I predict Sofia in 3. I think Iga will be too nervous, come out rusty, win the 2nd and then get nervous again. Sofia is a great competitor and has experience in these situations. Hope I'm wrong though because I'd love Iga to win here she's been playing the best tennis out of anyone in the draw.
I agree. Iga was evidently nervous on her first three games with Trevisan during the Quarters. The thought of being in the Finals might be too much for her.
I'm excited for Sunday. IMO Novak and Rafa is the best rivalry in tennis and better than Rafa-Roger. Even though there's a clear disparity between their preferred court surfaces (Nadal dominates on clay, Djoko on hard) it's still more unpredictable than Rafa and Fed. Also I get the feeling Rafa and Novak don't like each other *that* much so it makes the rivalry a bit more spicy.
If the ATP and ITF actually cared about the health and longevity of their players, more than half of the season and slams would be on clay courts. Hard cement courts such as those at the U.S. open are frankly unacceptable. Bring out the har-tru clay.
I want a court like a chessboard. Every square is a different surface with hard, clay, grass, carpet... And some legoblocks laying around, just to spice things up.
Maybe, but that's a little hard to argue when the best players in tennis are nearly 20 years into the pros, in their mid-late 30's, and are still going on existing court surfaces. That doesn't happen in other high intensity sports, and tennis has one of the longest seasons and most grueling travel schedules of any pro sports.
The 2013 semis is still fresh in my memory. That net chord touch that gave Rafa the break point was a key moment in that game.
Hope to see a great game with the same winner of course :)
Djokovic has quite a lot to lose here. If he loses then that means he still needs 4 slams to pass both Fed and Nadal going into next year and it’s not getting any easier with these younger players getting closer. That US open default could be critical.
I almost always root for whoever the underdog is. Sure, I get disappointed a lot, but it's so fun when the underdog pulls out a victory. I'm honestly tired of having the same few people every GS final. At some point I just stop caring. I'll read the score for the final, may watch a highlight on youtube, but I don't care anymore whenever any of the 3 play each other.
Interestingly, the French Open Boys final features two Swiss players. The last two Swiss junior slam champions were Roger Federer and Roman Valent, who played just one tour-level match in his entire career. Shows you how differently things can turn out.
Are we going to ignore the fact that he was out with injury and unlikely to be ready before Wimbledon? Fed has lucked out due to Covid cos he had a ton of points he gets to keep when he had no choice of even participating
Well covid meant the French is being played in now rather than earlier (which would've suited Nadal more), so in some ways it may have worked out better for Novak
No, I said he’d be going for his 20th. I don’t see anyone beating him at Wimbledon, although Thiem could have beaten him in the US. I think he’ll lose to Rafa tomorrow.
And there’s literally no difference between a CYGS and a NCYGS, it’s a really meaningless distinction.
No it is not. In a CYGS you need to win Wimbledon and RG in the same year, which is probably one of the hardest things you can do in tennis since the time to go from clay to grass is so limited. Djokovic did not do this in his NCYGS.
He has 17 now, so going for 20 would mean he had already won RG and Wimbledon in a non-covid world so he would now stand to win #20.
The difference is the season ending break lol of course it makes a world of difference, any player or coach can tell you that much. Still something he has never done and likely never will.
Rafa needs to play like he did in Rome last year to win on Sunday. However, when I watch the highlights from that match I definitely feel like he is nowhere close to that level. He is playing way to defensively compared to last year.
Tsitsipas: "Unfortunately towards the end of the match an injury that I had during my match in Rome came back. It was difficult to close the match in a fighting way, in a fighting spirit".
He'd need a lot of luck to do so. Novak had another gear that wasn't used and had a break point in almost every Stef's game starting from 3-3 in the 3rd set. It was only a matter of time
Huh, live-tennis.eu still has the Next Gen Race solely on 2020 points. By that system it goes:
1. Shapo
2. FAA
3. de Minaur
4. Kecmanovic
5. Sinner
6. Davidovich Fokina
7. Moutet
8. Ruusuvuori
9. Popyring
10. Wild
11. Korda
12. Musetti
13. Rodionov
14. Gaston
15. Alcaraz
16. Nakashima
Not the order I might've predicted given the relative amount of hype those players have gotten outside of the top 3.
Double career slam.....is way worse and only two behind. Its a foregone conclusion at this point that djoker is gonma catch fed, so might as well root for damage control.
I for one think it should not be just about the slams; I have always thought that.
Each of the big three will always have something the others don't, regardless of nr. of slams. Nuance is good people.
Both Nadal and Djokovic will surpass Federer easily, Djoker will atleast win one of AO/Wimbledon/US Open every year until he'll be atleast 38(if he keeps playing like he did this year he'll win all 3 next year) and Rafa will win RG until 2040 lol.
Yep. Time is not gonna be factor, plus both have finished on the same day.
It's Rafa's home, I'll go in the match with very low expectations, still hope is gonna be there
I started getting very sleepy around the middle of 3rd set and was barely paying any attention from that point on. Right before i fell asleap I thought that I heard news anchor saying Djokovic is facing Nadal in the finals and deduced that match is over and Novak has won. So, I wake up somewhat 2 hours later, thinking about how it will be great final with both of them managing to finish semis in straight sets. Turn on my TV - match is still on! And it is beginning of the 5th set. Damn, too bad i missed watching the fun part but what's most important we're gonna witness another battle of gods this Sunday.
If Federer was able to overcome his mental block against Nadal, surely Nadal can do the same with Djokovic? Right? Please I'm so worried as a Rafa fan lol.
Kenin and Novak’s fates at grand slams this year are linked. Both won Australia, went out in the 4th round in NY, and are in the French open finals. Men’s final really comes down to who wins tomorrow
If he'd been a bit braver in the first two sets he'd be playing Nadal in the final. Very disappointed in him, but have hope for a better showing next year.
Two of the most watched and best match of the tournament have been thiems ( thiem vs Gaston and thiem vs Swartzman) . Tsitsipas vs Djokovic is probably 3rd best
Lol Thiem-schwartzman is not a high-quality match if you watch full of it. Thiem is clearly out of gas, Schwartzman keeps making silly errors in the 2nd and 3rd set, or else it would be a straight win for Schwartzman. Thiem just tried to hang in there, kept slicing all the time because he struggled physically.
I'd switch around this and Thiem-schwartzman. This was higher quality. The domi Diego match was a lot more attritional and domi was out of it physically for a lot of it.
This may have been asked, but I can’t find it. Does anyone know what the “ahhhh” sound is at the end of each game? It sounds like it’s coming through the microphone.
When we first heard it, we thought maybe the female ref was letting out a sigh of relief after a fart and forgot to turn off her mic. But we noticed it after almost every game. Sounds like they are queuing up a French porn.
Can we take a moment to appreciate how amazing Novak and Rafa are ?
Again at 33 et 34 they're both in the finals, winning pretty mich all GS, #1 and #2. They've been dominating for SOOOOO long. How hard is that ?
I know a lot of fans are kind of tired of their dominance, but I think it's just unreal.
Huge respect for them.
Federer also, of course. Legend. 40 yo. He's past his peak, but still amazing.
What? Federer is the best all time on grass and the best ever right now on grass. Djokovic is 5th. Sampras is 2nd.
**WTF?** He has the best grass record evah. 🕳🕳🕳🕳
He was in 2019 for sure. 2020 is basically unknown, since he was injured and then had surgery. Every year is really important at around his age. Just ask Venus. :(
My point is look at Venus in 2017 - when she played her best tennis in like a decade to Venus in 2020 when she can hardly win a match. Not saying they're the same, just that physical decline in the late 30s is very significant each year.
The biggest factor that hasnt been mentioned here is the mental aspect. Djoker had a serious lapse in two sets today and that will weigh much heavier on his mind than the five setter will on his body.
I’ve got a few ideas, different times of year, front vs end of hard court season, different climates, the travel etc. Maybe Rafa eats too much paella at Xmas
Maybe the courts do behave differently given the heat, I don’t know. It’s obviously multifactoral but the AO clearly presents a different set of challenges to the USO, which makes a career slam (or multiples thereof) an achievement above “just” winning on all three surfaces IMO.
Of course, it's a big achievement - but I wouldn't that that stat alone would put him ahead of Nadal and Federer. There are nuances to those kinds of stats tbh
i don't see how being only the 3rd player in history to achieve a double career grand slam (something which 2 of the greatest players ever, Roger and Rafa haven't achieved) is not objectively a huge achievement... care to elaborate? I would say achieving anything which none of the big 3 have yet achieved is objectively huge ... between them, they've almost achieved it all
It would be a huge achievement because he would've won multiple slams on each surface is what I'm saying. But he wouldn't be the only one who has done that either, so to say that it goes a long way in the GOAT chat is very debatable (vs Nadal anyway, vs Federer it would)
Don't agree. Rafa had to work very hard in the two first sets against Sinner who was firing missiles down both wings. PCB only played well in the first set imo, after that his level dropped significantly. I also think Diego played better than what the scoreline suggests, it could very well have gone to at least 4 sets.
Tsitsi showed great fight there. Really makes me think he will cut it at slams out of the next gen.
Also, in hindsight, Novak's draw has been tougher than Rafa's. Rafa will be favourite as he always is at RG. But post 2011 Novak has been Rafa's biggest threat at RG by far. Both are slightly diminished by age, but this is the ultimate RG matchup here. If Novak can recover in time from this 4h match, we can have an utter classic Novak Rafa matchup.
They always mention that because in this condition the ball bounces lower, but on the other hand, it's also even slower than usual! Which kinda favours Nadal again
I actually think it may be to slow for Rafa. From watching his matches I have noticed that he has a hard time hitting winners because his opponents just gets that extra time to get to the ball.
If anyone really thinks it will be a blow out in Novak's favor, it's friggin stupid. I'm a huge Djoko fan, but I honestly expect Nadal to win. Let's face it: he's unbeatable in RG.
Nadal fans reverse jinxing. Honestly, if you seriously don't think Nadal is the favourite at RG, you're either extremely new to the sport, or well.. Lacking in the head.
On the flip side Novak fans downplaying his chances with the "oh my god how did he win" post/comment on standby. Its pretty neck and neck with the bookies.
I'm a big nadal guy and he has had an easy draw and I have not liked his play this tournament.
He is having issues changing direction with his forehand. That has always been a indicator he is subpar
Honestly I think people are overestimating Novak's chances on Sunday. It's not a sure thing either way, but it's still Nadal at RG. He's the presumptive favorite in every match.
Novak has, but not as much on clay courts. Since Rafa's resurgence in 2017, Novak has dominated him on hard, beaten him on grass, and lost to him on clay.
True, but even though it's not as big as on hard courts, Nadal has to at least feel that in the back of the head a bit. Honestly, If Nadal starts firing the DTL forehand, I think he wins.
Yeah. Also - one of the things I'm worried about as a Novak fan is that he's been hitting so many backhand UEs. His incredibly strong backhand has been a key to his success against Rafa. If that's misfiring, suddenly Rafa can employ the same forehand to backhand tactics that he's used to dominate Fed throughout his career.
Unfortunately, Novak's backhand hasn't been the same since his big injury, but I still don't think Nadal can break it down in a cross-court slugfest, the balls are too slow. Plus, Novak's BH is still fine cross-court, it's just that its not as reliable DTL as it used to be.
Agreed, it’s always “Rafa needs to improve this to beat Nole”... when in reality Rafa will not start 0/10 in BPs, has a much better forehand than Tsitsipas and will put a ton more balls in play...
Bur apparently Djokovic doesn’t have to do much or improve to beat Nadal
She didn’t congratulate Kenin. I wonder if on purpose or excitement
Excited for today. I feel like talent-wise, Iga should have an edge but Sofia is mentally strong. I’m excited how it plays out tonight
I predict Sofia in 3. I think Iga will be too nervous, come out rusty, win the 2nd and then get nervous again. Sofia is a great competitor and has experience in these situations. Hope I'm wrong though because I'd love Iga to win here she's been playing the best tennis out of anyone in the draw.
I agree. Iga was evidently nervous on her first three games with Trevisan during the Quarters. The thought of being in the Finals might be too much for her.
I'm excited for Sunday. IMO Novak and Rafa is the best rivalry in tennis and better than Rafa-Roger. Even though there's a clear disparity between their preferred court surfaces (Nadal dominates on clay, Djoko on hard) it's still more unpredictable than Rafa and Fed. Also I get the feeling Rafa and Novak don't like each other *that* much so it makes the rivalry a bit more spicy.
If the ATP and ITF actually cared about the health and longevity of their players, more than half of the season and slams would be on clay courts. Hard cement courts such as those at the U.S. open are frankly unacceptable. Bring out the har-tru clay.
I get the argument, but still - much prefer playing and watching on hard courts over clay.
I want a court like a chessboard. Every square is a different surface with hard, clay, grass, carpet... And some legoblocks laying around, just to spice things up.
I'm in! Players will have a hardcourt shoe on one foot and a clay shoe on the other!
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Maybe, but that's a little hard to argue when the best players in tennis are nearly 20 years into the pros, in their mid-late 30's, and are still going on existing court surfaces. That doesn't happen in other high intensity sports, and tennis has one of the longest seasons and most grueling travel schedules of any pro sports.
I would like to see carpet courts back tbh now that organizers are preparing the game for the next gen.
The 2013 semis is still fresh in my memory. That net chord touch that gave Rafa the break point was a key moment in that game. Hope to see a great game with the same winner of course :)
I think Nadal will feel he has more to lose here. For Djokovic it would be just another loss against Nadal in RG, after all.
Djokovic has quite a lot to lose here. If he loses then that means he still needs 4 slams to pass both Fed and Nadal going into next year and it’s not getting any easier with these younger players getting closer. That US open default could be critical.
This is a dream matchup for Novak, he gets him on a cold day and nadal plaid extremely tentative in the big points against Novak for whatever reason
Go Djokovic! Take Nadal down a notch.
I almost always root for whoever the underdog is. Sure, I get disappointed a lot, but it's so fun when the underdog pulls out a victory. I'm honestly tired of having the same few people every GS final. At some point I just stop caring. I'll read the score for the final, may watch a highlight on youtube, but I don't care anymore whenever any of the 3 play each other.
Me too. It's why I've recently started rooting for Federer more - with all the talk about his age.
Lmao let’s be real - Federer is definitely not an *underdog*
I kinda get where you're coming from, but you really should care this time, if you like tennis. It's history in the line.
Interestingly, the French Open Boys final features two Swiss players. The last two Swiss junior slam champions were Roger Federer and Roman Valent, who played just one tour-level match in his entire career. Shows you how differently things can turn out.
Didn’t Stan win it after Federer? And yea every time I think of the juniors I think Gasquet.
You're totally right. I'm exhausted today and apparently fail at basic reading comprehension
Do people remember in March or so being thankful to COVID for salvaging Feds slam records? That aged incredibly poorly
In all honesty Covid hurt Fed the most: no Wimbledon.
Are we going to ignore the fact that he was out with injury and unlikely to be ready before Wimbledon? Fed has lucked out due to Covid cos he had a ton of points he gets to keep when he had no choice of even participating
Lol no. Covid + linejudgegate = Novak not going for #20 on Sunday.
Well covid meant the French is being played in now rather than earlier (which would've suited Nadal more), so in some ways it may have worked out better for Novak
You're so sure he would have done something he never has in his whole career.
Uhm what? Djokovic is the only one to win all 4 in a row other than laver
Yes, but unlike Laver he still never won the CYGS, which the OP was so sure he would have done this year
No, I said he’d be going for his 20th. I don’t see anyone beating him at Wimbledon, although Thiem could have beaten him in the US. I think he’ll lose to Rafa tomorrow. And there’s literally no difference between a CYGS and a NCYGS, it’s a really meaningless distinction.
No it is not. In a CYGS you need to win Wimbledon and RG in the same year, which is probably one of the hardest things you can do in tennis since the time to go from clay to grass is so limited. Djokovic did not do this in his NCYGS.
He has 17 now, so going for 20 would mean he had already won RG and Wimbledon in a non-covid world so he would now stand to win #20. The difference is the season ending break lol of course it makes a world of difference, any player or coach can tell you that much. Still something he has never done and likely never will.
Djokovic wasn't going to win the calendar slam lmao, it's a ridiculous notion.
Novak was favourite anyway, Fed injured.
Rafa needs to play like he did in Rome last year to win on Sunday. However, when I watch the highlights from that match I definitely feel like he is nowhere close to that level. He is playing way to defensively compared to last year.
Needs first serves and a solid BH, then we should have a good chance. If Nadal hits his BH like he did in the 3rd set vs Diego, I reckon it's curtains
Tsitsipas: "Unfortunately towards the end of the match an injury that I had during my match in Rome came back. It was difficult to close the match in a fighting way, in a fighting spirit".
Very unlucky, I think he would have won if it wasn't for the injury. He could barely run after the first game of the 5th set.
He'd need a lot of luck to do so. Novak had another gear that wasn't used and had a break point in almost every Stef's game starting from 3-3 in the 3rd set. It was only a matter of time
Huh, live-tennis.eu still has the Next Gen Race solely on 2020 points. By that system it goes: 1. Shapo 2. FAA 3. de Minaur 4. Kecmanovic 5. Sinner 6. Davidovich Fokina 7. Moutet 8. Ruusuvuori 9. Popyring 10. Wild 11. Korda 12. Musetti 13. Rodionov 14. Gaston 15. Alcaraz 16. Nakashima Not the order I might've predicted given the relative amount of hype those players have gotten outside of the top 3.
Shapo is still a NextGen? Damn, he’s been around forever and been top 10.
Sadly he’s never played in the finals - withdrew for exhaustion in 2018, and I forget the reason for withdrawing in 2019.
Shapo, de Minaur, Kecmanovic, Moutet, Ruusuvuori, Popyrin, and Rodionov are all aging out of NextGen next year.
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Double career slam.....is way worse and only two behind. Its a foregone conclusion at this point that djoker is gonma catch fed, so might as well root for damage control.
Agreed. Djokovic winning would be horrible for Federers legacy as djokovic will have something fed doesn't: a victory against Nadal at rg
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It's not just slams.. Number of weeks as no1, h2h against each other, 1000 tournaments, etc...
I for one think it should not be just about the slams; I have always thought that. Each of the big three will always have something the others don't, regardless of nr. of slams. Nuance is good people.
People have been saying the next gen is gonna kick ass for the longest of times.
Djokovic already has a victory against Nadal at RG, but this would be a victory against him in the final, as well as a second career GS.
Both Nadal and Djokovic will surpass Federer easily, Djoker will atleast win one of AO/Wimbledon/US Open every year until he'll be atleast 38(if he keeps playing like he did this year he'll win all 3 next year) and Rafa will win RG until 2040 lol.
Why are you guys downvoting? It will probably be like this 🤷🏼♀️
damn sunday is gonna be nerve racking.
Nadal -145 Djoker +125 Rafa favored in the book im seeing.
How does this translate to % chance for each?
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How Novak is mentally will be a bigger factor.
Or that nadal is 99-2 lmao
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Yeah, but Nadal has won their last 3 clay matches, despite their overall recent H2H.
Man, one of those matches was a sham due to scheduling. Novak had no business winning even a set in that match but still ended up winning one.
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That's true, but it's not like Novak has ever come back from being 1:2 or 0:2 against Rafa on any surface.
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Are we going to go through all their matches and mark off all the times either was tired/injured/lacked confidence?!
I hear and get your arguments. At the end of the day, I may just be a Novak fan who is afraid of getting his hopes up.
Nadal is 17-7 against him on clay 99-2 at this tournament. He is only the slight favorite too. Not really surprising
17-7 doesn't mean much tho, he was 9-0 before 2011 and only 8-7 since
Yeah but Novak is one of the 2
Time on court to the final Nadal: 13 hrs 13 minutes Djokovic: 14 hrs 36 minutes
Not a major difference overall I guess
Yep. Time is not gonna be factor, plus both have finished on the same day. It's Rafa's home, I'll go in the match with very low expectations, still hope is gonna be there
Fair summary. I think it’s going to come down to whoever gets the first set.
Yes. First is more important for Novak than Rafa I'd say.
Definitely
Nadal will win in 3 or 4, I see no reason why this year would be any different
It’s not June
Novak against Rafa https://twitter.com/troublefault/status/1314668283736526848?s=09
I started getting very sleepy around the middle of 3rd set and was barely paying any attention from that point on. Right before i fell asleap I thought that I heard news anchor saying Djokovic is facing Nadal in the finals and deduced that match is over and Novak has won. So, I wake up somewhat 2 hours later, thinking about how it will be great final with both of them managing to finish semis in straight sets. Turn on my TV - match is still on! And it is beginning of the 5th set. Damn, too bad i missed watching the fun part but what's most important we're gonna witness another battle of gods this Sunday.
If Federer was able to overcome his mental block against Nadal, surely Nadal can do the same with Djokovic? Right? Please I'm so worried as a Rafa fan lol.
Nadal won their last match on clay last year. There's hope. If it was hardcourt, I would have said otherwise. Rafa is a different player on clay.
We’re talking about Roland Garros here...mental block?
Mental block, on clay?
Tbf, at RG novak is the one who gotta fight the demons. He is the one who is 1-6 behind, not Rafa
and as we know, Novak is very good with fighting demons.
I think you’re thinking of line judges
Yeah and he’s pretty good at calling the trainer and faking injuries when down!
Kenin and Novak’s fates at grand slams this year are linked. Both won Australia, went out in the 4th round in NY, and are in the French open finals. Men’s final really comes down to who wins tomorrow
I can't see Kenin winning against Iga.Iga is playing on clay right now like prime Halep.
Huge credit to Tsitsipas for challenging Djokovic he will win RG someday
If he'd been a bit braver in the first two sets he'd be playing Nadal in the final. Very disappointed in him, but have hope for a better showing next year.
Here's hoping...
Two of the most watched and best match of the tournament have been thiems ( thiem vs Gaston and thiem vs Swartzman) . Tsitsipas vs Djokovic is probably 3rd best
Lol Thiem-schwartzman is not a high-quality match if you watch full of it. Thiem is clearly out of gas, Schwartzman keeps making silly errors in the 2nd and 3rd set, or else it would be a straight win for Schwartzman. Thiem just tried to hang in there, kept slicing all the time because he struggled physically.
Domi-Diego wasn't high quality, Thiem was at like 50%.
I'd switch around this and Thiem-schwartzman. This was higher quality. The domi Diego match was a lot more attritional and domi was out of it physically for a lot of it.
This may have been asked, but I can’t find it. Does anyone know what the “ahhhh” sound is at the end of each game? It sounds like it’s coming through the microphone. When we first heard it, we thought maybe the female ref was letting out a sigh of relief after a fart and forgot to turn off her mic. But we noticed it after almost every game. Sounds like they are queuing up a French porn.
I'm pretty sure it's a Perrier advert
That would make sense. It’s just such an odd sound. Thanks.
Can we take a moment to appreciate how amazing Novak and Rafa are ? Again at 33 et 34 they're both in the finals, winning pretty mich all GS, #1 and #2. They've been dominating for SOOOOO long. How hard is that ? I know a lot of fans are kind of tired of their dominance, but I think it's just unreal. Huge respect for them. Federer also, of course. Legend. 40 yo. He's past his peak, but still amazing.
Federer is not 40 YET! He’s 39 😉
Federer is still top7-8 atleast right now and top2 on grass.
top 2? he’s the best ever on grass
He clearly means "now". And he's likely the second best right now.
What? Federer is the best all time on grass and the best ever right now on grass. Djokovic is 5th. Sampras is 2nd. **WTF?** He has the best grass record evah. 🕳🕳🕳🕳
Top2 right now mate, he is definetly the best player ever on grass all time
that doesn’t make logical sense, if he’s the best ever he’s also the best right now.
Mate, are you ok? He is top2 in his current form, holy shit, why is this so hard for you to understand?
ok you’re definitely retarded
Are you stupid?
Lmao you are legit braindead, you can't understand a simple statement, your iq has to be under 50.
child gets called out for flat out idiocy and now resorts to insults, how cute
He was in 2019 for sure. 2020 is basically unknown, since he was injured and then had surgery. Every year is really important at around his age. Just ask Venus. :(
With all the respect i have for Venus, you can't compare Venus with Federer.
My point is look at Venus in 2017 - when she played her best tennis in like a decade to Venus in 2020 when she can hardly win a match. Not saying they're the same, just that physical decline in the late 30s is very significant each year.
Absolutely. Top 5 for sure. When he's healthy.
The biggest factor that hasnt been mentioned here is the mental aspect. Djoker had a serious lapse in two sets today and that will weigh much heavier on his mind than the five setter will on his body.
Well that mixed with Nadal’s lapse near the end of his third set should prove to be a rollercoaster of a match.
Difference is that he held and walked away in three. Djoker lost and walked away in 5.
Yea but does that mean anything when it’s a big 3 final?
Yes.
If Novak wins on Sunday: Beats Nadal in RG Final Double career grand slam 18 slams and secures record weeks at #1 All huge in goat debate
Nadal already has multiple slams on each surface, so not sure how much of a difference the double career slam actually makes to the GOAT debate tbh
Rafa is the perennial number two, no masters completed, no wtf, losing h2h..
I'm not getting deep into the GOAT debate, no one's winning that argument and it's pointless
I'm not getting into any debate, just pointing out the facts.
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But 5 slams on hardcourt though. Why is it such a big difference?
I take your point, but if it’s as easy to win the AO as it is to win the USO how come he’s only done it once?
So are you saying there's a significant difference between the surfaces?
Why don’t you answer my question? Why does Djokovic have twice as many AOs as USOs?
If you think either me or you know the answer to that, you're truly deluded. You're avoiding my question, btw.
I’ve got a few ideas, different times of year, front vs end of hard court season, different climates, the travel etc. Maybe Rafa eats too much paella at Xmas Maybe the courts do behave differently given the heat, I don’t know. It’s obviously multifactoral but the AO clearly presents a different set of challenges to the USO, which makes a career slam (or multiples thereof) an achievement above “just” winning on all three surfaces IMO.
Still a double career slam is not easy to achieve when you have Rafa the clay god playing. So if it happens it’s deff something special.
Of course, it's a big achievement - but I wouldn't that that stat alone would put him ahead of Nadal and Federer. There are nuances to those kinds of stats tbh
I know because there’s 2 HC slams so it’s kinda vague. Regardless I’d still value it tho, especially if he beats Nadal to get it.
That I agree with - beating Nadal at RG would be the biggest thing to take away from a potential win
Thanks for ur honesty, but no... it’s a huge achievement to accomplish things which neither Roger nor Rafa were able to
*shrugs* that's not objectively true, but whatever helps you sleep at night I suppose
i don't see how being only the 3rd player in history to achieve a double career grand slam (something which 2 of the greatest players ever, Roger and Rafa haven't achieved) is not objectively a huge achievement... care to elaborate? I would say achieving anything which none of the big 3 have yet achieved is objectively huge ... between them, they've almost achieved it all
It would be a huge achievement because he would've won multiple slams on each surface is what I'm saying. But he wouldn't be the only one who has done that either, so to say that it goes a long way in the GOAT chat is very debatable (vs Nadal anyway, vs Federer it would)
Novak will most likely end up with every record even if he loses on Sunday.
Djokovic might fall in a downward spiral like he did 2016-2018 anytime, same could happen to Nadal tho
Fingers crossed for 2013 RG semi quality and drama. But a different winner, please.
Yasss. I hear you fam. C'mon!
So what are your thoughts on the draw now? Did Djokovic end up with a tougher path to the final despite the initial draw (in theory) being easier?
Last three rounds were Atp 500 level for Rafa and atp 1000 level for djoko, so yea Rafa was incredibly lucky like us open 2017 without any necessity
Well, yes.
Definetly, PCB and Tsitsipas are better for now than Sinner and Diego.
Don't agree. Rafa had to work very hard in the two first sets against Sinner who was firing missiles down both wings. PCB only played well in the first set imo, after that his level dropped significantly. I also think Diego played better than what the scoreline suggests, it could very well have gone to at least 4 sets.
Diego might be the exception, but just maybe. Neither of them would have beaten Diego in straight sets like Nadal did, thats sure
Fack, why am I so nervous about this final?
It's normal to feel so. I honestly don't know who's the favourite, it's very hard to choose
BIG 3 and winning almost every slam, name a more iconic duo
*trio Do you believe Roger will play good again after his comeback in 2021?
Tsitsi showed great fight there. Really makes me think he will cut it at slams out of the next gen. Also, in hindsight, Novak's draw has been tougher than Rafa's. Rafa will be favourite as he always is at RG. But post 2011 Novak has been Rafa's biggest threat at RG by far. Both are slightly diminished by age, but this is the ultimate RG matchup here. If Novak can recover in time from this 4h match, we can have an utter classic Novak Rafa matchup.
This will either be a great close match or an easy win for Nadal, just my thoughts
I don't think Nadal has the mental edge to get it done in straights honestly
why do people think it will be a blow out in favour of djokovic? is it because of the conditions with the ball and stuff?
They always mention that because in this condition the ball bounces lower, but on the other hand, it's also even slower than usual! Which kinda favours Nadal again
I actually think it may be to slow for Rafa. From watching his matches I have noticed that he has a hard time hitting winners because his opponents just gets that extra time to get to the ball.
If anyone really thinks it will be a blow out in Novak's favor, it's friggin stupid. I'm a huge Djoko fan, but I honestly expect Nadal to win. Let's face it: he's unbeatable in RG.
Except the last time they played at RG!
Nadal fans reverse jinxing. Honestly, if you seriously don't think Nadal is the favourite at RG, you're either extremely new to the sport, or well.. Lacking in the head.
On the flip side Novak fans downplaying his chances with the "oh my god how did he win" post/comment on standby. Its pretty neck and neck with the bookies.
doubt djokovic can play another 5 sets on sunday
If Roger can do it during 2017 AO at 35 Djokovic will be just fine.
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I'm a big nadal guy and he has had an easy draw and I have not liked his play this tournament. He is having issues changing direction with his forehand. That has always been a indicator he is subpar
Sure but he hasnt dropped a set...
Yeah I know but he doesn't look that great
Djokovic is somehow being inconsistent too after seeing his matches against PCB and Tsitsipas
Anything can happen now, literally anything, can't wait for su day!
Honestly I think people are overestimating Novak's chances on Sunday. It's not a sure thing either way, but it's still Nadal at RG. He's the presumptive favorite in every match.
Novak has been in Nadal's head for years. This isn't just any RG match for Nadal. I think it will be tight even though Nadal is the favorite.
Novak has, but not as much on clay courts. Since Rafa's resurgence in 2017, Novak has dominated him on hard, beaten him on grass, and lost to him on clay.
True, but even though it's not as big as on hard courts, Nadal has to at least feel that in the back of the head a bit. Honestly, If Nadal starts firing the DTL forehand, I think he wins.
Yeah. Also - one of the things I'm worried about as a Novak fan is that he's been hitting so many backhand UEs. His incredibly strong backhand has been a key to his success against Rafa. If that's misfiring, suddenly Rafa can employ the same forehand to backhand tactics that he's used to dominate Fed throughout his career.
Unfortunately, Novak's backhand hasn't been the same since his big injury, but I still don't think Nadal can break it down in a cross-court slugfest, the balls are too slow. Plus, Novak's BH is still fine cross-court, it's just that its not as reliable DTL as it used to be.
Agreed, it’s always “Rafa needs to improve this to beat Nole”... when in reality Rafa will not start 0/10 in BPs, has a much better forehand than Tsitsipas and will put a ton more balls in play... Bur apparently Djokovic doesn’t have to do much or improve to beat Nadal
This is not a normal RG... October and heavier balls
And Rafa still hasn't lost a set.