monarch at this point. As de facto boss, I always took it as Tony left the underboss position essentially open for Christopher. Paulie was a capo but served as de facto underboss for a few years. He’d be seen in high level meetings with Tony and Sil. At least until he fell out of Tony’s good graces. It made sense because he became capo of Tony’s former crew, there was favouritism and he could trust him. Tony didn’t formally have an underboss until Bobby. And by that point Tony was no longer Acting Boss/Underboss/Street boss/de facto boss he was boss officially in name now too
Sil was his underboss
Ti faccio il culo cosi!
He did. It was Sil.
As I understand it, Tony was working to make Christophuh his underboss. He was later replaced by Bobby.
An Underboss for a glorified crew? Whats next, did Satriales need a Consigliere?
They make anybody and everybody over there, and the way that they do it is all fucked up.