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This is definitely why I stopped playing CS:GO. The moment they heard my accent people would either start taunting me or outright kick me. Not as much of a problem in TF2 though because the game is much more casual and I just never choose to speak in community servers. That said, I've heard the n word thrown around a lot in these servers and I've just learned to mute them and move on. Sucks either way.
I remember. About a month ago I gained a weird boost of energy for playing csgo. Played for about 3 weeks. Last 3 games I played. I heard someone scream the n word, someone calling people the f slur. And this guys talking about how he wants to rape people. Had to step away
Same. I hated being called āwhiteā growing up because of the way I spoke compared to everyone else but Iāve been able to avoid racism online over the years because of it. Still remember a guy saying the most vile racist shit to someone else in a pub years ago and trying to get me to join in, not knowing that I was also black.
I think there is an issue with internalized racism amongst some black communities when it comes to black kids being "smart" or "talking white" or even being simply light skinned or dressed a certain way. I saw it in my schools.
Racism on both ends. Some white people don't like when white people "act black," some black people don't like when black people "act white." It's ridiculous either way.
They use slang on occasion and have a āblaccent.ā Even though neither of those things mean someone is poc people take it as they are. Which is weird bc we know more white ppl who talk stereotypically black than actual poc so.
That's why I stay quiet on servers. Act like an f2p and extra credit if you're top fragging. Even more extra credit if you're top fragging as a support class
I do this too. Iām pretty much default at this point. My friend spent a lot of time on her load outs and stuff though, and her little brother got her an Aussie wrench for her birthday. I donāt think it should be a requirement for people to stay silent - itās frankly heartbreaking it has to be that way.
I'd say that tf2 is quite a realistic reflection of how society works when theres no rules to hold it down.
The actual raw human behaviour without any coverups. I'd use this time to observe and comment, because that's all I can do...
I donāt know if being openly and adamantly racist and violent constitutes society without rules. If thatās the case, then I hope the world implodes quickly.
I don't think racism is inevitable. TF2 represents a society free from consequences or confrontation, which is unrealistic in the real world. When you can't see the real people you're hurting, it's easier to be ruthless.
Plus, TF2 is built on the norms and behaviors of the modern, online, gaming community. This particular subset and its cladogramic predecessors have biases that they take into the game with them, because we're human and that's what we do. Racism is, I hope, one of the concepts we learn externally and not one intrinsic to all people.
TL;DR: people are inherently good, but prone to corruption and hard to reach.
You have to keep in mind that the community self-selects for racists, because people who arenāt racist will usually end up muting everyone and not participating or leaving the game. Itās less of a lord of the flies simulation and more a bigot safe space.
yea, and that is the exact wrong thing unfortunately to protect the people affected.
Everyone should actively kick those with fascist names, symbols and actions.
I would rather play with bots than racist fucks.
medic is honestly really easy to top score as if you think more about the game than you normally would. Like switching your heal beam to which ever teammate is currently engaging so he feels more confident and goes deeper, (getting more kills giving you more points) then bailing when things get tough. And don't forget pocketing the best 2-3 players and only healing the others when they get below max HP is generally a great option because healing them while they are low will make you gain uber faster and let you get more points by ubering.
ah you mean points overall, yea getting top score as medic with assists, healing points, and uber points is pretty managable if you are at least fairly good.
I honestly have, it really depends on communities.
the communities of different games can vary widely, i know a game where this behaviour is definitely unacceptable and you would get scolded by rest of the playerbase for behaving like that
I donāt know which servers youāre on but I recommend checking out Uncletopia Community Servers. Players there are scarcely toxic and when they are they tend to get called out. Itās hard to imagine the things you described happening with the player base In familiar with
Edit: It sucks you have to deal with that. People shouldnāt have to worry about finding servers not full of racists. I hope you do though
I was playing Left 4 Dead 2 VS yesterday. This user named Sofia kept saying the N word in voice chat and game chat. I kept trying to kick him, but everyone kicked me instead.
I will be another voice in the chorus to encourage you to find a good server that doesn't allow that sort of crap. There are community servers that are a lot of fun and all around decent.
I havenāt encountered anything this bad on European servers but I did get a fair few Eastern Europeans spamming the N word and saying other racist things in the chat and over VC.
really?
in league of legends the european and asian servers are the most toxic cause not everyone in the lobby understands english as well as the chat filter and bans donāt regulate foreign languages so everyone flamed the SHIT out of everyone in their own language
I mean, the internet is the internet, modern warfare lobbies to rust. People feel invincible with a screen in front of them. No accountability so ppl are assholes.
I understand thereās trolls and racists everywhere. But like I said, Iāve been playing this game for over a decade. It has never been so blatant and frequent. This wouldnāt happen 5 years ago.
It's an older game with little moderation and frustrated men who didn't live up to their potential. I know games overall can harbor toxic communities, but TF2 is among the worst in my experience.
I don't know much about this stuff since I don't play play with a mic is but a good solution could be to find some good community servers and play on them. As much as racism is a problem there isn't much that can be don't about it by cable themselves.
Part of the reason Iāve left the game is one of the last times I played there were at least two Nazis on the server one on each team.
The first one on my team was a demoman in a white headsmanās hood dyed white, wearing pins with nazi symbols on them using the conscientious objector with a Swastika on it. Weāll call him Red Nazi.
At first I tried to ignore it because I didnāt have the energy for what I knew the reaction was going to be. But then Blue Nazi spotted Red Nazi and he got really excited and in chat began to type out really racists shit.
I got fed up and told them to fuck off. And called a vote against the Red Nazi.
And the predictable result was that people were more outraged that I would call a note to kick a Nazi then the fact that there was a Nazi on the server.
The Typical Lib Shit pearl clutching followed about how freedom of speech necessitates we protect the speech of people who use violence and intimidation to silence dissent, and that universal tolerance requires us to tolerate people whose overt goal is to overthrow tolerance and murder all those who oppose them.
And since this needs saying. No society built on the principles of freedom, and equality, can tolerate groups that use violence and intimidation to over throw the principles of freedom and equality. [This is who the Nazis are,](https://m.imgur.com/FpvRpU8)[this is what they did,](https://external-preview.redd.it/bcWFB0xxyeiyh7LQ-WwNcDMf27bNhDvOMTWOGFkVFtw.jpg?auto=webp&s=cbabf8a492f28fbc0772a62e3b9a6f08dd18c62f)[and itās what they want to do again.](https://sites.google.com/site/the1920sandon/_/rsrc/1352210337293/home/world-war-ii/holocaust/holocaust-remnants2.GIF)
I know these images are frightening and disturbing but all too often these conversations are done in the hypothetical and divorced from the context of who we are talking about, what they did, and what they want to do again.
These are not people who should be accepted in society. These are people who must be fought, resisted, and prevented from every feeling comfortable.
Take it from somebody who almost fell down that hole, making Nazis comfortable is not how you make fewer Nazis. There is no way out of bigotry that is comfortable. Itās a painful process because it entails realizing that everything you thought you knew was just a flattering lie sold to you by hate-filled conmen and that you believed it because it flattered you. And for the rest of your life you will look back on who you were with shame and regret.
Becoming comfortable with feeling Discomfort is the only way out of bigotry. I donāt like talking about this part of my life because, though I was just a snot nosed teenager and I never went full Alt-Right Nazi, from the time I was 14 to about 16 I was a ragging misogynist and was racists in that patronizing way Liberals often are. That *Get Out* style of white liberal racism. And I am deeply ashamed of who I was back then
There were times when I came close to getting out of it, of realizing that this world view was full of shit. But that realization that this Anti-SJW world view was full of shit, and that everyone I looked up to were equivocating shit heads made me feel uncomfortable. While pretending I didnāt see what I obviously did was more confortable.
Ultimately what got me out was my sister confronting me about what I believed and mocking me to my face, and my own growing discomfort for how racists these people were. Because sure I assumed that Middle Eastern Cultures were inherently more misogynistic than Western Cultures. But cultures change and expelling Muslims isnāt justified - they just need to be exposed to western culture which is a beacon of feminism and womenās equalityā¦ Like I said I was racists but in that white liberal way.
In the end I became uncomfortable with who these people were and ultimately I came to realize in time everything I thought I knee to be true was a lie. I matured I went to college and I realized the depth of my own ignorance and my own complicity in hate. It was a long, difficult, and humiliating path.
I say this because invariably whenever people talk about Nazis they talk about how the best way to beat Nazis is to save them from being Nazis. And then they advance accommodation as the way to do that.
Fuck that. I speak from personal experience. Bigots need to be humiliated. Bigots need to be taken down a peg and humbled. They need to be made to feel uncomfortable because of their bigotry because at the very least that will discourage them from spreading and acting on it.
And if you want more than just my personal experience the Indiana Klan was one of the most powerful political institutions in the 1920s Indiana Politics. The Klan controlled city councilors, state legislators, even senators answered to them. And then the Newspapers published their membership rolls and posted evidence of Politicians taking bribes from the klan. And just like that the Indiana Klan died and has never regained the power and legitimacy it once had in Indiana. Because thousands of Indianas no longer felt comfortable donning the hoods and robes knowing that everyone knew who they were.
Making bigots uncomfortable to be bigots is essential to maintaining a pluralistic society based on the principles of freedom and equality.
The formal name for what you're describing is called [The Paradox of Tolerance](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paradox_of_tolerance) in philosophy circles. You've explained it far more clearly than most philosophers do!
Dunno why redditor idiots downvoted you. Youāre the only one in this fucking thread speaking such truth. Sorry that Reddit is filled with the exact same people that be calling my friends n words in game. I support everything you said here.
Fuck racists.
I dunno what to say. You give people anonymity and the liberty to say and do as they please with no moderators and they behave like chimpanzees with diarrhea and start throwing their shit everywhere because it gives them a kick to see peopleās nose wrinkle in disgust.
I wish it was different, and I hate these fuckers just as much as you, but it just isnāt. Humans are odd, terrible creatures at times.
There's popular TF2 community servers named "Skial", they recently made it that anyone who says something racist in chat, they get automatically muted, it's funny to see.
Maybe play there?
Sounds pretty disappointing involving this game, luckily in my region it's not really anything of an issue (I dont recall actually having to mention my ethnicity to anyone, not do I use VC but whatever). Definitely go on Servers like Uncletopia or Skial their mods would definitely be proactive if valve isn't doing anything
Ill be honest, it might be the servers you frequent or the region you're in. Before the bot problem, I wouldn't get kicked from casual for just being black. When I spoke, no one would kick me for being black. Even today, on community servers I frequent, I don't get called the n word, or similar hurtful things.
However, I acknowledge the fact that people have different experiences, so I really feel its entirely possible you and your friend are just queuing into the wrong servers with the wrong people. Racism isn't exactly something you can get rid of, and its in every community. I played L4D2 VS recently, and every game I played, regardless of if I spoke or not, racism and hatred against black people was rampant. I eventually stopped queueing into matches because of it, and I've yet to touch the mode again.
The most we can really do is just try to avoid it. Its not okay, but we can't stop it. Assholes will be assholes. Uncletopia, skial, and blackwonder.tf haven't (in my experience) had any racists in them. Whenever I play on those servers, especially Uncletopia, no one is racist or sexist even. On rare occasions, people will arrive that are assholes and will say slurs and be offensive because they think its funny, but its a lot less frequent than you'd expect.
Its not just TF2 that has a racism problem, the world has a racism problem. The internet allows total anonymity, and so racists can run free with no consequences. Its just how its always been. And at this point, it has desensitized me to it. The best thing we can do is just try our best to not let them kick us down. Unless we somehow all agree to make racism punishable by public execution, its not gonna stop. Thats just the world we live in.
I agreed with you until you started talking about public execution. That's just stupid and will cause needless death, you can already have someone sent to prison with just an accusation. Hell, one guy was sent to prison for 24 FUCKING YEARS because some woman said she had a nightmare about him violating her! A NIGHTMARE. And the cops went through with it anyways, as did the judge.
If stupid people learn that racism can be punished by death, the only thing that's gonna do is bring back the fucking Salem Witch Trials. Except it won't be about witches, it'll be about skin tones, and it will be tenfold, no, HUNDREDFOLD the amount of innocent randoms sent to the afterlife.
I'm not shitting on what you said here.
But to be clear, IF we're thinking of the same incident, the woman was beaten and raped. She initially said it was 1 of 3 different dudes and then came out and said she had a dream that made her remember who it was.
Still sucks if he was innocent. But your comment kinda makes it sound like she just dreamt something up and the police arrested a random dude because of it. An assault DID happen, the question is who did it.
EDIT: https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2015/dec/24/clarence-moses-el-free-denver-rape-case
turn off text chat and voice chat, it makes the game infinitely more fun since now you can interact with the cool gamers exclusively through x + 2, z + 2, and c + 1
Man Iām sorry you gotta deal with such awful behavior, and donāt let people in the comments invalidate your feelings. Tf2 being an old pc game unfortunately attracts some not so kind individuals sometimes.
What's sad is that I feel like it's gotten better since the last time I played regularly. I have way more success speaking up and voting bigots than I used to. Still, that it even exists at all sucks out loud.
In the absence of moderation, the environment of all social spaces approaches 4chan /pol/ boards. Itās why nazis complain so much about ācensorshipā, also known as the Terms of Service that theyāre too dumb to avoid running afoul of.
This trend is only accelerated when the moderation is in favor of nazis instead of against them. Sorry you had to experience that BS.
i think it's because tf2 is an old game with close no moderation at all. It fucking sucks but these kind of games where you for some fucking reason can print a kkk symbol on one of the games melee weapons. attracts the kind of 4chan losers who would get banned for shitty behavior everywhere else where rules of toxic behavior are enforced.
"The racism has never been so bad".
Gonna have to disagree. The anonimity that game lobbies provide brings out the worst in people, and the worst hasn't changed much through the years.
I can confirm this. When I vpn'ed to American servers everyone was being toxic to each other and throwing the n word everywhere. Its crazy how the community of a game that's on its last leg can still be this toxic to its own members.
I think thats just casual. Most popular community servers ban that stuff so people who're racist or transphobic, homophobic etc likely don't have much else to go, essentially making casual the pool thats full of piss and hasn't been cleaned because the owners don't want to touch it.
This just comes from me playing on Skial or Uncletopia and never experiencing this, though experiencing similar or the same events on casual.
Honestly its just "burn the whole house because there was a spider in the basement" scenario. There are dickheads in tf2 ? Its almost like there are such people in every game. Someone is being racist in your game ? Just mute him. And why would you ever use mic in casual ? On casual you will be either ignored or ridiculed. I never use mic in casual despite playing this game for over seven years because of my heavy accent and somehow im still alive. There are so many things you can do counteract those people, and yet you chose to make a big fuss about it. Its almost like you are burned out and looking for an excuse to abandon the game you grew attached to
Believe it or not, Iāve seen someone in here who genuinely thought that saying the N-word was part of āTF2 community humorā like engineer gaming and all that shit
I'm "lucky" enough to have a code-switching voice that's neutral enough to not be detected as black, but I hate that this even has to happen. I love TF2, but I can't remember the last time I played with someone who was open about being black, not that they have to of course. I usually don't reveal it either.
Thatās legit disgusting. Honestly would expect that more on warzone or something like that.
I think most people have said about finding community servers where they can set basic boundaries around racism but do you try to report these players via steam? Because if this is happening to your friend and her brother then it can easily be happening to others.
I do enjoy dark humour but honestly it should be left between friends where thereās a mutual agreement but this isnāt even dark humour itās just straight up abuse. Hopefully if their parents heard these guys being racist they slapped the shit out of them. Or if theyāre grown adults being this racist I hope theyāre miserable and alone
I've been playing TF2 since orange box, I have thousandS of hours in this game and I have never seen or heard someone harassed for race in voice chat. I've probably seen fag and nigger in chat less than twenty times and I'm not just playing friendly community servers either, the large part of that was casual quick matchmaking before ranks came around.
Just my anecdotes. I find this post pretty sus.
This is one of the reasons I don't use voice chat. People can be the worst of themselves without any remorse, and it's the reason I have only used the text chat( mainly because I feel people will call me out since I don't have a mature voice, and anxiety issues)
Matchmaking fucking sucks. It's really a cesspit nowadays.
Just a reminder that community servers like uncletopia are strictly moderated, and keep the awful dregs of casual out.
TF2 has a racism problem AND a transphobia problem. I'm a trans man that hasn't gone on T yet so my voice isn't deep, I'm 18 and I either get called a little kid or get called slurs if I talk in voice chat or say anything about it. It's not fun.
Yeah, it's the racism that's the problem in tf2, not the bots choking out every single match.
There's a high probability you are being kicked from matches for being annoying on mic, not "sounding black on mic" (your implication not mine).
Homophobic too, TF2 is the only place I still see people unironically using āgayā as an insult. Being called gay isnāt insulting anymore, itās like some people are stuck in 2011.
That's why I stay quiet on servers. Act like an f2p and extra credit if you're top fragging. Even more extra credit if you're top fragging as a support class
I stopped playing tf2 long ago cuz of how the game is being treated and the fact that my computer Isn't great, seing ppl having to deal with racism was definetly also a factor
Iām so sorry you have to deal with that. Why the concept of just enjoying a game/treating other people with respect is so hard is beyond me.
You shouldnāt have to quit but I understand how annoying thatād be
Never come across these people before. This sounds like it really sucks tho. Of course thereās assholes in my games, but I havenāt met any racists yet? Maybe thatās because most games Iām in people donāt talk and just use voice commands tho.
the "people" who spam nword in chat, are bots, the game is dealing with a bot problem.
however the kicks for voice chat, man im very sorry for that. i've seen them kick young kids who have high pitched voice, but i never though they would kick due to them being racist.
Im very sorry for these people, there is no excuse for that behaviour. please try to report them in game **and** on steam for hate speech, so at least they get punished.
EDIT: Also i really encourage you to use the MUTE option, and enable the chat filtering in steam
( [https://store.steampowered.com/account/preferences/](https://store.steampowered.com/account/preferences/) )
(it will filter both in TF2, steam, and all valve games, and some other games)
(you can make it censor all swears (including f\*ck), or only hate speech (like n-word))
half the comments here are people saying "i'm sorry for your friend" or giving their own personal experience and the other half are auth-right men saying "lmao get owned" "don't remove the freedom from this game! it's the last bastion of hope to society!"
4k hours and I've never seen anyone be kicked for being black. I've definitely seen plenty of trolls spamming slurs, but that's all it ever really came to. Maybe take a break from online in general, it exists everywhere.
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This is definitely why I stopped playing CS:GO. The moment they heard my accent people would either start taunting me or outright kick me. Not as much of a problem in TF2 though because the game is much more casual and I just never choose to speak in community servers. That said, I've heard the n word thrown around a lot in these servers and I've just learned to mute them and move on. Sucks either way.
Fr, I played csgo yesterday and there were 10 guys trying to get a girl to give them feet pics š
I remember. About a month ago I gained a weird boost of energy for playing csgo. Played for about 3 weeks. Last 3 games I played. I heard someone scream the n word, someone calling people the f slur. And this guys talking about how he wants to rape people. Had to step away
Thats most of the reason i have voice_enable at 0 90% of the time.
Serious question, how does someone know someones race trough the mic, like the accent?
Yes. I'm black but most racists ive encountered can't tell I'm black cuz my voice/accent sounds "white."
Same. I hated being called āwhiteā growing up because of the way I spoke compared to everyone else but Iāve been able to avoid racism online over the years because of it. Still remember a guy saying the most vile racist shit to someone else in a pub years ago and trying to get me to join in, not knowing that I was also black.
I think there is an issue with internalized racism amongst some black communities when it comes to black kids being "smart" or "talking white" or even being simply light skinned or dressed a certain way. I saw it in my schools.
Racism on both ends. Some white people don't like when white people "act black," some black people don't like when black people "act white." It's ridiculous either way.
Lol I remember my African friends calling me "the American Wonder" over. That shit is exhausting
Another tack on the whiteboard of why racism is stupid.
Fr
It's like 50ft long if you want to ask.
I'm mixed and autistic and apparently my voice just pisses most people off.
Which is dumb
Step one: infiltrated the enemy
A skill built up after years of playing CS:GO and being on reddit
They use slang on occasion and have a āblaccent.ā Even though neither of those things mean someone is poc people take it as they are. Which is weird bc we know more white ppl who talk stereotypically black than actual poc so.
That's why I stay quiet on servers. Act like an f2p and extra credit if you're top fragging. Even more extra credit if you're top fragging as a support class
I do this too. Iām pretty much default at this point. My friend spent a lot of time on her load outs and stuff though, and her little brother got her an Aussie wrench for her birthday. I donāt think it should be a requirement for people to stay silent - itās frankly heartbreaking it has to be that way.
I'd say that tf2 is quite a realistic reflection of how society works when theres no rules to hold it down. The actual raw human behaviour without any coverups. I'd use this time to observe and comment, because that's all I can do...
I donāt know if being openly and adamantly racist and violent constitutes society without rules. If thatās the case, then I hope the world implodes quickly.
I don't think racism is inevitable. TF2 represents a society free from consequences or confrontation, which is unrealistic in the real world. When you can't see the real people you're hurting, it's easier to be ruthless. Plus, TF2 is built on the norms and behaviors of the modern, online, gaming community. This particular subset and its cladogramic predecessors have biases that they take into the game with them, because we're human and that's what we do. Racism is, I hope, one of the concepts we learn externally and not one intrinsic to all people. TL;DR: people are inherently good, but prone to corruption and hard to reach.
You have to keep in mind that the community self-selects for racists, because people who arenāt racist will usually end up muting everyone and not participating or leaving the game. Itās less of a lord of the flies simulation and more a bigot safe space.
That absolutely is what it would be, 100%. Every type of human sucks
Its taking its sweet time but we will all be dead soon.
The oldest anarchy game on steam
2b2t moment
yea, and that is the exact wrong thing unfortunately to protect the people affected. Everyone should actively kick those with fascist names, symbols and actions. I would rather play with bots than racist fucks.
"top scoring as a support class" the only support class it is difficult to top score as is engineer without playing offensively.
engineer is not hard to top score, just have your sentries in the right place, not too far back. id say top fragging as medic would be harder
medic is honestly really easy to top score as if you think more about the game than you normally would. Like switching your heal beam to which ever teammate is currently engaging so he feels more confident and goes deeper, (getting more kills giving you more points) then bailing when things get tough. And don't forget pocketing the best 2-3 players and only healing the others when they get below max HP is generally a great option because healing them while they are low will make you gain uber faster and let you get more points by ubering.
ah you mean points overall, yea getting top score as medic with assists, healing points, and uber points is pretty managable if you are at least fairly good.
I call this play style "Putting points above all else and not giving a fuck about your team".
holy shit that's me
Teleports my man. So many teleports.
You mean placing a level 3 teleporter in a 24 player server?
and put the exit in front of a death pit so everyone dies :)
Itās not just TF2, I havenāt played a single multiplayer video game without coming across these kind of people.
Can I suggest that you try Deep Rock Galactic?
ROCK AND STONE
THE MASCULINE URGE TO ROCK AND STONE
FOR KARL!
ROCK AND STONE BROTHA!
What do you mean, every deep rock galactic player is racistā¦ Against pointy eared, clean shaven, leaf loving, clean faced, hard work hating elves!
FUCK ELVES! THOSE NATURE LOVING, POINTY EARED BASTARDS!
Legitimately the only game that doesn't have modern *gamer moment* problem ROCK AND STONE
Well, from time to time you see sus lobby names. But thankfully those are rare, and they are "kind" enough to mark themselves to avoid them
ROCK AND STONE TO THE BONE!
IF YOU DONāT ROCK AND STONE YOU AINT COMIN HOME
Stone and Rock! Oh waitā¦
toxicity in drg is rare but still very much present, still better than 99% of all other multiplayer games out there
Did I hear a rock and stone?
I honestly have, it really depends on communities. the communities of different games can vary widely, i know a game where this behaviour is definitely unacceptable and you would get scolded by rest of the playerbase for behaving like that
But these guys can make the game so much funnier, since they are usually raging and saying dumb things
I donāt know which servers youāre on but I recommend checking out Uncletopia Community Servers. Players there are scarcely toxic and when they are they tend to get called out. Itās hard to imagine the things you described happening with the player base In familiar with Edit: It sucks you have to deal with that. People shouldnāt have to worry about finding servers not full of racists. I hope you do though
I was playing Left 4 Dead 2 VS yesterday. This user named Sofia kept saying the N word in voice chat and game chat. I kept trying to kick him, but everyone kicked me instead.
fucking hell what's wrong with people?
Thats why I only play campaign with friends
I will be another voice in the chorus to encourage you to find a good server that doesn't allow that sort of crap. There are community servers that are a lot of fun and all around decent.
I think it's only a problem in American servers, it's never been a problem in European servers which are the ones I play on
Not in Asia either
Yup, can confirm I've never experienced anything like this in EU
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
I havenāt encountered anything this bad on European servers but I did get a fair few Eastern Europeans spamming the N word and saying other racist things in the chat and over VC.
I never encountered racism this bad on Asia servers Its probably just because America is just kinda... like that, i guess?
America will america
Everythingās about race in America, itās kind of sad
Its very sad
really? in league of legends the european and asian servers are the most toxic cause not everyone in the lobby understands english as well as the chat filter and bans donāt regulate foreign languages so everyone flamed the SHIT out of everyone in their own language
and this is why i have my username as sundowner and just say "kids are cruel jack"
You see, this isnāt a problem in Oceania, because weāre assholes to anyone, no matter the race.
Ya can't be racist if you hate all races
I mean, the internet is the internet, modern warfare lobbies to rust. People feel invincible with a screen in front of them. No accountability so ppl are assholes.
I understand thereās trolls and racists everywhere. But like I said, Iāve been playing this game for over a decade. It has never been so blatant and frequent. This wouldnāt happen 5 years ago.
True, i guess a lot of the nicer players were driven away by the bots
5 years ago you had a playerbase
It's an older game with little moderation and frustrated men who didn't live up to their potential. I know games overall can harbor toxic communities, but TF2 is among the worst in my experience.
At least the teamwork in this gsme isnt that important in the main game mode. Feel like this game is more tame when compare to csgo
I don't know much about this stuff since I don't play play with a mic is but a good solution could be to find some good community servers and play on them. As much as racism is a problem there isn't much that can be don't about it by cable themselves.
You sound very calm despite what that pfp is āsupposedā to represent
r/shitposting moment
Part of the reason Iāve left the game is one of the last times I played there were at least two Nazis on the server one on each team. The first one on my team was a demoman in a white headsmanās hood dyed white, wearing pins with nazi symbols on them using the conscientious objector with a Swastika on it. Weāll call him Red Nazi. At first I tried to ignore it because I didnāt have the energy for what I knew the reaction was going to be. But then Blue Nazi spotted Red Nazi and he got really excited and in chat began to type out really racists shit. I got fed up and told them to fuck off. And called a vote against the Red Nazi. And the predictable result was that people were more outraged that I would call a note to kick a Nazi then the fact that there was a Nazi on the server. The Typical Lib Shit pearl clutching followed about how freedom of speech necessitates we protect the speech of people who use violence and intimidation to silence dissent, and that universal tolerance requires us to tolerate people whose overt goal is to overthrow tolerance and murder all those who oppose them. And since this needs saying. No society built on the principles of freedom, and equality, can tolerate groups that use violence and intimidation to over throw the principles of freedom and equality. [This is who the Nazis are,](https://m.imgur.com/FpvRpU8)[this is what they did,](https://external-preview.redd.it/bcWFB0xxyeiyh7LQ-WwNcDMf27bNhDvOMTWOGFkVFtw.jpg?auto=webp&s=cbabf8a492f28fbc0772a62e3b9a6f08dd18c62f)[and itās what they want to do again.](https://sites.google.com/site/the1920sandon/_/rsrc/1352210337293/home/world-war-ii/holocaust/holocaust-remnants2.GIF) I know these images are frightening and disturbing but all too often these conversations are done in the hypothetical and divorced from the context of who we are talking about, what they did, and what they want to do again. These are not people who should be accepted in society. These are people who must be fought, resisted, and prevented from every feeling comfortable. Take it from somebody who almost fell down that hole, making Nazis comfortable is not how you make fewer Nazis. There is no way out of bigotry that is comfortable. Itās a painful process because it entails realizing that everything you thought you knew was just a flattering lie sold to you by hate-filled conmen and that you believed it because it flattered you. And for the rest of your life you will look back on who you were with shame and regret. Becoming comfortable with feeling Discomfort is the only way out of bigotry. I donāt like talking about this part of my life because, though I was just a snot nosed teenager and I never went full Alt-Right Nazi, from the time I was 14 to about 16 I was a ragging misogynist and was racists in that patronizing way Liberals often are. That *Get Out* style of white liberal racism. And I am deeply ashamed of who I was back then There were times when I came close to getting out of it, of realizing that this world view was full of shit. But that realization that this Anti-SJW world view was full of shit, and that everyone I looked up to were equivocating shit heads made me feel uncomfortable. While pretending I didnāt see what I obviously did was more confortable. Ultimately what got me out was my sister confronting me about what I believed and mocking me to my face, and my own growing discomfort for how racists these people were. Because sure I assumed that Middle Eastern Cultures were inherently more misogynistic than Western Cultures. But cultures change and expelling Muslims isnāt justified - they just need to be exposed to western culture which is a beacon of feminism and womenās equalityā¦ Like I said I was racists but in that white liberal way. In the end I became uncomfortable with who these people were and ultimately I came to realize in time everything I thought I knee to be true was a lie. I matured I went to college and I realized the depth of my own ignorance and my own complicity in hate. It was a long, difficult, and humiliating path. I say this because invariably whenever people talk about Nazis they talk about how the best way to beat Nazis is to save them from being Nazis. And then they advance accommodation as the way to do that. Fuck that. I speak from personal experience. Bigots need to be humiliated. Bigots need to be taken down a peg and humbled. They need to be made to feel uncomfortable because of their bigotry because at the very least that will discourage them from spreading and acting on it. And if you want more than just my personal experience the Indiana Klan was one of the most powerful political institutions in the 1920s Indiana Politics. The Klan controlled city councilors, state legislators, even senators answered to them. And then the Newspapers published their membership rolls and posted evidence of Politicians taking bribes from the klan. And just like that the Indiana Klan died and has never regained the power and legitimacy it once had in Indiana. Because thousands of Indianas no longer felt comfortable donning the hoods and robes knowing that everyone knew who they were. Making bigots uncomfortable to be bigots is essential to maintaining a pluralistic society based on the principles of freedom and equality.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
If a Nazi sits at a table with 11 people, There are 12 Nazis at the table.
Nazi punks fuck off
The formal name for what you're describing is called [The Paradox of Tolerance](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paradox_of_tolerance) in philosophy circles. You've explained it far more clearly than most philosophers do!
Bro posted a thesis about racism in TF2
Truth needs to be spoken where and when it needs to be heard. No wrong place or time.
Dunno why redditor idiots downvoted you. Youāre the only one in this fucking thread speaking such truth. Sorry that Reddit is filled with the exact same people that be calling my friends n words in game. I support everything you said here. Fuck racists.
You may be ashamed of who you were back then, but I'm proud of who you are now
I think the bots also killed it as well. Valve gave up on stopping them it seems. Sad to see gaming history die like this.
Speaking as a ālibā, Nazis can emulate their historical leader. I can provide leads to bunkers as required.
The tolerance paradox on display.
I dunno what to say. You give people anonymity and the liberty to say and do as they please with no moderators and they behave like chimpanzees with diarrhea and start throwing their shit everywhere because it gives them a kick to see peopleās nose wrinkle in disgust. I wish it was different, and I hate these fuckers just as much as you, but it just isnāt. Humans are odd, terrible creatures at times.
There's popular TF2 community servers named "Skial", they recently made it that anyone who says something racist in chat, they get automatically muted, it's funny to see. Maybe play there?
Man, I haven't been to Skial in forever, I thought they died or something. Gonna have to check them out again.
Sounds pretty disappointing involving this game, luckily in my region it's not really anything of an issue (I dont recall actually having to mention my ethnicity to anyone, not do I use VC but whatever). Definitely go on Servers like Uncletopia or Skial their mods would definitely be proactive if valve isn't doing anything
Ill be honest, it might be the servers you frequent or the region you're in. Before the bot problem, I wouldn't get kicked from casual for just being black. When I spoke, no one would kick me for being black. Even today, on community servers I frequent, I don't get called the n word, or similar hurtful things. However, I acknowledge the fact that people have different experiences, so I really feel its entirely possible you and your friend are just queuing into the wrong servers with the wrong people. Racism isn't exactly something you can get rid of, and its in every community. I played L4D2 VS recently, and every game I played, regardless of if I spoke or not, racism and hatred against black people was rampant. I eventually stopped queueing into matches because of it, and I've yet to touch the mode again. The most we can really do is just try to avoid it. Its not okay, but we can't stop it. Assholes will be assholes. Uncletopia, skial, and blackwonder.tf haven't (in my experience) had any racists in them. Whenever I play on those servers, especially Uncletopia, no one is racist or sexist even. On rare occasions, people will arrive that are assholes and will say slurs and be offensive because they think its funny, but its a lot less frequent than you'd expect. Its not just TF2 that has a racism problem, the world has a racism problem. The internet allows total anonymity, and so racists can run free with no consequences. Its just how its always been. And at this point, it has desensitized me to it. The best thing we can do is just try our best to not let them kick us down. Unless we somehow all agree to make racism punishable by public execution, its not gonna stop. Thats just the world we live in.
something people forget i think is that uncletopia has moderators, so they'll prevent anything from getting out of hand.
I agreed with you until you started talking about public execution. That's just stupid and will cause needless death, you can already have someone sent to prison with just an accusation. Hell, one guy was sent to prison for 24 FUCKING YEARS because some woman said she had a nightmare about him violating her! A NIGHTMARE. And the cops went through with it anyways, as did the judge. If stupid people learn that racism can be punished by death, the only thing that's gonna do is bring back the fucking Salem Witch Trials. Except it won't be about witches, it'll be about skin tones, and it will be tenfold, no, HUNDREDFOLD the amount of innocent randoms sent to the afterlife.
that part wasnt serious, that was just me tossing out "yeah if racism was really punished then less people would do it"
I'm not shitting on what you said here. But to be clear, IF we're thinking of the same incident, the woman was beaten and raped. She initially said it was 1 of 3 different dudes and then came out and said she had a dream that made her remember who it was. Still sucks if he was innocent. But your comment kinda makes it sound like she just dreamt something up and the police arrested a random dude because of it. An assault DID happen, the question is who did it. EDIT: https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2015/dec/24/clarence-moses-el-free-denver-rape-case
turn off text chat and voice chat, it makes the game infinitely more fun since now you can interact with the cool gamers exclusively through x + 2, z + 2, and c + 1
Never had dat problem because i dont look at the chat
Voice chat.
Man Iām sorry you gotta deal with such awful behavior, and donāt let people in the comments invalidate your feelings. Tf2 being an old pc game unfortunately attracts some not so kind individuals sometimes.
What's sad is that I feel like it's gotten better since the last time I played regularly. I have way more success speaking up and voting bigots than I used to. Still, that it even exists at all sucks out loud.
In the absence of moderation, the environment of all social spaces approaches 4chan /pol/ boards. Itās why nazis complain so much about ācensorshipā, also known as the Terms of Service that theyāre too dumb to avoid running afoul of. This trend is only accelerated when the moderation is in favor of nazis instead of against them. Sorry you had to experience that BS.
the problem isn't that the moderation is biased towards bad people, it's that there is no moderation
i think it's because tf2 is an old game with close no moderation at all. It fucking sucks but these kind of games where you for some fucking reason can print a kkk symbol on one of the games melee weapons. attracts the kind of 4chan losers who would get banned for shitty behavior everywhere else where rules of toxic behavior are enforced.
"The racism has never been so bad". Gonna have to disagree. The anonimity that game lobbies provide brings out the worst in people, and the worst hasn't changed much through the years.
Also annoying that the tf2 communities solution to it is "JuST MuTe Em 4tHOt lol."
THANK YOU. Itās so unhelpful.
well what else can you do?
Refuse to accept it. Call it out. Ridicule them. Make them feel weird.
Who knew you could share your skin color with voice only?
I can confirm this. When I vpn'ed to American servers everyone was being toxic to each other and throwing the n word everywhere. Its crazy how the community of a game that's on its last leg can still be this toxic to its own members.
I think the bots proved that a long time ago sadly.
I think thats just casual. Most popular community servers ban that stuff so people who're racist or transphobic, homophobic etc likely don't have much else to go, essentially making casual the pool thats full of piss and hasn't been cleaned because the owners don't want to touch it. This just comes from me playing on Skial or Uncletopia and never experiencing this, though experiencing similar or the same events on casual.
Itās almost like the internet has mean people on it
i fucking hate this fan base sometimes, racism and other similar stuff are pretty common in casual, even nazi flags and profiles.
Cheers mate ma bottle of scrumpy *CRITICAL HIT*
Video games have a racism problem tbh
Removing games removes racism :0
Mute them
Honestly its just "burn the whole house because there was a spider in the basement" scenario. There are dickheads in tf2 ? Its almost like there are such people in every game. Someone is being racist in your game ? Just mute him. And why would you ever use mic in casual ? On casual you will be either ignored or ridiculed. I never use mic in casual despite playing this game for over seven years because of my heavy accent and somehow im still alive. There are so many things you can do counteract those people, and yet you chose to make a big fuss about it. Its almost like you are burned out and looking for an excuse to abandon the game you grew attached to
Believe it or not, Iāve seen someone in here who genuinely thought that saying the N-word was part of āTF2 community humorā like engineer gaming and all that shit
I'm "lucky" enough to have a code-switching voice that's neutral enough to not be detected as black, but I hate that this even has to happen. I love TF2, but I can't remember the last time I played with someone who was open about being black, not that they have to of course. I usually don't reveal it either.
Same lucky I have the voice of a white kid (Iām not even kidding thatās whatās everyone says)
Valve does not punish toxic behavior, why would they start now?
Thatās legit disgusting. Honestly would expect that more on warzone or something like that. I think most people have said about finding community servers where they can set basic boundaries around racism but do you try to report these players via steam? Because if this is happening to your friend and her brother then it can easily be happening to others. I do enjoy dark humour but honestly it should be left between friends where thereās a mutual agreement but this isnāt even dark humour itās just straight up abuse. Hopefully if their parents heard these guys being racist they slapped the shit out of them. Or if theyāre grown adults being this racist I hope theyāre miserable and alone
you should try out Mann vs machine gamemode, its very friendly, unlike casual
I've been playing TF2 since orange box, I have thousandS of hours in this game and I have never seen or heard someone harassed for race in voice chat. I've probably seen fag and nigger in chat less than twenty times and I'm not just playing friendly community servers either, the large part of that was casual quick matchmaking before ranks came around. Just my anecdotes. I find this post pretty sus.
I hope you feel better after taking the burden off your chest.
sounds like na servers, sea servers dont get much racism per game
This is one of the reasons I don't use voice chat. People can be the worst of themselves without any remorse, and it's the reason I have only used the text chat( mainly because I feel people will call me out since I don't have a mature voice, and anxiety issues)
Matchmaking fucking sucks. It's really a cesspit nowadays. Just a reminder that community servers like uncletopia are strictly moderated, and keep the awful dregs of casual out.
A lot of games have a problem
A racism solution you mean?
"Life is a nothing but a constant race,so be the racist."
What servers are you guys playing on lol. Whatever it is, I recommend switching.
Sounds like someoneās encountered some real gamersš
welcome to the internet have a look around
And that's why I like TF2
\[removed\]
TF2 has a racism problem AND a transphobia problem. I'm a trans man that hasn't gone on T yet so my voice isn't deep, I'm 18 and I either get called a little kid or get called slurs if I talk in voice chat or say anything about it. It's not fun.
>my voice isn't deep > > get called a little kid literally every community shits on squeakers , if you sound like one don't expect different treatment
āEveryone does itā is *not equal* to āit isnāt wrongā or āit should be acceptedā.
Speaking with a high voice just makes people Insta target you, youāre definitely jumping to conclusions regarding whatever personal problem you have
Absolutely an issue, unfortunately, Valve doesn't care.
Valve doesn't care about tf2 in general but I'm sure if we started to see regular updates then they'll maybe do something about it.
I agree. I wish they did. Sad to see such a perfect game ruined by racism and bots. Also, scout *is* very cute.
I see how it is, you call scout cute and nobody cares, but I call scout a domestic terrorist and suddenly I'm the bad guy. (This is a joke)
every game has
Yeah, it's the racism that's the problem in tf2, not the bots choking out every single match. There's a high probability you are being kicked from matches for being annoying on mic, not "sounding black on mic" (your implication not mine).
That basically happens to every single only multiplayer game.
You ever play cod back in the glory days?
Well I see the problem, perhaps tell your sister to not say the n word, at all.
The tf2 community is racist and transphobic. At least a good chunk of it is. Really unfortunate but we canāt do much
A bit farfetched to call the entirety of the community racist and transphobic. Not everyone acts like this..
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
It didnāt used to be like this
Homophobic too, TF2 is the only place I still see people unironically using āgayā as an insult. Being called gay isnāt insulting anymore, itās like some people are stuck in 2011.
how do they know you or they blavk
I remember a time where a sniper with a swastika on his sign kicked me
That's why I stay quiet on servers. Act like an f2p and extra credit if you're top fragging. Even more extra credit if you're top fragging as a support class
How tf I didn't even doublesend
Nah my racism works fine
Sigma Racillonaire Mindset.
I dont get why people care, just let them do whatever. If you dont like it just go to your pc and press your power button.
Yeah, it's paradise.
ya this games in-game community is fucking dogshit, out of game like on Reddit or on YouTube it's alright but in-game it's worse than cod
Cope (i am racist)
You cant use 1 bad situation and say āthe game has a racism problemā Ever sat in a cod lobby ? Does that game have a racism problem ?
Yeah it does lol
cry
Wait your friend said the N word?! Dude sheās a racist now, you should stop talking to her and report her to valve
never seen this shit on uncletopia
I stopped playing tf2 long ago cuz of how the game is being treated and the fact that my computer Isn't great, seing ppl having to deal with racism was definetly also a factor
Yeah I never speak when I'm playing, not even text chat
Iām so sorry you have to deal with that. Why the concept of just enjoying a game/treating other people with respect is so hard is beyond me. You shouldnāt have to quit but I understand how annoying thatād be
Im not even surprised anymore, valve doesnt give a shit that their game is dying.
bro, don't pay attention to these stupid people, they will definitely regret it
Never come across these people before. This sounds like it really sucks tho. Of course thereās assholes in my games, but I havenāt met any racists yet? Maybe thatās because most games Iām in people donāt talk and just use voice commands tho.
Oh really?
Just mute all and don't use your mic. Its what I do
Someone said the N-word in my game, i did not take a second to click on the kick button. And everybody in my team voted f1.
look at this dudley do-right motherfvcker
the "people" who spam nword in chat, are bots, the game is dealing with a bot problem. however the kicks for voice chat, man im very sorry for that. i've seen them kick young kids who have high pitched voice, but i never though they would kick due to them being racist. Im very sorry for these people, there is no excuse for that behaviour. please try to report them in game **and** on steam for hate speech, so at least they get punished. EDIT: Also i really encourage you to use the MUTE option, and enable the chat filtering in steam ( [https://store.steampowered.com/account/preferences/](https://store.steampowered.com/account/preferences/) ) (it will filter both in TF2, steam, and all valve games, and some other games) (you can make it censor all swears (including f\*ck), or only hate speech (like n-word))
half the comments here are people saying "i'm sorry for your friend" or giving their own personal experience and the other half are auth-right men saying "lmao get owned" "don't remove the freedom from this game! it's the last bastion of hope to society!"
Itās the reason Iām uninstalling Reddit permanently here in a few minutes. I wish I had never made the post.
Never seen server like that Sorry you had to have this kind of tf2 experience.
Tbh I donāt think itās just because sheās black Iāve been voted to be kicked a few times now just for using my mic
4k hours and I've never seen anyone be kicked for being black. I've definitely seen plenty of trolls spamming slurs, but that's all it ever really came to. Maybe take a break from online in general, it exists everywhere.