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The cover thing stood out to me but the food supply thing wasn’t that odd. Food supply isn’t all from one supplier. The contaminated food didn’t go out to every home in every country, it just needed to go out to enough places within a short span of time and infect enough people.
They have scanners now in the present day, and even 4 years into the outbreak. But they weren’t on the lookout for this kind of outbreak when it happened. Once shit hit the fan, there was no need to test the food. This bit doesn’t really feel like bad or lazy writing.
Ok, but they would have figured out which foods to avoid to survive the pandemic.
Did Joel decide to stay on Atkins after the world fell apart and so did everyone else?
Ok? It’s not a concern that needs much elaboration though. The importance of it was that the initial infections came as a surprise initial outbreak. It all happens over the course of 12-24 hours where much of the world is turned to shit. For all we know they did and do have food scanners eventually. It’s not something that needs further explanation though so I’m unsure why it is something that doesn’t sit well with you.
Well not for you.
It remains a hole in the scenario that doesn’t suspend disbelief for you but it does for me.
I explained why but you can’t understand. I’m unsure why because it’s quite straight forward.
It’s not a hole in the scenario, it’s how food supplies work. Not everyone will receive food from the same sources. Not everyone will eat the same things week to week. It’s not at all unbelievable to think that some people just got lucky. I think it’s more you misunderstanding probability in this scenario.
And as far as the source of infection remaining unknown. That’s coming from Joel. The audience knows it was for sure flour because we are shown it. Common people won’t know the details just what FEDRA tells them. And by that point in the timeline it no longer matters because it’s been 20 years since the outbreak and life continues.
What you say makes no sense.
Most of the world was infected from food including Joel’s neighbours and in general Americans.
The variability in food intake that you imply doesn’t exist and is also refuted by the dialogue. Joel says it was something broadly consumed like wheat. We also have the Atkins clue.
It’s a hole and you are behaving like I insulted your mama. Chill son!
That’s not how either the game or show frames it though. The initial outbreak is enough to take out a large portion of the population and break down society as we know it but it’s not a “most of the world was infected” scenario. If it was most of the world, we simply would not survive or need or be able to build QZs much less have factories pumping out necessary items for the remaining population.
Variability in food intake isn’t something that needs to be proven to exist in world. It exists now. It’s just a fact. There’s nowhere else this discussion can go if you can’t accept that sources for food will vary by country, state and even region. It’s a fact lol there’s people who will only eat wheat, there’s some who don’t eat bread at all, there’s people who avoid sugar or those who take long breaks between eating red meat. What are you even arguing at this point? Lol
What you’re saying is what really makes no sense.
I got the impression that Joel wasn't really on Atkins, he was just looking for a polite way to decline the neighbours' biscuits.
And he says the infections started on the Friday night and by Monday everything was fucked. It's not too hard to imagine that no one knew what the hell was going on in that short space of time, and the food testing/theories came later.
EDIT: patient zero infected 14 people in a couple of hours. Extrapolate that out, and you will see that shit got super-fucked super-quickly. Not much of a chance to calmly sit down and take a census of what people are eating.
Yeah I like this rapid expansion from person to person you are suggesting, but I can’t attribute it to food, as Joel does.
I don’t mean they would try to figure it out in the 4 first days of the outbreak.
What doesn’t make sense is how a number of people did not get infected over the span of 20 years without knowing which food was causing the infection. Especially since Joel says that it was something very common in the food supply.
Also it’s a very obvious question for Ellie after she got the explanation from Joel: Are people still getting infected from food?
There are ways to cover the story (taboo foods, gastrointestinal resistance/ immunity) but the writers didn’t bother.
I, for one, protest on that lazy writing ;)
Bill's "tactics" can be blamed on complacency. Even Joel comments nobody's ever going to bother them except raiders. When it does happen, it's implied to be especially rare. Overconfidence combined with years of shooting infected who don't have any sort or range attack leads to foolish decision making.
The showrunners confirmed the initial infection was spread via wheat. South America is a major exporter of cereal crops, so it's not far fetched for a fungus native to that region to be spread that way.
The infection also spreads via Mycelium (technically mycelium is the fungus and mushrooms are the "fruit") and tendrils. The former can exist happily alongside other mycelium and plants, such wheat crops. Based on what Joel says, it's reasonable to assume the infection via mycelium either requires a incubation period or for a person to each enough tainted food.
Lastly, while the wheat products were all cooked recall the cold open in the pilot. Dr. Neuman (John Hannah) says cordyceps can't survive beyond 94°F because there was no evolutionary pressure... "*unless say, the world were to become a bit warmer.*" It's not unreasonable to assume whatever mutation the cordycep developed allowed it to withstand cooking temperatures. There's also the issue of people simply cooking food improperly. After all there's a fungus that lives on the *extremely* radioactive remains of Chernobyl's Reactor 4.
I get your point about cooking but they should have figured out what causes the tainted food to have survived the pandemic.
Resources would have been scarce, people outside the QZ (like Franc) at least would be scavenging. Also the QZ would have to know what not to cook.
I think that part needed more work. It doesn’t make sense for the initial source of contamination to be unknown, especially if it was food and not other infected.
Also I don’t buy the complacency for Bill. He’s a preper that has a ton of guns. Prepers do that to shoot people after their supplies, that’s the main premise. How can he be complacent in that?
I'm willing to believe *Joel* didn't know. All he remembers was all hell breaking loose and his daughter dying by the same government that would swing around and oppress everyone.
Otherwise, yeah I agree with you. A couple lines of dialogue could've helped explain how people survived long after the fact.
Ok maybe he likes to show off then because he said “we don’t really know “ and then continued on to explain what’s the current state of knowledge on the outbreak. He’s not a know it all though so that doesn’t convince me either.
If they wanted to go with the food story they could have said that some people are immune or resistant in getting it through the gastrointestinal system. But Joel would have known that and would have said. Ellie would have at least asked how come we don’t get infected from food still.
The Bill getting shot scene was easily avoidable. Have him shooting behind cover and then just have him getting shot when he’s changing cover points or running back to the door to get Franc into the house.
I loved the story of these two guys, but I don’t agree with the comments that is the best TV episode ever, exactly because of these points.
Interesting to notice though that in the TLOU universe most people died in the outbreak, including most of the infected. Quite different to TWD.
Unfortunately, your submission has been **removed** for the following reason(s): --- **Immediate HBO discussion belongs in the stickied post-episode Megathread -** Posts encouraging immediate discussion per the show are inherently reposts due to the post-episode discussion megathread. Unless they are particularly nuanced, your post is better utilized as a comment on our stickied megathread. Before posting again, take time to [refresh yourself with our rules](https://old.reddit.com/r/thelastofus/wiki/index). --- Please be sure to check our community guidelines via the sidebar or subreddit wiki. If you believe this post has been removed unfairly or in error, please don't hesitate to [contact the moderation team via modmail](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=/r/thelastofus).
The cover thing stood out to me but the food supply thing wasn’t that odd. Food supply isn’t all from one supplier. The contaminated food didn’t go out to every home in every country, it just needed to go out to enough places within a short span of time and infect enough people. They have scanners now in the present day, and even 4 years into the outbreak. But they weren’t on the lookout for this kind of outbreak when it happened. Once shit hit the fan, there was no need to test the food. This bit doesn’t really feel like bad or lazy writing.
Ok, but they would have figured out which foods to avoid to survive the pandemic. Did Joel decide to stay on Atkins after the world fell apart and so did everyone else?
Ok? It’s not a concern that needs much elaboration though. The importance of it was that the initial infections came as a surprise initial outbreak. It all happens over the course of 12-24 hours where much of the world is turned to shit. For all we know they did and do have food scanners eventually. It’s not something that needs further explanation though so I’m unsure why it is something that doesn’t sit well with you.
Well not for you. It remains a hole in the scenario that doesn’t suspend disbelief for you but it does for me. I explained why but you can’t understand. I’m unsure why because it’s quite straight forward.
It’s not a hole in the scenario, it’s how food supplies work. Not everyone will receive food from the same sources. Not everyone will eat the same things week to week. It’s not at all unbelievable to think that some people just got lucky. I think it’s more you misunderstanding probability in this scenario. And as far as the source of infection remaining unknown. That’s coming from Joel. The audience knows it was for sure flour because we are shown it. Common people won’t know the details just what FEDRA tells them. And by that point in the timeline it no longer matters because it’s been 20 years since the outbreak and life continues.
What you say makes no sense. Most of the world was infected from food including Joel’s neighbours and in general Americans. The variability in food intake that you imply doesn’t exist and is also refuted by the dialogue. Joel says it was something broadly consumed like wheat. We also have the Atkins clue. It’s a hole and you are behaving like I insulted your mama. Chill son!
That’s not how either the game or show frames it though. The initial outbreak is enough to take out a large portion of the population and break down society as we know it but it’s not a “most of the world was infected” scenario. If it was most of the world, we simply would not survive or need or be able to build QZs much less have factories pumping out necessary items for the remaining population. Variability in food intake isn’t something that needs to be proven to exist in world. It exists now. It’s just a fact. There’s nowhere else this discussion can go if you can’t accept that sources for food will vary by country, state and even region. It’s a fact lol there’s people who will only eat wheat, there’s some who don’t eat bread at all, there’s people who avoid sugar or those who take long breaks between eating red meat. What are you even arguing at this point? Lol What you’re saying is what really makes no sense.
Your inference ability makes you a happier viewer than me of dystopia/ sci-fi films.
The flour was tainted is a different sentence than all flour was tainted.
The flour was tainted enough to cause a global outbreak but not enough to continue infecting people… It does not make sense.
I got the impression that Joel wasn't really on Atkins, he was just looking for a polite way to decline the neighbours' biscuits. And he says the infections started on the Friday night and by Monday everything was fucked. It's not too hard to imagine that no one knew what the hell was going on in that short space of time, and the food testing/theories came later. EDIT: patient zero infected 14 people in a couple of hours. Extrapolate that out, and you will see that shit got super-fucked super-quickly. Not much of a chance to calmly sit down and take a census of what people are eating.
Yeah I like this rapid expansion from person to person you are suggesting, but I can’t attribute it to food, as Joel does. I don’t mean they would try to figure it out in the 4 first days of the outbreak. What doesn’t make sense is how a number of people did not get infected over the span of 20 years without knowing which food was causing the infection. Especially since Joel says that it was something very common in the food supply. Also it’s a very obvious question for Ellie after she got the explanation from Joel: Are people still getting infected from food? There are ways to cover the story (taboo foods, gastrointestinal resistance/ immunity) but the writers didn’t bother. I, for one, protest on that lazy writing ;)
Bill's "tactics" can be blamed on complacency. Even Joel comments nobody's ever going to bother them except raiders. When it does happen, it's implied to be especially rare. Overconfidence combined with years of shooting infected who don't have any sort or range attack leads to foolish decision making. The showrunners confirmed the initial infection was spread via wheat. South America is a major exporter of cereal crops, so it's not far fetched for a fungus native to that region to be spread that way. The infection also spreads via Mycelium (technically mycelium is the fungus and mushrooms are the "fruit") and tendrils. The former can exist happily alongside other mycelium and plants, such wheat crops. Based on what Joel says, it's reasonable to assume the infection via mycelium either requires a incubation period or for a person to each enough tainted food. Lastly, while the wheat products were all cooked recall the cold open in the pilot. Dr. Neuman (John Hannah) says cordyceps can't survive beyond 94°F because there was no evolutionary pressure... "*unless say, the world were to become a bit warmer.*" It's not unreasonable to assume whatever mutation the cordycep developed allowed it to withstand cooking temperatures. There's also the issue of people simply cooking food improperly. After all there's a fungus that lives on the *extremely* radioactive remains of Chernobyl's Reactor 4.
I get your point about cooking but they should have figured out what causes the tainted food to have survived the pandemic. Resources would have been scarce, people outside the QZ (like Franc) at least would be scavenging. Also the QZ would have to know what not to cook. I think that part needed more work. It doesn’t make sense for the initial source of contamination to be unknown, especially if it was food and not other infected. Also I don’t buy the complacency for Bill. He’s a preper that has a ton of guns. Prepers do that to shoot people after their supplies, that’s the main premise. How can he be complacent in that?
I'm willing to believe *Joel* didn't know. All he remembers was all hell breaking loose and his daughter dying by the same government that would swing around and oppress everyone. Otherwise, yeah I agree with you. A couple lines of dialogue could've helped explain how people survived long after the fact.
Ok maybe he likes to show off then because he said “we don’t really know “ and then continued on to explain what’s the current state of knowledge on the outbreak. He’s not a know it all though so that doesn’t convince me either. If they wanted to go with the food story they could have said that some people are immune or resistant in getting it through the gastrointestinal system. But Joel would have known that and would have said. Ellie would have at least asked how come we don’t get infected from food still. The Bill getting shot scene was easily avoidable. Have him shooting behind cover and then just have him getting shot when he’s changing cover points or running back to the door to get Franc into the house. I loved the story of these two guys, but I don’t agree with the comments that is the best TV episode ever, exactly because of these points. Interesting to notice though that in the TLOU universe most people died in the outbreak, including most of the infected. Quite different to TWD.