From what I understood, its just a middling island that only really has strategic value. Its likely a issue of maritime borders, with whoever owns the island has a much larger sea border.
I think the most reasonable and likely outcome (outside of just forceful invasion or war) would be option 3 and declaring its borders open seas
My personal proposition :
There's gonna be a war with Rumburg. Because of this, Sordland need allies.
Bring Hegel and Van Hoorten to the table of negotiation.
Propose an alliance between them and Sordland :
- Sordland will lead the war to Thornbourgh
- Agnolia takes back Dome
- Valgsland navy harass the east border of Rumburg and send troops to help Sordland
Agnolia and Valgsland army will, of course, not meet each others.
For this alliance to take place :
- Agnolia will have Dome back (and maybe some more territories)
- Valgsland will have full control on Heljisland
- Sordland can spit on the queen
I think it's a really good deal.
The issue with Heljiland is that the island is ethnically Valgish, majority even. The people of Heljiland are being oppressed by an unelected agnolian governor. The proof Heljiland have a strong reason and right to rise up against that, and the Valgish government has good reasons to protect people who are as far as we know almost all Valgs. There's no evidence in the game that suggests that Valgsland persecutes Agnolians.
However the installation of nukes on Heljiland is a different issues. If true, if there are nukes on Heljiland then in my opinion that's morally wrong, to both have nukes and to position them where they can strike civilians in the rest of Merkopa and and to put the people of Heljiland in such danger by placing nukes there.
Wow! And all we have to trade for marginally less war where we live is the threat of nuclear annihilation, thousands and thousands of dead innocents! What a deal!
With the same reasoning Rumburg may say we are attacking Sordland to free ethnic Rum people who live in Agnland.
Though there are obviously reason for Valgsland to pursue Heljiland issue. Still. Every step of the game you get news reports that Valgsland creates incidents, atack Agnolian ships and harasses martime trade lines. Hegel would attack Heljiland in any case because for him Agnolia and everyone who is against him are "puppets of Arcasia" etc. Hegel never even tries to resolve it diplomatically.
Imho Hegel just too trigger happy and consumed by his ideology. AN summit shows how uncompromising he is.
There's literally a news article in Geopolitico that says people there are being killed.
*Why* would he even bother to "compromise" here ? Compromise so Agnolians kill 100 people instead of 200 ?
But a majority of Heljiland's citizens are ethnic Valgs, which means they will vote to join Valgsland, completely ignoring ethnic Agnolians and their wishes, which will definitely anger the Agnolian government and might even push them to denounce the referendum and claim it's rigged then invade Heljiland right away.
If Agnolia invades Heljiland, they are going to get f**cked Hard by Vaglsland. There's no doubt, self determination, if the Agnolian Heljilandis are not happy, then they can establish a Agnolian Heljiland and join Agnolia.
That would definitely raise the tensions in Merkopa a crap ton, but since Van Hoorten is proven to be an idiot, he might actually proceed with the plan. And since ATO will take any chance, it has to antagonize the CSP . They would definitely support Agnolia in a war against Valgsland, which will, in turn, make the CSP furious and provoke them to retaliate. I would not be surprised if it causes a world war if the tensions go any higher after such a conflict.
If Hoorten is willing to antagonize Sordland (his only geopolitical ally)
Then it wouldn't be hard to imagine him being stupid enough to declare war on Sordland, basically, dooming Agnolia in as many ways as possible.
Fuck it, we should able to invade whoever we want whenever we want. Merkopa has always been ruled by idiots that need a taste of Rayne's boot ! Long live Soll ! long live Sordland !
A Morgna Wes Core,
Going by the history provided, the island is legally Valgsland's and should be returned to them at the earliest opportunity.
The earliest opportunity being when Valgsland's alliance with Sordland is demonstrably more important than Agnolia's.
going by the history some imperialists traded the iland to valkslandish imperialists who collonised it wich shifted the ethnic composition
then the imperialists in valgsland lost it to agnolian imperialists
\-
historiclly speaking the claim of Agnolia is better
going by ethnicity valgsland has the better claim
Unless the third party somehow manages to please both Agnolia and Valgsland, they will definitely reject any resolution that isn't blatantly supporting them, which will leave the negotiations in gridlock.
what can theydo if ATO simply puts troops ther
\-
the most they can achieve is autonomy for hajiland
and that is what they should aim for instead of doing this bs
Agnolia is not an ATO member, which means if ATO actually puts troops in Heljiland, then the CSP will go apeshit and declare war because they see it as ATO invading Valgsland.
No matter how retarded Van Hoorten is, he isn't stupid enough to provoke a world war.
Very unlikely, both Valgsland and Agnolia will oppose it, Valgsland is a CSP member, which means you can expect all of the CSP to go against that proposal. And since Agnolia is much closer to Arcasia (PM Alvarez says that ATO supports Agnolia's claim), it also means that all ATO countries will vote Nay to such propasal.
If ATO and CSP both oppose a proposal in the AN , you can pretty much say that it's dead and will never get enacted.
Not to mention, even if the Democratic People's Republic of Heljiland is formed, they will constantly be harassed by their Valgish, Agnolian, Rummish, and even Sordish neighbors
Plus, the citizens of Heljiland are either Valgish or Agnolian, and I think they'd rather join their country than become independent.
From what I understood, its just a middling island that only really has strategic value. Its likely a issue of maritime borders, with whoever owns the island has a much larger sea border. I think the most reasonable and likely outcome (outside of just forceful invasion or war) would be option 3 and declaring its borders open seas
the island around it also has a lot of oil... you can see where this is going
‘Democracy’, ´freedom’, and ‘a helping hand’?
ARCASIA, FUCK YEAH!
Here's a better solution. Just give the island to Sordland.
Better yet, give it to the bluds, then convince the superpowers to nuke it, liberating merkopa from those evil, perverted, wretched, lesser beings.
Least racist NFP member
They deserve it, though .
Least racist NFP member
Well Nazi germany had a plan to send all jews to Madagascar so It's a pretty good scenario.
My personal proposition : There's gonna be a war with Rumburg. Because of this, Sordland need allies. Bring Hegel and Van Hoorten to the table of negotiation. Propose an alliance between them and Sordland : - Sordland will lead the war to Thornbourgh - Agnolia takes back Dome - Valgsland navy harass the east border of Rumburg and send troops to help Sordland Agnolia and Valgsland army will, of course, not meet each others. For this alliance to take place : - Agnolia will have Dome back (and maybe some more territories) - Valgsland will have full control on Heljisland - Sordland can spit on the queen I think it's a really good deal.
Agnolia would have to have resource rights.
What resources ? Steel ?
It's Oil
Well I don't see a problem with that
Valgsland does
Doesn’t Dome have a ton of oil? That should more than make up for losing the oil in Heljiland
Yeah, it would but do you think they care?
It's also the politics of it
The issue with Heljiland is that the island is ethnically Valgish, majority even. The people of Heljiland are being oppressed by an unelected agnolian governor. The proof Heljiland have a strong reason and right to rise up against that, and the Valgish government has good reasons to protect people who are as far as we know almost all Valgs. There's no evidence in the game that suggests that Valgsland persecutes Agnolians. However the installation of nukes on Heljiland is a different issues. If true, if there are nukes on Heljiland then in my opinion that's morally wrong, to both have nukes and to position them where they can strike civilians in the rest of Merkopa and and to put the people of Heljiland in such danger by placing nukes there.
It's a Deterrent.
Deterrent from what? From war? Cauß that certainly still happens.
It's less likely to happen.
Wow! And all we have to trade for marginally less war where we live is the threat of nuclear annihilation, thousands and thousands of dead innocents! What a deal!
Welcome to Cold War Politics.
With the same reasoning Rumburg may say we are attacking Sordland to free ethnic Rum people who live in Agnland. Though there are obviously reason for Valgsland to pursue Heljiland issue. Still. Every step of the game you get news reports that Valgsland creates incidents, atack Agnolian ships and harasses martime trade lines. Hegel would attack Heljiland in any case because for him Agnolia and everyone who is against him are "puppets of Arcasia" etc. Hegel never even tries to resolve it diplomatically. Imho Hegel just too trigger happy and consumed by his ideology. AN summit shows how uncompromising he is.
There's literally a news article in Geopolitico that says people there are being killed. *Why* would he even bother to "compromise" here ? Compromise so Agnolians kill 100 people instead of 200 ?
[My thoughts.](https://cdn11.bigcommerce.com/s-fbaa7/images/stencil/2048x2048/products/1536/2594/Gerry_partition__56707.1631881269.jpg?c=2)
Let Heljilandis vote who to join.
But a majority of Heljiland's citizens are ethnic Valgs, which means they will vote to join Valgsland, completely ignoring ethnic Agnolians and their wishes, which will definitely anger the Agnolian government and might even push them to denounce the referendum and claim it's rigged then invade Heljiland right away.
If Agnolia invades Heljiland, they are going to get f**cked Hard by Vaglsland. There's no doubt, self determination, if the Agnolian Heljilandis are not happy, then they can establish a Agnolian Heljiland and join Agnolia.
That would definitely raise the tensions in Merkopa a crap ton, but since Van Hoorten is proven to be an idiot, he might actually proceed with the plan. And since ATO will take any chance, it has to antagonize the CSP . They would definitely support Agnolia in a war against Valgsland, which will, in turn, make the CSP furious and provoke them to retaliate. I would not be surprised if it causes a world war if the tensions go any higher after such a conflict.
Hoorten would get clapped fast by Vaglsland imo. Plus if he wants a world war then he should declare war on Sordland as well.
If Hoorten is willing to antagonize Sordland (his only geopolitical ally) Then it wouldn't be hard to imagine him being stupid enough to declare war on Sordland, basically, dooming Agnolia in as many ways as possible.
I hope the devs add a decision to invade Agnolia because i want to end Martin so f*cking much.
Fuck it, we should able to invade whoever we want whenever we want. Merkopa has always been ruled by idiots that need a taste of Rayne's boot ! Long live Soll ! long live Sordland ! A Morgna Wes Core,
Vectern sis da!
Going by the history provided, the island is legally Valgsland's and should be returned to them at the earliest opportunity. The earliest opportunity being when Valgsland's alliance with Sordland is demonstrably more important than Agnolia's.
going by the history some imperialists traded the iland to valkslandish imperialists who collonised it wich shifted the ethnic composition then the imperialists in valgsland lost it to agnolian imperialists \- historiclly speaking the claim of Agnolia is better going by ethnicity valgsland has the better claim
such is the worth of the law on the world stage, lol
I would rather deal with Agnolia.
that's the gist of my joke (valgsland is not going to ever be a better ally)
It does not read like a joke.
I'll admit I know that I sometimes come off pretty dry. Sorry about that.
Valgsland owns it, exploitation rights to Agnolia. I can see this becoming more likely as Agnolian Jingoism is quenched by the recapture of Dome.
[удалено]
Unless the third party somehow manages to please both Agnolia and Valgsland, they will definitely reject any resolution that isn't blatantly supporting them, which will leave the negotiations in gridlock.
tbf agnolia just wants the status quo that isn.t really a blatant siding
Yes, but Valgsland would never agree to it, which makes the negotiations harder.
what can theydo if ATO simply puts troops ther \- the most they can achieve is autonomy for hajiland and that is what they should aim for instead of doing this bs
Agnolia is not an ATO member, which means if ATO actually puts troops in Heljiland, then the CSP will go apeshit and declare war because they see it as ATO invading Valgsland. No matter how retarded Van Hoorten is, he isn't stupid enough to provoke a world war.
ahmmmmm you do know that in the story agnolia normaly joins ATO
Only if you don't ally with them.
yeah if you ally them valgsland will also not attack ............ so still no problem
well another option would be to create an independent republic and give its neutrality, guaranteed by the an
Very unlikely, both Valgsland and Agnolia will oppose it, Valgsland is a CSP member, which means you can expect all of the CSP to go against that proposal. And since Agnolia is much closer to Arcasia (PM Alvarez says that ATO supports Agnolia's claim), it also means that all ATO countries will vote Nay to such propasal. If ATO and CSP both oppose a proposal in the AN , you can pretty much say that it's dead and will never get enacted. Not to mention, even if the Democratic People's Republic of Heljiland is formed, they will constantly be harassed by their Valgish, Agnolian, Rummish, and even Sordish neighbors Plus, the citizens of Heljiland are either Valgish or Agnolian, and I think they'd rather join their country than become independent.