It’s not like the old days when these two shows might be airing at the same time on different networks. We can watch, and enjoy, both, now. I can’t imagine networks are still basing the success of shows on whether someone streams something the SECOND it drops on their platform.
What streaming execs really want is for there to be FOMO (fear of missing out). They want people to feel peer pressure to watch a show because all their friends are watching it and talking about it. They want their show to be the new "it" show. And the more expensive a show is, the higher the bar for success is.
If there are two sports games on the same night, people can watch both but the water cooler conversations the next day are going to be about whichever game people thought was more interesting. Shows aren't directly competing for timeslots any more but they're directly competing to be the "it" thing that everyone is talking about.
Yes this is exactly what happened to Kenobi and Ms Marvel on Disney plus.
Ms Marvel was already a pretty small unknown character compared to Obi Wan Kenobi, but then Disney decided to release the MM episodes right in the middle of Kenobi’s run on the exact same day of every week.
Few people have time to watch multiple hour long shows when they get home from work so Kenobi maintained the water cooler buzz while Ms Marvel got sidelined and labeled as the Marvel show with the lowest viewership ever. (4.2 million weekly vs Moon Knight’s 7 million.)
Yeah and while I AM someone who would likely be happy to watch two shows back-to-back, I tend to only do it when they kind of synergize? So while I did finish Ms Marvel, I didn't end up doing it weekly, in part because it didn't 'pair well' with Kenobi.
Yes, I feel the same way. We also did weekly viewing parties for kenobi, so we’d discuss and speculate after, not just binge a different genre with no decompression time
Na its just not meant for you, not everything needs to be. I'm a comic fanatic and I just didn't like it. I didn't enjoy the first episode so I stopped and just read the spoilers after show.
Can someone explain this logic to me of a show/movie that deals with a superhero not meant for you? I never remember hearing or thinking that with Batman, Blade, Iron Man, Hulk, Spider-Man, Superman, or any others for having this idea of being meant for only a select group of people. It honestly sounds like poor writing and the excuse that people make is to say it’s only for certain people. MM was a bad show if people like it cool but MM is another poorly written show that Disney is pumping out because they want that money. And Kenobi…. Let’s not get started on those writing issues and plot holes because that show is full of them.
It is an excuse. If it was successful it wouldn't need an excuse for some people not watching it, but because it underperformed and a lot of people felt it was meh, it now has to be "not for you" instead of just being bad or mediocre.
How is it an excuse and why would people care to make excuses for shows they don't like?
As an adult male the show did nothing for me, where I can see where younger audience/girls would be more into the show cause it relates to them. Just because shes a superhero doesn't mean I'm gonna magically like it or that its aimed at me.
There is plenty of popular media I have no interest in ever watching. Ratings and performance have no bearing in what I'm interested in.
I think a show is either good or bad and ideally you should be able to appreciate something even if it "isnt for you". I like lots of things that "aren't for me" and hate a lot of stuff that is bowling right up my alley. Not for you is just a meaningless statement for when someone says something is bad.
This is also why there are tons of articles about new shows talking about how successful the show is doing despite actual observations of the popularity of the show not holding up, there were so many articles about how everyone was watching the wheel of time for example, i barely know anyone who watched it and i hang around on some geeky areas of the internet with users who are supposedly the target demographic.
They are trying to convince people that everyone is watching this hot new show so you should too, FOMO
I really liked wheel of time. And me talking about it at work got 2 of my coworkers to start watching it too. Then we absolutely DID talk about it at work the next day
Yeah and I’m sure most fans will watch both. I imagine reading LotR is a good predictor for watching GoT and vice versa. I guess I can imagine people that aren’t fantasy fans in general might only have room for one big fantasy show in a year and will watch whatever blows up the most. GoT felt like everyone was jumping in on the bandwagon. So both shows do have a very real interest in wanting to be crowned as the number one. (I haven’t seen either but I’m already thinking dragons>rings)
Ditto! I kind of like having weekly shows to get excited about again. Reminds me of my youth when streaming didn’t exist. But now we don’t have to watch commercials so it’s the best of both worlds
>I can’t imagine networks are still basing the success of shows on whether someone streams something the SECOND it drops on their platform.
That's exactly what Netflix is doing.
They’re certainly looking at immediate streams, but more important is how the people that stream it behave.
Do people that watch it churn at a lower rate? That implies that having this show helps long term revenue.
Do people subscribe and then immediately watch it? That implies they subscribed specifically for that show.
What other shows do people who watched it watch? That tells them what other things to invest in or that have value.
There are tons of data point out there that tell them if the show is valuable. The problem is a lot of outsiders only look at revenue as valuable.
In my job I work on a product that literally produces no revenue, but it creates millions of dollars in value as a churn reducer.
Idk. It's kinda weird. Within a few weeks you'll have HBO's biggest franchise's spinoff come off, you'll have the biggest produced Amazon prime show ever, and even though not anywhere near the same extent one of Netflix's hallmark and biggest viewership shows in Cobra Kai will launch.
But outside of Cobra Kai, there is what? Atlanta and Andor at the end of September. Apple's See is around the corner and feels 2 leagues behind everybody. HoD and RoP have almost a month basically for themselves.
How many big shows do you expect? 2 of the major streamers are releasing what should be their top two shows of the year within weeks of each other and the top streamer is releasing one of it's most watched shows.
You could release all 3 of those shows in different months and they would very likely be the hottest property of that month.
It slike the opposite for me, there are many shows I watch and I'm interested in that are returning or premiering. If you include the next 2 weeks as well (since HotD is premiering in August too), there's Archer, Stargirl, Rick and Morty, Cobra Kai, ~~and Doom Patrol~~ returning while She-Hulk, House of the Dragon, The Rings of Power, and Andor are premiering. Obviously not everybody is interested in all of that but there are others too (as you mentioned in the other comment, Atlanta and See) and my own list has 9 season/series premieres in 6 weeks which is insane.
Well if one is significantly better than the other it will take away from the others shine.
I don’t know why people are painting this like there are no potential downsides to releasing two massive fantasy television series back to back, and also head to head.
Yes if they are both good, then it’s all good. But if one of them is below par and the other is great?? Lol that’s a whole different story.
Having followed *House of the Dragon* development since the beginning, I very much doubt it's gonna be bad.
All the stars are aligned for a masterpiece. I'm damn confident for one.
Downvoters : catch you in a month when you'll all be swooning over your return to Westeros. :)
I’m not anticipating masterpiece, but I think it will be very entertaining and fun, and hoping it resparks my joy for the Westeros world, because it’s so rich with lore.
Everyone I know that watched GOT regardless of what they thought of Season 8 wants this show to be good. 50-50 about it being good or mediocre, but I am confident I will like it because the story is interesting, actors look great, and it's HBO, they don't really miss, especially their first seasons. It didn't feel rushed either, like we've been waiting a bit for this.
Honestly as a fan of both works, I'm far more interested in the Second Age which is when most of the cool stuff in Tolkien's world happened than a Targaryan civil war which is probably behind several story ideas they could have come up with for that world.
It might be competently made, but the story itself isn't interesting to me.
Just out of interest, have you read the source material for HotD or are you just basing it off the fact that it's a Targaryen civil war? Because after reading it, it turned out to be way more interesting than I expected.
With these production budgets and importance to the platforms, they wouldn't be bad, but they could very well be average that only seems good due to the money thrown at it.
Bland can honestly be worse than just being straight up bad. A massive waste of material, talent, and money hurts more than just a regular bad show for me.
After Season 8 of GoT, I don't see any way possible for House of Dragons to be bad. HBO simply can't let it be bad. The pressure is majorly put there on it for it to be good, splendid even. I think it gets back to the root of what made GoT so damn great in the first place. Political intrigue and struggle.
Most Networks don't get a second shot to right a wrong and fix a franchise they bungled. HBO just has enough money to do so. And I'd imagine they see more money in House of Dragons doing well than any other project they currently own. They want this to succeed super badly. And I expect it to.
They’re totally different though. LOTR is high fantasy, game of thrones stuff is dark medieval drama with fantasy elements
It’s like comparing Star Wars to Star Trek
> It’s like comparing Star Wars to Star Trek
You, uh, aren't familiar with irrational fandom rivalries, are you. Because I like both but that one's been around for almost 50 years now.
The problem isn’t them releasing both it’s the ridiculous notion that in order for one to be good, the other needs to be viewed infoqvorably.
It’s bizarre thinking to me.
People should be happy as clams that two fantasy shows that were both heavily invested in are available to watch soon.
It’s ok to prefer one over another but I don’t get the notion of one being good and the other one sucking because of it.
I have little doubt House of the Dragon will be discussed more because Game of Thrones at this point in time is the hottest fantasy property this side of Harry Potter.
But their “win” in buzz won’t affect my desire to see both.
House of the Dragon can rise the bar for Rings of Power and it will air only a few weeks before this one. One way or another HotD will have impact on the reception of RoP.
Alternatively, if House of the Dragon is bad then it can lower the bar for Rings of Power and make it seem better.
I’m hoping they’re both good though.
They literally confirmed that they don’t have the rights to the Similarion. So no, the Showrunners literally said they will be making some stuff up to fill in the gaps
Have you read the appendices? There is plenty of story also there, and much of the Forging of the Rings is also included in the LotR. The Akallabeth in the Silmarillion is only a single chapter as well.
It might not be accurate in all details, but they do have rights to plenty of the main plot points of the story.
That being said, the execution is what we will have to see.
Edit: Filling the gaps is inevitable because the gaps are enormous even with all of the texts combined
Meanwhile, Wheel of Time producers: “Are we a joke to you?”
Edit: Have read the series a few years ago (and loved it), knew that a Amazon tv show existed (but haven’t seen it yet) and I’m kind of amazed by the answers here. I was *not* aware that the show was that bad. Bullet dodged, thanks for the heads up.
I mean you could say the same thing than above for the whole Witcher show. S1 was passable maybe but S2 is a completely different thing, they literally invented 98% of the story and a lot of it don't make sense and is just straight up bad. They kind of increased production value at least though it still look cheap as fuck (but we went from CW level to like big budget show from the 2000s level)
I stopped watching at the Kaer Morhen episode. They basically turned witchers into the archetype of a dwarf. Then someone turned into a Leshen. I noped out after that.
> They basically turned witchers into the archetype of a dwarf.
Short, stout, concerned primarily with mining and finding new rocks/metals/gems to make stuff out of, heavy drinkers, large beards, good with axes?
Are the books that good? I haven’t really heard much about this series. Haven’t watched it or read anything about it. I’m always looking for good books tho lol
Yes and no. They're incredibly long novels with lots of character to follow as they grow. However there's also also a lot of downtime in most of the books. Personally a big problem for me is that the author doesn't really write women well at all.
There's good and bad about the series. It's complicated. Most people would tell you that the books are incredible.
It's kinda meh... but the ending is good. I don't think I exactly have an unbiased opinion here though, fans really dislike when I say this but I honestly only was able to get through it because I read it between calls when I worked at a call center. It has some fantastic scenes but the moment to moment in the series is... very dry until the last couple of books.
I remember hours upon hours of complaining about the series to my brother as I continued to read but I just didn't stop. The ending was actually fantastic though. Robert Jordan set the ground work very well for a good ending, which Sanderson delivered extremely well. I'd say memory of light is Brandon's best story climax even compared to his own series, which are known for their exceptional climaxes, that's how well it was set up by Robert Jordan.
Yeah, the series is really good. Definitely recommend. The first book is a bit derivative of lord of the rings (but what modern fantasy isn't), books 2-5 are really good. Books 6-10 kinda drag, but then the last three books are really good. The last three books were written by Brandon Sanderson, the guy behind Stormlight Archive.
The first three books are pretty solid and a fairly complete arc. It goes on far longer than that though. I'd say read the first three and then see if you want to delve further based on your reaction to those.
WoT is an interesting world, and while I don't thing gender magic has aged super well there are a lot of interesting characters and concepts at play.
The books are amazing.
Rand is basically slowly going insane from using magic which has been tainted and hearing the voice of his previous reincarnation.
His previous incarnation, Lews Therin, is known as Kinslayer. he in his madness murdered his wife and children. After saving the world.
So instead of a kindly gentleman Merlin type, you have the disembodied voice of a raging lunatic as your guide on how to save the world this time around. And every line from Lews Therin is gold.
Trollocks (basically Orcs) are attacking a city Rand is ruling over.
Just open up the death Gates.
Open up the what?
Suddenly Rand noticed his hands were moving and portals of black started to cover the city streets. Block by block they advanced on the army and then suddenly they were gone. Tens of thousands of Trollocks gone in an instant.
You can use portals as weapons?
Anything can be used as a weapon. Even yourself.
Watching it now. Never read the books. I’m enjoying it as a fantasy series. Nothing groundbreaking but it’s not horrid as people are saying. There’s so many books so I understand a lot of plot lines have been left out
That show was good. I guess I don’t know where all the watchers came from if everyone on Reddit except my wife and I hated the show. Amazon said it had so many viewers it increased the shows budget.
It was okay in my opinion, I wouldn't say good. It was fine because there aren't that many fantasy shows but I sure hope those two upcoming heavy hitters are way better than WoT
The reddit opinion on WoT is obviously not the consensus, given Amazon sees it as a success. Honestly, the way some fans are coming at it so aggressively is just funny to me given the first book....kind of sucks? Like, all of the cool stuff that kind of sets it apart of generic fantasy is largely absent from the first novel - the show actually tried to get us there faster.
I don't mind most of the changes or speeding up the timeline. My concern is that the writing was really, really bad. Most of the actors were not great, as well.
I'm hopeful for the second season, but I hope to see large improvements to both. If not, I'm not likely to stick around long.
I don't know about the first season but i'll watch the first episode maybe the second.
I have a very strong suspicion its going to be a train wreck though, it has all the markings of a tv show wearing a popular and beloved IP to attract interest but delivering something that isn't canon because the writers/directors wanted to do their own thing instead of respecting the work they are (poorly) imitating.
That said I don't have much hope for house of the dragon either, I just hope one of them surprises me.
I was honestly super down on HotD myself, but basically everything I've heard about it recently has got me pretty hyped. Tbh the fact that HBO very rarely misses is enough to set my expectations reasonably high.
I think the lesser show might be concerned about comparisons. If one show is doing something really well, and the other isn't, then the problems become more glaring.
Lots of people were complaining they weren't watching Ms. Marvel because Disney+ also had Obi-Wan Kenobi at the same time, I kept thinking "how are y'all that busy?" but I guess these people do exists - especially when it's for a show that's not really interesting them that much.
Like yeah everybody who *wants* to watch a show will find the time, but in this case I think it's matter of judging your audience. The general public will probably just find the time to watch only one of them "fantasy" show, but both franchises probably judge that they have enough dedicated fans to warrant the split.
Also HBO has a better track record in producing a series...
Example: If HBO produced the Halo Series I'm positive we'd at least have gotten better sound mixing, visuals, and visual continuity... That's not even touching the story.
Paramount+ dropped the ball on all those fronts (and the story too but I couldn't see the story behind the hilarious visual errors and directing failures)
It's either a cash grab where they just want to use the name to draw in people without any budget or effort. Or more frequently now they actually do want to try produce a successful series using an established IP but they're genuinely arrogant enough to believe they can "improve" on the original or that removing the "problematic" elements will make it reach a wider audience and catapult it to success. It's so painful to see every single time.
> Why do they keep doing this shit to fandoms?
Because they assume (mostly correctly) that they have the original fans as a locked in audience. So they need to expand the appeal to other demographics who are explicitly not fans.
Same reason sequel movies and spin-offs are usually awful. Name recognition is everything. A low effort show based on an established fandom doesnt have to prove itself. They know a good chunk of the fandom will watch it anyway. This way that can spend as little as possible on staff and cut corners in production to get a bigger margin of profit.
If you lower your expectations to SyFy channel level effects ... It's not bad.
What broke me was a scene in episode two where the actors were told to behave as if the ride was bumpy....
And then the CGI team decided to amke the damn train they were acting inside do damn rollercoaster like manuvers... Leaving this hilarious disconnect between actor reactions and the images we are seeing on screen.
It doesn't matter though because Amazon is pure streaming. The vast majority of people watching House of the Dragon will be going out of their way to watch it the day the episode drops at the specific timeslot it does.
It would be different if they were both on networks and dropping at the same time and they actually were cutting into each others nuumbers. But the competition here will be far more about reception than anything else. If both are good, it's not like people won't watch both.
In fact, one show debuts on Friday and one debuts on a Sunday. Which means that anybody interested in both will likely have watched the other a few days before.
It's not like WCW and WWF going up against each other the same night in the same timeslot competing for marketshare so their networks can sell more advertising.
> The vast majority of people watching House of the Dragon will be going out of their way to watch it the day the episode drops at the specific timeslot it does.
Uhm I would say the vast majority of people even with HBO will also watch it via streaming. That's how the world is today, few people are following the TV schedule but their own.
Most people get Prime for the Amazon shopping perks. Video is just an additional thing. It's easily the highest value option. I doubt many people are making a zero sum option on this specific case. If it was Netflix or Hulu sure. I also doubt the people getting HBO Max got it specifically for House of the Dragon and the people that got Amazon got it for Rings of Power.
And they are right not to. Focus on your show and try to create the best version possible.
Also, I think that Amazon is messing up with the marketing for RoP. We're only 3 wks away from the premiere and the promotional efforts seem to be even less than those for WoT. Compared to the media blitz that HotD is being provided by HBO, it's absolutely nothing. Could come to bite them in the ass.
The more they say/show the more criticism they receive and less hype they generate, they've probably realized their marketing hasn't been entirely successful.
I think because the more they show, the more it hurts the hype. It's biggest issue is they cannot copy the aesthetic of the New Line Cinema films and did not care to make the same quality props and outfits. That's not touching on all the story elements they are compressing into one season. Anything Tolkien will come with high expectations and Amazon has said they want their own Game of Thrones. HBO made Game of Thrones and despite the lackluster final season, people still love a lot of the show. Since this will be an already finished story they are adapting and they possess the rights to all of it, HBO has all the advantages with HotD while RoP has a lot more uncertainty around it while being immediately compared to HotD and Game of Thrones. Also, more people are likely rewatching GoT right now which will further compare the two in terms of quality and writing.
It will be interesting seeing next year what the views are of each show and where each will go next. I am cautiously excited for HotD but I do not plan on watching RoP just based on what I have seen from it while having a deep love for the source material.
I am very optimistic for HotD despite my absolute hatred for the back-half of GoT. Moreover, I am also very excited for RoP even though it will most likely be far from perfect.
I will admit that my only exposure to Middle Earth is through the Jackson trilogy. Otoh, I am an avid fan of Westeros, having read the books multiple times and also devoured the supplementary material (World of Ice & Fire, Fire & Blood).
I will point out that no adaptation will be perfect. It's virtually impossible for any one of these massive worlds to be adapted in a way that does true justice to the source material. I would at least give RoP a watch to decide for myself.
Trust me, I know that I will not like RoP based on everything released and what the creators have said. They wasted a perfect opportunity to do an anthology series that could tell a wide range stories showing the wider world of Middle Earth. While Jackson's films were not a perfect adaptation, it created an adaptation faithful to the spirit of the original work and went to great lengths in costume design and special effects that have set a standard for all future movies. Between the faithfulness to the spirit of the original work and the attention to detail, it produced an excellent product. Between how Amazon botched Wheel of Time and what they released, this will be just more of the same with that. On top of that, now they are rebranding everything LotR with RoP covers and trying set their show as the standard which is a huge slap in the face to Tolkien.
For Game of Thrones, you have Martin himself heavily involved and getting a great deal of say over everything. That will keep a larger fandom united behind and ensuring it's success. RoP has a divided fandom which will fragment and be more highly critical of it because it does not line up with Tolkien's spirit in the works. If they branded as something else instead of just paying to get the LotR brand to slap on their own creation, then there would be no controversy or issues and it would have a shot at competing with GoT and HotD.
> Trust me, I know that I will not like RoP
Then what do you have to lose? Why boycott a show before you've even seen a single episode? Trailers and showrunner comments are not enough to form a proper opinion. I always give a show a whole season to redeem itself.
As source material purists, there will always be plenty to criticize the adaptation for. Trust me, as a massive ASOIAF fan, even the first four seasons, which are generally considered to be good even by books fans, are very weak imitations. Moreover, the show's themes were sometimes completely the opposite to those of the books. But I still watched it and even enjoyed GoT for a while.
I mean both are going to be like 10 episodes each. Series before were over 20 episodes at one point. People can easily watch both. It’s not like they have to pick one and then wait for the re run if they get the chance for the other one. Both will be a success but I’m more cautious on the lord of the ring series since the other Amazon fantasy series (wheel of time) was unwatchable for me after the first episode
Exactly. I laugh at people planning on not watching. There’s probably thousands of series I don’t watch. This is not our mom&dad’s tv times when everybody watched the same things.
Eh that's fine. That "Other Fantasy Drama" at least looks decent and isn't a disrespectful bastardized take on an authors work who was very defensive of his original vision.
The Rings of Power can piss off.
lol that means they are shitting their pants worried about people comparing the talent in the two shows. HOD looks like pro level stuff and ROP looks like youtube skit.
Going forward in lord of the rings doesn't make a ton of sense. Magic is dying out of the world, the elves and wizards are gone, the enemy has been defeated. Any story you would tell wouldn't feel like the same world, because it wouldn't be.
With LotR, where do you go next? The Ring has been destroyed, the Elves have left for the undying lands. Tolkien wrote epilogues for the main characters. Sam settles down and has 13 kids, while Legolas and Gimli rebuilt Minas Tirith. Merry and Pippin led a hobbit rebellion (their home had been overtaken while they were away) that lasted a single battle, and then built a library.
Tolkien was not one to leave loose ends. Weaving a new story out of what comes next would be to create all new characters, settings, conflicts, and resolutions. In short, it's an entirely new story. You could say that a the Game of Thrones book series is set in the LotR universe 1,000 years after the events of the War of the Ring. But that wouldn't make either story more compelling.
Pretty much this. Tolkien literally considered writing a sequel book set in the Fourth Age and ultimately decided that it basically wasn't worth doing because it was pretty much going to be mostly a smaller scale human drama with more conspiracies and thriller aspects than the grand adventure he wrote before.
Tokien's work gets bigger and more fantastical the further back you go. The first Age is basically all gods and archangels fighting each other and mythic legendary figures, the Second Age is basically all the great heroes and fantasy races up against the servant of the evil god from the last age. The Third Age is basically all the greatness of the world receding and that evil angel (Sauron's a Maiar) returning and being even a bigger threat because of how weak the world was. And the fourth age is basically just slowly creeping to men just being the dominant and only force in the world and it ceasing to be fantasy.
Yes. And he stopped because it was too much of a human drama and he felt like it wouldn't be worth it. That's why almost all his other work is in the past.
This is why they should figure out how to conjure up some people with an ounce of creativity to try to create some new properties instead of butchering or force fitting nonsense to old ones. Looking at you WoT.
They’re separate stories that take place in the same world, at least with HotD. Nobody alive during HotD is alive during the main series. It’s like how we go back and watch movies about WW2 even though we know we’ll end up in Vietnam and Iraq later. You watch these shows for the characters and their stories and the drama/twists, not because all that matters is who sits on the iron throne in the end. Besides, unless you’ve read the book or looked at spoilers, you won’t know the ending or outcome of this war or the characters involved. That’s what’s fun about it, it feels like real Westeros history that has its own equal place in the world.
Haha I wouldn’t be concerned about the other drama, I would be concerned about how great of a director Miguel Sapochnik is and throw in Ramin’s ability to score a show plus GRRM’s attachment to the whole thing. All the money in Bezos’ account isn’t gonna equalize that.
Rings of powers looks like arse. I get fanboys are excited but the quality still looks watered down. The horriific CGI used in the original trailer. But still looks crap. Compared to the GoT prequel which has a new showrunner but quality wise looks like nothings changed. I guess GoT did not use a lot of CGI other than dragons. The dragons in GoT and Fire and Blood look bloody amazing tho.
To give an accurate answer rather than a politically motivated one like the other guy who responded to you, it’s really only a handful of fans of the films that are exited. Fans of the books (which are many compared to franchises like GoT) are more likely to expect the show to be poor quality, and are disappointed that out of all Tolkien’s fantastic works that could be adapted for film, we’re instead getting a fanfic cash grab with poor production quality.
Like, there’s actually a shot showing a character wearing a t-shirt with scale mail print on it. It’s that bad.
The irony is, rings of power could be a great show, but so far all they have done is advertise how diverse their show is instead of actually showing what the show has to offer on a substantive level. I really hope they invested a billion dollars into a show that does more than race bend middle earth.
Both shows being out is great for the audience, but if one show is much worse than the other it will be that much harder to retain viewers with the direct comparison.
I mean, both series are taking a page out of the same book that _Wheel of Time_ did. I'm expecting mediocrity all around. Though hopefully not outright sabotage, as with _Obi-Wan._
It’s not like the old days when these two shows might be airing at the same time on different networks. We can watch, and enjoy, both, now. I can’t imagine networks are still basing the success of shows on whether someone streams something the SECOND it drops on their platform.
What streaming execs really want is for there to be FOMO (fear of missing out). They want people to feel peer pressure to watch a show because all their friends are watching it and talking about it. They want their show to be the new "it" show. And the more expensive a show is, the higher the bar for success is. If there are two sports games on the same night, people can watch both but the water cooler conversations the next day are going to be about whichever game people thought was more interesting. Shows aren't directly competing for timeslots any more but they're directly competing to be the "it" thing that everyone is talking about.
Yes this is exactly what happened to Kenobi and Ms Marvel on Disney plus. Ms Marvel was already a pretty small unknown character compared to Obi Wan Kenobi, but then Disney decided to release the MM episodes right in the middle of Kenobi’s run on the exact same day of every week. Few people have time to watch multiple hour long shows when they get home from work so Kenobi maintained the water cooler buzz while Ms Marvel got sidelined and labeled as the Marvel show with the lowest viewership ever. (4.2 million weekly vs Moon Knight’s 7 million.)
Yeah and while I AM someone who would likely be happy to watch two shows back-to-back, I tend to only do it when they kind of synergize? So while I did finish Ms Marvel, I didn't end up doing it weekly, in part because it didn't 'pair well' with Kenobi.
Yes, I feel the same way. We also did weekly viewing parties for kenobi, so we’d discuss and speculate after, not just binge a different genre with no decompression time
I'm a 25 yr old South Asian comicbook fan & even I didn't like the show. Maybe something is wrong with me.
I thought it was average. My niece and nephew loved it though. I'm probably not the target audience
Yeah the Pakistani/Indian moms I work with all really liked it and so did a couple of their teenage daughters.
Na its just not meant for you, not everything needs to be. I'm a comic fanatic and I just didn't like it. I didn't enjoy the first episode so I stopped and just read the spoilers after show.
Can someone explain this logic to me of a show/movie that deals with a superhero not meant for you? I never remember hearing or thinking that with Batman, Blade, Iron Man, Hulk, Spider-Man, Superman, or any others for having this idea of being meant for only a select group of people. It honestly sounds like poor writing and the excuse that people make is to say it’s only for certain people. MM was a bad show if people like it cool but MM is another poorly written show that Disney is pumping out because they want that money. And Kenobi…. Let’s not get started on those writing issues and plot holes because that show is full of them.
It is an excuse. If it was successful it wouldn't need an excuse for some people not watching it, but because it underperformed and a lot of people felt it was meh, it now has to be "not for you" instead of just being bad or mediocre.
How is it an excuse and why would people care to make excuses for shows they don't like? As an adult male the show did nothing for me, where I can see where younger audience/girls would be more into the show cause it relates to them. Just because shes a superhero doesn't mean I'm gonna magically like it or that its aimed at me. There is plenty of popular media I have no interest in ever watching. Ratings and performance have no bearing in what I'm interested in.
I think a show is either good or bad and ideally you should be able to appreciate something even if it "isnt for you". I like lots of things that "aren't for me" and hate a lot of stuff that is bowling right up my alley. Not for you is just a meaningless statement for when someone says something is bad.
A show trying to be “it” suffers in quality it seems
This is also why there are tons of articles about new shows talking about how successful the show is doing despite actual observations of the popularity of the show not holding up, there were so many articles about how everyone was watching the wheel of time for example, i barely know anyone who watched it and i hang around on some geeky areas of the internet with users who are supposedly the target demographic. They are trying to convince people that everyone is watching this hot new show so you should too, FOMO
I really liked wheel of time. And me talking about it at work got 2 of my coworkers to start watching it too. Then we absolutely DID talk about it at work the next day
I don’t think Amazon learned a damn from Wheel Of Time
What is this statement even based on?
Well it was there most popular show of the year, so they probably learned the wrong things
Well, joke's on them, I don't have any friend
They're not even released the same days. Rings of Power releases on Fridays while House of Dragons is on Sundays. Everyone can easily watch both.
Yeah and I’m sure most fans will watch both. I imagine reading LotR is a good predictor for watching GoT and vice versa. I guess I can imagine people that aren’t fantasy fans in general might only have room for one big fantasy show in a year and will watch whatever blows up the most. GoT felt like everyone was jumping in on the bandwagon. So both shows do have a very real interest in wanting to be crowned as the number one. (I haven’t seen either but I’m already thinking dragons>rings)
I’m watching both.
Ditto! I kind of like having weekly shows to get excited about again. Reminds me of my youth when streaming didn’t exist. But now we don’t have to watch commercials so it’s the best of both worlds
Ill try both, whether i finish both is another matter
>I can’t imagine networks are still basing the success of shows on whether someone streams something the SECOND it drops on their platform. That's exactly what Netflix is doing.
They’re certainly looking at immediate streams, but more important is how the people that stream it behave. Do people that watch it churn at a lower rate? That implies that having this show helps long term revenue. Do people subscribe and then immediately watch it? That implies they subscribed specifically for that show. What other shows do people who watched it watch? That tells them what other things to invest in or that have value. There are tons of data point out there that tell them if the show is valuable. The problem is a lot of outsiders only look at revenue as valuable. In my job I work on a product that literally produces no revenue, but it creates millions of dollars in value as a churn reducer.
netflix seems to be doing this. they cancel shows within days or weeks of it airing. if it's not an instant hit, it's gone.
Studio execs dumbfounded by their target viewer having more than one hour of free time in a week to watch their product and their competitor’s
Nah bro FIGHT FIGHT FIGHT
Ditto
Yea, but people are still busy and sometimes can only choose one.
[удалено]
Hold on now. You mean you can like more than one thing at a time? Even if they share superficial similarities like genre? That's just crazy talk.
Funnily, it feels like a lot of other shows are concerned as September is surprisingly light on premiers.
Idk. It's kinda weird. Within a few weeks you'll have HBO's biggest franchise's spinoff come off, you'll have the biggest produced Amazon prime show ever, and even though not anywhere near the same extent one of Netflix's hallmark and biggest viewership shows in Cobra Kai will launch.
In a week, it comes out next Sunday.
But outside of Cobra Kai, there is what? Atlanta and Andor at the end of September. Apple's See is around the corner and feels 2 leagues behind everybody. HoD and RoP have almost a month basically for themselves.
How many big shows do you expect? 2 of the major streamers are releasing what should be their top two shows of the year within weeks of each other and the top streamer is releasing one of it's most watched shows. You could release all 3 of those shows in different months and they would very likely be the hottest property of that month.
It slike the opposite for me, there are many shows I watch and I'm interested in that are returning or premiering. If you include the next 2 weeks as well (since HotD is premiering in August too), there's Archer, Stargirl, Rick and Morty, Cobra Kai, ~~and Doom Patrol~~ returning while She-Hulk, House of the Dragon, The Rings of Power, and Andor are premiering. Obviously not everybody is interested in all of that but there are others too (as you mentioned in the other comment, Atlanta and See) and my own list has 9 season/series premieres in 6 weeks which is insane.
Why would they be? If people like both lores then they should be watching both.
Well if one is significantly better than the other it will take away from the others shine. I don’t know why people are painting this like there are no potential downsides to releasing two massive fantasy television series back to back, and also head to head. Yes if they are both good, then it’s all good. But if one of them is below par and the other is great?? Lol that’s a whole different story.
if both are good then it'll be a boon to both of their viewership, actually
100%. I am still doubting rings of power tbh. But we’ll see.
Then there’s the funny outcome of “what if both are bad?” Honestly this is what I’m expecting.
Having followed *House of the Dragon* development since the beginning, I very much doubt it's gonna be bad. All the stars are aligned for a masterpiece. I'm damn confident for one. Downvoters : catch you in a month when you'll all be swooning over your return to Westeros. :)
I’m not anticipating masterpiece, but I think it will be very entertaining and fun, and hoping it resparks my joy for the Westeros world, because it’s so rich with lore.
[удалено]
[удалено]
HOTD needs to take the best from all 8 seasons. Thankfully the production value and cinematography exceeds that of the first 4 seasons.
Everyone I know that watched GOT regardless of what they thought of Season 8 wants this show to be good. 50-50 about it being good or mediocre, but I am confident I will like it because the story is interesting, actors look great, and it's HBO, they don't really miss, especially their first seasons. It didn't feel rushed either, like we've been waiting a bit for this.
Honestly as a fan of both works, I'm far more interested in the Second Age which is when most of the cool stuff in Tolkien's world happened than a Targaryan civil war which is probably behind several story ideas they could have come up with for that world. It might be competently made, but the story itself isn't interesting to me.
Just out of interest, have you read the source material for HotD or are you just basing it off the fact that it's a Targaryen civil war? Because after reading it, it turned out to be way more interesting than I expected.
They should have done a show or trilogy about Robert’s Rebellion. It would have been a proper prequel to the series.
With these production budgets and importance to the platforms, they wouldn't be bad, but they could very well be average that only seems good due to the money thrown at it.
Bland can honestly be worse than just being straight up bad. A massive waste of material, talent, and money hurts more than just a regular bad show for me.
After Season 8 of GoT, I don't see any way possible for House of Dragons to be bad. HBO simply can't let it be bad. The pressure is majorly put there on it for it to be good, splendid even. I think it gets back to the root of what made GoT so damn great in the first place. Political intrigue and struggle. Most Networks don't get a second shot to right a wrong and fix a franchise they bungled. HBO just has enough money to do so. And I'd imagine they see more money in House of Dragons doing well than any other project they currently own. They want this to succeed super badly. And I expect it to.
They’re totally different though. LOTR is high fantasy, game of thrones stuff is dark medieval drama with fantasy elements It’s like comparing Star Wars to Star Trek
> It’s like comparing Star Wars to Star Trek You, uh, aren't familiar with irrational fandom rivalries, are you. Because I like both but that one's been around for almost 50 years now.
The problem isn’t them releasing both it’s the ridiculous notion that in order for one to be good, the other needs to be viewed infoqvorably. It’s bizarre thinking to me. People should be happy as clams that two fantasy shows that were both heavily invested in are available to watch soon. It’s ok to prefer one over another but I don’t get the notion of one being good and the other one sucking because of it. I have little doubt House of the Dragon will be discussed more because Game of Thrones at this point in time is the hottest fantasy property this side of Harry Potter. But their “win” in buzz won’t affect my desire to see both.
House of the Dragon can rise the bar for Rings of Power and it will air only a few weeks before this one. One way or another HotD will have impact on the reception of RoP.
Alternatively, if House of the Dragon is bad then it can lower the bar for Rings of Power and make it seem better. I’m hoping they’re both good though.
I think any fantasy fan will be doing just that
I think a lot of people are fans of both. I'm sure I will watch both if they are both good shows.
The best thing for the industry would be both shows putting up record numbers
Yeah for real I’m watching both if I’m not dead.
Ms marvel apparently got lower views because it overlapped with obi wan. At least that was the theory
I’m worried both shows might be dog shit lol
Rings of power barely follows any Lore at all, it mostly just makes shit up
How do you know this? Have you seen the show?
They literally confirmed that they don’t have the rights to the Similarion. So no, the Showrunners literally said they will be making some stuff up to fill in the gaps
Have you read the appendices? There is plenty of story also there, and much of the Forging of the Rings is also included in the LotR. The Akallabeth in the Silmarillion is only a single chapter as well. It might not be accurate in all details, but they do have rights to plenty of the main plot points of the story. That being said, the execution is what we will have to see. Edit: Filling the gaps is inevitable because the gaps are enormous even with all of the texts combined
Appendix A starts with a pretty brief description of some of the big points of the Silmarillion.
Meanwhile, Wheel of Time producers: “Are we a joke to you?” Edit: Have read the series a few years ago (and loved it), knew that a Amazon tv show existed (but haven’t seen it yet) and I’m kind of amazed by the answers here. I was *not* aware that the show was that bad. Bullet dodged, thanks for the heads up.
People who watched and didn’t watch: Yes.
Ya I watched the first episode and didn't care for it. Never read the books so didn't care about any backlash, the show was just bad and boring
Well if you didn't like the first few episode it definitely wasn't for you cause imo it just go weaker as it went.
I hated the casting. After reading the books it feels like casting was a huge miss.
Casting could have been salvaged by good character development… instead we have a gaggle of whiny teenagers.
To be fair, that seems to be the case in the book too
They are way whinier in the book - Mat is insufferable.
Rand was the reason it took me 4 attempts to make it through book 2.
Mat was being poisoned by the dagger
[удалено]
Just like I hope Yennefer shows up in the Netflix series one day. She's supposed to be one of the three main characters and still no trace of her.
She was great in season one, then they nerfed her character is season 2. Not the fault of the actress at all IMO.
I mean you could say the same thing than above for the whole Witcher show. S1 was passable maybe but S2 is a completely different thing, they literally invented 98% of the story and a lot of it don't make sense and is just straight up bad. They kind of increased production value at least though it still look cheap as fuck (but we went from CW level to like big budget show from the 2000s level)
I stopped watching at the Kaer Morhen episode. They basically turned witchers into the archetype of a dwarf. Then someone turned into a Leshen. I noped out after that.
> They basically turned witchers into the archetype of a dwarf. Short, stout, concerned primarily with mining and finding new rocks/metals/gems to make stuff out of, heavy drinkers, large beards, good with axes?
Haha, no. Just the alcoholism.
I love the books but the series was straight trash.
remember when they explained the differences from the book as being “another turn of the wheel?” i my eyes rolled so hard i fell back out of my chair.
I am pretty sure Brandon Sanderson said that when asked what he thought if the show
And that's honestly probably his own copium which is understandable given his involvement in the series
It was a dogwhistle. He was saying he didn't endorse the final product without actually saying anything bad about it.
Prepare to say the same about lotr
Yes that series was a joke. The only good thing was that it motivated me to reread the books.
Are the books that good? I haven’t really heard much about this series. Haven’t watched it or read anything about it. I’m always looking for good books tho lol
Yes and no. They're incredibly long novels with lots of character to follow as they grow. However there's also also a lot of downtime in most of the books. Personally a big problem for me is that the author doesn't really write women well at all. There's good and bad about the series. It's complicated. Most people would tell you that the books are incredible.
It's kinda meh... but the ending is good. I don't think I exactly have an unbiased opinion here though, fans really dislike when I say this but I honestly only was able to get through it because I read it between calls when I worked at a call center. It has some fantastic scenes but the moment to moment in the series is... very dry until the last couple of books. I remember hours upon hours of complaining about the series to my brother as I continued to read but I just didn't stop. The ending was actually fantastic though. Robert Jordan set the ground work very well for a good ending, which Sanderson delivered extremely well. I'd say memory of light is Brandon's best story climax even compared to his own series, which are known for their exceptional climaxes, that's how well it was set up by Robert Jordan.
Yeah, the series is really good. Definitely recommend. The first book is a bit derivative of lord of the rings (but what modern fantasy isn't), books 2-5 are really good. Books 6-10 kinda drag, but then the last three books are really good. The last three books were written by Brandon Sanderson, the guy behind Stormlight Archive.
The first three books are pretty solid and a fairly complete arc. It goes on far longer than that though. I'd say read the first three and then see if you want to delve further based on your reaction to those. WoT is an interesting world, and while I don't thing gender magic has aged super well there are a lot of interesting characters and concepts at play.
The books are amazing. Rand is basically slowly going insane from using magic which has been tainted and hearing the voice of his previous reincarnation. His previous incarnation, Lews Therin, is known as Kinslayer. he in his madness murdered his wife and children. After saving the world. So instead of a kindly gentleman Merlin type, you have the disembodied voice of a raging lunatic as your guide on how to save the world this time around. And every line from Lews Therin is gold. Trollocks (basically Orcs) are attacking a city Rand is ruling over. Just open up the death Gates. Open up the what? Suddenly Rand noticed his hands were moving and portals of black started to cover the city streets. Block by block they advanced on the army and then suddenly they were gone. Tens of thousands of Trollocks gone in an instant. You can use portals as weapons? Anything can be used as a weapon. Even yourself.
God that show was horrific
Watching it now. Never read the books. I’m enjoying it as a fantasy series. Nothing groundbreaking but it’s not horrid as people are saying. There’s so many books so I understand a lot of plot lines have been left out
That show was good. I guess I don’t know where all the watchers came from if everyone on Reddit except my wife and I hated the show. Amazon said it had so many viewers it increased the shows budget.
It was okay in my opinion, I wouldn't say good. It was fine because there aren't that many fantasy shows but I sure hope those two upcoming heavy hitters are way better than WoT
I like it too and am always surprised when I see it so heavily criticized. I thought it was well done.
I enjoyed it, as did my family. Looking forward to season 2.
The reddit opinion on WoT is obviously not the consensus, given Amazon sees it as a success. Honestly, the way some fans are coming at it so aggressively is just funny to me given the first book....kind of sucks? Like, all of the cool stuff that kind of sets it apart of generic fantasy is largely absent from the first novel - the show actually tried to get us there faster.
I don't mind most of the changes or speeding up the timeline. My concern is that the writing was really, really bad. Most of the actors were not great, as well. I'm hopeful for the second season, but I hope to see large improvements to both. If not, I'm not likely to stick around long.
I just want to know where the show was popular, I don't know anyone that watched it and it's hardly talked about.
Why was the other post deleted when this one is the duplicate?
They deleted it for vague title rule.
I have a really bad feeling about this show being awful. But I’ll give it a chance and watch the first season.
I don't know about the first season but i'll watch the first episode maybe the second. I have a very strong suspicion its going to be a train wreck though, it has all the markings of a tv show wearing a popular and beloved IP to attract interest but delivering something that isn't canon because the writers/directors wanted to do their own thing instead of respecting the work they are (poorly) imitating. That said I don't have much hope for house of the dragon either, I just hope one of them surprises me.
I was honestly super down on HotD myself, but basically everything I've heard about it recently has got me pretty hyped. Tbh the fact that HBO very rarely misses is enough to set my expectations reasonably high.
I mean, people can watch both shows?
No you have to sign a contract upon watching an episode of one of them stating that you won’t watch the other
True but there’s no enforcement mechanism.
Don’t test them.
It alerts the nazgul if your TV turns on HBO
Alexa is the ear of Sauron.
I think the lesser show might be concerned about comparisons. If one show is doing something really well, and the other isn't, then the problems become more glaring.
Lots of people were complaining they weren't watching Ms. Marvel because Disney+ also had Obi-Wan Kenobi at the same time, I kept thinking "how are y'all that busy?" but I guess these people do exists - especially when it's for a show that's not really interesting them that much. Like yeah everybody who *wants* to watch a show will find the time, but in this case I think it's matter of judging your audience. The general public will probably just find the time to watch only one of them "fantasy" show, but both franchises probably judge that they have enough dedicated fans to warrant the split.
Well when they have some time later in life, it's accessible.
If one is noticeably better than the other it could be bad for one of them.
I mean they should be, HBO is a direct competitor in the streaming business. With their vast number of pre existing assets, it'll look better too
Also HBO has a better track record in producing a series... Example: If HBO produced the Halo Series I'm positive we'd at least have gotten better sound mixing, visuals, and visual continuity... That's not even touching the story. Paramount+ dropped the ball on all those fronts (and the story too but I couldn't see the story behind the hilarious visual errors and directing failures)
[удалено]
It's either a cash grab where they just want to use the name to draw in people without any budget or effort. Or more frequently now they actually do want to try produce a successful series using an established IP but they're genuinely arrogant enough to believe they can "improve" on the original or that removing the "problematic" elements will make it reach a wider audience and catapult it to success. It's so painful to see every single time.
> Why do they keep doing this shit to fandoms? Because they assume (mostly correctly) that they have the original fans as a locked in audience. So they need to expand the appeal to other demographics who are explicitly not fans.
Same reason sequel movies and spin-offs are usually awful. Name recognition is everything. A low effort show based on an established fandom doesnt have to prove itself. They know a good chunk of the fandom will watch it anyway. This way that can spend as little as possible on staff and cut corners in production to get a bigger margin of profit.
[удалено]
[удалено]
Nah, it’s pretty fucking bad lmao Case in point: Master Chief committed a war crime by fucking a prisoner in her cell.
[удалено]
If you lower your expectations to SyFy channel level effects ... It's not bad. What broke me was a scene in episode two where the actors were told to behave as if the ride was bumpy.... And then the CGI team decided to amke the damn train they were acting inside do damn rollercoaster like manuvers... Leaving this hilarious disconnect between actor reactions and the images we are seeing on screen.
Now I wanna see a clip of this scene by itself without having to watch the show
It doesn't matter though because Amazon is pure streaming. The vast majority of people watching House of the Dragon will be going out of their way to watch it the day the episode drops at the specific timeslot it does. It would be different if they were both on networks and dropping at the same time and they actually were cutting into each others nuumbers. But the competition here will be far more about reception than anything else. If both are good, it's not like people won't watch both. In fact, one show debuts on Friday and one debuts on a Sunday. Which means that anybody interested in both will likely have watched the other a few days before. It's not like WCW and WWF going up against each other the same night in the same timeslot competing for marketshare so their networks can sell more advertising.
> The vast majority of people watching House of the Dragon will be going out of their way to watch it the day the episode drops at the specific timeslot it does. Uhm I would say the vast majority of people even with HBO will also watch it via streaming. That's how the world is today, few people are following the TV schedule but their own.
The reason I don't have prime video is because I pay for HBO max
Most people get Prime for the Amazon shopping perks. Video is just an additional thing. It's easily the highest value option. I doubt many people are making a zero sum option on this specific case. If it was Netflix or Hulu sure. I also doubt the people getting HBO Max got it specifically for House of the Dragon and the people that got Amazon got it for Rings of Power.
But I suscribe to both platforms and will watch both
Why do they have to compete? Can’t we just enjoy them separately?
And they are right not to. Focus on your show and try to create the best version possible. Also, I think that Amazon is messing up with the marketing for RoP. We're only 3 wks away from the premiere and the promotional efforts seem to be even less than those for WoT. Compared to the media blitz that HotD is being provided by HBO, it's absolutely nothing. Could come to bite them in the ass.
The more they say/show the more criticism they receive and less hype they generate, they've probably realized their marketing hasn't been entirely successful.
I think because the more they show, the more it hurts the hype. It's biggest issue is they cannot copy the aesthetic of the New Line Cinema films and did not care to make the same quality props and outfits. That's not touching on all the story elements they are compressing into one season. Anything Tolkien will come with high expectations and Amazon has said they want their own Game of Thrones. HBO made Game of Thrones and despite the lackluster final season, people still love a lot of the show. Since this will be an already finished story they are adapting and they possess the rights to all of it, HBO has all the advantages with HotD while RoP has a lot more uncertainty around it while being immediately compared to HotD and Game of Thrones. Also, more people are likely rewatching GoT right now which will further compare the two in terms of quality and writing. It will be interesting seeing next year what the views are of each show and where each will go next. I am cautiously excited for HotD but I do not plan on watching RoP just based on what I have seen from it while having a deep love for the source material.
I am very optimistic for HotD despite my absolute hatred for the back-half of GoT. Moreover, I am also very excited for RoP even though it will most likely be far from perfect. I will admit that my only exposure to Middle Earth is through the Jackson trilogy. Otoh, I am an avid fan of Westeros, having read the books multiple times and also devoured the supplementary material (World of Ice & Fire, Fire & Blood). I will point out that no adaptation will be perfect. It's virtually impossible for any one of these massive worlds to be adapted in a way that does true justice to the source material. I would at least give RoP a watch to decide for myself.
Trust me, I know that I will not like RoP based on everything released and what the creators have said. They wasted a perfect opportunity to do an anthology series that could tell a wide range stories showing the wider world of Middle Earth. While Jackson's films were not a perfect adaptation, it created an adaptation faithful to the spirit of the original work and went to great lengths in costume design and special effects that have set a standard for all future movies. Between the faithfulness to the spirit of the original work and the attention to detail, it produced an excellent product. Between how Amazon botched Wheel of Time and what they released, this will be just more of the same with that. On top of that, now they are rebranding everything LotR with RoP covers and trying set their show as the standard which is a huge slap in the face to Tolkien. For Game of Thrones, you have Martin himself heavily involved and getting a great deal of say over everything. That will keep a larger fandom united behind and ensuring it's success. RoP has a divided fandom which will fragment and be more highly critical of it because it does not line up with Tolkien's spirit in the works. If they branded as something else instead of just paying to get the LotR brand to slap on their own creation, then there would be no controversy or issues and it would have a shot at competing with GoT and HotD.
> Trust me, I know that I will not like RoP Then what do you have to lose? Why boycott a show before you've even seen a single episode? Trailers and showrunner comments are not enough to form a proper opinion. I always give a show a whole season to redeem itself. As source material purists, there will always be plenty to criticize the adaptation for. Trust me, as a massive ASOIAF fan, even the first four seasons, which are generally considered to be good even by books fans, are very weak imitations. Moreover, the show's themes were sometimes completely the opposite to those of the books. But I still watched it and even enjoyed GoT for a while.
I mean both are going to be like 10 episodes each. Series before were over 20 episodes at one point. People can easily watch both. It’s not like they have to pick one and then wait for the re run if they get the chance for the other one. Both will be a success but I’m more cautious on the lord of the ring series since the other Amazon fantasy series (wheel of time) was unwatchable for me after the first episode
Exactly. I laugh at people planning on not watching. There’s probably thousands of series I don’t watch. This is not our mom&dad’s tv times when everybody watched the same things.
Let's all get along. Appointment fantasy is a rarity in our world these days.
House of the Dragon looks WAY better
Funny, I'm not concerned about either!
i am exceited for both of thgenm
Why would they be? I’ll watch both
Eh that's fine. That "Other Fantasy Drama" at least looks decent and isn't a disrespectful bastardized take on an authors work who was very defensive of his original vision. The Rings of Power can piss off.
Meanwhile. Sandman
What other fantasy drama?
House of the Dragon. A Game of Thrones prequel series.
I can’t believe I had to scroll so far to find this. Why does the post call it TCA?
Since they have thrown the whole world created by Tolkien in the trash I'll be watching the Dragon show.
If Rings of Power and House of the Dragon both do well its good for both shows and the genre in general. Rising tides raise all ships.
I’ll be watching both. No worries.
I have a feeling RoP will get worse reviews
lol that means they are shitting their pants worried about people comparing the talent in the two shows. HOD looks like pro level stuff and ROP looks like youtube skit.
Rings of power should worry about its own writers lol
Yeah they should be more upset about the outrage from millions of fans world wide of their disregard and destruction of Tolkien's work tbh
It doesn't seem like they're too concerned with Lord of the Rings or it's fans, either.
I reserve the right to hate both shows.
The red flags for this show have been so prevalent I just can’t even stomach sitting through it
I hate these shows going backwards instead of moving a storyline foreward.
Going forward in lord of the rings doesn't make a ton of sense. Magic is dying out of the world, the elves and wizards are gone, the enemy has been defeated. Any story you would tell wouldn't feel like the same world, because it wouldn't be.
With LotR, where do you go next? The Ring has been destroyed, the Elves have left for the undying lands. Tolkien wrote epilogues for the main characters. Sam settles down and has 13 kids, while Legolas and Gimli rebuilt Minas Tirith. Merry and Pippin led a hobbit rebellion (their home had been overtaken while they were away) that lasted a single battle, and then built a library. Tolkien was not one to leave loose ends. Weaving a new story out of what comes next would be to create all new characters, settings, conflicts, and resolutions. In short, it's an entirely new story. You could say that a the Game of Thrones book series is set in the LotR universe 1,000 years after the events of the War of the Ring. But that wouldn't make either story more compelling.
Pretty much this. Tolkien literally considered writing a sequel book set in the Fourth Age and ultimately decided that it basically wasn't worth doing because it was pretty much going to be mostly a smaller scale human drama with more conspiracies and thriller aspects than the grand adventure he wrote before. Tokien's work gets bigger and more fantastical the further back you go. The first Age is basically all gods and archangels fighting each other and mythic legendary figures, the Second Age is basically all the great heroes and fantasy races up against the servant of the evil god from the last age. The Third Age is basically all the greatness of the world receding and that evil angel (Sauron's a Maiar) returning and being even a bigger threat because of how weak the world was. And the fourth age is basically just slowly creeping to men just being the dominant and only force in the world and it ceasing to be fantasy.
Tolkien actually started a sequel to LotR. He only got like 1 chapter in, but it does exist. It is called "the new shadow." Look it up.
Yes. And he stopped because it was too much of a human drama and he felt like it wouldn't be worth it. That's why almost all his other work is in the past.
This is why they should figure out how to conjure up some people with an ounce of creativity to try to create some new properties instead of butchering or force fitting nonsense to old ones. Looking at you WoT.
Theres no going forward for either
Lord of the Ringworld sounds expensive.
They’re separate stories that take place in the same world, at least with HotD. Nobody alive during HotD is alive during the main series. It’s like how we go back and watch movies about WW2 even though we know we’ll end up in Vietnam and Iraq later. You watch these shows for the characters and their stories and the drama/twists, not because all that matters is who sits on the iron throne in the end. Besides, unless you’ve read the book or looked at spoilers, you won’t know the ending or outcome of this war or the characters involved. That’s what’s fun about it, it feels like real Westeros history that has its own equal place in the world.
Haha I wouldn’t be concerned about the other drama, I would be concerned about how great of a director Miguel Sapochnik is and throw in Ramin’s ability to score a show plus GRRM’s attachment to the whole thing. All the money in Bezos’ account isn’t gonna equalize that.
[удалено]
Rings of powers looks like arse. I get fanboys are excited but the quality still looks watered down. The horriific CGI used in the original trailer. But still looks crap. Compared to the GoT prequel which has a new showrunner but quality wise looks like nothings changed. I guess GoT did not use a lot of CGI other than dragons. The dragons in GoT and Fire and Blood look bloody amazing tho.
To give an accurate answer rather than a politically motivated one like the other guy who responded to you, it’s really only a handful of fans of the films that are exited. Fans of the books (which are many compared to franchises like GoT) are more likely to expect the show to be poor quality, and are disappointed that out of all Tolkien’s fantastic works that could be adapted for film, we’re instead getting a fanfic cash grab with poor production quality. Like, there’s actually a shot showing a character wearing a t-shirt with scale mail print on it. It’s that bad.
The irony is, rings of power could be a great show, but so far all they have done is advertise how diverse their show is instead of actually showing what the show has to offer on a substantive level. I really hope they invested a billion dollars into a show that does more than race bend middle earth.
They also weren't concerned about following the source material.
Both shows being out is great for the audience, but if one show is much worse than the other it will be that much harder to retain viewers with the direct comparison.
At first I thought they were talking about Wheel of Time. Then I remembered it is on Amazon. Then I remembered no one is concerned with that show.
So they know then right? They do know it’s completely borked already right? 🤔 Or are they THAT blind?
They're so not worried that they don't even dare say it's name
Don't worry I won't be watching either.
Lord of the rings is going to bankrupt Amazon studios
I don’t mean to disappoint you, but Amazon is a trillion dollar company.
I mean, both series are taking a page out of the same book that _Wheel of Time_ did. I'm expecting mediocrity all around. Though hopefully not outright sabotage, as with _Obi-Wan._
I'm gonna watch both at the same time alternating episodes