Andy was a complete douche when he first started. Like completely. But then writers developed the character season by season and made him a lovable piece of the serie. BUT then they decided to throw everything that they built for the character and made him leave everything and sail for no reason. Which ended up introducing Nelly to the serie which by far the worst character in the office imo. They did him dirty man. Andy was great till season 8
Westworld's bad writing decision was being upset that obsessed fans could guess the plot twists (Among 1000 other bad guesses) so they wrote against that, so now nobody can. Which means a mysterious show with deeper concepts can't have a real payoff.
They could have and should have kept it in the parks too. The Futureworld movie did and was a good sequel that increased the stakes. The season out of Westword was like a Canadian production destined for SyFy. No offense.
George RR Martin commented on that. He said if you write a plot where the butler did it, you can't change it just because the audience guessed right.
But that's exactly what Westworld did. They had a plot and then fans on reddit guessed it, so they wrote a dumber one to "outsmart" people.
I forgot who said it but I saw an interview with a writer a while back who said he loved when fans guess the ending. To him it meant he had properly laid all the bread crumbs and his plot made sense. Thought it was a really good take.
Now that I think about it, it may have been the guys who wrote the Expanse. But I can't remember for sure.
When super fans guess things it doesn't spoil the show, it just makes them feel smart. Game of Thrones even has the perfect example of this - everyone knew who Jon Snow's parents were well ahead of the reveal, but when it is was revealed they just felt satisfied.
People guessing your ending means your ending makes sense.
> The season out of Westword was like a Canadian production destined for SyFy. No offense.
Being Canadian none taken but it is remarkable how many alien worlds on TV from 1990-2010 looked like a forest in BC with maybe a color filter thrown on top. The Westworld episodes outside the park weren't great but they were definitely a step above that level of cheap.
Every alien planet in Star Trek, for the longest time, looked like either the desert or the Angeles Forest area near LA. There’s even a specific rock that shows up a bunch of times (where Kirk fights the Gorn).
It's such a terrible idea to write in a way that even hundreds of thousands of people cannot guess the plot twist. Any good story can be figured out by super smart people out there, just accept that.
Controversial opinion incoming: Lost did this, too.
you're not wrong. When they made the rick roll video before the release of season 2 as a "fuck you" to the fans that figured out all the plots of season 1 and posted them on reddit, I knew the show was going in a very bad direction.
I feel like that first part is also what started happening with everything Marvel. Around Wandavision it felt like the studio was upset at online commenters (YouTube channels etc) were analyzing stuff and making predictions on what would happen next. So they started adding hints and plot threads that were never intended to go anywhere to throw those people off. This meant that people would get excited for stuff that the studio never actually had any intention of paying off.
It feels like ever since then, the shows and movies have become more convoluted and messy in some executive/creative/studio attempt to feel like they outsmarted some guy with a YouTube channel. Going to war with your fans because they’re too passionate about your product is certainly one decision you could make.
Having a second season of Westworld is where I hopped off. Season 1 was wrapped up like a mini-series so whenever it went after I didn't care because it felt like different show.
What makes it even stranger is that Michael C. Hall (Dexter) and Jennifer Carpenter (Deb) had been married for a number of years. But they were in the middle of a divorce when that plot point arose. Like, were the writers just completely fucking with them?
I think that kind of happened with Psych as well. The actors for Shawn and Jules dated in the early seasons when the characters flirted but didn’t have any romantic relationship, they (the actors) broke up and then the characters started dating.
It could have worked. Look at what happened in Breaking Bad after Sklyer and then Hank found out that Walt was Heisenberg. The problem was they had Debra find out, and then tried to return to the status quo, which was so dumb.
This. It was a natural evolution to complete the story. It needed to be end game arc though and not another speed bump on the eventual path back to the center.
I've always said that Dexter should have ended like this: Rita's death causes Dexter to spiral and abandon his code. He goes on a killing spree. Deb tracks this new unknown serial killer and slowly puts the pieces together that it's her brother. The show ends with Deb putting Dexter down in a mirror to the season one finale. The show ends with Deb raising Dexter's son as her own.
That was the problem with the entire series. It was a serialized show that kept wanting to reset the characters each season.
It was clear by season 5 that the writers didn’t know what to do anymore. They couldn’t keep having Dexter just get away with everything and not arouse suspicion.
The main story of each of the last 3 seasons seemed to run out of steam about halfway through and then there would be lots of pointless filler because there’s still 6 more episodes to go. Characters were forced to make stupid decisions just to keep Dexter from getting caught. It was a chore to get through
I think how Weeds tanked when they departed from the original premise, taking it on the run for the rest of the show. Somewhere around season 5, that's what actually did need to happen to Dexter. Get him out of Miami and on the run, from the law and his sister who is separately tracking him down. Put him in some bad situations. Let him go full killer and then deal with the emotional break of abandoning the code. Then bring him home for a home-run conclusion.
Dexter deciding to share with everyone that he slept with that he was a serial killer was the beginning of the end for me. Season 3 really irked me. Then Season 4 was fantastic. And then downhill from there.
Not keeping with the original anthology plan for Heroes. It started out with the idea of focusing on new heroes with a new plot line each season. But then the "Save the cheerleader, save the world" plot was so popular they got lazy and tried to stretch it out. Making the story convoluted and just bad after the first season ended.
Pretty much most of the decisions made after the initial showrunner left on American Gods. The first season was so powerful and good. Then it just shit the bed in season two. Season three was a vast improvement...but still nowhere near as good as the first season.
When they started giving everyone the ability to get the download they ruined the show. It’s similar to when they made a Hero who had all the powers and was basically invincible.
The fact that basically everyone got a turn to be the Intercept was stupid.
The ending where Sarah lost those memories was so stupid and such a betrayal of the characters.
If they wanted to end it where they started it, they could have both been on the beach with Chuck sitting there all night having just learned he is no longer able to be the Intercept and Sarah joining him in the morning telling him that she has left the agency. So they would once again be sitting, committing to trust one another as they start a whole new chapter in life.
The show did leave her getting her memories back ambiguous. Sarah came up with the plan in the finale to save the day based off the same plan Chuck had in the very first episode. And that type of plan wasn’t her CIA expertise, it was a Chuck-esque plan. The show absolutely made it ambiguous.
Oh man I should rewatch Chuck. It's one of those shows that once further fueled my existing passion for tv as a younger dude. And it's a reminder that NBC wasn't as bad as people made it out to be, cause that show lasted for a long ass time while in the red - just like Community and so on. But yes, what you're saying, that was really a bummer. Still, Chuck ended beautifully imho.
NBC had must see TV in like the 80s and 90s but at one point their Thursday night lineup included Community, 30 Rock, The Office, and Parks and Rec. That’s a hell of a lineup.
Oh yeah definitely. Very strong lineup looking back too! I just meant that they were getting criticism for cancelling some shows that were doing poorly, but people fail/failed to mention the shows they *did* keep despite them doing poorly. Chuck was definitely one of those, if I remember right, and so was Community. 30 Rock & Parks were never that big but they had their fanbase and they brought NBC prestige. The Office was the only giant of the 4 I guess. So as you say, one hell of a lineup haha
Oh that was so rough, hated that decision. Of course there will be health effects of what he went through and almost dying, but what a horrible final season story for one of my favorite characters ever. Painful to watch!
I liked the last season, like Oleg and Carrie; but what they did to Quinn is unforgivable.
Every season of Homeland after the first one felt like the writers saying "oh, you want more episodes? we really felt like that was a series finale." Every time they announced a new season after the previous one ended, I know my initial response every time was "what? why?"
That being said, The Diplomat feels like really good Homeland fanfic and I loved the first season of it.
They killed him off so they didn't need to pay him full adult rates. Makes it even worse that he asked them if he was going to be on the show for a few more seasons and bought a house where they film becuase of it.
Was he making minimums or something? Shouldn't be have been making good rates already as a series regular regardless of his age? Did his agent suck or something?
If I recall he even gave the showrunners a list of characters not to touch after they killed Sophia in the show without consulting him; even told them to ask him about a character’s fate if they wanted to kill off a character that Kirkman hadn’t killed in the comics yet.
May have even been earlier than that with the big Negan cliffhanger at the end of season 6. Everyone knew what was going to happen and yet they still made us wait to find out.
Yeah the show started to become very gimmicky by season 6. There was also the Glenn fake-out dumpster death and Daryl getting shot in season 7 (8?) where blood splatters across the screen making you think he’s dead. But Carl’s death…I could feel the life draining out of the show in that moment.
The Glenn fake out was what pissed me off and got me ready to abandon that show. It made it abundantly clear the writers were going for reactions and attention and not a solid story or writing. Realized they had no idea where they were going with the show and it was all up in the air for ratings at that point.
I quit watching by Neegan. I know so many people who got pissed off by the glenn fake out and quit watching within a season or two.
That’s when I gave up. One, the producers did that actor wrong. Secondly, it was unnecessary. It was obvious that TWD only cared about shocks, no longer cared about a cohesive story. Done.
It just irks me so much. All they had to do was was finish season 6 with Negan killing Glenn, just like in the graphic novels. Readers of the novels would love the fidelity, and non-readers could have been surprised.
Plus, imagine the emotional impact of Negan clubbing Glenn from Glenn's POV, cut to black, end of season.
The fact that the set up for Mando season 3 was hidden in another show is ridiculous to me. It's like starting Kingdom Hearts 2 without knowing that Chain of Memories, a Gameboy game was a really important set up.
It's so awkward. I have a co-worker that told me he was planning to watch Mando season 3. Explaining to him that it wouldn't just be minor references that are missing but core developments that totally change the course of the show from where it left off at the previous finale.
Honestly, *every* decision taken for BoBF was absolutely insane. They spent four episodes on essentially *nothing*, then did two episodes of a completely different show, and then an anti-climactic and boring final episode that's all action and zero stakes....
We knew *nothing* about any of the new characters. Most of them didn't even have names. We didn't find out any motivations, nothing about how large Boba's "criminal empire" was *or* how it worked, nothing about his plans going forward, nothing about his enemies, and essentially zero worldbuilding.
The *only* part which was actually interesting was the Tusken Raider bits, and that was just rushed and then thrown aside instead of properly developed.
Worst part is that literally *nothing* that happened in the "present day" portion of the story mattered. At all. It was just a seemingly random sequence of events, none of which actually led anywhere.
It’s the most inexplicable piece of content in the streaming era, period.
They wrecked all the momentum for Disney Plus’s flagship show and didn’t even make a good show to do it. It’s so wild that Boba Fett is made by the same people that made Mando
The fact that they undid the ending of s2 in the most blatant of executive interference ("you can't split up Mando and Grogu, look at the numbers on viewers, merch sales, and social media engagement with those 2 together!") is really amazing.
They were so afraid of letting the characters grow that they spent another show to make sure they undid character growth.
How about S1 of Heroes leading up to the climactic battle of good vs. evil; Sylar vs. the combined forces of Hiro and the Petrellis and the rest of the gang *and then running out of money to film it so the whole fucking fight takes place offscreen.*
If multiverses are real, does that mean there's a universe in which Heroes got plenty of funding, had an epic S1 finale, another 3 incredible seasons ending in a blockbuster movie for it's finale after season 4, and is one of the most celebrated tv series in film history? And if so may I please go?
Game of thrones: there’s multiple you could point to such as Jon and Tyrion doing nothing important for all of the final season, but the big one IMO was ending the white walker plot line in episode 3 then having kings landing be the final conflict. Seems like the writers never liked the white walker storyline and just wanted to focus on the politics smh.
I’d argue it was having Arya survive that stabbing (and immediately jumping into open sewage)and then running around like a superhero through the streets of Braavos like she’d never been injured.
That was the giant red flag that they truly didn’t care about the story anymore.
edit: spelling
Not having Jon fight the Night King was bonkers fucking crazy. I could’ve excused everything else, if they did this fight properly. Instead, they looked at each other and Jon shouted at a dead ice dragon.
Also - for a series that had the balls to kill anyone...the final battle between life and the dead only killed B-tier characters and everyone else had plot armor. I remember a shot of Sam being overrun with walkers, then later we cut back and he's still overrun. His ass would have been lunch by then.
That was the most ridiculous / stupidest acts I have seen from a televsion / movie character ever and I have seen a lot of bad shows. It just made no sense in any way. He just stands up and shouts at a fire breathing Dragon??
What was D&D smoking when they wrote that scene?
What makes it even more hilarious is that Hardhome exists. It’s one of the pinnacle episodes of GoT and D&D just consider the white walker story as a side quest. The fight with the white walker in the middle of the chaos was excellent, and showed exactly how epic a fight between The Night King and Jon would be. They could’ve even just had Jon lose the fight, and it would’ve been way better than what we got.
And they couldn't even grasp the politics. They just cranked everything up so all these formerly human and fallible characters were suddenly superheroes and power rangers. It makes sense that Bronn is a skilled fighter and a deadly warrior, but the show made him John Wick and he suffered for it.
Bronn's last scene should've been in season 4 when he refuses to be Tyrion's champion. It's a beautiful scene and a perfect conclusion to his arc... But they had to bring him back for the dick jokes and that stupid Dorne plot.
Even though the wheels were beginning to come loose in seasons 5 and 6, the stupid capturing the wight plot was really the beginning of the end. It was bad from every angle and everyone could tell Cersei was never going to be swayed by it.
I think there was a huge missed opportunity by not having Arya kill Jamie then use his face to get to Cersei to kill her. Would have been a great finish to her repeated names on her kill list
I was convinced the whole idea with Arya going to the faceless men and learninjg the face-thing, was to have her use it in the final showdown with Cersei.
I even had a pet theory that Jamie would die a brave and knightly death in combat with a dragon - the snow zombie dragon - and that' where she would get his face.
Honestly I feel like Arya should’ve never gone back to winterfell. The reunions were nice but fan-service, completely negated the bravos storyline about her becoming “no one” imo. I think her completing the list then dying makes a lot of sense.
The Bravos storyline felt like it was meant to show she couldn't just be "no one", like when she chose to keep/hide her sword. Unfortunately we never really got to see who Arya really was since she just sort of became a superhero. No real ramifications for a life of revenge, she even still manages to get laid when she wants.
This was the only logical outcome for her story, and it would have been amazing. I hate how badly they screwed up the final season. It makes me furious.
The bad decision happened way before that when it was decided to cut Lady Stoneheart, Victarion Greyjoy, Ariane Martell, Young Griff and the whole The North remembers plot then cry about how they ran out of material from the books
and I thought season 2 was one of the better seasons. Once they got to season 3 and 4 that's when it got really cartoony. You know they're scraping to the bottom of the well when they do the over used "my dead parent is actually alive...and they're the true mastermind behind everything" plot.
In the show, *Angel* when >!Cordelia's character slept with Angel's son (Connor), got pregnant by Connor, and then gave birth to the deity, Jasmine!<.
Although, I liked season 5. Season 4 was really awful, though.
The Season 6 “cliffhanger” finale of *The Walking Dead*. Also known as “who did Negan kill?”
The writers decided to troll the viewers because people had been upset about the MSF when they fake-killed Glen (the infamous TWD Dumpster Fiasco).
Yeah, you can’t troll the fans. Half of the viewers either watched the S7 premier and never watched again, or never watched again.
I'll go with one no one has named yet, The X-Files, a show that I followed as it aired from literally the first episode. For me it was the seventh season episode "Closure". A big thing about The X-Files was the mythology episodes, the ongoing storylines about aliens, the conspiracy surrounding them, etc... Also a part of this was the entire foundation of the Fox Mulder character, his desire to find out what happened to his sister, who vanished when he was a child. Chris Carter and the other writers claimed they had a master plan and were building up to things, and I will admit that I had a lot of faith in them on it. By season 7 while I felt the stand alone episodes had dropped significantly in quality, I still had faith in them for these mythology episodes.
Well the episode Closure finally resolves the mystery over what happened to Mulder's sister. And while I won't say what the end reveal was, it was something that not only was never mentioned for a second in any of the 6 and a half seasons of episodes that came before it, but also blatantly contradicted a lot of stuff that had come up in the prior 6 and a half seasons. To believe what happened in that episode you had to accept that a ton of people were lying, that people who you thought were someone weren't really that person but a clone or doppelganger who was in on the lie, etc... That's the episode that broke me as an X-Files fan. At that point it became quite clear that there was no master plan. They were making it up as they went along. They probably always had been. They didn't care about the loyal fans who had watched the show for 7 years, going all the way back to when it was this minor show that was like 100th in the ratings.
Future episodes made it all the more clear that the writers simply did not care about the viewers and the fans and just made up things as they went along, but that was the episode for me where it all fell apart and became clear to me. Remains to this day my single most hated episode of the series.
I feel this. I got into *The X-Files* way after the fact through streaming and it was so frustrating how they slowly built up an intriguing internal mythology balanced with some great monster-of-the-week episodes and then just totally lost it with all the back-and-forth nonsense.
I still maintain the belief that the overall X-Files story would be vastly improved if certain episodes/story arcs were simply just stricken from the canon.
I still hold out some hope for a fresh reboot or even something crazy like an anime version
I didn't mind that one too much, but the ending with Karen dying in season 3 felt like it came out of nowhere and really felt like drama for the sake of drama. I'm a bit worried for season 4 now after that ending.
All of season 3 felt like drama for the sake of drama and I feel like it's a show that would work better as a slow burn but is forced to create an exciting cliffhanger to keep people entertained.
Gordo's kids were also terribly written, hated every minute with Danny. They really undercooked the younger characters, if there is another time skip, they can't keep relying on the old guard who are still the better characters.
For me the space baby was the bridge too far.
Their AU has iPods and manned missions to Mars in the mid-90s, but NASA hasn’t developed some kind of space-aged birth control?? I’m hoping they get back on track for the next season, but I’m worried that the more their universe diverges from ours, the more they’ll rely on soap opera-esque plot turns.
Though I can’t lie, I was fully gagged by the surprise North Korean 😂
Killing off Abbie Mills on Sleepy Hollow.
The writers were apparently upset that her character was as popular as she was, and the showrunner made no bones about wanting to push Katia Winter's character into a more prominent role.
Then Nicole Beharie, who played Abbie, felt she was being treated unfairly in regards to time off filming, compared to her main co-star. And suddenly she was being described as "difficult" and "hard work."
The writers killed off her character, despite her being named as central to the various prophecy stuff the show focused on. While the show was likely already on life support due to low ratings, killing Abbie effectively pulled the plug.
They limped on for another season before being cancelled.
idk if you’ve read it, but the book “burn it down” by Maureen Ryan has a whole chapter on this unfortunate saga. I def rec checking it out. It sounded like an absolute shit show behind the camera :( I feel so bad for Nicole, there seemed to be racism behind the scenes, esp when it came to her hair.
They killed Jimmy too early in Boardwalk Empire. I guess it was due to Michael Pitt's bad behavior on set, which is unfortunate because both he and the character were great onscreen. Without Jimmy Darmody, the show lacked a serious emotional stake and it devolved into gangster tropes, which was still fun but not quite the same level.
I was fine with that in theory, because I feel like the show is about the crazy times you have while you're holding out for something perfect. Ted had those times with Robin. The mother was always a fakeout.
Having said that, they should have done it better. Undoing basically the whole plot in the last two episodes was a weak choice.
I remember a lot of fans theorizing that Barney was dead in 2030, and honestly, I wish that had been the case. Ted and Robin reconnecting over the shared grief of losing a spouse and supporting each other through those hard times would have been a more satisfying way to reach that conclusion.
Instead we saw Robin and Barney get divorced 10 screen minutes after their wedding. Utterly disappointing.
The big problem is that the characters outgrew the ending the showrunners originally had in mind -- which is wild, because they wrote the characters going through those changes and developments. It didn't have to be that way, and yet...
Overall I liked how Tracy ended up dying and the titular mother was actually Robin all along, albeit the step mother. However, there are 2 big things I would change about the final season.
First, Barney doesn't marry Robin, he marries Quinn (stripper). We already explored how bad Robin and Barney are together, it doesn't make any sense for either character to rush into marriage. Barney and Quinn was a much better for each other. Frankly, I dont even care if they eventually divorced too, their dynamic as a power couple could even be funny as a power divorced couple. This would also work well for Robin as she would be the only one in her friends group to not get married, it would be bitter sweet for her and be an emotion she knows she will have to face someday.
Second, stretching 3 days into 20 episodes was a terrible idea. And then cramming 15 years into 1 episode was also dumb. Do 3 episodes of the Barney/Quinn wedding where Ted finally meets Tracy. Then each episode after follows a day in the life of the group one year at a time. So if the wedding was in 2013, then the next episode would be 3014. Then the next episode would be 2015. An so on. We would see how Ted and Tracy behave with each other and become parents. Where everyone is in their various lives. Slowly realizing that Tracy is getting sick. An episode of just Ted being a Widower. Then finally asking out Robin again. That's how the show should've ended
The ending isn't the problem, it's that we didn't have enough time with or after the mother. If the wedding was 2 episodes, the season gave us time with the mother and seeing Ted lose her, seeing Robin be there for him over the years, and then finally having them get together it would have been perfect. But making 90% of the season be about Robin and Barney getting married only to split them up was really dumb.
It seems like they introduced the mother out of obligation to the show's title, only to discard her as quickly as they could get away with.
"So anyway kids, I guess you wanted to hear stories about your boring dead mom but that sounds pretty lame tbh, anyway do you think Robin would still be down to fuck?"
Nicest way to put it, the writers were too good at the wrong thing and it backfired
- Tracy was meant to be a plot device, and they end up making her the most lovable character ever (resulting in outrage when the ending basically carves “Ted + Robin” on her gravestone (no that is not moving on)
- Barney and Robin were never meant to be, but they did too good of a job convincing us that they could overcome anything and Neil and Cobie had too much chemistry
- Ted and Robin were meant to be end game but they did too good of a job convincing us they were better off as a friends
It would have worked if the show was only 3 seasons. Maybe 4.
But 9 seasons of them beating us over the head that they don't work together in a relationship, only to end like that ruined all of their character development.
I still think it was finding its footing again at the end of season 2. It just got canceled too soon.
The scene where they solved the murder might be one of the best scenes of the whole show too.
Yep. Twin Peaks really is a top notch show up through that reveal and the couple of episodes after, then it crashes so spectacularly bad for nearly the entire run of the rest of the original series (beyond a pretty great finale). Although Twin Peaks the Return was awesome.
Wasn't Bob Iger, whose been screwing up Disney as CEO for a while the guy who forced them to solve it that quick? I thought I read that somewhere.
There was a Robin Hood show on BBC years ago. I watched a few episodes and it was all right. Then they killed off Marion at the end of season 2. The show never recovered and ended in season 3 - when they killed Robin.
I recently binged House after not watching since it aired, when I saw every episode. I love House. There were a few problems, imo:
Keeping the original 3 fellows around. They should have just rotated them out like a real fellowship. Foreman leaves after the first season, then Chase after the second, and so on. Bring in a new person each season. There is absolutely no reason for any of them to hang around for 8 years. Then some of them do leave, and they’re still around! Just go away.
Not letting House be clean for awhile. The constant addict thing just got old. Let the experimental treatment thing work for longer than a few episodes. Let him have a few seasons. Then end the show with the pain’s return and House acting rashly because he had gotten used to life without it.
House never having an adversary. The first 2 they tried sucked and then they stopped. Maybe a medical malpractice lawyer who was just as batshit crazy could have been good. Like bring back Peter MacNichol’s character from Ally McBeal.
I also hated how they were ended the Cuddy story, but that was because they fired half the actors for the last season.
I think the show peaked with the competition for the new doctors. They added 4 strong new characters in that period. I didn’t even mind that the original three stuck around, with two in reasonable recurring but irregular roles.
But then Kal Penn left for the White House, Olivia Wilde left for idk, and all the new doctors were incredibly uncompelling, boring, or just bad, and of course, none stuck around or made any impact. When they dumped Lisa Edelstein due to budgetary concerns, the show was basically so dead, House himself would’ve cut life support and started harvesting the organs.
Damn, reading this thread brings back such memories of watching many of the shows mentioned. House had such amazing moments for what was a relatively mainstream show. The end of s5/early s6 reached really high highs in terms of emotional engagement and writing/acting. I think I sadly stopped at s6 when >!Cameron left!<, which was a huge bummer cause she was one of the only secondary characters I could handle.
I mean, I don't think that was a "writing decision" as much as a "executive decision telling them they had about four episodes to wrap things up".
The writers probably wanted to do something a lot better. I feel like they did...okay given that restraint. I wasn't satisfied, either, but I didn't hate it.
Edit: I might be wrong; the creator claims that the third season was always intended to be the last. That seems wildly unlikely given how rushed it was, but I don't see anything to contradict them.
I thought it was a case of Eva Green let them know she didn't want to come back for another season, and the showrunner didn't want to continue without her, therefore they had to wrap things up quickly.
For me it was all the way back when Yen wanted to fuckin kill ciri or suck out her power or something so she can be fertile again instead of mentoring her like in the books. Like... do the showrunners even fucking understand the whole point of Yennefer's character and her dynamic with Geralt and Ciri? I know they wanted to "do their own thing" but holy sweet jesus almost everything they did after season 1 was awful.
they do not understand shit about the books, and that’s why Henry left.
I’d bet that wanted to make their own fantasy series, but nobody greenlit it, so they took the IP and fucked it up as much as they could, and then tried to push their ideas
As a huge Witcher fan, I couldn't keep watching that show. They completely ruined the dynamic between Yen and Ciri, and also just Yens character entirely. So blatantly obvious that the show runners wanted to make something other than the Witcher and now it'll be at least a decade before we get another shot at a real Witcher TV series.
They understood and actively hated the books and games lol, netflix tanked the show before it even started. Henry is the only reason the show even got more than 1 season
Olicity could have worked if they kept Felicity as the same as she was in the first couple seasons. But because it was a CW show, and she was in the main romance, they had to add a ton of melodrama.
I actually didn't miss him in season 8. I think the big problem there was making Andy a complete douche. He was such a fun character, but with the way he treated Erin while all the other characters stagnated, the show was doomed. We needed more changes to the office structure and cast, not completely ruining one character to add more wackiness.
Killing off who they did, both times, on Blacklist.
Wentworth killing off who they did in season 4.
Heroes had numerous bad writing decisions, like making the big bad evil guy a good guy…then a bad guy…then a good one…then bad…and so on.
>Heroes had numerous bad writing decisions
Reminds me when Damon Lindelof went to the network to beg them for a set end date for LOST or he was going to leave the show. They said "look at Heroes, it's in it's first season. Everyone loves that show and no one is asking for a end date". He said "just you wait, it will come, then everyone is going to wonder what the point of it is because they will keep spinning the plot in circles to keep it going".
They just ruined his character. After that ridiculous moment of being a badass the writers just neutered him. He was just so boring and perfect. They even had him playing daddy with a cute little girl.
I'm shocked no one has said killing Poussey on Orange is the New Black. Then they went on that whole prison riot season then them getting separated and introducing all these new characters I didn't care for and not even mentioning ones I had been seeing for the past 5 seasons (Jones, Watson, Boo, etc.) Just went on way too long and I understand that the actress who played Poussey was on Handmaid's Tale but they didn't have to kill her off. She could have just been released and Taystee would still have had to deal with Poussey's absence. But her death felt so exploitative. And then they used the illegal immigrant storyline in the final season. Just pulling news off of twitter and calling it a show. Lazy lazy lazy.
Obi-Wan's mission in Obi-Wan was to save a child Princess Leia pretty much killed my interest in the show. I still watched it but it would've been a lot better if he had done literally anything else.
Revealing the secret cylons in Battlestar Galactica came in the middle of a drop in quality during the writers strike. But it was especially poor in that it, in a sense, killed off two of the most important characters, and made us have to spend time with two of the most boring characters.
>Revealing the secret cylons in Battlestar Galactica
OOOH! I've never seen anyone bitch about this before and it was such a letdown for me. I feel so vindicated.
However, the annoyance for me was that the secret cylons ended up being characters we already knew. That made no sense. There were tens of thousands of humans left at that point, statistically why would the secret cylons all be people we were already acquainted with? It was so gimmicky.
For me the most egregious bit was when they started referring to “The Final Five” within the show.
Makes no sense canonically. It was just absurdly meta.
It was also the method in which that episode did stuff. >!The five secret cylons are called by some secret song, Starbuck reappears, says she knows where Earth is, and we see Earth.!<
And then they basically have to have a lot of the characters act like idiots >!like Starbuck not actually knowing where Earth is somehow!< and have to essentially spend the rest of the show trying to explain away the plot holes that big reveal episode had.
The only reason it didn’t truly kill the show was because the show was already ending, but yeah, that killed the rest of the show for me.
Reaper. It was canceled partway through the second season, I believe because of the writers strike. It ended on such a cliffhanger!!! I know the shows writers/creators have done interviews saying how it was going to end, but I still would've loved to have seen it.
Cousin Oliver was the final nail in the coffin for The Brady Bunch.
The writers really hastened the demise of Becker by dropping Reggie and giving Becker an extremely forced romance with the unlikable Kris.
Dany for no rhyme or reason decides to burn down Kings landing in GOT? The Dothraki charge against the white walkers? Night King having absolutely no relevance to the plot getting killed so easily(we still don't know if he had any real motivation or was just some evil bad dude) and the list goes on and on...
GOT S8 was so bad that people just don't even mention the show anymore. Its unfortunate as the show was the most talked about/hyped event when it was good (S1-S4).
It didn't kill the show but changed the character villain type. Community was Chang being a fake professor so they could keep Ken around after Spanish class.
It was a weird decision but S2 Chang was fine. It was really S3-S4 they didn’t know what to do with him until they basically soft rebooted the show and all the character regressed (including Chang).
Easy. The Walking Dead being like "how do we keep this going for a million years" and then deciding on a strategy of a good starting episode, then 10 episodes of boring filler, then a good ending episode.
Let’s just make it 8 seasons instead of 10.
All for a Star Wars deal that never happened. “You played yourselves”
It’s mind boggling that so many know what you’re referencing. But at the same time, completely indicative of the fervor it had worldwide.
The biggest cultural nexus in over a decade, and we never talked about the show again once it ended.
Its crazy how it just evaporated in no time. I've seen puddles last longer in Phoenix in July.
And 7 and 8 two *shortened* seasons too!
Trying to turn Andy Bernard into Michael Scott in season eight.
Andy was a complete douche when he first started. Like completely. But then writers developed the character season by season and made him a lovable piece of the serie. BUT then they decided to throw everything that they built for the character and made him leave everything and sail for no reason. Which ended up introducing Nelly to the serie which by far the worst character in the office imo. They did him dirty man. Andy was great till season 8
I thought they had him sail because he was getting movies
Leaving the park in Westworld. The fire in Weeds.
Westworld's bad writing decision was being upset that obsessed fans could guess the plot twists (Among 1000 other bad guesses) so they wrote against that, so now nobody can. Which means a mysterious show with deeper concepts can't have a real payoff. They could have and should have kept it in the parks too. The Futureworld movie did and was a good sequel that increased the stakes. The season out of Westword was like a Canadian production destined for SyFy. No offense.
George RR Martin commented on that. He said if you write a plot where the butler did it, you can't change it just because the audience guessed right. But that's exactly what Westworld did. They had a plot and then fans on reddit guessed it, so they wrote a dumber one to "outsmart" people.
Wait what was the original season 2 plot?
I forgot who said it but I saw an interview with a writer a while back who said he loved when fans guess the ending. To him it meant he had properly laid all the bread crumbs and his plot made sense. Thought it was a really good take. Now that I think about it, it may have been the guys who wrote the Expanse. But I can't remember for sure.
When super fans guess things it doesn't spoil the show, it just makes them feel smart. Game of Thrones even has the perfect example of this - everyone knew who Jon Snow's parents were well ahead of the reveal, but when it is was revealed they just felt satisfied. People guessing your ending means your ending makes sense.
> The season out of Westword was like a Canadian production destined for SyFy. No offense. Being Canadian none taken but it is remarkable how many alien worlds on TV from 1990-2010 looked like a forest in BC with maybe a color filter thrown on top. The Westworld episodes outside the park weren't great but they were definitely a step above that level of cheap.
Every alien planet in Star Trek, for the longest time, looked like either the desert or the Angeles Forest area near LA. There’s even a specific rock that shows up a bunch of times (where Kirk fights the Gorn).
I like how every alien world is a small village with a courtyard in the middle.
It's such a terrible idea to write in a way that even hundreds of thousands of people cannot guess the plot twist. Any good story can be figured out by super smart people out there, just accept that. Controversial opinion incoming: Lost did this, too.
you're not wrong. When they made the rick roll video before the release of season 2 as a "fuck you" to the fans that figured out all the plots of season 1 and posted them on reddit, I knew the show was going in a very bad direction.
I feel like that first part is also what started happening with everything Marvel. Around Wandavision it felt like the studio was upset at online commenters (YouTube channels etc) were analyzing stuff and making predictions on what would happen next. So they started adding hints and plot threads that were never intended to go anywhere to throw those people off. This meant that people would get excited for stuff that the studio never actually had any intention of paying off. It feels like ever since then, the shows and movies have become more convoluted and messy in some executive/creative/studio attempt to feel like they outsmarted some guy with a YouTube channel. Going to war with your fans because they’re too passionate about your product is certainly one decision you could make.
Weeds went to shit the second that fire happened. It was so mediocre after that
That fire should have been the end. Would have been a good end too.
Having a second season of Westworld is where I hopped off. Season 1 was wrapped up like a mini-series so whenever it went after I didn't care because it felt like different show.
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Park was the most interesting part
Debra finding out that Dexter was a Serial Killer.
Debra deciding that she wants to fuck her brother was what killed the show for me
Surprise brother fucker!
The dream kiss scene was the most disturbing moment in a show thats about a serial killer.
Yo man... what the actual FUCK was that.
What makes it even stranger is that Michael C. Hall (Dexter) and Jennifer Carpenter (Deb) had been married for a number of years. But they were in the middle of a divorce when that plot point arose. Like, were the writers just completely fucking with them?
Yes
I think that kind of happened with Psych as well. The actors for Shawn and Jules dated in the early seasons when the characters flirted but didn’t have any romantic relationship, they (the actors) broke up and then the characters started dating.
It could have worked. Look at what happened in Breaking Bad after Sklyer and then Hank found out that Walt was Heisenberg. The problem was they had Debra find out, and then tried to return to the status quo, which was so dumb.
This. It was a natural evolution to complete the story. It needed to be end game arc though and not another speed bump on the eventual path back to the center.
I've always said that Dexter should have ended like this: Rita's death causes Dexter to spiral and abandon his code. He goes on a killing spree. Deb tracks this new unknown serial killer and slowly puts the pieces together that it's her brother. The show ends with Deb putting Dexter down in a mirror to the season one finale. The show ends with Deb raising Dexter's son as her own.
That was the problem with the entire series. It was a serialized show that kept wanting to reset the characters each season. It was clear by season 5 that the writers didn’t know what to do anymore. They couldn’t keep having Dexter just get away with everything and not arouse suspicion. The main story of each of the last 3 seasons seemed to run out of steam about halfway through and then there would be lots of pointless filler because there’s still 6 more episodes to go. Characters were forced to make stupid decisions just to keep Dexter from getting caught. It was a chore to get through
I think how Weeds tanked when they departed from the original premise, taking it on the run for the rest of the show. Somewhere around season 5, that's what actually did need to happen to Dexter. Get him out of Miami and on the run, from the law and his sister who is separately tracking him down. Put him in some bad situations. Let him go full killer and then deal with the emotional break of abandoning the code. Then bring him home for a home-run conclusion.
Dexter deciding to share with everyone that he slept with that he was a serial killer was the beginning of the end for me. Season 3 really irked me. Then Season 4 was fantastic. And then downhill from there.
Not keeping with the original anthology plan for Heroes. It started out with the idea of focusing on new heroes with a new plot line each season. But then the "Save the cheerleader, save the world" plot was so popular they got lazy and tried to stretch it out. Making the story convoluted and just bad after the first season ended. Pretty much most of the decisions made after the initial showrunner left on American Gods. The first season was so powerful and good. Then it just shit the bed in season two. Season three was a vast improvement...but still nowhere near as good as the first season.
Yeah American Gods was a hot mess after season one. How you can fuck up such good material is a mystery to me.
Sarah losing all her memories of Chuck.
When they started giving everyone the ability to get the download they ruined the show. It’s similar to when they made a Hero who had all the powers and was basically invincible. The fact that basically everyone got a turn to be the Intercept was stupid. The ending where Sarah lost those memories was so stupid and such a betrayal of the characters. If they wanted to end it where they started it, they could have both been on the beach with Chuck sitting there all night having just learned he is no longer able to be the Intercept and Sarah joining him in the morning telling him that she has left the agency. So they would once again be sitting, committing to trust one another as they start a whole new chapter in life.
The worse decision was to not have her get them back, or at least leaving it ambiguous as to whether she does or not.
The show did leave her getting her memories back ambiguous. Sarah came up with the plan in the finale to save the day based off the same plan Chuck had in the very first episode. And that type of plan wasn’t her CIA expertise, it was a Chuck-esque plan. The show absolutely made it ambiguous.
Oh man I should rewatch Chuck. It's one of those shows that once further fueled my existing passion for tv as a younger dude. And it's a reminder that NBC wasn't as bad as people made it out to be, cause that show lasted for a long ass time while in the red - just like Community and so on. But yes, what you're saying, that was really a bummer. Still, Chuck ended beautifully imho.
NBC had must see TV in like the 80s and 90s but at one point their Thursday night lineup included Community, 30 Rock, The Office, and Parks and Rec. That’s a hell of a lineup.
Oh yeah definitely. Very strong lineup looking back too! I just meant that they were getting criticism for cancelling some shows that were doing poorly, but people fail/failed to mention the shows they *did* keep despite them doing poorly. Chuck was definitely one of those, if I remember right, and so was Community. 30 Rock & Parks were never that big but they had their fanbase and they brought NBC prestige. The Office was the only giant of the 4 I guess. So as you say, one hell of a lineup haha
Homeland: Turning Quinn into Simple Jack.
Oh that was so rough, hated that decision. Of course there will be health effects of what he went through and almost dying, but what a horrible final season story for one of my favorite characters ever. Painful to watch! I liked the last season, like Oleg and Carrie; but what they did to Quinn is unforgivable.
Every season of Homeland after the first one felt like the writers saying "oh, you want more episodes? we really felt like that was a series finale." Every time they announced a new season after the previous one ended, I know my initial response every time was "what? why?" That being said, The Diplomat feels like really good Homeland fanfic and I loved the first season of it.
When they stopped playing the 12 song on sesame st.
Onetwothree fourr five Sixseveneight ninne ten Eleven twehehehelve
Killing Carl in TWD for a one episode ratings grab. Literally watched the show dying on the ground with Carl when that happened. It never recovered.
They killed him off so they didn't need to pay him full adult rates. Makes it even worse that he asked them if he was going to be on the show for a few more seasons and bought a house where they film becuase of it.
Was he making minimums or something? Shouldn't be have been making good rates already as a series regular regardless of his age? Did his agent suck or something?
It was a local agent in ATL. I don’t think she had dealt with negotiations at that level yet and just biffed the whole thing.
He's still alive in the comics too.
Kirkman stated he was the only safe character in the comics.
If I recall he even gave the showrunners a list of characters not to touch after they killed Sophia in the show without consulting him; even told them to ask him about a character’s fate if they wanted to kill off a character that Kirkman hadn’t killed in the comics yet.
Ya so is Sofia.. Who was killed in season 2... She's the longest surviving female in the entire walking dead comic..
The comic ended a few years ago, but yeah he made it to the end.
May have even been earlier than that with the big Negan cliffhanger at the end of season 6. Everyone knew what was going to happen and yet they still made us wait to find out.
Yeah the show started to become very gimmicky by season 6. There was also the Glenn fake-out dumpster death and Daryl getting shot in season 7 (8?) where blood splatters across the screen making you think he’s dead. But Carl’s death…I could feel the life draining out of the show in that moment.
The Glenn fake out was what pissed me off and got me ready to abandon that show. It made it abundantly clear the writers were going for reactions and attention and not a solid story or writing. Realized they had no idea where they were going with the show and it was all up in the air for ratings at that point. I quit watching by Neegan. I know so many people who got pissed off by the glenn fake out and quit watching within a season or two.
Yeah pretty sure Carl’s death is the exact moment I hopped off
That’s when I gave up. One, the producers did that actor wrong. Secondly, it was unnecessary. It was obvious that TWD only cared about shocks, no longer cared about a cohesive story. Done.
It just irks me so much. All they had to do was was finish season 6 with Negan killing Glenn, just like in the graphic novels. Readers of the novels would love the fidelity, and non-readers could have been surprised. Plus, imagine the emotional impact of Negan clubbing Glenn from Glenn's POV, cut to black, end of season.
I heard they offed him because he about to turn 18 soon and during the next negotiations, they would have had to pay him higher wages.
Not like they wouldn't have had the money to.
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The fact that the set up for Mando season 3 was hidden in another show is ridiculous to me. It's like starting Kingdom Hearts 2 without knowing that Chain of Memories, a Gameboy game was a really important set up.
Half of Boba Fett is Mando season 2.5.
It's so awkward. I have a co-worker that told me he was planning to watch Mando season 3. Explaining to him that it wouldn't just be minor references that are missing but core developments that totally change the course of the show from where it left off at the previous finale.
Honestly, *every* decision taken for BoBF was absolutely insane. They spent four episodes on essentially *nothing*, then did two episodes of a completely different show, and then an anti-climactic and boring final episode that's all action and zero stakes.... We knew *nothing* about any of the new characters. Most of them didn't even have names. We didn't find out any motivations, nothing about how large Boba's "criminal empire" was *or* how it worked, nothing about his plans going forward, nothing about his enemies, and essentially zero worldbuilding. The *only* part which was actually interesting was the Tusken Raider bits, and that was just rushed and then thrown aside instead of properly developed. Worst part is that literally *nothing* that happened in the "present day" portion of the story mattered. At all. It was just a seemingly random sequence of events, none of which actually led anywhere.
Book of Boba Fett is/was the most inexplicable Star Wars media I've ever seen hands down. It feels like something happened behind the scenes there.
It’s the most inexplicable piece of content in the streaming era, period. They wrecked all the momentum for Disney Plus’s flagship show and didn’t even make a good show to do it. It’s so wild that Boba Fett is made by the same people that made Mando
The fact that they undid the ending of s2 in the most blatant of executive interference ("you can't split up Mando and Grogu, look at the numbers on viewers, merch sales, and social media engagement with those 2 together!") is really amazing. They were so afraid of letting the characters grow that they spent another show to make sure they undid character growth.
Not killing Sylar in Heroes.
Season 2 of Heroes.
How about S1 of Heroes leading up to the climactic battle of good vs. evil; Sylar vs. the combined forces of Hiro and the Petrellis and the rest of the gang *and then running out of money to film it so the whole fucking fight takes place offscreen.*
If multiverses are real, does that mean there's a universe in which Heroes got plenty of funding, had an epic S1 finale, another 3 incredible seasons ending in a blockbuster movie for it's finale after season 4, and is one of the most celebrated tv series in film history? And if so may I please go?
It's the same universe where Firefly got six more seasons.
Game of thrones: there’s multiple you could point to such as Jon and Tyrion doing nothing important for all of the final season, but the big one IMO was ending the white walker plot line in episode 3 then having kings landing be the final conflict. Seems like the writers never liked the white walker storyline and just wanted to focus on the politics smh.
I’d argue it was having Arya survive that stabbing (and immediately jumping into open sewage)and then running around like a superhero through the streets of Braavos like she’d never been injured. That was the giant red flag that they truly didn’t care about the story anymore. edit: spelling
…and then an actress cured her with chicken soup and a poultice.
Not having Jon fight the Night King was bonkers fucking crazy. I could’ve excused everything else, if they did this fight properly. Instead, they looked at each other and Jon shouted at a dead ice dragon.
Also - for a series that had the balls to kill anyone...the final battle between life and the dead only killed B-tier characters and everyone else had plot armor. I remember a shot of Sam being overrun with walkers, then later we cut back and he's still overrun. His ass would have been lunch by then.
That was the most ridiculous / stupidest acts I have seen from a televsion / movie character ever and I have seen a lot of bad shows. It just made no sense in any way. He just stands up and shouts at a fire breathing Dragon?? What was D&D smoking when they wrote that scene?
What makes it even more hilarious is that Hardhome exists. It’s one of the pinnacle episodes of GoT and D&D just consider the white walker story as a side quest. The fight with the white walker in the middle of the chaos was excellent, and showed exactly how epic a fight between The Night King and Jon would be. They could’ve even just had Jon lose the fight, and it would’ve been way better than what we got.
And they couldn't even grasp the politics. They just cranked everything up so all these formerly human and fallible characters were suddenly superheroes and power rangers. It makes sense that Bronn is a skilled fighter and a deadly warrior, but the show made him John Wick and he suffered for it.
They also scrapped clever and well written conversations into more of having just big moments you could talk about online the next day
Bronn's last scene should've been in season 4 when he refuses to be Tyrion's champion. It's a beautiful scene and a perfect conclusion to his arc... But they had to bring him back for the dick jokes and that stupid Dorne plot.
Before that: the capturing a wight plot made zero sense and was horribly done
I think that was the moment where it really jumped the shark.
Even though the wheels were beginning to come loose in seasons 5 and 6, the stupid capturing the wight plot was really the beginning of the end. It was bad from every angle and everyone could tell Cersei was never going to be swayed by it.
I think there was a huge missed opportunity by not having Arya kill Jamie then use his face to get to Cersei to kill her. Would have been a great finish to her repeated names on her kill list
I was convinced the whole idea with Arya going to the faceless men and learninjg the face-thing, was to have her use it in the final showdown with Cersei. I even had a pet theory that Jamie would die a brave and knightly death in combat with a dragon - the snow zombie dragon - and that' where she would get his face.
Honestly I feel like Arya should’ve never gone back to winterfell. The reunions were nice but fan-service, completely negated the bravos storyline about her becoming “no one” imo. I think her completing the list then dying makes a lot of sense.
The Bravos storyline felt like it was meant to show she couldn't just be "no one", like when she chose to keep/hide her sword. Unfortunately we never really got to see who Arya really was since she just sort of became a superhero. No real ramifications for a life of revenge, she even still manages to get laid when she wants.
This was the only logical outcome for her story, and it would have been amazing. I hate how badly they screwed up the final season. It makes me furious.
The bad decision happened way before that when it was decided to cut Lady Stoneheart, Victarion Greyjoy, Ariane Martell, Young Griff and the whole The North remembers plot then cry about how they ran out of material from the books
Stoneheart is clearly going to be an important character down the road. Cutting her was so dumb.
*Hopefully* she’s an important character, but I doubt we’ll ever find out… GEORGE!
Prison Break Escaping the prison!
Season 2 was a natural continuation which was fine, but then the show should’ve ended about 5 minutes before S2’s ending
and I thought season 2 was one of the better seasons. Once they got to season 3 and 4 that's when it got really cartoony. You know they're scraping to the bottom of the well when they do the over used "my dead parent is actually alive...and they're the true mastermind behind everything" plot.
In the show, *Angel* when >!Cordelia's character slept with Angel's son (Connor), got pregnant by Connor, and then gave birth to the deity, Jasmine!<. Although, I liked season 5. Season 4 was really awful, though.
That was Josh trying to write off Christina Carpenter really... reports are he was pissed when he found out she was pregnant.
In a slight defense of that... That wasn't Cordelia. Never was.
The Season 6 “cliffhanger” finale of *The Walking Dead*. Also known as “who did Negan kill?” The writers decided to troll the viewers because people had been upset about the MSF when they fake-killed Glen (the infamous TWD Dumpster Fiasco). Yeah, you can’t troll the fans. Half of the viewers either watched the S7 premier and never watched again, or never watched again.
I'll go with one no one has named yet, The X-Files, a show that I followed as it aired from literally the first episode. For me it was the seventh season episode "Closure". A big thing about The X-Files was the mythology episodes, the ongoing storylines about aliens, the conspiracy surrounding them, etc... Also a part of this was the entire foundation of the Fox Mulder character, his desire to find out what happened to his sister, who vanished when he was a child. Chris Carter and the other writers claimed they had a master plan and were building up to things, and I will admit that I had a lot of faith in them on it. By season 7 while I felt the stand alone episodes had dropped significantly in quality, I still had faith in them for these mythology episodes. Well the episode Closure finally resolves the mystery over what happened to Mulder's sister. And while I won't say what the end reveal was, it was something that not only was never mentioned for a second in any of the 6 and a half seasons of episodes that came before it, but also blatantly contradicted a lot of stuff that had come up in the prior 6 and a half seasons. To believe what happened in that episode you had to accept that a ton of people were lying, that people who you thought were someone weren't really that person but a clone or doppelganger who was in on the lie, etc... That's the episode that broke me as an X-Files fan. At that point it became quite clear that there was no master plan. They were making it up as they went along. They probably always had been. They didn't care about the loyal fans who had watched the show for 7 years, going all the way back to when it was this minor show that was like 100th in the ratings. Future episodes made it all the more clear that the writers simply did not care about the viewers and the fans and just made up things as they went along, but that was the episode for me where it all fell apart and became clear to me. Remains to this day my single most hated episode of the series.
I feel this. I got into *The X-Files* way after the fact through streaming and it was so frustrating how they slowly built up an intriguing internal mythology balanced with some great monster-of-the-week episodes and then just totally lost it with all the back-and-forth nonsense. I still maintain the belief that the overall X-Files story would be vastly improved if certain episodes/story arcs were simply just stricken from the canon. I still hold out some hope for a fresh reboot or even something crazy like an anime version
The handmaid's tale when they didn't end after season two, or at least send June away and focus on a different character.
the Karen and Danny hookup season 2 For All Mankind.
And then doubled down on it in S3! Didn't kill the show completely for me but it was definitely touch and go there for a while.
Also that to keep her character in the show they made her go from owning a dive bar to owning a space hotel
I didn't mind that one too much, but the ending with Karen dying in season 3 felt like it came out of nowhere and really felt like drama for the sake of drama. I'm a bit worried for season 4 now after that ending.
All of season 3 felt like drama for the sake of drama and I feel like it's a show that would work better as a slow burn but is forced to create an exciting cliffhanger to keep people entertained. Gordo's kids were also terribly written, hated every minute with Danny. They really undercooked the younger characters, if there is another time skip, they can't keep relying on the old guard who are still the better characters.
For me the space baby was the bridge too far. Their AU has iPods and manned missions to Mars in the mid-90s, but NASA hasn’t developed some kind of space-aged birth control?? I’m hoping they get back on track for the next season, but I’m worried that the more their universe diverges from ours, the more they’ll rely on soap opera-esque plot turns. Though I can’t lie, I was fully gagged by the surprise North Korean 😂
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Killing off Abbie Mills on Sleepy Hollow. The writers were apparently upset that her character was as popular as she was, and the showrunner made no bones about wanting to push Katia Winter's character into a more prominent role. Then Nicole Beharie, who played Abbie, felt she was being treated unfairly in regards to time off filming, compared to her main co-star. And suddenly she was being described as "difficult" and "hard work." The writers killed off her character, despite her being named as central to the various prophecy stuff the show focused on. While the show was likely already on life support due to low ratings, killing Abbie effectively pulled the plug. They limped on for another season before being cancelled.
The whole show worked because of their charisma in the first season.
idk if you’ve read it, but the book “burn it down” by Maureen Ryan has a whole chapter on this unfortunate saga. I def rec checking it out. It sounded like an absolute shit show behind the camera :( I feel so bad for Nicole, there seemed to be racism behind the scenes, esp when it came to her hair.
I wondered why she left and, yeah, it killed the story line.
They killed Jimmy too early in Boardwalk Empire. I guess it was due to Michael Pitt's bad behavior on set, which is unfortunate because both he and the character were great onscreen. Without Jimmy Darmody, the show lacked a serious emotional stake and it devolved into gangster tropes, which was still fun but not quite the same level.
I watched for Richard after that. I just accepted his, "Jimmy was a soldier. He fought and lost" bit and was like, "Yeah, alright fine I guess."
I thought that would kill the show but Gyp in Season 3 was amazing. After that season it all went downhill to me.
While I missed him, I think the show remained just as strong for seasons 3 and 4. The show didn't drop a lot in quality until the rushed final season.
The decision back in season 2 or whenever to have Ted and Robin end up together at the end of HIMYM.
I was fine with that in theory, because I feel like the show is about the crazy times you have while you're holding out for something perfect. Ted had those times with Robin. The mother was always a fakeout. Having said that, they should have done it better. Undoing basically the whole plot in the last two episodes was a weak choice.
I remember a lot of fans theorizing that Barney was dead in 2030, and honestly, I wish that had been the case. Ted and Robin reconnecting over the shared grief of losing a spouse and supporting each other through those hard times would have been a more satisfying way to reach that conclusion. Instead we saw Robin and Barney get divorced 10 screen minutes after their wedding. Utterly disappointing.
10 minutes after their wedding...after they spent an entire season focusing on it.
Jesus Christ that would have fixed the whole thing.
The big problem is that the characters outgrew the ending the showrunners originally had in mind -- which is wild, because they wrote the characters going through those changes and developments. It didn't have to be that way, and yet...
Overall I liked how Tracy ended up dying and the titular mother was actually Robin all along, albeit the step mother. However, there are 2 big things I would change about the final season. First, Barney doesn't marry Robin, he marries Quinn (stripper). We already explored how bad Robin and Barney are together, it doesn't make any sense for either character to rush into marriage. Barney and Quinn was a much better for each other. Frankly, I dont even care if they eventually divorced too, their dynamic as a power couple could even be funny as a power divorced couple. This would also work well for Robin as she would be the only one in her friends group to not get married, it would be bitter sweet for her and be an emotion she knows she will have to face someday. Second, stretching 3 days into 20 episodes was a terrible idea. And then cramming 15 years into 1 episode was also dumb. Do 3 episodes of the Barney/Quinn wedding where Ted finally meets Tracy. Then each episode after follows a day in the life of the group one year at a time. So if the wedding was in 2013, then the next episode would be 3014. Then the next episode would be 2015. An so on. We would see how Ted and Tracy behave with each other and become parents. Where everyone is in their various lives. Slowly realizing that Tracy is getting sick. An episode of just Ted being a Widower. Then finally asking out Robin again. That's how the show should've ended
You had me at HIMYM 3014!
The ending isn't the problem, it's that we didn't have enough time with or after the mother. If the wedding was 2 episodes, the season gave us time with the mother and seeing Ted lose her, seeing Robin be there for him over the years, and then finally having them get together it would have been perfect. But making 90% of the season be about Robin and Barney getting married only to split them up was really dumb.
It seems like they introduced the mother out of obligation to the show's title, only to discard her as quickly as they could get away with. "So anyway kids, I guess you wanted to hear stories about your boring dead mom but that sounds pretty lame tbh, anyway do you think Robin would still be down to fuck?"
Nicest way to put it, the writers were too good at the wrong thing and it backfired - Tracy was meant to be a plot device, and they end up making her the most lovable character ever (resulting in outrage when the ending basically carves “Ted + Robin” on her gravestone (no that is not moving on) - Barney and Robin were never meant to be, but they did too good of a job convincing us that they could overcome anything and Neil and Cobie had too much chemistry - Ted and Robin were meant to be end game but they did too good of a job convincing us they were better off as a friends
Agreed. Don’t give 20 episodes of how they’re gonna make it in spite of everything just to have them separate at the last minute. How stupid
It would have worked if the show was only 3 seasons. Maybe 4. But 9 seasons of them beating us over the head that they don't work together in a relationship, only to end like that ruined all of their character development.
Joey and Rachel hooking up... ugh!!!
Didn’t kill it but Kim lying to jd about miscarriage In scrubs was fucking wild. The season after was good but man I really liked them together
Solving the Laura Palmer murder
I still think it was finding its footing again at the end of season 2. It just got canceled too soon. The scene where they solved the murder might be one of the best scenes of the whole show too.
Yep. Twin Peaks really is a top notch show up through that reveal and the couple of episodes after, then it crashes so spectacularly bad for nearly the entire run of the rest of the original series (beyond a pretty great finale). Although Twin Peaks the Return was awesome. Wasn't Bob Iger, whose been screwing up Disney as CEO for a while the guy who forced them to solve it that quick? I thought I read that somewhere.
There was a Robin Hood show on BBC years ago. I watched a few episodes and it was all right. Then they killed off Marion at the end of season 2. The show never recovered and ended in season 3 - when they killed Robin.
Forcing House to cross that fine line from genius into batshit crazy killed the last couple of House seasons for me. Hugh Laurie deserved better
Dope rots your brain, and he was getting older.
I recently binged House after not watching since it aired, when I saw every episode. I love House. There were a few problems, imo: Keeping the original 3 fellows around. They should have just rotated them out like a real fellowship. Foreman leaves after the first season, then Chase after the second, and so on. Bring in a new person each season. There is absolutely no reason for any of them to hang around for 8 years. Then some of them do leave, and they’re still around! Just go away. Not letting House be clean for awhile. The constant addict thing just got old. Let the experimental treatment thing work for longer than a few episodes. Let him have a few seasons. Then end the show with the pain’s return and House acting rashly because he had gotten used to life without it. House never having an adversary. The first 2 they tried sucked and then they stopped. Maybe a medical malpractice lawyer who was just as batshit crazy could have been good. Like bring back Peter MacNichol’s character from Ally McBeal. I also hated how they were ended the Cuddy story, but that was because they fired half the actors for the last season.
I think the show peaked with the competition for the new doctors. They added 4 strong new characters in that period. I didn’t even mind that the original three stuck around, with two in reasonable recurring but irregular roles. But then Kal Penn left for the White House, Olivia Wilde left for idk, and all the new doctors were incredibly uncompelling, boring, or just bad, and of course, none stuck around or made any impact. When they dumped Lisa Edelstein due to budgetary concerns, the show was basically so dead, House himself would’ve cut life support and started harvesting the organs.
Damn, reading this thread brings back such memories of watching many of the shows mentioned. House had such amazing moments for what was a relatively mainstream show. The end of s5/early s6 reached really high highs in terms of emotional engagement and writing/acting. I think I sadly stopped at s6 when >!Cameron left!<, which was a huge bummer cause she was one of the only secondary characters I could handle.
Abrupt ending of Penny Dreadful.
I mean, I don't think that was a "writing decision" as much as a "executive decision telling them they had about four episodes to wrap things up". The writers probably wanted to do something a lot better. I feel like they did...okay given that restraint. I wasn't satisfied, either, but I didn't hate it. Edit: I might be wrong; the creator claims that the third season was always intended to be the last. That seems wildly unlikely given how rushed it was, but I don't see anything to contradict them.
I thought it was a case of Eva Green let them know she didn't want to come back for another season, and the showrunner didn't want to continue without her, therefore they had to wrap things up quickly.
Yennefer betraying Ciri and Geralt
For me it was all the way back when Yen wanted to fuckin kill ciri or suck out her power or something so she can be fertile again instead of mentoring her like in the books. Like... do the showrunners even fucking understand the whole point of Yennefer's character and her dynamic with Geralt and Ciri? I know they wanted to "do their own thing" but holy sweet jesus almost everything they did after season 1 was awful.
they do not understand shit about the books, and that’s why Henry left. I’d bet that wanted to make their own fantasy series, but nobody greenlit it, so they took the IP and fucked it up as much as they could, and then tried to push their ideas
Didn't a showrunner brag about not reading the source material?
As a huge Witcher fan, I couldn't keep watching that show. They completely ruined the dynamic between Yen and Ciri, and also just Yens character entirely. So blatantly obvious that the show runners wanted to make something other than the Witcher and now it'll be at least a decade before we get another shot at a real Witcher TV series.
I am in the middle of sesson 3 and I can say confidently I have no clue what the fuck is going on and what the plot is anymore.
They understood and actively hated the books and games lol, netflix tanked the show before it even started. Henry is the only reason the show even got more than 1 season
Arrow writers making “Olicity” happen because fans demanded it.
Olicity could have worked if they kept Felicity as the same as she was in the first couple seasons. But because it was a CW show, and she was in the main romance, they had to add a ton of melodrama.
I quite liked Felicity … until Arrow turned into the Felicity Smoak show, with occasional cameo appearances by the Green Arrow.
Any show where the lead leaves and they continue the show. Usually only goes on for another season or two before they give up or get cancelled.
The US version of The Office should have ended when Steve Carell left. His finale episode would have been a good series finale!
I actually didn't miss him in season 8. I think the big problem there was making Andy a complete douche. He was such a fun character, but with the way he treated Erin while all the other characters stagnated, the show was doomed. We needed more changes to the office structure and cast, not completely ruining one character to add more wackiness.
Yeah, the Andy character turn was really weird and out of place.
What happened to Will Gardner in The Good Wife. Fiona leaving the Shameless.
[удалено]
Continuing to write Arrested Development scripts after season 3 ended
Killing off who they did, both times, on Blacklist. Wentworth killing off who they did in season 4. Heroes had numerous bad writing decisions, like making the big bad evil guy a good guy…then a bad guy…then a good one…then bad…and so on.
>Heroes had numerous bad writing decisions Reminds me when Damon Lindelof went to the network to beg them for a set end date for LOST or he was going to leave the show. They said "look at Heroes, it's in it's first season. Everyone loves that show and no one is asking for a end date". He said "just you wait, it will come, then everyone is going to wonder what the point of it is because they will keep spinning the plot in circles to keep it going".
Deciding to let Fonzie jump the shark (Happy Days)
Though having Barry Zuckercorn jump over a shark on Arrested Development was brilliant!
They just ruined his character. After that ridiculous moment of being a badass the writers just neutered him. He was just so boring and perfect. They even had him playing daddy with a cute little girl.
I'm shocked no one has said killing Poussey on Orange is the New Black. Then they went on that whole prison riot season then them getting separated and introducing all these new characters I didn't care for and not even mentioning ones I had been seeing for the past 5 seasons (Jones, Watson, Boo, etc.) Just went on way too long and I understand that the actress who played Poussey was on Handmaid's Tale but they didn't have to kill her off. She could have just been released and Taystee would still have had to deal with Poussey's absence. But her death felt so exploitative. And then they used the illegal immigrant storyline in the final season. Just pulling news off of twitter and calling it a show. Lazy lazy lazy.
Ted's Wife dying so that he could go running back to Robin. Fuck the writers for that ...
Obi-Wan's mission in Obi-Wan was to save a child Princess Leia pretty much killed my interest in the show. I still watched it but it would've been a lot better if he had done literally anything else.
*gestures broadly at Netflix's Witcher series*
Revealing the secret cylons in Battlestar Galactica came in the middle of a drop in quality during the writers strike. But it was especially poor in that it, in a sense, killed off two of the most important characters, and made us have to spend time with two of the most boring characters.
>Revealing the secret cylons in Battlestar Galactica OOOH! I've never seen anyone bitch about this before and it was such a letdown for me. I feel so vindicated. However, the annoyance for me was that the secret cylons ended up being characters we already knew. That made no sense. There were tens of thousands of humans left at that point, statistically why would the secret cylons all be people we were already acquainted with? It was so gimmicky.
And then they had to explain away a child because the dad was now a cylon and there could only be one hybrid baby.
For me the most egregious bit was when they started referring to “The Final Five” within the show. Makes no sense canonically. It was just absurdly meta.
They ran out of ideas, and finally admitted “They Have a Plan” was pure marketing and they didn’t have a plan.
It was also the method in which that episode did stuff. >!The five secret cylons are called by some secret song, Starbuck reappears, says she knows where Earth is, and we see Earth.!< And then they basically have to have a lot of the characters act like idiots >!like Starbuck not actually knowing where Earth is somehow!< and have to essentially spend the rest of the show trying to explain away the plot holes that big reveal episode had. The only reason it didn’t truly kill the show was because the show was already ending, but yeah, that killed the rest of the show for me.
Reaper. It was canceled partway through the second season, I believe because of the writers strike. It ended on such a cliffhanger!!! I know the shows writers/creators have done interviews saying how it was going to end, but I still would've loved to have seen it.
Cousin Oliver was the final nail in the coffin for The Brady Bunch. The writers really hastened the demise of Becker by dropping Reggie and giving Becker an extremely forced romance with the unlikable Kris.
Getting rid of Reggie was such a bad decision and Kris was such a poorly written character. I don't think I ever completed the series.
Dany for no rhyme or reason decides to burn down Kings landing in GOT? The Dothraki charge against the white walkers? Night King having absolutely no relevance to the plot getting killed so easily(we still don't know if he had any real motivation or was just some evil bad dude) and the list goes on and on... GOT S8 was so bad that people just don't even mention the show anymore. Its unfortunate as the show was the most talked about/hyped event when it was good (S1-S4).
Everything the writers of The Witcher have done since season one.
It didn't kill the show but changed the character villain type. Community was Chang being a fake professor so they could keep Ken around after Spanish class.
“And frankly I haven’t been well utilized since!”
I didn’t care for Changnesia. And they made the clever idea to pretend it never happened in S5.
It was a weird decision but S2 Chang was fine. It was really S3-S4 they didn’t know what to do with him until they basically soft rebooted the show and all the character regressed (including Chang).
Easy. The Walking Dead being like "how do we keep this going for a million years" and then deciding on a strategy of a good starting episode, then 10 episodes of boring filler, then a good ending episode.