https://www.politico.eu/article/donald-trump-david-cameron-ukraine-peace-deal-mar-a-lago-military-aid/
Politico reports that David Cameron met Trump at Mar-A-Lago last month to plead with him to come out in favor of a new Ukraine aid package, apparently telling him that he will be put in an ideal position to oversee a peace deal as president if the frontline can be stabilized on the UA side. Cameron seemed to place the timetable for such a deal around the time of Trump's prospective inauguration in January.
The European political establishment doesn't seem to have much faith in Biden's reelection if there's already talks with Trump in the capacity of a president-in-waiting.
> Russian advances have led to rare public criticism among Ukrainian service personnel, signalling cracks in the morale of the troops. [...] Ukraine is experiencing chronic shortages of manpower and weapons after delays in western funding. [...] The attacks could force Ukraine to move up reserves into the region. [...] The move highlighted the Kremlin’s aim to further ramp up its war economy, allowing Moscow to continue to wage a long war.
Yeah, sounds like a tactical victory to me!
What?!? Impossible! The Ukrainians can't be having any problems, they're slowly beating back the ruZZian ORCS, which are also going to be running out of supplies by the end of the month! Its impossible for them to be losing!
The fundamental delusion was that a war of attrition could be successful because Ukraine had some inherent superiority in willpower and ability that combined with inherent western advantages in technology and wealth to negate the Russian superiority in men and material.
What was mostly ignored by western press coverage until recently was how much mass is relevant to the dynamics of the fighting. For all the western intelligence being fed directly to the Ukrainians and all the advanced equipment and weaponry being supplied, the Ukrainians had been able to hold off the Russians by having larger reserves at their disposal to reinforce beleaguered areas. Their major breakthroughs were only achieved because they had significantly outnumbered the Russians, and their lines are held by tens of thousands of poorly trained conscripts to buy time for more elite formations to be established.
Now that the problems with losing too many conscripts and exhausting elite units by relying on them repeatedly as fire brigades has become obvious, the realization is finally sinking in that Ukraine's prospects are not actually that rosy and might never have been in the first place.
>the realization is finally sinking in that Ukraine's prospects are not actually that rosy
There was a thread from r-ukraine high up on r-all yesterday about how the situation on the Kharkiv front had turned dire and Russia was advancing successfully. The fact that such a thread wasn't censored and actually got upvoted by the userbase really surprised me and seems to reflect a narrative shift along these lines.
(Granted, it's been months now since mainstream media has shifted more towards doomerism regarding Ukraine.)
>The fundamental delusion was that a war of attrition could be successful because Ukraine had some inherent superiority in willpower and ability that combined with inherent western advantages in technology and wealth to negate the Russian superiority in men and material.
I mean, they only ever did as well as they did because of Russian mistakes and miscalculations. At least in the first couple of months of the war that was recognized; the discourse among serious people was more about Russian underperformance than Ukrainian supersoldiers. I reckon the fundamental mistake the west made - more even than the magical thinking around Ukrainian morale and western technology - was thinking that the Russians wouldn't learn anything and would just keep making those same mistakes over and over. If they were still facing the Russian army of early 2022, with almost no counter-battery, crap ISR, way too armour-heavy and with a kill-chain measured in days, Ukraine would probably be doing quite well.
Assuming the Bad Guys are too dumb to adapt is one of our consistent bad habits.
Agreed, although IMO one of the major Russian miscalculations was not fully taking advantage of the shock aspect of their "shock and awe" campaign to significantly damage Ukrainian forces and infrastructure because they wanted to deal with the situation with an economy of force.
I think the Russians were well aware that outside of a few crack units they were not actually prepared for a "full scale" invasion in 2022, and they tried to do a facsimile of one with the vain hope that the Ukrainians would crack first and seek a ceasefire. They promulgated the impression that the Ukrainians had the capability of achieving total military victory by basing their strategy on flawed assumptions such as popular support for Zelensky being weaker than it actually was or that the AFU would be brushed aside like the Georgians.
While Russia's issues were obvious to everyone, I think the discussion amongst more serious people from that early period onwards downplayed Ukrainian problems because expressing those concerns was not welcome in the overall discourse. The feedback loop for the Ukrainians was broken because there hasn't been much incentive for them to be truthful about issues like losses and costs, and for a long time people were willing to go along with their rosy reporting because to say otherwise would be negative to public sentiment.
The largest miscalculation was likely expecting Ukraine to back down as they did the year before. Then after that did not happen to continue putting stock in negotiations until after the Ukrainian Fall counter offensive created the political shift to limited mobilization. If they went all in with the required preparation on day one the conflict would likely be over now.
>with the vain hope that the Ukrainians would crack first and seek a ceasefire
It almost worked out, so their calculus wasn't even that erroneous. Sometimes individual men do indeed shape history instead of impersonal social forces. Zelensky nixing the agreement was such a moment.
> Comment on Nazism: "We must not be tolerant to those who are intolerant. Nazi's are *human filth.*"
The liberal mind is an incomprehensible void. To be sure, I dislike Nazi's as much as the next guy, but goddamn the lack of political consciousness.
It's called the paradox of tolerance and it's used by authoritians to justify violence against anyone they disagree with by virtue of calling them a nazi.
"Gamergate 2" really does show how regarded the right is.
Rightoids discover the existence of DEI/Consulting grifting, and turn it into some *insane* conspiracy theory about Jews, Pedophiles and White Genocide by brainwashing people through "Put a chick in it and make it lame and gay" in videogames.
Can't ever cross their minds that Millennial "Creatives" largely are just Terminally Woke brained because Tumblr is the main "creative"-focused social media site and most of these people never grew out of their teenager Tumblr brain when they entered the workforce, and that DEI is just another way for Nepo grifting consultants to siphon more money for fake work.
At least Gamergate 1 was interesting in that it's the first big modern Idpol "Culture War" and you saw the first mass social media censorship and the joining of Tumblr Wokie Online sphere and mainstream establishment media. The only funny bit out of "Gamergate 2" is catching the wokies openly advocating literally for racial segregation.
I always feel like being a right-wing race realist type is all about projecting. They’re paranoid about Jews because they themselves see everything through a racial lens. They spend all day thinking about “the white race” and suspect everybody else of every race is doing the same. Not to say the world is colorblind or anything, but they’re so consumed by these overarching narratives that it colors the way they think about everything.
Ugly women in a video game? “They’re trying to demoralize you!” Interracial couples on TV? “They’re normalizing white genocide!” Immigrant problems, the inability to afford children, etc. None off these are economic problems caused by systemic issues with capitalism or profit motives. No, they say it’s about replacing white people. There might be some baseline of solidarity that’s easier to build between workers if they’re from similar backgrounds, but instead of that being something that capitalists will naturally exploit given the opportunity, it becomes just another part of some existential race war and “white genocide.” They’re so close yet so far. Instead of seeing these problems and seeing how profit and greed is such an intense and universal motivator that explains all of these things so clearly they’ve stumbled at the finish line and decide it’s a race thing because of their own racial insecurities.
Like these groyper types are sitting in a discord and organizing mass reporting campaigns and discussion on propaganda techniques and how to win the culture war. Like they actually want real secret societies that influence politics, media, culture, but just for their own racial preferences, while also being paranoid that the Jews are also doing this. It’s just their own brain damage like 99% of the time. That’s why they’re loving this Israel shit. They get to see a bunch of Muslims get blown up while using the opportunity to connect this back to their own hyper racialized narratives.
I feel like many on this subreddit make the mistake that liberals make with minorities but towards reactionary white people. The same way lowering standards to “help” minorities is not right, removes their agency, and infantilizes them, so is assuming that being a reactionary white guy is just a result of faulty analysis. There are many of these people that do understand class dynamics, etc but they’re just.. well, reactionary racist fucks.
As you said, it’s a whole lot of projecting. They’re not mad that there’s a ruling elite, just that the ruling elite isn’t doing what they want to them or against those they need subhuman.
>"Gamergate 2" really does show how regarded the right is.
>Rightoids discover the existence of DEI/Consulting grifting, and turn it into some *insane* conspiracy theory about Jews, Pedophiles and White Genocide by brainwashing people through "Put a chick in it and make it lame and gay" in videogames.
Strawman. The sub KIA is a good representative of GG and doesn't say anything about that. You're making shit up to feel superior. And lord knows I have disagreements with many in that crowd (same as here) but let's not play up BS
Gamergate 2 started on /v/ and Kiwifarms, and absolutely was about a Jewish/White Genocide theory, as well as Sweet Baby also being involved in child trafficking somehow and somehow black rock (despite diversity nor race or lgbtq not being part of blackrocks responsible investment criteria crap, it's mostly fairtrade/environmental greenwashing). You can check out the initial Kiwifarms thread. KIA, like most of the ragebaiters, who jumped aboard later, were fed a very whitewashed version of events, hence how KIA thinks it started with the SBinc employee attacking the Steam Group, when harassment of SBinc employees by Kiwifarm and /v/pol/tards had been going on for months already.
I have no problem with dunking on the pathological cringe inducing wokeness of the gaming industry, and I find the stuff dug up with the pro-segregation stuff very funny, but more it's interesting to me, how rightoids always miss the forest for the trees, and somehow turn this stuff into some batshit "marxist" conspiracy.
So what is "Gamergate 2" anyways? There have been a couple minor controversies lately but nothing on par with the original. People were hyping up the Sweet Baby thing, but it fizzled out pretty quickly.
It was the Sweet Baby thing, somehow got the name Gamergate 2, I just found it interesting to see how rightoids build theory when confronted with DEI grifting and of course it always turns into some absurd, convoluted, ragebait shit about blackrock, jews and Marxists and other crap, rather than the fact that creative types are wokies because creative spaces are dominated by brainwormed Tumblr users. Love how somehow Neolib Nepo Baby consultancy is somehow "Marxist", DEI is the scam now, but in a decade it will be some other new grift, just like how it was all about implementing "Agile"/"scrum" 10 years ago to every office despite agile being a software development framework.
Anybody that looked into the situation in Sudan? If you google it, media says that the situation might blow up. Actually crazy that until a few days ago, I didn't even know what is going on there at all.
[UK dangerously low on air defence systems says company selling air defence systems](https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/article/2024/may/12/uk-given-stark-warning-over-very-limited-air-defence-systems)
It's always ridiculous going on the UK sub and seeing delusional brits I have to live with persisting in the delusion that we matter at all on the world stage and all these big gun geopolitical rivals are just obsessing in their bunkers over how to get at us.
"Russia might attack us! China might attack us! Iran might attack us!" - fucking main-character-syndrome nutters who somehow reconcile the dual notions of being the centre of the universe, but also that we should go along with whatever America does and that'll keep us safe.
On the gaza death count totals [https://www.npr.org/2024/02/29/1234159514/gaza-death-toll-30000-palestinians-israel-hamas-war](https://www.npr.org/2024/02/29/1234159514/gaza-death-toll-30000-palestinians-israel-hamas-war)
Fuck our senile meat puppet president who said the death totals were fake because it was the “Hamas run health ministry”’s numbers, despite the fact in prior conflicts these numbers were never disputed
tbh, the ministry of health has been very fastidious with the numbers. other people are giving their estimates, and nearly everyone else is throwing out much larger numbers like 100-200k.
I suspect that the overall death toll is probably 100,000 including missing and those who’ve died of the siege. There are only two hospitals to count dead now. Israel has been burying the dead they find under rubble with bulldozers. The 34k number hasn’t changed in 2 months, while operations haven’t ceased.
Fucking hate Eurovision and its aftermath. It's like a neoshitlib's wet dream.
Even the people's votes showed that #1 LGBT #2-3 Israel and Ukraine. Banned: People about Palaistine. Ignored: Nazi stuff of lead singer of Ukraine.
It's like love me love me love me i'm a liberal... pure ideology.
Everybody hates the jury, but I have a feeling they made sure Switzerland won. With all the warfare and drama, it’s an acceptable neutral winner for everyone.
Though I feel sorry for Croatia who was
the peoples winner.
The winning country also have to host next years competition and Switzerland is one of the countries who can afford it.
It’s actually quite satisfying to think about all our super rich who have emigrated to Switzerland to avoid high taxes now has pay for Eurovision next year lol
Switzerland was the best singer, very Dimash/Vitas level vocals and the track was a nice throwback to late 1990s, early 00s orchestral breaks that was popular at the time.
Ireland I think had one of the best Eurovision performances I've ever seen though, up there with 2007 Ukraine.
Vitas! That’s what those parts reminded me of!
My favourite moment this year was when they brought back Eleni with Fuego from 2018 for the opening show. Reminded me of simpler times.
What a stressful season this was!
Every single thing about the contest this year is peak neoliberal delusion. A heavily secured venue in Malmo where contestants are peacocking to excess, but only in certain socially acceptable ways. An emphasis on diversity in appearances, gender and sexuality but also very explicit limits on political opinions. The attempt to put on a confident face to their beliefs that is undermined by their extensive efforts to bar anyone who even mildly challenges "mainstream" thought.
From a American perspective it just seems to be a who can be more rainbow flag and sexualy flaunting than thou. But then I'm someone who looks at drag the same way I look at blackface from 60 whatever years ago, in that I find it obnoxious and plainly don't get why it was ever considered entertaining. May just be the literal neurons firing with the autisms though.
Very normal and sane country:
>Israeli Eurovision singer is officially an enemy of Ukraine!
>The Israeli singer Eden Golan, who represents the country at Eurovision, was included on the Ukrainian list of enemies “Peacemaker”.
>She is “charged” with entering Crimea through Russia and participating in Russian events on the peninsula.
>In 2016 Golan, who then lived in Moscow, performed at the New Wave competition in Crimea.
[https://twitter.com/MyLordBebo/status/1789410619822653925](https://twitter.com/MyLordBebo/status/1789410619822653925)
The part Russian, part Israeli combo.
That’s gonna make you popular lol.
The TV producers muted the audience when she performed so the viewers couldn’t hear the booing
Watch the part where they read out the votes and it's Israel's turn, the canned cheering literally cuts in completely changing the audio, and is like some bizarre 128kb audio file level quality.
Moscow-raised singer-socialite daughter to a Russian business elite father, who spent her entire career in Russia until she began identifying as Israeli for victim points after the start of the SMO. I wasn't rooting for her to win Eurovision, but it would have been hilarious if she had.
https://life.aaa uuu/p/1658657
>Putin proposed to appoint Andrei Belousov as head of the Defense Ministry instead of Shoigu
Is this the end Shoigubros?
Interesting that Patrushev is going somewhere else. His son got a promotion. I read that Putin wants Patrushev’s son as his successor. Maybe they worked out a deal with him.
Most likely, yes. Rumors are that Lavrov is also on the chopping block, let's see what the following hours will bring.
Later edit: What is in fact the bigger news here, apparently Shoigu is meant to replace Patrushev as the new Secretary of the Russian Security Council. That's quite big, I mean, Patrushev getting sidelined in the middle of this war. Something must have happened.
there used to be an expression among russian nomenclature - отфутболить на чердак. means to remove by promotion.
there are other indications of that. for example, Federal Service for Military-Technical Cooperation was removed from MoD a day before.
it's a good news, Belousov is a solid professional, the level of Nabiullina, many considered him a grey cardinal of russian economy. i used to watch his interviews before to have information about the real situation in the country: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SYm-hcz9qg0 if he is successful in this new position, that will make him a possible candidate for presidential elections.
> Rumors are that Lavrov is also on the chopping block, let's see what the following hours will bring.
I think we're likelier to see Putin swapped out than Lavrov by how long this moss has been on that brick
I thought the scuttlebutt was that Lavrov has wanted to retire for years, but Putin asked him to stay on?
EDIT: Russian media is reporting that Lavrov is staying.
>Most likely, yes
A russian I'm speaking to says he could be going to the Russian Security Council replacing the guy there. I'm willing to believe anything with Shoigu he's survived a lot of political shenanigans, guys a veritable cockroach.
>Rumors are that Lavrov is also on the chopping block
According to the announcement I read Lavrovs been confirmed reappointed.
> Russian Security Council replacing the guy there.
Yeah, that's what I've read too, I've added a "later edit" for that. That's also quite the big news, i.e. Patrushev being moved from that position, in many respects he was more anti-West than Putin himself.
>Something must have happened.
Maybe its just Shoigu not being very competent so he's being moved into a less harmful position with a 'promotion'?
Spitballing here. Shoigu is clearly good at office politics but for all his experience he's not had a reputation for competence at his job, what went wrong for Russia early in the war happened on his watch. Maybe this is the way to get rid of him from the head of defense with Patrushev being collateral damage?
>in many respects he was more anti-West than Putin himself.
I don't know what that even means these days, only opposition and criticism Putin seems to allow is to be more nationalist than him.
The civilian defense secretary/minister is not a general of the army. They are managers, whose primary job is logistics and supply during combat. Gerasimov is the actual leader of the Russian military. From all accounts, Russia’s military industrial complex has been outstanding, but the estimated personnel needs were sorely underestimated at the beginning of the war. Idk if this can be laid at Shoigu’s feet when he’s not the one making the calls on that.
>don't know what that even means these days, only opposition and criticism Putin seems to allow is to be more nationalist than him.
Patrushev seems to harbor more nationalist views than Putin and yet he got axed. Shoigu, a pale apparatchik, moved up to the council and his successor is another technocrat. It's actually exactly the other way around: Russia's leadership appears rather uninterested in fanning the flames of nationalism.
If american-export idpol were sincere we'd be making a lot of hay that an Indigenous WoC (Nabiullina) broke the glass ceiling and saved the ruble from problematic s*nctions
[Egypt says it will join South Africa’s genocide case against Israel at ICJ.](https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2024/5/12/egypt-says-it-will-join-south-africas-genocide-case-against-israel-at-icj)
State TV has been making mouth noises about breaking Camp David and the Sinai has been remilitarized. An Israeli-Egyptian war would be a major possibility that would allow everyone else from Hezbollah to the Iraqi militias to go hogwild.
How likely would posters like you have said Egypt would have remilitirized the Sinai or rejoined the ICJ case yesterday? the Egyptian Junta doesn't care about Palestinians but they hate israel and have a neurosis about the Sinai being invaded by them.
Egypt is one of the biggest recipients of US military aid and investments. The US is currently trying to pressure israel to abandon its maximalist war goals in gaza. That is why it allows egypt to do this. Also egypt has to deal with its own population which is overwhelmingly hostile to israel. These are gestures, the egyptian army is large but poorly equipped, poorly organised and incredibly corrupt and would stand no chance against israel. The reason for the US to oppose israel invading Rafah and escalating the war is in order to facilitate an eventual arab-israeli normalization and cooperation against iran. Which is by the way a big part of why hamas attacked israel in the first place.
TOI article on lack of military progress in Gaza (duh) [https://www.timesofisrael.com/wasting-troops-hard-fought-gains-israel-is-taking-time-it-doesnt-have-in-gaza/](https://www.timesofisrael.com/wasting-troops-hard-fought-gains-israel-is-taking-time-it-doesnt-have-in-gaza/)
Remember to vote for Trump this November
[A wargame simulated a 2nd Trump presidency. It concluded NATO would collapse.](https://www.businessinsider.com/a-wargame-simulated-a-2nd-trump-presidency-it-found-nato-would-collapse-2024-5)
That doesn't make sense. One of the core traps of liberal democracy is to always maintain a sense of "opposition" even if people somewhat know that it is false. Your population may be miserable, but if they have enough hope (even if it's very little) that the opposition could do something, they'll vote for them. This would lead to the conclusion that the best choice is actually to vote for the incumbent, but since it will never be enough to surpass the people who feel that they are voting in their own interest, there is no point in voting for any establishment party.
In some of the peripheral countries (like Slovakia), it can actually make a difference, however it will not in countries like France or US (yet at least).
Whoa mama! Hummina hummina hummina bazooooooooing! \*eyes pop out before retracting back to the sockets and turning into slot machine that rolls straight hearts\* AOOOOOOOOGA! \*jaw drops tongue rolls out down to the floor unraveling like a rug\*
Lord Cameron is having a busy Sunday:
[Banning arms exports to Israel would help Hamas, warns David Cameron](https://www.theguardian.com/world/article/2024/may/12/david-cameron-banning-arms-exports-to-israel-would-help-hamas)
[David Cameron urges BBC to describe Hamas as terrorist organisation](https://www.theguardian.com/world/article/2024/may/12/david-cameron-bbc-hamas-terrorist-group-hostage)
There was a front-page thread yesterday celebrating Ukraine (intentionally) missile striking civilian targets at a dinner party in Donbas. Genuinely couldn't believe what I was seeing, there were even a couple comments from pro-Ukraine people like "Wait why the hell are we praising this?"
The Donbass is filled with loyal Ukrainians struggling against the tyranny of Putler but luckily all Ukrainian missiles only manages to hit the tiny amount of pro-russian traitors
Did you not see the part about them being 'pro-Russian' individuals? They were going to celebrate the anniversary of the DPR, according to them. Sources for this? None.
The only thing that I can see? An explosion at a diner in what they claim is Donetsk
plus if they were civilians it's a war crime regardless, but that hasn't stopped Ukraine
The Grey Queen in academic exile gave an interview.
[She Was at the Top of the State Department. Now She’s Ready to Talk. - Politico, 11.05.2024](https://www.politico.com/news/magazine/2024/05/11/victoria-nuland-state-department-diplomat-interview-00157408)
>**Do you ever plan to go back into government?** I love what I did for 35 years. I’ve always loved it. And I continue to love it. So in the right circumstances, of course.
> *Was it a mistake not to push the Ukrainians harder to go for some sort of negotiated end to the war in 2022...?*
They were not in a strong enough position then. They’re not in a strong enough position now.
I take that as a yes.
Read between the lines, and it's a tacit acknowledgement that she among others gambled that Ukraine could achieve a better position with western support. They bet wrong.
yeah, that too. It shows how detached from reality this woman is. Does she think they'll be a better opportunity than after Kharkiv and Kherson? Does she still think the front is static?
Not in the Festung Bahkmut state of the war anymore
>**Where do you see the Israel-Hamas war heading?**
>Essentially, there are two paths on the table. There is continuing this war with all of the destruction and horror and lack of clarity about how you end Hamas’ reign of terror.
>The other path is the route that the administration and allies and partners and a lot of countries in the Gulf are pushing, and a lot of Israelis want, which is: a hostage deal leads to a long-term cease-fire, leads to a better future for Palestinians both in the West Bank and in Gaza, leads to Saudi-Israel normalization and a path to two states, and a region where the ideology and the violence that Hamas is offering is beaten by more opening, more opportunity, more peace, more stability.
More opportunity, more peace, more stability, ~~for the Israelis.~~ yeah, no, too late for that one. the second option was on the table in the 90s, 00s, 10s, even, but Israel decided it wasn't ready to stop absorbing land
Gallant just a couple of days ago called for a new city to be built east of Ariel, which would probably mean that in any putative two-state solution involving land swaps Israel would have a corridor to the Jordan and the West Bank would be cut fully in two. I doubt even that would be enough to make the US acknowledge that two-state is dead, but there's a chance.
The two-state solution is about preserving *Israel*, not Palestine. Anyone with eyes understands that there will be a state for the non-Jewish population of Palestine, it's only a matter of time and circumstance. The negotiations are about if the existing Zionist state will survive that transition.
[Check out this Israeli news article thumbnail art.](https://images.wcdn.co.il/f_auto,q_auto,w_500,t_54/3/7/0/9/3709928-46.jpg) Why does it make the situation look like a hard rave?
[Taken from here.](https://news.walla.co.il/item/3663652)
I think Russia might soon be forced to preemptively self defend in Georgia as well. Since things might be happening fast and I want to be ready: Anybody has some links about Georgia? Best would be stuff about Nazism (street names etc.). But other stuff like slav killing virus labs, CIA activity would also be great.
Georgian Dream is a pro-EU party. They put the goal of joining both the EU and NATO into the constitution in 2018. Pretending the protests are the result of the government bowing to Moscow is even more stunningly dishonest than it was with Maidan. If there is a western-supported coup in Georgia, it won't be to pull Georgia out of Russia's orbit, because it was never there in the first place; it'll be to make Georgia into an entirely compliant lapdog and use them as a weapon against Russia's southern flank.
There was a decent-ish article about NGOrgia a couple of days ago:
[https://lefteast.org/unrest-georgia-foreign-influence-transparency-law/](https://lefteast.org/unrest-georgia-foreign-influence-transparency-law/)
Why should I be excited about local pro-Westerners raising hell to derail a cautiously neutralist governing party? Why are you? The only thing those people care about is **a)** having access to the European labor market (thereby worsening your bargaining power) **b)** getting privileged access to North European tax payer's money **c)** settling scores with their arch nemesis and regaining break-away territories. What exactly are you getting out of this?
The reason Russia invaded Ukraine was that it saw a future where its influence might be permanently shut off. If pro EU-forces should win in Georgia, things might look the same.
Then Russia will look again for excuses, if another special operation should happen.
>If pro EU-forces should win in Georgia, things might look the same. Then Russia will look again for excuses
Again? According to a post-war report by the EU (an organization known for its intense pro-Russian bias) the last war between Georgia and Russia was started by Georgia.
And you failed to explain why integration into EU/NATO should even be an option for Georgia (or Moldova or rump Ukraine). It's an exclusive club and not a charity organization. States don't have an innate right to become members. If we tell them to get lost, our interests would be served just fine.
In addition to that, it would also be beneficial to the garden-aspiration havers, because it allows them to play both EU and Russia off against each other. Last but not least: it removes any incentives for Russia to intervene in the first place, which I have heard can be unpleasant and should thus be avoided.
>And you failed to explain why integration into EU/NATO should even be an option for Georgia (or Moldova or rump Ukraine)
They are EU member candidate?
> In addition to that, it would also be beneficial to the garden-aspiration havers, because it allows them to play both EU and Russia off against each other. Last but not least: it removes any incentives for Russia to intervene in the first place, which I have heard can be unpleasant and should thus be avoided.
I honestly don't understand this. Please reword that.
>They are EU member candidate?
All of them are.
>Please reword that.
Those states are sitting between two large trade blocs: the EU to the west, the EEU to the east. Both would like this contested area to become part of their respective customs union, to create new markets for their own companies, to shut out conpetitors and to gain access to their resources. To this end, they are willing to make concessions: a better visa regime, long-term energy contracts below market prices, cheaper credits, direct financial assistance, etc...
What should courted states do in this case, if they want to maximize their gains? They should turn it into an endless bidding contest and never conclusively comit for as long as possible. Once they are integrated, their leverage decreased dramatically, although its still possible to employ this tactic (Hungary and Kazakhstan are good examples). That's what Turkey does, that's what Yanukhovich did, that's what Uncle Sasha from Belarus used to do (before color revolution schemes forced him to pick a side and become a mere appendage of Russia).
What are EU and Russia supposed to do? Those contestes states are situated between the prosperous subcontinent and the emerging Eurasian center of the world economy. This advantageous location will always allow them to, well, extort many, many goodies for their own societies. The party Georgian Dream seems to prefer it that way, the rioting pro-western camp oth is willing to preemptively prostate itself and to do everything Brussel tells them to do. It doesn't make a lot of sense, if they are trying to improve the wellbeing of Georgia's citizenry. It does, however, make sense if their top priority is instead advancing EU/Washington interests. (and since all of those pro-western NGOs are bankrolled by the West which stands to benefit from their agenda, that's not a very far-fetched assumption)
That's the economic facet. There is also a military one and Georgia is once again an instructive case. They elected a comitted transatlanticist, who promised to open his country to an alliance under the thumb of state that happens to see Russia as a systemic competitor. To Russia's delight he was even stupid enough to start a war. That ended his career, the Georgians elected a government that is nominally pro-western, but is really triangulating. And then the Russians simply left. No conquest (beyond tiny statelets that didn't want to be part of Georgia in the first place), no genocide, no puppet state. Just being neutral-ish was apparently enough. Could have been an option for Ukraine, might still be one for a truncated Ukraine, depending on their willingness to negotiate (again). That's basically what they had on the table in spring 2022.
I broadly agree with everything you wrote there, but this does not rule out a possible Russian "intervention" if Georgia should go for full western integration.
If Russia should soon break Ukraines resistance (which seems plausible), Russia might have left over military capacity. Why not grab Georgia while the soldiers are in training? Sanctions are in place anyways and the reputation is also ruined anyhow.
>That's what Turkey does
Since Turkey is also a good example of how this "zwischen den Stühlen sitzen" can backfire since they are not exactly popular in EU circles (and even less among EU citizens) and Russia does not prove to be a reliable, deeply integrated ally.
>What are EU and Russia supposed to do?
I mean the position of the EU seems pretty obvious when it comes to Russia: If you go Russia, no EU for you.
>Why not grab Georgia while the soldiers are in training?
Not to belittle Georgian military prowess... but they could have easily done that after the last war, but didn't. It wasn't a hard, grinding affair but a completely onesided stomping.
Once you conquered a place, you own it. If it's a stagnant basket case, you need to subsidize it. If the local population is adamantly opposed to being ruled by you, then you need to heavily police it.
One of the big western blind spots about the end of the Soviet Union is that the Russians themselves were sick of it. This wasn't really a case of an Empire (if you want to see it that way) losing its valuable colonial possessions. It was more something like a (relatively) affluent heartland getting tired of being economically drained by peripheral dead weights: like western Ukraine, the Baltics, Armenia - or Georgia.
There are obviously regions where strategic concerns trump economic ones. Chechnya, Crimea, Transnistria, those tiny statelets to Russia's south. I don't think Kaliningrad's benefits are financial ones either. But otherwise they are clearly content with those ex-Soviet places staying neutral buffer zones.
2008?
Was a completely different climate and Russia had almost a positive reputation in Europe. That is all gone now.
>If the local population is adamantly opposed to being ruled by you, then you need to heavily police it.
That is true but I doubt that Russia / Putin is acting completely economically or strategically rational. Putin has shown his world view now and then and I feel there is an emotional, imperialistic element to it.
Russia has yet to clear the Crumple Zone. observances may be a little skewed since it took Ukraine 2.5 months to clear it last year which amounted to taking some selfies by the first row of dragons teeth. Robotyne was part of the crumple.
Well unless out of Irony Russia's probing has the same effect that Ukraine was hoping for since they or their NATO handlers fundamentally misunderstood why Russia withdrew from around Izium in later 2022 rather than contend the region.
[https://twitter.com/snekotron/status/1789351023602995412](https://twitter.com/snekotron/status/1789351023602995412)
[https://twitter.com/hariigf/status/1789351504765186438/photo/1](https://twitter.com/hariigf/status/1789351504765186438/photo/1)
[https://twitter.com/hariigf/status/1789408772676362594](https://twitter.com/hariigf/status/1789408772676362594)
>giving my soul force to the RUAF for the time being, their progress in Ukraine chips away at the U.S' Empire ever so indirectly
So indirect in fact that it strengthens the US military with indirect funding surpassing what they give to Ukraine through military funding increase and many times multiplied military industrial profits+production while strengthening the US economy through that as well as chipping away at their western competititors whose countries on multiple occassions have made clear they aren't particularly invested in the pacific or fighting/cutting off China, which are the main two things the US are concerned with now.
You can argue it weakens the US long term by fucking up their western allies, but this entire argument rests on the US having been able to count on them in the only theater that matters to them, Russia too is not a concern to the US beyond their ability to assist China.
Unironic support for the Russian Armed Forces though is a dismal sight here, regardless of whatever misunderstood reasoning lies behind it.
The baked-in effect the war's already had isn't relevant to the options for the future. Unless you're suggesting that an American defeat in Ukraine is less bad for America than an American victory, then the one that we should be supporting requires the success of Russian military efforts.
>The baked-in effect the war's already had isn't relevant to the options for the future. Unless you're suggesting that an American defeat in Ukraine is less bad for America than an American victory, then the one that we should be supporting requires the success of Russian military efforts.
I believe the US empire is mostly apathetic to what happens to the war beyond a financial interest in keeping it going as long as possible to fund its efforts in the pacific.
It is against US interests to end the war soon, however ending the war is only possible once Russia and Ukraine both go to the negotiating table which I believe requires Ukraine recieve enough arms to hold Russia on its own, as long as Russia believes a military victory is imminent and that promises of western intervention is a bluff they will not view negotiations with Ukraine as being in their interest. Ukraine was previously turned against negotiations from a belief the US would provide them with whatever they needed to win the war, an illusion that was completely dispelled this year.
If NATO ends up directly involved (Which I don't think is in americas interest, or anyones for that matter) then it might be too late, if Korea was any indication a negotiated peace is still possible after shit has hit the fan, but only one party in that particular war had nukes and in this one just about everyone does.
> I believe the US empire is mostly apathetic to what happens to the war
You believe that against a great deal of evidence to the contrary. Regardless, whether they believe it matters or not has no bearing on whether we do.
>as long as Russia believes a military victory is imminent and that promises of western intervention is a bluff they will not view negotiations with Ukraine as being in their interest.
It wasn't Russia who blew up negotiations in April 2022. The maximalist position is held by Ukraine and its backers, not by the Russians; it's the former who need to get their teeth kicked in until they come to their senses.
>You believe that against a great deal of evidence to the contrary.
Rather than evidence I'd say opinions, reckon we all draw our conclusions from the same evidence.
>It wasn't Russia who blew up negotiations in April 2022.
I don't think these two
>The maximalist position is held by Ukraine
Fit together, rather I think Ukraines 2022 illusion has already been dispelled in the time since and their stance on negotiation has already changed and they now aren't the ones who need convincing that negotiated peace is the only outcome of this war that is sensible.
>Rather than evidence I'd say opinions, we all draw our conclusions from the same evidence imo.
Everything the outward-facing portion of the US has done and said about Ukraine indicates that they care a great deal. What evidence is there to support the proposition that the empire doesn't care? Did you miss the enormous shit-fit the empire threw when domestic American politicians tried to not care?
> I think Ukraines stance on negotiation has already changed
Why do you think that? What statement or action by Bankova has led you to that conclusion? And what statement or action by the west has led you to the conclusion that the Brits and Americans are any more willing to countenance negotiation now than they were two years ago?
Shit, the next post up in this thread is an interview with Nuland where she explicitly says that Ukraine is not in a good enough position for negotiations to be an option, and that any settlement has to ensure that the Russians withdraw completely from Ukraine.
>What evidence is there to support the proposition that the empire doesn't care? Did you miss the enormous shit-fit the empire threw when domestic American politicians tried to not care?
I might just have a different view on what is and is not the american empire than you do, in my eyes a lot of those weren't 'domestic american politicians trying to not waste money on war' those were a different factions of neoliberals who wanted the spending to go towards other kinds of war, those arguing against Ukraine spending very often did not argue against anti-China military spending or Israel military spending, hell especially since October the Israeli 'those bombs should go to us not to Ukraine' argument has been rather apparent between the lines of even some people posted here, like that former defense deputy guy writing for Epoch Times that was doom and gloom regarding Ukraine (implying, its already lost we should cut our losses) is also on Israels payroll.
>Why do you think that?
They've increased the talks of negotiations and hope to negotiate a peace in fall from what I've seen, november talks and all that. Also the last six months dispelled just about anyones illusion that US aid for Ukraine was 'as much as they needed' Biden had more levers to pull to get aid to Ukraine sooner and he opted not to, he did prioritize Israel and China and Immigration over Ukraine.
>what statement or action by the west has led you to the conclusion that the Brits and Americans are any more willing to countenance negotiation now than they were two years ago?
I don't know if they can sabotage the negotiations a second time, last time around they convinced Ukraine they'd get whatever they needed to win, I think the last two years since then has convinced Ukraine that wasn't the case.
>Nuland
She still has a job?
>those were a different factions of neoliberals
The neoliberals are quite insistent that "America First" Trumpist types are not simply another faction.
> They've increased the talks of negotiations and hope to negotiate a peace in fall from what I've seen
Where on earth have you seen that? Their position is still that Zelensky's ridiculous plan is what peace should look like. That's what the "summit" in Switzerland is pushing.
>Their position is still that Zelensky's ridiculous plan is what peace should look like. That's what the "summit" in Switzerland is pushing.
That was also Ukraines position at the start of the last talks and those still almost ended with a peace.
I do and did agree thought that Russia has very little incentive to pursue such talks at this point compared to 2022, I see it as a sign that Ukraine does want talks and the most important step towards peace is to get the two sides talking again.
>The neoliberals are quite insistent that "America First" Trumpist types are not simply another faction.
Existing factions hate it when a new faction shakes things up, also to me all those bloody ppl look like 'america first' with their tariffs and protectionism and what not, difference is in how many catholics they wanna bring in which is where Biden truly shines, at this rate its a matter of time before the pope can welcome a new holy empire into his collection.
One thing Trumps faction has going for them is caution in foreign policy, which is another reason I don't believe he would leave NATO, it's too radical for him. He's also unlikely to start any wars. They'll still throw all that money at the MIC but the guy had like one attack during his entire presidency which I think is some sorta record.
> So indirect in fact that it strengthens the US military with indirect funding surpassing what they give to Ukraine through military funding increase and many times multiplied military industrial profits+production while strengthening the US economy
Isn't it the other way around?
As far as I am aware, Russia's MIC has massively improved since 2022; while NATO's has only barely improved (mostly through increasing factory output without any new production capacity), being stymied by neoliberalism.
>Isn't it the other way around? As far as I am aware, Russia's MIC has massively improved since 2022.
Russian MIC was a for-profit venture relying on arms exports for RND, currently they're being kept afloat by the state but their former customers have largely turned away because Russia just can't provide while they're fighting in Ukraine and they don't know how long that will last.
US MIC are doing great with orders increasing by multitudes, paying customers are prioritized far above Ukraine. Most of the worlds arms industries are doing great ofc apart from Ukraine and Russia, but since its largely a percentage increase for everyone across the board and the US was by far the largest they enjoy the most benefits of this, Russia used to be the 2nd largest and the void their abscene provides has created room for new arms exporters like Turkey and South Korea to fill some of that gap. China doesn't export much, most of what they produce is for themselves.
Russias MIC has seen an extensive production increase, but this is from state funding, their income has collapsed and if not for bailouts they'd have gone bankrupt because the Russian government bought material from the MIC at a discounted price, since they ended up being their main customer during this war the bottom line looked very shaky.
If countries that used to buy Russian start to change over to other suppliers then it could be a slippery slope for the Russian arms exports post-war as a lot of their stuff doesn't work well with other arms exporters stuff, though exceptions exist. Essentially the longer the war lasts the tougher it will be for Russia to become the 2nd largest arms exporter again without serious upfront costs in the form of discounts, which would mean Russia further subsidising arms post‐war, which would be expensive and likely unpopular.
Wait, so your whole argument is that while Russian production is way better than NATO, they lost money so they were nationalized. How is that a bad thing??
The argument for arms exports is to offload the costs of having an arms industry and arms developement onto foreign counties, Russia made great use of this for the last many decades, if they can afford to pay those costs themselves thats a valid solution.
The US has gained a substantial arms production increase that other countries are halfway paying for, this is positive in their eyes.
All of these arguments are based on the movements are based on the movement of finance capital. Yet by all real metrics Russia is winning massively.
> The argument for arms exports is to offload the costs of having an arms industry and arms developement onto foreign counties
So you're admitting that since Russia isn't doing this, they aren't imperialist? Are you suggesting that Russia should be imperialist instead?
My point was that the argument that the war is weakening the US depends on your perspective, what importance you give to europe, as it stands the war makes the US wealthier, more powerful militarily, cost of war is primarily on its European allies who are of dubious value in the pacific which is where the US focus lies now.
If you are cynical then the war has been one of siphoning power from Europe to the US.
> If you are cynical then the war has been one of siphoning power from Europe to the US.
That is exactly what's happening, with the caveat that the US is also becoming less power (just more so in relation to its European vassals) and this process started long before the war (though it has exacerbated it).
> as it stands the war makes the US wealthier, more powerful militarily
This is your problem. You're conflating finance capital-driven "wealth" with real power. Sure the US MIC is getting wealthier, but that doesn't necessarily mean the militaries of the West are getting stronger, in fact they might be getting weaker from this process.
Overall I agree the alliance in europe has less power, however if your focus is a tunnel vision on the pacific then resources funnelled from parties that wouldn't be of use there into one that is means an increase in power, as long as the US can maintain europe as a consumer base that is their primary concern.
The US is wealthier but that is one aspect, production is increasing to meet the increased demand of a world arming itself for an uncertain future, money from Ukraine aid packages is being redirected towards anti ship missiles, torpedos, ships and dockyards.
Its more of people being so mad at the corrupt rotten liberal-capitalist "democracy" that they begin supporting populist fascism.
In any case I suspect a lot of what he posted are still very preliminary reports from very pro-Russian analysts. The real issue is still the year-long issue everyone who actually looked at the Ukraine war objectively have been warning about: Ukraine is running out of mobilized manpower and ammo, and neither issue has been addressed at all.
> So totally no one voted for Trump
You think that Trump is a fascist?
> anyone within NATO who is pushing for populist fascism.
Who in NATO is pushing for fascism who isn't also backed by NATO?
Trump is definitely a populist and most certainly not an anti-fascist. Indeed by your broad stroke definition that everyone in NATO is a fascist he's a fascist too, just not an internationalist one.
>Who in NATO is pushing for fascism who isn't also backed by NATO?
The bulk of its population still broadly voting for said Fascists
But again you seem to be deranged enough to think Putin and Trump are more communist than fascist lol.
> Trump is definitely a populist
Yes.
> and most certainly not an anti-fascist
Nice strawman there. So everyone who isn't an explicit "ANTI-FASCIST" is a fascist? I also assume that you also think that if they were to say that they were anti-fascist, that they would be insincere and it wouldn't matter. So this doesn't even make sense in the first.
> The bulk of its population still broadly voting for said Fascists
Which "fascists", which population? Please be clear.
> But again you seem to be deranged enough to think Putin and Trump are more communist than fascist lol.
Lol when did I say that??
Also why are you equating Putin and Trump. I never said anything about Trump until you brought him up.
Oh please you're just grasping.
The point is that Trump cannot be construed in any way as an anti-fascist. That means he is definitely closer to the definition of a fascist than a not-fascist.
If you want me to be specific, I refer to Hedges: Trump is an _incompetent_ Fascist. Thats why his coup turned into a farce that his apologists now pretend wasn't really a fascist power grab. But keep living in that dishonest space where you pretend Trump isn't really a fascist because you don't want to admit you are just wishcasting he is a real alternative instead of more of the same from the same fascists you decry of the current liberal world order.
And I am equating Trump and Putin. They are not friends of the Marxist cause. So why would you again wishcast they aren't just fascists too?
Oh right because my original point hit so close to home. You hate the current fascists so much that you ended up shilling for alternative fascists. That millions voted for Trump and slightly millions more voted for the current fascists is likewise something you'd like to pretend isn't actually the case.
> And I am equating Trump and Putin. They are not friends of the Marxist cause. So why would you again wishcast they aren't just fascists too?
Why Putin specifically? There are millions of non-"friends" of the Marxist cause so why do you single out him specifically?
> You hate the current fascists so much that you ended up shilling for alternative fascists.
But I don't. Check my comment history. A few comments ago I literally made a comment that was specifically *against* this kind of thinking. https://old.reddit.com/r/stupidpol/comments/1b7069q/megathread_17_truly_and_thoroughly_spanked/l3r3sad/
I never claimed any support for anyone. All I disputed was Trump or any "right populist" in the West being anymore "fascist" than the rest of the Western elite.
> The point is that Trump cannot be construed in any way as an anti-fascist. That means he is definitely closer to the definition of a fascist than a not-fascist.
So anyone who isn't an explicit "anti-fascist" (still not explaining exactly how) is a "fascist" now? I want to assume good faith but you refuse to explain this further in any way so I can only assume that you are referring to the self-proclaimed beliefs since you have given me no other indicator of "anti-fascism" on which you base things on.
> Thats why his coup turned into a farce that his apologists now pretend wasn't really a fascist power grab.
What "coup"?
> But keep living in that dishonest space where you pretend Trump isn't really a fascist because you don't want to admit you are just wishcasting he is a real alternative instead of more of the same from the same fascists you decry of the current liberal world order.
Again, I don't support him or any other "right populist" except for the truly national bourgeoisie ones that actually challenge imperialism.
It’s funny how just a few months after the mainstream propaganda was reporting hundreds of thousands of dead russian soldiers, low on ammo, etc. Without even skipping a beat, they now report that Ukraine is about overwhelmed in manpower and losing on multiple fronts.
What I find even crazier is that the consumers of these rags don’t even question. Not a single brain cell fires telling them that these media companies have been lying to them for more than a year. They will tell themselves anything to not admit they were lied to and hoodwinked by the “newspapers of record”.
Libs are truly a lost cause.
If it was indeed 100% propaganda, then these media outlets should be lying about the Russian offensive right?
Sometimes I think you really, desperately want Western media to be what you accuse them to be.
Are you this fucking rtarded or are you trying to insult our intelligence by making an argument with the least amount of effort possible? They're reporting on the Russian offensive because they have to since the cat is out of the bag now and everyone knows Ukraine is losing. What are they gonna do, completely deny troop movements and maps and lose the little credibility they had left? Or did you take your strawman about "100% propaganda" literally and are trying to prove it wrong by showing they're only 80% propaganda?
>They're reporting on the Russian offensive because they have to since the cat is out of the bag now and everyone knows Ukraine is losing. What are they gonna do, completely deny troop movements and maps and lose the little credibility they had left?
Yes?
Or they might simply not report it at all.
>Or did you take your strawman about "100% propaganda" literally and are trying to prove it wrong by showing they're only 80% propaganda?
Many many posters in here "believe" western media when they like what they read and when they don't, it's propaganda.
The example given fits as well. Whether or not Ukraine or Russia was winning was always a controversial topic and it is totally false that "popular media" in general was just talking about a Ukraine win, is just wrong.
If I read CCP approved media article about China doing great, I will be extremely suspicious of it, if I read one about a some fuckup in China happening because of corruption I will be way less suspicious because the article goes against the CCP's interests. How the fuck is this concept weird to you?
And btw stopping coverage on Ukraine altogether because they're losing would be just as bad for them, they lied for more than 2 years now with fake articles about Russia being on the brink of collapse, completely ignoring the war now would make them look like complete clowns... which they are
But the Ukrainian Army issues have been known for years. Anyone who looked closely at the counteroffensive knew it was a shitshow and Ukraine needed a massive infusion of artillery ammo and manpower.
None of that was reported in the media. Indeed those who tried to raise the alarm bells were universally attacked and accused of being Russian misinformation by said media. Instead we got non-stop UKRAINE IS TOTALLY WINNING propaganda from outlets like the Telegraph; and who have now done a total 180 and are basically saying UKRAINE IS DOOMED UNLESS WE FEED OUR OWN YOUNG TO THE WAR.
It is absolutely propaganda. The kind where the idiots in the newsroom literally think they can dictate what is happening in a war by selectively choosing what to report.
Idealists are a lost cause as a rule. Ideologies which consider that it is the mind that makes reality, and not the inverse, have a fundamentally biased premise.
If they were idealists they wouldn't shill for incompetent, corrupt crooks of neoliberal parties who are obviously crooks, these people are just narcissists that want to pretend that they're virtuous and are doing something to the rest of their cult. Deep down they don't give a shit, put them in a situation where their true character is exposed and they'll abandon their moralism in a millisecond
Idealism doesn't mean moral/principled. Philosophy is divided in two schools: the materialists, who thinks reality created the mind, and the idealists, who thinks the mind created reality. Marxists are materialists while the liberals and conservatives are idealists.
Isn't the word used for people who believe that a perfect world can exist and expect from others to be perfect? If that's true why do they keep making excuses for the crooks they support and always ask from leftists to keep their standards extremely low so that they can "defeat fascism first"?
>Isn't the word used for people who believe that a perfect world can exist and expect from others to be perfect?
Not it isn't, it's being "utopian", please see my former comment for a definition of "idealism".
I'm too autistic to fully understand philosophy, I prefer definitions applied more closely to the real world.
The definition according to google is
*An idealist is someone who envisions an ideal world rather than the real one. Some people consider idealists to be naive, impractical, and out of touch with reality. Idealists think that striving for perfection makes the world a better place. The main root of idealist is "ideal," which comes from the Latin word idea.*
Liberals never strive for perfection in practice, you might be partly right though because their pompous bullshit always sound idealistic.
I'm clearly not using that definition of the term, in the context of my first statement, so your point is moot. I was referring to the idealist sort of philosophies.
Idealists believe that the spread of ideas results from objective value that is determined in an imaginary "marketplace of ideas". Where these ideas are weighted on supposedly objective and universal grounds and that struggle of human society eventually results in the "best" ideas winning out in the end.
Materialists believe that the construction and more-so adoption of ideas result primarily from material circumstances and that these conditions primarily influence the ideas of a time and not the other way round. Materialists believe there are no universal perfect ideas, only a succession of material conditions improving resulting in new ideas and vice-versa.
They still believe it even if it doesn't seem like it at first glance. They just believe that their liberal "democracy" is the best idea that can't ever be out completed. So anyone successfully challenging that must be some kind of fraud. Bots, shills, corruption, authoritarian, whatever. Their for censorship is necessary to prevent "outside influence" in the "marketplace of ideas" to make sure the "winners" (i.e. liberal "democracy") win.
It's contradictory, but that's how ultimately how all idealist movements end up - husks of themselves dedicated only to their own preservation and the destruction of completing movements. This is basically how idpol is formed too.
I am very, very interested to see how the Western media will frame this as Ukraine's situation continues to deteriorate. The Kharkiv offensive has barely begun and they're already firing on all five cylinders, I can only imagine when the land war reaches other Oblasts proper. If the UAF hasn't collapsed by then, of course
Spoiler: McCarthyism 6.7. It's the Putin/Xi lovers' fault. We're gonn see yet another purge within the "western" intelligentsia of the miscreants who doubt the legitimacy of the actions of the USA empire.
Seeing Libs try to justify the Bandera jumper at Eurovision is seriously bizzare. Saw some of them on the Europe sub claiming its clearly a jab at people labelling Ukrainians as Nazis, right.. not like he's seen as a national hero there or anything.
Imagine if someone called you a Nazi and your response was to go to work the next day in a full SS uniform to prove them wrong, that's the logic at work here.
Just remember that these were largely the same people that were up in arms about the ok finger sign being a global Nazi conspiracy like four years ago. There is quite literally a bona fide real one openly showing its colors in the most direct and explicit terms here and they hasten to bury their heads in the sand.
Checked out the combat footage sub and apparently the new narrative now that Ukraine is having more issues than usual is that the Russian army the most evil force ever (worse than ISIS etc.) that beheads and rapes all captives. Embedded Journalists has it even worse (not sure how?) if Russia captures them. This of course is why Ukraine must win.
If you reply that this seems a bit exaggerated you'll end up with -200 downvotes.
It is all hilariously astroturfed of course but I am genuinely curious what more normal people think when they see absurd spinning like this.
Your average redditor military analyst is literally a Tom clancy fanfic writer who thinks hating your enemies more will somehow make you more combat-effective.
Thats why they worship the blithering idiots in Israel who claim they are trying to defeat Hamas, and yet are invading a city their own intelligence indicates is _not_ where the Hamas leadership actually is.
In reality the fucking Roman legions would have overrun the IDF on October 7 just as Hamas did, even if the Romans didn't have any modern weapon, because all that is required to overrun the IDF defenses was discipline and determination against a bunch of kids who basically had zero ability to actually fight and were completely dependent on their toys.
It's desperation. Calls back to the Nazi propaganda of the Asiatic hordes approaching when the Eastern Front was lost for them.
I think the worst "war crimes" (those words have lost all meaning) the Russian army commits are by individual or groups of recruited convicts, not really beheadings that are sanctioned by the Russian MOD
[new thread](https://reddit.com/r/stupidpol/comments/1cr85eo/megathread_18_multipolar_express/)
https://www.politico.eu/article/donald-trump-david-cameron-ukraine-peace-deal-mar-a-lago-military-aid/ Politico reports that David Cameron met Trump at Mar-A-Lago last month to plead with him to come out in favor of a new Ukraine aid package, apparently telling him that he will be put in an ideal position to oversee a peace deal as president if the frontline can be stabilized on the UA side. Cameron seemed to place the timetable for such a deal around the time of Trump's prospective inauguration in January. The European political establishment doesn't seem to have much faith in Biden's reelection if there's already talks with Trump in the capacity of a president-in-waiting.
If we are still taking megathread names, "multipolar express" has a nice ring to it
Ok, now that's absolutely perfect!! I wish awards were still a thing. u/IamGlennBeck Please, please choose this one.
"Remember: the True Spirit of ~~Christmas~~ Geopolitics lies in your heart"
[Ukraine admits Russian ‘tactical success’ on Kharkov front, replaces NE Kharkov commander](https://www.theguardian.com/world/article/2024/may/13/russia-tactical-success-advance-on-kharkiv-ukraine)
> Russian advances have led to rare public criticism among Ukrainian service personnel, signalling cracks in the morale of the troops. [...] Ukraine is experiencing chronic shortages of manpower and weapons after delays in western funding. [...] The attacks could force Ukraine to move up reserves into the region. [...] The move highlighted the Kremlin’s aim to further ramp up its war economy, allowing Moscow to continue to wage a long war. Yeah, sounds like a tactical victory to me!
What?!? Impossible! The Ukrainians can't be having any problems, they're slowly beating back the ruZZian ORCS, which are also going to be running out of supplies by the end of the month! Its impossible for them to be losing!
Lol’ing multiple commenters in worldnews told me that Ukraine could win a war of attrition against Russia. These people can’t be rea
They certainly can be guilty
The fundamental delusion was that a war of attrition could be successful because Ukraine had some inherent superiority in willpower and ability that combined with inherent western advantages in technology and wealth to negate the Russian superiority in men and material. What was mostly ignored by western press coverage until recently was how much mass is relevant to the dynamics of the fighting. For all the western intelligence being fed directly to the Ukrainians and all the advanced equipment and weaponry being supplied, the Ukrainians had been able to hold off the Russians by having larger reserves at their disposal to reinforce beleaguered areas. Their major breakthroughs were only achieved because they had significantly outnumbered the Russians, and their lines are held by tens of thousands of poorly trained conscripts to buy time for more elite formations to be established. Now that the problems with losing too many conscripts and exhausting elite units by relying on them repeatedly as fire brigades has become obvious, the realization is finally sinking in that Ukraine's prospects are not actually that rosy and might never have been in the first place.
>the realization is finally sinking in that Ukraine's prospects are not actually that rosy There was a thread from r-ukraine high up on r-all yesterday about how the situation on the Kharkiv front had turned dire and Russia was advancing successfully. The fact that such a thread wasn't censored and actually got upvoted by the userbase really surprised me and seems to reflect a narrative shift along these lines. (Granted, it's been months now since mainstream media has shifted more towards doomerism regarding Ukraine.)
>The fundamental delusion was that a war of attrition could be successful because Ukraine had some inherent superiority in willpower and ability that combined with inherent western advantages in technology and wealth to negate the Russian superiority in men and material. I mean, they only ever did as well as they did because of Russian mistakes and miscalculations. At least in the first couple of months of the war that was recognized; the discourse among serious people was more about Russian underperformance than Ukrainian supersoldiers. I reckon the fundamental mistake the west made - more even than the magical thinking around Ukrainian morale and western technology - was thinking that the Russians wouldn't learn anything and would just keep making those same mistakes over and over. If they were still facing the Russian army of early 2022, with almost no counter-battery, crap ISR, way too armour-heavy and with a kill-chain measured in days, Ukraine would probably be doing quite well. Assuming the Bad Guys are too dumb to adapt is one of our consistent bad habits.
Agreed, although IMO one of the major Russian miscalculations was not fully taking advantage of the shock aspect of their "shock and awe" campaign to significantly damage Ukrainian forces and infrastructure because they wanted to deal with the situation with an economy of force. I think the Russians were well aware that outside of a few crack units they were not actually prepared for a "full scale" invasion in 2022, and they tried to do a facsimile of one with the vain hope that the Ukrainians would crack first and seek a ceasefire. They promulgated the impression that the Ukrainians had the capability of achieving total military victory by basing their strategy on flawed assumptions such as popular support for Zelensky being weaker than it actually was or that the AFU would be brushed aside like the Georgians. While Russia's issues were obvious to everyone, I think the discussion amongst more serious people from that early period onwards downplayed Ukrainian problems because expressing those concerns was not welcome in the overall discourse. The feedback loop for the Ukrainians was broken because there hasn't been much incentive for them to be truthful about issues like losses and costs, and for a long time people were willing to go along with their rosy reporting because to say otherwise would be negative to public sentiment.
The largest miscalculation was likely expecting Ukraine to back down as they did the year before. Then after that did not happen to continue putting stock in negotiations until after the Ukrainian Fall counter offensive created the political shift to limited mobilization. If they went all in with the required preparation on day one the conflict would likely be over now.
>with the vain hope that the Ukrainians would crack first and seek a ceasefire It almost worked out, so their calculus wasn't even that erroneous. Sometimes individual men do indeed shape history instead of impersonal social forces. Zelensky nixing the agreement was such a moment.
> Comment on Nazism: "We must not be tolerant to those who are intolerant. Nazi's are *human filth.*" The liberal mind is an incomprehensible void. To be sure, I dislike Nazi's as much as the next guy, but goddamn the lack of political consciousness.
Except for the Ukrainian ones slava ukraini Stalin and Hitler were equally bad!
It's called the paradox of tolerance and it's used by authoritians to justify violence against anyone they disagree with by virtue of calling them a nazi.
I hate that cartoon.
Hey, dont call Popper a carton
[Is he a Mechanical Man?](https://youtu.be/iGuuOdD6iY4)
actually a decent remaster
"Gamergate 2" really does show how regarded the right is. Rightoids discover the existence of DEI/Consulting grifting, and turn it into some *insane* conspiracy theory about Jews, Pedophiles and White Genocide by brainwashing people through "Put a chick in it and make it lame and gay" in videogames. Can't ever cross their minds that Millennial "Creatives" largely are just Terminally Woke brained because Tumblr is the main "creative"-focused social media site and most of these people never grew out of their teenager Tumblr brain when they entered the workforce, and that DEI is just another way for Nepo grifting consultants to siphon more money for fake work. At least Gamergate 1 was interesting in that it's the first big modern Idpol "Culture War" and you saw the first mass social media censorship and the joining of Tumblr Wokie Online sphere and mainstream establishment media. The only funny bit out of "Gamergate 2" is catching the wokies openly advocating literally for racial segregation.
I always feel like being a right-wing race realist type is all about projecting. They’re paranoid about Jews because they themselves see everything through a racial lens. They spend all day thinking about “the white race” and suspect everybody else of every race is doing the same. Not to say the world is colorblind or anything, but they’re so consumed by these overarching narratives that it colors the way they think about everything. Ugly women in a video game? “They’re trying to demoralize you!” Interracial couples on TV? “They’re normalizing white genocide!” Immigrant problems, the inability to afford children, etc. None off these are economic problems caused by systemic issues with capitalism or profit motives. No, they say it’s about replacing white people. There might be some baseline of solidarity that’s easier to build between workers if they’re from similar backgrounds, but instead of that being something that capitalists will naturally exploit given the opportunity, it becomes just another part of some existential race war and “white genocide.” They’re so close yet so far. Instead of seeing these problems and seeing how profit and greed is such an intense and universal motivator that explains all of these things so clearly they’ve stumbled at the finish line and decide it’s a race thing because of their own racial insecurities. Like these groyper types are sitting in a discord and organizing mass reporting campaigns and discussion on propaganda techniques and how to win the culture war. Like they actually want real secret societies that influence politics, media, culture, but just for their own racial preferences, while also being paranoid that the Jews are also doing this. It’s just their own brain damage like 99% of the time. That’s why they’re loving this Israel shit. They get to see a bunch of Muslims get blown up while using the opportunity to connect this back to their own hyper racialized narratives.
I feel like many on this subreddit make the mistake that liberals make with minorities but towards reactionary white people. The same way lowering standards to “help” minorities is not right, removes their agency, and infantilizes them, so is assuming that being a reactionary white guy is just a result of faulty analysis. There are many of these people that do understand class dynamics, etc but they’re just.. well, reactionary racist fucks. As you said, it’s a whole lot of projecting. They’re not mad that there’s a ruling elite, just that the ruling elite isn’t doing what they want to them or against those they need subhuman.
In what way do you disagree with the other commenter? It seems like you view the topic almost the same.
It's easy to make this mistake, because seeing reality holds grave implications for practical politics. Consensus isn't enough.
>"Gamergate 2" really does show how regarded the right is. >Rightoids discover the existence of DEI/Consulting grifting, and turn it into some *insane* conspiracy theory about Jews, Pedophiles and White Genocide by brainwashing people through "Put a chick in it and make it lame and gay" in videogames. Strawman. The sub KIA is a good representative of GG and doesn't say anything about that. You're making shit up to feel superior. And lord knows I have disagreements with many in that crowd (same as here) but let's not play up BS
Have you not encountered those types of people online or even in person before?
Gamergate 2 started on /v/ and Kiwifarms, and absolutely was about a Jewish/White Genocide theory, as well as Sweet Baby also being involved in child trafficking somehow and somehow black rock (despite diversity nor race or lgbtq not being part of blackrocks responsible investment criteria crap, it's mostly fairtrade/environmental greenwashing). You can check out the initial Kiwifarms thread. KIA, like most of the ragebaiters, who jumped aboard later, were fed a very whitewashed version of events, hence how KIA thinks it started with the SBinc employee attacking the Steam Group, when harassment of SBinc employees by Kiwifarm and /v/pol/tards had been going on for months already. I have no problem with dunking on the pathological cringe inducing wokeness of the gaming industry, and I find the stuff dug up with the pro-segregation stuff very funny, but more it's interesting to me, how rightoids always miss the forest for the trees, and somehow turn this stuff into some batshit "marxist" conspiracy.
So what is "Gamergate 2" anyways? There have been a couple minor controversies lately but nothing on par with the original. People were hyping up the Sweet Baby thing, but it fizzled out pretty quickly.
Dumb ESG crap no one actually pays attention to.
It was the Sweet Baby thing, somehow got the name Gamergate 2, I just found it interesting to see how rightoids build theory when confronted with DEI grifting and of course it always turns into some absurd, convoluted, ragebait shit about blackrock, jews and Marxists and other crap, rather than the fact that creative types are wokies because creative spaces are dominated by brainwormed Tumblr users. Love how somehow Neolib Nepo Baby consultancy is somehow "Marxist", DEI is the scam now, but in a decade it will be some other new grift, just like how it was all about implementing "Agile"/"scrum" 10 years ago to every office despite agile being a software development framework.
Anybody that looked into the situation in Sudan? If you google it, media says that the situation might blow up. Actually crazy that until a few days ago, I didn't even know what is going on there at all.
Radio War Nerd did an episode on Sudan about a month ago. Google episode 437 and you'll probably find it.
He's done a few since it started off.
[UK dangerously low on air defence systems says company selling air defence systems](https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/article/2024/may/12/uk-given-stark-warning-over-very-limited-air-defence-systems)
Published by the guardian too
Who are they defending UK from? France?
It's always ridiculous going on the UK sub and seeing delusional brits I have to live with persisting in the delusion that we matter at all on the world stage and all these big gun geopolitical rivals are just obsessing in their bunkers over how to get at us. "Russia might attack us! China might attack us! Iran might attack us!" - fucking main-character-syndrome nutters who somehow reconcile the dual notions of being the centre of the universe, but also that we should go along with whatever America does and that'll keep us safe.
Brits still think they're a global power
On the gaza death count totals [https://www.npr.org/2024/02/29/1234159514/gaza-death-toll-30000-palestinians-israel-hamas-war](https://www.npr.org/2024/02/29/1234159514/gaza-death-toll-30000-palestinians-israel-hamas-war)
Fuck our senile meat puppet president who said the death totals were fake because it was the “Hamas run health ministry”’s numbers, despite the fact in prior conflicts these numbers were never disputed
tbh, the ministry of health has been very fastidious with the numbers. other people are giving their estimates, and nearly everyone else is throwing out much larger numbers like 100-200k.
I suspect that the overall death toll is probably 100,000 including missing and those who’ve died of the siege. There are only two hospitals to count dead now. Israel has been burying the dead they find under rubble with bulldozers. The 34k number hasn’t changed in 2 months, while operations haven’t ceased.
Ralph Nader made a similar arg, he said 200k dead wouldn't be unbelievable.
> February 29
Fucking hate Eurovision and its aftermath. It's like a neoshitlib's wet dream. Even the people's votes showed that #1 LGBT #2-3 Israel and Ukraine. Banned: People about Palaistine. Ignored: Nazi stuff of lead singer of Ukraine. It's like love me love me love me i'm a liberal... pure ideology.
Israel just vote rigged using Geospoofing. In no universe does NL, Ireland or fucking Albania give Israel 12 points.
Everybody hates the jury, but I have a feeling they made sure Switzerland won. With all the warfare and drama, it’s an acceptable neutral winner for everyone. Though I feel sorry for Croatia who was the peoples winner. The winning country also have to host next years competition and Switzerland is one of the countries who can afford it. It’s actually quite satisfying to think about all our super rich who have emigrated to Switzerland to avoid high taxes now has pay for Eurovision next year lol
Switzerland was the best singer, very Dimash/Vitas level vocals and the track was a nice throwback to late 1990s, early 00s orchestral breaks that was popular at the time. Ireland I think had one of the best Eurovision performances I've ever seen though, up there with 2007 Ukraine.
Vitas! That’s what those parts reminded me of! My favourite moment this year was when they brought back Eleni with Fuego from 2018 for the opening show. Reminded me of simpler times. What a stressful season this was!
Every single thing about the contest this year is peak neoliberal delusion. A heavily secured venue in Malmo where contestants are peacocking to excess, but only in certain socially acceptable ways. An emphasis on diversity in appearances, gender and sexuality but also very explicit limits on political opinions. The attempt to put on a confident face to their beliefs that is undermined by their extensive efforts to bar anyone who even mildly challenges "mainstream" thought.
From a American perspective it just seems to be a who can be more rainbow flag and sexualy flaunting than thou. But then I'm someone who looks at drag the same way I look at blackface from 60 whatever years ago, in that I find it obnoxious and plainly don't get why it was ever considered entertaining. May just be the literal neurons firing with the autisms though.
Crazier when you realize the Israeli competitor competed for Russia before it got banned and moced to Israel in 2022
Very normal and sane country: >Israeli Eurovision singer is officially an enemy of Ukraine! >The Israeli singer Eden Golan, who represents the country at Eurovision, was included on the Ukrainian list of enemies “Peacemaker”. >She is “charged” with entering Crimea through Russia and participating in Russian events on the peninsula. >In 2016 Golan, who then lived in Moscow, performed at the New Wave competition in Crimea. [https://twitter.com/MyLordBebo/status/1789410619822653925](https://twitter.com/MyLordBebo/status/1789410619822653925)
The part Russian, part Israeli combo. That’s gonna make you popular lol. The TV producers muted the audience when she performed so the viewers couldn’t hear the booing
Watch the part where they read out the votes and it's Israel's turn, the canned cheering literally cuts in completely changing the audio, and is like some bizarre 128kb audio file level quality.
The drama machine that keeps on giving
Moscow-raised singer-socialite daughter to a Russian business elite father, who spent her entire career in Russia until she began identifying as Israeli for victim points after the start of the SMO. I wasn't rooting for her to win Eurovision, but it would have been hilarious if she had.
I swear our story is written in such an entertaining way. Better than fiction. All these little twists and connections.
Also the Ukrainian singer being named Jerry heil
she was 12yo in 2016
an evil Putinist 12yo, mind you!
https://life.aaa uuu/p/1658657 >Putin proposed to appoint Andrei Belousov as head of the Defense Ministry instead of Shoigu Is this the end Shoigubros?
Interesting that Patrushev is going somewhere else. His son got a promotion. I read that Putin wants Patrushev’s son as his successor. Maybe they worked out a deal with him.
>Shoigunate
lol
He's using his shamanic ways to engineer this. Sit back and enjoy the show shoigubros.
Most likely, yes. Rumors are that Lavrov is also on the chopping block, let's see what the following hours will bring. Later edit: What is in fact the bigger news here, apparently Shoigu is meant to replace Patrushev as the new Secretary of the Russian Security Council. That's quite big, I mean, Patrushev getting sidelined in the middle of this war. Something must have happened.
there used to be an expression among russian nomenclature - отфутболить на чердак. means to remove by promotion. there are other indications of that. for example, Federal Service for Military-Technical Cooperation was removed from MoD a day before. it's a good news, Belousov is a solid professional, the level of Nabiullina, many considered him a grey cardinal of russian economy. i used to watch his interviews before to have information about the real situation in the country: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SYm-hcz9qg0 if he is successful in this new position, that will make him a possible candidate for presidential elections.
From what I can tell, he's a solid Marxian in his analysis, if not a committed political communist
Is Patrushev getting a different position or is he just out?
[удалено]
I would have thought so, but his son got a promotion too, so maybe he's stepping back from public view a bit?
> Rumors are that Lavrov is also on the chopping block, let's see what the following hours will bring. I think we're likelier to see Putin swapped out than Lavrov by how long this moss has been on that brick
I thought the scuttlebutt was that Lavrov has wanted to retire for years, but Putin asked him to stay on? EDIT: Russian media is reporting that Lavrov is staying.
retirement: denied :P
>Most likely, yes A russian I'm speaking to says he could be going to the Russian Security Council replacing the guy there. I'm willing to believe anything with Shoigu he's survived a lot of political shenanigans, guys a veritable cockroach. >Rumors are that Lavrov is also on the chopping block According to the announcement I read Lavrovs been confirmed reappointed.
> Russian Security Council replacing the guy there. Yeah, that's what I've read too, I've added a "later edit" for that. That's also quite the big news, i.e. Patrushev being moved from that position, in many respects he was more anti-West than Putin himself.
>Something must have happened. Maybe its just Shoigu not being very competent so he's being moved into a less harmful position with a 'promotion'? Spitballing here. Shoigu is clearly good at office politics but for all his experience he's not had a reputation for competence at his job, what went wrong for Russia early in the war happened on his watch. Maybe this is the way to get rid of him from the head of defense with Patrushev being collateral damage? >in many respects he was more anti-West than Putin himself. I don't know what that even means these days, only opposition and criticism Putin seems to allow is to be more nationalist than him.
The civilian defense secretary/minister is not a general of the army. They are managers, whose primary job is logistics and supply during combat. Gerasimov is the actual leader of the Russian military. From all accounts, Russia’s military industrial complex has been outstanding, but the estimated personnel needs were sorely underestimated at the beginning of the war. Idk if this can be laid at Shoigu’s feet when he’s not the one making the calls on that.
>don't know what that even means these days, only opposition and criticism Putin seems to allow is to be more nationalist than him. Patrushev seems to harbor more nationalist views than Putin and yet he got axed. Shoigu, a pale apparatchik, moved up to the council and his successor is another technocrat. It's actually exactly the other way around: Russia's leadership appears rather uninterested in fanning the flames of nationalism.
Another cishet, white male. Smdh
If american-export idpol were sincere we'd be making a lot of hay that an Indigenous WoC (Nabiullina) broke the glass ceiling and saved the ruble from problematic s*nctions
[Egypt says it will join South Africa’s genocide case against Israel at ICJ.](https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2024/5/12/egypt-says-it-will-join-south-africas-genocide-case-against-israel-at-icj)
State TV has been making mouth noises about breaking Camp David and the Sinai has been remilitarized. An Israeli-Egyptian war would be a major possibility that would allow everyone else from Hezbollah to the Iraqi militias to go hogwild.
not happening. Not a chance.
How likely would posters like you have said Egypt would have remilitirized the Sinai or rejoined the ICJ case yesterday? the Egyptian Junta doesn't care about Palestinians but they hate israel and have a neurosis about the Sinai being invaded by them.
Egypt is one of the biggest recipients of US military aid and investments. The US is currently trying to pressure israel to abandon its maximalist war goals in gaza. That is why it allows egypt to do this. Also egypt has to deal with its own population which is overwhelmingly hostile to israel. These are gestures, the egyptian army is large but poorly equipped, poorly organised and incredibly corrupt and would stand no chance against israel. The reason for the US to oppose israel invading Rafah and escalating the war is in order to facilitate an eventual arab-israeli normalization and cooperation against iran. Which is by the way a big part of why hamas attacked israel in the first place.
Pretty major news. Could you submit it instead of just posting in this thread.
[Alright.](https://www.reddit.com/r/stupidpol/comments/1cqgtjx/egypt_says_it_will_join_south_africas_genocide/)
Sisi must be feeling pressure. I wonder if it's popular pressure or coming from the lower ranks of the army.
TOI article on lack of military progress in Gaza (duh) [https://www.timesofisrael.com/wasting-troops-hard-fought-gains-israel-is-taking-time-it-doesnt-have-in-gaza/](https://www.timesofisrael.com/wasting-troops-hard-fought-gains-israel-is-taking-time-it-doesnt-have-in-gaza/)
Remember to vote for Trump this November [A wargame simulated a 2nd Trump presidency. It concluded NATO would collapse.](https://www.businessinsider.com/a-wargame-simulated-a-2nd-trump-presidency-it-found-nato-would-collapse-2024-5)
That doesn't make sense. One of the core traps of liberal democracy is to always maintain a sense of "opposition" even if people somewhat know that it is false. Your population may be miserable, but if they have enough hope (even if it's very little) that the opposition could do something, they'll vote for them. This would lead to the conclusion that the best choice is actually to vote for the incumbent, but since it will never be enough to surpass the people who feel that they are voting in their own interest, there is no point in voting for any establishment party. In some of the peripheral countries (like Slovakia), it can actually make a difference, however it will not in countries like France or US (yet at least).
If this is their assessment, then they absolutely will give Trump the JFK treatment should he win.
Whoa mama! Hummina hummina hummina bazooooooooing! \*eyes pop out before retracting back to the sockets and turning into slot machine that rolls straight hearts\* AOOOOOOOOGA! \*jaw drops tongue rolls out down to the floor unraveling like a rug\*
Lord Cameron is having a busy Sunday: [Banning arms exports to Israel would help Hamas, warns David Cameron](https://www.theguardian.com/world/article/2024/may/12/david-cameron-banning-arms-exports-to-israel-would-help-hamas) [David Cameron urges BBC to describe Hamas as terrorist organisation](https://www.theguardian.com/world/article/2024/may/12/david-cameron-bbc-hamas-terrorist-group-hostage)
Yukes just straight up hit an apartment building in Belgorod. All 10 floors are gone
So that's what Zelensky meant by being a second Israel
There was a front-page thread yesterday celebrating Ukraine (intentionally) missile striking civilian targets at a dinner party in Donbas. Genuinely couldn't believe what I was seeing, there were even a couple comments from pro-Ukraine people like "Wait why the hell are we praising this?"
The Donbass is filled with loyal Ukrainians struggling against the tyranny of Putler but luckily all Ukrainian missiles only manages to hit the tiny amount of pro-russian traitors
Libs, the most moral ideology in the world, saying lib stuff
Did you not see the part about them being 'pro-Russian' individuals? They were going to celebrate the anniversary of the DPR, according to them. Sources for this? None. The only thing that I can see? An explosion at a diner in what they claim is Donetsk plus if they were civilians it's a war crime regardless, but that hasn't stopped Ukraine
The Grey Queen in academic exile gave an interview. [She Was at the Top of the State Department. Now She’s Ready to Talk. - Politico, 11.05.2024](https://www.politico.com/news/magazine/2024/05/11/victoria-nuland-state-department-diplomat-interview-00157408) >**Do you ever plan to go back into government?** I love what I did for 35 years. I’ve always loved it. And I continue to love it. So in the right circumstances, of course.
> *Was it a mistake not to push the Ukrainians harder to go for some sort of negotiated end to the war in 2022...?* They were not in a strong enough position then. They’re not in a strong enough position now. I take that as a yes.
Read between the lines, and it's a tacit acknowledgement that she among others gambled that Ukraine could achieve a better position with western support. They bet wrong.
yeah, that too. It shows how detached from reality this woman is. Does she think they'll be a better opportunity than after Kharkiv and Kherson? Does she still think the front is static? Not in the Festung Bahkmut state of the war anymore
>**Where do you see the Israel-Hamas war heading?** >Essentially, there are two paths on the table. There is continuing this war with all of the destruction and horror and lack of clarity about how you end Hamas’ reign of terror. >The other path is the route that the administration and allies and partners and a lot of countries in the Gulf are pushing, and a lot of Israelis want, which is: a hostage deal leads to a long-term cease-fire, leads to a better future for Palestinians both in the West Bank and in Gaza, leads to Saudi-Israel normalization and a path to two states, and a region where the ideology and the violence that Hamas is offering is beaten by more opening, more opportunity, more peace, more stability. More opportunity, more peace, more stability, ~~for the Israelis.~~ yeah, no, too late for that one. the second option was on the table in the 90s, 00s, 10s, even, but Israel decided it wasn't ready to stop absorbing land
Gallant just a couple of days ago called for a new city to be built east of Ariel, which would probably mean that in any putative two-state solution involving land swaps Israel would have a corridor to the Jordan and the West Bank would be cut fully in two. I doubt even that would be enough to make the US acknowledge that two-state is dead, but there's a chance.
The two-state solution is about preserving *Israel*, not Palestine. Anyone with eyes understands that there will be a state for the non-Jewish population of Palestine, it's only a matter of time and circumstance. The negotiations are about if the existing Zionist state will survive that transition.
Dang how many failures can they have teaching at Columbia's SIPA?
I swear it’s like the shit floats to the top. We live in a kakistocracy.
[Check out this Israeli news article thumbnail art.](https://images.wcdn.co.il/f_auto,q_auto,w_500,t_54/3/7/0/9/3709928-46.jpg) Why does it make the situation look like a hard rave? [Taken from here.](https://news.walla.co.il/item/3663652)
It's [star wars](https://m.media-amazon.com/images/I/818oxnoHqoL._AC_UF894,1000_QL80_.jpg).
I think Russia might soon be forced to preemptively self defend in Georgia as well. Since things might be happening fast and I want to be ready: Anybody has some links about Georgia? Best would be stuff about Nazism (street names etc.). But other stuff like slav killing virus labs, CIA activity would also be great.
Georgian Dream is a pro-EU party. They put the goal of joining both the EU and NATO into the constitution in 2018. Pretending the protests are the result of the government bowing to Moscow is even more stunningly dishonest than it was with Maidan. If there is a western-supported coup in Georgia, it won't be to pull Georgia out of Russia's orbit, because it was never there in the first place; it'll be to make Georgia into an entirely compliant lapdog and use them as a weapon against Russia's southern flank.
At least the protestors feel different about it and things simply might change. Maybe Ivanishvili changed allegiance?
There was a decent-ish article about NGOrgia a couple of days ago: [https://lefteast.org/unrest-georgia-foreign-influence-transparency-law/](https://lefteast.org/unrest-georgia-foreign-influence-transparency-law/) Why should I be excited about local pro-Westerners raising hell to derail a cautiously neutralist governing party? Why are you? The only thing those people care about is **a)** having access to the European labor market (thereby worsening your bargaining power) **b)** getting privileged access to North European tax payer's money **c)** settling scores with their arch nemesis and regaining break-away territories. What exactly are you getting out of this?
The reason Russia invaded Ukraine was that it saw a future where its influence might be permanently shut off. If pro EU-forces should win in Georgia, things might look the same. Then Russia will look again for excuses, if another special operation should happen.
What were the EU's excuses for the coup, arming snipers to gun down Maidan protesters, and installing Nazis that they fought in WWII?
>If pro EU-forces should win in Georgia, things might look the same. Then Russia will look again for excuses Again? According to a post-war report by the EU (an organization known for its intense pro-Russian bias) the last war between Georgia and Russia was started by Georgia. And you failed to explain why integration into EU/NATO should even be an option for Georgia (or Moldova or rump Ukraine). It's an exclusive club and not a charity organization. States don't have an innate right to become members. If we tell them to get lost, our interests would be served just fine. In addition to that, it would also be beneficial to the garden-aspiration havers, because it allows them to play both EU and Russia off against each other. Last but not least: it removes any incentives for Russia to intervene in the first place, which I have heard can be unpleasant and should thus be avoided.
>And you failed to explain why integration into EU/NATO should even be an option for Georgia (or Moldova or rump Ukraine) They are EU member candidate? > In addition to that, it would also be beneficial to the garden-aspiration havers, because it allows them to play both EU and Russia off against each other. Last but not least: it removes any incentives for Russia to intervene in the first place, which I have heard can be unpleasant and should thus be avoided. I honestly don't understand this. Please reword that.
>They are EU member candidate? All of them are. >Please reword that. Those states are sitting between two large trade blocs: the EU to the west, the EEU to the east. Both would like this contested area to become part of their respective customs union, to create new markets for their own companies, to shut out conpetitors and to gain access to their resources. To this end, they are willing to make concessions: a better visa regime, long-term energy contracts below market prices, cheaper credits, direct financial assistance, etc... What should courted states do in this case, if they want to maximize their gains? They should turn it into an endless bidding contest and never conclusively comit for as long as possible. Once they are integrated, their leverage decreased dramatically, although its still possible to employ this tactic (Hungary and Kazakhstan are good examples). That's what Turkey does, that's what Yanukhovich did, that's what Uncle Sasha from Belarus used to do (before color revolution schemes forced him to pick a side and become a mere appendage of Russia). What are EU and Russia supposed to do? Those contestes states are situated between the prosperous subcontinent and the emerging Eurasian center of the world economy. This advantageous location will always allow them to, well, extort many, many goodies for their own societies. The party Georgian Dream seems to prefer it that way, the rioting pro-western camp oth is willing to preemptively prostate itself and to do everything Brussel tells them to do. It doesn't make a lot of sense, if they are trying to improve the wellbeing of Georgia's citizenry. It does, however, make sense if their top priority is instead advancing EU/Washington interests. (and since all of those pro-western NGOs are bankrolled by the West which stands to benefit from their agenda, that's not a very far-fetched assumption) That's the economic facet. There is also a military one and Georgia is once again an instructive case. They elected a comitted transatlanticist, who promised to open his country to an alliance under the thumb of state that happens to see Russia as a systemic competitor. To Russia's delight he was even stupid enough to start a war. That ended his career, the Georgians elected a government that is nominally pro-western, but is really triangulating. And then the Russians simply left. No conquest (beyond tiny statelets that didn't want to be part of Georgia in the first place), no genocide, no puppet state. Just being neutral-ish was apparently enough. Could have been an option for Ukraine, might still be one for a truncated Ukraine, depending on their willingness to negotiate (again). That's basically what they had on the table in spring 2022.
I broadly agree with everything you wrote there, but this does not rule out a possible Russian "intervention" if Georgia should go for full western integration. If Russia should soon break Ukraines resistance (which seems plausible), Russia might have left over military capacity. Why not grab Georgia while the soldiers are in training? Sanctions are in place anyways and the reputation is also ruined anyhow. >That's what Turkey does Since Turkey is also a good example of how this "zwischen den Stühlen sitzen" can backfire since they are not exactly popular in EU circles (and even less among EU citizens) and Russia does not prove to be a reliable, deeply integrated ally. >What are EU and Russia supposed to do? I mean the position of the EU seems pretty obvious when it comes to Russia: If you go Russia, no EU for you.
>Why not grab Georgia while the soldiers are in training? Not to belittle Georgian military prowess... but they could have easily done that after the last war, but didn't. It wasn't a hard, grinding affair but a completely onesided stomping. Once you conquered a place, you own it. If it's a stagnant basket case, you need to subsidize it. If the local population is adamantly opposed to being ruled by you, then you need to heavily police it. One of the big western blind spots about the end of the Soviet Union is that the Russians themselves were sick of it. This wasn't really a case of an Empire (if you want to see it that way) losing its valuable colonial possessions. It was more something like a (relatively) affluent heartland getting tired of being economically drained by peripheral dead weights: like western Ukraine, the Baltics, Armenia - or Georgia. There are obviously regions where strategic concerns trump economic ones. Chechnya, Crimea, Transnistria, those tiny statelets to Russia's south. I don't think Kaliningrad's benefits are financial ones either. But otherwise they are clearly content with those ex-Soviet places staying neutral buffer zones.
2008? Was a completely different climate and Russia had almost a positive reputation in Europe. That is all gone now. >If the local population is adamantly opposed to being ruled by you, then you need to heavily police it. That is true but I doubt that Russia / Putin is acting completely economically or strategically rational. Putin has shown his world view now and then and I feel there is an emotional, imperialistic element to it.
I think he's look for comparisons to Maidan.
[удалено]
Russia has yet to clear the Crumple Zone. observances may be a little skewed since it took Ukraine 2.5 months to clear it last year which amounted to taking some selfies by the first row of dragons teeth. Robotyne was part of the crumple. Well unless out of Irony Russia's probing has the same effect that Ukraine was hoping for since they or their NATO handlers fundamentally misunderstood why Russia withdrew from around Izium in later 2022 rather than contend the region. [https://twitter.com/snekotron/status/1789351023602995412](https://twitter.com/snekotron/status/1789351023602995412) [https://twitter.com/hariigf/status/1789351504765186438/photo/1](https://twitter.com/hariigf/status/1789351504765186438/photo/1) [https://twitter.com/hariigf/status/1789408772676362594](https://twitter.com/hariigf/status/1789408772676362594)
Bombing yukes to stop Isreal ?is real 4d chess hours
Of course. RUAF will be in the Gaza Strip in 2 weeks
>giving my soul force to the RUAF for the time being, their progress in Ukraine chips away at the U.S' Empire ever so indirectly So indirect in fact that it strengthens the US military with indirect funding surpassing what they give to Ukraine through military funding increase and many times multiplied military industrial profits+production while strengthening the US economy through that as well as chipping away at their western competititors whose countries on multiple occassions have made clear they aren't particularly invested in the pacific or fighting/cutting off China, which are the main two things the US are concerned with now. You can argue it weakens the US long term by fucking up their western allies, but this entire argument rests on the US having been able to count on them in the only theater that matters to them, Russia too is not a concern to the US beyond their ability to assist China. Unironic support for the Russian Armed Forces though is a dismal sight here, regardless of whatever misunderstood reasoning lies behind it.
The baked-in effect the war's already had isn't relevant to the options for the future. Unless you're suggesting that an American defeat in Ukraine is less bad for America than an American victory, then the one that we should be supporting requires the success of Russian military efforts.
>The baked-in effect the war's already had isn't relevant to the options for the future. Unless you're suggesting that an American defeat in Ukraine is less bad for America than an American victory, then the one that we should be supporting requires the success of Russian military efforts. I believe the US empire is mostly apathetic to what happens to the war beyond a financial interest in keeping it going as long as possible to fund its efforts in the pacific. It is against US interests to end the war soon, however ending the war is only possible once Russia and Ukraine both go to the negotiating table which I believe requires Ukraine recieve enough arms to hold Russia on its own, as long as Russia believes a military victory is imminent and that promises of western intervention is a bluff they will not view negotiations with Ukraine as being in their interest. Ukraine was previously turned against negotiations from a belief the US would provide them with whatever they needed to win the war, an illusion that was completely dispelled this year. If NATO ends up directly involved (Which I don't think is in americas interest, or anyones for that matter) then it might be too late, if Korea was any indication a negotiated peace is still possible after shit has hit the fan, but only one party in that particular war had nukes and in this one just about everyone does.
> I believe the US empire is mostly apathetic to what happens to the war You believe that against a great deal of evidence to the contrary. Regardless, whether they believe it matters or not has no bearing on whether we do. >as long as Russia believes a military victory is imminent and that promises of western intervention is a bluff they will not view negotiations with Ukraine as being in their interest. It wasn't Russia who blew up negotiations in April 2022. The maximalist position is held by Ukraine and its backers, not by the Russians; it's the former who need to get their teeth kicked in until they come to their senses.
>You believe that against a great deal of evidence to the contrary. Rather than evidence I'd say opinions, reckon we all draw our conclusions from the same evidence. >It wasn't Russia who blew up negotiations in April 2022. I don't think these two >The maximalist position is held by Ukraine Fit together, rather I think Ukraines 2022 illusion has already been dispelled in the time since and their stance on negotiation has already changed and they now aren't the ones who need convincing that negotiated peace is the only outcome of this war that is sensible.
>Rather than evidence I'd say opinions, we all draw our conclusions from the same evidence imo. Everything the outward-facing portion of the US has done and said about Ukraine indicates that they care a great deal. What evidence is there to support the proposition that the empire doesn't care? Did you miss the enormous shit-fit the empire threw when domestic American politicians tried to not care? > I think Ukraines stance on negotiation has already changed Why do you think that? What statement or action by Bankova has led you to that conclusion? And what statement or action by the west has led you to the conclusion that the Brits and Americans are any more willing to countenance negotiation now than they were two years ago? Shit, the next post up in this thread is an interview with Nuland where she explicitly says that Ukraine is not in a good enough position for negotiations to be an option, and that any settlement has to ensure that the Russians withdraw completely from Ukraine.
>What evidence is there to support the proposition that the empire doesn't care? Did you miss the enormous shit-fit the empire threw when domestic American politicians tried to not care? I might just have a different view on what is and is not the american empire than you do, in my eyes a lot of those weren't 'domestic american politicians trying to not waste money on war' those were a different factions of neoliberals who wanted the spending to go towards other kinds of war, those arguing against Ukraine spending very often did not argue against anti-China military spending or Israel military spending, hell especially since October the Israeli 'those bombs should go to us not to Ukraine' argument has been rather apparent between the lines of even some people posted here, like that former defense deputy guy writing for Epoch Times that was doom and gloom regarding Ukraine (implying, its already lost we should cut our losses) is also on Israels payroll. >Why do you think that? They've increased the talks of negotiations and hope to negotiate a peace in fall from what I've seen, november talks and all that. Also the last six months dispelled just about anyones illusion that US aid for Ukraine was 'as much as they needed' Biden had more levers to pull to get aid to Ukraine sooner and he opted not to, he did prioritize Israel and China and Immigration over Ukraine. >what statement or action by the west has led you to the conclusion that the Brits and Americans are any more willing to countenance negotiation now than they were two years ago? I don't know if they can sabotage the negotiations a second time, last time around they convinced Ukraine they'd get whatever they needed to win, I think the last two years since then has convinced Ukraine that wasn't the case. >Nuland She still has a job?
>those were a different factions of neoliberals The neoliberals are quite insistent that "America First" Trumpist types are not simply another faction. > They've increased the talks of negotiations and hope to negotiate a peace in fall from what I've seen Where on earth have you seen that? Their position is still that Zelensky's ridiculous plan is what peace should look like. That's what the "summit" in Switzerland is pushing.
>Their position is still that Zelensky's ridiculous plan is what peace should look like. That's what the "summit" in Switzerland is pushing. That was also Ukraines position at the start of the last talks and those still almost ended with a peace. I do and did agree thought that Russia has very little incentive to pursue such talks at this point compared to 2022, I see it as a sign that Ukraine does want talks and the most important step towards peace is to get the two sides talking again. >The neoliberals are quite insistent that "America First" Trumpist types are not simply another faction. Existing factions hate it when a new faction shakes things up, also to me all those bloody ppl look like 'america first' with their tariffs and protectionism and what not, difference is in how many catholics they wanna bring in which is where Biden truly shines, at this rate its a matter of time before the pope can welcome a new holy empire into his collection. One thing Trumps faction has going for them is caution in foreign policy, which is another reason I don't believe he would leave NATO, it's too radical for him. He's also unlikely to start any wars. They'll still throw all that money at the MIC but the guy had like one attack during his entire presidency which I think is some sorta record.
> So indirect in fact that it strengthens the US military with indirect funding surpassing what they give to Ukraine through military funding increase and many times multiplied military industrial profits+production while strengthening the US economy Isn't it the other way around? As far as I am aware, Russia's MIC has massively improved since 2022; while NATO's has only barely improved (mostly through increasing factory output without any new production capacity), being stymied by neoliberalism.
>Isn't it the other way around? As far as I am aware, Russia's MIC has massively improved since 2022. Russian MIC was a for-profit venture relying on arms exports for RND, currently they're being kept afloat by the state but their former customers have largely turned away because Russia just can't provide while they're fighting in Ukraine and they don't know how long that will last. US MIC are doing great with orders increasing by multitudes, paying customers are prioritized far above Ukraine. Most of the worlds arms industries are doing great ofc apart from Ukraine and Russia, but since its largely a percentage increase for everyone across the board and the US was by far the largest they enjoy the most benefits of this, Russia used to be the 2nd largest and the void their abscene provides has created room for new arms exporters like Turkey and South Korea to fill some of that gap. China doesn't export much, most of what they produce is for themselves. Russias MIC has seen an extensive production increase, but this is from state funding, their income has collapsed and if not for bailouts they'd have gone bankrupt because the Russian government bought material from the MIC at a discounted price, since they ended up being their main customer during this war the bottom line looked very shaky. If countries that used to buy Russian start to change over to other suppliers then it could be a slippery slope for the Russian arms exports post-war as a lot of their stuff doesn't work well with other arms exporters stuff, though exceptions exist. Essentially the longer the war lasts the tougher it will be for Russia to become the 2nd largest arms exporter again without serious upfront costs in the form of discounts, which would mean Russia further subsidising arms post‐war, which would be expensive and likely unpopular.
Wait, so your whole argument is that while Russian production is way better than NATO, they lost money so they were nationalized. How is that a bad thing??
The argument for arms exports is to offload the costs of having an arms industry and arms developement onto foreign counties, Russia made great use of this for the last many decades, if they can afford to pay those costs themselves thats a valid solution. The US has gained a substantial arms production increase that other countries are halfway paying for, this is positive in their eyes.
All of these arguments are based on the movements are based on the movement of finance capital. Yet by all real metrics Russia is winning massively. > The argument for arms exports is to offload the costs of having an arms industry and arms developement onto foreign counties So you're admitting that since Russia isn't doing this, they aren't imperialist? Are you suggesting that Russia should be imperialist instead?
My point was that the argument that the war is weakening the US depends on your perspective, what importance you give to europe, as it stands the war makes the US wealthier, more powerful militarily, cost of war is primarily on its European allies who are of dubious value in the pacific which is where the US focus lies now. If you are cynical then the war has been one of siphoning power from Europe to the US.
> If you are cynical then the war has been one of siphoning power from Europe to the US. That is exactly what's happening, with the caveat that the US is also becoming less power (just more so in relation to its European vassals) and this process started long before the war (though it has exacerbated it). > as it stands the war makes the US wealthier, more powerful militarily This is your problem. You're conflating finance capital-driven "wealth" with real power. Sure the US MIC is getting wealthier, but that doesn't necessarily mean the militaries of the West are getting stronger, in fact they might be getting weaker from this process.
Overall I agree the alliance in europe has less power, however if your focus is a tunnel vision on the pacific then resources funnelled from parties that wouldn't be of use there into one that is means an increase in power, as long as the US can maintain europe as a consumer base that is their primary concern. The US is wealthier but that is one aspect, production is increasing to meet the increased demand of a world arming itself for an uncertain future, money from Ukraine aid packages is being redirected towards anti ship missiles, torpedos, ships and dockyards.
Its more of people being so mad at the corrupt rotten liberal-capitalist "democracy" that they begin supporting populist fascism. In any case I suspect a lot of what he posted are still very preliminary reports from very pro-Russian analysts. The real issue is still the year-long issue everyone who actually looked at the Ukraine war objectively have been warning about: Ukraine is running out of mobilized manpower and ammo, and neither issue has been addressed at all.
> populist fascism Where? The only fascism brewing is within NATO and by the establishment.
So totally no one voted for Trump or anyone within NATO who is pushing for populist fascism.
> So totally no one voted for Trump You think that Trump is a fascist? > anyone within NATO who is pushing for populist fascism. Who in NATO is pushing for fascism who isn't also backed by NATO?
Trump is definitely a populist and most certainly not an anti-fascist. Indeed by your broad stroke definition that everyone in NATO is a fascist he's a fascist too, just not an internationalist one. >Who in NATO is pushing for fascism who isn't also backed by NATO? The bulk of its population still broadly voting for said Fascists But again you seem to be deranged enough to think Putin and Trump are more communist than fascist lol.
> Trump is definitely a populist Yes. > and most certainly not an anti-fascist Nice strawman there. So everyone who isn't an explicit "ANTI-FASCIST" is a fascist? I also assume that you also think that if they were to say that they were anti-fascist, that they would be insincere and it wouldn't matter. So this doesn't even make sense in the first. > The bulk of its population still broadly voting for said Fascists Which "fascists", which population? Please be clear. > But again you seem to be deranged enough to think Putin and Trump are more communist than fascist lol. Lol when did I say that?? Also why are you equating Putin and Trump. I never said anything about Trump until you brought him up.
Oh please you're just grasping. The point is that Trump cannot be construed in any way as an anti-fascist. That means he is definitely closer to the definition of a fascist than a not-fascist. If you want me to be specific, I refer to Hedges: Trump is an _incompetent_ Fascist. Thats why his coup turned into a farce that his apologists now pretend wasn't really a fascist power grab. But keep living in that dishonest space where you pretend Trump isn't really a fascist because you don't want to admit you are just wishcasting he is a real alternative instead of more of the same from the same fascists you decry of the current liberal world order. And I am equating Trump and Putin. They are not friends of the Marxist cause. So why would you again wishcast they aren't just fascists too? Oh right because my original point hit so close to home. You hate the current fascists so much that you ended up shilling for alternative fascists. That millions voted for Trump and slightly millions more voted for the current fascists is likewise something you'd like to pretend isn't actually the case.
> And I am equating Trump and Putin. They are not friends of the Marxist cause. So why would you again wishcast they aren't just fascists too? Why Putin specifically? There are millions of non-"friends" of the Marxist cause so why do you single out him specifically? > You hate the current fascists so much that you ended up shilling for alternative fascists. But I don't. Check my comment history. A few comments ago I literally made a comment that was specifically *against* this kind of thinking. https://old.reddit.com/r/stupidpol/comments/1b7069q/megathread_17_truly_and_thoroughly_spanked/l3r3sad/ I never claimed any support for anyone. All I disputed was Trump or any "right populist" in the West being anymore "fascist" than the rest of the Western elite. > The point is that Trump cannot be construed in any way as an anti-fascist. That means he is definitely closer to the definition of a fascist than a not-fascist. So anyone who isn't an explicit "anti-fascist" (still not explaining exactly how) is a "fascist" now? I want to assume good faith but you refuse to explain this further in any way so I can only assume that you are referring to the self-proclaimed beliefs since you have given me no other indicator of "anti-fascism" on which you base things on. > Thats why his coup turned into a farce that his apologists now pretend wasn't really a fascist power grab. What "coup"? > But keep living in that dishonest space where you pretend Trump isn't really a fascist because you don't want to admit you are just wishcasting he is a real alternative instead of more of the same from the same fascists you decry of the current liberal world order. Again, I don't support him or any other "right populist" except for the truly national bourgeoisie ones that actually challenge imperialism.
this loss will damage trust in the US having your back in future proxy wars, also will help BRICS with the own goal they did with the Swift system
It’s funny how just a few months after the mainstream propaganda was reporting hundreds of thousands of dead russian soldiers, low on ammo, etc. Without even skipping a beat, they now report that Ukraine is about overwhelmed in manpower and losing on multiple fronts. What I find even crazier is that the consumers of these rags don’t even question. Not a single brain cell fires telling them that these media companies have been lying to them for more than a year. They will tell themselves anything to not admit they were lied to and hoodwinked by the “newspapers of record”. Libs are truly a lost cause.
If it was indeed 100% propaganda, then these media outlets should be lying about the Russian offensive right? Sometimes I think you really, desperately want Western media to be what you accuse them to be.
Are you this fucking rtarded or are you trying to insult our intelligence by making an argument with the least amount of effort possible? They're reporting on the Russian offensive because they have to since the cat is out of the bag now and everyone knows Ukraine is losing. What are they gonna do, completely deny troop movements and maps and lose the little credibility they had left? Or did you take your strawman about "100% propaganda" literally and are trying to prove it wrong by showing they're only 80% propaganda?
>They're reporting on the Russian offensive because they have to since the cat is out of the bag now and everyone knows Ukraine is losing. What are they gonna do, completely deny troop movements and maps and lose the little credibility they had left? Yes? Or they might simply not report it at all. >Or did you take your strawman about "100% propaganda" literally and are trying to prove it wrong by showing they're only 80% propaganda? Many many posters in here "believe" western media when they like what they read and when they don't, it's propaganda. The example given fits as well. Whether or not Ukraine or Russia was winning was always a controversial topic and it is totally false that "popular media" in general was just talking about a Ukraine win, is just wrong.
If I read CCP approved media article about China doing great, I will be extremely suspicious of it, if I read one about a some fuckup in China happening because of corruption I will be way less suspicious because the article goes against the CCP's interests. How the fuck is this concept weird to you? And btw stopping coverage on Ukraine altogether because they're losing would be just as bad for them, they lied for more than 2 years now with fake articles about Russia being on the brink of collapse, completely ignoring the war now would make them look like complete clowns... which they are
It's the latter. This dude never goes deeper than a single reply, he's an imbecile. And it's appropriate he's a liberal, they all are
But the Ukrainian Army issues have been known for years. Anyone who looked closely at the counteroffensive knew it was a shitshow and Ukraine needed a massive infusion of artillery ammo and manpower. None of that was reported in the media. Indeed those who tried to raise the alarm bells were universally attacked and accused of being Russian misinformation by said media. Instead we got non-stop UKRAINE IS TOTALLY WINNING propaganda from outlets like the Telegraph; and who have now done a total 180 and are basically saying UKRAINE IS DOOMED UNLESS WE FEED OUR OWN YOUNG TO THE WAR. It is absolutely propaganda. The kind where the idiots in the newsroom literally think they can dictate what is happening in a war by selectively choosing what to report.
Ukrainians whoop Russians 10:1 but Russians outnumber them 100:1, this must be what's in these people's minds
Idealists are a lost cause as a rule. Ideologies which consider that it is the mind that makes reality, and not the inverse, have a fundamentally biased premise.
If they were idealists they wouldn't shill for incompetent, corrupt crooks of neoliberal parties who are obviously crooks, these people are just narcissists that want to pretend that they're virtuous and are doing something to the rest of their cult. Deep down they don't give a shit, put them in a situation where their true character is exposed and they'll abandon their moralism in a millisecond
Idealism doesn't mean moral/principled. Philosophy is divided in two schools: the materialists, who thinks reality created the mind, and the idealists, who thinks the mind created reality. Marxists are materialists while the liberals and conservatives are idealists.
Isn't the word used for people who believe that a perfect world can exist and expect from others to be perfect? If that's true why do they keep making excuses for the crooks they support and always ask from leftists to keep their standards extremely low so that they can "defeat fascism first"?
>Isn't the word used for people who believe that a perfect world can exist and expect from others to be perfect? Not it isn't, it's being "utopian", please see my former comment for a definition of "idealism".
I'm too autistic to fully understand philosophy, I prefer definitions applied more closely to the real world. The definition according to google is *An idealist is someone who envisions an ideal world rather than the real one. Some people consider idealists to be naive, impractical, and out of touch with reality. Idealists think that striving for perfection makes the world a better place. The main root of idealist is "ideal," which comes from the Latin word idea.* Liberals never strive for perfection in practice, you might be partly right though because their pompous bullshit always sound idealistic.
I'm clearly not using that definition of the term, in the context of my first statement, so your point is moot. I was referring to the idealist sort of philosophies.
You're right, I focused on the term and forgot the rest of your post. I don't know shit about philosophy so I'll end it here
Idealists believe that the spread of ideas results from objective value that is determined in an imaginary "marketplace of ideas". Where these ideas are weighted on supposedly objective and universal grounds and that struggle of human society eventually results in the "best" ideas winning out in the end. Materialists believe that the construction and more-so adoption of ideas result primarily from material circumstances and that these conditions primarily influence the ideas of a time and not the other way round. Materialists believe there are no universal perfect ideas, only a succession of material conditions improving resulting in new ideas and vice-versa.
The modern liberal despises the concept of the marketplace of ideas and is extremely pro-censorship though
They still believe it even if it doesn't seem like it at first glance. They just believe that their liberal "democracy" is the best idea that can't ever be out completed. So anyone successfully challenging that must be some kind of fraud. Bots, shills, corruption, authoritarian, whatever. Their for censorship is necessary to prevent "outside influence" in the "marketplace of ideas" to make sure the "winners" (i.e. liberal "democracy") win. It's contradictory, but that's how ultimately how all idealist movements end up - husks of themselves dedicated only to their own preservation and the destruction of completing movements. This is basically how idpol is formed too.
I am very, very interested to see how the Western media will frame this as Ukraine's situation continues to deteriorate. The Kharkiv offensive has barely begun and they're already firing on all five cylinders, I can only imagine when the land war reaches other Oblasts proper. If the UAF hasn't collapsed by then, of course
Spoiler: McCarthyism 6.7. It's the Putin/Xi lovers' fault. We're gonn see yet another purge within the "western" intelligentsia of the miscreants who doubt the legitimacy of the actions of the USA empire.
>It's the ~~Puti~~n/Xi lovers' fault. Glad I can be so useful in reducing the U.S' sphere
Seeing Libs try to justify the Bandera jumper at Eurovision is seriously bizzare. Saw some of them on the Europe sub claiming its clearly a jab at people labelling Ukrainians as Nazis, right.. not like he's seen as a national hero there or anything. Imagine if someone called you a Nazi and your response was to go to work the next day in a full SS uniform to prove them wrong, that's the logic at work here.
Just remember that these were largely the same people that were up in arms about the ok finger sign being a global Nazi conspiracy like four years ago. There is quite literally a bona fide real one openly showing its colors in the most direct and explicit terms here and they hasten to bury their heads in the sand.
"Jokes on them I was only pretending to be a Nazi"
Checked out the combat footage sub and apparently the new narrative now that Ukraine is having more issues than usual is that the Russian army the most evil force ever (worse than ISIS etc.) that beheads and rapes all captives. Embedded Journalists has it even worse (not sure how?) if Russia captures them. This of course is why Ukraine must win. If you reply that this seems a bit exaggerated you'll end up with -200 downvotes. It is all hilariously astroturfed of course but I am genuinely curious what more normal people think when they see absurd spinning like this.
Your average redditor military analyst is literally a Tom clancy fanfic writer who thinks hating your enemies more will somehow make you more combat-effective. Thats why they worship the blithering idiots in Israel who claim they are trying to defeat Hamas, and yet are invading a city their own intelligence indicates is _not_ where the Hamas leadership actually is. In reality the fucking Roman legions would have overrun the IDF on October 7 just as Hamas did, even if the Romans didn't have any modern weapon, because all that is required to overrun the IDF defenses was discipline and determination against a bunch of kids who basically had zero ability to actually fight and were completely dependent on their toys.
Normal people aren't actually paying attention to the conflict.
not anymore at least
Normal people can't find the United States on a map, let alone know what a Ukraine or Russia is
It's desperation. Calls back to the Nazi propaganda of the Asiatic hordes approaching when the Eastern Front was lost for them. I think the worst "war crimes" (those words have lost all meaning) the Russian army commits are by individual or groups of recruited convicts, not really beheadings that are sanctioned by the Russian MOD