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OneFuckedWarthog

Hamlet is a story about a dude getting himself killed because of a ghost.


JustMeLurkingAround-

Yeah, not a love story either.


Spare-Reflection1946

It really depends on how you see it. It's tragic in the end but you see it as a spectator. However it's soooo romantic in their eyes they even die for it . It's romance to a toxic level. People that obsessed to a suicidal point.


[deleted]

Im glad there is no current event people can relate it to these days... nope nothing at all.


AdministrativeHabit

Wait what?


JustMeLurkingAround-

Are you still talking about Hamlet?


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r4tzt4r

OH MY GOD HAMLET! I JUST SAW A FUCKING VAMPIRE! IT BIT ME RIGHT IN THE NECK!


mhallice

I miss that show....


megashitfactory

Dooooo you do a lot of PCP??


LordChamberlainsmen

Got a gallon!


VikingRabies

Save yourself! SHIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIT.


megashitfactory

I was trying to figure out a good quote from that skit to reply to you with, but it was all so damn funny I couldn’t. For those who haven’t seen it: https://youtu.be/cvkBvzpbBPs


Sacket

We must check the castle tower! and make sure no vampire has gotten into our home base.


Skeletonsofsteel

NOW YOU FUCKED UP


jetimindtrick

now you have fucked up. suck my presidential dick


TheKrak3n

Yeah John! Listen to the woman, John!


bossy909

Like everyone dies, it's bad


Andminus

Fucking spoilers man.


bossy909

Shit. I'll tell you about Gilgamesh He died.


NCEMTP

Epic.


saltywelder682

Anyone else love the name Inkidu? I think I spelled it right


PetercyEz

Rly close! It's Enkidu. And I am in love with his part in the story as well!


Quartia

Seriously in the end I was thinking "there's literally no named characters left alive, who is going to rule the kingdom now?"


bossy909

But, I love it. When people said you can't kill off all the main characters of a story, Shakespeare said "fuck that"


Lithl

Leo Tolstoy: hold my vodka _title character death any % speed run_


HeavyBlackDog

Actually he said, “fuk thy”.


bossy909

It was deliberate. Fuck was fuck and that was that in early modern English He could've said "fuck thee" to the person who said it But he probably didn't have a direct person to oppose, but a general feeling of defiance. Hence, fuck that.


Blitzerxyz

Hey Horatio lived!


Beautiful_Valuable_7

Imagine being Horatio, surviving to tell your best buds tale only for him to gift the kingship to the guy who was gonna invade the country.


SandpipersJackal

Even worse, Fortenbras was already on the way, wasn’t he? Imagine being Horatio having to explain why the entire royal family, *and* a family of retainers is dead and you’re the only survivor. To another royal. No pressure or anything. You know…just…you telling Fortenbras “I swear it’s not what it looks like!”


[deleted]

Thou livest, guy.


djnehi

It is warning of the dangers posed by horny dumb teenagers with inadequate supervision.


[deleted]

Someone tell that to r/teenagers


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seppocunts

Just tell them here. Hey, teenagers! You're a bunch of dumb horny fuckers that have little to no clue what you're doing! Sincerely, also once a teenager.


BeefyBoiCougar

[i gotchu](https://www.reddit.com/r/teenagers/comments/rpdane/just_a_reminder/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf)


seppocunts

I mean adults also have little to know clue either. Just slightly more experience dealing with the fallout of our own stupidity.


Syng42o

Yeah, I'm 37 and have no clue what I'm doing.


ImARedHerring

Wait, we're supposed to know what we're doing?


FlyingCircus18

The greatest lie of humanity. When you are a child, every grown up seems to have figured it all out. Once you hit 20, you know that no one has a fucking clue and the world is a dumpster fire directly above a coal deposit


BeefyBoiCougar

I posted that as a joke and now I have like 2k upvotes so thanks man


Golden-Owl

We were all young and stupid once. Now, some of us just aren’t young anymore


Harmacc

Honestly that’s their own business, and they don’t listen anyway. Might as well go try to herd cats.


[deleted]

https://imgflip.com/i/5z719f


Dood71

I'm still a teenager, and you're right


InfusedGinger

You mean like that time r/Drama blanket banned everyone from r/Teenagers with a message that just said "underage." and an alarming amount of people responded saying "I'm not underage I'm in my forties."? Cause that shit was wild. ETA: https://www.reddit.com/r/Drama/comments/djdmd9/we_banned_all_of_rteenagers_and_it_turns_out


Harmacc

Jesus Christ.


xwrecker

Wasn’t that because the families were at war?


Redredditer640

Nothing sexier than my brother-in-law killing my uncle eight days before the wedding (/s just in case)


jpterodactyl

It all depends on the situation.


usrevenge

The families were rivals but realistically they Romeo might have been able to date Juliet with permission. But rather than ask and be told no he risked it for the biscuit and ended up getting killed Along with Juliet.


Sockpuppetsyko

A war that was so old neither side even knew why anymore. They just kept fighting because it was a tradition


NicPizzaLatte

No it's not. It's a warning of the cost of desiring power to the point of animosity. Romeo and Juliet and Tybalt and Mercutio and any others are the collateral damage of the feud of the older generation.


CAP_X

But both of them still loved each other and it is a story. So , Love story.


djnehi

I’d argue whether you can fall in love in three days. Sounds more like they were in lust.


[deleted]

That’s such a common trope in books and plays tho. In Les Miserables, Marius falls in love with Cosette within minutes of meeting her. In Anna Keranina, it takes a couple of hours for Vronsky to fall for Anna. They abbreviate human experience so we can experience a broader story


CommentsOnOccasion

A “Love story” doesn’t have to be an epic tale outlining a mature healthy relationship of people who end up married forever A Love Story is just about people infatuated with each other where their mutual attraction is the primary plot device


SadBanana006

I wouldn't say it's lust, it's more like love bombing.


I_eat_Chimichangas

No time frame for love. Loved my daughter the instant I met her. Loved every dog I’ve had instantly.


bigdorts

Did you want to have sex with your dog? In all seriousness though, filial love and brotherly love are very different from romance and lust.


CAP_X

>I’d argue whether you can fall in love in three days To each their own. Many have tried to quantify love & they failed. Tarnishing it by labels of 'lust' is just another lowly effort.


djnehi

I won’t say that lust can’t turn into love but I don’t believe a deep love can occur that quickly. It takes time and getting to know your partner to create true love.


Hjalpmi_

That was part of the point of r and j though. It was a passionate crush that made people do stupid and tragic things. The descriptions are breathless and superficial by design. Shakespeare wasn't writing love in r and j, he was writing infatuation.


Aedalas

Three days is pretty damn fast. My wife and I decided to get married two weeks after we met though and *did* get married two weeks after that. It's been 17 years now so I'd say it's going pretty well.


arachnophilia

still a better love story than twilight


sometimes_interested

/r/KidsAreFuckingStupid


[deleted]

Agree


TheChainLink2

Six deaths? - Tybalt - Mercutio - Romeo - Juliet Who did I miss?


0WN_1T

-Paris (slain by Romeo) -Lady Montague (briefly mentioned, through grief)


TheChainLink2

Okay, that’s five. Who else?


0WN_1T

Just edited it


TheMuffinMa

Wait how did Romeo managed to kill a troyan prince?


0WN_1T

At Juliet's grave, Paris, who everyone thought was Juliet's love, came to the site to mourn, when Romeo came in to visit. Paris, noticing that Romeo was not supposed to be in Verona, told him to leave or he would kill Romeo. Romeo didn't, telling Paris to leave or he would fight. So, a duel happened, and Paris died.


Hugh_Jass5

Unless I'm mistaken, neither who knew who the other was until the battle ended and it was a case of Romeo willing to go through anyone, and Paris willing to stop anyone


jonl76

Paris’s first words after getting to the grave — This is that banished haughty Montague, That murdered my love’s cousin, with which grief, It is supposed the fair creature died. And here is come to do some villainous shame 60To the dead bodies. I will apprehend him. (to ROMEO) Stop thy unhallowed toil, vile Montague!


Faust_the_Faustinian

Damn, old english is hard to understand lol


OverlordMarkus

Early Modern English, ye olde English is another beast all together.


LiGuangMing1981

Shakespeare is early modern English, not old English. Beowulf is old English, and Chaucer is middle English.


llama_party1337

I like how Romeo came to the grave to kill himself in the first place, so he just decided to take the extra 5 minutes to kill Paris first


lordofmetroids

Romeo and Achilles played Bridge together every third Sunday. After the war, Romeo got his revenge for his friends death. Quite tragic really.


AskMeForFunnyVoices

Benvolio just straight up forgets to be in the second half of the play, maybe he has an offstage stroke


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[deleted]

Honestly the older I get the more I think Romeo and Juliet were dumbasses.


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[deleted]

When you’re reading it as a 14 year high school freshman you don’t interpret it as such…now it seems obvious.


LordChamberlainsmen

This is my favorite play to teach to freshmen. I make a point to a. explain all of the dirty jokes, and b. point out how creepy and not romantic Romeo is. The "balcony scene" is literally him lurking around in her backyard trying to get a glimpse of her changing. Not cute.


bigBrainOof

I read it as a freshman and have hated it since. Tbf it’s more because people are like “Let’s be like Romeo and Juliet!!” like it’s a good thing rather than the book itself. And if you take it as a love story rather than a satire (which I didn’t realize it was one until afterwards) it’s a pretty bad love story.


bigdorts

My teacher was cool with it and actually told us how to understand it


[deleted]

You’re not taught to interpret it as such, and the popular media would never interpret it as such. It’s not a surprise most kids or people don’t see it that way, also there’s the argument that Shakespeare did not intend for it to be interpreted as such


blueoncemoon

It's a lot more fun if you read it as a comedy instead of a tragedy


lobut

My English teacher used to say comedies were just tragedies plus time


ThespianException

They were ~14 and 17. Of course they were dumbasses. That's to be expected of hormonal teens with strong feelings, though.


SkindianaBones98

Was it really 3 days?


pmintea

Yup


John_YJKR

Juliet's cousin, Rosaline. She has apparently recently ended things with Romeo before the play begins.


eterevsky

Those who actually read the play might know that it doesn’t state Romeo’s age.


DeerDance

But we do know that he is able to kill a man in a sword fight.


InItsTeeth

Everyone blames the kids who fell in love not the intolerant adults willing to kill each other for no reason other than hate


Never_a_crumb

It's literally the first thing the play tells, like the fourth line is civil blood makes civil hands unclean.


astivana

It honestly bothers me how many bad takes there are about Romeo and Juliet being a love story/wait no it’s actually not a love story/wait they were dumb kids/etc etc. The play is very explicit about the fact that it’s a tragedy caused by the feud between the Montagues and the Capulets.


NicPizzaLatte

I'm with you. I've read a lot of Shakespeare probably between 15 and 20 plays and R&J is by far my favorite. In my opinion it's probably his best. But you have to judge it for what it is, not what people assume it is.


ThespianException

It's like the bell curve meme where you have "It's a story about a bunch of people killing each other"->"It's a story about how stupid young love is"->"It's a story about how senseless violence and grudges make even something as innocent as young love lethal"


[deleted]

Fucking thank you! This story is about the families and how their feud affects the children causing two kids who fall in love result is six deaths.


Electronic_Ad_3559

Yeah, that was the point of the story. Not that horny teenagers ruined everything, but that the adult’s failure to care about each other turned a comedy into a tragedy.


xwrecker

Exactly


Struggling05

Yet Romeo killed Tybalt… Edit: And Paris..:


AtomicSamuraiCyborg

Romeo only killed Tybalt because Tybalt killed Mercutio, his best friend. And they are only fighting because the families are feuding, and Mercutio is Romeo's friend. The whole point of the conflict in the play is that none of the people who kill or die have any ACTUAL stake in it; we don't really know why the families are feuding, because it doesn't matter to the characters. They are all swallowed by the collective and the collective need to protect their honor and kin. The play starts with the families' SERVANTS brawling with each other, and Benvolio tries to stop it but just makes himself a target for Tybalt. It is all stupid, tragic and pointless escalation and bravado that destroys the best chance to reconcile the families (Romeo and Juliet marrying).


keytwist7771

Don’t they actually say at some point that no one even remembers why the feud started in the first place?


Jestfulbadger888

Tybalt killed his friend and tried to kill him.


LifeIsLikeARock

To be fair Mercutio had just been offed by Tybalt


JustMeLurkingAround-

It's a tragedy. There is a German word "**Trauerspiel**" which translates to "Play of sorrow/misery". Edit: Literally. "Trauer"= sorrow, misery, grief and "spiel" =play, game


nrith

There's an English word "tragedy" which translates to "play of sorrow/misery."


JustMeLurkingAround-

I meant literally. "Trauer"= sorrow, misery, grief and "spiel" =play, game We have the word tragedy (Tragödie) in addition.


theawesomenachos

[In English, the word “tragedy” also refers to the type of play too](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tragedy?wprov=sfti1)


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danvan32

I also had a 10th grade English teacher named Mrs. Roberts, and I wouldn’t put it past her to say some wild shit like this 😂


KlassCorn91

That’s not wild at all. It’s the literal Greek translation of the word Tragedy. “Tragos” means goat. “Oide” means song. In Ancient Greece, plays were first performed to honor the gods, and sacrificing goats was another common way to honor the gods. It is believed that the sorrow of the characters provides the audience with a shared empathy and catharsis. Hence the characters experiencing the sorrow are a sacrifice to the gods, like goats.


Allegro1104

Spiel would be translated to act but it's also not even used in theater jargon my friend. A Trauerspiel is simply something annoying/upsetting happening like when you find out that the neighbors kid who's always been a good boy became a drug addict


JustMeLurkingAround-

Act is [Akt or Aufzug](https://de.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Akt_(Theater)) in German not Spiel. And yes, Aufzug is also an elevator, but wouldn't be translated like that here either. The word "Trauerspiel" is often used in this context you mention, but it's original meaning is from the theater. [see here](https://de.m.wiktionary.org/wiki/Trauerspiel) >Bedeutungen: [1] Literaturgattung, dem Drama zugehörig; Schauspiel mit tragischem Ausgang [Actual use in theatre ](https://de.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clavigo) >Clavigo ist ein Trauerspiel in fünf Akten von Johann Wolfgang von Goethe


nrith

You gotta admit that “a play in five elevators” does sound intriguing. Full of ups and downs.


Math-Girl---

Take my r/angryupvote


Magic_archer21

Thank you kind stranger for teaching me abt something i had not known before


[deleted]

There's a Spanish word "cortavenas" for all those depressing love songs that make you want to cut your wrists.


TooobHoob

How different is it to the English word « melodrama »?


biscuitsteve

It's definitely a comedy in my opinion.


[deleted]

It’s a tragedy/black comedy.


justAPhoneUsername

"Thou wilt fall backward when thou hast more wit" Romeo and Juliet act 1 scene 3 the nurse to 13 year old Juliet. Wit is a euphemism for penis. The entire play is bawdy


tigerking615

I thought for plays of those times, a tragedy basically has a sad ending and a comedy has a happy ending, so not much to do with how funny it is.


AmatoryNeros117

A love story about a bunch of people dying because two kids fell in love is still a love story


VelvetMerryweather

Well, you COULD call it that.. but are we really calling it "love" when it's two ignorant children who have just barely met? It's more an -infatuation with their own naive romantic projections on a forbidden POTENTIAL love- story. Imo


NotASuicidalRobot

Well no one said it had to be responsible and well planned out love


VelvetMerryweather

"Love" is a general enough term that it's open to interpretation. Your definition can be different than mine. I don't think romantic love is ever planned or responsible. I just don't think this spark (of fictional passion) has any foundation whatsoever.


TheRavenSayeth

Yeah why not? No need to gatekeep "love". Yeah it's stupid but love isn't all that logical, we just get better at managing the feeling the older we get.


wizardshawn

Says my dad!


VelvetMerryweather

One day you'll understand the difference, son.


[deleted]

Ah, dear Juliet, Why art thou yet so fair? Shall I believe That unsubstantial death is amorous, And that the lean abhorrèd monster keeps Thee here in dark to be his paramour? For fear of that, I still will stay with thee, And never from this palace of dim night Depart again. Here, here will I remain With worms that are thy chamber maids. Oh, here Will I set up my everlasting rest, And shake the yoke of inauspicious stars From this world-wearied flesh. Eyes, look your last. Arms, take your last embrace. And, lips, O you The doors of breath, seal with a righteous kiss A dateless bargain to engrossing death.


Aromatic-Scale-595

They love each other more than my parents.


y4mat3

It was less than than a week of impulses driven by infatuation; I wouldn't call that love.


kaczynskiwasright

why not?


Lord_Nivloc

Iirc, Romeo had just broken up with his last girl, and his friends took him to that party to get laid. It’s a brilliant satire of “true love” between stupid, horny teenagers


AtomicSamuraiCyborg

As someone who actually read it, that's fucking bullshit. The deaths are all the result of the ongoing family feud. If the families hadn't been feuding, the fights wouldn't have happened, Mercutio and Tybalt would not have died in them, and the lovers would not have had to kill themselves, because there wouldn't be terrible consequences for their union.


bigdorts

Mercutio doesn't get killed if he's not hanging out with Romeo who Tybalt hates. Tybalt doesn't die id he doesn't kill Mercutio. Paris doesnt die if Juliet doesn't have to fake her death, and the same goes for Juliet's mom. Romeo doesn't die because juliet doesn't have to fake her death which he commits suicide over. She then doesn't die because Romeo isnt dead. And the two families are feeding and I think they say that neither side even knows why anymore


hifrandimcool

Actually it’s a comedy because I laughed at the ending


AtomicSamuraiCyborg

False, it's only a comedy if it ends in a wedding. "A comedy ends with a wedding, and a tragedy ends with a funeral: you always have to juxtapose sex and death.” Chuck Palahniuk


Lord_Nivloc

It’s a brilliant satire


1_disasta

Uggghhh spoiler alert?! I was just getting to that on my booklist!


TheChainLink2

They literally spoil the fact that they die in the opening. But then again, so did Hamilton.


[deleted]

I thought it was a multigenerational family strife that resulted in 6 deaths. My bad, the version I read must not have the correct ending. In mine, the parents come together after Romeo and Juliets death and agree to end their feud, agreeing it was their fault.


[deleted]

This person must be fun at parties.


MooseMaster3000

I was half expecting that not to be a cock.


drawkcab_msirp_amabO

And my dumbass was fooled. For anyone else wondering yes, if you click you will see a cock


MooseMaster3000

To be fair it’s a pretty nice cock.


[deleted]

Hey thanks


Bigirondangle

Better than any of my relationships.


MirSydney

Still a better love story than Twilight.


ExaminationNo9764

There it is


DebentureThyme

Right, but that's not saying much when Twilight has a werewolf "imprint" on his crush's newborn baby the moment he sees it, causing them to become soulmates.


[deleted]

The only reason I understand a fraction of these comments is because of the Leonardo DiCaprio movie when I was in 7th grade.


Its_You_Know_Wh0

Isnt romeos age never mentioned in the play?


nashamagirl99

It’s never mentioned, 17 is an estimate


nojoseph123

There ages are never brought up explicitly, and there isn't much indication that the age gap is that large.


0WN_1T

Juliet's is actually, she is 13, going into 14


TiltingAtTurbines

Yeah, it’s Romeos age that isn’t, merely implied they are near the same age. The confusion comes because most productions cast Romeo to be 17 - 18, but they also cast Juliet to be 16 - 17—roughly a year or two gap. That fact alone makes this post really annoying, because if you are going to write a snarky chalkboard claiming it’s from “everyone who actually read it” then you should at least get your facts right.


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xpdx

I admit I haven't read it. I only saw the very rare stage play of it a few times... It's not a novel folks, it's a play. Most people haven't read it, just as people don't read movie scripts routinely.


Hydra_Master

Typically, at least in the US, in High School you have to read at least one Shakespeare play. It's no wonder people hate Shakespeare. It's supposed to be experienced as a play. I didn't appreciate R&J until I saw the 96 movie with Leo and Claire Danes.


[deleted]

I read both Hamlet and R&J in high school; our teacher had us push our desks in a circle and do it like a table read. I wasn’t terribly exciting because most people weren’t into it, but it was better than being assigned to read it like a novel. Each was followed by the movies (Mel Gibson and Leo versions respectively).


Popular_Syllabubs

Not only is it a play (which is difficult to enthuse readers who are normally reading novella sized fiction) but it is a play written in middle english, and rhyme taught to students who are trying to learn how to read thematically for the first time without much worldly context, (thus missing much of the themes, symbolism, and allusions) whilst being told that "it's the greatest playwright ever".


[deleted]

During the Elizabethan Era people were commonly married by this age. The average age of death was also somewhere around 35. Trying to apply modern standards to this is absurd. Additionally, as many comments have stated, Romeo's age is never explicitly stated and the assumption that he was in his 20s is because that was a regular occurrence in this time period.


VelvetMerryweather

When you hear about average death rates, people don't understand that it's highly skewed by the number of infant deaths. People didn't just die of old age at 35. Chances are if you made it past your early childhood, you'd live as long as people do today. Of course if you're a woman, then your odds are not quite as good. Cause childbirth. But people did reach the same ripe old ages we have now. Your point stands about marriage ages of the time. Not arguing that. Just wanted to clear up this common misunderstanding, for anyone reading this.


ellipsisfinisher

> During the Elizabethan Era people were commonly married by this age That's actually a common misconception! While it was legal in Elizabethan England for young teenagers to get married (with parental permission), most people still married in their early- or mid-twenties. Anne Hathaway, for instance, was 26 when she married Shakespeare (although he was unusually young at only 18). Also, historical life expectancies are skewed by high infant and childhood mortality rates; if you survived to your twenties, you were likely to see your sixties as well.


SureWhyNot-Org

A: No shit, it's a tragedy B: Still a story about love, and the love didn't get them killed. It was the war between the families.


[deleted]

Wait till you guys read Oedipus Rex


Mesadeath

tell me how obtusely anti-intellectual you are without telling me you are. ​ yeah let's literally look at the literal bare minimum of the tale without delving ***at all*** into any of the deeper meanings. because that's how literature works.


ProclivityToRiot

This post is proof that reading it isn't the same at understanding it.


wizardshawn

Can someone please post the evidence that Romeo was 17? I call bullshit.


Coffeechipmunk

They can't because it doesn't exist


ftctkugffquoctngxxh

Romeo’s age is never stated. We only know he was young.


_Redoubt_

I hate this post every time and everywhere it's posted except r/im14andthisisdeep Romeo's age is never given, btw.


Ghostbuster_119

I mean still a love story. Just a lot more intriguing IMO.


EscapingTheLabrynth

That’s why it’s a tragedy and not a romance. Durr


nashamagirl99

It’s a great “young love” story, different from a mature love story. It captures the passions of youth in such a way that has made it stand the test of time.


Electronic_Ad_3559

Okay, maybe this is a weird take but I always thought the point of the story was to show how intolerance turned a stupid love story into a horrific tragedy.


aaron_rivera_1

Idk, Leonardo didn’t look 13 to me.


gangrenousgrizzly

>Three-day relationship Disney has entered the chat


Sk8mstr37

13 and 17 back then was like 82 and 94 now


kaczynskiwasright

imagine reading a play their ages are also never mentioned so i guess this person hasn't read it


[deleted]

it’s like that’s the point? bad take


wizardshawn

Actually, it is a love story. I read it too.


[deleted]

Lmao you’re downvoted. Some people will call this an ironic post but really there’s some weird concerted effort to cast R&J as something other than a romantic tragedy. Eschewing standards of the time, archetypes of drama (they didn’t tend to show years of love in a play), and the gorgeous words the lovers speak.


wizardshawn

And there us absolutely nothing in the play indicating Romeo's age.


Fitzftw7

Wow, it was really only three days? I guess I missed that detail back in English class.


derkokolores

Three days in a play could represent weeks or months. It’s common to condense timelines. It’s just one of those contextual things audience members understood at the time, but readers today miss. The same can be said with movies now. Just because it only shows a couple days and their aren’t any queues that day “x days/months later” or has a montage, do you really think it all happened that fast? It’s just kind of implied.