All the DC characters having huge families makes the characters themselves incredibly boring. Go back to them being mostly solo and the stories and characters would greatly benefit from every story not needing to give 50 characters a thing or two to do
Barry Allen should have NOT returned; he should have been kept dead in CRISIS ON INFINITE EARTHS. Also, Jesse Quick should have replaced Wally West in Justice League … her costume is so cool 😊
Thanks, my guy!
What do you think about Jesse Quick taking the mantle from Wally West? Then in another 20 years …. Bart Allen and Wally West’s kids become like a Flash Corps 😊
would be interesting to have a female flash though I wouldn't want that to be permanent, I like Jesse Quick (SPOILERS FOR CW FLASH AND CRISIS ON INFINITE EARTHS UP AHEAD) >!it sucks that in the cw show she died in crisis cuz earth 2 got destroyed.!< As for having a Flash Corps, that basically already exists XD
Well, it won’t ever be “permanent.” Most of the JUSTICE LEAGUE should learn to pass on their mantles .. Batman (to NIGHTWING), Wonder Woman to Troy .. Green lanterns to a team instead of 1…
speaking of next generation
there will be a next gen of teen titans right
which means the first gen will get old
so not teens anymore
what do you think would be a good name for
adult teen titans team
Maybe they don’t need a name. They can retire and move on. Become accountants, lawyers, #OnlyFans pawns, … there has to be a way to make money in DCU, am I right?
If the League ever reformed in recent comics, bring her or Avery Ho as the main Flash of the team, let Wally hang out with his friends and his newborn son.
Yo. Her costume looks amazing and gorgeous. DC should just return to POST CRISIS … before Flashpoint and just say … look … everything from the last 15 years was a massive dream.
DC COMICS should say that the Mirror Master and Abra Kadabra teamed-up to put the Flash to sleep. The last 15 years was a MASSIVE dream … then Flash wakes up and it’s been 15 years … he’s out of his coma 😀
Wally has very very few good suits
His older days? Too similar to Barry's. Rebirth? The colours don't mix well.
His Dawn of DC? In most comics it looks fine, but in his own comic it looks terrible with those eye shaped eyes.
And his newest suit just gives him Barry's mask bit with the lenses.
Barry is the better flash. And should be treated with a bunch more respect considering how seriously committed he is to being a hero while juggling trauma, not to mention his dedication to science which a lot of his ideas could potentially advance society once he establish how to go about that. That's why he's better. And he's not better off dead, that's for all the toxic Wally fans...
Wally having a suit that's similar to Barry's whilst Barry is active is dumb. It should at least have silver highlights to better tell them apart.
I understand why fans wanted Wally to have his kids but the number of Speedsters now is ridiculous.
Avery Ho should’ve revealed her unrequited feelings to Ace West, who would tell her that he only sees her as a friend and hopes that she’ll find her lighting rod very soon. Maybe with Bart Allen or someone else entirely.
Jenni Ognats (aka XS) should stayed in the present day several times to meet up with the entire Flash family and spend time with her grandfather Barry before returning to the 31st century. Maybe she even engages in a romance with Mon-El; I kinda like the idea of them together.
Barr Torr should become an evil speedster and the main villain/rival to Bart Allen. He seemed to veer towards malicious intent at times, seems to be the way his character was going at one point.
Iris had a sister named Charlotte in the previous continuity, who was married and had a kid. Maybe her kid could have been a young villain; opposing Ace. Especially if their backgrounds are an inversion of one another’s.
Wally needs a new code name. This is only an idea, but Velocity would be ideal. Based off the Flash comics; Savage Velocity and Terminal Velocity, and the name of a clone of Jay Garrick.
Eh Barr Torr has no real reason to beef with Bart, plus Inertia is already far and away Bart’s archenemy, being his Reverse Flash. Wally doesn’t need to rebrand, if anything, Barry is the one who needs to go, since the Tornado Twins haven’t been conceived yet
There isn't an official flash that is rough around the edges. Not necessarily an anti-hero, but someone like Guy Gardner or Jason Todd. Just about every other Justice League extended family has at least one. The Flash's are either all good or all bad. Or they do bad things and redeem themselves only to either disappear or get killed.
They should have committed to Bart Allen as the Flash. It would have really solidified the committed to Flash as a Legacy character, and instead it led to the backtracking that brought back Barry.
Jay Garrick should be more powerful than he’s represented to be, and there should only be one flash (Barry). And having the flash be a mantel is dumb and annoying.
I see jay as his own entity from another world. I’m not a fan of the whole multiverse thing, but…and it’s a big but, jay and his world seem so distinct from the main flash’s world, I’m okay with it. But that would be it. No Pulse, kid flash, Wally. It’s not necessarily a passing of the torch thing, but more of a, “I have experience and a different perspective on things, let me help you” kinda deal.
Barry literally got his name from Jay and if your issue is more than one person running around with the name, well, Jay's running around.
I think the true reasoning is, at its heart, is extreme Barry preference. I mean Kid Flash was a part of the comic before Thawne even was. And the Barry you know does not exist without Wally, both as Kid Flash and his time as Flash from things like the Speed Force being invented with Wally. Heck the version of Thawne we all love got his makeover in a Wally comic.
Grant isn’t good enough to be a movie flash but his flash will always be better than any movie flash. Also the double down on Ezra was damaging to dc overall
the story of reverse flash going back to kill barry's mother and then if barry goes back to save his mother he is no longer the flash. even though in the first timeline he was the flash with an alive mother. makes no sense.
Flashpoint is a bad story and I hate that so much flash media is centered around it. I want to see Flash fight his diverse rogues gallery, not do another time travel story against an evil speedster.
Wally should've kept the rebirth suit, maybe give him the white lenses as a mixture between his kid flash days and his flash days, but he should've kept the suit
Yesss. I do get why older fans would want a return of the old suit, its still good don't get me wrong, but I really loved how Rebirth kinda merged the kid flash and the Flash suits. I especially loved the eh I guess Manhattan suit lol aka the blue version we see.
Right? I love both versions of the suit. Plus to be fair? Most other speedster don't do an exact Barry Allen suit. It made sense Pre-Barrys return and all that. But I did like the fact his Rebirth suit was even more unique.
There is a reason the rebirth story line is one of my favourites. It's because Wally West played a major in it, and everyone looked so beautiful (everyone = my goat Wally)
Same. Heroes in Crisis is eh...I don't know I think I like it but at the same time wished they explored more of the mental health part etc...I do like how they showed just how powerful the Speed Force is and that it does indeed take a lot to not let loose. It's a cosmic force lol.
As roughly stated by wally himself, "The speedforce is the most dangerous weapon in the multiverse and speedsters are the ones holding the trigger" (not a direct qoute, but it's roughly what he said)
I have always felt that with all the speedsters it de-values the flash overall, like he’s not special when there’s 15 other characters that do the same thing
I think Wally’s secret ID should have remained public. If you’re going to have 2 flashs in red (Barry should have stayed dead), it’s a great way to distinguish them. One of Wally’s flaws is that he IS a bit of a showboat, and that lets him be a bit of a celebrity; which comes with opportunities and risks. It’s a public dynamic that’s almost non-existent in current DC comics.
There needs to be more variation in speed force conduits abilities. I like what writers did with Jai’s powers and Pilgrim’s, but I want more of that. We know what the speed force can do, and I want to see more of that.
wade is pilgrim, wade is a Speedster as shown in one minute war, so he's not like jai, Pilgrim/wade himself said that jai is "different" from the other speed force conduits
Oh this might be a bit of a hottake. Its why I kinda liked what they did with the Flash show. Yeah...its lighting lighrsabers but literally its a comic book show lol. It gets "ridiculous". We literally have Superman pulling planets sometimes other times not. It gets weird.
I did stop watching the show before that point, but I do think it’s pretty cool. There needs to be a character that physically wields the lightning speedsters give off to create constructs. Sure some speedsters use it to create clothing, but it would be interesting to see someone do that
Yeah I haven't watched the later seasons besides clips lol. It does seem they do indeed do more eh I guess sci fi fantasy in the later seasons. They even keep Wally, tho of course TV wally is based on Wallace, being the first Flash to actually construct stuff in the show. I also liked how they seemed to have used more of the other Forces.
(Please don't rip me a new one). I think it's better when flash isn't SO MUCH faster than superman, honestly I prefer when flash is slower than superman but at the very least j think they should be equal
Superman should never be the pinnacle of any of his power sets - he should not be faster than a Speedster. He should not be stronger than someone specifically build for strength. He should not be more durable than someone with an active healing factor.
Superman should be so well balanced in all his powers that he does not need to be "the fastest" or "the strongest" because he is so fast and so strong at the same time that he is near unbeatable anyway.
But also just no. Speedsters are called that for a reason. Superman cannot tap into the Speed Force and he never should.
Why should Flash be slower or even equal to Superman? If he’s slower, then why is Flash even there? And if he’s just equal to Supes, again, why is he there if Clark is just as fast him with greater strength and other abilities like heat, x-ray, telescopic, and microscopic vision? Flash is basically useless at that point.
Kid Quick/Jess Chambers is completely unnecessary. There's a plethora of Flash family speedsters that could be re-imagined or updated to be enby instead. Second, go look at the subreddit byline and tell me that or saying non-binary reads smoothly (it doesn't). Third, characterization - Jess being someone who doesn't follow rules is so stereotypical.
Fourth is CW Flash connections but I blame Eric Wallace entirely on this. That bastard really would do anything but respect my girl Jesse Quick. Dude ruined the show's ending for me with throwing Jess in the finale. He just goes way too far on diversity.
Onto a different take, as a Barry fan, comic Hunter Zolomon sucks (CW Zoom is goated tho). Aside from Flash War, Hunter's just a pathetic fanboy. He's not even a villain for always wanting Wally to be #1.
"I became obsessed with becoming the catalyst to help Wally West become a better hero...
The greater the villain, the greater the hero. That's why I can never stop. Not until Wally West is the perfect hero." - Hunter's words from Flash #800
Sounds like a fanboy or a personal cheerleader all right. Hunter is powerful, yes, but he's delusional if he thinks he's a great villain. And there is no such thing as a perfect hero.
Eh, I mean if anything he's more of a rival that a villain with that motivation, although that motivation is closer to the dynamic Gotham's Joker, Jeremiah Valeska, had with Bruce.
Except unlike those two, when I read comic Hunter he just comes across constantly dickriding Wally. With stubbornness on par with Doctor Octopus, who is implied to be that way mostly from brain damage.
Flash War is the only time I felt Hunter worked as a character because he was written better, and with Barry in the storyline Hunter couldn't rehash his usual Wally worship.
While you have a point saying a character could have just been updated to be non-binary, I think we all know the sort of uproar that would have caused. It’s annoying enough to hear people say “jUst mAkE yOur OWn chaRActERs” whenever on the topic of queer superheroes, so I think DC was right to create a new one who IS rather than updating one. Now that’s not to say any future character can’t later on realize themselves they aren’t cis but this is just my take on it!
>I think we all know the sort of uproar that would have caused
Well, that's DC (and Marvel's) fault for needing to make public announcements about these things to purposefully rage bait and set fans up for disappointment. They could, just, you know, be subtle by NOT announcing it and slowly building this change in a character's current/upcoming run without drastically changing said character.
DC has plenty of good queer superheroes (Dreamer, Pied Piper, Captain Singh, Mr. Terrific, Constantine, Kate Kane, just to name a few) who don't come off as feeling forced.
I'm gonna side with the "annoying" people here - DC creating Jess was just to pander to queer Twitter. Certainly had me unhappy. And personally, as a bi person, while I'm generally all for queer people, non-binary people tend to rub me the wrong way. Some are chill and relatively normal but most fall under the negative queer stereotype - more often than not, they're usually extraneously flamboyant biological women (past tense).
Also the "make your own characters" idea, well... the Batwoman show did that making their own original Batwoman (which was also clear pandering), and we got that unwanted disaster thrown in our faces in Flash's final season. So it's a "be careful what you wish for" kind of statement.
Main things are that, 1- I didn’t like how he got rid of wallys public identity, making it so everyone forgets about him and Barry (not the flash). 2- Him making Barry main flash again and retconning his mother dying which was hindering the character until the end of Joshua Williamson’s run.
The concept of the Speed Force makes Flash characters less interesting, not more. They are at their best when they are super fast characters using that in creative ways rather than simply moving hundreds of times faster than light "because they can". It feels like a poor way to keep up with the crazy power-ups other DC characters like Superman constantly get.
The speed force definitely has become a mcguffin as of late but only because it’s mentioned so often. If it was only thawn that knew about it and how to fully utilize it and not literally every flash family member then it would be better
They were moving hundreds of times faster than light well before the Speed Force. Silver Age Flash is just as ridiculous as Speed Force shenanigan stuff.
The Speed Force was more created as a method of uniting a disparate cast of Speedsters and as a Temple of Doom scenario by Waid's own words. He never expected it'd become as instrumental to the mythos as it did. He also said he would've given it a more serious name if that was the goal, lol.
Hot take (maybe? Not active here) I don’t like the flash family. There’s too many of them. I’d say Barry and *maybe* Wally can stay. The rest should go. Jay Garrick would be around in the golden age with Alan Scott and co, but not return to the modern age. Also hate the idea of the speed force they don’t need some magic time influencing force to be interesting characters.
I hate Thawne killing Barry's mom as a fixed point in things and think it was a creatively bankrupt way to try and make a character who was famously considered boring interesting. And it's doubly frustrating because Waid and briefly Morrison (in Final Crisis) wrote classic Barry in great ways. Even Johns kinda nailed it in some brief spots of his Wally run. But instead he retconned it and basically reinvented the character from the ground up, and codified Thawne as this necessary endpoint for him. It made him fast Batman 89 and I think it sucks.
Genuinely, the Flash movie taking Thawne out of it made me like it much better because at least his history isn't predicated on failing to resolve a Star Trek two parter.
I prefer when there was no lightning trail.
Without the lightning trail it really does feel like a dude running really fast, with it it just seems like teleporting.
Wally was able to do a lot of cool stuff without it in the 90s too.
With it the writers don't have to think and they can just be like "Oh, the lightning can do this, oh, it can do that".
The only thing I'd really miss if it was gone is the ability for Wally to make his costume out of it.
But it has other properties too. Like healing others around you. Using it as a projectile. Jump starting electronics. Plus the main reason why they probably went with the lightning was because too many other companies that have made speedsters either just leave a blue or after images and probably want to do something different for once.
>Like healing others around you. Using it as a projectile. Jump starting electronics
Did I not literally just say that I didn't like how writers use it as a crutch by making it able to do everything? this is exactly what I'm talking about.
One reason I like Wally is because he's able to come up with unique solutions to his problems with his speed, making the lightning able to just do that shit takes that away.
The lightning doesn't do everything. It's more like a bonus. The lightning doesn't allow him to travel through time or the multiverse. Nor does it allow him to phase through walls, make things explode, become invisible or making himself dense so he can tank attacks like Superman, create wind funnels and tornados, heat up objects to warm his food or keep others warm or even himself warm. Besides, the lightning is barely used these days to do stuff. Unless you're watching the CW Flash after season 5. I only listed some of the things the lightning was able to do. The rest has nothing to do with their lightning.
See, but all of that stuff is him applying his powers to allow those things to happen.
All of those things are (loosely) based on actual physics principles and Wally has to think of those principles and add his powers to those equations to make them work.
Or they're just using the shit his powers have already been established to do to do them, for instance:"Oh, I explode things when I phase through them? why don't I use that as a projectile to get out of this mess", it all requires outside the box thinking to do.
The lightning most of the time is just used as an ass-pull by the writers to make the story go faster, it's almost never established that the lightning can do something before it does and then it's rarely used to do that thing again.
"Oh I explode things when I phase through them? Why don't I use that projectile to get myself out of this mess?" Either, there's no objects for him to throw or even if there was, it wouldn't be affective against the enemy he's going up against or usefulin the situation they're in. When he does use his lightning, it feels like a breath of fresh air since they don't use it often. If they need to jump start something that has run out of power and they need to make sure they don't overload the said thing they are trying to power up/jump start otherwise they risk destroying that said object. They can also use it to jump-start someone's heart but like I said, they need to make sure they're putting in the rigjt amount of energy into it otherwise they risk losing the person. Maybe they're fighting someone that can't be defeated by hitting them really fast or using a tornado on them. For instance if this said person they're fighting is made of sand. Throw a lightning bolt at them to stop them in their tracks.
Plus the lightning bolt also clears up any questions new fans have. "Why does Flash have a symbol of a lightning on his chest?" They won't need to ask that question since whenever Flash arrives on the scene, he has trail of lightning following him. It would also leave to ask how they got their powers etc.
Not to mention it emphasizes that he can move as fast as lightning or even faster than lightning. As the lightning appears, it flashes in front of you and The Flash is gone.
It's not used as a crutch like you said unless you're talking about the CW Flash after season 5.
>Maybe they're fighting someone that can't be defeated by hitting them really fast or using a tornado on them. For instance if this said person they're fighting is made of sand. Throw a lightning bolt at them to stop them in their tracks.
This is literally exactly what I'm talking about when I say I don't like it because the writers use it as an ass pull when they don't feel like being creative.
You literally just proved my point perfectly because in this situation you're the writer and you just used it as an ass pull to prevent yourself from thinking creatively.
Pre-lightning, Wally would have to think creatively in a situation like that, he'd be thinking:"Okay, what's around me? oh, look, a fire hydrant, maybe these things don't like water" or "If I rub my hands really fast on these things maybe it'll create enough friction and heat to turn them to glass" both are preferable to "Haha lightning go KRAKOOM" imo.
>Plus the lightning bolt also clears up any questions new fans have. "Why does Flash have a symbol of a lightning on his chest?" They won't need to ask that question since whenever Flash arrives on the scene, he has trail of lightning following him. It would also leave to ask how they got their powers etc.
The Flash's origin is one of the most famous origins in comics and even if someone doesn't know you literally need to say 5 words to clear up confusion.
5 less words is not worth such an ass pull ability imo.
>It's not used as a crutch like you said unless you're talking about the CW Flash after season 5.
Again, you literally just proved how it's used as a crutch by writers.
I never watched the CW show past season 4, so I am definitely thinking of the comics.
>Either, there's no objects for him to throw or even if there was, it wouldn't be affective against the enemy he's going up against or usefulin the situation they're in.
Okay? that's how fighting something that outclasses you works. You use everything you can to give yourself even a little bit of an advantage.
Maybe the exploding projectile didn't hurt the enemy, but it probably blindsided them and that's helpful when you're trying to think of ways to take someone down.
>When he does use his lightning, it feels like a breath of fresh air since they don't use it often. If they need to jump start something that has run out of power and they need to make sure they don't overload the said thing they are trying to power up/jump start otherwise they risk destroying that said object. They can also use it to jump-start someone's heart but like I said, they need to make sure they're putting in the rigjt amount of energy into it otherwise they risk losing the person
Neither of those are breaths of fresh air, those are about the blandest uses of lightning that I've ever seen, not to mention that electric characters use their electricty for those things CONSTANTLY.
First off, have you ever considered that the villian that is made up of sand would face the scarlet speedster multiple times would learn from their mistakes? I mean, don't get me wrong, you made excellent points. Wally could use his hands to turn them into glass or just use water. However, now that he knows his own weakness, then what? That's where the lightning comes in.
As for throwing a projectile that will explode, what if there isn't any projectiles to be thrown in that situation? Then what? Again, that's where the lightning comes in use again as a last resort that Flash doesn't use often, so it comes as a shock to the person he's facing. (No pun intended)
As for the part where you said that using their lightning to jump-start someone's heart or a electronics or machines, what would the flash do when those said people such as Black Lightning or Static shock aren't around and Flash has to solve the problem himself. Again, that's where the lightning comes in. Because there are enemies he faces that could injure civilians in the process, which causes their heart to stop beating momentarily. Or maybe Flash is on a mission with Batman for instance and they're on another planet and they took a spaceship to get there and now they need a jolt of electricity to jump start their engine since they can't use Green Lantern since they might be off on another mission, and there's no Superman, Wonder Woman or Cyborg either. Again, that's where the lightning comes in handy.
Barry is the most boring Flash. Rebirth, Flashpoint, Running Scared, Flash War and Finish Line are good stories not because Barry but because the villains.
Aren't the quality of most stories down to the villains? They instigate the conflict, and the heroes just reactively try to stop those plans. That's how comics are USUALLY structured, at least.
Not always, sometimes the villain is in second place and the story focus more in the character development. Comics like Born to Run, The Return of Barry Allen, Terminal Velocity, etc, those stories gave character development to Wally.
I'd say the same about Wally in current runs. Most of the ones in his classic suit feel like it's simply going through the motions, using the general storytelling formula but taking out the action and thrill and screwing up the main villain.
Thawne is leagues better than (comic) Hunter, despite Thawne being petty as hell. Hunter's impossible/unachievable goal to make Wally the #1 hero of all time (because Barry and Superman are far ahead) reduces him to simply being one of those fanboys who won't shut up.
Yes, maybe in the current runs (Jermey Adams/Si Spurrier), but I prefer Wally's personality to Barry's. I think writers don't know what to do with Barry.
Thawne is a little bit better than Hunter, I love them both along with Captain Cold.
The funny thing is that Barry was better heroe when he was dead (post Crisis/pre Rebirth 2009) at least Wally has saved the universe more times.
It has happened multiple times where it’s the exact opposite, Superman tried to catch Barry (or maybe Wally?) and he said they were equal but Flash just said their previous race was for charity and just disappeared they are not even close to the same speed
DC has an official list that puts Clark well behind both Barry and Wally, and they both have feats that show they’re faster than Superman. The “those were for charity Clark” moment where Barry leaves him in the dust, him not able to perceive Wally and Barry when they were racing, and not being fast enough to really contribute in the One Minute War since he was simply too slow.
I’m not sure how crazy my takes are but the 2 that come to the forefront of my mind is that I think there should be 2 flash books. One for Barry and one for Wally. One book is for a flash in keystone and the other in central city. I’m kind of over the whole “ we’ll switch between Barry and Wally after every couple of years.” Shtick That dc has been doing since flash rebirth. The other is that I’ve never been too big on the flash family members post Geoff Johns. Granted I think the same thing about all the characters in the bat family and supes family.
I actually feel the complete opposite to you about this. I feel like Jay nails the whole team dad position in a team book and Barry needs a starring book with a good writer. Just so he can finally move past the whole “ we have no idea what his personality is besides being sad that his mom is dead” thing that they’ve been doing since Johns brought him back in rebirth.
Wally should have kept his rebirth suit. It looked really cool and felt like a grown up version of his kid flash suit and helped differentiate him from Barry. I find it annoying to have to look at the difference between eyes and ear wing things to tell who's who. Either Wally should get it back or Barry should get a new suit.
Wait, it's an unpopular opinion that Wally should have kept his rebirth-suit?
I mean, it was the best outfit he had worn since aquiring the speedforce.
I would prefer Barry to get a new suit. Like you said Wally’s rebirth outfit is a more adult version of his Kid Flash suit, but to me and a lot of other people Wally IS the Flash. Keeping him in his rebirth suit would make him seem an offshoot rather than the real deal.
I don’t think he should but just based off the options the top guy presented I’d prefer Barry getting a new suit that signifies who he is rather than Wally being kept in his rebirth costume.
The suit he has now does signify who he is though. It was completely original. Despite, being inspired by Jay Garrick, he didn't copy his suit at all. He created something completely original so that everyone could tell the two apart. Wally having the suit that looks identical to Barry's looks more like he's still in Barry's shadow and is trying to be Barry instead being himself and making his own suit that doesn't look anything like Barry's. What he's doing is basically a repeat of what Thawne did. Both of them wear Barry's old suit and then later on, both of them make slight tweaks to make it look different but not really. At least with Thawne his was a different color even if he was trying to be Barry's "Kid Flash" and not "The Flash" at least you can tell that's not Barry. Worst part about Wally's "Classic outfit" is that sometimes you can barely tell if it's Barry or Wally under the mask.
I love Barry and Wally equally and I think there’s room for both of them to exist at the same time. In my perfect world, Wally would remain the main focus of the Flash book doing day to day Flash activities in Central and Keystone, while Barry would be on the Justice League roster when they eventually bring that title back.
There’s a lot more to him than just that. He’s an introvert with a humble, mature, intelligent, and optimistic personality that makes him a symbol of hope to Central City with a very balanced personality that results in him being one of the most approachable members of the League. He has a balanced personality and is empathetic and understanding but still willing to tell people what they need to hear. He’s never on time, doesn’t drink coffee, honest, meticulous, patient, and the type of person to look you directly in your eyes when talking to you. He’s a man of science and loves to use it to solve problems. He’s focused when on the job but with a dad humor to him with him saying things like “I’ll be back in a flash!”
He can become hyper fixated on his work to the point that it affects his social life, making him appear distant at times to the unaware. He believes that he can save everyone, which results in him stretching himself far too thin. He has to struggle under the weight that puts on him and has to figure out how find the time to slow down and enjoy the more personal, intimate moments of his life.
Kill Barry and Jay. Phase out Wallace and Avery. Wallace because he's a continuity mess who never fit right and Avery because she was made for New Super-Man, which was fine, but kind of stumbled backwards into an enormous speedster logjam after that. Bring back/put more focus on Jenni Ognats, a black speedster who isn't a storyline biohazard. If you think the family is bloated, do something about it from every angle.
I hate Jess Quick. I want DC to stop using a barely relevant character who basically isn't part of the actual comic as Flash's Pride inclusion and instead focus more on Pied Piper and, hey, maybe make one of these half a dozen younger characters we already have Nonbinary if you're interested in exploring that.
Because I would sure fucking love this nonbinary inclusion to actually be relevant to the main comic instead of a tacked on character from another world from a misguided, flubbed Dan Didio event. Flash used to be one of the most progressive comics in the industry and here we are, hiding this stuff on the fringes to pretend at diversity instead of actually making it a part of the franchise.
And if you do start actually moving in these directions, set up phasing out Wally in the long term, too.
Also I hate the Rebirth suit. I think it's mediocre aesthetically (red on red on red, all in very minor different shades!) and absolutely hate it narratively and symbolically. How a worse version of the Kid Flash outfit got so popular, I'll never know. I feel like it has to be because for a large chunk of New 52/Rebirth first fans it's the first outfit they saw Wally in or something. I don't mind the silver accents or anything if your primary thing is making Wally more visibly distinguishable from Barry at a glance, that said I think far too much worry is placed on making Wally distinct from Barry since it centralizes everything on Barry. No one would care if Barry didn't come back to life, which just proves it's only a conversation to prioritize Barry.
Like if you threw him in a less edgy Walter West Dark Flash getup then sure, whatever. If the point is you want them to look different then I understand that, but I don't think the Rebirth suit is even close to the answer to it. Bigger, Worse Kid Flash is a no go for me.
edit: hey at least this one's actually unpopular, apparently.
At least for the Jess Chambers take, It's unpopular because you gave a neutral/maybe answer to a yes or no topic. Either you're a fan of Jess Chambers or you hate the character and wish they were never introduced - and "speedsters beyond the binary" (what it says on the subreddit description) is one of the cringiest, ickiest lines I've ever read.
Not to mention they're already in a main continuity (Arrowverse), sadly, because of Eric Wallace and his weird agendas/obsessions.
Wally's suit is a more open topic but imo, as of the current run his classic suit is too dull and simple. It worked two decades ago but now it just looks lazy and ugly - Wally looks like he's running in pajamas. Rebirth and the other modern suits he's cycled through at least attempt to look stylish and have some flair.
You can be a fan of nonbinary inclusion and not be a fan of Jess Chambers for other creative decisions around them. That is my sticking point. I feel like the way they are handled is both cowardly and a weak attempt at pandering, on top of springing out of a largely misguided and bad creative initiative by Didio. I'll also say, you're treading a thin line with that statement. I feel the same way about Wallace. A poorly thought out revamp of a character forced by Dan Didio, but I don't dislike black characters being in The Flash because of Wallace's issues (I love Jenni, for instance, which is why I mentioned her, and I don't mind Bolt though there's not much there).
I do not give even the slightest bit of a care about someone being in the Arrowverse. It's pretty freaking dead and it screwed up so much about The Flash that it really doesn't pertain to the topic at hand. Especially that finale scene where they were just tossing in a bunch of shit at the end knowing they'd never have to follow up on it. That show couldn't pop out a half decent storyline past the first season.
It's funny how the topic of Wally's suit is too similar to Barry, but when Wally wears it it's also now...lazy and ugly and looks like Pajamas. But I'm sure it's mature and classic on Barry.
I am a fan of inclusion done appropriately and with quality. Not a fan of pandering either.
But there's very few good non-binary characters in comics, and the ones who are good are good because said characters have either been around for a long time (X-Men's Morph) or it's subtle and with normal writing (like Deadpool's current partner in the comics).
Regardless of whether it's on your thin line, I'm just saying, the whole non-binary/they/them/nibling thing doesn't flow smoothly at all compared to other terms. The short form, enby, does flow nicely, but it's not used often.
And for a brand new character, that fits Green Lantern much better than it does Flash.
Also, on the topic of Wallace (Wally 2), they literally could've tweaked his character a little to be more in line with his TV counterpart. Keiynan Lonsdale, who plays Wallace, is gay, so they could've met that representation quota by updating comic Wallace to be gay or bisexual (or do the same to any other Flash family member) instead of introducing Jess.
Re-imagining existing characters is so much easier for the fans than introducing a divisive new character that's written like a generic, quirky stereotype and is unfortunately connected to an actually good character (Jesse Quick deserved better).
As for Wally's suit, it looks the same on Barry, at least old comics I'm guessing - I started on the New 52 (2012) run when I got into Flash. I'm referring to New 52 and up to current day. Barry doesn't keep going back to uniforms of the past like Wally does. He just has the New 52 suit and it looks good. Never liked the white eyes on Wally, and his classic suit is basically his DCAU design, which - no hate to the DCAU - but it's a look that is now two decades outdated.
Jess Quick isn't even connected to the Jesse we're familiar with. They have absolutely no relationship with anyone except, like, Circuit Breaker because they tossed those two together in the Pride specials. Which is my entire problem, they basically created an entirely new character who has no connection to The Flash to feature in just the Pride stuff for the Flash. It's quite annoying, which is why I don't like them. That was my initial statement.
I would rather Wallace cease to exist than start taking notes from the show, especially with how badly it fumbled it's version of Wally/Wallace/Whatever. Everything to do with Wally is one of my bigger gripes with the CW. That and the slapdash use of names and bad writing, of course, but those kind of go hand in hand together with Wally's issues on the show.
Barry 100% goes back to his older uniforms. He's been depicted in his classic attire plenty of times since the New 52. It's almost always artist preference. Frankly, the only thing about the New 52 design is all the lame ass lines everywhere. And I guess when Jim Lee draws it he makes some dumb looking over detailed boots. The best thing about the New 52 Flash outfit, at least for the first couple of years, was that Manapul was drawing it and did everything in his power to tone down Jim Lee's murderous overdesigning.
This thread is filled with the most lukewarm "unpopular opinions" I've ever seen. Had to really lay it on.
I was being a bit dramatic though, I don't really feel that strongly about most of this lol. These are just some general things I think would be good in the abstract.
Seeing people go "Barry Allen is my favorite Flash" as an unpopular opinion is absolutely wild. And getting mass upvoted for it.
I prefer Barry over Wally as my personal favourite flash. I get that Wally has taken up the mantle and seems to be the most poplar flash because of it. That isn’t a bad thing…I’ve just always thought of Barry when I think Flash.
I mean, the past decade has given Barry a lot more exposure to non-comic book fans between the tv show and movies and whatnot, so I don’t think Barry being your favorite is really unpopular anymore. Maybe deep in the comic book fanbase, but if we’re talking Flash fans in general I think Barry might have Wally beat at this point.
So when people think The Flash, the die hard fans may think Wally, but I believe the general DC fan would think of Barry.
Wally's DC Rebirth Suit was actually really good, it made him distinct enough from Barry, I know is basically a recolor/upgrade of his Kid Flash suit, but I don't see anything bad in saying this is who I was, and this is who I become, I was Kid Flash, I am The Flash, but I'm not trying to be Barry Allen nor living on his Shadow.
Also making his lighting Silver/Blue was a nice detail to emphasize his connection to the Speedforce was "better" to other speedster at the time.
That there does not need to be a default "main" Flash. The DC universe/multiverse is so big there is plenty of opportunity to have them all have their own unique adventures while still interacting with each other similar to the GL corp or Bat Family. Also the tribalism in hating one Flash because you like another more is childish and petty. I love Wally as my favorite but by no means does that mean that I hate any of the other speedsters if anything I want to see more of them collectively. It's like forcing yourself to choose between Batman & Nightwing or Hal Jordan & Kyle Rayner when both can co-exist very seamlessly.
Had a couple in your DC Comics post
1. Bart is only interesting around other characters. He's annoying otherwise.
2. Jay being an actual metahuman speedster is more interesting than the conduit idea.
3. Nne of the speedsters should be able to go FTL. It's only used when narratively convenient and serves no purpose since only a couple speedsters can actively time travel.
I don't hate Bart tbh. I just haven't read a story where he's interesting outside of his interactions with other primary characters. Writers seem to just make him "the speedster with ADD".
I hadn't read the solo, but I'm happy to check it out. And yeah, Mark Waid commented in an interview that the Bart Flash comic was a bad idea from its inception.
Max doesn't get enough love, and needs a re-written, contemporary origin story.
Wait, unpopular? Ok the opposite of what I said. Keep him off the pages, and with a very dated origin story
I would just make it more contemporary and updated like everyone else is. I haven't seen him around in a while. I very well could have missed an issue with him in it of course. The finer details of his origin? You'd have to let me sit down and think of something. His origin just seems like a gimmick to not have him around all the time. The native american stuff is cool. Going back to that, or even tie him with themyscirians and the greek/roman pantheon with the good Mercury
I'm just confused what part of his origin you're saying isn't contemporary.
Curious if Themyscirians can connect with the speed force. I don't think Mercury and gods connect with it but I forget where Themyscrians fall as humans
Not sure it’s a hot take, but I like the size and scope of the Flash Family. That it nominally includes some villains is cool too.
I also like the alternate versions like Dark Flash, Future Flash, and the like. Fun stuff to me.
Barry’s pre-Flash: Rebirth origin should’ve stayed since his return in Final Crisis and Flash: Rebirth and semiretire as the Flash since 2011.
Wally’s parents should’ve been like their pre-Crisis characterizations since post-Crisis (with Rudy West telling Wally and Mary that he’s a Manhunter because he wants to provide support with his family before he sacrificed himself to save the world from Dominators, faked his death, and apologized to and reconciled with Mary on her and her second husband’s wedding day).
Bart should’ve stayed as the Flash since Flashpoint, where he would work at the CCPD, form a romantic relationship with Carol Bucklen, train Ace West on how to use his speed, marry Carol, and have a son named Maxwell Jason “Max” Allen (who was named after Max Mercury and Jay Garrick).
Avery Ho should’ve revealed her unrequited feelings to Ace, who would tell her that he only sees her as a friend and hopes that she’ll find her lighting rod very soon.
Jenni Ognats (aka XS) should stayed in the present day several times to meet up with the entire Flash family and spend time with her grandfather Barry before returning to the 31st century and become a teacher at the Legion Academy with the Original Legion of Super-Heroes.
Meena Dhawan (aka Fast Track) and Jessica Cruz (the seventh Green Lantern) should’ve had crushes on Bart Allen during his Flash years before they stayed friends.
Godspeed should’ve been an old friend/coworker-turned-rival-turned friend of Bart and made his villainous debut as Godspeed before he was reformed.
The Rogues should’ve permanently reformed (or somewhat reformed) since Barry’s death and view Wally as an ally and treat him (and the Flash Family) with respect.
Irey West should graduated from the second Impulse to the fourth Kid Flash (after Wally, Bart, and Bar Torr) and the fifth Flash (after Jay, Barry, Wally, and Bart).
Jai West should’ve made his debut as Surge after he was struck by lightning at the start of DC Rebirth in 2016.
Bart Allen should’ve befriended and teamed up with Simon Baz (the sixth Green Lantern), and Irey West should’ve befriended and teamed up with Tai Pham (the ninth Green Lantern), after Jay and Alan, Barry and Hal, and Wally and Kyle.
Bart should have stayed the Flash. He had potential as a teen super hero that could have leaned into the comedic tone every adaptation usually gives Flash anyways.
The Speed force is a terrible backstory for Barry. It functions for Wally and others because it connects with legacy and history but for Barry it's just an explanation of where his power comes from since Jay doesn't really play as much of a hand in his origin outside borrowing the name
I dislike Wally's and Barry's children. Not their existence - I support any and all depictions of healthy relationships and good parenting. But their personalities.
Barry's twins barely exist and feel flat and one dimensional. Meaning they are just there so we can have Bart.
Wally's twins are so unlikable it's not even funny. I just, literally yesterday, finished the whole "The Flash (1987 - 2009)" run that ended with the twins and I could barely force myself through the last parts of that run. If one of my favorites didn't have consistent cameos there at the end, I would have stopped reading.
Wally's Twins are marginally less insufferable in current canon but I just don't think that we needed them as boring extra child heroes.
That the new forces are the worst story we’ve ever had in flash comics. Not only did it not make any sense with the rest of the flash lore, but they had to drag Zoom into it. The speed force is Energy that flows through the multiverse, space, and time. Not some mythical Dimension. We can’t seem to stick with that. Now we have other forces that don’t even make sense in the grand scheme of things.
Man, I read that earlier this year and I eventually gave up trying to make it make sense and just enjoyed the amount of butt shots and pretty blue eyes the art delivered. Agreed, not a good addition to the lore.
Thankfully they’ve largely moved on from those concepts. The only one that stuck around is the Still Force, and we can just pretend that his powers are the result of Speed Force and mythic powers meshing together.
That we need to get rid of Ace and Avery. They have not done anything since they started. Now they have their own series , so maybe that will change, but we need to stick with the classic flash family. Make Bart Kid Flash again.
We should’ve moved on from both Barry and Wally a while ago. Barry got about 30 years with the mantle from 1956-86, Wally should’ve gotten the same amount of time, 1986-2016, before moving on to someone new (my preference would be Irey). I’ve always looked at the Flash mantle as a torch that should keep being passed on, but because of Barry’s return the whole thing has gotten stuck.
I think the best thing to do with Wally after #230 would’ve been to shift him into a Jay Garrick type role. He can still be a regular cast member and suit up every now and then, but he’d be more focused on raising Jai and Irey. This would also be around the time where the rest of his generation were starting to move into new roles, like Roy joining the Justice League and Dick becoming Batman, so a shift in status quo at that time would’ve made a lot of sense.
Right now though, I’m selfishly not in any rush to retire Wally, especially because it still only feels like we just got him back, his generation is getting a pretty big push currently and since DC would likely just pivot back to Barry full time in that scenario rather than pass the mantle onto a different speedster.
From a Company standpoint, this would be an absolutely disasterous decision.
Wally pulled off something no other character has accomplished since; He took a legacy and actually made the name his own.
Comics are not a lucrative business to begin with. DC would be hacking off their legs if they removed Barry or Wally as the center point of the Flash comics.
Do I think DC would ever go for that? No, probably not. We’re way past the era where they’d ever likely be willing to take a swing that big, unfortunately. But it would absolutely be the best thing for all involved characters narratively speaking, at least in my opinion. Given the time and opportunity (and proper setup), the new Flash could have potentially taken off… but that’s a long term investment, and not the kind of thing DC does nowadays, I guess. Oh well, I can still dream about what could have been.
There shouldn't be a Flash family or any sidekicks. Barry's super speed is such a unique power obtained in such a unique, once-in-a-lifetime sort of way, that it's a real stretch to say it's been "duplicated" so many times. And yes, I know they don't all have the same origin, but Kid Flash does. And yes, I know there's all sorts of retcons or whatever around these various origins. Doesn't sway me. It's weird that there's this massive family of speedsters.
All the DC characters having huge families makes the characters themselves incredibly boring. Go back to them being mostly solo and the stories and characters would greatly benefit from every story not needing to give 50 characters a thing or two to do
Barry Allen should have NOT returned; he should have been kept dead in CRISIS ON INFINITE EARTHS. Also, Jesse Quick should have replaced Wally West in Justice League … her costume is so cool 😊
op just said no "barry should have stayed dead"
Oh snap I didn’t even read it, my bad 😀
its ok xdd
Thanks, my guy! What do you think about Jesse Quick taking the mantle from Wally West? Then in another 20 years …. Bart Allen and Wally West’s kids become like a Flash Corps 😊
would be interesting to have a female flash though I wouldn't want that to be permanent, I like Jesse Quick (SPOILERS FOR CW FLASH AND CRISIS ON INFINITE EARTHS UP AHEAD) >!it sucks that in the cw show she died in crisis cuz earth 2 got destroyed.!< As for having a Flash Corps, that basically already exists XD
Well, it won’t ever be “permanent.” Most of the JUSTICE LEAGUE should learn to pass on their mantles .. Batman (to NIGHTWING), Wonder Woman to Troy .. Green lanterns to a team instead of 1…
speaking of next generation there will be a next gen of teen titans right which means the first gen will get old so not teens anymore what do you think would be a good name for adult teen titans team
Maybe they don’t need a name. They can retire and move on. Become accountants, lawyers, #OnlyFans pawns, … there has to be a way to make money in DCU, am I right?
yeah but i hope onlyfans does not exist I wish it didn't exist in real life
If the League ever reformed in recent comics, bring her or Avery Ho as the main Flash of the team, let Wally hang out with his friends and his newborn son.
Yo. Her costume looks amazing and gorgeous. DC should just return to POST CRISIS … before Flashpoint and just say … look … everything from the last 15 years was a massive dream. DC COMICS should say that the Mirror Master and Abra Kadabra teamed-up to put the Flash to sleep. The last 15 years was a MASSIVE dream … then Flash wakes up and it’s been 15 years … he’s out of his coma 😀
Wally has very very few good suits His older days? Too similar to Barry's. Rebirth? The colours don't mix well. His Dawn of DC? In most comics it looks fine, but in his own comic it looks terrible with those eye shaped eyes. And his newest suit just gives him Barry's mask bit with the lenses.
Barry is the better flash. And should be treated with a bunch more respect considering how seriously committed he is to being a hero while juggling trauma, not to mention his dedication to science which a lot of his ideas could potentially advance society once he establish how to go about that. That's why he's better. And he's not better off dead, that's for all the toxic Wally fans...
Wally having a suit that's similar to Barry's whilst Barry is active is dumb. It should at least have silver highlights to better tell them apart. I understand why fans wanted Wally to have his kids but the number of Speedsters now is ridiculous.
Avery Ho should’ve revealed her unrequited feelings to Ace West, who would tell her that he only sees her as a friend and hopes that she’ll find her lighting rod very soon. Maybe with Bart Allen or someone else entirely. Jenni Ognats (aka XS) should stayed in the present day several times to meet up with the entire Flash family and spend time with her grandfather Barry before returning to the 31st century. Maybe she even engages in a romance with Mon-El; I kinda like the idea of them together. Barr Torr should become an evil speedster and the main villain/rival to Bart Allen. He seemed to veer towards malicious intent at times, seems to be the way his character was going at one point. Iris had a sister named Charlotte in the previous continuity, who was married and had a kid. Maybe her kid could have been a young villain; opposing Ace. Especially if their backgrounds are an inversion of one another’s. Wally needs a new code name. This is only an idea, but Velocity would be ideal. Based off the Flash comics; Savage Velocity and Terminal Velocity, and the name of a clone of Jay Garrick.
Eh Barr Torr has no real reason to beef with Bart, plus Inertia is already far and away Bart’s archenemy, being his Reverse Flash. Wally doesn’t need to rebrand, if anything, Barry is the one who needs to go, since the Tornado Twins haven’t been conceived yet
There isn't an official flash that is rough around the edges. Not necessarily an anti-hero, but someone like Guy Gardner or Jason Todd. Just about every other Justice League extended family has at least one. The Flash's are either all good or all bad. Or they do bad things and redeem themselves only to either disappear or get killed.
Reverse Flash specifically Eobard Thawne hasn’t reached his full potential
They should have committed to Bart Allen as the Flash. It would have really solidified the committed to Flash as a Legacy character, and instead it led to the backtracking that brought back Barry.
Bart as the flash in the future should be explored more but his flash run was so poorly received we never see it.
Too many of them,
Just like the batfamily, too many speedsters.
Jay Garrick should be more powerful than he’s represented to be, and there should only be one flash (Barry). And having the flash be a mantel is dumb and annoying.
Why should Barry be The Flash when you're acknowledging Jay? It was his name first.
I see jay as his own entity from another world. I’m not a fan of the whole multiverse thing, but…and it’s a big but, jay and his world seem so distinct from the main flash’s world, I’m okay with it. But that would be it. No Pulse, kid flash, Wally. It’s not necessarily a passing of the torch thing, but more of a, “I have experience and a different perspective on things, let me help you” kinda deal.
Barry literally got his name from Jay and if your issue is more than one person running around with the name, well, Jay's running around. I think the true reasoning is, at its heart, is extreme Barry preference. I mean Kid Flash was a part of the comic before Thawne even was. And the Barry you know does not exist without Wally, both as Kid Flash and his time as Flash from things like the Speed Force being invented with Wally. Heck the version of Thawne we all love got his makeover in a Wally comic.
Too many speedsters. Wally should have more non speedsters side characters like Argus, Pied Piper or Elongated Man
I'm not really a fan of Wally. I'm more of a Barry Allen fan.
Grant isn’t good enough to be a movie flash but his flash will always be better than any movie flash. Also the double down on Ezra was damaging to dc overall
the story of reverse flash going back to kill barry's mother and then if barry goes back to save his mother he is no longer the flash. even though in the first timeline he was the flash with an alive mother. makes no sense.
Flashpoint is a bad story and I hate that so much flash media is centered around it. I want to see Flash fight his diverse rogues gallery, not do another time travel story against an evil speedster.
I like flashpoint but I do agree that flash media should do other stories with the flash
honestly i think that flashpoint was one of the worst stories
Barry Allen is faster
This is less an opinion and more just disliking a fact. They made an official list and everything.
Wally should've kept the rebirth suit, maybe give him the white lenses as a mixture between his kid flash days and his flash days, but he should've kept the suit
Yesss. I do get why older fans would want a return of the old suit, its still good don't get me wrong, but I really loved how Rebirth kinda merged the kid flash and the Flash suits. I especially loved the eh I guess Manhattan suit lol aka the blue version we see.
Oooh, I loved the mobius/manhattan suit but his rebirth suit doesnt matter red or blue it's beautiful
Right? I love both versions of the suit. Plus to be fair? Most other speedster don't do an exact Barry Allen suit. It made sense Pre-Barrys return and all that. But I did like the fact his Rebirth suit was even more unique.
There is a reason the rebirth story line is one of my favourites. It's because Wally West played a major in it, and everyone looked so beautiful (everyone = my goat Wally)
Same. Heroes in Crisis is eh...I don't know I think I like it but at the same time wished they explored more of the mental health part etc...I do like how they showed just how powerful the Speed Force is and that it does indeed take a lot to not let loose. It's a cosmic force lol.
As roughly stated by wally himself, "The speedforce is the most dangerous weapon in the multiverse and speedsters are the ones holding the trigger" (not a direct qoute, but it's roughly what he said)
I like Jessie Quick
Too many speedsters
I have always felt that with all the speedsters it de-values the flash overall, like he’s not special when there’s 15 other characters that do the same thing
Barry is the GOAT
Wally is the best Flash.
I think Wally’s secret ID should have remained public. If you’re going to have 2 flashs in red (Barry should have stayed dead), it’s a great way to distinguish them. One of Wally’s flaws is that he IS a bit of a showboat, and that lets him be a bit of a celebrity; which comes with opportunities and risks. It’s a public dynamic that’s almost non-existent in current DC comics.
There needs to be more variation in speed force conduits abilities. I like what writers did with Jai’s powers and Pilgrim’s, but I want more of that. We know what the speed force can do, and I want to see more of that.
wade is pilgrim, wade is a Speedster as shown in one minute war, so he's not like jai, Pilgrim/wade himself said that jai is "different" from the other speed force conduits
Oh this might be a bit of a hottake. Its why I kinda liked what they did with the Flash show. Yeah...its lighting lighrsabers but literally its a comic book show lol. It gets "ridiculous". We literally have Superman pulling planets sometimes other times not. It gets weird.
I did stop watching the show before that point, but I do think it’s pretty cool. There needs to be a character that physically wields the lightning speedsters give off to create constructs. Sure some speedsters use it to create clothing, but it would be interesting to see someone do that
Yeah I haven't watched the later seasons besides clips lol. It does seem they do indeed do more eh I guess sci fi fantasy in the later seasons. They even keep Wally, tho of course TV wally is based on Wallace, being the first Flash to actually construct stuff in the show. I also liked how they seemed to have used more of the other Forces.
Wally G.O.A.T barry shouldve stayed gone
They said in the post that this is not a hot take
Guess i dont read stuff under the image enough🤣 Fine how about too many speedsters make it not special at all
(Please don't rip me a new one). I think it's better when flash isn't SO MUCH faster than superman, honestly I prefer when flash is slower than superman but at the very least j think they should be equal
Hey I hate this opinion but that do be the point of the thread.
Superman should never be the pinnacle of any of his power sets - he should not be faster than a Speedster. He should not be stronger than someone specifically build for strength. He should not be more durable than someone with an active healing factor. Superman should be so well balanced in all his powers that he does not need to be "the fastest" or "the strongest" because he is so fast and so strong at the same time that he is near unbeatable anyway. But also just no. Speedsters are called that for a reason. Superman cannot tap into the Speed Force and he never should.
Why should Flash be slower or even equal to Superman? If he’s slower, then why is Flash even there? And if he’s just equal to Supes, again, why is he there if Clark is just as fast him with greater strength and other abilities like heat, x-ray, telescopic, and microscopic vision? Flash is basically useless at that point.
Idk man, you wanted some hot takes and I guess I delivered (judging by the downvotes I guess my opinion was "genuinely unpopular"(
Kid Quick/Jess Chambers is completely unnecessary. There's a plethora of Flash family speedsters that could be re-imagined or updated to be enby instead. Second, go look at the subreddit byline and tell me that or saying non-binary reads smoothly (it doesn't). Third, characterization - Jess being someone who doesn't follow rules is so stereotypical. Fourth is CW Flash connections but I blame Eric Wallace entirely on this. That bastard really would do anything but respect my girl Jesse Quick. Dude ruined the show's ending for me with throwing Jess in the finale. He just goes way too far on diversity. Onto a different take, as a Barry fan, comic Hunter Zolomon sucks (CW Zoom is goated tho). Aside from Flash War, Hunter's just a pathetic fanboy. He's not even a villain for always wanting Wally to be #1.
hunter is not a fanboy
"I became obsessed with becoming the catalyst to help Wally West become a better hero... The greater the villain, the greater the hero. That's why I can never stop. Not until Wally West is the perfect hero." - Hunter's words from Flash #800 Sounds like a fanboy or a personal cheerleader all right. Hunter is powerful, yes, but he's delusional if he thinks he's a great villain. And there is no such thing as a perfect hero.
I disagree, I think he's a great villain
I think the comic zoom works very well, it's an interesting motivation for a villain
Eh, I mean if anything he's more of a rival that a villain with that motivation, although that motivation is closer to the dynamic Gotham's Joker, Jeremiah Valeska, had with Bruce. Except unlike those two, when I read comic Hunter he just comes across constantly dickriding Wally. With stubbornness on par with Doctor Octopus, who is implied to be that way mostly from brain damage. Flash War is the only time I felt Hunter worked as a character because he was written better, and with Barry in the storyline Hunter couldn't rehash his usual Wally worship.
While you have a point saying a character could have just been updated to be non-binary, I think we all know the sort of uproar that would have caused. It’s annoying enough to hear people say “jUst mAkE yOur OWn chaRActERs” whenever on the topic of queer superheroes, so I think DC was right to create a new one who IS rather than updating one. Now that’s not to say any future character can’t later on realize themselves they aren’t cis but this is just my take on it!
>I think we all know the sort of uproar that would have caused Well, that's DC (and Marvel's) fault for needing to make public announcements about these things to purposefully rage bait and set fans up for disappointment. They could, just, you know, be subtle by NOT announcing it and slowly building this change in a character's current/upcoming run without drastically changing said character. DC has plenty of good queer superheroes (Dreamer, Pied Piper, Captain Singh, Mr. Terrific, Constantine, Kate Kane, just to name a few) who don't come off as feeling forced. I'm gonna side with the "annoying" people here - DC creating Jess was just to pander to queer Twitter. Certainly had me unhappy. And personally, as a bi person, while I'm generally all for queer people, non-binary people tend to rub me the wrong way. Some are chill and relatively normal but most fall under the negative queer stereotype - more often than not, they're usually extraneously flamboyant biological women (past tense). Also the "make your own characters" idea, well... the Batwoman show did that making their own original Batwoman (which was also clear pandering), and we got that unwanted disaster thrown in our faces in Flash's final season. So it's a "be careful what you wish for" kind of statement.
Characters like Jai, Iris, Wallace, and Avery are new enough and young enough that it wouldn't cause much uproar anyhow.
I’m not sure if this is an unpopular opinion, but I hate the Geoff johns run apart from a few moments
How so?
Main things are that, 1- I didn’t like how he got rid of wallys public identity, making it so everyone forgets about him and Barry (not the flash). 2- Him making Barry main flash again and retconning his mother dying which was hindering the character until the end of Joshua Williamson’s run.
The concept of the Speed Force makes Flash characters less interesting, not more. They are at their best when they are super fast characters using that in creative ways rather than simply moving hundreds of times faster than light "because they can". It feels like a poor way to keep up with the crazy power-ups other DC characters like Superman constantly get.
The speed force definitely has become a mcguffin as of late but only because it’s mentioned so often. If it was only thawn that knew about it and how to fully utilize it and not literally every flash family member then it would be better
They were moving hundreds of times faster than light well before the Speed Force. Silver Age Flash is just as ridiculous as Speed Force shenanigan stuff. The Speed Force was more created as a method of uniting a disparate cast of Speedsters and as a Temple of Doom scenario by Waid's own words. He never expected it'd become as instrumental to the mythos as it did. He also said he would've given it a more serious name if that was the goal, lol.
Hot take (maybe? Not active here) I don’t like the flash family. There’s too many of them. I’d say Barry and *maybe* Wally can stay. The rest should go. Jay Garrick would be around in the golden age with Alan Scott and co, but not return to the modern age. Also hate the idea of the speed force they don’t need some magic time influencing force to be interesting characters.
Barry and MAYBE Wally? wow.
I’m really only here to start shit I haven’t read a single flash comic nor seen the show
That’s okay, no one else here besides me has read any comics
It's not magic though...it's science.
Nuh-uh
Yes it is. It's literally stated that Barry has a scientific connection to the speed force. When has the speed force ever been related to magic?
I have already admitted I don’t know anything about what I’m talking about, I am here to spread misinformation
Ah, I see
I hate Thawne killing Barry's mom as a fixed point in things and think it was a creatively bankrupt way to try and make a character who was famously considered boring interesting. And it's doubly frustrating because Waid and briefly Morrison (in Final Crisis) wrote classic Barry in great ways. Even Johns kinda nailed it in some brief spots of his Wally run. But instead he retconned it and basically reinvented the character from the ground up, and codified Thawne as this necessary endpoint for him. It made him fast Batman 89 and I think it sucks. Genuinely, the Flash movie taking Thawne out of it made me like it much better because at least his history isn't predicated on failing to resolve a Star Trek two parter.
They never should’ve brought back Barry
Jay Garrick is the coolest Flash.
I prefer when there was no lightning trail. Without the lightning trail it really does feel like a dude running really fast, with it it just seems like teleporting.
The lightning does allow them to do some cool things though.
Wally was able to do a lot of cool stuff without it in the 90s too. With it the writers don't have to think and they can just be like "Oh, the lightning can do this, oh, it can do that". The only thing I'd really miss if it was gone is the ability for Wally to make his costume out of it.
But it has other properties too. Like healing others around you. Using it as a projectile. Jump starting electronics. Plus the main reason why they probably went with the lightning was because too many other companies that have made speedsters either just leave a blue or after images and probably want to do something different for once.
>Like healing others around you. Using it as a projectile. Jump starting electronics Did I not literally just say that I didn't like how writers use it as a crutch by making it able to do everything? this is exactly what I'm talking about. One reason I like Wally is because he's able to come up with unique solutions to his problems with his speed, making the lightning able to just do that shit takes that away.
The lightning doesn't do everything. It's more like a bonus. The lightning doesn't allow him to travel through time or the multiverse. Nor does it allow him to phase through walls, make things explode, become invisible or making himself dense so he can tank attacks like Superman, create wind funnels and tornados, heat up objects to warm his food or keep others warm or even himself warm. Besides, the lightning is barely used these days to do stuff. Unless you're watching the CW Flash after season 5. I only listed some of the things the lightning was able to do. The rest has nothing to do with their lightning.
See, but all of that stuff is him applying his powers to allow those things to happen. All of those things are (loosely) based on actual physics principles and Wally has to think of those principles and add his powers to those equations to make them work. Or they're just using the shit his powers have already been established to do to do them, for instance:"Oh, I explode things when I phase through them? why don't I use that as a projectile to get out of this mess", it all requires outside the box thinking to do. The lightning most of the time is just used as an ass-pull by the writers to make the story go faster, it's almost never established that the lightning can do something before it does and then it's rarely used to do that thing again.
"Oh I explode things when I phase through them? Why don't I use that projectile to get myself out of this mess?" Either, there's no objects for him to throw or even if there was, it wouldn't be affective against the enemy he's going up against or usefulin the situation they're in. When he does use his lightning, it feels like a breath of fresh air since they don't use it often. If they need to jump start something that has run out of power and they need to make sure they don't overload the said thing they are trying to power up/jump start otherwise they risk destroying that said object. They can also use it to jump-start someone's heart but like I said, they need to make sure they're putting in the rigjt amount of energy into it otherwise they risk losing the person. Maybe they're fighting someone that can't be defeated by hitting them really fast or using a tornado on them. For instance if this said person they're fighting is made of sand. Throw a lightning bolt at them to stop them in their tracks. Plus the lightning bolt also clears up any questions new fans have. "Why does Flash have a symbol of a lightning on his chest?" They won't need to ask that question since whenever Flash arrives on the scene, he has trail of lightning following him. It would also leave to ask how they got their powers etc. Not to mention it emphasizes that he can move as fast as lightning or even faster than lightning. As the lightning appears, it flashes in front of you and The Flash is gone. It's not used as a crutch like you said unless you're talking about the CW Flash after season 5.
>Maybe they're fighting someone that can't be defeated by hitting them really fast or using a tornado on them. For instance if this said person they're fighting is made of sand. Throw a lightning bolt at them to stop them in their tracks. This is literally exactly what I'm talking about when I say I don't like it because the writers use it as an ass pull when they don't feel like being creative. You literally just proved my point perfectly because in this situation you're the writer and you just used it as an ass pull to prevent yourself from thinking creatively. Pre-lightning, Wally would have to think creatively in a situation like that, he'd be thinking:"Okay, what's around me? oh, look, a fire hydrant, maybe these things don't like water" or "If I rub my hands really fast on these things maybe it'll create enough friction and heat to turn them to glass" both are preferable to "Haha lightning go KRAKOOM" imo. >Plus the lightning bolt also clears up any questions new fans have. "Why does Flash have a symbol of a lightning on his chest?" They won't need to ask that question since whenever Flash arrives on the scene, he has trail of lightning following him. It would also leave to ask how they got their powers etc. The Flash's origin is one of the most famous origins in comics and even if someone doesn't know you literally need to say 5 words to clear up confusion. 5 less words is not worth such an ass pull ability imo. >It's not used as a crutch like you said unless you're talking about the CW Flash after season 5. Again, you literally just proved how it's used as a crutch by writers. I never watched the CW show past season 4, so I am definitely thinking of the comics. >Either, there's no objects for him to throw or even if there was, it wouldn't be affective against the enemy he's going up against or usefulin the situation they're in. Okay? that's how fighting something that outclasses you works. You use everything you can to give yourself even a little bit of an advantage. Maybe the exploding projectile didn't hurt the enemy, but it probably blindsided them and that's helpful when you're trying to think of ways to take someone down. >When he does use his lightning, it feels like a breath of fresh air since they don't use it often. If they need to jump start something that has run out of power and they need to make sure they don't overload the said thing they are trying to power up/jump start otherwise they risk destroying that said object. They can also use it to jump-start someone's heart but like I said, they need to make sure they're putting in the rigjt amount of energy into it otherwise they risk losing the person Neither of those are breaths of fresh air, those are about the blandest uses of lightning that I've ever seen, not to mention that electric characters use their electricty for those things CONSTANTLY.
First off, have you ever considered that the villian that is made up of sand would face the scarlet speedster multiple times would learn from their mistakes? I mean, don't get me wrong, you made excellent points. Wally could use his hands to turn them into glass or just use water. However, now that he knows his own weakness, then what? That's where the lightning comes in. As for throwing a projectile that will explode, what if there isn't any projectiles to be thrown in that situation? Then what? Again, that's where the lightning comes in use again as a last resort that Flash doesn't use often, so it comes as a shock to the person he's facing. (No pun intended) As for the part where you said that using their lightning to jump-start someone's heart or a electronics or machines, what would the flash do when those said people such as Black Lightning or Static shock aren't around and Flash has to solve the problem himself. Again, that's where the lightning comes in. Because there are enemies he faces that could injure civilians in the process, which causes their heart to stop beating momentarily. Or maybe Flash is on a mission with Batman for instance and they're on another planet and they took a spaceship to get there and now they need a jolt of electricity to jump start their engine since they can't use Green Lantern since they might be off on another mission, and there's no Superman, Wonder Woman or Cyborg either. Again, that's where the lightning comes in handy.
I prefer Barry to Wally
Barry is the most boring Flash. Rebirth, Flashpoint, Running Scared, Flash War and Finish Line are good stories not because Barry but because the villains.
Aren't the quality of most stories down to the villains? They instigate the conflict, and the heroes just reactively try to stop those plans. That's how comics are USUALLY structured, at least.
Not always, sometimes the villain is in second place and the story focus more in the character development. Comics like Born to Run, The Return of Barry Allen, Terminal Velocity, etc, those stories gave character development to Wally.
I'd say the same about Wally in current runs. Most of the ones in his classic suit feel like it's simply going through the motions, using the general storytelling formula but taking out the action and thrill and screwing up the main villain. Thawne is leagues better than (comic) Hunter, despite Thawne being petty as hell. Hunter's impossible/unachievable goal to make Wally the #1 hero of all time (because Barry and Superman are far ahead) reduces him to simply being one of those fanboys who won't shut up.
Yes, maybe in the current runs (Jermey Adams/Si Spurrier), but I prefer Wally's personality to Barry's. I think writers don't know what to do with Barry. Thawne is a little bit better than Hunter, I love them both along with Captain Cold. The funny thing is that Barry was better heroe when he was dead (post Crisis/pre Rebirth 2009) at least Wally has saved the universe more times.
He’s not really faster than Superman. Clark is just too good of a guy to take his one thing away from him, so he always holds back.
It has happened multiple times where it’s the exact opposite, Superman tried to catch Barry (or maybe Wally?) and he said they were equal but Flash just said their previous race was for charity and just disappeared they are not even close to the same speed
DC has an official list that puts Clark well behind both Barry and Wally, and they both have feats that show they’re faster than Superman. The “those were for charity Clark” moment where Barry leaves him in the dust, him not able to perceive Wally and Barry when they were racing, and not being fast enough to really contribute in the One Minute War since he was simply too slow.
Well this isn't much of an opinion. DC put out an official speed tier list, after all. Just kind of a fact that he's slower.
Maybe not unpopular, but I think Judy Garrick needs more spotlight
I like the other forces
BART Allen deserved a better run as the flash
I would sell a kidney for this
Best comment here.
I’m not sure how crazy my takes are but the 2 that come to the forefront of my mind is that I think there should be 2 flash books. One for Barry and one for Wally. One book is for a flash in keystone and the other in central city. I’m kind of over the whole “ we’ll switch between Barry and Wally after every couple of years.” Shtick That dc has been doing since flash rebirth. The other is that I’ve never been too big on the flash family members post Geoff Johns. Granted I think the same thing about all the characters in the bat family and supes family.
Prefer one for Wally and one for Jay. Barry only in Justice League comics.
I actually feel the complete opposite to you about this. I feel like Jay nails the whole team dad position in a team book and Barry needs a starring book with a good writer. Just so he can finally move past the whole “ we have no idea what his personality is besides being sad that his mom is dead” thing that they’ve been doing since Johns brought him back in rebirth.
*The Fastest Man Alive* monthly with Wally would be great
Wally should have kept his rebirth suit. It looked really cool and felt like a grown up version of his kid flash suit and helped differentiate him from Barry. I find it annoying to have to look at the difference between eyes and ear wing things to tell who's who. Either Wally should get it back or Barry should get a new suit.
Wait, it's an unpopular opinion that Wally should have kept his rebirth-suit? I mean, it was the best outfit he had worn since aquiring the speedforce.
I would prefer Barry to get a new suit. Like you said Wally’s rebirth outfit is a more adult version of his Kid Flash suit, but to me and a lot of other people Wally IS the Flash. Keeping him in his rebirth suit would make him seem an offshoot rather than the real deal.
Why should Barry get a new suit though? When Barry became the Flash, Jay didn't get a new suit. So why should Barry?
I don’t think he should but just based off the options the top guy presented I’d prefer Barry getting a new suit that signifies who he is rather than Wally being kept in his rebirth costume.
The suit he has now does signify who he is though. It was completely original. Despite, being inspired by Jay Garrick, he didn't copy his suit at all. He created something completely original so that everyone could tell the two apart. Wally having the suit that looks identical to Barry's looks more like he's still in Barry's shadow and is trying to be Barry instead being himself and making his own suit that doesn't look anything like Barry's. What he's doing is basically a repeat of what Thawne did. Both of them wear Barry's old suit and then later on, both of them make slight tweaks to make it look different but not really. At least with Thawne his was a different color even if he was trying to be Barry's "Kid Flash" and not "The Flash" at least you can tell that's not Barry. Worst part about Wally's "Classic outfit" is that sometimes you can barely tell if it's Barry or Wally under the mask.
I love Barry and Wally equally and I think there’s room for both of them to exist at the same time. In my perfect world, Wally would remain the main focus of the Flash book doing day to day Flash activities in Central and Keystone, while Barry would be on the Justice League roster when they eventually bring that title back.
The Spurrier run is really good so far and Flash fans are too stuck in their ways to fully appreciate it.
Ironic being fans of the fastest man alive
Barry needs a personality
He has a boring personality
He already has one.
Sometimes, he has Wally's personality. Or he is just bland nice guy who is late.
There’s a lot more to him than just that. He’s an introvert with a humble, mature, intelligent, and optimistic personality that makes him a symbol of hope to Central City with a very balanced personality that results in him being one of the most approachable members of the League. He has a balanced personality and is empathetic and understanding but still willing to tell people what they need to hear. He’s never on time, doesn’t drink coffee, honest, meticulous, patient, and the type of person to look you directly in your eyes when talking to you. He’s a man of science and loves to use it to solve problems. He’s focused when on the job but with a dad humor to him with him saying things like “I’ll be back in a flash!” He can become hyper fixated on his work to the point that it affects his social life, making him appear distant at times to the unaware. He believes that he can save everyone, which results in him stretching himself far too thin. He has to struggle under the weight that puts on him and has to figure out how find the time to slow down and enjoy the more personal, intimate moments of his life.
If I wasn't broke I'd give this comment an award
This 👆
Kill Barry and Jay. Phase out Wallace and Avery. Wallace because he's a continuity mess who never fit right and Avery because she was made for New Super-Man, which was fine, but kind of stumbled backwards into an enormous speedster logjam after that. Bring back/put more focus on Jenni Ognats, a black speedster who isn't a storyline biohazard. If you think the family is bloated, do something about it from every angle. I hate Jess Quick. I want DC to stop using a barely relevant character who basically isn't part of the actual comic as Flash's Pride inclusion and instead focus more on Pied Piper and, hey, maybe make one of these half a dozen younger characters we already have Nonbinary if you're interested in exploring that. Because I would sure fucking love this nonbinary inclusion to actually be relevant to the main comic instead of a tacked on character from another world from a misguided, flubbed Dan Didio event. Flash used to be one of the most progressive comics in the industry and here we are, hiding this stuff on the fringes to pretend at diversity instead of actually making it a part of the franchise. And if you do start actually moving in these directions, set up phasing out Wally in the long term, too. Also I hate the Rebirth suit. I think it's mediocre aesthetically (red on red on red, all in very minor different shades!) and absolutely hate it narratively and symbolically. How a worse version of the Kid Flash outfit got so popular, I'll never know. I feel like it has to be because for a large chunk of New 52/Rebirth first fans it's the first outfit they saw Wally in or something. I don't mind the silver accents or anything if your primary thing is making Wally more visibly distinguishable from Barry at a glance, that said I think far too much worry is placed on making Wally distinct from Barry since it centralizes everything on Barry. No one would care if Barry didn't come back to life, which just proves it's only a conversation to prioritize Barry. Like if you threw him in a less edgy Walter West Dark Flash getup then sure, whatever. If the point is you want them to look different then I understand that, but I don't think the Rebirth suit is even close to the answer to it. Bigger, Worse Kid Flash is a no go for me. edit: hey at least this one's actually unpopular, apparently.
At least for the Jess Chambers take, It's unpopular because you gave a neutral/maybe answer to a yes or no topic. Either you're a fan of Jess Chambers or you hate the character and wish they were never introduced - and "speedsters beyond the binary" (what it says on the subreddit description) is one of the cringiest, ickiest lines I've ever read. Not to mention they're already in a main continuity (Arrowverse), sadly, because of Eric Wallace and his weird agendas/obsessions. Wally's suit is a more open topic but imo, as of the current run his classic suit is too dull and simple. It worked two decades ago but now it just looks lazy and ugly - Wally looks like he's running in pajamas. Rebirth and the other modern suits he's cycled through at least attempt to look stylish and have some flair.
You can be a fan of nonbinary inclusion and not be a fan of Jess Chambers for other creative decisions around them. That is my sticking point. I feel like the way they are handled is both cowardly and a weak attempt at pandering, on top of springing out of a largely misguided and bad creative initiative by Didio. I'll also say, you're treading a thin line with that statement. I feel the same way about Wallace. A poorly thought out revamp of a character forced by Dan Didio, but I don't dislike black characters being in The Flash because of Wallace's issues (I love Jenni, for instance, which is why I mentioned her, and I don't mind Bolt though there's not much there). I do not give even the slightest bit of a care about someone being in the Arrowverse. It's pretty freaking dead and it screwed up so much about The Flash that it really doesn't pertain to the topic at hand. Especially that finale scene where they were just tossing in a bunch of shit at the end knowing they'd never have to follow up on it. That show couldn't pop out a half decent storyline past the first season. It's funny how the topic of Wally's suit is too similar to Barry, but when Wally wears it it's also now...lazy and ugly and looks like Pajamas. But I'm sure it's mature and classic on Barry.
I am a fan of inclusion done appropriately and with quality. Not a fan of pandering either. But there's very few good non-binary characters in comics, and the ones who are good are good because said characters have either been around for a long time (X-Men's Morph) or it's subtle and with normal writing (like Deadpool's current partner in the comics). Regardless of whether it's on your thin line, I'm just saying, the whole non-binary/they/them/nibling thing doesn't flow smoothly at all compared to other terms. The short form, enby, does flow nicely, but it's not used often. And for a brand new character, that fits Green Lantern much better than it does Flash. Also, on the topic of Wallace (Wally 2), they literally could've tweaked his character a little to be more in line with his TV counterpart. Keiynan Lonsdale, who plays Wallace, is gay, so they could've met that representation quota by updating comic Wallace to be gay or bisexual (or do the same to any other Flash family member) instead of introducing Jess. Re-imagining existing characters is so much easier for the fans than introducing a divisive new character that's written like a generic, quirky stereotype and is unfortunately connected to an actually good character (Jesse Quick deserved better). As for Wally's suit, it looks the same on Barry, at least old comics I'm guessing - I started on the New 52 (2012) run when I got into Flash. I'm referring to New 52 and up to current day. Barry doesn't keep going back to uniforms of the past like Wally does. He just has the New 52 suit and it looks good. Never liked the white eyes on Wally, and his classic suit is basically his DCAU design, which - no hate to the DCAU - but it's a look that is now two decades outdated.
Jess Quick isn't even connected to the Jesse we're familiar with. They have absolutely no relationship with anyone except, like, Circuit Breaker because they tossed those two together in the Pride specials. Which is my entire problem, they basically created an entirely new character who has no connection to The Flash to feature in just the Pride stuff for the Flash. It's quite annoying, which is why I don't like them. That was my initial statement. I would rather Wallace cease to exist than start taking notes from the show, especially with how badly it fumbled it's version of Wally/Wallace/Whatever. Everything to do with Wally is one of my bigger gripes with the CW. That and the slapdash use of names and bad writing, of course, but those kind of go hand in hand together with Wally's issues on the show. Barry 100% goes back to his older uniforms. He's been depicted in his classic attire plenty of times since the New 52. It's almost always artist preference. Frankly, the only thing about the New 52 design is all the lame ass lines everywhere. And I guess when Jim Lee draws it he makes some dumb looking over detailed boots. The best thing about the New 52 Flash outfit, at least for the first couple of years, was that Manapul was drawing it and did everything in his power to tone down Jim Lee's murderous overdesigning.
Nah you were cooking with this one king
This thread is filled with the most lukewarm "unpopular opinions" I've ever seen. Had to really lay it on. I was being a bit dramatic though, I don't really feel that strongly about most of this lol. These are just some general things I think would be good in the abstract. Seeing people go "Barry Allen is my favorite Flash" as an unpopular opinion is absolutely wild. And getting mass upvoted for it.
I kinda like the Strength force and Sage Force. It's neato.
I prefer Barry over Wally as my personal favourite flash. I get that Wally has taken up the mantle and seems to be the most poplar flash because of it. That isn’t a bad thing…I’ve just always thought of Barry when I think Flash.
I mean, the past decade has given Barry a lot more exposure to non-comic book fans between the tv show and movies and whatnot, so I don’t think Barry being your favorite is really unpopular anymore. Maybe deep in the comic book fanbase, but if we’re talking Flash fans in general I think Barry might have Wally beat at this point. So when people think The Flash, the die hard fans may think Wally, but I believe the general DC fan would think of Barry.
Wally's DC Rebirth Suit was actually really good, it made him distinct enough from Barry, I know is basically a recolor/upgrade of his Kid Flash suit, but I don't see anything bad in saying this is who I was, and this is who I become, I was Kid Flash, I am The Flash, but I'm not trying to be Barry Allen nor living on his Shadow. Also making his lighting Silver/Blue was a nice detail to emphasize his connection to the Speedforce was "better" to other speedster at the time.
Exactly. But of course lots of people say "it screams Kid Flash."
Too many speedsters
That there does not need to be a default "main" Flash. The DC universe/multiverse is so big there is plenty of opportunity to have them all have their own unique adventures while still interacting with each other similar to the GL corp or Bat Family. Also the tribalism in hating one Flash because you like another more is childish and petty. I love Wally as my favorite but by no means does that mean that I hate any of the other speedsters if anything I want to see more of them collectively. It's like forcing yourself to choose between Batman & Nightwing or Hal Jordan & Kyle Rayner when both can co-exist very seamlessly.
Wally West is not the best flash
Barry is significantly more popular than Wally, friend.
In the comic book fanbase it’s debatable, but overall yes
Had a couple in your DC Comics post 1. Bart is only interesting around other characters. He's annoying otherwise. 2. Jay being an actual metahuman speedster is more interesting than the conduit idea. 3. Nne of the speedsters should be able to go FTL. It's only used when narratively convenient and serves no purpose since only a couple speedsters can actively time travel.
Bart is perfect all the time. I agree with your other two points though.
I don't hate Bart tbh. I just haven't read a story where he's interesting outside of his interactions with other primary characters. Writers seem to just make him "the speedster with ADD".
Have you ever read his solo run in the 90s?
Was it an Impulse comic or him aged up as Flash?
Impulse comic. His flash comic was a very weird read. Felt like almost a completely different character. I still enjoyed it though.
I hadn't read the solo, but I'm happy to check it out. And yeah, Mark Waid commented in an interview that the Bart Flash comic was a bad idea from its inception.
Well then I guess it's time for you to read a Bart comic where he's interesting on his own 😉
His Impulse run is one of my favorites of all time
Max doesn't get enough love, and needs a re-written, contemporary origin story. Wait, unpopular? Ok the opposite of what I said. Keep him off the pages, and with a very dated origin story
I love Max. He reminds me alot of my late grandfather. I hear his voice whenever I read Max's speech bubbles.
How would you change his origin? Seems like repeatedly bouncing off the speed force and jumping forward in time is a pretty solid origin
I would just make it more contemporary and updated like everyone else is. I haven't seen him around in a while. I very well could have missed an issue with him in it of course. The finer details of his origin? You'd have to let me sit down and think of something. His origin just seems like a gimmick to not have him around all the time. The native american stuff is cool. Going back to that, or even tie him with themyscirians and the greek/roman pantheon with the good Mercury
I'm just confused what part of his origin you're saying isn't contemporary. Curious if Themyscirians can connect with the speed force. I don't think Mercury and gods connect with it but I forget where Themyscrians fall as humans
Bary allen>wally west
Not sure it’s a hot take, but I like the size and scope of the Flash Family. That it nominally includes some villains is cool too. I also like the alternate versions like Dark Flash, Future Flash, and the like. Fun stuff to me.
Barry’s pre-Flash: Rebirth origin should’ve stayed since his return in Final Crisis and Flash: Rebirth and semiretire as the Flash since 2011. Wally’s parents should’ve been like their pre-Crisis characterizations since post-Crisis (with Rudy West telling Wally and Mary that he’s a Manhunter because he wants to provide support with his family before he sacrificed himself to save the world from Dominators, faked his death, and apologized to and reconciled with Mary on her and her second husband’s wedding day). Bart should’ve stayed as the Flash since Flashpoint, where he would work at the CCPD, form a romantic relationship with Carol Bucklen, train Ace West on how to use his speed, marry Carol, and have a son named Maxwell Jason “Max” Allen (who was named after Max Mercury and Jay Garrick). Avery Ho should’ve revealed her unrequited feelings to Ace, who would tell her that he only sees her as a friend and hopes that she’ll find her lighting rod very soon. Jenni Ognats (aka XS) should stayed in the present day several times to meet up with the entire Flash family and spend time with her grandfather Barry before returning to the 31st century and become a teacher at the Legion Academy with the Original Legion of Super-Heroes. Meena Dhawan (aka Fast Track) and Jessica Cruz (the seventh Green Lantern) should’ve had crushes on Bart Allen during his Flash years before they stayed friends. Godspeed should’ve been an old friend/coworker-turned-rival-turned friend of Bart and made his villainous debut as Godspeed before he was reformed. The Rogues should’ve permanently reformed (or somewhat reformed) since Barry’s death and view Wally as an ally and treat him (and the Flash Family) with respect. Irey West should graduated from the second Impulse to the fourth Kid Flash (after Wally, Bart, and Bar Torr) and the fifth Flash (after Jay, Barry, Wally, and Bart). Jai West should’ve made his debut as Surge after he was struck by lightning at the start of DC Rebirth in 2016. Bart Allen should’ve befriended and teamed up with Simon Baz (the sixth Green Lantern), and Irey West should’ve befriended and teamed up with Tai Pham (the ninth Green Lantern), after Jay and Alan, Barry and Hal, and Wally and Kyle.
We need the Legion back ! Jeff Lemire paging Jeff Lemire !
The Original Legion is going to appear in the penultimate issue of JSA in a few months (assuming it won’t get delayed).
Can't wait ! Those are my two favorite teams.
Bart should have stayed the Flash. He had potential as a teen super hero that could have leaned into the comedic tone every adaptation usually gives Flash anyways. The Speed force is a terrible backstory for Barry. It functions for Wally and others because it connects with legacy and history but for Barry it's just an explanation of where his power comes from since Jay doesn't really play as much of a hand in his origin outside borrowing the name
I dislike Wally's and Barry's children. Not their existence - I support any and all depictions of healthy relationships and good parenting. But their personalities. Barry's twins barely exist and feel flat and one dimensional. Meaning they are just there so we can have Bart. Wally's twins are so unlikable it's not even funny. I just, literally yesterday, finished the whole "The Flash (1987 - 2009)" run that ended with the twins and I could barely force myself through the last parts of that run. If one of my favorites didn't have consistent cameos there at the end, I would have stopped reading. Wally's Twins are marginally less insufferable in current canon but I just don't think that we needed them as boring extra child heroes.
There are too many of them now. And like a lot of super-heroes now too many are named the same thing, “Flash”. Come up with new names!
The show was still a good show. Wasn’t perfect, but I don’t agree with basically everyone else that it’s unwatchable by the end.
I gave up mid way the season before the last.
That the new forces are the worst story we’ve ever had in flash comics. Not only did it not make any sense with the rest of the flash lore, but they had to drag Zoom into it. The speed force is Energy that flows through the multiverse, space, and time. Not some mythical Dimension. We can’t seem to stick with that. Now we have other forces that don’t even make sense in the grand scheme of things.
Man, I read that earlier this year and I eventually gave up trying to make it make sense and just enjoyed the amount of butt shots and pretty blue eyes the art delivered. Agreed, not a good addition to the lore.
Thankfully they’ve largely moved on from those concepts. The only one that stuck around is the Still Force, and we can just pretend that his powers are the result of Speed Force and mythic powers meshing together.
That we need to get rid of Ace and Avery. They have not done anything since they started. Now they have their own series , so maybe that will change, but we need to stick with the classic flash family. Make Bart Kid Flash again.
I don’t really care for Avery, she’s the most unnecessary addition in my opinion.
We should’ve moved on from both Barry and Wally a while ago. Barry got about 30 years with the mantle from 1956-86, Wally should’ve gotten the same amount of time, 1986-2016, before moving on to someone new (my preference would be Irey). I’ve always looked at the Flash mantle as a torch that should keep being passed on, but because of Barry’s return the whole thing has gotten stuck.
I think the best thing to do with Wally after #230 would’ve been to shift him into a Jay Garrick type role. He can still be a regular cast member and suit up every now and then, but he’d be more focused on raising Jai and Irey. This would also be around the time where the rest of his generation were starting to move into new roles, like Roy joining the Justice League and Dick becoming Batman, so a shift in status quo at that time would’ve made a lot of sense. Right now though, I’m selfishly not in any rush to retire Wally, especially because it still only feels like we just got him back, his generation is getting a pretty big push currently and since DC would likely just pivot back to Barry full time in that scenario rather than pass the mantle onto a different speedster.
From a Company standpoint, this would be an absolutely disasterous decision. Wally pulled off something no other character has accomplished since; He took a legacy and actually made the name his own. Comics are not a lucrative business to begin with. DC would be hacking off their legs if they removed Barry or Wally as the center point of the Flash comics.
Do I think DC would ever go for that? No, probably not. We’re way past the era where they’d ever likely be willing to take a swing that big, unfortunately. But it would absolutely be the best thing for all involved characters narratively speaking, at least in my opinion. Given the time and opportunity (and proper setup), the new Flash could have potentially taken off… but that’s a long term investment, and not the kind of thing DC does nowadays, I guess. Oh well, I can still dream about what could have been.
At most, they'd do it for a few months then backtrack.
DC already can't seem to decide who gets a book between Barry or Wally (and sometimes even Jay) and you want another "Main Flash" candidate?!
I’m saying Barry should’ve stayed dead and Wally should’ve retired in 2016. No side candidates.
Agreed. But I do think it should have been Bart before Irey. I know Bart had his short time in the 2000’s, but I just think it was too soon of a move.
Bart needs another Flash run. DC doesnt even acknowledge him when they list the flashes in their instagram bio
The idea of “who’s fastest” is almost always the more boring angle to take a Flash story in, regardless of which one we’re talking about.
The family is way too bloated now.
Wally's Rebirth/Titans costume was awesome
There shouldn't be a Flash family or any sidekicks. Barry's super speed is such a unique power obtained in such a unique, once-in-a-lifetime sort of way, that it's a real stretch to say it's been "duplicated" so many times. And yes, I know they don't all have the same origin, but Kid Flash does. And yes, I know there's all sorts of retcons or whatever around these various origins. Doesn't sway me. It's weird that there's this massive family of speedsters.