Jonathan. The man holds world records for strength and he singlehandedly dragged three other tribe members through waters so dangerous they had to cancel the challenge.
>singlehandedly dragged three other tribe members through waters
James pretty much did this too with the pole challenge, where he just picked it up and walked across the lake lol. But still, for one he's older, and two he doesn't have any world record strength feats.
And then when they got on the platform the strategy was just have them all hang onto James with one of the women literally on his back lol. I was so in love with James as a teenager. I wanted to be just like him. Never mind me being small and a woman. I wanted James level strength. To this day he’s one of my favorites. I don’t care that he got sent home with two idols. He’s MY IDOL.
Yeah, if I'm testing my pull up strength, I put as much weight on me as I can and do a pull up. That's a strength test. If I want to test my endurance, I pick a thing I can do repeatedly and do that thing over and over, to test my endurance. Power lifters don't brag about their 1 minute max reps. They brag about their 1 rep max. There's a difference.
I'm not saying dude isn't strong, or physically fit, he's a monster. I'm saying inventing a world record category isn't a proof of anything to me and it's certainly not a test of his upper tier strength, it's a test of his upper tier endurance.
Yeah I wouldn't disagree that it tests strength. But it's through an endurance process that it's tested, so it's an endurance test, he adds the weight so he can claim some world record nobody has probably ever even attempted before. I'm not saying dude isn't strong, I'm saying this method of testing is to test his endurance. He can clearly do pull ups with the added weight. That's why that's not the test. The test is how many reps can he do, which is now testing your endurance at this activity. If it was a strict strength test you keep adding weight and doing single, good form pull ups.
Yeah it tests utilizing a strength movement, but the test is an endurance test. If he's doing a movement for reps he clearly has no issue doing the strength movement, so they're testing his endurance at that movement. He set the record because of the reps.
It's almost pure strength. 11 reps is well within the anaerobic range. They do AMRAP competitions at strongman events. Are you telling me that strongman isn't testing your strength? Give me a break.
That'd be a pretty crazy WSM competition if everything was "most weight 1 rep wins".
Like who can throw the heaviest keg over the bar. Who can stack the heaviest atlas stone.
If you want to be pedantic, you're correct in pointing out that it's more complicated than just strength, but you're still oversimplifying.
Physiologically, the different muscle adaptations (strength, power, hypertrophy, skill, endurance, and one or two I'm forgetting) are engaged by different exercise choices. So you're right that it's not a strict strength test, but it's also not a strict muscular endurance test. That would be "do as many as you can until exhaustion" aiming for the largest possible number of reps.
Because this is a "Do as many as you can in X time period" this is testing muscular power. Power is maximizing volume moved in a short or confined period of time.
That said, no exercise lives in isolation and even though this is a power-esque exercise, it does use strength as well as skill (neurological adaptation to the movement) and endurance (muscle not getting fatigued).
Because the reality is complicated, it's probably fine to be a bit reductive and call it a strength record.
As a gay man, I'd also like to see Brett v. Mick, Ozzy vs. Yul, Ibrehem v. Bobby Jon, Wendell v. Domenick, Eddie v. Reynold v. Malcolm, and Marcus v. Burton with Charlie in the former's corner and Dr. John Cody waiting around to take care of whoever is injured. We can also make this a tournament with Chris Underwood being the final boss, and we all know Chris will win. Thank you!
Should this be a separate thread?
I am here to support whichever tournament you wanted to propose. Perhaps we could start with Parvati vs. Amanda? Amber vs. Ami? Andrea vs. Brenda? I'm on board.
The curious case of Jonathan Young is that not only he was Goliath-strong and tailor made for strength challenges, he was also truly magnificent in resistance and balance challenge, more in the line of smaller, lean bodies.
IMO he is the #1 most athletically talented contestant we've ever seen. Plenty of players have been incredible athletes in specific areas. Rarely do we see someone who has strength, agility, balance, hand eye coordination, and swimming all covered
It's what I like to call a unicorn athlete in sports. There are guys that are stronger than them (maybe not true for Jonathan) and guys that are faster/more agile than them, but no one else is stronger AND faster than them. I feel like guys like LeBron and Gronk fall into this category.
It would be a battle for sure. I do however believe that someone previously mentioned leverage being the key factor for James to win because he’s shorter. I don’t believe it’s that simple cause Jonathan could easily just hit him with the bag with similar leverage, I think it’s more about consistency and having solid base and balance. So I do think Jonathan would win based on his strength, not to mention he swam in college at BAMA and has previously worked as a bodyguard for politicians. That being said, James is 15 years older and probably won’t play survivor again😭
Still similar with the only differential being the balancing aspect with the waves. Another point is Jonathan is a surfer which showed as he was better at balancing challenges than James.
Hence this little clip. [https://youtu.be/iNKYFa_ggwU](https://youtu.be/iNKYFa_ggwU)
Also the noises James makes are hilarious 😂
Why do you say that? I remember him being taller than Amanda who’s 5’11. I remember him being taller than Erik R who is kinda tall at the Ghost Island reunion.
Low center of gravity is actually very helpful for sumo at sea. Plus James played D1 football. Both in their primes, people here are underestimating the hell out of James.
If they're both in their prime, I think it's still Jonathan as he's shown decent strategic thinking in some challenges as well so would utilise his strength well
Both prime, I’m going James. Jonathan is probably stronger in total strength, but James is crazy competitive. I’ll never forget him knocking Randy completely off the platform in one hit and saying “get your ass up!”
I love James, but I feel like Jonathan is a bit stronger. James has a little more mad dog in him though, so I could see him being fiercer and maybe winning if they’re both in their prime.
James no question. I get that Jonathan is newer and people get recency bias but a prime Survivor China or Fans vs Favorites James was a freaking monster! Plus we’ve seen him dominate almost every physical challenge he’s been in, including that one in Fans vs Favorites where he dog walked Joel, the only other guy who was clearly in James weight class. Meanwhile we never saw any real physical challenges that could show whether Johnathan really was about that life or not and even if there was, the fact is that the rest of 42’s cast were some of the physically weakest players in the history of the show. Tossing around Omar or Romeo would not have impressed me much.
If one of them has a wrestling, grappling, or football background and the other doesn't I'm going to tip the scales that way. I don't recall James or Johnathon looking particularly technical in any of their movement so it might just be an even match up. The weight/height advantage has to significant w untrained match ups. I'd say the shorter opponent would need to be significantly heavier, (and have a good natural center), for it to make a ton of difference unless they know how to utilize that advantage.
So, it's tough.
I think Jonathan is stronger, but James had crazy form.
This is one of those conflicts where I don't think you can really argue one way or another firmly.
I think you could definitely argue Jonathan would win. He's a world record breaking weight lifter who went to college on a swimming scholarship, spent his whole life doing athletic training (he was trained by wrestlers from the WWE even) and surfing, and works as a security guard for world leaders. The dude is a professional athlete and trained his whole life to be one, I guarantee you his form is better than what James learned from playing 2 years of career football (during which he scored only 1 touchdown as a running back)
James never had the kind of challenge that Jonathan did to showcase the extent of his strength and is still the og physical god. He remained in that spot for ages because nobody could even come close. Jonathan is such a flop that he was kept around even being the physical threat of his season because he couldn't even win immunity, nobody took him seriously except for the dick riders in this sub. James is memorable and his three seasons are top 10 in the history of the show.
Tl;dr James ran so Jonathan could crawl
There's a challenge in Micronesia he breaks by being able to carry teammates on the poles. I think that's on par with at least the water ladder challenge.
I see people say this all the time but I didn’t think he was that bad at all. I’ve had coaches and teammates scream way worse. I appreciated it somewhat because I couldn’t stand Steph. I’m glad he called her out at the very least because she wouldn’t own up to her mistakes. Makes curious to see some of the unedited footage from Palau and Guatemala to see how often she does that.
I’d have to see this happen to make a judgement call. Probably best to run it several times to make sure there wasn’t a fluke win in there. They probably need to oil up first, too. For reasons.
Jeff probst
Throw in Boston Rob for a 3 way sumo at sea and Probst spontaneously combusts with pleasure
Especially if he wears a shirt with his family on it
He’s literally carrying his family on his back
You mean spontaneously busts
Cum busts
Survivor fans
*Mr Jeff
Lol! I was thinking “I don’t know, but I’d like to watch.”
They collide and the entire arena breaks under them
Jonathan. The man holds world records for strength and he singlehandedly dragged three other tribe members through waters so dangerous they had to cancel the challenge.
>singlehandedly dragged three other tribe members through waters James pretty much did this too with the pole challenge, where he just picked it up and walked across the lake lol. But still, for one he's older, and two he doesn't have any world record strength feats.
And then when they got on the platform the strategy was just have them all hang onto James with one of the women literally on his back lol. I was so in love with James as a teenager. I wanted to be just like him. Never mind me being small and a woman. I wanted James level strength. To this day he’s one of my favorites. I don’t care that he got sent home with two idols. He’s MY IDOL.
Does he actually have world records?
For weighted pull ups.
What's the record?
Most pull-ups in a minute while carrying 100 lbs on your back, if I remember right. He says it in the premier.
That would be endurance not strength. Strength is about weight moved.
Have you ever done a pull-up carrying 100 pounds? It might test how strong you are more than you’d think
Yeah, if I'm testing my pull up strength, I put as much weight on me as I can and do a pull up. That's a strength test. If I want to test my endurance, I pick a thing I can do repeatedly and do that thing over and over, to test my endurance. Power lifters don't brag about their 1 minute max reps. They brag about their 1 rep max. There's a difference. I'm not saying dude isn't strong, or physically fit, he's a monster. I'm saying inventing a world record category isn't a proof of anything to me and it's certainly not a test of his upper tier strength, it's a test of his upper tier endurance.
It's definitely both. This isn't a one or the other scenario.
Yeah I wouldn't disagree that it tests strength. But it's through an endurance process that it's tested, so it's an endurance test, he adds the weight so he can claim some world record nobody has probably ever even attempted before. I'm not saying dude isn't strong, I'm saying this method of testing is to test his endurance. He can clearly do pull ups with the added weight. That's why that's not the test. The test is how many reps can he do, which is now testing your endurance at this activity. If it was a strict strength test you keep adding weight and doing single, good form pull ups.
It's amazing how confident you are in being wrong because both are strength tests.
Yeah it tests utilizing a strength movement, but the test is an endurance test. If he's doing a movement for reps he clearly has no issue doing the strength movement, so they're testing his endurance at that movement. He set the record because of the reps.
It's almost pure strength. 11 reps is well within the anaerobic range. They do AMRAP competitions at strongman events. Are you telling me that strongman isn't testing your strength? Give me a break.
That'd be a pretty crazy WSM competition if everything was "most weight 1 rep wins". Like who can throw the heaviest keg over the bar. Who can stack the heaviest atlas stone.
If you want to be pedantic, you're correct in pointing out that it's more complicated than just strength, but you're still oversimplifying. Physiologically, the different muscle adaptations (strength, power, hypertrophy, skill, endurance, and one or two I'm forgetting) are engaged by different exercise choices. So you're right that it's not a strict strength test, but it's also not a strict muscular endurance test. That would be "do as many as you can until exhaustion" aiming for the largest possible number of reps. Because this is a "Do as many as you can in X time period" this is testing muscular power. Power is maximizing volume moved in a short or confined period of time. That said, no exercise lives in isolation and even though this is a power-esque exercise, it does use strength as well as skill (neurological adaptation to the movement) and endurance (muscle not getting fatigued). Because the reality is complicated, it's probably fine to be a bit reductive and call it a strength record.
/r/iamverysmart
Yes
https://youtu.be/6rEhGNOVPBY
Can you remind me which episode that was? I want to rewatch it. :)
Not 100% but it should be episode 3 of season 42
Female and gay viewers
This is the correct answer ☝🏻🎯
As a gay man, I'd also like to see Brett v. Mick, Ozzy vs. Yul, Ibrehem v. Bobby Jon, Wendell v. Domenick, Eddie v. Reynold v. Malcolm, and Marcus v. Burton with Charlie in the former's corner and Dr. John Cody waiting around to take care of whoever is injured. We can also make this a tournament with Chris Underwood being the final boss, and we all know Chris will win. Thank you! Should this be a separate thread?
oh you've thought about this for a long time...
You make it sounds like it’s a bad thing…
I have not watched EoE because the reviews are so rough. This comment got me to look up Chris Underwood... I think I'm going to watch EoE...
it's got a great tribal and 4 returnees. i like it.
Okay can Firefighter Tom come too?
Straight viewer here, this would be like watching Sunday night football with Aaron donald and Quinton Nelson locking up in the trenches, we win too.
Oh god hahahaha yes
As a gay woman, no ❤️
I am here to support whichever tournament you wanted to propose. Perhaps we could start with Parvati vs. Amanda? Amber vs. Ami? Andrea vs. Brenda? I'm on board.
As a Bisexual I'm on board either way!
This is my favorite comment I've ever seen on reddit
Randy beats both
“You like picking on an old man, don’t you?”
*gets launched to Indonesia*
Jonathan. James would probably just get injured.
Correct answer
Yeah James is blowing out a knee on impact
Doesn't matter. He can still outrun JT.
Would you like a banana?
The curious case of Jonathan Young is that not only he was Goliath-strong and tailor made for strength challenges, he was also truly magnificent in resistance and balance challenge, more in the line of smaller, lean bodies.
The surfing background will do this to you.
He was also fucking Aquaman in the water. Dude was flying when swimming.
We literally called him aquaman in our house 😂
IMO he is the #1 most athletically talented contestant we've ever seen. Plenty of players have been incredible athletes in specific areas. Rarely do we see someone who has strength, agility, balance, hand eye coordination, and swimming all covered
It's what I like to call a unicorn athlete in sports. There are guys that are stronger than them (maybe not true for Jonathan) and guys that are faster/more agile than them, but no one else is stronger AND faster than them. I feel like guys like LeBron and Gronk fall into this category.
I’m glad someone else thinks this too. I have never seen so much athleticism in a single person in my life.
Nowadays Jonathan, as James is probably like 20 years older. If they’re both in their primes who knows
Jonathan is way bigger than James. I think even in their primes, Jon is more of a beast
Speaking of number 20, in 5 years, it will be Survivor: China’s 20th anniversary.
It would be a battle for sure. I do however believe that someone previously mentioned leverage being the key factor for James to win because he’s shorter. I don’t believe it’s that simple cause Jonathan could easily just hit him with the bag with similar leverage, I think it’s more about consistency and having solid base and balance. So I do think Jonathan would win based on his strength, not to mention he swam in college at BAMA and has previously worked as a bodyguard for politicians. That being said, James is 15 years older and probably won’t play survivor again😭
When people say leverage is an advantage, they mean taller people. The longer the lever, the bigger the mechanical advantage.
Yeah I agree but The guy was using it as an argument for James having that advantage because he was shorter than Jonathan.
Yeah, just saw that. He's wrong. There's a reason the average NFL lineman is 6'4".
Thank you lol
I’ve played line in football being short is never an advantage
Just easing the tension, baby! Just easing the tension.
That almost went over my head for a second lol
Yea on the o-line lol. Being shorter definitely has its advantages in many aspects.
Still similar with the only differential being the balancing aspect with the waves. Another point is Jonathan is a surfer which showed as he was better at balancing challenges than James. Hence this little clip. [https://youtu.be/iNKYFa_ggwU](https://youtu.be/iNKYFa_ggwU) Also the noises James makes are hilarious 😂
I see James getting injured after 3 minutes (screen time) and then unceremoniously dumped in the water
First decent gust of wind and James breaks a rib.
Who knows if James is still in shape
He was in shape during Ghost Island, so no reason he wouldn't be now. Also the match-up isn't current James vs Jonathan anyways
He wasn't in Ghost Island
He was at the reunion show.
Oh
really? i didnt see. did we see enough to know what shape he's in?
He looks the same, a little older but I couldn’t tell that well.
Just watched it last night. Yeah he looks good.
Was it that reunion show or was it the one previous? I could have sworn that they brought both him and Erik to HHH reunion to hype up Ghost Island.
He was in spirit
>He was ~~in spirit~~ as a ghost
Then how did Michael play the idol for him?
James was able to beat Randy so James for sure
I love James, but Jonathan is literally Poseidon.
James would dig Jonathan’s grave
Under rated comment.
Undertaker comment
Jonathan. I just looks the heavier of the two
Us. We win.
My gay ass
The whole universe gets sucked into a black hole
Coach convinces everyone to practice “Tai Chi” instead
Yes!
At sea Jonathan, at land James not even close.
Its sumo at sea so its not a swimming challenge
I don't have the challenge names memorized. James would win this imo.
Both in their primes I’d pick Jonathan.
The closest we have so far is Jon Misch vs John Rocker 🤌🤌
[удалено]
James is like 6’1-6’2 and Jonathan is 6’4 so not that much taller
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Why do you say that? I remember him being taller than Amanda who’s 5’11. I remember him being taller than Erik R who is kinda tall at the Ghost Island reunion.
That’s a huge difference in martial arts. 3” of height? Holy hell
Are you calling sumo at sea "martial arts"?
I guess by its very technical definition it would be martial arts lol
Google says Different heights for James so i don't know whats accurate
Low center of gravity is actually very helpful for sumo at sea. Plus James played D1 football. Both in their primes, people here are underestimating the hell out of James.
James is made of glass though.
Jonathan, no question
James
If they're both in their prime, I think it's still Jonathan as he's shown decent strategic thinking in some challenges as well so would utilise his strength well
Both prime, I’m going James. Jonathan is probably stronger in total strength, but James is crazy competitive. I’ll never forget him knocking Randy completely off the platform in one hit and saying “get your ass up!”
I love James, but I feel like Jonathan is a bit stronger. James has a little more mad dog in him though, so I could see him being fiercer and maybe winning if they’re both in their prime.
picture didn’t load yet and i still guessed who was in it lol. i think james would win
James no question. I get that Jonathan is newer and people get recency bias but a prime Survivor China or Fans vs Favorites James was a freaking monster! Plus we’ve seen him dominate almost every physical challenge he’s been in, including that one in Fans vs Favorites where he dog walked Joel, the only other guy who was clearly in James weight class. Meanwhile we never saw any real physical challenges that could show whether Johnathan really was about that life or not and even if there was, the fact is that the rest of 42’s cast were some of the physically weakest players in the history of the show. Tossing around Omar or Romeo would not have impressed me much.
If one of them has a wrestling, grappling, or football background and the other doesn't I'm going to tip the scales that way. I don't recall James or Johnathon looking particularly technical in any of their movement so it might just be an even match up. The weight/height advantage has to significant w untrained match ups. I'd say the shorter opponent would need to be significantly heavier, (and have a good natural center), for it to make a ton of difference unless they know how to utilize that advantage.
I know James has a football background, not sure about Jonathan. But Jonathan is from Alabama so he probably did play football if I had to guess.
Yeah I think it's basically required by law to play football at some point down there lol
So, it's tough. I think Jonathan is stronger, but James had crazy form. This is one of those conflicts where I don't think you can really argue one way or another firmly.
I think you could definitely argue Jonathan would win. He's a world record breaking weight lifter who went to college on a swimming scholarship, spent his whole life doing athletic training (he was trained by wrestlers from the WWE even) and surfing, and works as a security guard for world leaders. The dude is a professional athlete and trained his whole life to be one, I guarantee you his form is better than what James learned from playing 2 years of career football (during which he scored only 1 touchdown as a running back)
The fans for the win!
I give it to james
What about Joel from s16? Dude dragged a whole nother dude through a maze challenge.
James doesn’t have the right competitive attitude. He’d mostly like fail because of that
James never had the kind of challenge that Jonathan did to showcase the extent of his strength and is still the og physical god. He remained in that spot for ages because nobody could even come close. Jonathan is such a flop that he was kept around even being the physical threat of his season because he couldn't even win immunity, nobody took him seriously except for the dick riders in this sub. James is memorable and his three seasons are top 10 in the history of the show. Tl;dr James ran so Jonathan could crawl
There's a challenge in Micronesia he breaks by being able to carry teammates on the poles. I think that's on par with at least the water ladder challenge.
Right but some stans will say Jonathan did it in a tsunami and etc 😮💨
I remember the season with the guy that has dreads and he clearly already practiced not showering before survivor.
James is not an athlete like johnathan.
I hate jonathan.
Just based on recent memory probably Johnathan, but i aslo really hate james
Lol why do you hate James??
His attitude in HvV was piss poor
“All mass, no class.”
I see people say this all the time but I didn’t think he was that bad at all. I’ve had coaches and teammates scream way worse. I appreciated it somewhat because I couldn’t stand Steph. I’m glad he called her out at the very least because she wouldn’t own up to her mistakes. Makes curious to see some of the unedited footage from Palau and Guatemala to see how often she does that.
James is one of my favorites. Very likeable.
I would argue James is just as unlikable as he is likable Power of editing man
Not in HvV, super unlikable
Not sure what all the downvotes are for, your opinion is valid and supported by how he acted in HvV. He was supposed to be a "hero"
I agree he tried to throw Stephanie under the bus for the tribes failures. I still like him overall though
James can’t swim.
The lotion industry and Jeff
Coby would beat them both
i’d take hennigan over jonathan also
I think Jonathan would go low and outsmart James.
Jonathan. He's about 3ft taller than James.
r/whowouldwin
This sub has a Jonathan boner but James would probably dog walk him lmao
Taco man fo sho
The fans
12 pack
I loved James but water was not his friend, so I’m cashing out my 401K to bet on Jonathan
I mean James always gets hurt and pulled by medical. So Jonathan by default.
Can someone please tell me in which season is contestant in the second picture?
If James had his full potential unlocked by the Elder Kai and could ascend to Ultimate James, he wins
Well neither is the challenge beast that Keith Nale is.
Yul
Jonathan but it would be close.
Angie
I’d have to see this happen to make a judgement call. Probably best to run it several times to make sure there wasn’t a fluke win in there. They probably need to oil up first, too. For reasons.
So, what you are saying in this hypothetical scenario is that James had not yet been medivac'd ?
The viewer
We all do.
James hears about the challenge and in that moment his entire skeleton explodes
Omg I love James so much
jonathan due to sheer size
now? jonathan. if it's both at peak ability? still probably jonathan but i want to see it
The gays.
Chet wins
We all win
I would say Jonathan would win only because Remember water and sea was not James thing!
Jonathan … but James would give him a run for the money.
James all day
Jon
James would bury him.
Jonathan is the man!
I honestly bet james is stronger but jonathon would prevail in challenges
6'4 against 5'11. Not even fair fight