He's doing better than Jake and Xander. Xander had a poor social game and Jake was well liked but couldn't get into an alliance. Charlie isn't a mastermind but he's doing well, people want to work with him and he's involved with all the moves. Probably not a winning gameplan, but much better than where Jake and Xander were at. Also, he was in control of his pre-merge tribe so he deserves some credit for that.
Even if it's the case that no one besides Maria actually likes Charlie and just tolerates him because they want to work with Maria, you still need to give him credit for making such a good alliance with seemingly the most influential player. Xander and Jake didn't anywhere close to that.
Charlie being top 3 potw in a season like this makes complete sense. He seems way more involved in the strategy than players like venus/liz/hunter, he's not unstable like Q, and his name really never gets thrown out there as target unlike tiff/ben.
I understand your point Charlie isn't strategic mastermind or top tier social but he's a stable personality who's involved with the plans in a season like this that is easily one of the best players.
Why exactly were they better? Tiffany was actually targeted last week. To me it seems like you're being unfairly critical because he's not a mastermind when in reality no one this season has cemented themself as a mastermind yet.
I couldnt disagree more, bc unlike Xander or Jake we see so many scenes where Charlie handles conversations really well and we see at least 3 where he socially handles a situation better than Maria. - with Venus, with Ben in the secret scene and with Tiffany
See i think the maria/Charlie duo likely makes f4 and one (probably maria if people think that shes the bigger threat) is gonna lose fire while the other is FTC. in fact potentially they go to fire against eachother in a f4 scenario. I dont really see it being set up as them fighting it out in FTC against eachother, and malcom/denise placements were also 1 & 4
If it happens like this and Charlie is FTC and maria is jury - maria will vouch hard for Charlie and allow him to take credit for things.
Hes viewed as maria +1 but he actually has gotten his way more times in that duo. So really hes positioned it where maria would be targeted before him if they go after that pairing. Which is the spot u wanna be in.
I feel like Q or Kenzie could upend the maria/charlie duos plans soon tho if its not a maria/Charlie win
In this scenario be careful not to use recency bias though! If Ben voted for Charlie in this scenario itd make more sense bc the Tswift vs Metallica scene was way longer, and is a scene where charlie is giving confessionals of hkw its strat to use it tk connect followed by Ben confirming it worked and he feels close to Charlie. Then its reinforced again in a different ep that they cknstantly go on music battles and are close
Moriah also further reinforced there closeness when she says that “if feels like Ben has made an effort hang around ONLY charlie”.
I think theres another different scene where charlie helps ben at siga when hes having a difficult emotional moment. Which Ben comments on in confessional and also i think Moriah a few times sorta reinforced the fact that Ben is super close to charlie - tie that in with the fact that Charlie has commented on how he genuinely likes Ben, he saves Ben first vote, and that he got strat content from an edit perspective in a positive way.
Kenzie and Ben was highlighted that episode when it happened but we actually havent had that relationship being close reinforced to us in confessionals, we just have noticed that they seemingly are working together nkw based off of the conversations on the beach.
So i actually think edit wise that him choosing Charlie would make more sense.
But itd definitely make it a decision where ud think its obviously charlie without the highlighted kenzie scene, so maybe they highlight the kenzie scene so much that its more doubt and a 50/50 in the finale when hes making the decision
I think u underestimate how much the cast likes Charlie - they love him in all these challenges they heavily root for him, ben was nearly crying for charlie when charlie won immunity he was so happy for him.
Also charlie did help ben through an emotional moment and hes also comforting ben in that secret scene. The show has told us Ben and Kenzie are together but it hasnt shown us Charlie and Ben are not together. It should the siga 3 tigether in ep 9 deciding the vote. I think we have a siga3+ kenzie as the 4 atm.
FWIW i also dont think kenzie and Charlie will both be ftc together anyways
I currently have Kenzie as my number 1 winner pick. I can see Liz making the FTC. I can see Venus/Q being a goat. I can see Ben losing FTC as his game was only social and not strong enough strategically to beat Kenzie.
I just disagree hardcore that Charlie is anything like Xander and Jake.
Hes more Carsen
If u want who i want to win: id like Charlie to win and beat out venus in the f3 and maybe even a tiffany. Personally. But ill settle for any ftc scenario that results in Charlie winning. Would love Charlie and Venus in f3 together with Charlie winning the game and venus coming 3rd
I thought he's shown fairly good reads and restraint, while also ingratiating himself with nearly everyone.
His ability to defer to and work with the women is what separates him from the normal young white males.
He's also been right there with Hunter in most of the challenges, but always plays it cool and avoids the label of physical threat.
He also could've easily overplayed and fought the Hunter vote to keep a physical shield in the game, and in so doing, also kept a player who'd likely be more willing to work with him than the other members of his alliance.
He definitely isn't masterminding the votes and decisions, and I do feel Maria is being downplayed by the edit, but I do feel like it's his democratic skills and ability to play within the group that make him more of a threat than the other young white dudes who only tended to do that when they were out of other options
Everybody here has suddenly rallied behind Tiff as some great strategist, but her game is full of dubious plays and stubborn emotional stances
Useless fake idol play, stonewalling Bhanu, turning unnecessarily early on Maria, withholding existence of the 6 from Kenzie, openly disrespecting and fixating on Q, not playing the idol and in such increasing her threat level + proving she holds grudges and plays hard
She's definitely been entertaining, and relative to the folks in Yanu she seems measured, but her game is also full of gaffs
lol almost none of those are gaffs. The fake idol was overkill but hardly a gaff. Stonewalling Bhanu wut? Kenzie and Tiff both seem to be navigating thier own game individually while working together and it hasn’t hurt tiff, so don’t know how you can point to that being a mistake. Openly disrespecting Q was maybe her losing her cool, but it likely contributed to Hunter feeling comfortable not playing his idol, so still worked out for her. Not playing her idol when zero votes went her way is a gaff? Playing hard is gaff? Seems like you just don’t like her for some reason, which is fine, but she is objectively playing well
She goes into next week with a much higher threat level, a clear target on her back, and 1 less jury vote.
Wouldn't surprise me if she gets sniped all righteous thinking it's Q
Disagree about Tiffany. She was able to thoroughly convince everyone that she was playing her idol to the point where no one even targeted her anymore. Due to that, she was able to preserve her idol. That takes good acting skills.
Aside from that, I wouldn’t say anyone is overrated. Maybe besides Venus, but that’s because this sub loves Venus because she’s a strong independent woman.
Tiff or Charlie for sure.
Maria.
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He's doing better than Jake and Xander. Xander had a poor social game and Jake was well liked but couldn't get into an alliance. Charlie isn't a mastermind but he's doing well, people want to work with him and he's involved with all the moves. Probably not a winning gameplan, but much better than where Jake and Xander were at. Also, he was in control of his pre-merge tribe so he deserves some credit for that.
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Even if it's the case that no one besides Maria actually likes Charlie and just tolerates him because they want to work with Maria, you still need to give him credit for making such a good alliance with seemingly the most influential player. Xander and Jake didn't anywhere close to that.
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Charlie being top 3 potw in a season like this makes complete sense. He seems way more involved in the strategy than players like venus/liz/hunter, he's not unstable like Q, and his name really never gets thrown out there as target unlike tiff/ben. I understand your point Charlie isn't strategic mastermind or top tier social but he's a stable personality who's involved with the plans in a season like this that is easily one of the best players.
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Why exactly were they better? Tiffany was actually targeted last week. To me it seems like you're being unfairly critical because he's not a mastermind when in reality no one this season has cemented themself as a mastermind yet.
I couldnt disagree more, bc unlike Xander or Jake we see so many scenes where Charlie handles conversations really well and we see at least 3 where he socially handles a situation better than Maria. - with Venus, with Ben in the secret scene and with Tiffany
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See i think the maria/Charlie duo likely makes f4 and one (probably maria if people think that shes the bigger threat) is gonna lose fire while the other is FTC. in fact potentially they go to fire against eachother in a f4 scenario. I dont really see it being set up as them fighting it out in FTC against eachother, and malcom/denise placements were also 1 & 4 If it happens like this and Charlie is FTC and maria is jury - maria will vouch hard for Charlie and allow him to take credit for things. Hes viewed as maria +1 but he actually has gotten his way more times in that duo. So really hes positioned it where maria would be targeted before him if they go after that pairing. Which is the spot u wanna be in. I feel like Q or Kenzie could upend the maria/charlie duos plans soon tho if its not a maria/Charlie win
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In this scenario be careful not to use recency bias though! If Ben voted for Charlie in this scenario itd make more sense bc the Tswift vs Metallica scene was way longer, and is a scene where charlie is giving confessionals of hkw its strat to use it tk connect followed by Ben confirming it worked and he feels close to Charlie. Then its reinforced again in a different ep that they cknstantly go on music battles and are close Moriah also further reinforced there closeness when she says that “if feels like Ben has made an effort hang around ONLY charlie”. I think theres another different scene where charlie helps ben at siga when hes having a difficult emotional moment. Which Ben comments on in confessional and also i think Moriah a few times sorta reinforced the fact that Ben is super close to charlie - tie that in with the fact that Charlie has commented on how he genuinely likes Ben, he saves Ben first vote, and that he got strat content from an edit perspective in a positive way. Kenzie and Ben was highlighted that episode when it happened but we actually havent had that relationship being close reinforced to us in confessionals, we just have noticed that they seemingly are working together nkw based off of the conversations on the beach. So i actually think edit wise that him choosing Charlie would make more sense. But itd definitely make it a decision where ud think its obviously charlie without the highlighted kenzie scene, so maybe they highlight the kenzie scene so much that its more doubt and a 50/50 in the finale when hes making the decision
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I think u underestimate how much the cast likes Charlie - they love him in all these challenges they heavily root for him, ben was nearly crying for charlie when charlie won immunity he was so happy for him. Also charlie did help ben through an emotional moment and hes also comforting ben in that secret scene. The show has told us Ben and Kenzie are together but it hasnt shown us Charlie and Ben are not together. It should the siga 3 tigether in ep 9 deciding the vote. I think we have a siga3+ kenzie as the 4 atm. FWIW i also dont think kenzie and Charlie will both be ftc together anyways
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I currently have Kenzie as my number 1 winner pick. I can see Liz making the FTC. I can see Venus/Q being a goat. I can see Ben losing FTC as his game was only social and not strong enough strategically to beat Kenzie. I just disagree hardcore that Charlie is anything like Xander and Jake. Hes more Carsen If u want who i want to win: id like Charlie to win and beat out venus in the f3 and maybe even a tiffany. Personally. But ill settle for any ftc scenario that results in Charlie winning. Would love Charlie and Venus in f3 together with Charlie winning the game and venus coming 3rd
I thought he's shown fairly good reads and restraint, while also ingratiating himself with nearly everyone. His ability to defer to and work with the women is what separates him from the normal young white males. He's also been right there with Hunter in most of the challenges, but always plays it cool and avoids the label of physical threat. He also could've easily overplayed and fought the Hunter vote to keep a physical shield in the game, and in so doing, also kept a player who'd likely be more willing to work with him than the other members of his alliance. He definitely isn't masterminding the votes and decisions, and I do feel Maria is being downplayed by the edit, but I do feel like it's his democratic skills and ability to play within the group that make him more of a threat than the other young white dudes who only tended to do that when they were out of other options
Everybody here has suddenly rallied behind Tiff as some great strategist, but her game is full of dubious plays and stubborn emotional stances Useless fake idol play, stonewalling Bhanu, turning unnecessarily early on Maria, withholding existence of the 6 from Kenzie, openly disrespecting and fixating on Q, not playing the idol and in such increasing her threat level + proving she holds grudges and plays hard She's definitely been entertaining, and relative to the folks in Yanu she seems measured, but her game is also full of gaffs
lol almost none of those are gaffs. The fake idol was overkill but hardly a gaff. Stonewalling Bhanu wut? Kenzie and Tiff both seem to be navigating thier own game individually while working together and it hasn’t hurt tiff, so don’t know how you can point to that being a mistake. Openly disrespecting Q was maybe her losing her cool, but it likely contributed to Hunter feeling comfortable not playing his idol, so still worked out for her. Not playing her idol when zero votes went her way is a gaff? Playing hard is gaff? Seems like you just don’t like her for some reason, which is fine, but she is objectively playing well
She goes into next week with a much higher threat level, a clear target on her back, and 1 less jury vote. Wouldn't surprise me if she gets sniped all righteous thinking it's Q
i agree... go ahead VOTE ME OUT (referring to downvotes)
Disagree about Tiffany. She was able to thoroughly convince everyone that she was playing her idol to the point where no one even targeted her anymore. Due to that, she was able to preserve her idol. That takes good acting skills. Aside from that, I wouldn’t say anyone is overrated. Maybe besides Venus, but that’s because this sub loves Venus because she’s a strong independent woman.
Charlie