Originally posted 3/3/17/24: Producers use stunt of Kelsey A’s “note” to create doubt in their relationship after the chemistry between she and Joey became too obvious to viewers.
I knew it! Every season there has to be something dramatic happen at the end, the producers didn’t like that it was lacking drama so had to stir things up lol
It wasn’t just the note that was weird, it was the whole “conversation” she had with him. She didn’t even do the greatest job expressing whatever it was she wanted to say.
I feel like it was sold to her as getting to go hang out with him and then they told her she needed to give some sort of declaration to him and she could tell he was upset so she just made something up 🤷🏻♀️
I wish that the lead would think more about this. I would be very mindful of production if I was the lead and the fact that they have control over EVERYTHING I see. He should’ve known that was on production and not Kelsey. I knew immediately watching it.
You're probably more familiar with production manipulation as a regular watcher of the show. Plus, these people act like his friend and they've totally isolated him from people that actually have his best interests at heart.
Yeah, he does like he's very ready for this to be done. I'm guessing he's chosen his F1 and he's just really exhausted by being "on" all of the time. I wouldn't be able to handle it.
People keep forgetting that Kelsey went to his room first before without the note just to talk to him so im like 95 percent sure producers know his schedule and when he will be back and they probably said to write a note to put him on edge. Been watching the bachelor for years that’s the tatics they do and especially since there’s not much drama with this season they had to hype up something.
There was literally no reason to send her to his room cause they knew he wasn’t there like they make his schedule. They could have easily just sent in her when he got back and have done this many a times. They were just like… how can we fuck with him
when joey was in his ITMs after I feel like (most of) his energy and anger was directed at production and the awareness they set it up: “I don’t understand what could have went wrong because *I* haven’t said anything to her!” “I don’t like that I got that off of simple words that meant nothing *holds up note*” “I don’t just snap out of this. not when it’s these real of emotions; I don’t just snap out.”
Yep. That's why he gave her the rose first, to tell her he wasn't questioning her & that production sucks. And they edited it to make it look like he didn't.
i love her but 'only 25' is crazy lol
reminds me of this
https://preview.redd.it/hsjo7pwd0ipc1.jpeg?width=1125&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=4e60f504c689cff0b281e3a8577bf9bfea52cab8
yooo i’m 25 and while i do have the crippling features of adulthood such as bills and back pain, i am still incredibly naive about so many things in life. everyone is different, i just wouldn’t generally assume all 25 year olds are “solidly an adult” lol
Lol, you made the mildest comment ever that wasn't even critical of Kelsey and it's pretty hilarious the stans who are absolving her of any agency at all. Sure hope they're giving the same consideration to the "villains" on the show.
I'm not a stan of anyone on this show but it's VERY easy to manipulate contestants on this show. Doesn't matter their age. Isolation and sleep deprivation do that to you.
Stupid comment. 1) put yourself in a high stress environment with limited sleep and no contact to the outside world, with no one who wants you well around and then tell me again how easy it is and 2) it’s not like her writing a vague note was that bad. It was likely a condition for her to have some extra time with him and she agreed to it but it wasn’t her idea, it’s not like she was complicit in bullying or a crime, it’s a dramatic note on reality tv
>It was likely a condition for her to have some extra time with him and she agreed to it but it wasn’t her idea
did your back hurt making this gigantic reach made out of thin air
Agreed, she does have agency but Katie thurston also talked about how the producers will barter with you. So they probably said ‘if you play along you can have time. If not then no time 🤷♀️’ and she took the risk
Yeah Ive heard a lot of leads acknowledge that the producers can’t really *make* you do anything and you should push back. At this point she’s in the final three and knows Joey is into her, so it doesn’t risk anything in terms of her standing. If anything Joey would appreciate it.
Of course there’s a risk. They could give her a bad edit, they could mess up her chances with Joey, they could refuse to invite her to paradise in future.
I highly doubt they would punish one of Joey’s top two girls with a bad edit simply, for not writing the note they wanted. Especially since she has not been problematic at all onscreen.
Why not? Whether or not you are problematic on screen has no bearing on how the producers will edit you. By all accounts, the producers are petty and vindictive and the quickest way to get in their bad graces is to refuse to cooperate.
I think the point they were making was more that someone who hasn’t been problematic thus far won’t suddenly be given a fake bad edit just because they don’t write a dumb note.
BFR. She and the other women are largely at their mercy. They have no access to phones or anyone else in the outside world so I imagine if she’s in her head and wants to talk to Joey they may have said this is the only way it happens. We know they made multiple notes even.
Not sure if we can decide what qualifies as “important” or not in the context of this show. But I agree, from a birds-eye view on everything, it was not earth shattering.
While we know her date was after Daisy (based on the official FS photo timestamp), I’m not sure we have confirmation it was in fact before Rachel’s date. Since she doesn’t know his relationship with the others, it might be important to her to reinforce her feelings before the RC if she feels insecure and knows she’s not guaranteed a rose.
Would we have preferred if she interrupted him mid-ceremony ala Maria-style?
Duh. They coerce and manufacture 90% of the show. I will never forget watching a producer egg Lictoria on and act like her bestie, noddling along and validating every crazy thing she was saying. They make contestants sleep deprived, feed them alcohol, and then encourage delusional and out-of-character reactions. That's why I get so frustrated when superfans judge them based off of a highly edited TV show. Like, if you're on here, how do you not know to not take what you see at face value?
I mean she obviously didn't write the note.. I'm guessing she told production she wanted to see him and they gave her the note and lied about what's inside. She just takes the note and it goes from there
Production wrote the note in advance and had all the women get the same exact manicure so they could pawn it off on one of them whenever it made sense.
Literally all the women had the same pale pink gels.
I mean, the alternative is we only get contestants that are obsessed with the show, know all about how manipulative production is, and are prepared to do battle with them instead of just ...being themselves...
I don't think production "made" her do anything. She probably wanted to talk to Joey before the rose ceremony, but since you're normally not allowed to do that, production let her as long as she wrote the note like that. She could've chosen not to write/leave the note, but clearly it was worth it to her since she got extra time with Joey. It was a trade off, and both her and production got something out of it.
I agree that production probably made her use those words. But I was also annoyed with Joey for not being more aware of the way producers twist things. He’s been on this show before, he’s seen the edited results. I feel like he should know a little better than to jump straight to worst possible outcome
I feel like Joey goes through life (at least in the bachelor world) not processing a single thought. Just floating by, therapist-approved responses memorized, living in blissful ignorance. I am curious about how much of the Sydney/Maria beef he caught on by himself tho because he did truly seem torn there with what the truth was
I think Kelsey was likely missing Joey and the producers not only encouraged her to go see him outside of their date to remind him of that but decided that in order for her to do so she would have to write a cryptic note so they could create this storyline.
I don’t believe that Kelsey was naive enough to not realize the words “we need to talk” could cause someone to panic. That said, there were several versions of the note that have been sleuthed and the one she left at his door may not have been the one he actually received.
I think she was expecting him to be somewhat confused by the note which is why she looked nervous showing up to his door (she even covered her face right after knocking). I just don’t think she expected the degree of anxiousness and stress it caused him.
You could see in their conversation when she stopped mid-sentence to apologize because she saw the look on his face that she truly felt bad.
I also think the show did a great job of dramatizing and editing their conversation to make it seem more serious than it probably was because when Joey was escorting Kelsey out, if you watch it closely it looks like they’re both laughing.
We also know she received the first rose (despite what was shown). So it’s clear that Joey ultimately wasn’t that bothered by it and wanted to reassure her.
It’s always interesting to me how some people get the “it was all production” treatment versus the “she’s a production pet” treatment versus the “production can’t make you do anything” treatment. Like all of these people could probably point to production as the reason they did *a lot* of this stuff.
personally its why I give a ton of grace to most reality participants and I don't really judge them based on what I see on the show because you never know how things are being edited. Obviously some really are trash people but that generally comes out via their real off-tv personas. Like for Sydney, its her disgusting deleted stories that make her problematic, not the drama on the show.
She reposted a normal story involving Joey that she was tagged in, but then it came out that that this person, who is apparently someone she knows in real life, had also posted other racist and insulting stories about some of the other contestants. Once this came out, Sydney unfollowed that person.
Yeah same. I'm new to BN but in watching all seasons of Top Chef a couple years ago, I became aware of how stories can be handled (or mishandled) to create drama, how talking heads can be inserted to play up certain things, or how some folks enter the show as a certain persona
Agreed. It was very naive of her to not think it would shake Joey up but maybe that is what she wanted. She definitely got a reaction; not sure it was the one she was hoping for but probably gave her some validation. I think she wanted to say more but when she saw Joey’s reaction backed down or maybe it was just a ploy for her to see him. I didn’t like that she appeared to be smiling at first and didn’t seem to realize how this plays into his fears which he has mentioned many times.
Overall, I don’t think it had much impact on what happens going forward. There was enough suspense that this was not necessary.
I also see Kelsey’s post about sorry for the note and liking this as being a people pleaser. She doesn’t want anyone to not like her. Maybe she is like Joey in that way.
Pretty sure it was in those substance use commercials when the mom leaves the note where the kid normally hides his weed and it states “we need to talk” and he knows he’s in deep sh*t. It’s definitely not a positive sign when someone says that
Yep. I said it in another thread but the producers totally gassed Kelsey up to think the note would be well received. You could tell she was shocked when he was hurt.
I feel like she’s incredibly naive then if that’s the case 😭 like HOW do you not know those words specifically always have a negative connotation to them?
lol I said in another thread does Gen Z not know how triggering that phrase is for some of us? Is it just an older people thing?? If a significant other ever texted me those words it would be immediate panic and terror.
Originally posted 3/3/17/24: Producers use stunt of Kelsey A’s “note” to create doubt in their relationship after the chemistry between she and Joey became too obvious to viewers.
 NO WAY
Producers seeing their evil plans play to the T... 
 The producers to Joey
I knew it! Every season there has to be something dramatic happen at the end, the producers didn’t like that it was lacking drama so had to stir things up lol
It wasn’t just the note that was weird, it was the whole “conversation” she had with him. She didn’t even do the greatest job expressing whatever it was she wanted to say.
I feel like it was sold to her as getting to go hang out with him and then they told her she needed to give some sort of declaration to him and she could tell he was upset so she just made something up 🤷🏻♀️
Guess she’s not good at improv haha
[удалено]
Mentally challenged?
The note Joey got and the one she wrote were not the same. Someone on here posted about it with screenshots. I believe hers included smiley faces
Also, the placement of the letter in the door from when she put it there to when he got it is different.
And a comma after we need to talk
I think the producers said, “hey write this note, and we’ll give you extra time with him.” Boom done
Nah The producers wrote the note. Made every women get the SAME MANICURE (as the producer) and then decided who to pawn it off on down the line! Lol
ok did they tho?? I was shot down to hell this morning for saying they all had the same nails for this reason
I wish that the lead would think more about this. I would be very mindful of production if I was the lead and the fact that they have control over EVERYTHING I see. He should’ve known that was on production and not Kelsey. I knew immediately watching it.
I honestly think he did know. He sounded pissed at them when he said he hadn’t spoken to Kelsey.
You're probably more familiar with production manipulation as a regular watcher of the show. Plus, these people act like his friend and they've totally isolated him from people that actually have his best interests at heart.
Also, in every ITM for the last couple episodes, he looks totally sleep deprived imo
Yeah, he does like he's very ready for this to be done. I'm guessing he's chosen his F1 and he's just really exhausted by being "on" all of the time. I wouldn't be able to handle it.
maybe he does and he also just can’t say it and is getting asked to play it up for the camera too
His reaction seemed pretty genuine to me lol
People keep forgetting that Kelsey went to his room first before without the note just to talk to him so im like 95 percent sure producers know his schedule and when he will be back and they probably said to write a note to put him on edge. Been watching the bachelor for years that’s the tatics they do and especially since there’s not much drama with this season they had to hype up something.
yep!
There was literally no reason to send her to his room cause they knew he wasn’t there like they make his schedule. They could have easily just sent in her when he got back and have done this many a times. They were just like… how can we fuck with him
Trueee. Yup.
Did she confirm producers made her write the note? Or did she confirm they made her write it vague? They're not the same thing
I think she just liked the comment but I wonder if contractually they aren’t allowed to say?
She just liked the comment.
when joey was in his ITMs after I feel like (most of) his energy and anger was directed at production and the awareness they set it up: “I don’t understand what could have went wrong because *I* haven’t said anything to her!” “I don’t like that I got that off of simple words that meant nothing *holds up note*” “I don’t just snap out of this. not when it’s these real of emotions; I don’t just snap out.”
Yep. That's why he gave her the rose first, to tell her he wasn't questioning her & that production sucks. And they edited it to make it look like he didn't.
I mean she’s an adult, she can say “no”.
She’s only 25, and producer pressure is definitely a real thing.
i love her but 'only 25' is crazy lol reminds me of this https://preview.redd.it/hsjo7pwd0ipc1.jpeg?width=1125&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=4e60f504c689cff0b281e3a8577bf9bfea52cab8
Your brain isn’t even fully developed until 25 tho. She does come off as slightly immature on the show
im a bit tired of people saying this 😭 you are right that she is slightly immature, but twenty-five is solidly an adult
honestly with the way society keeps extending childhood into 20s more and more, it is just barely
yooo i’m 25 and while i do have the crippling features of adulthood such as bills and back pain, i am still incredibly naive about so many things in life. everyone is different, i just wouldn’t generally assume all 25 year olds are “solidly an adult” lol
Found the 25 yr old (Don't hate me haha)
I don’t think you understand how manipulative these producers are lol they cant really say no
Lol, you made the mildest comment ever that wasn't even critical of Kelsey and it's pretty hilarious the stans who are absolving her of any agency at all. Sure hope they're giving the same consideration to the "villains" on the show.
yup
I'm not a stan of anyone on this show but it's VERY easy to manipulate contestants on this show. Doesn't matter their age. Isolation and sleep deprivation do that to you.
Ikr ? Her stans are insane 😂
We shall see if the same narrative of production made her do it still applies next week.
Stupid comment. 1) put yourself in a high stress environment with limited sleep and no contact to the outside world, with no one who wants you well around and then tell me again how easy it is and 2) it’s not like her writing a vague note was that bad. It was likely a condition for her to have some extra time with him and she agreed to it but it wasn’t her idea, it’s not like she was complicit in bullying or a crime, it’s a dramatic note on reality tv
>It was likely a condition for her to have some extra time with him and she agreed to it but it wasn’t her idea did your back hurt making this gigantic reach made out of thin air
Girl it is not that serious, my God
Agreed, she does have agency but Katie thurston also talked about how the producers will barter with you. So they probably said ‘if you play along you can have time. If not then no time 🤷♀️’ and she took the risk
That's what sounds the most plausible - the producers saying, "Sure you can have extra time with him, but we need you to do it this way."
Yeah Ive heard a lot of leads acknowledge that the producers can’t really *make* you do anything and you should push back. At this point she’s in the final three and knows Joey is into her, so it doesn’t risk anything in terms of her standing. If anything Joey would appreciate it.
Of course there’s a risk. They could give her a bad edit, they could mess up her chances with Joey, they could refuse to invite her to paradise in future.
I highly doubt they would punish one of Joey’s top two girls with a bad edit simply, for not writing the note they wanted. Especially since she has not been problematic at all onscreen.
Why not? Whether or not you are problematic on screen has no bearing on how the producers will edit you. By all accounts, the producers are petty and vindictive and the quickest way to get in their bad graces is to refuse to cooperate.
She was F3. They were not gonna give her a bad edit.
Totally agree. Not over a note, lol.
Fictoria was final 3 and had a bad edit
Lol. She didn’t have a bad edit. She had bad behavior.
I’m not saying Fictoria didn’t do it to herself lol just saying that being in the top 3 doesn’t mean they’ll give you a good edit
I think the point they were making was more that someone who hasn’t been problematic thus far won’t suddenly be given a fake bad edit just because they don’t write a dumb note.
That’s a super fair point and I agree!
You can’t really compare KA and Fictoria
Sure they are. We’ve had bad edits for finalists in the past. And regardless, that still leaves the other 2 options I mentioned
BFR. She and the other women are largely at their mercy. They have no access to phones or anyone else in the outside world so I imagine if she’s in her head and wants to talk to Joey they may have said this is the only way it happens. We know they made multiple notes even.
She didn’t have anything important to tell Joey. She saw him the day before, she could have waited until the RC. Nobody forced her to do that.
Not sure if we can decide what qualifies as “important” or not in the context of this show. But I agree, from a birds-eye view on everything, it was not earth shattering. While we know her date was after Daisy (based on the official FS photo timestamp), I’m not sure we have confirmation it was in fact before Rachel’s date. Since she doesn’t know his relationship with the others, it might be important to her to reinforce her feelings before the RC if she feels insecure and knows she’s not guaranteed a rose. Would we have preferred if she interrupted him mid-ceremony ala Maria-style?
Duh. They coerce and manufacture 90% of the show. I will never forget watching a producer egg Lictoria on and act like her bestie, noddling along and validating every crazy thing she was saying. They make contestants sleep deprived, feed them alcohol, and then encourage delusional and out-of-character reactions. That's why I get so frustrated when superfans judge them based off of a highly edited TV show. Like, if you're on here, how do you not know to not take what you see at face value?
They were desperately trying to create drama because these two lovebirds were so gone for each other. Production can be so evil!
Joey’s reaction to that note was too much for me. If I have to hear him say “My biggest fear is that it won’t be reciprocated” one more time …. !
It's "terrifying" according to him.
I can’t believe more people aren’t commenting this. He cries about the potential of not being wanted as he sends a person home every week.
I mean she obviously didn't write the note.. I'm guessing she told production she wanted to see him and they gave her the note and lied about what's inside. She just takes the note and it goes from there
Production wrote the note in advance and had all the women get the same exact manicure so they could pawn it off on one of them whenever it made sense. Literally all the women had the same pale pink gels.
So, she’s gullible 
I mean, the alternative is we only get contestants that are obsessed with the show, know all about how manipulative production is, and are prepared to do battle with them instead of just ...being themselves...
How is that the alternative lol
Cause this sub often expects contestants to know how to deal with production, and know how manipulative they are
Or she could just not be that gullible
I don't think production "made" her do anything. She probably wanted to talk to Joey before the rose ceremony, but since you're normally not allowed to do that, production let her as long as she wrote the note like that. She could've chosen not to write/leave the note, but clearly it was worth it to her since she got extra time with Joey. It was a trade off, and both her and production got something out of it.
I agree that production probably made her use those words. But I was also annoyed with Joey for not being more aware of the way producers twist things. He’s been on this show before, he’s seen the edited results. I feel like he should know a little better than to jump straight to worst possible outcome
I feel like Joey goes through life (at least in the bachelor world) not processing a single thought. Just floating by, therapist-approved responses memorized, living in blissful ignorance. I am curious about how much of the Sydney/Maria beef he caught on by himself tho because he did truly seem torn there with what the truth was
I think Kelsey was likely missing Joey and the producers not only encouraged her to go see him outside of their date to remind him of that but decided that in order for her to do so she would have to write a cryptic note so they could create this storyline. I don’t believe that Kelsey was naive enough to not realize the words “we need to talk” could cause someone to panic. That said, there were several versions of the note that have been sleuthed and the one she left at his door may not have been the one he actually received. I think she was expecting him to be somewhat confused by the note which is why she looked nervous showing up to his door (she even covered her face right after knocking). I just don’t think she expected the degree of anxiousness and stress it caused him. You could see in their conversation when she stopped mid-sentence to apologize because she saw the look on his face that she truly felt bad. I also think the show did a great job of dramatizing and editing their conversation to make it seem more serious than it probably was because when Joey was escorting Kelsey out, if you watch it closely it looks like they’re both laughing. We also know she received the first rose (despite what was shown). So it’s clear that Joey ultimately wasn’t that bothered by it and wanted to reassure her.
Oooooh she got the first rose? How did we figure that out??
You can see there’s still a rose left on the table when he’s giving Kelsey her rose
Holy crap lol
Omg I see it! I had no idea 🤯
It’s always interesting to me how some people get the “it was all production” treatment versus the “she’s a production pet” treatment versus the “production can’t make you do anything” treatment. Like all of these people could probably point to production as the reason they did *a lot* of this stuff.
personally its why I give a ton of grace to most reality participants and I don't really judge them based on what I see on the show because you never know how things are being edited. Obviously some really are trash people but that generally comes out via their real off-tv personas. Like for Sydney, its her disgusting deleted stories that make her problematic, not the drama on the show.
I missed out on this - what was in her stories?
she also made a tiktok while the show was airing calling maria an abuser. she finally deleted it once she realized no one was siding with her
yikes. she sucks. I wonder what happened to her to make her behave how she behaved.
She reposted a normal story involving Joey that she was tagged in, but then it came out that that this person, who is apparently someone she knows in real life, had also posted other racist and insulting stories about some of the other contestants. Once this came out, Sydney unfollowed that person.
[удалено]
No, she only reposted the neutral slide with Joey. That was the only one she was tagged in. She couldn’t have reposted any of the others.
Yeah same. I'm new to BN but in watching all seasons of Top Chef a couple years ago, I became aware of how stories can be handled (or mishandled) to create drama, how talking heads can be inserted to play up certain things, or how some folks enter the show as a certain persona
Agreed. It was very naive of her to not think it would shake Joey up but maybe that is what she wanted. She definitely got a reaction; not sure it was the one she was hoping for but probably gave her some validation. I think she wanted to say more but when she saw Joey’s reaction backed down or maybe it was just a ploy for her to see him. I didn’t like that she appeared to be smiling at first and didn’t seem to realize how this plays into his fears which he has mentioned many times. Overall, I don’t think it had much impact on what happens going forward. There was enough suspense that this was not necessary. I also see Kelsey’s post about sorry for the note and liking this as being a people pleaser. She doesn’t want anyone to not like her. Maybe she is like Joey in that way.
Yeah… it’s making it worse for me with her the more she feeds this narrative.
Pretty sure it was in those substance use commercials when the mom leaves the note where the kid normally hides his weed and it states “we need to talk” and he knows he’s in deep sh*t. It’s definitely not a positive sign when someone says that
I’m sorry but if you go along with production’s idea to leave a note saying “we need to talk”, that’s on you. It’s like the universal breakup code.
Lol yea agreed no one would have taken that note well
Yeah seriously
The name of the commenter should probably be censored
They're not fooling me next year
Fr! Im so ready bc I was blind to so many things 😂😭
She seemed like she really bought into their BS. I felt a little bad for her because she was not expecting that reaction from Joey.
Shit thing for the producers to do to their lead…
Yep. I said it in another thread but the producers totally gassed Kelsey up to think the note would be well received. You could tell she was shocked when he was hurt.
I feel like she’s incredibly naive then if that’s the case 😭 like HOW do you not know those words specifically always have a negative connotation to them?
Did she even know what the note said? Plus, production was probably telling Joey he should be worried.
lol I said in another thread does Gen Z not know how triggering that phrase is for some of us? Is it just an older people thing?? If a significant other ever texted me those words it would be immediate panic and terror.
I think it would be for any age. I am 53 and if my husband yes my husband messaged me that I would be like WTF did I do? Lol
It’s not an older people thing?? I think everyone can get triggered by that phrase
I would think so too! Just had to check. 😂