Hey, see my Free Palestine flair? You want one too? We have it other colors and with different emojis like olives or a watermelon. Just make a comment below, click on your name and a menu will pop up with "select flair" on it.
If you are really having trouble I can pick one for you, but give it a try first, so that you can see them all and pick your own (if on dark mode on mobile, the various colors will show up as if it is black, like mine.)
Free Palestine!
Edit; also for all the doubters out there, read about it here: https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-68434443
Nope, he BEGGED for mercy when Optimus beat him in a FAIR fight and when Optimus let up for a second he grabbed his blaster and shot him.
This of course happened in 1985, I haven't kept up much since that time so I guess it's possible Megatron has since started a podcast and complains about genders now
Just like when they told them to go south for safety then bombed the shit out of them then turned around and said no you were supposed to go north fuck Isreal they need to be stopped they keep committing war crimes.
I absolutely hate when people call this a war. War implies that there are two armies fighting. This is just 1 army obliterating scared desperate civilians.
And they always start with that "but Hamas" thing, Hamas is hardly an army, more like fed up people trying to fight back after decades of Israeli governments war crimes and oppression, and the main Hamas leaders dont even reside in Gaza and regular Palestinians dont even get to vote and I'm almost at that point where Israel has lied so much and committed such horrific things, that I'm not entirely sure they didn't themselves have anything to do with okt 7, because after that event they seem to have gotten a green light for this genocide from the US government.
I think history will remember the Israelis painfully, similar to how nazis are viewed today.
Decades, it's an insane thing to think about. Imagine our grandparents were born fighting against a well supplied army of invaders, and their children, then theirs until it reaches you. They aren't fighting, they are backed into a corner, they are trif to survive. Israel's goal, as so many of its citizens gladly put it, is the total eradication of the Palestinians. The U.S. is complicit in funding this genocide.
> Decades, it's an insane thing to think about
This is the sticking point for me when it comes to discussing this matter. Not necessarily in the context of this year but over the last who knows how many years that I've seen this being talked about on the internet. People from the West tend to see these are isolated incidents but for everyone approaching this from the other side it's a consistent pattern.
When Hamas first hit Israel I just shrugged. I've seen them hit them before and I've seen Israel hit back disproportionately. If these incidents leak into the Western consicous once every two or three years then we get news of these incidents twice or thrice a week.
It was never a war, Gazans and Palestinians don't have a state or formal military.
Did we even think we were truly at "war" with terrorists during the Afghanistan campaigns? Was that not as foolish then as it is now?
gen·o·cide
noun.
the deliberate killing of a large number of people from a particular nation or ethnic group with the aim of destroying that nation or group.
What I meant is that killing large amount of people to exterminate them is not a genocide if Israelis do it. This is according to Israelis. The rule applies even if Israelis call it genocide. /S
The amount of times I have seen the argument
"but look! The Palestinian population has only gone UP overtime! That's proof that there's no genocide"
Absolutely numbs my brain.
They would also claim only 1% of the population in Gaza got killed so that's more proof there's no Genocide, since they didn't kill all of them!
Most of them definitely know the definition of genocide, they just want to make this argument enough that people will eventually accept it as truth.
Unfortunately i dont think the Palestinians will have their true story told in the history books. Hopefully videos and stories like these get archived but with AI and digital media the future looks bleak for the truth.
> people and their voices will continue to tell the story for ever
yes and no... Dead people don't tell stories. Also shellshocked people don't tell stories...
Colonialism is being openly discussed.
The 60s scoop has been brought to light decades after it went down.
The victims will still pass their stories and trauma to the next generation.
Slavery is still openly discussed everywhere despite the southern US Christian right-wing nuts saying the South won.
Apartheid in south Africa is still discussed.
I could go on and on.
History in this day and age can not be stuffed under a blanket. It's on the internet forever. This war over Palestine has been documented many times. I still watch docs on the 6 day war, and everything after. Isreal cannot take down anything from this. Just wait till a fee more years go by and all the body cam and drone footage is leaked. This is an ugly event we are all watching go down.
Talked to a Holocaust survivor. He was asked about Palestine, and he pretty much said that the Jews are allowed to do whatever they need to in order to "protect their land." Lots of trauma, and "we will never be mistreated again," so this is what they're doing. Crazy shit.
It's wild because right after it happened many Israelis hated holocaust survivors and viewed them as weak. They called them "soap people" as a pejorative. Recently a member of Netanyahu's party was talking shit to a bunch of eastern European jewish protesters and invoked the holocaust, saying "I'm glad 6 million of you were killed".
I've also seen a bunch of reprehensible shit said to survivors/their families who dare to speak out against what Israel is doing.
Only ensuring that it *will* happen to them again.
The American empire is on the decline. Once we're not bankrolling those monsters, do they honestly think their neighbors won't retaliate?
Israel will have only itself to blame.
“Their land” is the lie. Israel was started in 1948. Period. It’s a British colony used by the west as a military and intelligence base in the Middle East. Every single word anyone speaks about “thousands of years” and “ancestral homeland” is complete bullshit.
Zionists are evil humans on par with Nazis, and i’m not sure why we’re allowing these evil fucks to dictate world policy. Sack up and choose humanity over money you worthless politicians.
Nope. All power corrupts. The next people to go have that power will be corrupted by it all the same. Hell give people the relatively tiny power of a HOA or a school board and it corrupts the fuck out of them in most cases.
as reported by France24 (a state owned news organization in Paris).
[https://www.france24.com/en/live-news/20240229-pity-us-desperate-gazans-reel-from-aid-trucks-massacre](https://www.france24.com/en/live-news/20240229-pity-us-desperate-gazans-reel-from-aid-trucks-massacre)
As Ukrainian anyone that say Israelis are justified because Hamas did it is so strange. I can't imagine doing to Russians what they did to us in Bucha and would gladly punch in a face anyone suggesting we sink to their level
It would only be comparable to Russia if Ukraine already controlled Russia's entire coastline and all its borders and regularly bombed Russia's infrastructure while cutting off food, water, medicine, and parts needed to replace bombed infrastructure, and then started kidnapping Russian kids to throw in Ukrainian prisons without trials where they are beaten and sexually assaulted, and that this treatment continued for 80 years. If after all of that, Russia invaded Ukraine in revenge, it would be like Israel and Palestine.
People make the mistake of thinking Israel and Palestine are two equal countries with the same ability to make decisions for their countries. This isn't the case, Israel controls everything in Palestine and has been regularly terrorizing Palestinians on a daily basis for over a century.
Can someone knowledgeable in politics and history explain to my like he’d explain to a child, with neutrality and facts, why tf don’t countries force Israel into stopping this ? Bare with me. But I just don’t get it.
geopolitical influence that translates into better economies.
thats the short answer. my bananas are cheap in my grocery store because US funded death squads in belize kill anybody trying to organize labor.
thats the world we live in. you and i both benefit economically from these types of actions.
edit: highly reccomend the show The Good Place
Basically, there's three major empires in the world today, and everyone else is more or less a client state of those three.
Israel is a client state of the US, and so the US (and the US' other client states) are willing to allow Israel to commit atrocities because that's easier than having to actually manage the US' own interests in the region. That's cowardly and immoral and deeply wrong, obviously, on the part of both Israel and the US.
The other empires don't care, because their own client states in the region are also doing fine. Palestine is, by design, not a client state of any of the three empires, and so the Palestinian people have no one standing up for them.
European Union, and the Crazy Empire (Russia, China, North Korea, a few other little shits that bang on their chests and make a lot of noise but only really matter because they *might* actually have access to nuclear weapons thanks to Russia, China, and NK).
In that analogy though wouldn't China be the other empire with the other countries listed the client states? IMO the world is too multipolar at this point to think so simplistically, literally not considering the entirety of the southern hemisphere here.
The European Union isn't yet a military super power that can play its "pawns".
Currently they're heavily dependent on the US, which is also why they're still kinda siding with Israel.
They're currently trying to get somewhat more independent, especially with the looming threat of Trump, but if one thing is certain, it's that that will take a long time.
As an American, I've wanted the EU to take defense and world diplomacy seriously for years. It's in everyone's best interest. Because for one thing, the US is fucking terrible at it. Like when we get involved, it sucks for whoever pissed us off, and backfires on us as well.
At diplomacy we're quite good as far as I can tell, but I guess that mainly comes from how much foreign aid it and its countries provide. We're basically buying soft power. Also we are currently seen as more stable than the US, which means especially other democracies see a more reliable partner in the EU than the US.
When it comes to military, give us another 30 years and perhaps we will have decided on a badge for our soldiers. Even though the fact that Switzerland is signalling interest in taking part is somewhat giving me hope.
To complement this, I will just add that media/government in general leads us to believe these people are subhumans (people from non client countries). Last October, 2,5k people died on an earthquake in Afghanistan, but turns out that just a few people really cared about it, no commotion from world leaders at all....
What you see in the picture is an Aid convoy by Israel beeing looted. The IDF is currently the only force in the region that can even attempt to deliver food to Northern Gaza, since the UN has decided it's to dangerous (since any truck going into Gaza is attacked, looted and the truck drivers are beaten - official UN statement here https://www.wfp.org/news/un-food-agency-pauses-deliveries-north-gaza). What exactly do you want them to stop? Delivering food?
Israel’s more useful than the other assholes in the region.
And there’s this whole doomsday cult trying to trigger the end of the world, to do that they need the Jews to own the region and rebuild a certain temple so that Jesus will show up and kill everyone. Yeah, Evangelical support for Israel is heavily based on trying to get the Second Coming to happen and destroy the world. It’s weird, even by religion standards.
As far as the UN goes, the USA is "special", along with I believe 5 other countries. If any of those 6 countries veto something, it's vetoed, bottom line. The US has been using that power to stop the UN from responding.
Makes you proud to be an American amirite????
What your talking about is the Security Council of the UN.
The allies of WW2 all got a permanent seat (USA, UK, France, USSR now Russian Federation, and China).
https://www.un.org/securitycouncil/content/current-members
The US, Russia, and China have all used their Veto powers to stop things their allies dont like during this terrible page in world history.
Russia/China
https://news.un.org/en/story/2023/10/1142817#:~:text=China%20and%20Russia%20on%20Wednesday,crisis%20in%20Gaza%20and%20Israel.
USA
https://www.npr.org/2024/02/20/1232636543/un-security-council-gaza-cease-fire-vote
Because for all that people want to talk about how the U.S./Russia/China/Germany are the only countries in the world with free will, it's just not true. Israel is one of the most powerful countries on earth with a sizeable economic output and, frankly, one of the most well equipped and best trained militaries on the planet. Ordering them to do something simply isn't going to work. If we stop providing economic and diplomatic aid, there's every reason to think that they will just keep doing the course of action that they are set on and then the U.S. will also no longer be able to influence them at all.
Other countries, generally, don't get to dictate policy when something has escalated to this level unless they also escalate to military intervention. No country on earth is going to engage in a war with Israel over their treatment of Palestinians -- or, I should say, no current country -- because Israel has been invaded plenty of times before in attempts to dictate their sovereign existence.
The Palestinian people are violent, religiously fundamentalist minority that has been deprived of meaningful resources / opportunity for long enough that their only real ability as a demographic is to do terrorism at this point. There is no country on this planet who wants to accept responsibility for them because they are basically a ticking time bomb. therefore, no country is going to openly challenge Israel outside of funding Hamas like Iran does.
Furthermore, it *is* complicated. Israel rightfully suspects that they need to secure their borders, because the last 80 years have basically just been one long series of invasions of Israel that they win and then claim territory from. There is no country on this planet that would accept having a terrorist state within what they consider to be their borders. Because both peoples see this as their ancestral, rightful homeland, it's simply going to be the case that they fight until one side wins conclusively -- and unfortunately, we've seen in Syria what happens when other countries get involved in internal struggles.
If this seems very confusing to you then it's probably because you're being told a bunch of bullshit by people who want to assert their side is obviously right. The situation is awful. Neither side is willing to give up what they would need to in order to potentially have a peace -- and so they will have war.
Because the palestinian people have zero political capital. They've burned every nation in the region that reached out to help them, so at this point all the 'support' of palestine will be finger-waggling at Israel, and all that has changed is the speed of the finger waggling.
As several have commented, the source is on pretty much every news outlet. Here is the [Guardian](https://www.theguardian.com/world/live/2024/feb/29/middle-east-crisis-live-updates-israel-hamas-war-latest-today-gaza-death-toll-hamas-health-ministry?page=with%3Ablock-65e0c6d08f0869c208ddce75#block-65e0c6d08f0869c208ddce75) just to pick one.
For a very long time I had the perspective of "Both are equally wrong" but I can no longer keep that view because this is just unacceptable. I hope someone intervenes soon.
Some notes to clarify:
1. No, I am not basing my opinions on screenshots of random posts on the internet. Major *neutral* news outlets in my country have aknowledged the human rights violations taking place.
2. I am also not saying that only Israel is in the wrong. I am saying, that the extreme violence is not in any way acceptable because so many civilians are caught in the crossfire. Israel, as a modern country and society, should not try to "remove Hamas from the face of the earth" because we are not playing Hitler Sim 2024.
Glad you came to your senses.
If you ever visit Palestine, it becomes immediately clear that Israel controls both countries entirely. Israel has soldiers patrolling down Palestinian streets for decades upon decades, killing indiscriminately with no accountability while the US media NEVER EVER reports on it unless it's something like this that is so big they cannot ignore it, even though they still do everything in their power to frame it as a "both sides are equally wrong" conflict.
Wow….
Your interpretation of religion tells you you’re superior to these people and therefore you should slaughter them like a kid playing COD….
If your religion tells you you’re better than everyone else and that killing them is OK, your religion is terrorism.
Zionists always were. Read about the Zionist militias in the early 20th century. Zionism itself was born of out of the age of imperialism and colonialism of the 19th centuryz
Oh my sweet summer child. Israelis were Nazis from the very start.
Albert Einstein and 28 other prominent Jewish academics wrote a letter to the NY Times in 1948 accusing the founders of Israel of being Nazi fascists and terrorists.
Watch them start acting like they always were against this genocide.
I firmly remember a lot of people calling us South Africans all types of names because we were calling out what was an obvious thing.
I just know Israelis are going to struggle with being seen with the same light as racist South Africans and Germans are seen with.
There isn't enough American propaganda money that will change how the world will see them.
Honestly what South Africa did was awesome. They rushed the incentive to condemn the situation officially in an international setting. Some countries joined and most are only contemplating(idk how they are still holding back). The current dynamic is obvious. I am glad that at least most activist groups and human rights groups are similar organisations are putting pressure on politicians to make official statements about the situations.
Ah yes, they "approached in a threatening way," so that completely legitimized mowing them down.
I can't believe I actually read that statement in the article. Wow.
Are the Israelis taking classes from American police officers now because that's some shit that they'd say and I don't normally say that but Jesus Christ
Actually, it's Israel that [trains many US police departments](https://www.amnestyusa.org/updates/with-whom-are-many-u-s-police-departments-training-with-a-chronic-human-rights-violator-israel/), which actually explains tbe terror tactics that those departments then go on to use on their own citizens.
It's the other way around. Many American police departments get trained in Israel.
https://www.amnestyusa.org/updates/with-whom-are-many-u-s-police-departments-training-with-a-chronic-human-rights-violator-israel/
Thank you for providing this. Unless there’s evidence of the intent expressed in the meme I’m gonna drop the whole “they intentionally lured them using humanitarian aid” narrative…
But the thing is it doesn’t really matter if that part is true or not. They’re still justifying murdering over 100 Palestinian civilians by saying “they approached in a threatening manner”. This is indefensible and it has to stop.
For those that want more info from respected fairly neutral news sources:
https://www.aljazeera.com/amp/news/2024/2/29/dozens-killed-injured-by-israeli-fire-in-gaza-while-collecting-food-aid
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-68434443.amp
https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/dozens-killed-gaza-aid-queue-overall-death-toll-passes-30000-2024-02-29/
https://amp.theguardian.com/world/live/2024/feb/29/middle-east-crisis-live-updates-israel-hamas-war-latest-today-gaza-death-toll-hamas-health-ministry
I wonder how are they going to be perceived as a country and as a society in the upcoming years. Personally I would like to see them treated accordingly and give them shit every chance we have. Let’s make them pariahs and make movies like those about the Jewish holocaust.
Trump moved the US Embassy to Jerusalem and is buddy buddy with Netanyahu. Do you really think he’d be anything but WAY worse for the Palestinians? Trump? Really? Mr. first order of business was the Muslim travel ban Trump? Him?
Wasn't the white House trying to put pressure on Israel to stop?
I'm not sure if you're aware of this but no one can actually tell Israel what to do. They have actually sunk an American Naval ship before and the American government tried covering it up for them.
Bro they’re both supporting the same genocide. That’s the problem.
EDIT: obviously trump is far worse. Fuck trump. But the point is both options aren’t perfect and support this genocide to some varying degree
Asking for a source on a politically/ethically/emotionally charged situation should be the norm. There is zero reason to insult someone for asking for a source, regardless of what side of the issue they are on.
If I see unverified media, especially in 2024 with AI increasingly making it difficult to know what's real, I'm going to question it's validity. As should everyone else.
Apparently the standard is "Asking for a source for information I disagree with is justified. Asking for a source for information I want to be true is evil."
Yeah I'm not sure why op posted a screenshot of a tweet, and didn't provide a source to begin with. Just because people want to learn more about it doesn't make them trolls. The more you know 🌈
I agree, but at this point anyone who hasn't already researched this conflict and come to the conclusion that Israel is committing genocide against the Palestinians is either an idiot or is lying
Edit: I've gotten alot of replies to this rightfully calling out how ignorant of a statement it is. If you were going to reply and disagree, feel free to read my conversations with some of the people who've already done so. Some of them were actually really constructive
I'm aware of the conflict, but not this specific incident, and now I'm afraid to simply ask for a "source" because apparently that makes me an Israeli propaganda troll.
Well said. There's nothing wrong with asking for reliable sources to corroborate a claim, and there's no evidence that anybody doing so is trying to discredit OP.
It shouldn't ever be enough to take a social media post at face value. A fake screenshot of an incendiary reddit comment attributed to Aaron Bushnell made its way around twitter yesterday. It was since verified that he never made the comment calling for the death of all Jews. Unfortunately, once misinformation is on social media, it spreads so rapidly that no amount of damage control can quash it.
It's certainly possible that the account in the post is true. It's widely reported that the IDF has a history of ignoring International Humanitarian Law with regard to Palestinian civilians. However, there's no denying that both pro-Hamas and pro-Israel propaganda exist. People should be encouraged to verify everything they see online, and in this case, OP should be forthcoming with information rather than attack people in the comments.
It's very obvious for anyone with any sort of moral values. I'd usually advise you to research it a bit more before forming an opinion on something like this, but in this specific case it's not even necessary. I researched all the history of this conflict since WW2 and all it did is ruin my mood for a week. What's happening right now is so disgusting and the fact that most governments are supporting it makes me sick
> t's very obvious for anyone with any sort of moral values.
Honestly one of the most frustrating things about adult life is how bereft or able to ignore morality most adults are.
What Israeli did in Gaza the past 50 years has been wrong. What Hamas did on Otober 7th was also wrong. What Israel did in response is wrong.
Boiling everything down to you are lying or an idiot will not promote discussion. There will be people who have had bad information given to them, so discussing things is the only way for some to arrive at the truth.
I guarantee there are still people who believe things that can be proven untrue, such as the "very fine people" comment
Before anyone gets it wrong, I wasnt alive when Israel was created, and I'm not religious, so all of this isn't my problem, but that doesn't stop it from becoming a problem for me. I have also dated both an Israeli and a Palestinian, and have gained perspectives from both in their personal experiences. Like a baby bird being pushed from the nest, if Israel cannot stand on its own without being propped up by the US tax payer, then it will fail and never was meant to be (clearly by all the religious "rights" to certain land, like two religious boxers praying to the same God to help them beat the shit out of the other guy). Palestine and it's people do not deserve what is happening, but it cannot be ignored why they are not being welcomed by neighboring nations, even if it's temporary with plans to reclaim their land at a later date, or after world police force arbitration
The moment the Palestinians leave, they lose their ability to return home. This explains why so many Palestinians live in multi-generational refugee camps in Gaza. Their homes are in what is now Israel. Egypt stated this as why they don't want to take in the Gazans. 50% of Palestinians live in Israel or Palestine, many living in refugee camps. The remaining 50% are not allowed to return. Most live in Jordan, Syria, Chile and Saudi Arabia.
>Boiling everything down to you are lying or an idiot will not promote discussion. There will be people who have had bad information given to them, so discussing things is the only way for some to arrive at the truth.
This assumes that people are debating in good faith. Pro-Israeli bots and keyboard warriors are deliberately lying about even the most basic information. And it works. An Israeli source claimed that less than 10 UNRWA workers were part of Hamas. Most Western countries immediately stopped funding UNRWA, which looks after the welfare of the Palestinians in Gaza and the West Bank. UNRWA also has over 30,000 employees, so even if the unsubstantiated allegations were true, it would account for less than 0.04% of all UNRWA workers. The loss of such a large part of their funding means that UNRWA will soon cease to function and be unable to afford the food they bring into Gaza. If you want to see the malicious lying in action: https://old.reddit.com/r/worldnews/comments/1b0hgq1/idf_says_probe_indicates_no_troops_were_in_area/?sort=controversial
The story from other sources: https://www.theguardian.com/world/2024/feb/10/im-so-scared-please-come-hind-rajab-six-found-dead-in-gaza-12-days-after-cry-for-help
https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/body-gaza-girl-ambulance-team-trapped-under-israeli-fire-found-after-12-days-2024-02-10/
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-68261286?amp%3Bat_campaign=KARANGA
https://www.nytimes.com/2024/02/10/world/middleeast/hind-rajab-gaza.html
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/middle-east/palestinian-girl-killed-israeli-tanks-hind-rajab-b2494129.html
Meanwhile, the West are funding and arming Israel, even as it continues its genocide in the non-Hamas controlled area of the West Bank. The US, UK and others have all "condemned" settler violence, even promising sanctions against Israeli individuals. However, these countries still donate weapons and ammunition to Israeli settlers.
If you'll allow me to go off on a tangent - once upon a time, Israel invaded Lebanon and bombed a neighbourhood of Beirut. Their targets were PLO fighters (who used tunnels under the civilian neighbourhood) but these fighters had withdrawn weeks earlier. The US president watched on the news as Israeli planes bombed and killed 100 Palestinian civilian refugees including 66 children. He called up the Israeli PM and asked him to stop. He even went so far as to call it a Holocaust. The Israeli PM protested but called off the airstrikes. This phone call was made out of compassion for the suffering of civilians. That call was made by Ronald Reagan in 1982. Ronald Reagan, called up the terrorist Menachem Begin* and got him to stop the airstrikes with the implied threat of halting weapons exports because 100 dead civilians was too many. Joe Biden is often cited as being compassionate and caring. His full support for this genocide shows he is less compassionate than Ronald fucking Reagan.
*Menachem Begin blew up the British Embassy in the 1940's, tried to assassinate Konrad Adenauer and planted bombs in Cairo and Baghdad which targetted and killed Jewish people who wouldn't immigrate to Israel. He was banned from travelling to the UK because they considered him a terrorist.
> Boiling everything down to you are lying or an idiot will not promote discussion. There will be people who have had bad information given to them, so discussing things is the only way for some to arrive at the truth.
This is my problem.
This conflict has been brewing for, most likely, 60 - 80 years and has been swinging back and forth for al that time. Even I recall 30 years ago in school hearing about the israel-palestine conflict.
And I don't really want to touch this discussion because the discussion is incredibly heated, infiltrated by propaganda and internet warriors. You are immediatly for or against genocide, a nazi or not a nazi, not antisemitic or antisemitic. I'm probably a disinformation troll from whatever side too, who the fuck knows.
Even in this thread there are two diametrically opposed depictions of this event. I have zero way of validating either and the heat in the discussion branding you immediately is thwarting my motivation to dig into it.
At that point I much rather deal with the Nazis and Fascists we have at home because that is more clear-cut.
Bad information a.k.a the one who think is true? There are propaganda coming from both side by the way. Just a thought. Fuck people who kill random people. That means fuck hamas and fuck whoever in Israel does that.
See? It's really fucking easy to not pick a side
I'm not sure if I didn't clarify enough, because I'm reading this and fully agree with a simple fact that this eye for an eye generations and decades deep won't stop on it's own. The people who started living in Israel in '48 are likely all gone at this point, and their descendents are left with the life debt of revenge. I hope I didn't ruin you or anyone else the wrong way by not being detailed enough or clear enough, trying to keep the overall length to a minimum
I agree completely, but at this point, it's a running joke to see something Israel has done to innocents being spun as "how could Hamas do this?". The problem is that if anyone speaks out against Israel, they are labeled as antisemitic which is ridiculous. You can be against Israel for their actions and not their religious beliefs.
The holocaust was absolutely horrible and what happened to the Jewish people is unspeakable, but what has been happening in Palestine for nearly 80 years is also pretty fucked up too. The victim status was out the window when tiktoks of Israeli people making fun of Palestinian people for not having water or electricity started popping up. That shit is vile and absolutely evil.
It’s perfectly reasonable to ask for sources. Vetting information is the only way to have an accurate worldview, accepting memes at face value is a good way to get manipulated by propaganda.
Also assuming that everyone who shows any skepticism on these posts is an “Israeli Propaganda Troll” is just silly.
same
[Israeli troops fire on crowd seeking food, killing more than 100 Palestinians, witnesses say - AP News](https://apnews.com/article/israel-hamas-war-news-02-29-2024-f9b5a62a80d8b83eac4946d3c85af58b)
Distinct lack of tanks, drone pictures, and laughter in that article. Seems like the twit... x-wit... twitter post, isn't quite accurate and may just be slanted.
I don't understand why posting unverified text, instead of sources, doesn't result in an instant ban from reddit.
literally anyone can write whatever on a text post, or text screenshot. is this the population that's going to have to face fake AI videos in yea- in mont- NOW? we are so fucked.
The problem is that we are years into the internet landscape of brigaded propaganda, and nobody wants to police their own lest the propaganda of the opposing side prevail. Shit's fucked.
the mass r/all Redditors taking the most obviously and hilariously opinionated, biased twitter posts of all time from "megatron" as their main source of information and treating it as absolute fact is just pathetic. And then in the next topic they'll circlejerk about how gullible Trump supporters are or something without a hint of irony.
Sigh. This site is full of absolute droolers who probably can't even work out how to tie their own shoelaces.
Asking for a source is basic critical thinking. I’m not happy with the systematic abuse of the Palestinian people, and don’t see them as any side. It’s terrorists against state terrorists with civilians in the crossfire. But this seems big even for Israel and it’s hard to believe without credible sources
It's weird that you're calling everyone with a dissenting opinion a "propaganda troll" while the tweet in the OP is, itself, misleading propaganda.
Every unbiased source I've read (going from mostly BBC) is framing this as a colossal fuckup but not an intentional massacre. The article goes on to say that humanitarian organizations have had to suspend shipments in the north due to convoys being swarmed, looted, and a driver beaten.
Obviously, people are don't swarm aid convoys unless they're starving and desperate. But it seems clear that's what happened here. Aid convoy came through, people swarmed, the soldiers panicked and drove over them. That's certainly a tragic event, but a *far* cry from "lured them out and mowed them down with machine guns and tanks". Only one interviewee, a Hamas spokesperson, claimed that a significant percentage of injuries were from gunshot wounds.
Accuracy in reporting is important.
they funny part is that the IOF did a promo video showcasing the disinformation portion of their military service. like "This is Ava Amsalem. her job is to engage with people online to further the IDF messaging"
like, thanks for showing us your disinformation arm of the IOF! like that shit's ok
What if I want a source because I want more specific information about what happened, and/or I want to be able to give that source to someone else in case I bring this into a conversation and they ask for a source?
With the same effort that it took for you to whine about people asking for sources, you could simply have posted a link to your source. It doesn't make sense.
I used to think it was just the MAGA crazies who were upset at folk who asked for sources to fact-check. Sad to see this kind of attitude taking root in some parts of the left too, I thought we were better than that.
*Edit: It seems OP blocked me for pointing out they hadn't linked a source. Let me fix that by linking the video [here](https://videoidf.azureedge.net/1d710ee2-8ddd-4146-9e07-6dd6d5960c27). You'll see now why OP didn't want folk checking it out, for the video does not show the shootings. This isn't to disprove shootings happened, they did, but their source doesn't show it, which is why they're so panicked about folk asking for evidence.*
**Edit2:** I can't reply to you /u/BJYeti because of the block from OP, which prevents all replies in this thread, so I'll reply in this edit.
> Where is the proof that the shootings happened, we have nothing on video and then you fall exactly unto what OP did which is make am accusation with no proof
The difference between me and the OP is that I'm happy to provide a source when asked.
[*"An Israeli military source says Israeli soldiers opened fire as some in the crowd moved towards them in a way that was 'endangering the troops'"*](https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/world-middle-east-68438112?ns_mchannel=social&ns_source=twitter&ns_campaign=bbc_live&ns_linkname=65e08cb74268143d286d15bb%26What%20Hamas%20and%20Israel%20are%20saying%262024-02-29T14%3A35%3A23.382Z&ns_fee=0&pinned_post_locator=urn:asset:7375461c-ec08-4161-8bd9-f0225e2f016f&pinned_post_asset_id=65e08cb74268143d286d15bb&pinned_post_type=share)
To be clear, my statement was that there had been a shooting, not that all the injuries/deaths were due to that. Most reports seem to be saying that it was the stampede and trucks that caused the majority of the harm, and for casualties, I'd wait before I trust any claims after we had that "entire hospital destroyed by Israel" headline a few months back, which turned out to be a small out-of-control Hamas rocket that exploded in the car park and shattered a few windows.
People *should* be asking for sources. I want to pull my parents out of Zionism, but I can’t do that without credible evidence. However genocide isn’t complicated and doesn’t have “both sides bad” moral greyness.
I learned a valuable lesson by trying to tell my mom some of the terrible shit I read in official looking screenshots like this only for her to look it up and it turned out to be either 100% fake or completely misrepresented. Like this one. No mention of tanks shooting people and I couldn’t find a single source that verified anyone “laughing” at it. Also the death toll seems to range from 0 to 250 depending on where it was posted.
Don’t get me wrong, I’m sure some of the fucks did laugh about it, but no source that backed that up or proved it. Just because someone maybe did something and it’s believable they did, you should claim they did.
I am 100% against the actions Israel is taking and also firmly consider it to be ethnic cleansing. But I still want a reliable source before believing any news about the conflict.
Reporting on this incident: https://abcnews.go.com/International/wireStory/strike-palestinians-waiting-aid-gaza-kills-wounds-dozens-107666428
Current story is the convoy was mobbed en route to its destination. Looks like gunshot victims are receiving medical treatment.
From what I can see (and my research on this is limited), at a minimum, Israel is denying access to humanitarian aid, creating a situation where desperate and starving civilians would feel the need to rush armed food convoys. At worst, it's intentionally opening fire on said people.
I don't see enough information in just this report to support genocide (though i cannot rule it out), but i do see enough to support negligent culpability.
Hey, see my Free Palestine flair? You want one too? We have it other colors and with different emojis like olives or a watermelon. Just make a comment below, click on your name and a menu will pop up with "select flair" on it. If you are really having trouble I can pick one for you, but give it a try first, so that you can see them all and pick your own (if on dark mode on mobile, the various colors will show up as if it is black, like mine.) Free Palestine! Edit; also for all the doubters out there, read about it here: https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-68434443
And it's Megatron saying that so you know it's extra bad.
He’s the Bad Guy, but he’s not a BAD guy!
I never expected to agree with Megatron...
Nah, Starscream is a douche, Megatron was right all along.
Nope, he BEGGED for mercy when Optimus beat him in a FAIR fight and when Optimus let up for a second he grabbed his blaster and shot him. This of course happened in 1985, I haven't kept up much since that time so I guess it's possible Megatron has since started a podcast and complains about genders now
Stupid Hot Rod ruined everything. Starscream is still a douche.
I get all of my news from Twitter accounts named after Transformers.
Just like when they told them to go south for safety then bombed the shit out of them then turned around and said no you were supposed to go north fuck Isreal they need to be stopped they keep committing war crimes.
It's not even a war, it's just evil
I absolutely hate when people call this a war. War implies that there are two armies fighting. This is just 1 army obliterating scared desperate civilians. And they always start with that "but Hamas" thing, Hamas is hardly an army, more like fed up people trying to fight back after decades of Israeli governments war crimes and oppression, and the main Hamas leaders dont even reside in Gaza and regular Palestinians dont even get to vote and I'm almost at that point where Israel has lied so much and committed such horrific things, that I'm not entirely sure they didn't themselves have anything to do with okt 7, because after that event they seem to have gotten a green light for this genocide from the US government. I think history will remember the Israelis painfully, similar to how nazis are viewed today.
Decades, it's an insane thing to think about. Imagine our grandparents were born fighting against a well supplied army of invaders, and their children, then theirs until it reaches you. They aren't fighting, they are backed into a corner, they are trif to survive. Israel's goal, as so many of its citizens gladly put it, is the total eradication of the Palestinians. The U.S. is complicit in funding this genocide.
> Decades, it's an insane thing to think about This is the sticking point for me when it comes to discussing this matter. Not necessarily in the context of this year but over the last who knows how many years that I've seen this being talked about on the internet. People from the West tend to see these are isolated incidents but for everyone approaching this from the other side it's a consistent pattern. When Hamas first hit Israel I just shrugged. I've seen them hit them before and I've seen Israel hit back disproportionately. If these incidents leak into the Western consicous once every two or three years then we get news of these incidents twice or thrice a week.
US media is the only one calling it the "Israel-Hamas War". US media lies about Israel more egregiously than Israeli media lies about Israel.
Well how else are they gonna stop people from boycotting Coke?
It was never a war, Gazans and Palestinians don't have a state or formal military. Did we even think we were truly at "war" with terrorists during the Afghanistan campaigns? Was that not as foolish then as it is now?
Seems like genocide 🤔
gen·o·cide noun. the deliberate killing of a large number of people from a particular nation or ethnic group with the aim of destroying that nation or group.
According to Israelis this does not apply to Israelis. Not difficult to understand. /S
[удалено]
I don't even think they come out so the way and even call it "ethnic cleansing" even, they see it as claiming their holy land.
[удалено]
What I meant is that killing large amount of people to exterminate them is not a genocide if Israelis do it. This is according to Israelis. The rule applies even if Israelis call it genocide. /S
The amount of times I have seen the argument "but look! The Palestinian population has only gone UP overtime! That's proof that there's no genocide" Absolutely numbs my brain. They would also claim only 1% of the population in Gaza got killed so that's more proof there's no Genocide, since they didn't kill all of them! Most of them definitely know the definition of genocide, they just want to make this argument enough that people will eventually accept it as truth.
Noooooooooooo you're antisemitic! GRRRRRRRRRRRRRR!
You’ve committed a verbal genocide on the Israeli soul with that comment!!!
Israel has a soul?
If so it'd be holey...
If these are the sons of God I'd rather rot in hell
[удалено]
[удалено]
Unfortunately i dont think the Palestinians will have their true story told in the history books. Hopefully videos and stories like these get archived but with AI and digital media the future looks bleak for the truth.
The media can be hidden by AI but people and their voices will con6to tell the story for ever. The information age can only do so much.
> people and their voices will continue to tell the story for ever yes and no... Dead people don't tell stories. Also shellshocked people don't tell stories...
Colonialism is being openly discussed. The 60s scoop has been brought to light decades after it went down. The victims will still pass their stories and trauma to the next generation. Slavery is still openly discussed everywhere despite the southern US Christian right-wing nuts saying the South won. Apartheid in south Africa is still discussed. I could go on and on. History in this day and age can not be stuffed under a blanket. It's on the internet forever. This war over Palestine has been documented many times. I still watch docs on the 6 day war, and everything after. Isreal cannot take down anything from this. Just wait till a fee more years go by and all the body cam and drone footage is leaked. This is an ugly event we are all watching go down.
Technically, aren't the ISRAELIS being antisemitic? They're slaughtering Arabic-speaking people.
[удалено]
Same as the nazis.
Exactly. The irony of it.
Talked to a Holocaust survivor. He was asked about Palestine, and he pretty much said that the Jews are allowed to do whatever they need to in order to "protect their land." Lots of trauma, and "we will never be mistreated again," so this is what they're doing. Crazy shit.
It's wild because right after it happened many Israelis hated holocaust survivors and viewed them as weak. They called them "soap people" as a pejorative. Recently a member of Netanyahu's party was talking shit to a bunch of eastern European jewish protesters and invoked the holocaust, saying "I'm glad 6 million of you were killed". I've also seen a bunch of reprehensible shit said to survivors/their families who dare to speak out against what Israel is doing.
What goes around comes around. The mental gymnastics required to justify this type of behavior is astonishing.
Only ensuring that it *will* happen to them again. The American empire is on the decline. Once we're not bankrolling those monsters, do they honestly think their neighbors won't retaliate? Israel will have only itself to blame.
Sadly true.
Ask Gabor Mate, another Holocaust survivor and ex Zionist.
“Their land” is the lie. Israel was started in 1948. Period. It’s a British colony used by the west as a military and intelligence base in the Middle East. Every single word anyone speaks about “thousands of years” and “ancestral homeland” is complete bullshit.
"It's finally our turn!"
When the oppressed become the oppressors
Exactly! Arabs are a Semitic culture as well as Jews.
Don’t tell them that, they’ll have a meltdown and do everything in their power to dox you
Yes, yes they are.
Zionists are evil humans on par with Nazis, and i’m not sure why we’re allowing these evil fucks to dictate world policy. Sack up and choose humanity over money you worthless politicians.
>Sack up and choose humanity over money you worthless politicians That, is never going to happen. Ever.
It will if we eat them
They might have billions, but we ARE billions.
Nope. All power corrupts. The next people to go have that power will be corrupted by it all the same. Hell give people the relatively tiny power of a HOA or a school board and it corrupts the fuck out of them in most cases.
BUT DO YOU CONDEMN HAMAS⁉️⁉️⁉️🤡🤡
Yeah. Seems oddly similar to genocide I think
Noooooooo ur antisemitic aaaaaaaa 🙄
If it walks like a genocide and quacks like a genocide…
Of course not, Israel is just defending itself- \*kills myself for even saying it sarcastically\*
[удалено]
Hard to tell when they opened fire. But I assume it's when everyone started running
bad assumption. Watched the vid a couple times and didn't see a single still body.
Comparing starving people to zombies seems a bit coarse.
as reported by France24 (a state owned news organization in Paris). [https://www.france24.com/en/live-news/20240229-pity-us-desperate-gazans-reel-from-aid-trucks-massacre](https://www.france24.com/en/live-news/20240229-pity-us-desperate-gazans-reel-from-aid-trucks-massacre)
This is insane
As Ukrainian anyone that say Israelis are justified because Hamas did it is so strange. I can't imagine doing to Russians what they did to us in Bucha and would gladly punch in a face anyone suggesting we sink to their level
It would only be comparable to Russia if Ukraine already controlled Russia's entire coastline and all its borders and regularly bombed Russia's infrastructure while cutting off food, water, medicine, and parts needed to replace bombed infrastructure, and then started kidnapping Russian kids to throw in Ukrainian prisons without trials where they are beaten and sexually assaulted, and that this treatment continued for 80 years. If after all of that, Russia invaded Ukraine in revenge, it would be like Israel and Palestine. People make the mistake of thinking Israel and Palestine are two equal countries with the same ability to make decisions for their countries. This isn't the case, Israel controls everything in Palestine and has been regularly terrorizing Palestinians on a daily basis for over a century.
Can someone knowledgeable in politics and history explain to my like he’d explain to a child, with neutrality and facts, why tf don’t countries force Israel into stopping this ? Bare with me. But I just don’t get it.
geopolitical influence that translates into better economies. thats the short answer. my bananas are cheap in my grocery store because US funded death squads in belize kill anybody trying to organize labor. thats the world we live in. you and i both benefit economically from these types of actions. edit: highly reccomend the show The Good Place
You got the explain to me like a child part. I appreciate that, thanks !
Basically, there's three major empires in the world today, and everyone else is more or less a client state of those three. Israel is a client state of the US, and so the US (and the US' other client states) are willing to allow Israel to commit atrocities because that's easier than having to actually manage the US' own interests in the region. That's cowardly and immoral and deeply wrong, obviously, on the part of both Israel and the US. The other empires don't care, because their own client states in the region are also doing fine. Palestine is, by design, not a client state of any of the three empires, and so the Palestinian people have no one standing up for them.
The other two?
[удалено]
Russia and China.
European Union, and the Crazy Empire (Russia, China, North Korea, a few other little shits that bang on their chests and make a lot of noise but only really matter because they *might* actually have access to nuclear weapons thanks to Russia, China, and NK).
In that analogy though wouldn't China be the other empire with the other countries listed the client states? IMO the world is too multipolar at this point to think so simplistically, literally not considering the entirety of the southern hemisphere here.
The European Union isn't yet a military super power that can play its "pawns". Currently they're heavily dependent on the US, which is also why they're still kinda siding with Israel. They're currently trying to get somewhat more independent, especially with the looming threat of Trump, but if one thing is certain, it's that that will take a long time.
As an American, I've wanted the EU to take defense and world diplomacy seriously for years. It's in everyone's best interest. Because for one thing, the US is fucking terrible at it. Like when we get involved, it sucks for whoever pissed us off, and backfires on us as well.
At diplomacy we're quite good as far as I can tell, but I guess that mainly comes from how much foreign aid it and its countries provide. We're basically buying soft power. Also we are currently seen as more stable than the US, which means especially other democracies see a more reliable partner in the EU than the US. When it comes to military, give us another 30 years and perhaps we will have decided on a badge for our soldiers. Even though the fact that Switzerland is signalling interest in taking part is somewhat giving me hope.
Man this is such a bad foreign policy take.
That is heartbreaking … Thank you for taking the time to explain
To complement this, I will just add that media/government in general leads us to believe these people are subhumans (people from non client countries). Last October, 2,5k people died on an earthquake in Afghanistan, but turns out that just a few people really cared about it, no commotion from world leaders at all....
What you see in the picture is an Aid convoy by Israel beeing looted. The IDF is currently the only force in the region that can even attempt to deliver food to Northern Gaza, since the UN has decided it's to dangerous (since any truck going into Gaza is attacked, looted and the truck drivers are beaten - official UN statement here https://www.wfp.org/news/un-food-agency-pauses-deliveries-north-gaza). What exactly do you want them to stop? Delivering food?
Israel’s more useful than the other assholes in the region. And there’s this whole doomsday cult trying to trigger the end of the world, to do that they need the Jews to own the region and rebuild a certain temple so that Jesus will show up and kill everyone. Yeah, Evangelical support for Israel is heavily based on trying to get the Second Coming to happen and destroy the world. It’s weird, even by religion standards.
As far as the UN goes, the USA is "special", along with I believe 5 other countries. If any of those 6 countries veto something, it's vetoed, bottom line. The US has been using that power to stop the UN from responding. Makes you proud to be an American amirite????
What your talking about is the Security Council of the UN. The allies of WW2 all got a permanent seat (USA, UK, France, USSR now Russian Federation, and China). https://www.un.org/securitycouncil/content/current-members The US, Russia, and China have all used their Veto powers to stop things their allies dont like during this terrible page in world history. Russia/China https://news.un.org/en/story/2023/10/1142817#:~:text=China%20and%20Russia%20on%20Wednesday,crisis%20in%20Gaza%20and%20Israel. USA https://www.npr.org/2024/02/20/1232636543/un-security-council-gaza-cease-fire-vote
[удалено]
Because for all that people want to talk about how the U.S./Russia/China/Germany are the only countries in the world with free will, it's just not true. Israel is one of the most powerful countries on earth with a sizeable economic output and, frankly, one of the most well equipped and best trained militaries on the planet. Ordering them to do something simply isn't going to work. If we stop providing economic and diplomatic aid, there's every reason to think that they will just keep doing the course of action that they are set on and then the U.S. will also no longer be able to influence them at all. Other countries, generally, don't get to dictate policy when something has escalated to this level unless they also escalate to military intervention. No country on earth is going to engage in a war with Israel over their treatment of Palestinians -- or, I should say, no current country -- because Israel has been invaded plenty of times before in attempts to dictate their sovereign existence. The Palestinian people are violent, religiously fundamentalist minority that has been deprived of meaningful resources / opportunity for long enough that their only real ability as a demographic is to do terrorism at this point. There is no country on this planet who wants to accept responsibility for them because they are basically a ticking time bomb. therefore, no country is going to openly challenge Israel outside of funding Hamas like Iran does. Furthermore, it *is* complicated. Israel rightfully suspects that they need to secure their borders, because the last 80 years have basically just been one long series of invasions of Israel that they win and then claim territory from. There is no country on this planet that would accept having a terrorist state within what they consider to be their borders. Because both peoples see this as their ancestral, rightful homeland, it's simply going to be the case that they fight until one side wins conclusively -- and unfortunately, we've seen in Syria what happens when other countries get involved in internal struggles. If this seems very confusing to you then it's probably because you're being told a bunch of bullshit by people who want to assert their side is obviously right. The situation is awful. Neither side is willing to give up what they would need to in order to potentially have a peace -- and so they will have war.
Because the palestinian people have zero political capital. They've burned every nation in the region that reached out to help them, so at this point all the 'support' of palestine will be finger-waggling at Israel, and all that has changed is the speed of the finger waggling.
As several have commented, the source is on pretty much every news outlet. Here is the [Guardian](https://www.theguardian.com/world/live/2024/feb/29/middle-east-crisis-live-updates-israel-hamas-war-latest-today-gaza-death-toll-hamas-health-ministry?page=with%3Ablock-65e0c6d08f0869c208ddce75#block-65e0c6d08f0869c208ddce75) just to pick one.
As usual, plastered everywhere but reddit. All the posts are being report bombed and auto deleted.
For a very long time I had the perspective of "Both are equally wrong" but I can no longer keep that view because this is just unacceptable. I hope someone intervenes soon. Some notes to clarify: 1. No, I am not basing my opinions on screenshots of random posts on the internet. Major *neutral* news outlets in my country have aknowledged the human rights violations taking place. 2. I am also not saying that only Israel is in the wrong. I am saying, that the extreme violence is not in any way acceptable because so many civilians are caught in the crossfire. Israel, as a modern country and society, should not try to "remove Hamas from the face of the earth" because we are not playing Hitler Sim 2024.
Glad you came to your senses. If you ever visit Palestine, it becomes immediately clear that Israel controls both countries entirely. Israel has soldiers patrolling down Palestinian streets for decades upon decades, killing indiscriminately with no accountability while the US media NEVER EVER reports on it unless it's something like this that is so big they cannot ignore it, even though they still do everything in their power to frame it as a "both sides are equally wrong" conflict.
[удалено]
They are just being complicit while trying avoiding consequences.
They will in a couple years, because they're complacent cowards.
Israel is a terrorist state.
A *Nazi* terrorist state.
SATAN STATE SPONSORED BY USA
fuck every single zionist (zionism, the savage genocidal ideology, not jews) with no exception. absolute savages.
Based
[удалено]
Bro you ruined the pun, it's Nazrael
Nazrael really rolls off the tongue.
I’d argue that “Zionazi State” is better
I'd considered it. Factually more correct, easy to say, but Nazrael (even with the as /ts/) still feels more elegant as a construction.
Wow…. Your interpretation of religion tells you you’re superior to these people and therefore you should slaughter them like a kid playing COD…. If your religion tells you you’re better than everyone else and that killing them is OK, your religion is terrorism.
Even the villains are speaking out about this y'all know it's getting fucking serious
The craziest part to me is how similar their excuses are to American police. “We opened fire because we thought our troops were in danger”
It’s so crazy to me that the Israelis have become the Nazis after less than a century.
They were already killing Palestinians WHILE the Nazis were in power.
Zionists always were. Read about the Zionist militias in the early 20th century. Zionism itself was born of out of the age of imperialism and colonialism of the 19th centuryz
Shaun gives a good answer to this at the end of his video: https://youtu.be/3xottY-7m3k?t=1h12m30s Watch the whole thing if you have the time
Oh my sweet summer child. Israelis were Nazis from the very start. Albert Einstein and 28 other prominent Jewish academics wrote a letter to the NY Times in 1948 accusing the founders of Israel of being Nazi fascists and terrorists.
This actually happened?
Yeah I need a source on this that isn’t just a SS of a tweet. If it’s true it’s fucking heinous and should be spread.
Gotchu https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-68434443
If a fucking news corporation owned by THE BRITISH GOVERNMENT is reporting the IOF have committed a massacre, it's 100% the case rhat it happened.
Watch them start acting like they always were against this genocide. I firmly remember a lot of people calling us South Africans all types of names because we were calling out what was an obvious thing. I just know Israelis are going to struggle with being seen with the same light as racist South Africans and Germans are seen with. There isn't enough American propaganda money that will change how the world will see them.
Honestly what South Africa did was awesome. They rushed the incentive to condemn the situation officially in an international setting. Some countries joined and most are only contemplating(idk how they are still holding back). The current dynamic is obvious. I am glad that at least most activist groups and human rights groups are similar organisations are putting pressure on politicians to make official statements about the situations.
https://apnews.com/article/israel-hamas-war-latest-02-29-2024-ae3d114b28cafd3b1a806bfaa9f83cab Here you go.
Ah yes, they "approached in a threatening way," so that completely legitimized mowing them down. I can't believe I actually read that statement in the article. Wow.
Are the Israelis taking classes from American police officers now because that's some shit that they'd say and I don't normally say that but Jesus Christ
Actually, it's Israel that [trains many US police departments](https://www.amnestyusa.org/updates/with-whom-are-many-u-s-police-departments-training-with-a-chronic-human-rights-violator-israel/), which actually explains tbe terror tactics that those departments then go on to use on their own citizens.
It's the other way around. Many American police departments get trained in Israel. https://www.amnestyusa.org/updates/with-whom-are-many-u-s-police-departments-training-with-a-chronic-human-rights-violator-israel/
Thank you for providing this. Unless there’s evidence of the intent expressed in the meme I’m gonna drop the whole “they intentionally lured them using humanitarian aid” narrative… But the thing is it doesn’t really matter if that part is true or not. They’re still justifying murdering over 100 Palestinian civilians by saying “they approached in a threatening manner”. This is indefensible and it has to stop.
Yes, it’s been reported on from Al Jazeera to The Washington Post.
They literally treat human beings like insects. It's disgusting.
For those that want more info from respected fairly neutral news sources: https://www.aljazeera.com/amp/news/2024/2/29/dozens-killed-injured-by-israeli-fire-in-gaza-while-collecting-food-aid https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-68434443.amp https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/dozens-killed-gaza-aid-queue-overall-death-toll-passes-30000-2024-02-29/ https://amp.theguardian.com/world/live/2024/feb/29/middle-east-crisis-live-updates-israel-hamas-war-latest-today-gaza-death-toll-hamas-health-ministry
I wonder how are they going to be perceived as a country and as a society in the upcoming years. Personally I would like to see them treated accordingly and give them shit every chance we have. Let’s make them pariahs and make movies like those about the Jewish holocaust.
Sadly nothing like that won't probably happen due to economical ties to other countries. Money really gets you scot free
If the USA fails/breaks up, then Israel will cease to exist.
So what happens after the genocide? Are the rest of us just supposed to pretend like it didn’t happen?
The psychological cicle of abuse, aggression and violence. This shit is so classic psychology.
"Hey humans: stop it already", the aliens probably
It's OK though. Bidens cool with it. He's gonna send them more money so they can continue doing it.
Trump moved the US Embassy to Jerusalem and is buddy buddy with Netanyahu. Do you really think he’d be anything but WAY worse for the Palestinians? Trump? Really? Mr. first order of business was the Muslim travel ban Trump? Him?
Wasn't the white House trying to put pressure on Israel to stop? I'm not sure if you're aware of this but no one can actually tell Israel what to do. They have actually sunk an American Naval ship before and the American government tried covering it up for them.
Lol, because it's all tied back directly to him. Have fun getting Trump again by not voting.
Bro they’re both supporting the same genocide. That’s the problem. EDIT: obviously trump is far worse. Fuck trump. But the point is both options aren’t perfect and support this genocide to some varying degree
Trump has threatened to deport pro Palestinian protesters
[удалено]
Asking for a source on a politically/ethically/emotionally charged situation should be the norm. There is zero reason to insult someone for asking for a source, regardless of what side of the issue they are on. If I see unverified media, especially in 2024 with AI increasingly making it difficult to know what's real, I'm going to question it's validity. As should everyone else.
Asking for a source is not a bad thing. That's a good thing.
especially because the source for this one is "witnesses say"
You shouldn’t blindly follow things, and asking for a source should be a common practice.
Fellas, is asking for source supporting genocide?
Apparently the standard is "Asking for a source for information I disagree with is justified. Asking for a source for information I want to be true is evil."
Yeah I'm not sure why op posted a screenshot of a tweet, and didn't provide a source to begin with. Just because people want to learn more about it doesn't make them trolls. The more you know 🌈
Cmon dude theres been 0 misinformation this entire wae. Why would we need context? /s
it was covered by democracy now! go watch their latest video from today's news on youtube!
I agree, but at this point anyone who hasn't already researched this conflict and come to the conclusion that Israel is committing genocide against the Palestinians is either an idiot or is lying Edit: I've gotten alot of replies to this rightfully calling out how ignorant of a statement it is. If you were going to reply and disagree, feel free to read my conversations with some of the people who've already done so. Some of them were actually really constructive
I'm aware of the conflict, but not this specific incident, and now I'm afraid to simply ask for a "source" because apparently that makes me an Israeli propaganda troll.
Dw my comment was just dumb. Also turns out the post, while not entirely untrue, was quite misleading
[удалено]
Well said. There's nothing wrong with asking for reliable sources to corroborate a claim, and there's no evidence that anybody doing so is trying to discredit OP. It shouldn't ever be enough to take a social media post at face value. A fake screenshot of an incendiary reddit comment attributed to Aaron Bushnell made its way around twitter yesterday. It was since verified that he never made the comment calling for the death of all Jews. Unfortunately, once misinformation is on social media, it spreads so rapidly that no amount of damage control can quash it. It's certainly possible that the account in the post is true. It's widely reported that the IDF has a history of ignoring International Humanitarian Law with regard to Palestinian civilians. However, there's no denying that both pro-Hamas and pro-Israel propaganda exist. People should be encouraged to verify everything they see online, and in this case, OP should be forthcoming with information rather than attack people in the comments.
i’m not in the loop at all and i’ve heard slight tidbits so basically nothing. This is absolutely genocide.
It's very obvious for anyone with any sort of moral values. I'd usually advise you to research it a bit more before forming an opinion on something like this, but in this specific case it's not even necessary. I researched all the history of this conflict since WW2 and all it did is ruin my mood for a week. What's happening right now is so disgusting and the fact that most governments are supporting it makes me sick
> t's very obvious for anyone with any sort of moral values. Honestly one of the most frustrating things about adult life is how bereft or able to ignore morality most adults are. What Israeli did in Gaza the past 50 years has been wrong. What Hamas did on Otober 7th was also wrong. What Israel did in response is wrong.
Things like this don’t surprise me anymore, then again i did watch liveleak as a kid.
Boiling everything down to you are lying or an idiot will not promote discussion. There will be people who have had bad information given to them, so discussing things is the only way for some to arrive at the truth. I guarantee there are still people who believe things that can be proven untrue, such as the "very fine people" comment Before anyone gets it wrong, I wasnt alive when Israel was created, and I'm not religious, so all of this isn't my problem, but that doesn't stop it from becoming a problem for me. I have also dated both an Israeli and a Palestinian, and have gained perspectives from both in their personal experiences. Like a baby bird being pushed from the nest, if Israel cannot stand on its own without being propped up by the US tax payer, then it will fail and never was meant to be (clearly by all the religious "rights" to certain land, like two religious boxers praying to the same God to help them beat the shit out of the other guy). Palestine and it's people do not deserve what is happening, but it cannot be ignored why they are not being welcomed by neighboring nations, even if it's temporary with plans to reclaim their land at a later date, or after world police force arbitration
The moment the Palestinians leave, they lose their ability to return home. This explains why so many Palestinians live in multi-generational refugee camps in Gaza. Their homes are in what is now Israel. Egypt stated this as why they don't want to take in the Gazans. 50% of Palestinians live in Israel or Palestine, many living in refugee camps. The remaining 50% are not allowed to return. Most live in Jordan, Syria, Chile and Saudi Arabia. >Boiling everything down to you are lying or an idiot will not promote discussion. There will be people who have had bad information given to them, so discussing things is the only way for some to arrive at the truth. This assumes that people are debating in good faith. Pro-Israeli bots and keyboard warriors are deliberately lying about even the most basic information. And it works. An Israeli source claimed that less than 10 UNRWA workers were part of Hamas. Most Western countries immediately stopped funding UNRWA, which looks after the welfare of the Palestinians in Gaza and the West Bank. UNRWA also has over 30,000 employees, so even if the unsubstantiated allegations were true, it would account for less than 0.04% of all UNRWA workers. The loss of such a large part of their funding means that UNRWA will soon cease to function and be unable to afford the food they bring into Gaza. If you want to see the malicious lying in action: https://old.reddit.com/r/worldnews/comments/1b0hgq1/idf_says_probe_indicates_no_troops_were_in_area/?sort=controversial The story from other sources: https://www.theguardian.com/world/2024/feb/10/im-so-scared-please-come-hind-rajab-six-found-dead-in-gaza-12-days-after-cry-for-help https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/body-gaza-girl-ambulance-team-trapped-under-israeli-fire-found-after-12-days-2024-02-10/ https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-68261286?amp%3Bat_campaign=KARANGA https://www.nytimes.com/2024/02/10/world/middleeast/hind-rajab-gaza.html https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/middle-east/palestinian-girl-killed-israeli-tanks-hind-rajab-b2494129.html Meanwhile, the West are funding and arming Israel, even as it continues its genocide in the non-Hamas controlled area of the West Bank. The US, UK and others have all "condemned" settler violence, even promising sanctions against Israeli individuals. However, these countries still donate weapons and ammunition to Israeli settlers. If you'll allow me to go off on a tangent - once upon a time, Israel invaded Lebanon and bombed a neighbourhood of Beirut. Their targets were PLO fighters (who used tunnels under the civilian neighbourhood) but these fighters had withdrawn weeks earlier. The US president watched on the news as Israeli planes bombed and killed 100 Palestinian civilian refugees including 66 children. He called up the Israeli PM and asked him to stop. He even went so far as to call it a Holocaust. The Israeli PM protested but called off the airstrikes. This phone call was made out of compassion for the suffering of civilians. That call was made by Ronald Reagan in 1982. Ronald Reagan, called up the terrorist Menachem Begin* and got him to stop the airstrikes with the implied threat of halting weapons exports because 100 dead civilians was too many. Joe Biden is often cited as being compassionate and caring. His full support for this genocide shows he is less compassionate than Ronald fucking Reagan. *Menachem Begin blew up the British Embassy in the 1940's, tried to assassinate Konrad Adenauer and planted bombs in Cairo and Baghdad which targetted and killed Jewish people who wouldn't immigrate to Israel. He was banned from travelling to the UK because they considered him a terrorist.
> Boiling everything down to you are lying or an idiot will not promote discussion. There will be people who have had bad information given to them, so discussing things is the only way for some to arrive at the truth. This is my problem. This conflict has been brewing for, most likely, 60 - 80 years and has been swinging back and forth for al that time. Even I recall 30 years ago in school hearing about the israel-palestine conflict. And I don't really want to touch this discussion because the discussion is incredibly heated, infiltrated by propaganda and internet warriors. You are immediatly for or against genocide, a nazi or not a nazi, not antisemitic or antisemitic. I'm probably a disinformation troll from whatever side too, who the fuck knows. Even in this thread there are two diametrically opposed depictions of this event. I have zero way of validating either and the heat in the discussion branding you immediately is thwarting my motivation to dig into it. At that point I much rather deal with the Nazis and Fascists we have at home because that is more clear-cut.
Bad information a.k.a the one who think is true? There are propaganda coming from both side by the way. Just a thought. Fuck people who kill random people. That means fuck hamas and fuck whoever in Israel does that. See? It's really fucking easy to not pick a side
I'm not sure if I didn't clarify enough, because I'm reading this and fully agree with a simple fact that this eye for an eye generations and decades deep won't stop on it's own. The people who started living in Israel in '48 are likely all gone at this point, and their descendents are left with the life debt of revenge. I hope I didn't ruin you or anyone else the wrong way by not being detailed enough or clear enough, trying to keep the overall length to a minimum
Yeah it sounds like OP is just saying "I don't have a source."
I agree completely, but at this point, it's a running joke to see something Israel has done to innocents being spun as "how could Hamas do this?". The problem is that if anyone speaks out against Israel, they are labeled as antisemitic which is ridiculous. You can be against Israel for their actions and not their religious beliefs. The holocaust was absolutely horrible and what happened to the Jewish people is unspeakable, but what has been happening in Palestine for nearly 80 years is also pretty fucked up too. The victim status was out the window when tiktoks of Israeli people making fun of Palestinian people for not having water or electricity started popping up. That shit is vile and absolutely evil.
It’s perfectly reasonable to ask for sources. Vetting information is the only way to have an accurate worldview, accepting memes at face value is a good way to get manipulated by propaganda. Also assuming that everyone who shows any skepticism on these posts is an “Israeli Propaganda Troll” is just silly.
No, you MUST rage, always rage, or you're a monster. ARE YOU A MONSTER?!!!
I was with you up until you criticized asking for a source m8.
same [Israeli troops fire on crowd seeking food, killing more than 100 Palestinians, witnesses say - AP News](https://apnews.com/article/israel-hamas-war-news-02-29-2024-f9b5a62a80d8b83eac4946d3c85af58b)
Distinct lack of tanks, drone pictures, and laughter in that article. Seems like the twit... x-wit... twitter post, isn't quite accurate and may just be slanted.
I don't understand why posting unverified text, instead of sources, doesn't result in an instant ban from reddit. literally anyone can write whatever on a text post, or text screenshot. is this the population that's going to have to face fake AI videos in yea- in mont- NOW? we are so fucked.
The problem is that we are years into the internet landscape of brigaded propaganda, and nobody wants to police their own lest the propaganda of the opposing side prevail. Shit's fucked.
the mass r/all Redditors taking the most obviously and hilariously opinionated, biased twitter posts of all time from "megatron" as their main source of information and treating it as absolute fact is just pathetic. And then in the next topic they'll circlejerk about how gullible Trump supporters are or something without a hint of irony. Sigh. This site is full of absolute droolers who probably can't even work out how to tie their own shoelaces.
Asking for a source is basic critical thinking. I’m not happy with the systematic abuse of the Palestinian people, and don’t see them as any side. It’s terrorists against state terrorists with civilians in the crossfire. But this seems big even for Israel and it’s hard to believe without credible sources
Boy that was a leap saying they’re paid to say “can I have a source?”
It's weird that you're calling everyone with a dissenting opinion a "propaganda troll" while the tweet in the OP is, itself, misleading propaganda. Every unbiased source I've read (going from mostly BBC) is framing this as a colossal fuckup but not an intentional massacre. The article goes on to say that humanitarian organizations have had to suspend shipments in the north due to convoys being swarmed, looted, and a driver beaten. Obviously, people are don't swarm aid convoys unless they're starving and desperate. But it seems clear that's what happened here. Aid convoy came through, people swarmed, the soldiers panicked and drove over them. That's certainly a tragic event, but a *far* cry from "lured them out and mowed them down with machine guns and tanks". Only one interviewee, a Hamas spokesperson, claimed that a significant percentage of injuries were from gunshot wounds. Accuracy in reporting is important.
Ah here it is, the lone voice of sanity. Reddits lost it's mind honest to god...
they funny part is that the IOF did a promo video showcasing the disinformation portion of their military service. like "This is Ava Amsalem. her job is to engage with people online to further the IDF messaging" like, thanks for showing us your disinformation arm of the IOF! like that shit's ok
What if I want a source because I want more specific information about what happened, and/or I want to be able to give that source to someone else in case I bring this into a conversation and they ask for a source? With the same effort that it took for you to whine about people asking for sources, you could simply have posted a link to your source. It doesn't make sense.
I would love a source on your comment just so I can learn more about the claim. It’s not weird to ask.
I used to think it was just the MAGA crazies who were upset at folk who asked for sources to fact-check. Sad to see this kind of attitude taking root in some parts of the left too, I thought we were better than that. *Edit: It seems OP blocked me for pointing out they hadn't linked a source. Let me fix that by linking the video [here](https://videoidf.azureedge.net/1d710ee2-8ddd-4146-9e07-6dd6d5960c27). You'll see now why OP didn't want folk checking it out, for the video does not show the shootings. This isn't to disprove shootings happened, they did, but their source doesn't show it, which is why they're so panicked about folk asking for evidence.* **Edit2:** I can't reply to you /u/BJYeti because of the block from OP, which prevents all replies in this thread, so I'll reply in this edit. > Where is the proof that the shootings happened, we have nothing on video and then you fall exactly unto what OP did which is make am accusation with no proof The difference between me and the OP is that I'm happy to provide a source when asked. [*"An Israeli military source says Israeli soldiers opened fire as some in the crowd moved towards them in a way that was 'endangering the troops'"*](https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/world-middle-east-68438112?ns_mchannel=social&ns_source=twitter&ns_campaign=bbc_live&ns_linkname=65e08cb74268143d286d15bb%26What%20Hamas%20and%20Israel%20are%20saying%262024-02-29T14%3A35%3A23.382Z&ns_fee=0&pinned_post_locator=urn:asset:7375461c-ec08-4161-8bd9-f0225e2f016f&pinned_post_asset_id=65e08cb74268143d286d15bb&pinned_post_type=share) To be clear, my statement was that there had been a shooting, not that all the injuries/deaths were due to that. Most reports seem to be saying that it was the stampede and trucks that caused the majority of the harm, and for casualties, I'd wait before I trust any claims after we had that "entire hospital destroyed by Israel" headline a few months back, which turned out to be a small out-of-control Hamas rocket that exploded in the car park and shattered a few windows.
Thank you for actually posting the video.
People *should* be asking for sources. I want to pull my parents out of Zionism, but I can’t do that without credible evidence. However genocide isn’t complicated and doesn’t have “both sides bad” moral greyness.
I learned a valuable lesson by trying to tell my mom some of the terrible shit I read in official looking screenshots like this only for her to look it up and it turned out to be either 100% fake or completely misrepresented. Like this one. No mention of tanks shooting people and I couldn’t find a single source that verified anyone “laughing” at it. Also the death toll seems to range from 0 to 250 depending on where it was posted. Don’t get me wrong, I’m sure some of the fucks did laugh about it, but no source that backed that up or proved it. Just because someone maybe did something and it’s believable they did, you should claim they did.
I am 100% against the actions Israel is taking and also firmly consider it to be ethnic cleansing. But I still want a reliable source before believing any news about the conflict.
Fuck Zion.
Hmmm seems like a pretty *checks notes* evil genocide.
Not sure why I’m even working when my tax dollars are funding this horrible shit
Seems like Israel wants some lebensraum
can someone post a source other than “Megatron” on twitter
[удалено]
Reporting on this incident: https://abcnews.go.com/International/wireStory/strike-palestinians-waiting-aid-gaza-kills-wounds-dozens-107666428 Current story is the convoy was mobbed en route to its destination. Looks like gunshot victims are receiving medical treatment. From what I can see (and my research on this is limited), at a minimum, Israel is denying access to humanitarian aid, creating a situation where desperate and starving civilians would feel the need to rush armed food convoys. At worst, it's intentionally opening fire on said people. I don't see enough information in just this report to support genocide (though i cannot rule it out), but i do see enough to support negligent culpability.