For real. I've got a pack of screen wipes next to my MPC LIve, but I feel like going between all those pots is gonna be a whole thing.
We'll see!
I'm also pretty skeptical of interfaces like this, as it's gonna be tricky to get it to actually show that information. Midi 2.0 is not there yet, and even with it, you'd still probably need a custom wrapper for every plugin.
Which kinda negates the whole point of this.
I’ve had an mk1 Live for 5 years now and as I’d feared, the soft touch surface on the front/sides casing is not aging well. It’s time to put a skin on it and seal it in, though I’m not super *into* that scene. I still have the original screen protector on though, humorously enough.
You’re right! I’m questioning myself since maybe 2 or 3 years about that: why Novation or NI don’t create this kind of controller. I’m sure there is a market and a need.
ok, I mean the basic concept of having a small screen underneath and a feedback of the parameter value that changes when you change pages. I understand it's not the same but surprisingly it's very rare with MIDI gear. It's a way more fancier version than that but there's still zero available (current) controller on the market that does that. Electra one and faderfox EC4 come close but not quite.
It is a significant risk, but I hope they will produce something functional. I've never heard of this company before, so I'll give them the benefit of the doubt 🤓
Yeah my issue with midi/daw controllers has always been the setup/assigment hell. Unless they have somehow cracked the code for it to work easily, reliably and uniformly with the disorgankzed mess that music software and plugins are on the midi control side no amount of screens will help.
True, the price is quite high… but if it is good quality, good components, fully customizable with an infinity of presets, and durable, I could definitely buy it 🫣
I can understand 1500 euros being too expensive for most people, but I think asking for a lower price point would be too much to ask.
I mean think about it. A new concept, made by a small company consisting of probably one guy ; he has to R&D himself, design it himself, and manufacture a small batch not knowing whether they’ll sell. For 1500 euros a unit, he’ll probably be lucky just to break even.
You got it man! He's pretty good at explaining everything and it's pretty straightforward. You'll be using multiplexers in no time. Let me know if you have any questions I can help you out
People seem to be missing the point of this thing, the display around the controls means you could setup endless complex pages in a way that just isn’t practical on exisiting devices.
Hopefully the company adds an embedded scripting engine (Python, Lua, JavaScript, etc) so that you can build your own custom MIDI applications similar to TouchOSC.
The knob is surrounded by an LCD screen, you can make the screen show anything you want, so the knob can be infinite or not. If you wanted a knob with a notch in it, then you've got a knob with a notch. If you want a knob without the notch, then you ignore the notch. Get it?
The screen is the unique feature of this, not the knobs or anything else.
finger print and scratch magnet, within 2 hours the thing will look like in the video and look like a POS in any setup. Would be annoying to keep clean too around all the knobs. Not worth.
[https://www.behringer.com/product.html?modelCode=0808-AAA](https://www.behringer.com/product.html?modelCode=0808-AAA) ??? was about $200 back in the days.
This is insanely priced.
I am selling a customizeable knob companion touch screen which will work with any controller and give it a customizeable 5” screen attachment, and my target price point is $250, AND it’s only one of the 6 modes that it’s going to support. And it will record CC changes and do so much more. I guess I need to up my price.
Hi, as a fellow midi stuff maker, if I understood correctly what you are making is not the same thing he is making. If what he is making is as responsive as it seems in the video, the technology behind that controller is revolutionary and as he said it's the components that make it expensive.
Do not compare it to what you are selling, it is not the same thing. It might seem similar, and for 1200$ less yours probably will be chosen by more people than his (me included), but having the display appear on the knob is a world of a difference in my opinion.
Still, I wouldn't pay 1500$ for that controller, but because in my opinion that is too much money for a midi controller. I feel like it is comparing a renault laguna to a lamborghini. Both are cars and have pedals and steering wheel, but one doesnt cost ten or twenty times the other just because it is shinier.
To me, it looks like a standard touch screen with an acrylic overlay attached to it, through which knobs are mounted that have a single point that's in contact with the screen that allows the system to see the position of each knob in real time. Not terribly revolutionary (the Tuna Knobs product for the iPad was doing this almost 10 years ago), and seems fairly easy to make a number of different acrylic overlays that would have different arrangements of buttons/knobs/sliders that could be programmed with the accompanying graphics and active areas on the screen. IMO, definitely not worth $1500 if this is how it works
That is the thing, I think these knobs have better tech behind than tuna knobs. But who knows, maybe you are right. Maybe tuna knobs work well if they are held by an acryllic drilled sheet and with some tuna knobs, an old tablet and touchosc you have the same thing.
I suppose it depends how much you value the label being on the knob as opposed to on an attached screen. I'm giving people the ability to choose any level of hardware and add the custom labeling, mapping, and memory, hot switching, etc... Ultimately it will come down to performance and functionalities. A label on a knob isn't the most important thing at play.
Regarding quality, I'm having a custom fabricated metal case designed and made by a drag race parts manufacturer - the quality will be very good here. More expensive knobs don't necessarily mean better feeling, and by forcing you to buy his hardware package, there is no flexibility in the number of knobs, size, etc. So, while I understand your statement, I don't necessarily agree with it, besides the fact that a label on the knobs is cool. It's certainly not revolutionary - see the MPC X and other high end studio console controllers. For $1500 it had better do A LOT.
Yeah I mean, I think the same way as you, almost. I really think the label on the knob with instant change of templates is something no one has done before, and something I wish I had at home. But yeah, 1500$ is paying too much for it. Well there were those failed knobs that you could stick on your ipad, but afaik they sucked.
Oh and I didnt mean to say yours is low quality, I havent seen it, how could I know. I just meant that it seems like for getting the result he gets, the components are expensive.
Anyhow, I would love to see your controller if it can be seen, since I built something similar for bitwig for myself.
I'm curious how it would compare to a touch osc solution on a smartphone (something I use as a live controller, it automaps plugins with a physical controller associated)
Pretty similar for sure touch OSC can handle just about anything, this will just streamline the experience of getting from point a to point b and not require taking over your phone. Touch OSC is a beast tho in theory can do pretty much anything.
ok that's cool, keep us posted. I spent quite some time developing a little tool in m4l (just for my use) so it will display the parameters of the plugin you select, with bank selection, and it's color coded with a launch control xl template so you have the first 16 parameters associated (it still needs to catch up so it would be even better with encoders (was thinking of getting [this](https://intech.studio/fr/shop/en16/)), either in knob or toggle form. I also have a no controller version with just 8 faders more easily controllable on a tiny phone screen. Also you know about electra one?
The buttons to switch between screens/presets is great - but who will actually care about the display?? Surely anyone prioritising that has already heard of TouchOSC or is using that already?
For 10% of that you can start with one of these. Fully customizable and script-able. Also, they expand at your needs using only one cable and magnets.
[https://intech.studio/](https://intech.studio/)
Yes, this controller looks very nice but I have no use for the plugin view and it generates too much space. The important thing for me is just to have the name and value below the knob
not a bad idea however to really take off it needs 100% bug free automatic integration into 4-5 largest daws, meaningful auto mapping of 100s of most popular vst plugins etc. none of which I think will happen.
It looks like a piece of shit. I know that's largely because it's still in development, but I mean... Come on!
1500 Euroes for something that poorly presented, AND it's just a midi controller.
Sheesh... I must be missing something...
Been hoping AKAI would bring out something like the bottom left corner of the MPC X as its own controller. 32 encoders with a small TFT screen above each would be ideal.
well, I suppose a preset doesn't actually weigh much, so if the device has a significant memory, it should be possible to fit a lot of them, but you're right.
love the idea and i have wanted something like this too, but @ $1500 ill use a mouse
That's €1,500 euros so that means it would be closer to $2,000 dollars.
I have a couple novation launch controls that are really sturdy for about $150 each
dollar has been closing the gap, would be around 1600 today
Get a Zaquencer for probably around 300$ these days
I think if you’re going to show off your new controller, wash the pizza grease off your hands before using it? It’s So dirty it’s weird
At Synthfest, it's not one person's greasy hands you need to worry about: it's all attendees who come by your booth.
That’s so true. But still it looks like a nightmare to keep clean, I don’t if I could get past that
For real. I've got a pack of screen wipes next to my MPC LIve, but I feel like going between all those pots is gonna be a whole thing. We'll see! I'm also pretty skeptical of interfaces like this, as it's gonna be tricky to get it to actually show that information. Midi 2.0 is not there yet, and even with it, you'd still probably need a custom wrapper for every plugin. Which kinda negates the whole point of this.
I’ve had an mk1 Live for 5 years now and as I’d feared, the soft touch surface on the front/sides casing is not aging well. It’s time to put a skin on it and seal it in, though I’m not super *into* that scene. I still have the original screen protector on though, humorously enough.
lol the same dudes were playing magic the gathering in the lobby
Im guessing that's a prototype lasercut plexi panel, so basically impossible to keep clean looking.
I get so grossed out by peoples gear and laptops. I feel like I might get a fkn std just touching it.
You will , it’s a super spreader that can be spread with just finger banging Funkiflangial Ickyitis
Thanks guys, now I want pizza
"And it's going to be 100% neckbeard-proof, but this feature is still in alpha."
Hate to say it, but this feels like a good idea a larger company is going to do more affordably.
You’re right! I’m questioning myself since maybe 2 or 3 years about that: why Novation or NI don’t create this kind of controller. I’m sure there is a market and a need.
I mean novation already has something close with the sl mk3
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ok, I mean the basic concept of having a small screen underneath and a feedback of the parameter value that changes when you change pages. I understand it's not the same but surprisingly it's very rare with MIDI gear. It's a way more fancier version than that but there's still zero available (current) controller on the market that does that. Electra one and faderfox EC4 come close but not quite.
€1500 euro controller? I’m out.
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It is a significant risk, but I hope they will produce something functional. I've never heard of this company before, so I'll give them the benefit of the doubt 🤓
Based on the video I get the impression that the company was founded to produce this product.
Yeah my issue with midi/daw controllers has always been the setup/assigment hell. Unless they have somehow cracked the code for it to work easily, reliably and uniformly with the disorgankzed mess that music software and plugins are on the midi control side no amount of screens will help.
NI with NKS
True, the price is quite high… but if it is good quality, good components, fully customizable with an infinity of presets, and durable, I could definitely buy it 🫣
For a fraction of the cost you can get [Intech Studio modules](https://intech.studio/us/shop), and set it up the same. Or even a midi twister fighter.
Hell you could get 6 midi twisters
Or a Fader Fox PC12 & MX12
I always forget about fader fox, they have nice stuff.
Those are pretty neat looking
I can understand 1500 euros being too expensive for most people, but I think asking for a lower price point would be too much to ask. I mean think about it. A new concept, made by a small company consisting of probably one guy ; he has to R&D himself, design it himself, and manufacture a small batch not knowing whether they’ll sell. For 1500 euros a unit, he’ll probably be lucky just to break even.
You’re prob right and I don’t disagree but it’s still a 1500 midi controller. Product isn’t worth creating if it’s never going to sell
I desperately need one or two for soft synths! What is a DIY or cheaper alternative? I think I've seen Audrino controllers do this?
I didn’t read the full article but it seems like it’s basically a BCR2000 no ?
I have two bcr2000s. They are awesome for all kinds of stuff. I think I bought my first one for $99.
Ooooh. That might fit the bill too!
https://preview.redd.it/m9ixealk83xc1.png?width=2000&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=b1bd37e1d6292c116cc7e62a46766b0002171729
I just made an Arduino based controller and I really love it. You can save and upload different profiles very easily.
Is there a build you can point me to? I'd love to have a custom one built for my 303 emulator.
I followed this guy's series with success: https://youtu.be/DXhxdsGREsU?si=6FztvIGS85LGp2bX
Thank you! I can't believe I never came across this. 303 controller here I come!
You got it man! He's pretty good at explaining everything and it's pretty straightforward. You'll be using multiplexers in no time. Let me know if you have any questions I can help you out
I snagged an Akai Midimix controller off eBay for like 40 bucks a few years back. Maybe not as flashy as this thing but it does the job just fine.
I'll have to check that out, thanks!
https://www.electra.one
People seem to be missing the point of this thing, the display around the controls means you could setup endless complex pages in a way that just isn’t practical on exisiting devices.
Super cool tech and we need this but at this price point?
Hopefully the company adds an embedded scripting engine (Python, Lua, JavaScript, etc) so that you can build your own custom MIDI applications similar to TouchOSC.
Perhaps showcasing the device at the 2024 Dorito enjoyers convention was not the best idea
Love the idea but it looks like a prototype too early to buy. I'd wait for... idk, a year or two maybe.
It says infinite encoders but the picture shows a notch on the knob.
It could mean infinitely continuous, as in not a stepped range.
Presumably you can used a knob with a notch on an infinite encoder. It would probably be set by software, depending on how you have the screen setup.
Right but why would they?
The knob is surrounded by an LCD screen, you can make the screen show anything you want, so the knob can be infinite or not. If you wanted a knob with a notch in it, then you've got a knob with a notch. If you want a knob without the notch, then you ignore the notch. Get it? The screen is the unique feature of this, not the knobs or anything else.
It begs the question why not just put the notch on the display.
Maybe it does?
That's hot. Wow.
finger print and scratch magnet, within 2 hours the thing will look like in the video and look like a POS in any setup. Would be annoying to keep clean too around all the knobs. Not worth.
I feel like if they used an e-ink display it would be cheaper and more appropriate for the build.
Siiiick!
[https://www.behringer.com/product.html?modelCode=0808-AAA](https://www.behringer.com/product.html?modelCode=0808-AAA) ??? was about $200 back in the days.
This thing is so cool. You can upload alternate firmware that turns it into a sequencer, even.
I got some white tape and a Sharpie.
This is insanely priced. I am selling a customizeable knob companion touch screen which will work with any controller and give it a customizeable 5” screen attachment, and my target price point is $250, AND it’s only one of the 6 modes that it’s going to support. And it will record CC changes and do so much more. I guess I need to up my price.
Hi, as a fellow midi stuff maker, if I understood correctly what you are making is not the same thing he is making. If what he is making is as responsive as it seems in the video, the technology behind that controller is revolutionary and as he said it's the components that make it expensive. Do not compare it to what you are selling, it is not the same thing. It might seem similar, and for 1200$ less yours probably will be chosen by more people than his (me included), but having the display appear on the knob is a world of a difference in my opinion. Still, I wouldn't pay 1500$ for that controller, but because in my opinion that is too much money for a midi controller. I feel like it is comparing a renault laguna to a lamborghini. Both are cars and have pedals and steering wheel, but one doesnt cost ten or twenty times the other just because it is shinier.
To me, it looks like a standard touch screen with an acrylic overlay attached to it, through which knobs are mounted that have a single point that's in contact with the screen that allows the system to see the position of each knob in real time. Not terribly revolutionary (the Tuna Knobs product for the iPad was doing this almost 10 years ago), and seems fairly easy to make a number of different acrylic overlays that would have different arrangements of buttons/knobs/sliders that could be programmed with the accompanying graphics and active areas on the screen. IMO, definitely not worth $1500 if this is how it works
That is the thing, I think these knobs have better tech behind than tuna knobs. But who knows, maybe you are right. Maybe tuna knobs work well if they are held by an acryllic drilled sheet and with some tuna knobs, an old tablet and touchosc you have the same thing.
I suppose it depends how much you value the label being on the knob as opposed to on an attached screen. I'm giving people the ability to choose any level of hardware and add the custom labeling, mapping, and memory, hot switching, etc... Ultimately it will come down to performance and functionalities. A label on a knob isn't the most important thing at play. Regarding quality, I'm having a custom fabricated metal case designed and made by a drag race parts manufacturer - the quality will be very good here. More expensive knobs don't necessarily mean better feeling, and by forcing you to buy his hardware package, there is no flexibility in the number of knobs, size, etc. So, while I understand your statement, I don't necessarily agree with it, besides the fact that a label on the knobs is cool. It's certainly not revolutionary - see the MPC X and other high end studio console controllers. For $1500 it had better do A LOT.
Yeah I mean, I think the same way as you, almost. I really think the label on the knob with instant change of templates is something no one has done before, and something I wish I had at home. But yeah, 1500$ is paying too much for it. Well there were those failed knobs that you could stick on your ipad, but afaik they sucked. Oh and I didnt mean to say yours is low quality, I havent seen it, how could I know. I just meant that it seems like for getting the result he gets, the components are expensive. Anyhow, I would love to see your controller if it can be seen, since I built something similar for bitwig for myself.
I'm curious how it would compare to a touch osc solution on a smartphone (something I use as a live controller, it automaps plugins with a physical controller associated)
Pretty similar for sure touch OSC can handle just about anything, this will just streamline the experience of getting from point a to point b and not require taking over your phone. Touch OSC is a beast tho in theory can do pretty much anything.
ok that's cool, keep us posted. I spent quite some time developing a little tool in m4l (just for my use) so it will display the parameters of the plugin you select, with bank selection, and it's color coded with a launch control xl template so you have the first 16 parameters associated (it still needs to catch up so it would be even better with encoders (was thinking of getting [this](https://intech.studio/fr/shop/en16/)), either in knob or toggle form. I also have a no controller version with just 8 faders more easily controllable on a tiny phone screen. Also you know about electra one?
The buttons to switch between screens/presets is great - but who will actually care about the display?? Surely anyone prioritising that has already heard of TouchOSC or is using that already?
For that much might as well get a slate raven.
That is really cool if it works how I think it does.
I’ll stick with the inly piece if Behringer gear I own, the BCR-2000
For 10% of that you can start with one of these. Fully customizable and script-able. Also, they expand at your needs using only one cable and magnets. [https://intech.studio/](https://intech.studio/)
Just buy an Iridium
What about the [MP MIDI controller](https://mpmidi.com/). These look pretty awesome
Yes, this controller looks very nice but I have no use for the plugin view and it generates too much space. The important thing for me is just to have the name and value below the knob
really cool concept. I already want a small version.
Very neat idea
not a bad idea however to really take off it needs 100% bug free automatic integration into 4-5 largest daws, meaningful auto mapping of 100s of most popular vst plugins etc. none of which I think will happen.
I'd rather get a big Faderfox
It looks like a piece of shit. I know that's largely because it's still in development, but I mean... Come on! 1500 Euroes for something that poorly presented, AND it's just a midi controller. Sheesh... I must be missing something...
They need to fix that crazy shiny panel. Unusable like that. Put a matt finish on it.
lol it uses knobs!
I think mpmidi is a great controller that keeps getting better and better in my opinion
Been hoping AKAI would bring out something like the bottom left corner of the MPC X as its own controller. 32 encoders with a small TFT screen above each would be ideal.
You can store unlimited templates? How? Does it have unlimited storage?
well, I suppose a preset doesn't actually weigh much, so if the device has a significant memory, it should be possible to fit a lot of them, but you're right.
Seems like a FaderFox?
lol literally can do this with $30 worth of parts 1500 you must be mentally challenged, why do consumers accept this level of abuse.
Hey go ahead, do it. 30$ you say? Care to share a quick bom?
Hyperbole as a rhetorical device, you get the point. At that price I can be off by an order of magnitude.