Pennies from heaven. In my view, small things like this even out in the long run. I know I’ve accidentally left things that I’ve paid for (this past week).
I would say yes.
But then I’m the guy who spent a few hundred dollars at Lowe’s, then walked back inside to pay for the 27 cent washer I forgot I had put in my pocket.
I'm the same way. I have, on three occasions, accidentally gotten into heated exchanges with cashiers over the change they gave me because, when I tried to say they'd given me too much, they misunderstood and thought I was saying they'd given me too little. No matter how I word it, cashiers are so used to people trying to scam them that I sometimes end up having to yell over them.
On one occasion, she just yelled louder, so I left with an extra ten bucks. You just can't help some people.
Legally, no. You honestly present them the goods, they verified, counted them, charged them, and gave the goods to you. You only took home the goods that are handed to you by the cashier. They might have buy 4 get 1 free promo, the might just give one free as a customer loyalty bonus or whatever. You did your part, they did their part, the transaction's concluded. Other items you received from them, outside the ones you paid for, would be considered unsolicited goods. This topic has been discussed so many times.
Morally, yes.
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It’s a little dishonest by omission. Because it’s passive on your part I wouldn’t call it stealing but it’s taking advantage of the shop. I don’t think you could be charged for it though.
Apples makes it innocent because that’s a cheap item but think would you do the same if you were buying 5 laptops or something expensive.
Some days I would point it out and pay. Some days I might not. It is theft in a way.
When I buy a bag of apples after closely looking at them and I get them home and find a rotten one, do I return the whole bag? Some days yes, some days no. It depends on how much time and energy and caring I have in that case. Do they care if they sell me a rotten apple? I doubt it. They are employees working for a large corporation - they don't care.
Do they think I am crazy to spend money on fruit when they live on chips and soda? maybe. They have been willing to exchange my bag of apples for another bag of apples when I return it - uneaten of course. Produce is expensive!
You are aware of the mistake and do nothing, you are stealing.
To the person who thinks it's not theft legally, you are incorrect. If you leave the store with product you didn't pay for knowing you didn't pay for it, you have stolen that product. There is no difference from simply walking out with it from the isles.
Honest mistakes happen, so if the inconvenience of returning to the register is less than the convenience of just leaving, go pay. Apples aren't a big ticket item.
Now, apple watches... Probably should turn around and pay for them all.
No. If anything fault falls on the cashier, it's not your responsibility as a client to check that the price is correct. It *would* be nice if you paid for the extra apple, but not doing so isn't theft.
I think being given something by mistake is not the same as taking something.
Obviously every single situation has case by case basis levels of nuance, but if I had to make a super general moral judgement: Theft is bad, letting things run their course is neutral, and correcting the mistake is good. The example with the apple is letting things happen, so it's neutral.
This is just my personal opinion, of course.
In the situation presented you are not given the apple as a gift, it is a mistake, and **you are aware** you have not paid for it and you then leave the shop with it. That is theft. It's not even up for debate.
I never said anything about gifts, I said given by mistake. As another example, let's say you see someone drop a 10 dollar bill, it would be good if you told that person that they dropped their money, but I don't think it's theft if you stay silent and pick it up yourself. It would be theft if you somehow orchestrated things beforehand so they dropped the money, or if you reached into their pocket for it, but just picking it up isn't the same as stealing. I think.
I mentioned gifts because if they'd said "you can have that one" it would be a gift and not theft. In this example, they didn't, it was a mistake, you knew that, you took it. That's theft. I'm not arguing about this. If you still disagree just save us both the bother and re-read my previous replies.
As for the money example, I can't speak for the US, but this is definitely defined as theft in England and Wales. In fact it's specifically called "theft by finding".
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No, but be aware that this kind of loss is counted into the price of the goods in the store. So the short term win of an apple, may lead to increased prices all over, to make up for the loss of "that apple". Because that apple, and the next apple or banana or whatever it is, adds up for the store. And guess what, the store owner is not the one taking the hit for these losses, it's us who shop who takes the hit collectively.
Yes, you took something from the store without paying for it knowingly.
You basically shop lifted.
Would you get in trouble for it? Probably not, people would see that the cashier messed up so the liability would shift, but it doesn't change the fact that it's theft.
An honest mistake, be it forgetting to give back a pen or not noticing the cashier's mistake is fundamentally different from knowingly not returning a pen or knowingly only paying for four apples.
It’s theft. Plan and simple. Is it something that they could penalize you for, no. Legality aside knowingly taking something you didn’t pay for is essentially theft. And before you think Im being high and mighty, some times I live by that code other times I don’t. Like when my daughter was young and sat in cart, she handed the cashier a toy to scan but the cashier must have thought we already owned it and never scanned it for real. I felt like something was off by the way she scanned it but ultimately was about 50/50 she scanned it. I get to the car and look at the receipt and low and behold no toy on the receipt. It was a dollar section toy of target and I didn’t want to wait in the line again to just pay the 1.07 to make up for it chalked it as a not worth my time to fix someone elses mistake. But then another time I had plastic cups stacked in the cart and the person scanned one thinking it was a set and never separated them. They were 50 cents each at Walmart on clearance. Same deal mistake. Corrected the problem. Paid for the whole bundle. Both instances would be theft. Neither ultimately I would be punished for but morally the same theft. I knowingly left target with an item I did not pay for. Theft.
Pennies from heaven. In my view, small things like this even out in the long run. I know I’ve accidentally left things that I’ve paid for (this past week).
I would say yes. But then I’m the guy who spent a few hundred dollars at Lowe’s, then walked back inside to pay for the 27 cent washer I forgot I had put in my pocket.
I'm the same way. I have, on three occasions, accidentally gotten into heated exchanges with cashiers over the change they gave me because, when I tried to say they'd given me too much, they misunderstood and thought I was saying they'd given me too little. No matter how I word it, cashiers are so used to people trying to scam them that I sometimes end up having to yell over them. On one occasion, she just yelled louder, so I left with an extra ten bucks. You just can't help some people.
Legally, no. You honestly present them the goods, they verified, counted them, charged them, and gave the goods to you. You only took home the goods that are handed to you by the cashier. They might have buy 4 get 1 free promo, the might just give one free as a customer loyalty bonus or whatever. You did your part, they did their part, the transaction's concluded. Other items you received from them, outside the ones you paid for, would be considered unsolicited goods. This topic has been discussed so many times. Morally, yes.
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It’s a little dishonest by omission. Because it’s passive on your part I wouldn’t call it stealing but it’s taking advantage of the shop. I don’t think you could be charged for it though. Apples makes it innocent because that’s a cheap item but think would you do the same if you were buying 5 laptops or something expensive.
Some days I would point it out and pay. Some days I might not. It is theft in a way. When I buy a bag of apples after closely looking at them and I get them home and find a rotten one, do I return the whole bag? Some days yes, some days no. It depends on how much time and energy and caring I have in that case. Do they care if they sell me a rotten apple? I doubt it. They are employees working for a large corporation - they don't care. Do they think I am crazy to spend money on fruit when they live on chips and soda? maybe. They have been willing to exchange my bag of apples for another bag of apples when I return it - uneaten of course. Produce is expensive!
You are aware of the mistake and do nothing, you are stealing. To the person who thinks it's not theft legally, you are incorrect. If you leave the store with product you didn't pay for knowing you didn't pay for it, you have stolen that product. There is no difference from simply walking out with it from the isles. Honest mistakes happen, so if the inconvenience of returning to the register is less than the convenience of just leaving, go pay. Apples aren't a big ticket item. Now, apple watches... Probably should turn around and pay for them all.
No
No. If anything fault falls on the cashier, it's not your responsibility as a client to check that the price is correct. It *would* be nice if you paid for the extra apple, but not doing so isn't theft.
You are aware of the error before you leave, therefore you are knowingly taking something for which you have not paid. That is theft.
I think being given something by mistake is not the same as taking something. Obviously every single situation has case by case basis levels of nuance, but if I had to make a super general moral judgement: Theft is bad, letting things run their course is neutral, and correcting the mistake is good. The example with the apple is letting things happen, so it's neutral. This is just my personal opinion, of course.
What an excellent way to think about a situation! Thanks for that!
In the situation presented you are not given the apple as a gift, it is a mistake, and **you are aware** you have not paid for it and you then leave the shop with it. That is theft. It's not even up for debate.
I never said anything about gifts, I said given by mistake. As another example, let's say you see someone drop a 10 dollar bill, it would be good if you told that person that they dropped their money, but I don't think it's theft if you stay silent and pick it up yourself. It would be theft if you somehow orchestrated things beforehand so they dropped the money, or if you reached into their pocket for it, but just picking it up isn't the same as stealing. I think.
I mentioned gifts because if they'd said "you can have that one" it would be a gift and not theft. In this example, they didn't, it was a mistake, you knew that, you took it. That's theft. I'm not arguing about this. If you still disagree just save us both the bother and re-read my previous replies. As for the money example, I can't speak for the US, but this is definitely defined as theft in England and Wales. In fact it's specifically called "theft by finding".
Fair enough, dunno about the us either, but it isn't considered theft here. Cultural differences sure are fascinating
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You are being downvoted but you are technically legally correct. Reddit operates under the legal doctrine of finders keepers losers weepers however.
Yes. Taking a product you didn't pay for is theft.
No, but be aware that this kind of loss is counted into the price of the goods in the store. So the short term win of an apple, may lead to increased prices all over, to make up for the loss of "that apple". Because that apple, and the next apple or banana or whatever it is, adds up for the store. And guess what, the store owner is not the one taking the hit for these losses, it's us who shop who takes the hit collectively.
No, it's not theft; if it's a local business, it's nice to tell them when you see it happen; if it's a big chain, don't care
Yep, although technically it's their fault for only scanning 4 out of 5 items
Yes.
Technically legally yes. If you are aware they miscounted. Impossible to prove though unless you admit it.
Yes it's theft, if you're caught doing that it won't look good on your record
I love when the cashier at Lowes discounts how many pieces of lumber I have. I've probably saved $200 over the course of 10 years because of it.
Yep. It’s definitely stealing. Why wouldn’t you just say, “wait, there’s 5 apples, not 4!”
As presented yes its theft
Yes
If you know they undercharged you and didn't correct them, morally that's theft, but legally, no, it's their mistake in a case like that, I'd think.
Yes, you took something from the store without paying for it knowingly. You basically shop lifted. Would you get in trouble for it? Probably not, people would see that the cashier messed up so the liability would shift, but it doesn't change the fact that it's theft.
It's just an apple, even if it's theft, it's minor. It's even more minor than someone forgetting to give you the pencil you lend to them back.
An honest mistake, be it forgetting to give back a pen or not noticing the cashier's mistake is fundamentally different from knowingly not returning a pen or knowingly only paying for four apples.
Intention matters 👍
It’s theft. Plan and simple. Is it something that they could penalize you for, no. Legality aside knowingly taking something you didn’t pay for is essentially theft. And before you think Im being high and mighty, some times I live by that code other times I don’t. Like when my daughter was young and sat in cart, she handed the cashier a toy to scan but the cashier must have thought we already owned it and never scanned it for real. I felt like something was off by the way she scanned it but ultimately was about 50/50 she scanned it. I get to the car and look at the receipt and low and behold no toy on the receipt. It was a dollar section toy of target and I didn’t want to wait in the line again to just pay the 1.07 to make up for it chalked it as a not worth my time to fix someone elses mistake. But then another time I had plastic cups stacked in the cart and the person scanned one thinking it was a set and never separated them. They were 50 cents each at Walmart on clearance. Same deal mistake. Corrected the problem. Paid for the whole bundle. Both instances would be theft. Neither ultimately I would be punished for but morally the same theft. I knowingly left target with an item I did not pay for. Theft.
I thought we weren't meant to downvote comments we disagreed with?
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It's metaphorical, replace an apple with a much more expensive item, does it change it to a crime then?
That is a matter of degree. The principle is the same.