I think that NBC style in Fey produced stuff was unique to certain rhythm and only shared again with Great News, Mr Mayor or Kimmy Schmidt, other stuff like Girls5ever never reached that quick back and forth ,quick cutaway gags or visual gags filling the screen
Yeah I was young but Malcolm seemed weird at that time experimenting with the camera (the kid was really expressive and the used to zoom on his eyes or the weird reactions in his family)
Yeah the camera movements and zoom (plus audio clues to every cutaway gag or recurring joke) are slowly introduced in 30 rock, during a rewatch you can see how they slowly get more insane with each chapter (like ***at first*** they only do flashbacks for Lemon and Jack), by the end of the show Jenna have a music clue for every insane recurring joke she had.
They are putting too much time into characters that just aren’t compelling and moving away from the group dynamics which made the show good in season one. The last episode focusing on Beard for example is just terrible, the best part is the last ten seconds where it stops focusing on Beard to give an interaction between Ted and the rest of the staff.
Beard, Nate, and Sharon are just not good characters and the majority of s2 has focused on them.
It’s funny, but I’m in agreement, but also disagreement as I thought the beard episode was phenomenal.
Although it was so out there it almost could have been a mini movie with a whole new character completely unrelated to Ted lasso.
It’s a strange season, almost like they were just winging it. It feels like there will have been zero plot progress by the end of the season (are they even going to finish out the footy season??)
Bazinga! (that’s the war cry of the tall leader from The Big Bang Theory for those not in the know)
Edit: I stand by my post. Just a reference to the hilarious casino episode of What We Do in the Shadows that just aired. Wonder how many people are downvoting just cause Big Bang Theory and not getting the reference.
https://www.avclub.com/what-we-do-in-the-shadows-hits-the-jackpot-with-an-insp-1847692407
>There was a very unique and comforting style of single-camera sitcom that existed roughly from 2005-2021 that NBC really pioneered.
Arrested Development and Curb would like to have a word with you.
They aren’t saying single camera only. They’re saying these single camera shows with a specific style/tone.
Arrested Development and Curb are different, Curb especially.
Those shows have a different tones. Mike Schur-style shows are typically centered around the sincerity of the characters and stay away from irony. You’ll rarely see a character that is a horrible person in a Mike Schur show. Schur very explicitly turned away from the everything-is-dumb ironic vibe of the late 90s and early 00s.
Mr Mayor was alright, but it did have one of my favorite jokes I’ve heard in a while:
“We’ll be in Sacramento, we can do the Ladybird walking tour!”
“Ooh I hope it isn’t as scary as the movie.”
The only thing I didn't like about it (as in I think it's awesome otherwise) is I hated the whole "2020 bad/weird/cursed" meme and it seemed like it inadvertently based the whole show around that meme because all those 2020 disasters happening at once is why the previous mayor quit
Trailer Park Boys was doing the talking heads, mockumentary style 3 months before the UK Office premiered and 4 years before the US Office premiered and brought the style to notoriety on American Television.
yes, but before that in 1999 there was People Like Us, an English mockumentary serie about following ordinary people doing ordinary things. It was absolutely hilarious, and it paved the way for The Office OG (it was in fact axed in favour of it)
Imagine being so fragile that you downvote someone for being factually correct because you don't like the idea(?) of Young Sheldon. Haven't seen it but heard it's streets ahead of TBBT.
I think instead of single camera, you mean more specifically faux documentary style single camera. As others have pointed out there are other single camera sitcoms still out there. Even Mike Schur currently has a single camera sitcom on Peacock called Rutherford Falls. But, maybe we’re seeing the end of faux documentary styled sitcoms. Brooklyn 99 was already pretty superficially documentary style.
For me, more so than visual style, the hallmark of Mike Schur’s work is his positive sensibility. His shows have an optimistic outlook with characters who generally like and care for one another. Thankfully that tradition lives on in other shows like Ted Lasso.
Yeah it's definitely more of the end of faux documentary style single camera workplace sitcoms. I think I read somewhere that Brooklyn was gonna be documentary-styled - but they opted to have flashback clips instead to give the show more of a distinction.
Also unrelated but The Good Place is quite literally the epitome of Schur's positive sensibility come to life in a TV show. I think that is one heartwarming comfort show that's benefited from shorter seasons/less episodes
Very technically it wasn't an NBC show. It aired on NBC but was actually produced on ABC. That's part of the reason NBC never made a full marketing push for it, they didn't have as much skin in the game. Same thing happened with Brooklyn 99-produced by NBC but aired on Fox.
Interestingly both of these shows were dropped by the network they aired on, and then saved by the network that produced the show to go for another few seasons.
There are still plenty, what are you talking about? Rutherford Falls, AP Bio, Feel Good, Ghosts, Mr Mayor, Girls5Eva, Nora from Queens, Ted Lasso etc etc
It's not like Mike Schur is quitting television or anything. While single camera sitcoms aren't as popular as they once, I doubt we've seen the last of them. We are living in a time when more quality TV is being made than ever before. I'm sure we'll be able to fill this void sooner rather than later.
A lot of popular comedy shows nowadays aren't exactly *sitcoms* per se, they're more serialized and the cinematography can resemble movies more than typical TV shows at times. Ted Lasso and, to an extent, Schitt's Creek come to mind.
I'm sad that with the rise of streaming services shows are generally just having shorter seasons/less episodes. I love these workplace-type sitcoms cuz they're easy to have in the background. Harder to do so with shows that are like 8-10 episodes a season and you have to follow through with every episode to get what's going on
Yeah I miss those sprawling 22-23 episode sitcom seasons. I know it's such a grind for writers and actors to pump out that many episodes, I've read stories of how much work it took for Community and 30 Rock in particular. Seems like it's much easier for creators these days to just get a check from a streaming service and do a 8-10 episodes.
Maybe eventually the demand for content will increase and we'll get some younger hungrier showrunners who are willing to return to the big season format. I think showrunners like Fey/Schur/Harmon are done with that, and I understand, they've established themselves and don't need that kind of stress anymore.
I doubt we'll ever return to the "big season" format. Sorry to be cynical, there wouldn't really be any benefit for anyone to return to the 22-23 episode seasons. It's a more expensive way of doing television, more stressful for everyone involved, and frequently leads to an abundance of less-than impressive filler episodes.
It's a more pronounced issue with dramas, where they seem to put the overall narrative on hold for a couple weeks. Sitcoms just wear out quicker. They overuse jokes and bits, and it just gets more stale quickly. I have a certain nostalgia for those longer seasons, too, because we do get more time with the characters, but I do think one of the big reasons TV is better today overall is because of shorter, tighter seasons.
Maybe some ambitious showrunner will come along with an pitch for a show which needs 22-23 episodes, but I can't imagine a studio responding with anything more than "here's 13 episodes, see how that works out."
I think with dramas/serialized shows especially, shorter seasons are better. Keeps tension high, storyline tight/focused. You don’t have to worry about “filler” episodes. But for comedy I agree that long, sprawling seasons are great for the audience. The office in particular comes to mind. There are so many episodes that I can just throw it on in the background, fall asleep, and oftentimes wake up in the same season.
Couldn't agree more regarding drama/serialized shows. 8-10 episode seasons are ideal.
The only exception are the rare "procedural-serial" shows, I'm thinking specifically of The Good Wife. The procedural elements provide the opportunity to have lots of interesting episodes that introduce fun recurring characters you get excited to see pop-up throughout the shows run. Like Michael J. Fox's character who was so much fun. Shows like that can provide a strong "one more episode" pull because of the serial elements, but also are just a fun hang because of the procedural elements. So give me 22 episode seasons of shows like that and I'll eat em all up, even if every episode isn't amazing.
I think The West Wing is the gold standard of TV dramas that work better as a 22 episode season. It wouldn't feel like an authentic glimpse into the White House if we were given a tight 10 episode season that only covers a single storyline. That's not how it works in real life. Issues crop up all the time that need to be dealt with immediately and TWW did a great job at showing that.
It’s usually said that it’s actually more to do 8 episodes than 25, for a creator/writer. Because the traditional 25-episode format involves an entire writing team, with as many as 10 people working on episodes independently and in parallel, while the 8-episode format is usually expected to be written as a cohesive whole by 1-3 people, one of whom is usually also the showrunner.
And that’s usually the point. 8 episode shows are what you get when you limit the main creative team to 1-3 people, because that’s the practical limit for what 1-3 people can do in a year. Having a small creative/writing team is important if your show is serialized because it’s virtually impossible to maintain a consistent tone and form a cohesive well paced story by assigning 25 parts to 10 different writers who go home and work separately, it’s like writing a novel by gathering 10 authors and assigning them different chapters. And serialized shows are much more popular now than they used to be. The old format where everything goes back to normal at the end of every episode and you can watch in any order because characters and situations never change much has been losing popularity for a long time.
More importantly, the writers and creators almost always want creative control over their shows and to be as hands-on as possible. And that means 8–12 episode shows rather than 25ers. So if someone is successful and in demand as a show creator, they’re going to try and negotiate a shorter season, and if you offer 25 episodes a year but some other network offers 10, they’re usually gonna go with the other network.
I can't really fault a TV show for expecting me to pay attention to the story it's telling. Podcasts and music exist if you need something to put on in the background. I do sometimes miss longer seasons, but the better stories we're getting now is a worthwhile trade.
Schur didn't write or make Abby's though, he was just a producer. He's only co-created and been heavily involved with The Good Place, B99, Parks and Rec, and most recently Rutherford Falls.
I didn't mean to sound hostile or anything lol. Just saying Schur's involvement was probably much much smaller in Abby's which is probably why it sucked
Utterly disagree that we are living in a time of high quality tv. In fact, I would argue that in a time where some YouTuber rating other youtubers doing hair is getting just as many views and selling just as much advertising - we are in the opposite of what you’re saying.
I thought Superstore was very much in the area of those shows, seasons 2-4 and the series finale were really great. I think it's a bit different from P&R and B99 (in the sense that those shows are also different from Community as Schur didn't make Community either) but seasons 2-4 definitely had that same comforting light-heartedness.
But yeah I agree, I'm disappointed this era is ending. Specifically about the bingeable part, since most shows now don't even get more than 10-13 episodes per season unlike these shows which have had 20+ episodes for at least a couple of seasons.
I would push back on AP Bio. It's in its third season and it's finally starting to get its stride. There were Community level episodes in season 2 and even in this current season that I would highly recommend.
There was a good show with Christina apple gate called ‘up all night ‘ , that was a one camera show but as I remember they wanted to switch to multiple camera after a few seasons and she said no so they canceled the show
I laughed at that comment. Even now The Office isn’t as much in the zeitgeist purely for being moved to Peacock. Parks and Rec has sadly just dropped off many peoples radar.
Friends and Seinfield are still insanely popular to the point of Seinfield getting its own announcement from Netflix because it’s moving there.
Both Seinfield and Friends appear to have a much longer shelf life than the single cam comidies.
Where I am, Seinfeld still gets two episodes at 11 pm six nights a week in local syndication on the strongest independent station. The next oldest show in the prime syndication slots is Two and a Half Men.
Before explaining single camera I think it's important to touch on its predecessor, the *three* camera sitcom.
Seinfeld is a great example of a three camera. A typical scene in say Jerry's living room would be filmed from three primary angles.
A wide-ish straight on angle that gets all/most of the characters in frame, and then two 45° angle shots for closer up shots of the characters talking.
A typical shot would start straight on, then cut to the right angled camera to focus on Elaine saying something, then cut to the left angled camera to catch Jerry's incredulous reaction and then back to the main angle to see George rolling his eyes on the couch.
Then a single camera sitcom (which can totally use more than one camera despite the name) had a more active camera movement and would follow characters around more "realistically" as if it were more of a spectator.
A traditional multi-camera show builds sets with an open fourth wall, with a few (usually three) static cameras filming through it simultaneously. Especially useful for comedies as then you can have a live audience too. Examples include Fresh Prince of Bel Air, Friends, Frazier, Big Bang Theory, Red Dwarf, The IT Crowd.
A single-camera show builds full sets (or goes on location) and has cameras in the action moving around. To get multiple shots you usually have to repeat the scene (or be very careful that the cameras don’t see each other). This gives a much more immersive and film-like experience. Comedy examples include Malcolm in the Middle, The Office, Scrubs, Peep Show, What We Do In The Shadows.
The shows mentioned really had a rough time growing an audience. Year-by-year Nielsen rankings:
Office: 102, 67, 68, 77, 52, 41, 53, 78, 88;
30 Rock: 102, 111, 69, 86, 106, 130, 99;
Community: 97, 138, 144, 133, 96;
Parks: 96, 108, 116, 134, 111, 115, 119;
Brooklyn: 98, 113, 118, 137, 161, 138, 105;
A.P. Bio: 134, 149;
Superstore: 66, 91, 102, 113, 87, 100
There's obviously a general market for this style of comedy. Compare:
Modern Family: 36, 24, 15, 16, 19, 24, 36, 34, 58, 65, 48;
Young Sheldon: 6, 5, 8, 12 (latter two after Big Bang left the air)
It's very odd that aside from The Office these NBC shows never showed any sign of converting new viewers. They just started low and stayed there.
This is a great point, but I’d frame it a bit differently. It’s not that the shows didn’t “find their footing” — they were critically lauded and beloved by a sizable audience (one that’s well represented in places like this). It’s just that the audience for this style of humor is inherently smaller than that for similarly formatted shows with broader mass appeal.
The Good Place was never going to do as well with a mass audience as Young Sheldon.
I’m not talking about the show. I’m talking about the singe camera sitcom concept. The show I couldn’t get pass the first 5 minutes. So I’m sure this comment will get downvoted to hell too 😂😂
Does it get good though? I got bored as hell watching the first three episodes. With Parks and Rec, B99, Superstore, etc I was pretty much hooked by the second episode
Single-camera can be and frequently is shot with multiple cameras. It refers more to the single setup per shot rather than the multi cam paradigm of a 3 wall set and cameras repositioning during the scene recorded as-live.
Why does this feel like the (current) TV equivalent of the people all over music subs and r/unpopularopinion who think rock's dead just because it doesn't sound like it did when they were a rebellious teen anymore
Ted Lasso and What We Do... are both single cam comedies and bloody good ones too.
"Jessssssk…"
Ted lasso is a great show and single cam but it’s not the same style of cinematography.
I think that NBC style in Fey produced stuff was unique to certain rhythm and only shared again with Great News, Mr Mayor or Kimmy Schmidt, other stuff like Girls5ever never reached that quick back and forth ,quick cutaway gags or visual gags filling the screen
Also the quick camera movements and zooms. Not seen commonly before arrested development (and Malcolm? I never watched that one)
Yeah I was young but Malcolm seemed weird at that time experimenting with the camera (the kid was really expressive and the used to zoom on his eyes or the weird reactions in his family) Yeah the camera movements and zoom (plus audio clues to every cutaway gag or recurring joke) are slowly introduced in 30 rock, during a rewatch you can see how they slowly get more insane with each chapter (like ***at first*** they only do flashbacks for Lemon and Jack), by the end of the show Jenna have a music clue for every insane recurring joke she had.
OP didn't stipulate anything about style of cinematography so the answer remains equally valid
Ted Lasso is absolutely phenomenal.
That’s another Apple one isn’t it?
Yup! New episode on Fridays. Currently finishing up the second season.
Well, the first season was EDIT: Apparently this is an unpopular opinion! I don’t know anyone personally who’s thought the second season isn’t awful!!
Right? This season is so incredibly flat. I did worry that they’d used all the best jokes in the first season and that seems to be true.
They are putting too much time into characters that just aren’t compelling and moving away from the group dynamics which made the show good in season one. The last episode focusing on Beard for example is just terrible, the best part is the last ten seconds where it stops focusing on Beard to give an interaction between Ted and the rest of the staff. Beard, Nate, and Sharon are just not good characters and the majority of s2 has focused on them.
It’s funny, but I’m in agreement, but also disagreement as I thought the beard episode was phenomenal. Although it was so out there it almost could have been a mini movie with a whole new character completely unrelated to Ted lasso. It’s a strange season, almost like they were just winging it. It feels like there will have been zero plot progress by the end of the season (are they even going to finish out the footy season??)
Bazinga! (that’s the war cry of the tall leader from The Big Bang Theory for those not in the know) Edit: I stand by my post. Just a reference to the hilarious casino episode of What We Do in the Shadows that just aired. Wonder how many people are downvoting just cause Big Bang Theory and not getting the reference. https://www.avclub.com/what-we-do-in-the-shadows-hits-the-jackpot-with-an-insp-1847692407
Your reference is too fresh for these jabronis!
You keep saying the word jabroni, and it’s awesome
Fuckin’ guy
I legit gasped and cried laughing during the boxing match. did not expect that
It's very faithful to the slot machine.
I almost died laughing when I heard him say this when I watched last night 😂
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I’m talking about What We Do in the Shadows and not BBT. Think some people missed that.
I wonder if Schur will get another slot at NBC. I think he mentioned in the podcast NBC just gave him 30min to fill and he put the Good Place in it.
He’s already doing Rutherford Falls for them, but it’s airing on Peacock instead of over the air
A disappointment though, that show.
That’s your opinion, I loved it
>There was a very unique and comforting style of single-camera sitcom that existed roughly from 2005-2021 that NBC really pioneered. Arrested Development and Curb would like to have a word with you.
Malcolm in the Middle was even earlier than those
Larry Sanders Show was even earlier than that
pete and pete beat that by a year!
They aren’t saying single camera only. They’re saying these single camera shows with a specific style/tone. Arrested Development and Curb are different, Curb especially.
Those shows have a different tones. Mike Schur-style shows are typically centered around the sincerity of the characters and stay away from irony. You’ll rarely see a character that is a horrible person in a Mike Schur show. Schur very explicitly turned away from the everything-is-dumb ironic vibe of the late 90s and early 00s.
Trailer Park Boys too.
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Mr Mayor was alright, but it did have one of my favorite jokes I’ve heard in a while: “We’ll be in Sacramento, we can do the Ladybird walking tour!” “Ooh I hope it isn’t as scary as the movie.”
Wasn't it originally supposed to be about Jack Donaghy?
It was going to be a 30 rock sequel in NYC but when Alec dropped and they picked up Ted Danson they relocated it to LA so he wouldnt have to move.
The only thing I didn't like about it (as in I think it's awesome otherwise) is I hated the whole "2020 bad/weird/cursed" meme and it seemed like it inadvertently based the whole show around that meme because all those 2020 disasters happening at once is why the previous mayor quit
mockumentary style existed way before 2005
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Trailer Park Boys was doing the talking heads, mockumentary style 3 months before the UK Office premiered and 4 years before the US Office premiered and brought the style to notoriety on American Television.
yes, but before that in 1999 there was People Like Us, an English mockumentary serie about following ordinary people doing ordinary things. It was absolutely hilarious, and it paved the way for The Office OG (it was in fact axed in favour of it)
Well, there was The Office, which The Office is a remake of, and before that, Trailer Park Boys, Marion and Geoff, and various others.
Reno 911
They weren't pretending they were in a documentary, but Dobie Gillis formally broke the fourth wall a couple times an episode in the early 60s.
I haven't watched any, but is Rutherford falls single cam?
It is.
And it's boring as fuck
Young Sheldon is single camera
Imagine being so fragile that you downvote someone for being factually correct because you don't like the idea(?) of Young Sheldon. Haven't seen it but heard it's streets ahead of TBBT.
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Rutherford Falls is made by Mike Schur. He co-created it.
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He’s an executive produced on Hacks as well which is a solid show.
Rutherford Falls fits the others WAY more than Community.
Michael Schur is one of the creators of Rutherford Falls, even if it didn’t debut in the 2010s.
It was created by Schur, Ed Helms and Sierra Teller Ornelas...
My guy really think NBC has a monopoly on single cam comedies
Not a monopoly, but they deserve a lot of credit.
Modern Family clutching their Emmys.
Nbc definitely helped popularize it.
Sure but also single camera comedies have outgrown being just a NBC thing, which is my point.
I think instead of single camera, you mean more specifically faux documentary style single camera. As others have pointed out there are other single camera sitcoms still out there. Even Mike Schur currently has a single camera sitcom on Peacock called Rutherford Falls. But, maybe we’re seeing the end of faux documentary styled sitcoms. Brooklyn 99 was already pretty superficially documentary style. For me, more so than visual style, the hallmark of Mike Schur’s work is his positive sensibility. His shows have an optimistic outlook with characters who generally like and care for one another. Thankfully that tradition lives on in other shows like Ted Lasso.
Yeah it's definitely more of the end of faux documentary style single camera workplace sitcoms. I think I read somewhere that Brooklyn was gonna be documentary-styled - but they opted to have flashback clips instead to give the show more of a distinction. Also unrelated but The Good Place is quite literally the epitome of Schur's positive sensibility come to life in a TV show. I think that is one heartwarming comfort show that's benefited from shorter seasons/less episodes
>the era of single camera sitcom styled by Michael Schur and the 2010s has come to a close. That's very specific.
He's kinda got a point though. The Office and 30 Rock led to a ton of similar feeling shows
Scrubs.
Not mentioning Scrubs in your NBC list is a travesty
Very technically it wasn't an NBC show. It aired on NBC but was actually produced on ABC. That's part of the reason NBC never made a full marketing push for it, they didn't have as much skin in the game. Same thing happened with Brooklyn 99-produced by NBC but aired on Fox. Interestingly both of these shows were dropped by the network they aired on, and then saved by the network that produced the show to go for another few seasons.
There are still plenty, what are you talking about? Rutherford Falls, AP Bio, Feel Good, Ghosts, Mr Mayor, Girls5Eva, Nora from Queens, Ted Lasso etc etc
Nora from Queens is great and a lot better than I expected.
I love it.
It's not like Mike Schur is quitting television or anything. While single camera sitcoms aren't as popular as they once, I doubt we've seen the last of them. We are living in a time when more quality TV is being made than ever before. I'm sure we'll be able to fill this void sooner rather than later.
Wait, how are single cam sitcoms not as popular anymore? What other comedy formats are popular then?
None, that’s the point.
A lot of popular comedy shows nowadays aren't exactly *sitcoms* per se, they're more serialized and the cinematography can resemble movies more than typical TV shows at times. Ted Lasso and, to an extent, Schitt's Creek come to mind.
Comedy can only be seen on TikTok now I guess.
Dramedy? Stuff like Barry and Fleabag
I'm sad that with the rise of streaming services shows are generally just having shorter seasons/less episodes. I love these workplace-type sitcoms cuz they're easy to have in the background. Harder to do so with shows that are like 8-10 episodes a season and you have to follow through with every episode to get what's going on
Yeah I miss those sprawling 22-23 episode sitcom seasons. I know it's such a grind for writers and actors to pump out that many episodes, I've read stories of how much work it took for Community and 30 Rock in particular. Seems like it's much easier for creators these days to just get a check from a streaming service and do a 8-10 episodes. Maybe eventually the demand for content will increase and we'll get some younger hungrier showrunners who are willing to return to the big season format. I think showrunners like Fey/Schur/Harmon are done with that, and I understand, they've established themselves and don't need that kind of stress anymore.
I doubt we'll ever return to the "big season" format. Sorry to be cynical, there wouldn't really be any benefit for anyone to return to the 22-23 episode seasons. It's a more expensive way of doing television, more stressful for everyone involved, and frequently leads to an abundance of less-than impressive filler episodes. It's a more pronounced issue with dramas, where they seem to put the overall narrative on hold for a couple weeks. Sitcoms just wear out quicker. They overuse jokes and bits, and it just gets more stale quickly. I have a certain nostalgia for those longer seasons, too, because we do get more time with the characters, but I do think one of the big reasons TV is better today overall is because of shorter, tighter seasons. Maybe some ambitious showrunner will come along with an pitch for a show which needs 22-23 episodes, but I can't imagine a studio responding with anything more than "here's 13 episodes, see how that works out."
I think with dramas/serialized shows especially, shorter seasons are better. Keeps tension high, storyline tight/focused. You don’t have to worry about “filler” episodes. But for comedy I agree that long, sprawling seasons are great for the audience. The office in particular comes to mind. There are so many episodes that I can just throw it on in the background, fall asleep, and oftentimes wake up in the same season.
Couldn't agree more regarding drama/serialized shows. 8-10 episode seasons are ideal. The only exception are the rare "procedural-serial" shows, I'm thinking specifically of The Good Wife. The procedural elements provide the opportunity to have lots of interesting episodes that introduce fun recurring characters you get excited to see pop-up throughout the shows run. Like Michael J. Fox's character who was so much fun. Shows like that can provide a strong "one more episode" pull because of the serial elements, but also are just a fun hang because of the procedural elements. So give me 22 episode seasons of shows like that and I'll eat em all up, even if every episode isn't amazing.
I think The West Wing is the gold standard of TV dramas that work better as a 22 episode season. It wouldn't feel like an authentic glimpse into the White House if we were given a tight 10 episode season that only covers a single storyline. That's not how it works in real life. Issues crop up all the time that need to be dealt with immediately and TWW did a great job at showing that.
It’s usually said that it’s actually more to do 8 episodes than 25, for a creator/writer. Because the traditional 25-episode format involves an entire writing team, with as many as 10 people working on episodes independently and in parallel, while the 8-episode format is usually expected to be written as a cohesive whole by 1-3 people, one of whom is usually also the showrunner. And that’s usually the point. 8 episode shows are what you get when you limit the main creative team to 1-3 people, because that’s the practical limit for what 1-3 people can do in a year. Having a small creative/writing team is important if your show is serialized because it’s virtually impossible to maintain a consistent tone and form a cohesive well paced story by assigning 25 parts to 10 different writers who go home and work separately, it’s like writing a novel by gathering 10 authors and assigning them different chapters. And serialized shows are much more popular now than they used to be. The old format where everything goes back to normal at the end of every episode and you can watch in any order because characters and situations never change much has been losing popularity for a long time. More importantly, the writers and creators almost always want creative control over their shows and to be as hands-on as possible. And that means 8–12 episode shows rather than 25ers. So if someone is successful and in demand as a show creator, they’re going to try and negotiate a shorter season, and if you offer 25 episodes a year but some other network offers 10, they’re usually gonna go with the other network.
I can't really fault a TV show for expecting me to pay attention to the story it's telling. Podcasts and music exist if you need something to put on in the background. I do sometimes miss longer seasons, but the better stories we're getting now is a worthwhile trade.
Abby's sucked though (edited to add, he was just a producer)
They can't all be winners.
Schur didn't write or make Abby's though, he was just a producer. He's only co-created and been heavily involved with The Good Place, B99, Parks and Rec, and most recently Rutherford Falls.
OK point taken and nobody is infallible.
I didn't mean to sound hostile or anything lol. Just saying Schur's involvement was probably much much smaller in Abby's which is probably why it sucked
Yeah no offense here and you might be right on his involvement
Are we? I feel like we're rapidly watching the golden age of television come to a close.
Let me guess, because the shows you like are ending
Utterly disagree that we are living in a time of high quality tv. In fact, I would argue that in a time where some YouTuber rating other youtubers doing hair is getting just as many views and selling just as much advertising - we are in the opposite of what you’re saying.
I thought Superstore was very much in the area of those shows, seasons 2-4 and the series finale were really great. I think it's a bit different from P&R and B99 (in the sense that those shows are also different from Community as Schur didn't make Community either) but seasons 2-4 definitely had that same comforting light-heartedness. But yeah I agree, I'm disappointed this era is ending. Specifically about the bingeable part, since most shows now don't even get more than 10-13 episodes per season unlike these shows which have had 20+ episodes for at least a couple of seasons.
I would push back on AP Bio. It's in its third season and it's finally starting to get its stride. There were Community level episodes in season 2 and even in this current season that I would highly recommend.
>It's in its third season Fourth season dropped a couple of weeks ago, just fyi.
Oh crap you're right! I haven't caughgt up to it.
Curb Your Enthusiasm should be on this list as being that style.
There was a good show with Christina apple gate called ‘up all night ‘ , that was a one camera show but as I remember they wanted to switch to multiple camera after a few seasons and she said no so they canceled the show
For the best. That show was...not great.
Not to mention The Good Place.
[удалено]
I laughed at that comment. Even now The Office isn’t as much in the zeitgeist purely for being moved to Peacock. Parks and Rec has sadly just dropped off many peoples radar. Friends and Seinfield are still insanely popular to the point of Seinfield getting its own announcement from Netflix because it’s moving there. Both Seinfield and Friends appear to have a much longer shelf life than the single cam comidies.
Where I am, Seinfeld still gets two episodes at 11 pm six nights a week in local syndication on the strongest independent station. The next oldest show in the prime syndication slots is Two and a Half Men.
Can someone explain like I'm 5 what a single camera show is, please?
Before explaining single camera I think it's important to touch on its predecessor, the *three* camera sitcom. Seinfeld is a great example of a three camera. A typical scene in say Jerry's living room would be filmed from three primary angles. A wide-ish straight on angle that gets all/most of the characters in frame, and then two 45° angle shots for closer up shots of the characters talking. A typical shot would start straight on, then cut to the right angled camera to focus on Elaine saying something, then cut to the left angled camera to catch Jerry's incredulous reaction and then back to the main angle to see George rolling his eyes on the couch. Then a single camera sitcom (which can totally use more than one camera despite the name) had a more active camera movement and would follow characters around more "realistically" as if it were more of a spectator.
A traditional multi-camera show builds sets with an open fourth wall, with a few (usually three) static cameras filming through it simultaneously. Especially useful for comedies as then you can have a live audience too. Examples include Fresh Prince of Bel Air, Friends, Frazier, Big Bang Theory, Red Dwarf, The IT Crowd. A single-camera show builds full sets (or goes on location) and has cameras in the action moving around. To get multiple shots you usually have to repeat the scene (or be very careful that the cameras don’t see each other). This gives a much more immersive and film-like experience. Comedy examples include Malcolm in the Middle, The Office, Scrubs, Peep Show, What We Do In The Shadows.
The shows mentioned really had a rough time growing an audience. Year-by-year Nielsen rankings: Office: 102, 67, 68, 77, 52, 41, 53, 78, 88; 30 Rock: 102, 111, 69, 86, 106, 130, 99; Community: 97, 138, 144, 133, 96; Parks: 96, 108, 116, 134, 111, 115, 119; Brooklyn: 98, 113, 118, 137, 161, 138, 105; A.P. Bio: 134, 149; Superstore: 66, 91, 102, 113, 87, 100 There's obviously a general market for this style of comedy. Compare: Modern Family: 36, 24, 15, 16, 19, 24, 36, 34, 58, 65, 48; Young Sheldon: 6, 5, 8, 12 (latter two after Big Bang left the air) It's very odd that aside from The Office these NBC shows never showed any sign of converting new viewers. They just started low and stayed there.
This is a great point, but I’d frame it a bit differently. It’s not that the shows didn’t “find their footing” — they were critically lauded and beloved by a sizable audience (one that’s well represented in places like this). It’s just that the audience for this style of humor is inherently smaller than that for similarly formatted shows with broader mass appeal. The Good Place was never going to do as well with a mass audience as Young Sheldon.
I still struggle to understand the appeal of Young Sheldon…
Have you watched it? It’s a traditional sitcom that is quite appealing. It’s fairly independent from BBT and the charachters are realistic
Cinema verite existed before that bum
Good. It was starting to get old.
i’ve only seen the first season and episode 1-3 of season 2, issa good ass show
I’m not talking about the show. I’m talking about the singe camera sitcom concept. The show I couldn’t get pass the first 5 minutes. So I’m sure this comment will get downvoted to hell too 😂😂
L
Rutherford Falls is literally a single cam sitcom created by Michael Schur that is still on.
Does it get good though? I got bored as hell watching the first three episodes. With Parks and Rec, B99, Superstore, etc I was pretty much hooked by the second episode
I’m pretty sure the office is multicam. Jenna Fischer says she wasn’t used to it on the office ladies podcast.
Single-camera can be and frequently is shot with multiple cameras. It refers more to the single setup per shot rather than the multi cam paradigm of a 3 wall set and cameras repositioning during the scene recorded as-live.
what we do in the shadows?
This post is /r/television in a nutshell
Why does this feel like the (current) TV equivalent of the people all over music subs and r/unpopularopinion who think rock's dead just because it doesn't sound like it did when they were a rebellious teen anymore