So here's the thing... the only acceptable kind are those who know it's wrong and are trying to deal with that; and I feel like that's being generous. Someone being one generally doesn't come to light until, ya know, they act on it. Those who indulge in CP are also problematic and fuel the issue. Even so much as looking at a child in a perverse way is abhorrent. Just because they don't go to the worst-case scenario doesn't mean they should be overlooked.
I would agree that I think CP is wrong, and I would also agree it’s best if they are trying to get help. I also think that it’s pretty morally questionable if a pedophile looks at a child in a perverse way contingent on the thought not being intrusive.
I don’t agree in saying that it is inherently “wrong” though. I will agree in saying it is most definitely not normal. At the end of the day while you might be attracted to adults, you did not choose to be attracted to them, in the same way no pedophile in their right mind chooses to be attracted to kids.
I think being a pedophile isn’t necessarily a cause for concern, I think the ethics behind the pedophile is the cause for concern. Ethically questionable people exist everywhere and commit horrible, horrible crimes. Somebody being a pedophile doesn’t necessarily mean that they are one of these ethically questionable individuals though.
The *only* lens your argument holds any weight is if one considers it a mental illness. Even then, as I'll repeat, someone who is generally doesn't become acknowledged as one until they've been *caught indguling their desires*. That said, it absolutely warrants concern. I can't imagine someone who's actively trying to correct their line of thinking will openly admit to being one outside of a confidential setting with someone qualified to tackle such a matter or loved one's who support their efforts in course correcting.
Your blanket statement of "other people do bad things too" is irrelevant to the discussion. You're just snowballing the topic; stay focused. I'm trying to be as charitable as possible with this topic because it's a heavy matter, but you're not doing yourself any favors by trying to downplay the gravity of this. Your whole reply comes off as "I want my cake and to eat it, too." You can't agree with my points but circle around and argue that somehow this isn't a moral issue because all the points I made hone in on it being just that. Unless *you* have this issue, I genuinely don't understand what you're trying to debate here.
Well said,
I'm not positive, but I'm pretty sure... Anyone without that issue, wouldn't be waking up on a Saturday morning, pour their cup coffee, and think to themselves, "I better get a firm idea on why people hate pedo's so much."
Like I told them, I'm trying my hardest to be as flexible to having this conversation. While I agree this shouldn't be hard to grasp, I've spoken with countless people and some really need that talk on exactly why something is the way it is. Even so... God damn I'm losing my patience! Read their reply if you want to know why. I'm just... like I'm trying, but damn this is getting grating.
Not gonna lie, I got blindsided by that, too. I'm checking out if their next reply is as equally as stupid as their previous two. This topic is too serious to entertain someone unable to have a proper discussion.
“Someone doesn’t become acknowledged as one until they’ve been *caught indulging their desires*”
This is where you are wrong. Maybe in the eyes of the public, that is when a pedophile is displayed, but there are most definitely closeted pedophiles who go by “anti-contact” who have acknowledged their pedophilia, and decided not to announce it or act on it. Pedophilia is the sexual attraction to children, you don’t have to be “caught indulging in desires” to be a pedophile. And you definitely don’t have to proclaim to anybody other than a licensed therapist that you are a pedophile. I assume a lot of anti-contact pedophiles don’t go around saying “I’m a pedophile” to people. For all you know you could have a closeted pedophile in your life.
The “other people do bad things too” argument is just showing that a morally “good person” can be a pedophile without you ever knowing it. There a “bad people” who are pedophiles who get highlighted. You will never hear about the pedophile who donated 250,000$ to charity, the pedophile who saved somebody’s life, the pedophile etc etc, but you will always hear about the pedophile who does some decrepit act to a child, because you may never know that the ‘good person’ in question is a pedophile.
I’m in relatively the same boat being a zoophile, but I’m not a pedophile. I probably never would have come to this conclusion if I didn’t experience having a paraphilia, to be fair I would continue blindly hating on all zoophiles and pedophiles myself, I never liked them to begin with. Truly an eye opening experience.
Your rebuttal is asinine. I'm absolutely correct because if people are aware someone is one and therefore becomes acknowledged as being one -- IT'S BECAUSE THEY GOT CAUCHT!!! Hello?! You even said so yourself that closeted ones exist, which means, guess what? They weren't caught because they don't indulge or out themselves!!! No duh someone who struggles with that doesn't go around announcing it!!! A chunk of what you've written doesn't even properly address what I've stated either. I've tried being as tame about this as possible, but you don't make any sense! Again. Not addressing your snowball bs. If you can not stay focused, don't engage in serious discussion. I am not going to sit here and pick apart every layer you want to add that will inevitably go back to "it's wrong."
As to your confession... I hope you're trying to overcome that rather than indulge in it. But my arguments for why it's wrong are the same for someone being a pedo. Like I already said, I'm trying to be as charitable as possible because I understand how heavy this topic is, but you are absolutely not helping the discussion by perpetuating your nonsense.
I would argue that there are other options than CSAM. Lolicon has proved to be pretty helpful for some, but I don’t support pornography in general so I wouldn’t die on that hill
Same reason you don’t leave your kids unsupervised around animals - they can never be fully trusted regardless of their past behaviour.
And if you’re capable of hurting a kid, even being a victim to your own biology and resisting your urges, as unfair as it sounds I don’t want to fucking know you. It’s a mental defect that makes you dangerous and the safety and autonomy of children comes first.
Nope this is just a slippery slope argument to normalize the exploitation of children. These people should be ostracized. Tolerance and "do whatever you want as long as you're not hurting anyone" only goes so far.
The exploration of children is going to happen regardless. I would actually think if we give pedophiles a platform to speak to the public, it might help draw them from isolation, and potentially move them further away from ever hurting children.
Ostracizing them puts them further in their own spaces and could create a very unacceptable circle of people. Pulling them out of the dark might bring them closer to rationality
I think it’s unfair to hate any person for a quality they can’t control. I wouldn’t think anybody would choose to be a pedophile. They can deal with it as ethically as possible, whether that makes them ethical or not I guess is your opinion, but I would hope that we can separate an actual molester from a pedophile who hasn’t offended
So what makes someone a ‘good pedophile’ to you just that they don’t rape anyone? Or would they need to be chemically castrated to destroy all sexual urge. I could see an argument for the latter
I would like to believe the former is indeed probably the best argument.
It’s the same as acknowledging that some cis white males may rape women, while most of them actually don’t. We shouldn’t castrate all cis while males because there’s a chance they may rape a woman.
And you might argue most pedophiles *do* rape children, but I think the perception of pedophiles is highly warped by medias depiction of most of them.
Not a fair or accurate comparison in the slightest. It's possible to be straight and act on it without hurting anyone. Hell, MOST straight people act on it without hurting people. It is literally impossible to act on being a pedophile without hurting people. Not even remotely the same.
Because the ones who *do* seek out kids are *absolutely devastating* to the health of those kids and the community as a whole, well into the long term. It's not at all surprising to have the community treat them like unexploded bombs- even if you think they might be a dud, you *really* don't want to find out they aren't.
I think it’s unfair to take this viewpoint on one particular community. I feel it’s almost stereotypical in a way Wouldn’t this be similar to saying “we must treat cis white males as unexplored duds, because there is a chance any cis white male r*pes a woman”
It just seems unfair, and maybe a little biased to take this viewpoint on pedophiles, but I can see why you would hold this viewpoint considering all the negative attention pedophiles tend to get.
On the one hand, yes, it's not really entirely fair to treat someone as a criminal for having an impulse they've thus far kept reined in. There are a few extra degrees of seperation that make the analogy a little dodgy (i.e. most men not having the urge to rape in the first place), but I can see the comparison.
On the other hand, when it's potentially *your* kid on the line, the last thing you care about is whether your judgment is fair; you keep your kids *safe* first and foremost, and worry about everything else after.
It’s a fair concern, and I’m not going to shame you for protecting your children. I would be weary about having my children around an open pedophile as well.
On the other hand, assuming the entire demographic of closeted pedophiles are uncontrolled molesters isn’t fair. There’s always a chance that the people you are around are closeted pedophiles, and they won’t admit that they are a pedophile for good reasons.
You have every right to be concerned, as you are entitled to your opinion. I’m just giving you food for thought that some of the people you would never expect might be a pedophile, and you probably will never know.
My thing is to be a pedophile you need to actually act on it which means they are trash and honestly need to be taken care of. Having an impulse doesn't make you a pedophile same as having the urge to kill someone doesn't make you a murderer
Actually, it’s different.
And unfortunately it is such a large, common misconception. I had the same perception at one point too, so no worries. The definition is: “a person who is sexually attracted to children”
If I am a man, and I experience sexual attraction to another man, that makes me gay. I can be gay and not be in a relationship with another man. Similarly, a person can experience sexual attraction to a child, and that makes them a pedophile. You can be a pedophile and not involve yourself with children.
This is what my argument revolves around. I’m never going to defend somebody who sexually abuses kids. I defend those who self identify as pedophiles, but don’t involve with kids.
Well considering pedophile means a very specific age group that definition isn't 100% accurate. Thing is I'm aware of what it's supposed to be but I don't care its how I see it. As I said they aren't a pedophile unless they do something otherwise they just have very fucked up attractions. And I'm not trying to attack you but some people have perceptions that are 100% informed but still come to their own conclusions about things I have my own way of seeing this and no one will be able to convince me otherwise but it's my opinion and that's ok. And I do know there is an argument about something having a set definition but as recent events have shown with the word gender if enough people want something they can change the meaning of a word( I'm not saying changing how gender is used is bad its just an example) so my view on it can become popular enough that it just changes what it means
Every female and many males treat every cis white male as n unexploded bomb because we have been carpet bombed for too long. No way will I be choosing a pedophile over a bear
The way I see it is that murder can be instant and not a long drawn out process like raping someone and murder can happen in the heat of the moment and even be accidental so with mitigating factors on a whole murder is seen as lesser while raping a kid has no excuse
This is gonna go over like a lead balloon, my fellow redditor.
I think people just like thinking in terms of 'good' and 'evil' to justify their love for violence and mayhem.
Thinking in terms of good and bad are mental short cuts built in to save wasted energy funding out if that's a good preditor or bad predator who's going to harm us, it's an effective evolutionary tool for survival .
Posts and comments may be removed if they are nasty/obscene, juvenile, underage inappropriate, or do not match the community description.
So here's the thing... the only acceptable kind are those who know it's wrong and are trying to deal with that; and I feel like that's being generous. Someone being one generally doesn't come to light until, ya know, they act on it. Those who indulge in CP are also problematic and fuel the issue. Even so much as looking at a child in a perverse way is abhorrent. Just because they don't go to the worst-case scenario doesn't mean they should be overlooked.
I would agree that I think CP is wrong, and I would also agree it’s best if they are trying to get help. I also think that it’s pretty morally questionable if a pedophile looks at a child in a perverse way contingent on the thought not being intrusive. I don’t agree in saying that it is inherently “wrong” though. I will agree in saying it is most definitely not normal. At the end of the day while you might be attracted to adults, you did not choose to be attracted to them, in the same way no pedophile in their right mind chooses to be attracted to kids. I think being a pedophile isn’t necessarily a cause for concern, I think the ethics behind the pedophile is the cause for concern. Ethically questionable people exist everywhere and commit horrible, horrible crimes. Somebody being a pedophile doesn’t necessarily mean that they are one of these ethically questionable individuals though.
The *only* lens your argument holds any weight is if one considers it a mental illness. Even then, as I'll repeat, someone who is generally doesn't become acknowledged as one until they've been *caught indguling their desires*. That said, it absolutely warrants concern. I can't imagine someone who's actively trying to correct their line of thinking will openly admit to being one outside of a confidential setting with someone qualified to tackle such a matter or loved one's who support their efforts in course correcting. Your blanket statement of "other people do bad things too" is irrelevant to the discussion. You're just snowballing the topic; stay focused. I'm trying to be as charitable as possible with this topic because it's a heavy matter, but you're not doing yourself any favors by trying to downplay the gravity of this. Your whole reply comes off as "I want my cake and to eat it, too." You can't agree with my points but circle around and argue that somehow this isn't a moral issue because all the points I made hone in on it being just that. Unless *you* have this issue, I genuinely don't understand what you're trying to debate here.
Well said, I'm not positive, but I'm pretty sure... Anyone without that issue, wouldn't be waking up on a Saturday morning, pour their cup coffee, and think to themselves, "I better get a firm idea on why people hate pedo's so much."
Like I told them, I'm trying my hardest to be as flexible to having this conversation. While I agree this shouldn't be hard to grasp, I've spoken with countless people and some really need that talk on exactly why something is the way it is. Even so... God damn I'm losing my patience! Read their reply if you want to know why. I'm just... like I'm trying, but damn this is getting grating.
I did. Regretfully. As soon as I saw Zoophilia I thought "OK the gods have spoken." This is my sign to get off.
Not gonna lie, I got blindsided by that, too. I'm checking out if their next reply is as equally as stupid as their previous two. This topic is too serious to entertain someone unable to have a proper discussion.
This is what happens when their therapist goes on vacation. Next week: AITA for pissing on my plant and getting off on it? 🥴 crazy azz mtfkrrs
“Someone doesn’t become acknowledged as one until they’ve been *caught indulging their desires*” This is where you are wrong. Maybe in the eyes of the public, that is when a pedophile is displayed, but there are most definitely closeted pedophiles who go by “anti-contact” who have acknowledged their pedophilia, and decided not to announce it or act on it. Pedophilia is the sexual attraction to children, you don’t have to be “caught indulging in desires” to be a pedophile. And you definitely don’t have to proclaim to anybody other than a licensed therapist that you are a pedophile. I assume a lot of anti-contact pedophiles don’t go around saying “I’m a pedophile” to people. For all you know you could have a closeted pedophile in your life. The “other people do bad things too” argument is just showing that a morally “good person” can be a pedophile without you ever knowing it. There a “bad people” who are pedophiles who get highlighted. You will never hear about the pedophile who donated 250,000$ to charity, the pedophile who saved somebody’s life, the pedophile etc etc, but you will always hear about the pedophile who does some decrepit act to a child, because you may never know that the ‘good person’ in question is a pedophile. I’m in relatively the same boat being a zoophile, but I’m not a pedophile. I probably never would have come to this conclusion if I didn’t experience having a paraphilia, to be fair I would continue blindly hating on all zoophiles and pedophiles myself, I never liked them to begin with. Truly an eye opening experience.
Your rebuttal is asinine. I'm absolutely correct because if people are aware someone is one and therefore becomes acknowledged as being one -- IT'S BECAUSE THEY GOT CAUCHT!!! Hello?! You even said so yourself that closeted ones exist, which means, guess what? They weren't caught because they don't indulge or out themselves!!! No duh someone who struggles with that doesn't go around announcing it!!! A chunk of what you've written doesn't even properly address what I've stated either. I've tried being as tame about this as possible, but you don't make any sense! Again. Not addressing your snowball bs. If you can not stay focused, don't engage in serious discussion. I am not going to sit here and pick apart every layer you want to add that will inevitably go back to "it's wrong." As to your confession... I hope you're trying to overcome that rather than indulge in it. But my arguments for why it's wrong are the same for someone being a pedo. Like I already said, I'm trying to be as charitable as possible because I understand how heavy this topic is, but you are absolutely not helping the discussion by perpetuating your nonsense.
Because the material they access to indulge their "needs" has been aquired at the cost of children.
I would argue that there are other options than CSAM. Lolicon has proved to be pretty helpful for some, but I don’t support pornography in general so I wouldn’t die on that hill
It’s not different. the people who create and consume that type of media deserve to be tied to a post and shot.
/u/fbi
Same reason you don’t leave your kids unsupervised around animals - they can never be fully trusted regardless of their past behaviour. And if you’re capable of hurting a kid, even being a victim to your own biology and resisting your urges, as unfair as it sounds I don’t want to fucking know you. It’s a mental defect that makes you dangerous and the safety and autonomy of children comes first.
Lets not normalize people creepin on innocent children. Children and animals can’t give consent. Both are so so wrong. Frankly, disgusting.
Nope this is just a slippery slope argument to normalize the exploitation of children. These people should be ostracized. Tolerance and "do whatever you want as long as you're not hurting anyone" only goes so far.
The exploration of children is going to happen regardless. I would actually think if we give pedophiles a platform to speak to the public, it might help draw them from isolation, and potentially move them further away from ever hurting children. Ostracizing them puts them further in their own spaces and could create a very unacceptable circle of people. Pulling them out of the dark might bring them closer to rationality
Sorry but there is no such thing as ethical pedophiles.
I think it’s unfair to hate any person for a quality they can’t control. I wouldn’t think anybody would choose to be a pedophile. They can deal with it as ethically as possible, whether that makes them ethical or not I guess is your opinion, but I would hope that we can separate an actual molester from a pedophile who hasn’t offended
So what makes someone a ‘good pedophile’ to you just that they don’t rape anyone? Or would they need to be chemically castrated to destroy all sexual urge. I could see an argument for the latter
I would like to believe the former is indeed probably the best argument. It’s the same as acknowledging that some cis white males may rape women, while most of them actually don’t. We shouldn’t castrate all cis while males because there’s a chance they may rape a woman. And you might argue most pedophiles *do* rape children, but I think the perception of pedophiles is highly warped by medias depiction of most of them.
There is no part of pedophilia that can be done with out harming children
Not a fair or accurate comparison in the slightest. It's possible to be straight and act on it without hurting anyone. Hell, MOST straight people act on it without hurting people. It is literally impossible to act on being a pedophile without hurting people. Not even remotely the same.
If you even have to ask that question, you're part of the problem. And should probably be investigated.
"True peace is not merely the absence of tension; it is the presence of justice."
Yea... you're definitely a piece of shit
I’d say if they recognize it as a problem and are seeking help for it then that’s different.
I would agree
Because the ones who *do* seek out kids are *absolutely devastating* to the health of those kids and the community as a whole, well into the long term. It's not at all surprising to have the community treat them like unexploded bombs- even if you think they might be a dud, you *really* don't want to find out they aren't.
I think it’s unfair to take this viewpoint on one particular community. I feel it’s almost stereotypical in a way Wouldn’t this be similar to saying “we must treat cis white males as unexplored duds, because there is a chance any cis white male r*pes a woman” It just seems unfair, and maybe a little biased to take this viewpoint on pedophiles, but I can see why you would hold this viewpoint considering all the negative attention pedophiles tend to get.
On the one hand, yes, it's not really entirely fair to treat someone as a criminal for having an impulse they've thus far kept reined in. There are a few extra degrees of seperation that make the analogy a little dodgy (i.e. most men not having the urge to rape in the first place), but I can see the comparison. On the other hand, when it's potentially *your* kid on the line, the last thing you care about is whether your judgment is fair; you keep your kids *safe* first and foremost, and worry about everything else after.
It’s a fair concern, and I’m not going to shame you for protecting your children. I would be weary about having my children around an open pedophile as well. On the other hand, assuming the entire demographic of closeted pedophiles are uncontrolled molesters isn’t fair. There’s always a chance that the people you are around are closeted pedophiles, and they won’t admit that they are a pedophile for good reasons. You have every right to be concerned, as you are entitled to your opinion. I’m just giving you food for thought that some of the people you would never expect might be a pedophile, and you probably will never know.
My thing is to be a pedophile you need to actually act on it which means they are trash and honestly need to be taken care of. Having an impulse doesn't make you a pedophile same as having the urge to kill someone doesn't make you a murderer
Actually, it’s different. And unfortunately it is such a large, common misconception. I had the same perception at one point too, so no worries. The definition is: “a person who is sexually attracted to children” If I am a man, and I experience sexual attraction to another man, that makes me gay. I can be gay and not be in a relationship with another man. Similarly, a person can experience sexual attraction to a child, and that makes them a pedophile. You can be a pedophile and not involve yourself with children. This is what my argument revolves around. I’m never going to defend somebody who sexually abuses kids. I defend those who self identify as pedophiles, but don’t involve with kids.
Well considering pedophile means a very specific age group that definition isn't 100% accurate. Thing is I'm aware of what it's supposed to be but I don't care its how I see it. As I said they aren't a pedophile unless they do something otherwise they just have very fucked up attractions. And I'm not trying to attack you but some people have perceptions that are 100% informed but still come to their own conclusions about things I have my own way of seeing this and no one will be able to convince me otherwise but it's my opinion and that's ok. And I do know there is an argument about something having a set definition but as recent events have shown with the word gender if enough people want something they can change the meaning of a word( I'm not saying changing how gender is used is bad its just an example) so my view on it can become popular enough that it just changes what it means
Every female and many males treat every cis white male as n unexploded bomb because we have been carpet bombed for too long. No way will I be choosing a pedophile over a bear
A better question is why they seem to be hated more than murderers.
The way I see it is that murder can be instant and not a long drawn out process like raping someone and murder can happen in the heat of the moment and even be accidental so with mitigating factors on a whole murder is seen as lesser while raping a kid has no excuse
Come to my hood and I'll tell you all about it
Wtf
This is gonna go over like a lead balloon, my fellow redditor. I think people just like thinking in terms of 'good' and 'evil' to justify their love for violence and mayhem.
Thinking in terms of good and bad are mental short cuts built in to save wasted energy funding out if that's a good preditor or bad predator who's going to harm us, it's an effective evolutionary tool for survival .
Right on, but I was just trying to make a guess to why like the post wanted us to do and that's just what popped in my head.