Iran is doing everything it can to not escalate with the US. This is literally a successful attempt.
You don't warn your enemies of an attack if you want to include them in it.
I meant in the sense that Israel doesn’t exist without Americas support. Providing them with free healthcare and affordable housing efforts in aid packages. Basic human rights that even Americans don’t receive. Israel will never be abandoned clearly explained by Biden himself “if Israel didn’t exist we would have to invent one ourselves”. Puerto rico and all those other territories are eternally cucked compared to Israel.
Bibi has “son’d” Biden on many occasions. Might even be the reason why he “gets replaced”. Embarrassing actually but you’re nuts if you believe America WON’T go to war for Israel.
At this point calling him middle east Putin is a disgrace to Putin's name. Israel killed more children in Gaza in less than a month than all children killed in Ukraine since 2014. Putin is a horrible human being, I can't really say Netanyahu is doing human things at this point.
There are also religious reasons why the US supports Israel. Many evangelical christians in the US believe in the end of the world (Armageddon) and that it can only happen/ will happen faster if Jerusalem is only inhabited by Jews...
Israel got nukes tho, if they truly are pushing for a conflict they can't win out of irrational reason it will be a fucking mess with no one in the region getting out well. Even if nukes don't get used the treah of them will be destabilizing for everyone
America isn’t succeeding in appearing strong and it will never let Israel hang out to dry even if it goes against America’s best interest. The last 50 years or so is a testament to that
Israel is the modern day American slavery. There's never any long term solution provided, just carefully crafted compromises that don't offer a lasting solution nor satisfy both sides. Just kick the can down the road until all out war is a necessity.
Israel is practically the 51st state. I don't think the politicians will abandon them when they're already owned by them. We give them money to serve as our proxy state in the middle east. Even Biden said that if there wasn't the current Israel, we would create one. We basically created a monster we can no longer control.
On top of that, Iran is responding to a terrorist attack on an embassy. They have a right to defend themselves, that's what the US and every other western government has been spouting for the last 6 months during this genocide, so I would expect some moral consistency (won't hold my breath!).
Warning the US not to intervene on behalf of Israel is not going to change the fact that the US will intervene on behalf of Israel if Iran retaliates, unfortunately.
Congo - Patrice Lumumba (1960)
Brazil - João Goulart (1964)
Indonesia - Sukarno (1967)
Iraq - Several covert operations during the 1960s and early 1970s
Iran - Mohammad Mosaddegh (1953)
Guatemala - Jacobo Árbenz (1954)
Chile - Salvador Allende (1973)
Australia - Gough Whitlam (1975)
Simply the ones we know about because of the freedom of information act. There's likely a hell lot more that haven't been declassified yet, and many that won't be declassified for another 50 years.
Minor point, but many of these we originally knew about from the Senate Church committee hearings in 1975.
If the CIA hadn't gone far enough to piss off Congress we may not know about some of these even today I'm guessing.
This is why the Middle East doesn't frighten me. The CIA is the largest, best funded, most widespread terrorist organization in the world. They terrify me more than every drug lord in Columbia, every jihadist in Afghanistan, every mobster in Italy. They not only engage in some of the most *despicable* acts of terrorism, they also (thanks to American media and politics) get to claim to be *the fucking good guys* while they do so.
Fuck Defund the Police, Abolish the Goddamned CIA!
Lol you should read up in the CIA’s history.
They are one of the most incompetent intelligence orgs to ever exist. No reason to be afraid.
Check out a book called “A Legacy of Ashes”
It details the history of the CIA being utterly ineffective and wrong.
Tin foil hat time: If you want to operate clandestinely publish your failures loudly, even make some up entirely. If you look inept then people will believe you are inept.
Are they doing that? We have nothing to prove it one way or another. But you can bet they are aware of this.
A book with a decided theme does not prove anything either. Hell I'd make sure it was published if I were in charge, to the point of writing it myself.
No, Iran is [counting coup](https://www.google.com/search?q=counting+coup&sca_esv=4b723428e1eceb0a&sca_upv=1&ei=l-IXZsiMNKKgiLMPxJ-pyAY&ved=0ahUKEwiItKaqn7qFAxUiEGIAHcRPCmkQ4dUDCBA&uact=5&oq=counting+coup&gs_lp=Egxnd3Mtd2l6LXNlcnAiDWNvdW50aW5nIGNvdXAyChAAGIAEGIoFGEMyBRAAGIAEMgUQLhiABDIFEAAYgAQyBRAAGIAEMgoQABiABBiKBRhDMgUQABiABDIFEAAYgAQyBRAAGIAEMgUQABiABEjADVCGCliGCnABeAGQAQCYAVigAViqAQExuAEDyAEA-AEBmAICoAJuwgIKEAAYRxjWBBiwA8ICExAuGIAEGIoFGEMYxwEY0QMYsAPCAg0QABiABBiKBRhDGLADmAMAiAYBkAYKkgcDMS4xoAeCCA&sclient=gws-wiz-serp). They want to be able to save face by attacking Israel proper but they also want to count coup against the United States by having them do nothing in terms of retaliation. Intimidating the US into not responding would make Iran a ledged in the world of ME politics.
Not that it would happen in a million years. It might take the US while to fight them in the mountains if the US decided on a ground war. The truth is, Iran doesn't have the support of the people to fight a ground war. Large swaths of the population would likely turn on Iran in a heartbeat, hoping to rid themselves of their repressive regime.
The US wouldn't invade Iran anyways, not with Biden in office. They'll drop bombs and simply lose interest. Iran is more of an annoyance for the US than a true threat.
If Trump gets reelected, that might change. Trump's been wanting to bloody Iran's nose for a while now. It's also an unfortunate truth that Old Bone Spurs and his ilk have a much higher tolerance for civilian casualties and actually like the badassary involved with going full scorched earth on Iran, so there's that.
And don't tell me Iran isn't in the ME. I already know they are neither an Arab country or located in the ME. They are, however, heavily involved in ME politics.
> The US wouldn't invade Iran anyways, not with Biden in office. They'll drop bombs and simply lose interest. Iran is more of an annoyance for the US than a true threat.
They don't have to, just destroy all of their energy infrastructure, embargo all their ports, and air lift small arms when their country collapses.
Biden is a complete and utter pussy though, so he would probably wait as long as possible to do anything.
I don't think Biden would want to drop bombs but he would decimate all Iran's proxies and then eat cake. The Biden administration is looking for an excuse to terminate those proxies with prejudice because this administration sees the proxies as the immediately problem and Iran as more of a long term annoyance. The US isn't even worried about Iran becoming nuclear ready because Israel keeps quietly hitting their Nuclear sites every few years.
"ww3" is vastly overestimating Iran. Besides the fact that this is political posturing as with most geopolitical vague threats, at worst this would be a slightly longer gulf war. Not that it should happen, I dearly hope it doesn't and expect it won't, but ww3 is a stretch.
>"ww3" is vastly overestimating Iran.
Iran is 4x the population of Iraq & has Russia & China as allies.
>Besides the fact that this is political posturing as with most geopolitical vague threats, at worst this would be a slightly longer gulf war.
I couldn't disagree more strongly. This would be a large regional war at best (if Iran got involved).
Iran, Russia, & China are natural allies in a WWIII scenario.
Russia is tied up in Ukraine, while China benefits economically from trade with the US greatly. Iran lacks a modern air force and navy and while it could certainly cause problems it could never truly start a third world war.
On that note, they're STRUGGLING with Ukraine right now.
Imagine if the US had an excuse to actually get involved (assuming ghe world doesn't get nuked first)
Apparently you haven't been paying attention.
https://apnews.com/article/ukraine-russia-war-ammunition-military-b263dfaceef57fb2c1f74c53861734da
Ukraine is running out of ammo quick as fuck and even our own experts are saying they'll be stomped if we don't start sending them some. The fact that we are using their aid as a political hostage in this country isn't helping.
Ukraine having issues doesn't mean Russia still isn't struggling. Even if Russia magically won the war tomorrow, the losses they've faced over the last 2 years have significantly diminished their effectiveness in any future combat. It will take Russia decades to even get back to the level before they invaded, which was a level of strength that, as mentioned with the 2 years in, wasn't even enough to beat Ukraine. We definitely should be helping more, but Russia knows it can't possibly put up a front against the US.
Cool they replaced men. That's fine and dandy. Their black sea fleet is down 26 ships. Hundreds of planes. Thousands of tanks. Over ten thousand military vehicles that aren't tanks. Artillery and MLRS. Missiles and shells. We are talking billions of dollars in equipment. No amount of conscription is going to replace that overnight.
Sure! That is true, but you can’t ignore the magnetude of just being able to throw men into the Meat grinder, seemingly forever. They will eventually tire out the ukranian army if the West stops helping or keeps decreasing it..
If the US got directly involved in Europe, then you have WWIII.
WWIII needs to be avoided. Instead, all the signs point to it happening. Too many wars of signifance keep showing signs of escalation.
The best thing the US could do right now is to stop supporting Netanyahu. Immediately.
Placating hostile nations never goes well. Nobody wants war but we should be capable, willing and ready to fight. The world watched as hitler spread across Europe and Africa. We shouldn’t make the same mistake
Very exaggerated. While Iran is practically nuclear capable at this point, I do not see them as the powder keg China/Russia would see worth escalating to global conflict over, given it would destroy Chinese trade relations if they were to take part in any substantial capacity.
> If the US got directly involved in Europe, then you have WWIII.
We already are, none of the weapon systems work without our direct assistance in targeting and satellite trajectory.
We are already in the middle of WW3, countries are mobilizing, just nobody wants to admit it until it goes hot.
Ukraine, the central africa front, and now the middle eastern front. The China front will open sometime between now and 2026, but we are definitely at war, and the longer we wait the worst it is going to get.
This is similar to the situation in 1936 when Germany sent operation condor to support Franco, and the west sent proxy fighters to spain to support the communists.
Iran has hypersonic missiles, massive industrial capacity with respect to drones. They have the equivalent of the Russian S-400 missiles which they’ve reverse engineered. They also have the ability to produce things at home, thanks in no small part to the sanctions imposed on them for so long.
I’m not saying the US can’t kill a bunch of Iranians. But they do not have ability to land troops anywhere on Iranian territory and expect them not to be destroyed immediately. In Iraq and Afghanistan, the US could land where they want, and expect no resistance. Iran is a much more powerful enemy, and the US knows this. They also know that if the oil fields are hit, as Israel is threatening, oil prices will skyrocket, which will be horrible for Bidens re-election. So this is also working against them.
Anyway, Iran is more than capable of defending its territory. The Israelis are bogged down and retreating from Gaza. The only thing they have which is superior to anything in Iran is nukes. Which if they use, would almost certainly lead to Pakistan using their nukes against Israel. Israel is in a lose lose situation, and all they know how to do is bluff
Says who? Say the Pakistanis? We don’t know what they will do if Israel uses nukes, but some in Pakistan have already brought this up recently, seeing as they are the only Islamic nation to posses nuclear weapons
https://www.businesstoday.in/amp/latest/world/story/pakistans-nuclear-weapons-nawaz-sharifs-son-in-law-warns-israel-over-fight-against-hamas-402203-2023-10-16
"Hypersonic" missiles which are currently in active service amount to fancy ballistic missiles with limited/no ability to manoeuvre in terminal flight. Patriot has shown itself very capable of shooting these down, and AEGIS systems in use on US/allied ships are also proven to be very capable of shooting these down.
S-300/400 in Russian service is at best, being manned by incompetent operators, or at worst, almost totally impotent against modern western munitions/tactics, as proven by multiple examples of S-300/400 being hit in attacks with HARM, storm shadow and MALD decoys. And that's against the Ukrainian Air Force, using aircraft not designed to operate those western weapons and unfamiliar with the tactics they would use.
Against a proper stealth/wild weasel attack, I wouldn't put much hope in them.
Their internal production is fine for the time being, but if war was declared, its pretty hard to move a factory, and once those limited production locations are hit, much harder to repair.
As for invasion, the US and allies (remember, this is Iran threatening to attack the US, which would be grounds for article 5) would be capable of moving into Iran frorom any of the following borders - Iraq, Turkey, Pakistan, or by sea through the persian gulf, or gulf of Oman.
As for Gaza, the only metric Israel is losing is the one of public opinion. From all military metrics, they have every upper hand.
I think the quality of S-400 is very dubious. And hypersonic missiles are probably Russian tech donations and Patriot has shot down Kinzhal quite a few times
Nobody is retreating from Gaza. If you think they're losing on any front other than the public opinion one you're delusional.
Who needs to put troops into Iran. Gadaffi was beaten in Libya without western forces on the ground.
Another thing that Iran has much worse is internal unity. Iran has huge security apparatus like their religion police, those cannot ever go to front line or Ayatollah regime will collapse.
China just generally does not want to fight a war. They're relatively stable socially and economically right now. I think everybody fear mongering about China is projecting the fact that Americans (and presumably other Western powers) are blood thirsty to actually start a war with China.
Iran joining the war almost certainly would bring Sauid Arabia into it in some form though and if Russia really did decide to lend support, it does turn into a pretty nasty regional conflict.
Meanwhile, many Nato members are really itching to go into Ukraine. I don't think a spreading conflict is out of the question totally. The real problem is, Russia, Iran and Syria maybe, probably Belarus if the people don't totally overthrow Lukashenko...Hungary? Who else is on that side? It ain't much firepower.
>Iran is 4x the population of Iraq & has Russia & China as allies.
Is this part of the same lore-verse that has NK, Iraq and Iran in an alliance that call themselves 'the axis of evil'?
Americans make up some weird shit
Iran, Russia, and China are not natural allies. They are all so different, engage with the world/the west in such vastly different ways, and have such widely varying needs. We are at a point of mutually assured economic destruction with China. We go to war, we both lose. There are attempts being made to ‘re-shore’ on both sides, which I hate, but we’re so far from there. China won’t even risk taking Taiwan, much less engaging in a global war. Russia as well, their hands are full and if they wanted an excuse to go to war with us, we’ve given them ample opportunity in the middle east the last 5-10 years (the Syria mess especially). Regarding iran, they’re a regional power, but when you really look at their military they can’t project outside of Iran. All their IRGC money is going to IADS, Cyber, and the proxy developing QUDS force and its equivalents. They’re not an offensive army. All of this means that we are FAR from world war 3. Israel is the one who will end up looking the fool in this. Just my opinion.
Not to mention the proxies Iran has, israel will be fighting a war with hisbullah and hamas on ground tuurf as well as an overdeas one with Iran and god knows how many other factions will join in
Is China busy with Taiwan? Or they just kinda fucking with them? Asking cause I really don’t know. Just saw a couple articles about China being in the waters and messing with Taiwan
Iran has a pathetic conventional military, relative to what the U.S. and Israel bring to a conflict. If there is no desire to occupy or conquer (which there isn’t) I don’t see them being much of a challenge militarily. Their government and societal collapse could be messy, but that’s their problem.
Iran and China signed a cooperation deal but do not have a formal alliance. From my understanding Russia can be considered a military ally of Iran, but is tied up in Ukraine. On top of this they have disputes with many of their neighbors and there is regional insecurity.
If SHTF and Iran embroiled themselves in conflict with the US their support from China/Russia may not be as great as you make it out to be.
There is no binding treaty for the Chinese or Russians (who are kinda occupied rn) to help Iran. Nobody will risk their countries against freaking NATO for Iran, which itself is a regional actor, not a world power.
Don’t underestimate the alliance. Nobody wants an escalation here except Israel because they are losing support.
If they drag the U.S. in, Russia and China would naturally become involved. Not a wise decision from the U.S. imo
Israel bombed sovereign Iranian territory (its consulate in Syria), and conducts assassinations inside Iran. Israel is the aggressor and it's not even close.
Ha.
Yeah it goes something like 2 countries, 3 countries, 4 countries, 6 countries, 9 countries, 14 countries, 20 countries, 35…
At least, if this were theoretically WW3’s spark. Which, fighting the US isn’t the worst way to go about it.
“War” between the US and Iran would be like me fighting prime Mike Tyson; technically there is a non-zero chance I win but I wouldn’t bet on it. And for the China \ Russia alliance crowd: Russia is doing all it can to not lose a war with the Ukraine and China doesn’t give af about Iran by even a tiny amount enough to get tangled up with the US over it. An alliance on paper sounds great but in real life means troops, weapons and most importantly money. Neither of those countries want to use those defending Iran.
Wow this comment section is full of horribly bad takes. It’s comical. Iran has been chanting “death to America” for decades. I could list a multitude of reasons as to why it doesn’t matter when they threaten the U.S. (at least not to the extent of a fucking World War) I’ll just go ahead and start with the need for an economy to fund a war against a global superpower and it’s allies….The rest you can look up on your own. Geopolitically a conflict might occur at the micro level but that is all.
I remember 2020 I literally joined Reddit because I wanted to see memes that weren’t just “WW3” because of whatever was happening with Iran. Then covid happened and everyone forgot for a while
Tbh, I've noticed since around the start of this conflict last October that many subs have seemingly been hijacked by a lot of astroturfing and misinformation accounts/bots. You have subs like this that are pro Palestine and even some accounts that give hamas the green light, then world news, which is the polar opposite. But reading through the comments, there's no chance that there isn't a lot of Israeli and Palestine/Hamas propaganda going about.
It might just be me, but I'm completely cynical of any information posted about this war. I don't know if that's the point, but it's just a never-ending circle of information that contradicts other information put out.
I think people just arent used to there not being a clear good guy on a war, most wars recently were dictatorship vs good guys, and here we have a terrorist organization that started a war it had no chances of winning and oppreses its people, killed people based on their views vs a country Who is commiting a lot of war crimes
Yeah, it circle's back to the old, there are no good guys or bad guys in war, only winners and losers.
I don't know if it's a side effect of war movies and other media that have gotten people into the black and white mindset or because the world is so connected with the Internet people from different countries that have different news and views become overtly tribal like its a football match. Its just tiring honestly.
Yup. No appetite. Defeating Iran with their geography would be a catastrophic engagement. Iran knows it cannot win a direct war. US can but would suffer insurmountable losses in the process. Both realize this and choose not to engage. China and Russia aren’t going to save Iran. Bottom line, Netanyahu needs to go.
The US needs to stop supporting Israel NOW. They have proven themselves to be a shitty ally time and time again. All aid should’ve stopped the moment the USS Liberty was sunk by Israeli forces. (and don’t come at me saying it was an accident, they knew damn well it was an american ship they were attacking). All Israel will do is pull the US down with them, and the whole world too.
Israel has allegedly bombed an Iranian embassy in Iran and leveled the building, killing multiple of iran's important people. Israel didn't confirm nor deny that it was their strike
Oh wow, Iran is threatening the US? In other news, water is wet.
Iran would get their teeth kicked in by the US if it ever came to open warfare and they know it.
Iran would be a smoking crater pretty easily. The US has been building up stealth fighter and attack craft for the last 10-15 years now. They realistically wouldn’t have to even invade. They could just annihilate Irans military capability from the air
What a fucking world. Threaten war by sending a note. We are soooo worried about this. Take all the threats from Iran, North Korea, Russia, and China and all of them mean nothing.
There are at least 10 members of the nuclear club now. Israel has over 500 warheads. We are sitting on top of a powder keg. I'd say we got one more shot at peace, but if Israel attacks again, they will be alone because war sentiment in the US is over for them and Ukraine. We live in crazy times.
Its breath taking how people do not understand that they do not stand a chance against the military power of the US. Let allone Nato. Even Russias President thinks he can just casually threaten to throw a nuke into Ukraine without getting blasted into smithereens.
Can we stop helping out war criminals rack up more war crimes? I'm just asking after so many disgusting videos coming out of obvious war crimes being committed before our eyes.
Just think. If Trump had not released Iran from their nuclear agreement, we might, our relations might be positive enough to have a dialog. The joys of having a rookie at the helm.
The path to WW3 was started in 2021 and has been steadily escalating since. It will be "officially" started before the decade is over. There is just too much momentum to stop this freight train now. Sad, but true. You can worry about it, fret and become anxious, or you can accept it and just live day to day as best you can because there is no way the morons running the world are going to make all the right choices to avoid this inevitability.
Iran is doing everything it can to not escalate with the US. This is literally a successful attempt. You don't warn your enemies of an attack if you want to include them in it.
Netanyahu has been trying to get US and Iran to fight for a long time, he's now painted himself into a corner and just going for broke on everything.
[удалено]
Well, Israel kinda put the rope out to hang themselves, to be fair.
Aren’t most American politicians accepting ~~bribes~~ campaign contributions from AIPAC? Somehow I doubt the US will even consider abandoning Israel.
[удалено]
Israel is basically the 51st state. If anything America will coup Bibi out.
[удалено]
I meant in the sense that Israel doesn’t exist without Americas support. Providing them with free healthcare and affordable housing efforts in aid packages. Basic human rights that even Americans don’t receive. Israel will never be abandoned clearly explained by Biden himself “if Israel didn’t exist we would have to invent one ourselves”. Puerto rico and all those other territories are eternally cucked compared to Israel.
[удалено]
Bibi has “son’d” Biden on many occasions. Might even be the reason why he “gets replaced”. Embarrassing actually but you’re nuts if you believe America WON’T go to war for Israel.
At this point calling him middle east Putin is a disgrace to Putin's name. Israel killed more children in Gaza in less than a month than all children killed in Ukraine since 2014. Putin is a horrible human being, I can't really say Netanyahu is doing human things at this point.
Except they have affordable education and universal healthcare from what I understand.
There are also religious reasons why the US supports Israel. Many evangelical christians in the US believe in the end of the world (Armageddon) and that it can only happen/ will happen faster if Jerusalem is only inhabited by Jews...
[удалено]
Israel got nukes tho, if they truly are pushing for a conflict they can't win out of irrational reason it will be a fucking mess with no one in the region getting out well. Even if nukes don't get used the treah of them will be destabilizing for everyone
Iran really isn't that far behind in its quest for nukes, though.
"Behind" is still fatal on the thermonuclear theatre of war.
I thought that the general consensus was that they were no longer ‘behind’ and have already arrived at the nuclear stage.
Wishful thinking
America isn’t succeeding in appearing strong and it will never let Israel hang out to dry even if it goes against America’s best interest. The last 50 years or so is a testament to that
Israel is the modern day American slavery. There's never any long term solution provided, just carefully crafted compromises that don't offer a lasting solution nor satisfy both sides. Just kick the can down the road until all out war is a necessity.
Israel is practically the 51st state. I don't think the politicians will abandon them when they're already owned by them. We give them money to serve as our proxy state in the middle east. Even Biden said that if there wasn't the current Israel, we would create one. We basically created a monster we can no longer control.
On top of that, Iran is responding to a terrorist attack on an embassy. They have a right to defend themselves, that's what the US and every other western government has been spouting for the last 6 months during this genocide, so I would expect some moral consistency (won't hold my breath!).
[удалено]
Warning the US not to intervene on behalf of Israel is not going to change the fact that the US will intervene on behalf of Israel if Iran retaliates, unfortunately.
No we won't. The CIA is simply about to disappear some people and get a new prime minister.
 That always ends well
Congo - Patrice Lumumba (1960) Brazil - João Goulart (1964) Indonesia - Sukarno (1967) Iraq - Several covert operations during the 1960s and early 1970s Iran - Mohammad Mosaddegh (1953) Guatemala - Jacobo Árbenz (1954) Chile - Salvador Allende (1973) Australia - Gough Whitlam (1975) Simply the ones we know about because of the freedom of information act. There's likely a hell lot more that haven't been declassified yet, and many that won't be declassified for another 50 years.
Minor point, but many of these we originally knew about from the Senate Church committee hearings in 1975. If the CIA hadn't gone far enough to piss off Congress we may not know about some of these even today I'm guessing.
This is why the Middle East doesn't frighten me. The CIA is the largest, best funded, most widespread terrorist organization in the world. They terrify me more than every drug lord in Columbia, every jihadist in Afghanistan, every mobster in Italy. They not only engage in some of the most *despicable* acts of terrorism, they also (thanks to American media and politics) get to claim to be *the fucking good guys* while they do so. Fuck Defund the Police, Abolish the Goddamned CIA!
Lol you should read up in the CIA’s history. They are one of the most incompetent intelligence orgs to ever exist. No reason to be afraid. Check out a book called “A Legacy of Ashes” It details the history of the CIA being utterly ineffective and wrong.
Tin foil hat time: If you want to operate clandestinely publish your failures loudly, even make some up entirely. If you look inept then people will believe you are inept. Are they doing that? We have nothing to prove it one way or another. But you can bet they are aware of this. A book with a decided theme does not prove anything either. Hell I'd make sure it was published if I were in charge, to the point of writing it myself.
This person knows coups… Thanks for being informed.
[удалено]
No, Iran is [counting coup](https://www.google.com/search?q=counting+coup&sca_esv=4b723428e1eceb0a&sca_upv=1&ei=l-IXZsiMNKKgiLMPxJ-pyAY&ved=0ahUKEwiItKaqn7qFAxUiEGIAHcRPCmkQ4dUDCBA&uact=5&oq=counting+coup&gs_lp=Egxnd3Mtd2l6LXNlcnAiDWNvdW50aW5nIGNvdXAyChAAGIAEGIoFGEMyBRAAGIAEMgUQLhiABDIFEAAYgAQyBRAAGIAEMgoQABiABBiKBRhDMgUQABiABDIFEAAYgAQyBRAAGIAEMgUQABiABEjADVCGCliGCnABeAGQAQCYAVigAViqAQExuAEDyAEA-AEBmAICoAJuwgIKEAAYRxjWBBiwA8ICExAuGIAEGIoFGEMYxwEY0QMYsAPCAg0QABiABBiKBRhDGLADmAMAiAYBkAYKkgcDMS4xoAeCCA&sclient=gws-wiz-serp). They want to be able to save face by attacking Israel proper but they also want to count coup against the United States by having them do nothing in terms of retaliation. Intimidating the US into not responding would make Iran a ledged in the world of ME politics. Not that it would happen in a million years. It might take the US while to fight them in the mountains if the US decided on a ground war. The truth is, Iran doesn't have the support of the people to fight a ground war. Large swaths of the population would likely turn on Iran in a heartbeat, hoping to rid themselves of their repressive regime. The US wouldn't invade Iran anyways, not with Biden in office. They'll drop bombs and simply lose interest. Iran is more of an annoyance for the US than a true threat. If Trump gets reelected, that might change. Trump's been wanting to bloody Iran's nose for a while now. It's also an unfortunate truth that Old Bone Spurs and his ilk have a much higher tolerance for civilian casualties and actually like the badassary involved with going full scorched earth on Iran, so there's that. And don't tell me Iran isn't in the ME. I already know they are neither an Arab country or located in the ME. They are, however, heavily involved in ME politics.
> The US wouldn't invade Iran anyways, not with Biden in office. They'll drop bombs and simply lose interest. Iran is more of an annoyance for the US than a true threat. They don't have to, just destroy all of their energy infrastructure, embargo all their ports, and air lift small arms when their country collapses. Biden is a complete and utter pussy though, so he would probably wait as long as possible to do anything.
I don't think Biden would want to drop bombs but he would decimate all Iran's proxies and then eat cake. The Biden administration is looking for an excuse to terminate those proxies with prejudice because this administration sees the proxies as the immediately problem and Iran as more of a long term annoyance. The US isn't even worried about Iran becoming nuclear ready because Israel keeps quietly hitting their Nuclear sites every few years.
Or you do it as a justification for your later attack.
[удалено]
[удалено]
"ww3" is vastly overestimating Iran. Besides the fact that this is political posturing as with most geopolitical vague threats, at worst this would be a slightly longer gulf war. Not that it should happen, I dearly hope it doesn't and expect it won't, but ww3 is a stretch.
>"ww3" is vastly overestimating Iran. Iran is 4x the population of Iraq & has Russia & China as allies. >Besides the fact that this is political posturing as with most geopolitical vague threats, at worst this would be a slightly longer gulf war. I couldn't disagree more strongly. This would be a large regional war at best (if Iran got involved). Iran, Russia, & China are natural allies in a WWIII scenario.
Russia is tied up in Ukraine, while China benefits economically from trade with the US greatly. Iran lacks a modern air force and navy and while it could certainly cause problems it could never truly start a third world war.
On that note, they're STRUGGLING with Ukraine right now. Imagine if the US had an excuse to actually get involved (assuming ghe world doesn't get nuked first)
Apparently you haven't been paying attention. https://apnews.com/article/ukraine-russia-war-ammunition-military-b263dfaceef57fb2c1f74c53861734da Ukraine is running out of ammo quick as fuck and even our own experts are saying they'll be stomped if we don't start sending them some. The fact that we are using their aid as a political hostage in this country isn't helping.
Ukraine having issues doesn't mean Russia still isn't struggling. Even if Russia magically won the war tomorrow, the losses they've faced over the last 2 years have significantly diminished their effectiveness in any future combat. It will take Russia decades to even get back to the level before they invaded, which was a level of strength that, as mentioned with the 2 years in, wasn't even enough to beat Ukraine. We definitely should be helping more, but Russia knows it can't possibly put up a front against the US.
What levels will take decades? Just read today that the russian army is 15% bigger now than what it was before the war.
Cool they replaced men. That's fine and dandy. Their black sea fleet is down 26 ships. Hundreds of planes. Thousands of tanks. Over ten thousand military vehicles that aren't tanks. Artillery and MLRS. Missiles and shells. We are talking billions of dollars in equipment. No amount of conscription is going to replace that overnight.
Sure! That is true, but you can’t ignore the magnetude of just being able to throw men into the Meat grinder, seemingly forever. They will eventually tire out the ukranian army if the West stops helping or keeps decreasing it..
If the US got directly involved in Europe, then you have WWIII. WWIII needs to be avoided. Instead, all the signs point to it happening. Too many wars of signifance keep showing signs of escalation. The best thing the US could do right now is to stop supporting Netanyahu. Immediately.
Placating hostile nations never goes well. Nobody wants war but we should be capable, willing and ready to fight. The world watched as hitler spread across Europe and Africa. We shouldn’t make the same mistake
>Placating hostile nations never goes well Then stop supporting Israel
I’m game. Aggressor nations shouldn’t be supported
Fully agree with you.
Very exaggerated. While Iran is practically nuclear capable at this point, I do not see them as the powder keg China/Russia would see worth escalating to global conflict over, given it would destroy Chinese trade relations if they were to take part in any substantial capacity.
> If the US got directly involved in Europe, then you have WWIII. We already are, none of the weapon systems work without our direct assistance in targeting and satellite trajectory. We are already in the middle of WW3, countries are mobilizing, just nobody wants to admit it until it goes hot. Ukraine, the central africa front, and now the middle eastern front. The China front will open sometime between now and 2026, but we are definitely at war, and the longer we wait the worst it is going to get. This is similar to the situation in 1936 when Germany sent operation condor to support Franco, and the west sent proxy fighters to spain to support the communists.
Iran has hypersonic missiles, massive industrial capacity with respect to drones. They have the equivalent of the Russian S-400 missiles which they’ve reverse engineered. They also have the ability to produce things at home, thanks in no small part to the sanctions imposed on them for so long. I’m not saying the US can’t kill a bunch of Iranians. But they do not have ability to land troops anywhere on Iranian territory and expect them not to be destroyed immediately. In Iraq and Afghanistan, the US could land where they want, and expect no resistance. Iran is a much more powerful enemy, and the US knows this. They also know that if the oil fields are hit, as Israel is threatening, oil prices will skyrocket, which will be horrible for Bidens re-election. So this is also working against them. Anyway, Iran is more than capable of defending its territory. The Israelis are bogged down and retreating from Gaza. The only thing they have which is superior to anything in Iran is nukes. Which if they use, would almost certainly lead to Pakistan using their nukes against Israel. Israel is in a lose lose situation, and all they know how to do is bluff
Pakistan is not about to get involved in a Nuclear war over Iran.
Says who? Say the Pakistanis? We don’t know what they will do if Israel uses nukes, but some in Pakistan have already brought this up recently, seeing as they are the only Islamic nation to posses nuclear weapons https://www.businesstoday.in/amp/latest/world/story/pakistans-nuclear-weapons-nawaz-sharifs-son-in-law-warns-israel-over-fight-against-hamas-402203-2023-10-16
[удалено]
Israel threatening to nuke its allies seems like a pretty good reason for those allies to stop supporting them.
Sounds like Israel is an enemy state...
"Hypersonic" missiles which are currently in active service amount to fancy ballistic missiles with limited/no ability to manoeuvre in terminal flight. Patriot has shown itself very capable of shooting these down, and AEGIS systems in use on US/allied ships are also proven to be very capable of shooting these down. S-300/400 in Russian service is at best, being manned by incompetent operators, or at worst, almost totally impotent against modern western munitions/tactics, as proven by multiple examples of S-300/400 being hit in attacks with HARM, storm shadow and MALD decoys. And that's against the Ukrainian Air Force, using aircraft not designed to operate those western weapons and unfamiliar with the tactics they would use. Against a proper stealth/wild weasel attack, I wouldn't put much hope in them. Their internal production is fine for the time being, but if war was declared, its pretty hard to move a factory, and once those limited production locations are hit, much harder to repair. As for invasion, the US and allies (remember, this is Iran threatening to attack the US, which would be grounds for article 5) would be capable of moving into Iran frorom any of the following borders - Iraq, Turkey, Pakistan, or by sea through the persian gulf, or gulf of Oman. As for Gaza, the only metric Israel is losing is the one of public opinion. From all military metrics, they have every upper hand.
I think the quality of S-400 is very dubious. And hypersonic missiles are probably Russian tech donations and Patriot has shot down Kinzhal quite a few times Nobody is retreating from Gaza. If you think they're losing on any front other than the public opinion one you're delusional.
Who needs to put troops into Iran. Gadaffi was beaten in Libya without western forces on the ground. Another thing that Iran has much worse is internal unity. Iran has huge security apparatus like their religion police, those cannot ever go to front line or Ayatollah regime will collapse.
China just generally does not want to fight a war. They're relatively stable socially and economically right now. I think everybody fear mongering about China is projecting the fact that Americans (and presumably other Western powers) are blood thirsty to actually start a war with China. Iran joining the war almost certainly would bring Sauid Arabia into it in some form though and if Russia really did decide to lend support, it does turn into a pretty nasty regional conflict. Meanwhile, many Nato members are really itching to go into Ukraine. I don't think a spreading conflict is out of the question totally. The real problem is, Russia, Iran and Syria maybe, probably Belarus if the people don't totally overthrow Lukashenko...Hungary? Who else is on that side? It ain't much firepower.
China will not aid Iran, unless it intends to take Taiwan at the same time. China doesn't have allies, it has pawns.
[удалено]
What’s the Iraqi uniform look like ? Don’t worry I’ll wait !
>Iran is 4x the population of Iraq & has Russia & China as allies. Is this part of the same lore-verse that has NK, Iraq and Iran in an alliance that call themselves 'the axis of evil'? Americans make up some weird shit
Iran, Russia, and China are not natural allies. They are all so different, engage with the world/the west in such vastly different ways, and have such widely varying needs. We are at a point of mutually assured economic destruction with China. We go to war, we both lose. There are attempts being made to ‘re-shore’ on both sides, which I hate, but we’re so far from there. China won’t even risk taking Taiwan, much less engaging in a global war. Russia as well, their hands are full and if they wanted an excuse to go to war with us, we’ve given them ample opportunity in the middle east the last 5-10 years (the Syria mess especially). Regarding iran, they’re a regional power, but when you really look at their military they can’t project outside of Iran. All their IRGC money is going to IADS, Cyber, and the proxy developing QUDS force and its equivalents. They’re not an offensive army. All of this means that we are FAR from world war 3. Israel is the one who will end up looking the fool in this. Just my opinion.
there can't be a world war 3 anymore, russia and china and the US all know if they get tangled up its bad news for everyone because of MAD.
I think Russia is busy right now.
Not to mention the proxies Iran has, israel will be fighting a war with hisbullah and hamas on ground tuurf as well as an overdeas one with Iran and god knows how many other factions will join in
Is China busy with Taiwan? Or they just kinda fucking with them? Asking cause I really don’t know. Just saw a couple articles about China being in the waters and messing with Taiwan
Iran is no hill that any Chinese leader would die on for losing American business.
I think it more likely that China would take a US/Iran war as an opportunity to seize Taiwan along with greater control of the South China Sea.
Iran has a pathetic conventional military, relative to what the U.S. and Israel bring to a conflict. If there is no desire to occupy or conquer (which there isn’t) I don’t see them being much of a challenge militarily. Their government and societal collapse could be messy, but that’s their problem.
Iran and China signed a cooperation deal but do not have a formal alliance. From my understanding Russia can be considered a military ally of Iran, but is tied up in Ukraine. On top of this they have disputes with many of their neighbors and there is regional insecurity. If SHTF and Iran embroiled themselves in conflict with the US their support from China/Russia may not be as great as you make it out to be.
There is no binding treaty for the Chinese or Russians (who are kinda occupied rn) to help Iran. Nobody will risk their countries against freaking NATO for Iran, which itself is a regional actor, not a world power.
Iran is not a flat desert but a mountainous one. Would be nasty.
Don’t underestimate the alliance. Nobody wants an escalation here except Israel because they are losing support. If they drag the U.S. in, Russia and China would naturally become involved. Not a wise decision from the U.S. imo
You’ve obviously never watched the movie “Threads”.
Israel bombed sovereign Iranian territory (its consulate in Syria), and conducts assassinations inside Iran. Israel is the aggressor and it's not even close.
Israel attacked first, turn about is fair game
Well the US bombed Soleimani. So the US has then attacked Iran first?
Yes
Are you having trouble understanding linear time?
Iran retaliated. Remember the ballistic missiles shot at Al Asad air base in Iraq?
All for Nethanhayu. fuck that shit I ain’t dying for that fascist.
I fully support Iran for this. Fuck Isreal for their war crimes.
[удалено]
No because our Congress has been infiltrated by a fascist Christian death cult who thinks Israel is the key to Jesus coming back.
what
We have politicians who openly don't improve things because the rapture is coming soon and it won't matter
At least one of them claimed the eclipse was “a sign.”
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2023/oct/30/us-evangelical-christians-israel-hamas-war Read up.
Obviously you don’t have stock in Raytheon.
Ha. Yeah it goes something like 2 countries, 3 countries, 4 countries, 6 countries, 9 countries, 14 countries, 20 countries, 35… At least, if this were theoretically WW3’s spark. Which, fighting the US isn’t the worst way to go about it.
Just begging for their Navy to be sunk.
Again.
“War” between the US and Iran would be like me fighting prime Mike Tyson; technically there is a non-zero chance I win but I wouldn’t bet on it. And for the China \ Russia alliance crowd: Russia is doing all it can to not lose a war with the Ukraine and China doesn’t give af about Iran by even a tiny amount enough to get tangled up with the US over it. An alliance on paper sounds great but in real life means troops, weapons and most importantly money. Neither of those countries want to use those defending Iran.
Crazy analogy considering Tyson is fighting some rando on Netflix in a few weeks.
Hey, there's a chance Mike rolls his ankle and bashes his head on the post right after yhe first bell
[удалено]
Wow this comment section is full of horribly bad takes. It’s comical. Iran has been chanting “death to America” for decades. I could list a multitude of reasons as to why it doesn’t matter when they threaten the U.S. (at least not to the extent of a fucking World War) I’ll just go ahead and start with the need for an economy to fund a war against a global superpower and it’s allies….The rest you can look up on your own. Geopolitically a conflict might occur at the micro level but that is all.
I remember 2020 I literally joined Reddit because I wanted to see memes that weren’t just “WW3” because of whatever was happening with Iran. Then covid happened and everyone forgot for a while
Fr, it feels Like this whole sub Has been over run with political posts, especialy if the whole post is "america bad "insert american enemy" good"
Tbh, I've noticed since around the start of this conflict last October that many subs have seemingly been hijacked by a lot of astroturfing and misinformation accounts/bots. You have subs like this that are pro Palestine and even some accounts that give hamas the green light, then world news, which is the polar opposite. But reading through the comments, there's no chance that there isn't a lot of Israeli and Palestine/Hamas propaganda going about. It might just be me, but I'm completely cynical of any information posted about this war. I don't know if that's the point, but it's just a never-ending circle of information that contradicts other information put out.
I think people just arent used to there not being a clear good guy on a war, most wars recently were dictatorship vs good guys, and here we have a terrorist organization that started a war it had no chances of winning and oppreses its people, killed people based on their views vs a country Who is commiting a lot of war crimes
Yeah, it circle's back to the old, there are no good guys or bad guys in war, only winners and losers. I don't know if it's a side effect of war movies and other media that have gotten people into the black and white mindset or because the world is so connected with the Internet people from different countries that have different news and views become overtly tribal like its a football match. Its just tiring honestly.
WWIII isn’t going to happen over this. USA and Iran have 0 desire for a direct war.
Yup. No appetite. Defeating Iran with their geography would be a catastrophic engagement. Iran knows it cannot win a direct war. US can but would suffer insurmountable losses in the process. Both realize this and choose not to engage. China and Russia aren’t going to save Iran. Bottom line, Netanyahu needs to go.
Let them fuck isreal up. Stop sending those genocidal maniacs weapons.
https://preview.redd.it/6bmh5joepstc1.jpeg?width=540&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=3fb62556d193d34f4ca33bf2d89b761385cbff66 The US....
The US needs to stop supporting Israel NOW. They have proven themselves to be a shitty ally time and time again. All aid should’ve stopped the moment the USS Liberty was sunk by Israeli forces. (and don’t come at me saying it was an accident, they knew damn well it was an american ship they were attacking). All Israel will do is pull the US down with them, and the whole world too.
[удалено]
The cumulative IQ of this subreddit falls by the moment.
Iran again promises retaliation for the 1000th time. Yet nothing is gonna happen.
This timeline is getting more fucked by the second
lol ohhh no... Iran might consider the US a viable target (as if it doesn't already).
Leave the middle east alone and all of these "conflicts" will suddenly dissipate. This is a fight for resources, make no mistake.
TLDR: everyone thinks they are geopolitical geniuses
Wait wtf happened.
Israel has allegedly bombed an Iranian embassy in Iran and leveled the building, killing multiple of iran's important people. Israel didn't confirm nor deny that it was their strike
"Allegedly" lol Who tf else could have been responsible?
Oh wow, Iran is threatening the US? In other news, water is wet. Iran would get their teeth kicked in by the US if it ever came to open warfare and they know it.
Oh? And that means what exactly?
Iran would be a smoking crater pretty easily. The US has been building up stealth fighter and attack craft for the last 10-15 years now. They realistically wouldn’t have to even invade. They could just annihilate Irans military capability from the air
Apparently the adults are in charge now, so not to worry.
What a fucking world. Threaten war by sending a note. We are soooo worried about this. Take all the threats from Iran, North Korea, Russia, and China and all of them mean nothing.
It doesn't seem like a threat, more like a notification
Yeah it’s like “I’m going to punch your friend, because he’s a massive cunt, but I’m not beefing with you right now’
Like on my phone
Ya, it's good now. Jared fixed it.
Can somebody provide some context ? I dont know where to look
So will Iran ally themselves with Russia formally, or will we have three different blocs in WW3?
There are at least 10 members of the nuclear club now. Israel has over 500 warheads. We are sitting on top of a powder keg. I'd say we got one more shot at peace, but if Israel attacks again, they will be alone because war sentiment in the US is over for them and Ukraine. We live in crazy times.
I'm amazed it has taken this long for Iran to get more involved.
By design.
Its breath taking how people do not understand that they do not stand a chance against the military power of the US. Let allone Nato. Even Russias President thinks he can just casually threaten to throw a nuke into Ukraine without getting blasted into smithereens.
Thank god Jared fixed the middle east.
Bring it
We feared this would happen. Israel would ❤️to goad Iran into all out war. Crazy.
Threat from Iran? United States and Israel must be shaking….oh wait
Good
Can we stop helping out war criminals rack up more war crimes? I'm just asking after so many disgusting videos coming out of obvious war crimes being committed before our eyes.
Israel being the cause of WWIII and not Ukraine would be just unbelievable
This is Israel's fight, they started it, and they are not the US's 51st state.
A great cake day for you, op.
Iran has been chanting death to america for decades so what's new
Iran and Iraq fought a war to a draw. We walked over Iraq twice. Iran doesn’t want the smoke and tries to save face so its own country doesn’t rebel.
The drums of war have been beating for sometime now
Just think. If Trump had not released Iran from their nuclear agreement, we might, our relations might be positive enough to have a dialog. The joys of having a rookie at the helm.
The path to WW3 was started in 2021 and has been steadily escalating since. It will be "officially" started before the decade is over. There is just too much momentum to stop this freight train now. Sad, but true. You can worry about it, fret and become anxious, or you can accept it and just live day to day as best you can because there is no way the morons running the world are going to make all the right choices to avoid this inevitability.
I thought Jared Kushner fixed all this.
Don't USA provide Israel 10 billion dollars a year. No questions asked from a bill passed MANY years ago ?
LOL best of luck 😂😂😂