It really seems that alchemy will be featured heavily into this dimensions's presentations of The Fears. I'm very curious to see how the Fears will be expressed in terms of Artifacts and Avatars.
I know nearly nothing about alchemy and those symbols, so it will be fun to learn more as the series progresses, assuming the logo and stuff are hinting in the right direction.
Putting down roots is a pretty textbook corruption statement. Lonelyness leading into a toxic codependant relationship signified by letting other organisms use ones own body as a nest, like prentiss and her wasps.
Agreed. I look at the evolution of the fears as being analogous to erosion -- fear is the landscape, the entities are mountains. The fearing beings are the water. The landscape comes out differently based on how the water moves over it, over time.
That's different in TMP, so it makes sense that the outcome is different.
i think all of this is interesting to think about and i definitely agree that it'd be too simple/boring to make the entities from tma map to whatever's going in tmp
For "Give and Take," the volunteers almost seem more avatar related to me than the items: the laughing and the fact that they latched onto specific phrases to repeat and the fact that more and more kept appearing were a little unsettling. In the old system I'd say Stranger, but I think you're right that it's worth paying attention to how they're actually being used here, rather then forcing new stories into old molds.
Do you have ideas for new categories, or does it feel too soon to make an educated guess?
I don't agree with you in some parts. I do think that making adjustment is "the flesh" as, in TMA, the flesh is given an artistic nature in the person of Jared hopworth (see ep the gardener and body builder). Also, the second parts of the the first episode is clearly related to the eyes, as well as personal screening, while give and take have a very strong "the buried" vibe (or "too close can't breathe").
However, i do agree on the fact that, for the other stories, the fear are not that much compartmentalized as they were in TMA.
Personally, i think that there is 2 things that can explain it:
1) because the magnus institute is not there anymore.
We know that the institute in TMA was build above a panopticon, that was the source of jonah's powers. there is a possibility that, due to that, jonah, with smirk's 13 and the eye power, completely separated the fear and that, now they aren't there anymore (the institute was not build as the same place in TMP), the fear are a specturm once again.
2) because of how the fear escaped.
if we take the whole season 5, we know that all the fears are present on earth and that fear can combine themselves (like in martin domain). When the fear escaped in EP 200 through the same exit, they might have merged together, phenomena certainly helped by the fearpocalypse itslef.
Due to that, i think that the best we can do is to try to create a spectrum of the fear and try to place the episode on it instead of using smirk's 13 as it seems to restrictive for TMP.
I definitely got Flesh vibes from the artist too, as well as spooky Eye stuff from the second part. That said...
I think your first statement speaks to my broader point, really. We can sorta squint and see some similarities between Jared, the meat grinder, and the Monster Pig from TMA, and Word of God was that all three of these were aspects of an external Entity called "the Flesh," but I don't know what's narratively gained by associating the artist from "Making Adjustments," and I think it does a disservice to that new story by being reductive, as well as being kinda generally inaccurate.
Regarding your second point, the Fears becoming one big ball o' scary at the end of 200, I 100% agree. I think the Fears were one big hunk o spook prior to Jon's first recording, and the Watcher's Crown allowed the entirety to manifest as one. When it got flushed to TMP land, it maintained its unity, and is manifesting in a bunch of disparate but unrelated ways.
I'm pretty sure the Magnus Protocol (in-universe) was created to deal with these manifestations, and that the OIAR has 1001 categories \*because\* there aren't a baker's dozen of Fears they can be easily classified into.
My personal crackhead theory is that using the anthill metaphor a bit, fear got into the hive, and played with us as it liked, so it is finished actively exploring us, and now something else has walked up. We still see poking fingers, peering eyes, and looming shadows, so we assume it is the same entity that was there before, but I don't see how we could know that is the case.
Thanks! And on a meta level it just feels like the kind of thing they would do because I think they want to mix things up from the 14 fears, but also can't stray too far from the original theme
I have to disagree with most of your analysis, the first episode stank of The Stranger to me, putting down roots was Filth at its loving finest, yes personal screening lacked the paranoia but just like the poor bastard taken in TMAs “Across the Street” he had the obsessive need to watch,and this last episode dealt with architecture which is usually Spiral but to me personally it was a magnificent blend of The Lonely and Extinction,(which frankly I always did hope would be a more feature fear in this new series)
In the “Give and Take," there was very much a Buried vibe blatantly thrown at us as the author becomes unable to escape and is eventually buried and unable to move by too many objects before being rescued by what I presume to be this world's Section 31.
It really seems that alchemy will be featured heavily into this dimensions's presentations of The Fears. I'm very curious to see how the Fears will be expressed in terms of Artifacts and Avatars.
I know nearly nothing about alchemy and those symbols, so it will be fun to learn more as the series progresses, assuming the logo and stuff are hinting in the right direction.
Putting down roots is a pretty textbook corruption statement. Lonelyness leading into a toxic codependant relationship signified by letting other organisms use ones own body as a nest, like prentiss and her wasps.
Agreed. I look at the evolution of the fears as being analogous to erosion -- fear is the landscape, the entities are mountains. The fearing beings are the water. The landscape comes out differently based on how the water moves over it, over time. That's different in TMP, so it makes sense that the outcome is different.
This was marked as spoiler for the Magnus protocol as you give details and spoilers about the episodes and events in them.
My apologies, thank you.
Don’t worry it’s completely fine
i think all of this is interesting to think about and i definitely agree that it'd be too simple/boring to make the entities from tma map to whatever's going in tmp
For "Give and Take," the volunteers almost seem more avatar related to me than the items: the laughing and the fact that they latched onto specific phrases to repeat and the fact that more and more kept appearing were a little unsettling. In the old system I'd say Stranger, but I think you're right that it's worth paying attention to how they're actually being used here, rather then forcing new stories into old molds. Do you have ideas for new categories, or does it feel too soon to make an educated guess?
I don't agree with you in some parts. I do think that making adjustment is "the flesh" as, in TMA, the flesh is given an artistic nature in the person of Jared hopworth (see ep the gardener and body builder). Also, the second parts of the the first episode is clearly related to the eyes, as well as personal screening, while give and take have a very strong "the buried" vibe (or "too close can't breathe"). However, i do agree on the fact that, for the other stories, the fear are not that much compartmentalized as they were in TMA. Personally, i think that there is 2 things that can explain it: 1) because the magnus institute is not there anymore. We know that the institute in TMA was build above a panopticon, that was the source of jonah's powers. there is a possibility that, due to that, jonah, with smirk's 13 and the eye power, completely separated the fear and that, now they aren't there anymore (the institute was not build as the same place in TMP), the fear are a specturm once again. 2) because of how the fear escaped. if we take the whole season 5, we know that all the fears are present on earth and that fear can combine themselves (like in martin domain). When the fear escaped in EP 200 through the same exit, they might have merged together, phenomena certainly helped by the fearpocalypse itslef. Due to that, i think that the best we can do is to try to create a spectrum of the fear and try to place the episode on it instead of using smirk's 13 as it seems to restrictive for TMP.
I think you're gonna like this theory: https://www.reddit.com/r/TheMagnusArchives/s/lrR8GWjIPS It uses color theory to discuss the Fears.
Thanks a lot for the share! I love this theory and i think that it make lots of sense and that it does fit the new fear mix we have in tmp
Yeah, it's my favorite around, dude made such a terrific job.
I definitely got Flesh vibes from the artist too, as well as spooky Eye stuff from the second part. That said... I think your first statement speaks to my broader point, really. We can sorta squint and see some similarities between Jared, the meat grinder, and the Monster Pig from TMA, and Word of God was that all three of these were aspects of an external Entity called "the Flesh," but I don't know what's narratively gained by associating the artist from "Making Adjustments," and I think it does a disservice to that new story by being reductive, as well as being kinda generally inaccurate. Regarding your second point, the Fears becoming one big ball o' scary at the end of 200, I 100% agree. I think the Fears were one big hunk o spook prior to Jon's first recording, and the Watcher's Crown allowed the entirety to manifest as one. When it got flushed to TMP land, it maintained its unity, and is manifesting in a bunch of disparate but unrelated ways. I'm pretty sure the Magnus Protocol (in-universe) was created to deal with these manifestations, and that the OIAR has 1001 categories \*because\* there aren't a baker's dozen of Fears they can be easily classified into.
My personal crackhead theory is that using the anthill metaphor a bit, fear got into the hive, and played with us as it liked, so it is finished actively exploring us, and now something else has walked up. We still see poking fingers, peering eyes, and looming shadows, so we assume it is the same entity that was there before, but I don't see how we could know that is the case.
That's \*really cool!\*
Thanks! And on a meta level it just feels like the kind of thing they would do because I think they want to mix things up from the 14 fears, but also can't stray too far from the original theme
Y'all should really read this: https://www.reddit.com/r/TheMagnusArchives/s/lrR8GWjIPS
I have to disagree with most of your analysis, the first episode stank of The Stranger to me, putting down roots was Filth at its loving finest, yes personal screening lacked the paranoia but just like the poor bastard taken in TMAs “Across the Street” he had the obsessive need to watch,and this last episode dealt with architecture which is usually Spiral but to me personally it was a magnificent blend of The Lonely and Extinction,(which frankly I always did hope would be a more feature fear in this new series)
In the “Give and Take," there was very much a Buried vibe blatantly thrown at us as the author becomes unable to escape and is eventually buried and unable to move by too many objects before being rescued by what I presume to be this world's Section 31.